TexansBull
Hall of Fame
I think most or close to everyone are willing to draft a QB coming next year if Mills doesn’t he is it. Next year is a better year to draft a QB.
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Should Mills be given the reins next season?
- Thread starter Texansphan
- Start date
I think most or close to everyone are willing to draft a QB coming next year if Mills doesn’t he is it. Next year is a better year to draft a QB.
badboy
Hall of Fame
I don't know about everyone else but I am going to be watching one NFL quarterback and at least two college football quarterbacks extremely closely for the next season.
TheRealJoker
Hall of Fame
Is having a quality starting WR considered kid gloves? I assumed that was running the fisher price offense his first start on a Thursday night. Talented players help teams win (the goal). Cooks is a talented player. If you don’t think he will be a quality player for the next 3 seasons then we’ll have to agree to disagree.
Texansballer74
The Marine
Jerry Rice, Keyshawn Johnson, Joey Galloway, Terrell Owens, Derrick Mason, Randy Moss, TJ Houshmanzadeh, Anquan Boldin, and few others played pretty good at the ages past 30.
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I'm not going to quote everyone here. Just going to say:
* There were 3 WRs over 30 last season in the top 50 in receiving yards. AJ Green (36th), Marvin Jones (37th), Adam Thielen (50th). They collectively averaged 803 yards/season. Those were the best of the best 30 year olds.
* The last age 30+ age WR to have a 1000 yard season was Julio Jones in 2019. He averaged slightly over 600 receiving yards the following 2 seasons.
* Cooks was signed for 2022, his age 29 season. There was no pressing reason to extend him. No reason not to see how Cooks season would go before offering the largest WR AAV contract in Texans history for his age 30 and 31 seasons.
Now if I said the Texans shouldn't sign a 30+ RB to a huge guaranteed contract, I'm sure many would agree with me. Er...not. Many of the same posters applauding the Cooks extension were telling me what a great idea it was to sign 30+ age RBs like David Johnson and Mark Ingram. So pardon me if I take your opinion with a grain of salt.
* There were 3 WRs over 30 last season in the top 50 in receiving yards. AJ Green (36th), Marvin Jones (37th), Adam Thielen (50th). They collectively averaged 803 yards/season. Those were the best of the best 30 year olds.
* The last age 30+ age WR to have a 1000 yard season was Julio Jones in 2019. He averaged slightly over 600 receiving yards the following 2 seasons.
* Cooks was signed for 2022, his age 29 season. There was no pressing reason to extend him. No reason not to see how Cooks season would go before offering the largest WR AAV contract in Texans history for his age 30 and 31 seasons.
Now if I said the Texans shouldn't sign a 30+ RB to a huge guaranteed contract, I'm sure many would agree with me. Er...not. Many of the same posters applauding the Cooks extension were telling me what a great idea it was to sign 30+ age RBs like David Johnson and Mark Ingram. So pardon me if I take your opinion with a grain of salt.
If he falls off of a cliff at age 30, (Which I doubt happens) then Caserio is only paying for 1 yr of lack of production, while in the meantime giving the young guys a vet to learn the ropes from. Well worth the investment. IMHO
I liked the Ingram signing at the time and still do. A 1 yr deal for a leader like Ingram. No RB was going to be successful running behind that OL.
leebigeztx
Keep it Movin!
Remember how everyone had Tua as a can't miss and he's been avg at best. Its hard to judge the physical abilities of the Bama qb's because the team has soo much talent around them. The o-line,rb,wr. I watch Bryce Young play and I'm looking for his special trait. He has an nfl arm, but he's also small. He's also throwing in canyons. When he was under extreme pressure in the college championship game, he was very,very regular. That's why you need to also look for special traits like Herbert.
Carr Bombed
Hall of Fame
I never liked Tua, didn't like him in College, didn't like him as a prospect.. Felt the same way about Sam Darnold. (That dude looks like a character out of a Lego movie, block head).
So what does Cooks extension have to do with helping discern if Mills can play?
It assures that Mills will have a dependable vet wr he can count on for the next 2 yrs. Do you think reliability is a trait to be valued?
A reliable WR is always a trait to be valued. My question is when did it become fashionable to value that trait? Based on the reaction and justifications for the Hopkins trade by many on this forum, it wasn't valued. They were more concerned about WR targets.
NOTE: I'm not attacking any poster. Just the narrative of a WR1 getting too many targets to justify a bad trade without any concerns regarding losing a reliable WR.
Cooks was the only reliable WR Mills had and he was a rookie with very little playing experience. There's alot of difference between this and a 3rd yr QB forcing the ball to his college buddy when he had guys like WFV to throw to and Miller to throw the ball too and a guy who's had less than 30 starts in the college and the pro's. Do you think it's a coincidence that the QB had his best yr after Hopkins was traded? I dont.
Texansballer74
The Marine
Dude stop it. You were on to something until you brought up f boy. Every darn quarterback before him force fed Watson. Drew force fed his top receiver, Big Ben did the same and Rodgers force fed Adams. So can you please stop it with that none sense, because that list goes pretty darn long.
So you think it's a coincidence he had his best yr the yr after Hopkins left?
BTW, how many championships has Rodgers won with the forcing the ball to Adams.
Meanwhile Burrow and company make it to the SB spreading the ball around. The Rams forced the ball to Kupp out of necessity after Woods went down and they got lucky OBJ became available to take pressure off of Kupp.
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Sounds like you haven't been following the conversation.
Texansballer74
The Marine
Drew had a dynamite year without his main target as well. But that’s not the point. Every darn quarterback will go to the best receiver on the team. Even the great Brady went to Randy a lot and often. So again stop the nonsense.
TexansBull
Hall of Fame
We all choose our hills to die on.
TexansBull
Hall of Fame
Ask the FO. I didn’t offer the contract.
I would think that the FO is hedging their bets.
They will have receiver with very similar production numbers to Devante Adams for the next two years at a cheaper rate compared to Adams and the rapid escalating cost of WRs. 1 year for Mills and if he doesn’t work out then 1 year for new rookie. It may be next year we draft a rookie QB to take place if Mills and a rookie WR to take place of Cooks. Or Nico if he doesn’t step up this year.
Don’t know if this is the plan but it sounds like Cooks is an insurance plan for Mills, or another QB, or a new incoming WR.
If Mills shows he is the guy, and Nico shows he is the guy what a great position to be in to use those draft picks next year on other positions if need.
TexansBull
Hall of Fame
And having a WR that can put up numbers like Devante Adams is a lot better to have around to grade a QB and help them grow.
If the QB keeps throwing to players with brick hands or butterfingers how do you know what you got?
Texansballer74
The Marine
Cooks was extended for several reasons.
1) He has been consistent and reliable.
2) He is a veteran leader for this team, especially for this offensive unit.
3) To help Nico and the other young receivers.
4) To continue to help Mills in his progressions.
5) He has been healthy.
1) He has been consistent and reliable.
2) He is a veteran leader for this team, especially for this offensive unit.
3) To help Nico and the other young receivers.
4) To continue to help Mills in his progressions.
5) He has been healthy.
I've been told by the mods that I can't respond about different QBs and target shares in this thread anymore. So you can have the last word.
michaelm
vox nihili
I was against trading Cooks because I wanted him here for this season to help with Mills development.
I'm luke warm on the extension. That comes with worse ROI for me, for 2023/24.
I think they slightly over paid, but not enough to upset me.
@Lucky has a point that it's the additional years that are the concern. You can cite whatever examples you like of players having success after the age of 30, yet it's undeniable that the odds are increasingly against it, after that age.
Personally, I feel like Cooks can be an exception, but I can't be surprised by it if he fails to buck the obvious odds against him.
I'm luke warm on the extension. That comes with worse ROI for me, for 2023/24.
I think they slightly over paid, but not enough to upset me.
@Lucky has a point that it's the additional years that are the concern. You can cite whatever examples you like of players having success after the age of 30, yet it's undeniable that the odds are increasingly against it, after that age.
Personally, I feel like Cooks can be an exception, but I can't be surprised by it if he fails to buck the obvious odds against him.
The extension really only added 1 more year to his deal. It's not really a big deal.
leebigeztx
Keep it Movin!
Burrow had Higgins and Boyd along with the te and mixon. When Fuller played, which was very little, he got passes thrown his way or did I miss something. Fuller had targets when he played. When Fuller was hurt, who else could get open? KeKe looked to be that guy, but he couldn't stay out of the dog house. Look, if you want to say any qb needs weapons, no argument from me, but don't act like Watson has a bunch of weapons besides Hopkins.
leebigeztx
Keep it Movin!
What about Van Jefferson?
leebigeztx
Keep it Movin!
How many games did Fuller play as a Texans? The one thing you praise Stafford for despite throwing the most pick 6's in the history of the nfl, you hold against Watson. Kupp had more targets than anyone in the history of the nfl. Not only that, even with a oncoming Jefferson and OBJ on the roster, he was still being force fed. Lets not make Woods out to be Reggie Wayne opposite of Harrison either.
texanhead08
All Pro
Will Fuller games played
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The Next Franchise Starting QB for the Houston Texans is…Kyler Murray?
Unfounded rumor for sure.
But... If you were the Texans would you do it?
Nevermind the cost. Just say it's an even trade, Mills for Murray, would you do it?
Why or why not?
Unfounded rumor for sure.
But... If you were the Texans would you do it?
Nevermind the cost. Just say it's an even trade, Mills for Murray, would you do it?
Why or why not?
Texansphan
Football connoisseur
The first thought that comes to mind is why would Atlanta want to trade Murray in the first place?
Mills and Murray are two different styles of quarterback.
Which brings me to question #2 - which style does our coaching staff prefer?
Didn't the Calhoun's just trade a Diva QB?
Texansphan
Football connoisseur
Absolutely.
Let the big guys up front fight the battles.
By your responses, I take it you don't believe Kyler Murray is a Franchise QB. Or you believe Davis Mills is a Franchise QB.
I don't think Murray is a franchise QB. He's dynamic & you're going to win some games. But I don't think he's a franchise QB.
I don't think Murray is a franchise QB. He's dynamic & you're going to win some games. But I don't think he's a franchise QB.
Texansballer74
The Marine
Sticking with Mills
OptimisticTexan
2024 / Rebuilding Block 4 After Playoffs / Texans
I just wasn’t sure when 5’-8” to 5’-10” offensive linemen became a thing……
Context is everything
Remember, we didn't win the Super Bowl in 2021, we're not going to win it in 2022, & it's highly unlikely we'll win it in 2023.
I'd have signed Dalton, Flacco, Foles... or some veteran QB who has actually won games in the NFL & have been relatively healthy. Someone who can run an NFL offense & provide consistent leadership from the QB position.
I understand most won't like the idea. The guys I mentioned aren't the future of the Texans. I agree with that.
My idea is to build a team with Alex Smith, then put a Mohomes in the middle of it.
So far, the Mills build looks alright.
Maybe he's the one. I hope he is. Maybe he's our Burrow or Josh Allen, maybe Nick can put together a team that can compete in 2023/2024 & Mills turns out to be that guy. I hope so.
Just not the way I would have done it.
Texansphan
Football connoisseur
I could get on board with one of those guys coming over, but would he be starter and at what point do you give Mills more time under center?
We watched him progress, so why jeopardize that progression? Would the old vet resent playing second fiddle to him?
Make Mills the man and if he bombs out, then next draft you take another guy and perhaps try to get another vet in to help the rookie out.
This was in lieu of drafting Mills, with an eye of drafting a franchise QB in 2023/2024
with Mills on the roster now & bringing one of the guys would be like bringing in an extra QB coach.
Texansphan
Football connoisseur
All three of those guys have similar game to Mills so yeah.
The Pencil Neck
Hall of Fame
I would totally be for bringing in someone experienced like a Foles to be the backup, and also be able to help Mills in his development.
I'm against bringing in someone else to be the #1, and I'm against bringing in someone else who's young that needs extra work to develop.
I want Mills to get as many 1st team snaps as he can handle.
I'm against bringing in someone else to be the #1, and I'm against bringing in someone else who's young that needs extra work to develop.
I want Mills to get as many 1st team snaps as he can handle.
Dejaview
All Pro
But isn’t this just kicking the can down the road? mills was selected over a year ago so you want to wait until 2023 to begin to think about getting a longer term QB fix? You seem to me to be saying Mills wasn’t worth the pick because some other third rounder in 2021 was going to be so much more valuable and that we in some way set ourselves back with his pick. Well for one who was that third rounder? i guess you can scratch through the list to see if someone had a good year and say “that one!” but that’s too easy. Otherwise is there any guarantees in 2023 or 2024 your QB will be there to select and, if so, is guaranteed not to fail? And if Mills is even half way good this year you will get more than a third rounder in a trade if you want to go that route. And if he is half way good isn’t that about what you were going to get out of a retread anyway? In the end I just can’t imagine that this thread exists because of the nature of the position, the round of selection, and the intrigue that his play has shown. Seems to me like his pick has turned into a no brainer that is probably the envy of a lot of teams that could have made this selection so far out of the first round. It has already shown not to be a wasted pick IMO.
Texansphan
Football connoisseur
We saw the benefits of him having consistent play time through the season once TT went down.
We need to keep that going as I doubt we have seen his ceiling yet.
I'm approaching the question from two perspectives.
One, I believe team building should start in the trenches. Didn't make sense to draft Watson after you've decimated your OL. I believe Watson's inexperience in reading pre/post snap was a disadvantage for the young guys we had on the OL trying to learn how to play. Same with Mills in the O'Brien offense. Similarly, I didn't think we should have drafted a QB to be the future of the team when we've got next to nothing as far as a team, especially the OL.
Secondly, I'm looking at it from the perspective of where we are now. It appears the Texans believe Davis Mills may be a franchise guy. I don't think he's Brady or Mahomes, so I'm not expecting him to lead the Texans to a Super Bowl in his 2nd year. If I were the FO thinking Mills is a franchise guy, 2022 is about development.
I've never approached it that way. I don't have a clue who is playing what in college. For me it's about team building & the pieces taken to address different aspects of the team. Taking a QB you're expecting to lead your team, developing that QB is a huge part of your program. Like I said there's too much, "We have to do this for Mills, we have to do that for Mills, etc"
Hopefully we have the coaches who can develop a QB & build a team at the same time. Something they were not able to do with a more talented QB. Something most bad teams have not been able to do.
Every QB has to learn to read defenses, call plays in the huddle, adjust plays at the LOS, and execute at a high level. A retread already knows how to do those things allowing the young OL, RBs, WRs, & TEs to trust what the QB is saying from the huddle, at the LOS, & have a good idea what's going to happen after the snap. So they can play faster & worry about their job instead of having to interpret what the rookie QB is trying to say.
Your coaches don't have to "simplify" the offense for the receivers, the OL, & the QB.
It has. I'm not denying that. I've said before, far as I'm concerned, if I were the Texans I'd approach Mills' future the same way the Patriots approach Mac Jones. He's my QB of the future until he shows me he's not.
Unfortunately, Davis Mills is not in the same position as Mac Jones. Instead he's in a situation more similar to Trevor Lawrence, Zach Wilson, & Daniel Jones. They're more likely to fail than not & the team doesn't get any better around them. Largely due to having to deal with an inexperienced QB.
Dejaview
All Pro
I don’t have any deep thoughts or problems with any of this. I just don’t think it’s relevant. we are talking third round here and our starter was TT. It’s a layup. And we don’t know how any other pick would have performed at that spot to compare it to DM’s contribution Anyway.