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2017 Houston Texans Official OTA's, Minicamp, and Training Camp Thread

CloakNNNdagger said:
Early Risers from the Start of Houston Texans Training Camp
Through the first week of Houston Texans training camp a look at some of the early players with a strong start to 2017.

Tyler Ervin

Entering his second year, Tyler Ervin is finding his way in all three areas of his responsibility: rushing, catching the ball, and in the return game. Demonstrating a vastly increased amount of confidence on the field, Ervin is showing that he is the best receiving back of the group, having possibly the third best hands from the entire skill group behind DeAndre Hopkins and Jaelen Strong. Ervin also has the best ability to make defenders miss in open field and is a markedly different player when compared to last camp. Ervin has been solid since the team did its off-season work and he continues to make his mark during the team's preparations for the 2017 season.
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Anyone have thoughts on whether or not Ervin makes the team? I'm not sure what to think at the moment. Hunt brought a spark last year and was more reliable on special teams. I like Ervin's potential but with Foreman a lock to make the team, I think their skill sets overlap too much to keep them both (Hunt and Ervin). I don't think Hunt was really given the opportunity to make the team in last year's preseason - he tore it up and they went with Ervin anyway because he was the new and shiny draft pick. I'm hoping this year is more of an even playing field going into preseason and whoever plays better makes the team. Thoughts?
 
welsh texan said:
Wow, i dont even know where to start here. Yeah it makes or breaks a career. I can name a few where it ruined the player, you can name a few where it didnt. Id take the softly softly approach since we have a pair of competent QBs to try first and give Watson as much time as possible to slow the game down.


If, i said if he isn't ready. They are all probowlers at this point in the season according to the media though. I don't pay too much attention to what gets written. Looking forward to seeing how he's coming along in the pre season games though.
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Every player starting day one career could go sour. But damn why does we have that type of mentality when it comes to this young man and the Texans. You can't win skit if you're scared to gamble.

Was Carr ruined over their in Raider nation?

How about Cam Newton over there in Carolina?

What about Matt Ryan?

Oh and player can be ruined in year 2-whatever as well. You do know that right.
 
Max said:
Anyone have thoughts on whether or not Ervin makes the team? I'm not sure what to think at the moment. Hunt brought a spark last year and was more reliable on special teams. I like Ervin's potential but with Foreman a lock to make the team, I think their skill sets overlap too much to keep them both (Hunt and Ervin). I don't think Hunt was really given the opportunity to make the team in last year's preseason - he tore it up and they went with Ervin anyway because he was the new and shiny draft pick. I'm hoping this year is more of an even playing field going into preseason and whoever plays better makes the team. Thoughts?
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Yes he will make the team. He is a very versatile player.
 
JJ Watt again was not on the field today. O'Brien made the statement is that the new goal is Sept. 10th.............essentially almost 1 year since his last back surgery. Makes me think that something is of concern to someone.
 
sandman said:
Of course, all of those teams had QB's named Manning, Rodgers, Flacco and Warner.
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Flacco is very up and down. He got hot on a contract year and won a Super Bowl but aside from that I am not so sure you can mention him as some great leap forward in Qbing.
sandman said:
Actually, in the six seasons between 2007-2012, there were 5 teams in the Super Bowl that had 9-7 or 10-6 records. All of them won the Super Bowl except for Arizona in the 2008 season. It's about getting hot in the playoffs.
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I disagree. It is about building momentum heading into the playoffs and that usually carries over.

I could have brought up other teams besides the NY Giants but I brought up the Giants because of how they went on to beat an unbeaten team in the Super Bowl.

I don't care about excuses like we have a first place schedule. If anything that is all the more reason we can finish with a 9-7 or 10-6 record and win it all. With a tough schedule and us finishing strong it means we will be plenty battle tested.

I would rather us have a better record than 9-7 again but 9-7 does not necessarily spell doom for our team. History says as much.
 
welsh texan said:
eams are too quick to put first round QBs into the game, i wonder to myself how many bust QBs might have been decent players had they been given time to learn before picking up survival habits when the games too fast for them.
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I do too. I think some of those Qb's would have had much better careers.

I do however think this Texans team is set up a lot better for a rookie Qb to succeed than it was when David Carr was supposed work miracles for our team.
 
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Texansballer74 said:
The Colts should've did Luck the same way huh?

Seattle shouldn't have started Wilson as a rookie either huh?

Man why did the Eagles start Wentz his rookie year?

Peyton Manning most definitely should've sat his rookie year huh?
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I think it depends on the team and the talent that surrounds those young Qb's. However when you look at some of these bottom feeding teams who maintain a low level of accomplishment over a sustained period of time it can very much stunt the growth of a young Qb and ruin his confidence if he starts too soon.

I think throwing a rookie Qb to the wolves so to speak is only wise if the O-line is better than piece meal and there is at least a few go to weapons that they can rely on.

Our offense is not one I would want to rush a rookie into too soon. Lets see if the line play get's any better and let our young additions to the offense improve more before we put our rookie Qb out on the field to start.
 
TxnsJuggernaut said:
Flacco is very up and down. He got hot on a contract year and won a Super Bowl but aside from that I am not so sure you can mention him as some great leap forward in Qbing.
I disagree. It is about building momentum heading into the playoffs and that usually carries over.

I could have brought up other teams besides the NY Giants but I brought up the Giants because of how they went on to beat an unbeaten team in the Super Bowl.

I don't care about excuses like we have a first place schedule. If anything that is all the more reason we can finish with a 9-7 or 10-6 record and win it all. With a tough schedule and us finishing strong it means we will be plenty battle tested.

I would rather us have a better record than 9-7 again but 9-7 does not necessarily spell doom for our team. History says as much.
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Actually, the Giants started that season 6-2 going into the bye week, then went 4-4 in the second half of the season, including losing 2 of their last 3 games. Ironically, the last game of the regular season was a loss to the Patriots. They (in general, Eli in particular) literally got hot in the playoffs.

I don't disagree with anything you said about first place schedules. I was merely pointing out that while the Texans and Tits had the same record, they played different strengths of schedule.
 
Texansballer74 said:
Was Carr ruined over their in Raider nation?

How about Cam Newton over there in Carolina?

What about Matt Ryan?
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Those young men were drafted into better situations than Qb's who are drafted into teams that can't seem to do anything right. Jets, Browns, Jags are three teams that make rookie Qb's have short lived careers. There is no right or wrong way it just depends a lot on the situation and team.
 
TxnsJuggernaut said:
Those young men were drafted into better situations than Qb's who are drafted into teams that can't seem to do anything right. Jets, Browns, Jags are three teams that make rookie Qb's have short lived careers. There is no right or wrong way it just depends a lot on the situation and team.
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Exactly. Watson is also drafted into a pretty good situation. Dak Prescott was drafted into a great situation. My thing is you can not be scared to toss any player you think will be good to the wolves.
 
CloakNNNdagger said:
JJ Watt again was not on the field today. O'Brien made the statement is that the new goal is Sept. 10th.............essentially almost 1 year since his last back surgery. Makes me think that something is of concern to someone.
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Don't know what to think ? Can't be good but not necessarily bad either, not yet atleast. Of course we won't find anything out from O'Brien.
I'm thinkin several of the vets like JJoe & Cushing didn't even play in any of the early preseason games in TC last year ?
 
J.J. Watt was absent from practice however head coach Bill O’Brien made it clear that Watt is healthy and ready to go. O’Brien pointed to the season opener on September 10th as the target date for him. The Texans have been cautious with Watt all camp, allowing him get his work in with his position group while keeping him from a heavy workload on the field. Watt is coming back from a back issue and rushing him into heavy hitting situations does not benefit the team; keeping him in one piece and ready for the season is all that matters for the Texans.


The addition of wide receiver DeAndrew White subsequent to a workout on the off-day might not have seemed like that big of a deal, but White made his name known by his new teammates on day one. White caught everything thrown his way and might have had close to double digit catches on Tuesday’s practice during combined 7-on-7 and team drills. White made more of an impact today as a receiver than majority of the new receivers on the roster. It now falls on White to make this into a more than a singlular performance, he will need to continue contributing the entire length of camp and throughout the preseason. If White maintains his current pace, he will give the Texans something to think about when it comes time for the roster to be trimmed down.

Lamar Miller had the biggest run of the day and flipped the field in a hurry on a play in which he broke off right behind Xavier Su’a-Filo, Jeff Allen, and Nick Martin, taking a long run into the end zone. Miller looks much more comfortable in the offense and is seeing the creases much better. The best part of Miller’s big run was that he was able to walk away from defenders on his way to the end zone with no one close to catching him.
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http://scout.com/nfl/texans/Article/Quick-Hitters-Houston-Texans-Training-Camp-Day-Six-105693198

Some good stuff about Watson and Savage in there also. Also Canfora is reporting Luck might start the season on the PUP
 
welsh texan said:
Would much prefer this than to throw Watson out there if he isnt ready. Weedon has been fairly good as an in game replacement through his career.

Teams are too quick to put first round QBs into the game, i wonder to myself how many bust QBs might have been decent players had they been given time to learn before picking up survival habits when the games too fast for them.

I wonder how someone like Aaron Rodgers would have faired had he been forced to start early. Cant know the answer to those questions but id err on the side of caution.
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Last week on radio 610 they discussed some guy one of the talking head knew who had researched starting a rookie QB over letting rookie sit one year..allegedly the results said the rookie starting was more successful. I think David Carr is what comes to most people's mind when this topic discussed. If correct, I will have to change my opinion as I thought sitting a year was best.
 
infantrycak said:
Says who?

Savage goes down I seriously doubt Watson is holding a clipboard watching Weeden (brought in to be 3rd QB and always will be) start.
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Never know with that Bill O'Brien fella... dude marches to his own drum.
 
sandman said:
Last year the Texans went 9-7 playing a first place schedule, and throwing the last game of the season. The Titans went 9-7 playing a last place schedule. They are an improved team, but theoretically will be playing a tougher schedule than last year.
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We're playing the Patriots & Chiefs, the Titans will be playing the Dolphins & Raiders.

The Jags will play the Bills & Broncos
The Colts will play the Jets & Chargers.

Other than that, we play the same teams.

I think the Titans are more likely to beat the Dolphins than we are of beating the Patriots. I'll be surprised if the Jags beat the Bills. The Colts are 50/50 to beat the Jets.

Our chances of beating the Chiefs are about the same as Tennessee's chances of beating the Raiders, or the Colts beating the Chargers. I don't see the Jags beating the Broncos.
 
badboy said:
Last week on radio 610 they discussed some guy one of the talking head knew who had researched starting a rookie QB over letting rookie sit one year..allegedly the results said the rookie starting was more successful. I think David Carr is what comes to most people's mind when this topic discussed. If correct, I will have to change my opinion as I thought sitting a year was best.
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I think starting a rookie early is a sign of the organization's belief in that player. If they're thinking he's a franchise QB, they'll be more apt to help him be successful. Maybe they'll design an offense around what he can do... maybe they'll call plays to help him get in a rhythm. Maybe they'll design plays to protect him.


They're sometimes circumstances that affect when a rookie starts. Like Bret Farve, Tom Brady, or Peyton Manning on the roster.
 
Texansballer74 said:
Every player starting day one career could go sour. But damn why does we have that type of mentality when it comes to this young man and the Texans. You can't win skit if you're scared to gamble.

Was Carr ruined over their in Raider nation?

How about Cam Newton over there in Carolina?

What about Matt Ryan?

Oh and player can be ruined in year 2-whatever as well. You do know that right.
Click to expand...
I thought we had gone over this before.

Guys like Luck, Wilson, Newton, RGIII, Prescott, Matt Ryan, Winston, etc. had a HC that tailored the offense to their game, or they ran a similar offense in college.
Derek Carr ran a pro-style offense in 2011 before his new HC switched to the spread.
Wentz played under center a lot, sometimes from the offset I Pistol formation, for example.
Bridgewater was no stranger to the play action from under center from various formations.
Mariota had a TE, or two RBs in various formations. What that means is that the offense does have a lot of pro element in it, and not a pure spread.

Even so, Luck did have the lowest completion percentage and the worst TD/INT ratio of his career (and that doesn't even count the drops by the defensive players that Luck threw right to, and other possible Ints.

Did you take a look at Manning's rookie numbers? Aikman's? Bradshaw's?

With the NFL running from the spread more than ever before, it becomes less important for these college QBs to play earlier, but it would help if their HCs adapt the game plan to suit them.

Watson ran a spread that also has a number of pro concepts. He does have a TE, and play with 2 backs from time to time, with the zone read being just another form of play action.

Combined with his quick release and quick-decision making ability, he shouldn't take him too long to adapt to the pro game.

The thing that most worries me is that he may get injured either because of the line or by taking off early.
Even if he doesn't get injured, the unecessary hits can take a toll.

We saw what happened to RGIII.
And Luck has had his share of time in the tube.
 
thunderkyss said:
I think starting a rookie early is a sign of the organization's belief in that player. If they're thinking he's a franchise QB, they'll be more apt to help him be successful. Maybe they'll design an offense around what he can do... maybe they'll call plays to help him get in a rhythm. Maybe they'll design plays to protect him.


They're sometimes circumstances that affect when a rookie starts. Like Bret Farve, Tom Brady, or Peyton Manning on the roster.
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Or maybe they will end up like Blaine Gabbert or Christian Ponder.

It could also be easy to argue that Bortles could have used the time to work on his throwing mechanics.
 
76Texan said:
I thought we had gone over this before.

Guys like Luck, Wilson, Newton, RGIII, Prescott, Matt Ryan, Winston, etc. had a HC that tailored the offense to their game, or they ran a similar offense in college.
Derek Carr ran a pro-style offense in 2011 before his new HC switched to the spread.
Wentz played under center a lot, sometimes from the offset I Pistol formation, for example.
Bridgewater was no stranger to the play action from under center from various formations.
Mariota had a TE, or two RBs in various formations. What that means is that the offense does have a lot of pro element in it, and not a pure spread.

Even so, Luck did have the lowest completion percentage and the worst TD/INT ratio of his career (and that doesn't even count the drops by the defensive players that Luck threw right to, and other possible Ints.

Did you take a look at Manning's rookie numbers? Aikman's? Bradshaw's?

With the NFL running from the spread more than ever before, it becomes less important for these college QBs to play earlier, but it would help if their HCs adapt the game plan to suit them.

Watson ran a spread that also has a number of pro concepts. He does have a TE, and play with 2 backs from time to time, with the zone read being just another form of play action.

Combined with his quick release and quick-decision making ability, he shouldn't take him too long to adapt to the pro game.

The thing that most worries me is that he may get injured either because of the line or by taking off early.
Even if he doesn't get injured, the unecessary hits can take a toll.

We saw what happened to RGIII.
And Luck has had his share of time in the tube.
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No you and I never went in depth on this particular topic.

Ive posted Manning rookie numbers several times on this forum when discussing Watson potential to start.

All of those QB'S still were tossed to the wolves is my main point. We can not be afraid to toss Watson out there. The on the field live action can pay dividends in the long run. Im not saying he's going to light up the NFL like Manning did but the experience could work out great.
 
Texansballer74 said:
No you and I never went in depth on this particular topic.

Ive posted Manning rookie numbers several times on this forum when discussing Watson potential to start.

All of those QB'S still were tossed to the wolves is my main point. We can not be afraid to toss Watson out there. The on the field live action can pay dividends in the long run. Im not saying he's going to light up the NFL like Manning did but the experience could work out great.
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I'm not against playing a rookie QB, but I don't believe in sink or swim.

( when I typed "We", I meant to say that it had been discussed on the MB before.
 
76Texan said:
Or maybe they will end up like Blaine Gabbert or Christian Ponder.

It could also be easy to argue that Bortles could have used the time to work on his throwing mechanics.
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And maybe Gabbert and Ponder were going to end up Gabbert and Ponder even if they sat 3 years.

You can make the time argument til the cows come home and we won't know it would have done a bit of good.
 
Perki-Perk said:
So how do you feel about that S we picked up on Free Agency? Gilchrist I think from Clemson? I hear he is pretty good and a lot of folks were surprised we could still get him so late in the off season.
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It is a catch 22 we could have got lucky and found a serviceable player so late in the game or there might be a reason he was still available.
 
I don't know about the over/under but I think we have seen the best from JJ Watt.

In other back surgery news:

I think Tiger is done! I don't think Nike would've have dropped Golf Equipment if they thought Tiger had a chance of coming back.
 
Texian said:
I don't know about the over/under but I think we have seen the best from JJ Watt.

In other back surgery news:

I think Tiger is done! I don't think Nike would've have dropped Golf Equipment if they thought Tiger had a chance of coming back.
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I think we're also going to see more and more elite players take a big payday and then retire one they've collected their guarantees and there are signs of their skills declining and bodies breaking down. Especially linemen. Who wants to end up with CTE?
 
76Texan said:
Or maybe they will end up like Blaine Gabbert or Christian Ponder.

It could also be easy to argue that Bortles could have used the time to work on his throwing mechanics.
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Bottles started because the Jags started the season 0-3, or something. Not necessarily because they thought he was ready. They were trying to get him ready for the following season.

I don't remember Ponder's situation. But I do remember I liked him as a prospect.
 
The problem with Watson starting is he is getting little to no reps with the 1s. His timing won't be where it needs to be with Hopkins, Fuller and Miller. I think Savage is a lock to start
 
MScFlHN.png


Its happening!!
 
amazing80 said:
The problem with Watson starting is he is getting little to no reps with the 1s. His timing won't be where it needs to be with Hopkins, Fuller and Miller. I think Savage is a lock to start
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Not what I heard on the radio this morning.

Matter of fact the hosts (who are there watching camp) made a point to say he's getting an inordinate amount of reps with the first team. They said from the amount of reps he is getting with the first team it's obvious They are trying to bring him along quickly and that he's not being treated like the typical back up as far as reps are concerned.

This came from John Lopez and Cody Stoots.

As I said earlier I've heard some conflicting stuff so if you've heard or read otherwise please share.
 
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Max said:
Anyone have thoughts on whether or not Ervin makes the team? I'm not sure what to think at the moment. Hunt brought a spark last year and was more reliable on special teams. I like Ervin's potential but with Foreman a lock to make the team, I think their skill sets overlap too much to keep them both (Hunt and Ervin). I don't think Hunt was really given the opportunity to make the team in last year's preseason - he tore it up and they went with Ervin anyway because he was the new and shiny draft pick. I'm hoping this year is more of an even playing field going into preseason and whoever plays better makes the team. Thoughts?
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I agree100%
 
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Number19 said:
Weeden will be #2; although largely forgotten, he's having a very good camp.

Offensively, Savage is looking good; the RB's are looking good and the WR's are looking good. On the OL, Brown will be solid; Martin is having a good camp at OC and Allen is improved over last year.

Lamb, at RT, is taking a beating from our defense. Q is at LG and I haven't heard much but the few mentions I've read are positive. But these two positions are question marks.

I can't recall hearing one thing about our TE's.

Overall, with improved play at QB, RB and WR, we're going to have a more productive offense - to go along with our defense.

We have a very good team and we will contend.
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I thought Lamm was replacing Brown at LT for now?

Other thoughts: I hope some of our running backs are PS eligible. I am glad we have no cuts for now.
Is it time for kicker Fairburn to replace Novak (35 YOA Cap $1 million)?
 
infantrycak said:
And maybe Gabbert and Ponder were going to end up Gabbert and Ponder even if they sat 3 years.

You can make the time argument til the cows come home and we won't know it would have done a bit of good.
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I don't know, but Aaron Rodgers had the time to work on his throwing motion, and look where he's now.

http://thesidelineview.com/columns/nfl/can-quarterbacks-mechanics-be-altered

Had he been thrown in early like Bortles, he wouldn't have had time for that. It's not the easiest thing to fix.
They're still trying to fix Bortles' this offseason.

A bad habit can, and usually gets worse over the years.

According to Bill Walsh, it took Montana a few years to comfortably go trough all the progression (I read the book, but don't remember the exact number).
Montana sat and watched DeBerg suffered through a 2-win season as a rookie, and started just 7 games his second season.
And this was one of the smartest QB ever.
When he finally took over the reign in his third year, guess what happened?
The Niners won 5 games more than they did the previous two years combined, not counting the three in the playoffs that netted them a Lombardi.
 
thunderkyss said:
Bottles started because the Jags started the season 0-3, or something. Not necessarily because they thought he was ready. They were trying to get him ready for the following season.

I don't remember Ponder's situation. But I do remember I liked him as a prospect.
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See my post on Joe Montana.
 
76Texan said:
I don't know, but Aaron Rodgers had the time to work on his throwing motion, and look where he's now.

http://thesidelineview.com/columns/nfl/can-quarterbacks-mechanics-be-altered

Had he been thrown in early like Bortles, he wouldn't have had time for that. It's not the easiest thing to fix.
They're still trying to fix Bortles' this offseason.

A bad habit can, and usually gets worse over the years.

According to Bill Walsh, it took Montana a few years to comfortably go trough all the progression (I read the book, but don't remember the exact number).
Montana sat and watched DeBerg suffered through a 2-win season as a rookie, and started just 7 games his second season.
And this was one of the smartest QB ever.
When he finally took over the reign in his third year, guess what happened?
The Niners won 5 games more than they did the previous two years combined, not counting the three in the playoffs that netted them a Lombardi.
Click to expand...

Maybe borts just isn't that good.

And why couldn't Rodgers have worked on his throwing motion while playing?

Just because he may not have been as good right away doest mean playing earlier hinders him from getting where he is.
 
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