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19 yds rushing on 14 attempts

JackDizzle said:
Plenty of opportunities for them to bounce it outside and gain some yards. The only thing bouncing were Ron Dayne's man boobs.
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I can agree with this, but the strength of the backs that run in the Denver system, is not being able to bounce it outside. Not TerrellDavis' strong suite, not OlandisGary's strong suit, not Mike Anderson, Reuban droagns(sp), not Grifith, not even TatumBell/Mike Bell.
 
thunderkyss said:
I can agree with this, but the strength of the backs that run in the Denver system, is not being able to bounce it outside. Not TerrellDavis' strong suite, not OlandisGary's strong suit, not Mike Anderson, Reuban droagns(sp), not Grifith, not even TatumBell/Mike Bell.
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Do you seriously know what the difference is between the backs you just mentioned and the backs we have??? SPEED!!!!! and lots of it. They also have better vision and the ability to cut back if they have too. All we have are a couple of slow moving objects coming out of the backfield that only run in one direction. Right up there linemans AZZ!!!!
 
Bad run blocking + lack of explosive running backs + injuries = 1st draft pick in '07.

I hope it doesn't come down to this but without some sort of running game we are doomed! We can't even convert a 3rd and 1 with a handoff or a QB sneak. I thought we would do much better than this in the running game this year. Ironic that we relied on DD for the last 3 years and had no passing game and now we are better at pass protection with no running game. I heard somewhere once there are O-Lines out there that can actually do both.

I guess our OL just can't grasp or doesn't have the physical attributes for the ZBS, and we are playing some sort of hybrid scheme with big, powerful, and slow backs. I think we will see a big overhaul on the O-line in the offseason...and that may send us back to the drawing board again.
 
TexansJunkE said:
So What! That just means that the bums in front of him( Ryans not included in that) are not getting off blocks. Tell me when he has made a play or INT? I'll wait for your response:cool:
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Your wait is over.

Safety blitz for a sack of Bledsoe. Today. 9 tackles, 1 assist, 1 sack. :cool:

There is a lot not working in the secondary, but today isn't really a day to call out CC Brown in particular.
 
Hulk75 said:
tx_peterson_ap.jpg
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You can forget that. Coach Kube doesn`t believe in drafting franchise RB`s in the 1st round. Our running attack is reduced to a slow stroll.
 
HomeBred_Texan said:
Why? So another bumbling back can run over there leg and break it too?

The line was not the problem, the speed, or lack of is the problem in the backfield. Let's just agree that we disagree...
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i completely disagree here. while our backs arent very good, almost noone can produce behind this line. wand got cut and spencer's out so the left side takes a major hit. flanagan while not the best run blocker, is needed for the passing game and pitts is doing pretty well assisting flanagan ... flanagan's doing decently at taking that double team with pitts and then peeling off to the second level. the best thing the texans can do this offseason is trade weigert & mckinney to a division rival for a bag of peanuts. between those two and flanagan not being that great of a run blocker, the entire right side is impossible to run behind.
 
abbest said:
You can forget that. Coach Kube doesn`t believe in drafting franchise RB`s in the 1st round. Our running attack is reduced to a slow stroll.
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There are exceptions to every rule. If our running game stays this bad, or heaven forbid gets worse, Kubiak will probably pick a runningback in the first round. he likes to run the ball, and who we have now wont cut it.
 
Hardcore Texan said:
Bad run blocking + lack of explosive running backs + injuries = 1st draft pick in '07.

I hope it doesn't come down to this but without some sort of running game we are doomed! We can't even convert a 3rd and 1 with a handoff or a QB sneak. I thought we would do much better than this in the running game this year. Ironic that we relied on DD for the last 3 years and had no passing game and now we are better at pass protection with no running game. I heard somewhere once there are O-Lines out there that can actually do both.

I guess our OL just can't grasp or doesn't have the physical attributes for the ZBS, and we are playing some sort of hybrid scheme with big, powerful, and slow backs. I think we will see a big overhaul on the O-line in the offseason...and that may send us back to the drawing board again.
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I agree with the slow comment but not the powerful. They were dropping like flies today. We need a quick fix if they are serious about improving there record from last yr. If they dont do something soon we will be the first team in history to have back to back 1st rd. picks and if that were to happen they would probably screw it up like this last draft. Just my opinion.
 
thunderkyss said:
I can agree with this, but the strength of the backs that run in the Denver system, is not being able to bounce it outside. Not TerrellDavis' strong suite, not OlandisGary's strong suit, not Mike Anderson, Reuban droagns(sp), not Grifith, not even TatumBell/Mike Bell.
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So why start a reject from the same system? Picking up Ron Dayne wasn't a bad move, but making him our starting RB was. Morency should have never been traded and him and Lundy should be our main ballcarriers.
 
Hardcore Texan said:
Bad run blocking + lack of explosive running backs + injuries = 1st draft pick in '07.

I hope it doesn't come down to this but without some sort of running game we are doomed! We can't even convert a 3rd and 1 with a handoff or a QB sneak. I thought we would do much better than this in the running game this year. Ironic that we relied on DD for the last 3 years and had no passing game and now we are better at pass protection with no running game. I heard somewhere once there are O-Lines out there that can actually do both.

I guess our OL just can't grasp or doesn't have the physical attributes for the ZBS, and we are playing some sort of hybrid scheme with big, powerful, and slow backs. I think we will see a big overhaul on the O-line in the offseason...and that may send us back to the drawing board again.
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ok now who will be the Texans 1st pick next year? another 6'9" freak of nature that would neutralize the potent Colts offense. I can hardly wait.
 
JackDizzle said:
So why start a reject from the same system? Picking up Ron Dayne wasn't a bad move, but making him our starting RB was. Morency should have never been traded and him and Lundy should be our main ballcarriers.
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I agree with u on that. The running game was impressive in the preseason. After one regular season game you dump your two main ball carriers for someone else`s baggage. I am wondering now if that is the reason Kube was never offered a head coach position before.
 
Hulk75 said:
Yes it is, there are holes, but they do close faster BECAUSE our RBs are too slow to it them..........Do we have a gamebreaker our even a guy that can take it the distance? NO!
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Larry Johnson has 14 yards on 10 carries in the first half......... sounds kinda like Ron Dayne.. Maybe we can get a trade from KC, straight up.
 
abbest said:
You can forget that. Coach Kube doesn`t believe in drafting franchise RB`s in the 1st round. Our running attack is reduced to a slow stroll.
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It's common knowledge, that Kubiak was working a deal for us to get a Franchise running back in the first round.

I was wrong about Kubiak taking a running back early in the draft.....

It turns out that Denver hasn't done it because they never had the opportunity.
 
I'm beginning to think that a stoned Ricky Williams could be better than what we have atm. I'd take him stoned, Domanick on crutches and a 1 legged crossbred hickbilly over what we have let alone LJ or LT...
 
abbest said:
I agree with u on that. The running game was impressive in the preseason. After one regular season game you dump your two main ball carriers for someone else`s baggage. I am wondering now if that is the reason Kube was never offered a head coach position before.
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I do agree..... getting Dayne made sense.... & I could see getting Gado on our squad. But one or the other only.

I don't get the Trade, then not activating Lundy for any game since Philly....
 
abbest said:
You can forget that. Coach Kube doesn`t believe in drafting franchise RB`s in the 1st round. Our running attack is reduced to a slow stroll.
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And if that happens, you can bet on one thing for sure...

Reliant Stadium will look like the Astrodome... Empty and dusty...

How long do you think it will take before people quit wasting there time and money supporting a team that does not want to win? And by "does not want to win", I mean bypassing someone like a top running back in the draft when your running game sucks?????

To me, and this is just my opinion, Kubes gambled on his running game plan and lost. The personel are not as good as he had hoped. Do I think Mr. Reggie was the answer? Heck no, but I thought De'Angelo was... And I think that maybe, just maybe, Adriann P is the answer, but time will tell...
 
Everyone keeps mentioning these trade options. My question is whether it is worth it to make a trade. We are already 1-4. I say if we can't get to the playoffs we use this season to figure out which players fit the Kubiak system and which ones don't. Go ahead and give Winston some starts. Go ahead and activate Lundy and give him some starts. I don't want to give up a 3rd-4th round pick for someone that is mediocre at best.
 
JackDizzle said:
TK if you don't think that LJ would be an upgrade over Dayne your are not right in the head.
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The point is that even Larry Johnson, who is known to bounce to the outside every now and again gets stuffed. We met a better defense today(and against Miami).

If you're going to give up on Dayne after facing Dallas(3.1 ypc) & Miami (2.9 ypc) then LarryJohnson ought to be on the chopping block for facing Pittsburgh (3.4 ypc) & managing just 1.8 ypc(12 for 22 right now, and he is still in the game) & 2.25(16 for 36) against Arizona who gives up 4.3 ypc.

The guys on the other side of the ball gets payed pretty well to do what they do, and we've just gone against two of the top 4.
 
barzilla said:
Everyone keeps mentioning these trade options. My question is whether it is worth it to make a trade. We are already 1-4. I say if we can't get to the playoffs we use this season to figure out which players fit the Kubiak system and which ones don't. Go ahead and give Winston some starts. Go ahead and activate Lundy and give him some starts. I don't want to give up a 3rd-4th round pick for someone that is mediocre at best.
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WE put the players on the field, that gives us the best chance to win. If we ever stop trying to win football games, then this franchise is done.....

As fans, we should understand that we aren't going to win everygame, but the coach has an obligation to us fans, to the players, and to the organization to put the best team on the field, and try to win a game.

You guys act like we've lost to Tennesse, the Raiders, and Detroit. Washington beat us, but they've got more to hang their heads about, than we do.
 
thunderkyss said:
WE put the players on the field, that gives us the best chance to win. If we ever stop trying to win football games, then this franchise is done.....

As fans, we should understand that we aren't going to win everygame, but the coach has an obligation to us fans, to the players, and to the organization to put the best team on the field, and try to win a game.

You guys act like we've lost to Tennesse, the Raiders, and Detroit. Washington beat us, but they've got more to hang their heads about, than we do.
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And Tennessee beat Washington today...

Now we have allot of needs to fill. No way can all of these holes be filled in 1 season. Not writing the season off, but it sure doesn't look any better now than it did last year.

I just wished I had this magic ball that I could read and see what is in the future for us fans.

A Star Running Back?
A Star Defensive Back?
A Star Wide Receiver?
A Star Line Backer?

Who knows, I surely don't. I was very disappointed in the Dallas game today, not that we lost, but how we lost. Leading 6 - 3 at halftime, the running game being completely broken, but the D was holding it's own.

What team came out in the 2nd half? It surely wasn't the same team that played the 1st half....
 
thunderkyss said:
The point is that even Larry Johnson, who is known to bounce to the outside every now and again gets stuffed. We met a better defense today(and against Miami).

If you're going to give up on Dayne after facing Dallas(3.1 ypc) & Miami (2.9 ypc) then LarryJohnson ought to be on the chopping block for facing Pittsburgh (3.4 ypc) & managing just 1.8 ypc(12 for 22 right now, and he is still in the game) & 2.25(16 for 36) against Arizona who gives up 4.3 ypc.

The guys on the other side of the ball gets payed pretty well to do what they do, and we've just gone against two of the top 4.
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LJ's slow start is still better than Dayne's. Then there's that whole thing about LJ racking up 1700+ yards and 20TD's in 9 starts last year, while Ron Dayne was thinking of 1700 different ways to order his Whataburger. Sometimes I wonder what planet you're from.
 
thunderkyss said:
WE put the players on the field, that gives us the best chance to win. If we ever stop trying to win football games, then this franchise is done.....

As fans, we should understand that we aren't going to win everygame, but the coach has an obligation to us fans, to the players, and to the organization to put the best team on the field, and try to win a game.

You guys act like we've lost to Tennesse, the Raiders, and Detroit. Washington beat us, but they've got more to hang their heads about, than we do.
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Tenn and Detroit won today, with the Titans playing good against the Colts last week,as well-oh, and TB won with a rookie QB--we're fast running out of teams we have a chance to beat=Skins got beat today, as did the Eagles by the Saints (who also have a new HC and QB)--seems like most teams ahead of us are getting better while we're.....
 
The running game was pathetic today. The blocking sucked and so did the RB's. I could've sworn I saw some cutback lanes today, but I don't think our backs have the speed/vision to find those cutback lanes. How many times were we faced with 3rd and 1, 4th and 1, 3rd and 2 and ended up getting stuffed and having to punt or kick a FG. Until our running game steps up, we're going to continue to get slapped around by good teams.
 
TexansJunkE said:
CC Brown just sucks! How does Troy Vincent or Carroll, or Strait sit out there without jobs, But 6th rd pick CC Brown has one............Look I understand the past coaches and GM have ruined our drafts beyond belief, but...........................This Organization is finding it hard to cheer for them.:crying:
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You know what I gotta stop ya right there. CC is the only reason we had a chance at sacking DB today and that is final. Matter of fact I put CC up there by DRob in my book ahead of MW. But DRy is the man. CC he WAS defense today.:yikes:
 
thunderkyss said:
WE put the players on the field, that gives us the best chance to win. If we ever stop trying to win football games, then this franchise is done.....

As fans, we should understand that we aren't going to win everygame, but the coach has an obligation to us fans, to the players, and to the organization to put the best team on the field, and try to win a game.

You guys act like we've lost to Tennesse, the Raiders, and Detroit. Washington beat us, but they've got more to hang their heads about, than we do.
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NAH MAN WE LOST TO DALLAS!!! Thats way more than what washington has done yet, does washington have an "instate" team uuuuhhhh nah so dude come on with that one.
 
You guys act like we've lost to Tennesse, the Raiders, and Detroit. Washington beat us, but they've got more to hang their heads about, than we do.
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Thunderkyss,

It's not about not trying to win football games. It's about asking a very pointed question: how much better is Chris Brown than what we have? I don't want to give up a middle round pick for someone that isn't going to be a part of the long-term future. Perhaps it gets us from 6-10 to 7-9. Or maybe we go from 5-11 to 6-10.

There's a big difference between tanking games and simply not mortgaging your future for a mediocre player.
 
Something I keep coming back to in my mind is that the running game does not look anything like it did in the preseason and I'm not even remotely talking about the results we're getting with it.

I'm talking about the way we're running the ball and what our linemen are doing during running plays. I'm not the most insightful poster in here but I'm not seeing anything "Denver" about our rushing attack. I'm not seeing any lanes to cut back through at all. The only thing I'm seeing is a slow back or a quicker back running straight into the line whether a hole is there or not.

Like I said I'm not the guy you go to if you want to take apart a series of plays and find out what everyone on the line was (or wasn't) doing. I do have a general idea what Denvers offense looks like and this isn't even close.

I believe this is all Green Bay and Mike Sherman and I think that we have a real problem. One thing I do know when I see it is an offense that's straddling philosophies. I watched Capers/Palmer try to coexist for three seasons. This looks a lot like that.
 
chuckm said:
Dayne is a total zero ...... he runs like he has his eyes closed ...
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That's not accurate. Dayne is a 30 carry per game back who needs to line up deep behind the line so that he gets some momentum built up and who needs a good line to open holes for him. He's not a total zero man, he's just not a good fit for what we're apparently trying to do here right now with the players we have at the moment.
 
Hervoyel said:
Something I keep coming back to in my mind is that the running game does not look anything like it did in the preseason and I'm not even remotely talking about the results we're getting with it.

I'm talking about the way we're running the ball and what our linemen are doing during running plays. I'm not the most insightful poster in here but I'm not seeing anything "Denver" about our rushing attack. I'm not seeing any lanes to cut back through at all. The only thing I'm seeing is a slow back or a quicker back running straight into the line whether a hole is there or not.

Like I said I'm not the guy you go to if you want to take apart a series of plays and find out what everyone on the line was (or wasn't) doing. I do have a general idea what Denvers offense looks like and this isn't even close.

I believe this is all Green Bay and Mike Sherman and I think that we have a real problem. One thing I do know when I see it is an offense that's straddling philosophies. I watched Capers/Palmer try to coexist for three seasons. This looks a lot like that.
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Amen brother.

Kubiak is coaching the QB/K.Shanahan the receivers/Pariani the tight ends--totally Denver.

Sherman is coaching the line. The blocking doesn't appear to the be same sort of ZBS that Denver does, or even what the Texans did last year.
 
Hervoyel said:
I believe this is all Green Bay and Mike Sherman and I think that we have a real problem. One thing I do know when I see it is an offense that's straddling philosophies. I watched Capers/Palmer try to coexist for three seasons. This looks a lot like that.
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If it's true we aren't running the Denver scheme, asking most of our lineman to lose so much weight might have been a mistake.

Maybe that's why Spencer looked so good to everyone - he's the only guy that didn't make his target weight, or if he did make it he had the highest target.
 
Pathetic. The lack of a running game in Kubiak's philosophy basically spells doom no matter who you have at QB or WR. It is no wonder that we perform well on the first drive of the game, every game. It is the only element of surprise we have the entire game and they must only respect the run for that one drive. They adjust and then we are done offensively.

If they do not get the running game solved, we will not win another game. I see no one on the Offense getting better, thankfully Ryans and Williams are showing consistency and improvement respectively on the defensive side of the ball.

This just in, we suck.
 
HomeBred_Texan said:
A Star Running Back?
A Star Defensive Back?
A Star Wide Receiver?
A Star Line Backer?
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You draft the RB with your 1 next season, sign the best veteran DB you can find and draft another one in either the 2nd or 3rd rounds (depending on which is deeper, LB or DB) and you stand pat with your receivers as they are.

Of course if the Texans had taken Derrick Johnson instead of Travis Johnson then LB would be pretty much set right now. Likewise if we had bothered to try and hang on to Kenny Wright and Marlon McCree (and even Aaron Glenn for another year) we wouldn't be the disaster we are in the secondary.

Don't even get me thinking about what holes we could have plugged with the picks we threw away to get Phillip "should I return this one?" Buchanon and Jason "check out my ink" Babin. Granted I'm not terribly down on Babin but the trade was a train wreck just like the one for Buchanon.
 
Runner said:
If it's true we aren't running the Denver scheme, asking most of our lineman to lose so much weight might have been a mistake.

Maybe that's why Spencer looked so good to everyone - he's the only guy that didn't make his target weight, or if he did make it he had the highest target.
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The weight thing is an interesting deal.

If you talk the weight training/nutrition staff, they make a big point of not being weight focused--that they think it is a mistake to get people at a certain target weight number--they look more at proportions of the weight--muscle and distribution.

I know that Kubiak is very number specific and had target numbers for different linemen. It is very difficult to hit target weights in a short period of time without sacrificing muscle and not having enough energy to do stuff.
 
Hervoyel said:
You draft the RB with your 1 next season, sign the best veteran DB you can find and draft another one in either the 2nd or 3rd rounds (depending on which is deeper, LB or DB) and you stand pat with your receivers as they are.

Of course if the Texans had taken Derrick Johnson instead of Travis Johnson then LB would be pretty much set right now. Likewise if we had bothered to try and hang on to Kenny Wright and Marlon McCree (and even Aaron Glenn for another year) we wouldn't be the disaster we are in the secondary.

Don't even get me thinking about what holes we could have plugged with the picks we threw away to get Phillip "should I return this one?" Buchanon and Jason "check out my ink" Babin. Granted I'm not terribly down on Babin but the trade was a train wreck just like the one for Buchanon.
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Wow, I don't believe it. I never knew anyone on this board could see things as I see them. This is the very first post that anyone has posted that agrees with what I have been saying. Pos reps coming your way.... Thanks
 
Texans_Chick said:
I know that Kubiak is very number specific and had target numbers for different linemen. It is very difficult to hit target weights in a short period of time without sacrificing muscle and not having enough energy to do stuff.
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Excellent point. The players did lose some muscle as well as the pure mass. Now throw into the mix that right after the players lose the weight they go into training camp in the Texans heat and humidity. I'm surprised more lineman didn't go down from the stress.
 
HomeBred_Texan said:
Wow, I don't believe it. I never knew anyone on this board could see things as I see them. This is the very first post that anyone has posted that agrees with what I have been saying. Pos reps coming your way.... Thanks
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Well then it's a pleasant coincidence. I've been thinking RB with the #1 since this season started and every game makes me more certain that this is the way to go. We do need help at DB but I don't think what we need is going to come from putting a rookie (even a first rounder) opposite Dunta. It's not a question of physical ability here, we need a veteran with some game. We need Aaron Glenn from 2003 for instance. Still I'd get me a DB and a LB on day one if I could following that first round RB.

On the DB I'd take the best of CB or FS, whichever one is ranked higher on my board.

The Texans need a lot of help but they also need to sign some veterans to take the place of the ones we don't have thanks to lousy drafting. We've got a shortage of players and an abundance of athletes.
 
Hervoyel said:
Well then it's a pleasant coincidence. I've been thinking RB with the #1 since this season started and every game makes me more certain that this is the way to go. We do need help at DB but I don't think what we need is going to come from putting a rookie (even a first rounder) opposite Dunta. It's not a question of physical ability here, we need a veteran with some game. We need Aaron Glenn from 2003 for instance. Still I'd get me a DB and a LB on day one if I could following that first round RB.

On the DB I'd take the best of CB or FS, whichever one is ranked higher on my board.

The Texans need a lot of help but they also need to sign some veterans to take the place of the ones we don't have thanks to lousy drafting. We've got a shortage of players and an abundance of athletes.
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Well in a different thread, college part, I kept saying we need to get a franchise rb with first pick, everyone would jump me for it, no we need D help. I said look at what drafting D has gotten us so far. Not that we don't need it, we just haven't drafted real smart for whatever reason.

Which brings up the Adrian P debate... In my opinion, a real good high quality running back can make a sub-par O-line look much better. When you get a running game threat, the opposing D can't sit on just 1 part of your game plan. Then I had to hear how DD is great and can walk on water. I have never been a DD fan. If DD was so great, why did the Texans feel they needed to give away a high 2nd rounder for Hollings? Because all coaches knows our running game sucks and until it is fixed, we will never be successful.

It's not that I mind losing, cause sometimes you have to lose in order to win and it makes it much sweeter, but it is more of the way we are losing. We are getting blown out in these games because we cannot control the ball. Once we control the ball, then we have game management and the other team cannot score if they don't have the ball. I want to see more O on the field instead of the D all the time. I like some of our D players, but I didn't pay all of my season ticket money just to see them...

Sorry, got long winded...
 
The dogging on the RB's is knee-jerk.

What's different about Dayne since last year when he put 100 yards on the Cowboys?

What's different about the Cowboys' defense since he put 100 yards on them?

I don't think there's much difference in either case. Ron Dayne was just as fat last year as he is now. The Dallas defense is just as good as it was last year.

That leaves the Offensive Line. He had a good line last year and he doesn't this year. From the first game this season, it's been obvious that the run blocking has deteriorated. Vernand Morency didn't do all that great when he was running behind this line either against Philly.

****Speculation disclaimer. I could be totally off-base, but I doubt it.****

Mike Sherman's got an ego. He's been in the NFL too long to run a rookie HC's offense. I also think that he's got more input than he gets credit for. It was probably a condition of his taking the Asst. HC job.

We've got 1 guy who holds the title of Offensive Coordinator on our staff. We've got 2 guys that used to be OC's. I've got my doubts as to who is actually running the offense.
 
Battle Red Bull said:
The dogging on the RB's is knee-jerk.

What's different about Dayne since last year when he put 100 yards on the Cowboys?

What's different about the Cowboys' defense since he put 100 yards on them?

I don't think there's much difference in either case. Ron Dayne was just as fat last year as he is now. The Dallas defense is just as good as it was last year.
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Maybe the knee jerk reaction is expecting anything more out of Dayne. Last year seems to be the anomaly. Maybe we are overworking him though - he had almost as many carries in the first three games this year as he had in his ten games last year.

-----------------------Games----Runs-------Yds-----Ave
2000-New York Giants------16-----228-------770-----3.4
2001-New York Giants------16-----180-------690-----3.8
2002-New York Giants------16-----125-------428-----3.4
2003-New York Giants-------0-------0----------0------0
2004-New York Giants------14------52-------179-----3.4
2005-Denver Broncos-------10------53-------270-----5.1
2006-Houston Texans--------3------47-------153-----3.3
TOTAL---------------------75-----685------2490-----3.6

http://www.nfl.com/players/playerpage/187386

Battle Red Bull said:
We've got 1 guy who holds the title of Offensive Coordinator on our staff. We've got 2 guys that used to be OC's. I've got my doubts as to who is actually running the offense.
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How much like last year can this team get?
 
V Man said:
I was just thinking about that. Jonathan is still available isn't he. At least he acts like he runs with passion.
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I like that idea but Wells ain't doing nothing behind our current run blocking. I'm not sure Emmitt Smith could do much either.
 
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