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CJ Stroud year 2

steelbtexan said:
Can't wait to see this post with Stroud. It will be everybody else's fault but his when he fails and if he has any measures of success it will be inspite of coaching. At least that's the way it was around these parts when Derrick and BOB were here. Everybody knows the McNair's and Ryans won't get the blame for the failures. So that only leaves Slowik to be the fall guy.
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We had a conversation before about neither of us wanted a QB drafted. I said I would support Stroud since the Texans drafted him and you said you would too. Were you lying then?
 
JB said:
We had a conversation before about neither of us wanted a QB drafted. I said I would support Stroud since the Texans drafted him and you said you would too. Were you lying then?
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I want him to be successful.

I think he will have some success. Maybe even enough to get the Texans to the playoffs. Or he could be another OSU QB bust.
 
JB said:
So do you want to support him or not? If you do when are you going to start?
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I've been clear throughout. I want him to succeed, but I think he will be the anvil to mediocrity for the Texans. If he's successful after yr 3 his agent will come calling for Stroud to get the big bucks. This will destroy the Texans cap and there will be no championships.
 
JB said:
We all want him to be successful. Not many call him dumb and criticize every comment that mentions him. Maybe we have different ideas of supporting and of successful
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We all want him to win a championship. Do you want to know that I dont think he will ever win one because he's to dumb. Or would you rather me lie to you and say man this kool-aid tastes great?

What are your ideas of supporting him and being successful? Example: do you think Moon was successful? I would say he was very successful in getting the Oilers run out of town, despite putting up HOF numbers I would say he was a failure. Like Glanville once said, cant win the big ones.
 
steelbtexan said:
We all want him to win a championship. Do you want to know that I dont think he will ever win one because he's to dumb. Or would you rather me lie to you and say man this kool-aid tastes great?

What are your ideas of supporting him and being successful? Example: do you think Moon was successful? I would say he was very successful in getting the Oilers run out of town, despite putting up HOF numbers I would say he was a failure. Like Glanville once said, cant win the big ones.
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Heaven forbid anyone wanting to see him actually play a game in pads when it counts before dooming him to mediocrity
 
steelbtexan said:
Lmao

Failure isn't an option. You've met me before, I will let you draw your own conclusions. Business owners are generally calculated risk takers
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I’m going to give you an example of a situation that happens all too often on NFL football fields.

QB just threw a beautiful 30+ yard TD strike to hand his team the lead, but 90 seconds are left on the clock. All the defense has to do is hold the lead….they couldn’t stop the opposing offense and they score to win the game with no time on clock.

Who’s the loser or failed leader?

There are 48 men dressed to try and win a game. 48 men have to perform like cohesive unit for 60 minutes and have some luck fall their way. A QB tosses a final second TD bomb….so is he the exclusive leader in that victory? How about the WR who broke coverage and took the top off the defense and made the catch, could he be the leader? How about the OL that blocked well enough to give the play time to develop, could they be the leaders? How about the WR’s, TE(s), and RB who did their jobs in making that play happen, could they be the leaders?

I think Stroud like any rookie QB will have his ups and downs, but in no way will his rookie season define his NFL career. I’m not going to speculate at this time b/c I fully intend on using “my” eyes during the regular season to objectively rate his rookie season.
 
OptimisticTexan said:
I’m going to give you an example of a situation that happens all too often on NFL football fields.

QB just threw a beautiful 30+ yard TD strike to hand his team the lead, but 90 seconds are left on the clock. All the defense has to do is hold the lead….they couldn’t stop the opposing offense and they score to win the game with no time on clock.

Who’s the loser or failed leader?

There are 48 men dressed to try and win a game. 48 men have to perform like cohesive unit for 60 minutes and have some luck fall their way. A QB tosses a final second TD bomb….so is he the exclusive leader in that victory? How about the WR who broke coverage and took the top off the defense and made the catch, could he be the leader? How about the OL that blocked well enough to give the play time to develop, could they be the leaders? How about the WR’s, TE(s), and RB who did their jobs in making that play happen, could they be the leaders?

I think Stroud like any rookie QB will have his ups and downs, but in no way will his rookie season define his NFL career. I’m not going to speculate at this time b/c I fully intend on using “my” eyes during the regular season to objectively rate his rookie season.
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Quote from nothing but the Truth!
 
OptimisticTexan said:
I think Stroud like any rookie QB will have his ups and downs, but in no way will his rookie season define his NFL career. I’m not going to speculate at this time b/c I fully intend on using “my” eyes during the regular season to objectively rate his rookie season.
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Great little paragraph right here OP-Tex, well said !
And in addition just so we don't forget - CJ will be playing for a rookie HC and rookie OC this Fall so all of us who want him to succeed as I do and I know you do will therefore need to be patient.
 
steelbtexan said:
You've never had to meet a payroll? If you have them you know there are winners and losers. It doesn't matter how great of a leader you are if you're a loser. You're business gets shutdown. Successful people are generally the best leaders.
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As has already been stated, comparing a football player to a business is not a particularly good comparison.

In any case, I think we are just talking past each other at this point; I don't think being a winner makes you a leader. I don't think losing makes you a bad leader. Good leaders lose sometimes, bad leaders win sometimes. Tom Brady was not any worse a leader in the seasons he lost the Super Bowl than in the seasons he won it.
 
rmartin65 said:
As has already been stated, comparing a football player to a business is not a particularly good comparison.

In any case, I think we are just talking past each other at this point; I don't think being a winner makes you a leader. I don't think losing makes you a bad leader. Good leaders lose sometimes, bad leaders win sometimes. Tom Brady was not any worse a leader in the seasons he lost the Super Bowl than in the seasons he won it.
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Agree to disagree

We probably live in very different worlds. Nothing wrong with that. The key is respect and I respect you very much.
 
OptimisticTexan said:
I’m going to give you an example of a situation that happens all too often on NFL football fields.

QB just threw a beautiful 30+ yard TD strike to hand his team the lead, but 90 seconds are left on the clock. All the defense has to do is hold the lead….they couldn’t stop the opposing offense and they score to win the game with no time on clock.

Who’s the loser or failed leader?

There are 48 men dressed to try and win a game. 48 men have to perform like cohesive unit for 60 minutes and have some luck fall their way. A QB tosses a final second TD bomb….so is he the exclusive leader in that victory? How about the WR who broke coverage and took the top off the defense and made the catch, could he be the leader? How about the OL that blocked well enough to give the play time to develop, could they be the leaders? How about the WR’s, TE(s), and RB who did their jobs in making that play happen, could they be the leaders?

I think Stroud like any rookie QB will have his ups and downs, but in no way will his rookie season define his NFL career. I’m not going to speculate at this time b/c I fully intend on using “my” eyes during the regular season to objectively rate his rookie season.
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Tell me how the QB played the rest of the game and we might agree with each other.

Agreed about Stroud's rookie season not defining his career. We should be able to tell more about his career after 2 1/2 yrs.
 
rmartin65 said:
In any case, I think we are just talking past each other at this point; I don't think being a winner makes you a leader. I don't think losing makes you a bad leader. Good leaders lose sometimes, bad leaders win sometimes. Tom Brady was not any worse a leader in the seasons he lost the Super Bowl than in the seasons he won it.
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I completely agree.

I'm talking about the entirety of his career to date. Dak has been on some very talented, very complete teams & he struggled to even get them in the playoffs.

I'm not denying there were a plethora of "reasons" he didn't win. But over the course of his career, leadership plays a role.

That's what it means to be a franchise QB. The field general, a team captain.

I also acknowledge his career isn't over.
 
JB said:
Heaven forbid anyone wanting to see him actually play a game in pads when it counts before dooming him to mediocrity
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So we're not allowed to have opinions until after he plays? BTW, I expect him to play well enough to give his fans the I told you so moment they're so desperately looking for. I cant wait until after yr 3.
 
IDEXAN said:
Great little paragraph right here OP-Tex, well said !
And in addition just so we don't forget - CJ will be playing for a rookie HC and rookie OC this Fall so all of us who want him to succeed as I do and I know you do will therefore need to be patient.
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Lets start with is Stroud better than Mills?

How many games did the Texans lose by 1 score or less?

Is the Offense/defense more talented than last yrs on paper right now atleast?

Will the coaching be better and do you like the offensive system/OL be better? TBD.

Is the schedule easier?

So why since the McNair's have done exactly what most of the media has been telling the fanbase they should do, that the fanbase now should have lowered expectations?
 
Stroud has tons of talent. Whether or not that talent is translatable to the NFL is yet to be determined. I certainly hope he's the answer. If not, then it's back to normal for the crappy ole Texans. :lol:
 
Thorn said:
Stroud has tons of talent. Whether or not that talent is translatable to the NFL is yet to be determined. I certainly hope he's the answer. If not, then it's back to normal for the crappy ole Texans. :lol:
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I hope not. Hopefully DeMeco & Nick builds a team that could get Joe Flacco to the Super Bowl or Garoppolo to the NFCCG. All while continuing to look for that special QB.
 
thunderkyss said:
I hope not. Hopefully DeMeco & Nick builds a team that could get Joe Flacco to the Super Bowl or Garoppolo to the NFCCG. All while continuing to look for that special QB.
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I'd like the Texans to get to the point where every game is competitive, not where they are continually outclassed by the talent and coaching on the other side.

Games in which I'm still awake during the 2nd half would be an improvement. Hopefully DeMeco is The Man.
 
beerlover said:
He would be my last choice to do that. Just stick to football and stay out of the limelight. Happy Fathers Day 🍻
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He's not in the limelight, Ryans is in the spotlight.

He along with Slowik will be the scape goats if this doesn't go well.
 
steelbtexan said:
So we're not allowed to have opinions until after he plays? BTW, I expect him to play well enough to give his fans the I told you so moment they're so desperately looking for. I cant wait until after yr 3.
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……for success or failure?
 
steelbtexan said:
Lets start with is Stroud better than Mills?
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If CJ Stroud is not a substantially or potentially substantially superior QB to Mills then obviously the whole organization has made
major blunders in evaluating the two QBs, and the ownership would have also then made major blunders in who they hired as their GM & HC, so needless to say lets hope that' s not what's going to happen here in Houston.
steelbtexan said:
Is the Offense/defense more talented than last yrs on paper right now atleast?

Will the coaching be better and do you like the offensive system/OL be better? TBD.

Is the schedule easier?
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Yes the roster to include the Oline is probably better, the coaching staff should be better, and it would appear to be a less challenging schedule this year than last.
steelbtexan said:
So why since the McNair's have done exactly what most of the media has been telling the fanbase they should do, that the fanbase now should have lowered expectations?
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Even though I like DeMeco a lot and especially his potential for us over the longer term, I'd still feel better about our chances for this year, for the very short term if we had a former SB-winning coach at the helm as the Jags did last year.
 
IDEXAN said:
Even though I like DeMeco a lot and especially his potential for us over the longer term, I'd still feel better about our chances for this year, for the very short term if we had a former SB-winning coach at the helm as the Jags did last year.
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Was there one of those available last year other than Payton who wasn't coming here
 
JB said:
Was there one of those available last year other than Payton who wasn't coming here
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Staley was the guy I wanted two years ago & to tell you the truth I’d be worried about him if I were a Chargers fan. I thought Lovie was the best option.

I do like DeMeco. But I’d have felt better if he’d have brought in an experienced play caller.
 
IDEXAN said:
If CJ Stroud is not a substantially or potentially substantially superior QB to Mills then obviously the whole organization has made
major blunders in evaluating the two QBs, and the ownership would have also then made major blunders in who they hired as their GM & HC, so needless to say lets hope that' s not what's going to happen here in Houston....
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Disagree, in so much that almost everyone across the NFL, if not everyone, was in agreement that Stroud was either the #1 or #2 ranked QB, and with only Anderson possibly ranked higher overall.
 
thunderkyss said:
Staley was the guy I wanted two years ago & to tell you the truth I’d be worried about him if I were a Chargers fan. I thought Lovie was the best option.

I do like DeMeco. But I’d have felt better if he’d have brought in an experienced play caller.
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I love DeMeco's energy! I won't be shocked if he's the NFL coach of the year.
 
thunderkyss said:
Staley was the guy I wanted two years ago & to tell you the truth I’d be worried about him if I were a Chargers fan. I thought Lovie was the best option.

I do like DeMeco. But I’d have felt better if he’d have brought in an experienced play caller.
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Staley was my choice two years ago as well (1st interview was w/Texans).

Staley has struggled mightily to change Charger culture along with his own coaching brand. He is probably the hardest working most determined coach I’ve seen overcoming numerous key injuries, low probability high risk play calling and flexing his two high safety system into more looks & disguises. While rebuilding both trenches.

DeMeco is a better fit for Texans. More proven, conservative approach built on sound fundamentals. Not mention Texan bloodlines. Everything happens for a reason. Expect both teams ascending in 2023.
 
steelbtexan said:
Lets start with is Stroud better than Mills?
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What has Mills accomplished in college or the NFL that says he is better than Stroud? He was 7-6 in 13 college games and 5-21-1 in the 27 NFL games. He literally got benched for Kyle Allen this past season.

steelbtexan said:
How many games did the Texans lose by 1 score or less?
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4

Not including the Titans or Giants games because the Texans scored in the last seconds of both to bring them into one score.

Kindly pointing out that of those four losses within one score, Mills was personally responsible for choking away the win:
Denver - Mills went 1-7 for 3 yards across two possessions after the two-minute warning
Chicago - Mills INT in final 30 seconds set up game-winning FG for the Bears
Dallas - Mills INT in final 30 seconds sealed the Cowboys comeback
Kansas City - Mills fumble on first Texans play in OT set up game-winning FG for Chiefs
 
sandman said:
What has Mills accomplished in college or the NFL that says he is better than Stroud? He was 7-6 in 13 college games and 5-21-1 in the 27 NFL games. He literally got benched for Kyle Allen this past season.



4

Not including the Titans or Giants games because the Texans scored in the last seconds of both to bring them into one score.

Kindly pointing out that of those four losses within one score, Mills was personally responsible for choking away the win:
Denver - Mills went 1-7 for 3 yards across two possessions after the two-minute warning
Chicago - Mills INT in final 30 seconds set up game-winning FG for the Bears
Dallas - Mills INT in final 30 seconds sealed the Cowboys comeback
Kansas City - Mills fumble on first Texans play in OT set up game-winning FG for Chiefs
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This is the main reason the Texans should win 10 games next year.
 
sandman said:
What has Mills accomplished in college or the NFL that says he is better than Stroud? He was 7-6 in 13 college games and 5-21-1 in the 27 NFL games. He literally got benched for Kyle Allen this past season.



4

Not including the Titans or Giants games because the Texans scored in the last seconds of both to bring them into one score.

Kindly pointing out that of those four losses within one score, Mills was personally responsible for choking away the win:
Denver - Mills went 1-7 for 3 yards across two possessions after the two-minute warning
Chicago - Mills INT in final 30 seconds set up game-winning FG for the Bears
Dallas - Mills INT in final 30 seconds sealed the Cowboys comeback
Kansas City - Mills fumble on first Texans play in OT set up game-winning FG for Chiefs
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Cringeworthy stuff.
 
Buckeye Homer said:
As an Orlando Magic fan (lived here 35 years) I can totally relate. Coaches and players have come and gone but the two constants are ownership and LOSING.
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Those little Penny commercials were hilarious though.. Man did his career get derailed. Orlando was supposed to be Kobe and Shaq before Kobe and Shaq.

Oh yeah.. sorry about '95 :winky: No one was stopping Hakeem that year. He was a man on a mission. He basically stuffed MVP David Robinson into a locker.
 
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Carr Bombed said:
Those little Penny commercials were hilarious though.. Man did his career get derailed. Orlando was supposed to be Kobe and Shaq before Kobe and Shaq.

Oh yeah.. sorry about '95 :winky: No one was stopping Hakeem that year. He was a man on a mission. He basically stuffed MVP David Robinson into a locker.
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That series sucked. And then Shaq screwed Orlando by walking away and we got ZERO compensation.
 
Carr Bombed said:
Those little Penny commercials were hilarious though.. Man did his career get derailed. Orlando was supposed to be Kobe and Shaq before Kobe and Shaq.

Oh yeah.. sorry about '95 :winky: No one was stopping Hakeem that year. He was a man on a mission. He basically stuffed MVP David Robinson into a locker.
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The "Hakeem in '95!" is the Houston fan version of Cowboy fan "FIVE RINGS BABY!!!"
 
sandman said:
What has Mills accomplished in college or the NFL that says he is better than Stroud? He was 7-6 in 13 college games and 5-21-1 in the 27 NFL games. He literally got benched for Kyle Allen this past season.



4

Not including the Titans or Giants games because the Texans scored in the last seconds of both to bring them into one score.

Kindly pointing out that of those four losses within one score, Mills was personally responsible for choking away the win:
Denver - Mills went 1-7 for 3 yards across two possessions after the two-minute warning
Chicago - Mills INT in final 30 seconds set up game-winning FG for the Bears
Dallas - Mills INT in final 30 seconds sealed the Cowboys comeback
Kansas City - Mills fumble on first Texans play in OT set up game-winning FG for Chiefs
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Stroud should be better than Mills was last season.

Thanks for proving my point as to why the Texans should win 10 games, particularly against a weaker schedule. The Texans were very close to winning 5-6 games last year.
 
sandman said:
Kindly pointing out that of those four losses within one score, Mills was personally responsible for choking away the win:
Denver - Mills went 1-7 for 3 yards across two possessions after the two-minute warning
Chicago - Mills INT in final 30 seconds set up game-winning FG for the Bears
Dallas - Mills INT in final 30 seconds sealed the Cowboys comeback
Kansas City - Mills fumble on first Texans play in OT set up game-winning FG for Chiefs
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Can someone explain to me why this guy deserves another chance?
 
JB said:
Was there one of those available last year other than Payton who wasn't coming here
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There is really nobody other than DEMeco who I'd rather have as our new HC, but I'm merely pointing out that as a rookie HC I think it will be a couple seasons before he gets thru the learning curve and performs as well as we expect him to.
I for one will be patient and will take the long view and suggest that others do likewise.
 
Lucky said:
Can someone explain to me why this guy deserves another chance?
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I think we owe him a debt for being (lowercase) "the guy" the last two years to get this franchise to point of change that was needed. And I do think this system will help him develop more. Love to have him around as a backup and/or leverage him for draft picks.

But thinking he will actually outplay/perform Stroud when the bullets start flying? C'mon man...
 
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https://twitter.com/x/status/1670828657319739394

C.J. Stroud’s had a very nice spring in Houston. The Texans have put a pretty good lid on information over the five months that incumbent GM Nick Caserio and new coach DeMeco Ryans have been paired, but from what I’ve been able to ascertain, Stroud has shown early signs of justifying his lofty draft position.

We can get this part out of the way first—the arm talent is obvious and translated over to the practice fields in May and June.

Apart from just that, nothing’s looked too big for Stroud, which makes sense, given the stage at Ohio State; he’s shown a high aptitude and isn’t starting from zero when it comes to playing in a pro-style offense. And the coaches and front-office folks have seen other players, even the vets, gravitating toward Stroud, who’s easygoing and comfortable as a leader.

Another thing that’s helped is one specific pre-existing relationship that Stroud had in the Texans building, and that one is with his position coach, Jerrod Johnson. Johnson, who got into camp with a handful of teams as a quarterback himself, was one of Stroud’s 7-on-7 coaches over the summer of 2019 at the Elite 11 finals—and that event (Stroud threw 12 touchdown passes without a pick through the 7-on-7 tournament) is where the then-teenager’s stock as a recruit started to blow up.

The two bonded through the experience, and four years later that time has eased Stroud’s transition into the league. Add to that the knowhow of offensive coordinator Bobby Slowik and offensive assistant Shane Day, and there’s good infrastructure around the rookie, and good reason to think he’ll hit the ground running in late July.
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2. C.J. Stroud, QB, Houston Texans
How he has fared so far: Stroud's ball placement has stood out throughout the spring, as his passes have rarely been off target. Veteran quarterback Case Keenum has been impressed with Stroud's presence and said, "I would have thought he had been here a year, been in the league, been a four-, five-year vet."

Stroud has yet to run exclusively with the first-team offense, as he has split reps with Davis Mills, but it's only a matter of time. -- D.J. Bien-Aime
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www.espn.com

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