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FIRE O'BRIEN NOW!!!

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steelbtexan said:
We shouldn't ignore anything,
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talent level my ass. We were out coached plain and simple. The colts defense isn’t that good. They shut us down. Their offense isn’t that good. They had their way with us. Poor offensive game plan and even poorer defensive game plan.

Did you watch the rams colts game? That’s what real game planning looks like. We are vanilla on offense and defense. That’s not good enough in the playoffs. Never will be. Do we need more healthy weapons on offense and better blocking? Of course. Will that make a difference next year? We will see.

My bet is that a murder row of QBs on next years schedule will finally expose OB and RC for the coach he is.
 
JB said:
Yeah and maybe even more than that
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Lots of blame to go around unfortunately but my main concern going forward is a coach that I do not believe is very good.

I hate our play designs.

I don’t have any confidence in his ability to evaluate talent and to play to their strengths and weaknesses.

After 5 years I hear a lot of talk about what he wants and I’m not seeing anything close to that.
 
mussop said:
talent level my ass. We were out coached plain and simple. The colts defense isn’t that good. They shut us down. Their offense isn’t that good. They had their way with us. Poor offensive game plan and even poorer defensive game plan.

Did you watch the rams colts game? That’s what real game planning looks like. We are vanilla on offense and defense. That’s not good enough in the playoffs. Never will be. Do we need more healthy weapons on offense and better blocking? Of course. Will that make a difference next year? We will see.

My bet is that a murder row of QBs on next years schedule will finally expose OB and RC for the coach he is.
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You gotta have the WR's to beat the Colts defense and Jesus in cleats had a bad game as pointed out earlier. Without decent CB's Luck had a field day.
 
Mr teX said:
Quality of opponent is the theme for ALL coaches lol & the game develops & is called according to who has the most matchups and talent in their favor...always has been. The great equalizer is usually the qb, not the HC.

Look at the games yesterday. The Colts looked nothing like the offensive juggernaut they’d been looking like against everyone else. Luck looked like HE was in his 1st playoff game.

So what is the most likely explanation for this? Reich all of a sudden forgot how to call plays? Luck all of a sudden forgot how to read defenses? Unlikely considering both were going against the 31st ranked defense. That game unfolded for the Colts almost identically to how our game against them did for pretty much the exact same reasons. They got down double digits early in the 1st qtr in the blink of an eye. Matchup wise, they couldn’t protect Luck all that well as the chiefs sacked him 3 times & pressured him a number of other times. Castonzo and Smith had a tough time holding up against Houston and Ford. Look on the other side as well. The abundance of weapons for KC ripped that defense to shreds b/c the Colts couldn’t match up w Kelce, Hill and Williams.

It’s not nearly as much X’s & O’s as ya’ll think it is.
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BS. Zero creative play calling on either side of the ball was our downfall. Do you think ford and Houston are better than Watt and Clowney? No it was their scheme that helped them do better. DC for Chiefs called several blitzes that brought pressure from different angles. He mixed it up well. RC went vanilla and relied on our front seven to just beat their man. VANILLA!!!!! Good QBs eat up vanilla.
 
mussop said:
BS. Zero creative play calling on either side of the ball was our downfall. Do you think ford and Houston are better than Watt and Clowney? No it was their scheme that helped them do better. DC for Chiefs called several blitzes that brought pressure from different angles. He mixed it up well. RC went vanilla and relied on our front seven to just beat their man. VANILLA!!!!! Good QBs eat up vanilla.
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Bob Sutton is the DC for KC.
 
DBCooper said:
Except if you were to give Andy Reid one offseason this team would improve immensely.
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Wrong. Reid didn’t build anything in 1 offseason. The credit for the turnaround in KC probably belongs more to John Dorsey b/c most of that talent Reid is utilizing Dorsey drafted. Yet Reid was still underachieving with it though up until this year.

All Dorsey has done since leaving KC however is rebuild the Browns and given them a seemingly bright future.

If anything it highlights what a good GM can do for a team.
 
mussop said:
BS. Zero creative play calling on either side of the ball was our downfall. Do you think ford and Houston are better than Watt and Clowney? No it was their scheme that helped them do better. DC for Chiefs called several blitzes that brought pressure from different angles. He mixed it up well. RC went vanilla and relied on our front seven to just beat their man. VANILLA!!!!! Good QBs eat up vanilla.
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Good QBs eat up blitzing too genius.
 
Mr teX said:
Wrong. Reid didn’t build anything in 1 offseason. The credit for the turnaround in KC probably belongs more to John Dorsey b/c most of that talent Reid is utilizing Dorsey drafted. Yet Reid was still underachieving with it though up until this year.

All Dorsey has done since leaving KC however is rebuild the Browns and given them a seemingly bright future.

If anything it highlights what a good GM can do for a team.
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I said we’d be better.
 
DBCooper said:
Lots of blame to go around unfortunately but my main concern going forward is a coach that I do not believe is very good.

I hate our play designs.

I don’t have any confidence in his ability to evaluate talent and to play to their strengths and weaknesses.

After 5 years I hear a lot of talk about what he wants and I’m not seeing anything close to that.
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I don't think he knows what he wants
 
DBCooper said:
I said we’d be better.
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Considering Reid was regularly getting bounced in the playoffs early with better talent than BoB has had to work with...I’m gonna say it’s somewhat unlikely we’d be better...especially if he had Ricky as his GM.

Reid wasn’t doing much more than BoB is now until he upgraded his talent level at the most important position in the game...
 
Mr teX said:
Considering Reid was regularly getting bounced in the playoffs early with better talent than BoB has had to work with...I’m gonna say it’s somewhat unlikely we’d be better...especially if he had Ricky as his GM.

Reid wasn’t doing much more than BoB is now until he upgraded his talent level at the most important position in the game...
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I’m interested in what genius you see in O’Brien’s coaching abilities.
 
DBCooper said:
I’m interested in what genius you see in O’Brien’s coaching abilities.
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I don’t see any genius in BOB. However I think people forget just how bad Ried has been in past playoffs. He’s had some bad brain farts in clock management and some oddball play calls at the biggest moments. I’m personally rooting for Ried to win it all this year
 
DBCooper said:
I’m interested in what genius you see in O’Brien’s coaching abilities.
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So b/c I don’t join in on the tar and feathering I somehow think that BoB is a genius or super great coach?

I think the same thing about BoB that I think about most other HC’s not named Belichick who is the only HC in the league today who has consistently shown he can win pretty much no matter what. But even with him there’s the Tom Brady factor.

The difference between a good HC and bad one imo will always be the amount of talent and depth they have to work with. Without 1 or the other, they’ll all look like they don’t know what they’re doing. And BoB more or less...but especially this year got the most out of what he had to work with. Had a pretty good talent base to start with, but as soon as he had to start relying on his depth, things got difficult.
Beyond that, he does a good job of keeping this teams believing, focused, which is probably the toughest thing to do as a HC.

Does that make him great? No. But I believe with more talent and depth, he can get this team to new heights. i don’t think he’s any worse as a HC than a John/Jim Harbaugh, Jim Caldwell John Fox, Jim Fassel, Ron Rivera, Brian Billick or Jon Gruden. All of which took teams to SB’s.
 
Mr teX said:
Good QBs eat up blitzing too genius.
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Well then why didn’t luck and the colts win yesterday or the Texans win against the colts when they blitzed so much genius? Luck was constantly under pressure. Good DCs know how to disguise And mix up blitzes. RC just says Watt and Clowney go get em.

Good schemes that get pressure give all QBs fits. Vanilla gets devoured by good QBs.
 
Mr teX said:
So b/c I don’t join in on the tar and feathering I somehow think that BoB is a genius or super great coach?

I think the same thing about BoB that I think about most other HC’s not named Belichick who is the only HC in the league today who has consistently shown he can win pretty much no matter what. But even with him there’s the Tom Brady factor.

The difference between a good HC and bad one imo will always be the amount of talent and depth they have to work with. Without 1 or the other, they’ll all look like they don’t know what they’re doing. And BoB more or less...but especially this year got the most out of what he had to work with. Had a pretty good talent base to start with, but as soon as he had to start relying on his depth, things got difficult.
Beyond that, he does a good job of keeping this teams believing, focused, which is probably the toughest thing to do as a HC.

Does that make him great? No. But I believe with more talent and depth, he can get this team to new heights. i don’t think he’s any worse as a HC than a John/Jim Harbaugh, Jim Caldwell John Fox, Jim Fassel, Ron Rivera, Brian Billick or Jon Gruden. All of which took teams to SB’s.
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OB sucks. Deal with it.
 
mussop said:
Well then why didn’t luck and the colts win yesterday or the Texans win against the colts when they blitzed so much genius? Luck was constantly under pressure. Good DCs know how to disguise And mix up blitzes. RC just says Watt and Clowney go get em.

Good schemes that get pressure give all QBs fits. Vanilla gets devoured by good QBs.
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Schemes are only as good as the talent in them and the matchups they create.

the Chiefs didn’t need to blitz much to get after Luck. They were able to do what we couldn’t do...which was get pressure on him fast & pretty consistently with just their front 3-4 and drop the rest. Really had next to nothing to do with a vanilla scheme and game plan like you’re trying to assert. Justin Houston and Dee Ford gave Castonzo and Smith all they could handle on the edges and Nelson had his hands full with Jones in the middle.
 
Mr teX said:
Schemes are only as good as the talent in them and the matchups they create.

the Chiefs didn’t need to blitz much to get after Luck. They were able to do what we couldn’t do...which was get pressure on him fast & pretty consistently with just their front 3-4 and drop the rest. Really had next to nothing to do with a vanilla scheme and game plan like you’re trying to assert. Justin Houston and Dee Ford gave Castonzo and Smith all they could handle on the edges and Nelson had his hands full with Jones in the middle.
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So basically, you’re saying Houston & Ford are better than Watt & Clowney. Sad, if true.
 
Mr teX said:
So b/c I don’t join in on the tar and feathering I somehow think that BoB is a genius or super great coach?

I think the same thing about BoB that I think about most other HC’s not named Belichick who is the only HC in the league today who has consistently shown he can win pretty much no matter what. But even with him there’s the Tom Brady factor.

The difference between a good HC and bad one imo will always be the amount of talent and depth they have to work with. Without 1 or the other, they’ll all look like they don’t know what they’re doing. And BoB more or less...but especially this year got the most out of what he had to work with. Had a pretty good talent base to start with, but as soon as he had to start relying on his depth, things got difficult.
Beyond that, he does a good job of keeping this teams believing, focused, which is probably the toughest thing to do as a HC.

Does that make him great? No. But I believe with more talent and depth, he can get this team to new heights. i don’t think he’s any worse as a HC than a John/Jim Harbaugh, Jim Caldwell John Fox, Jim Fassel, Ron Rivera, Brian Billick or Jon Gruden. All of which took teams to SB’s.
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So in 5 years why hasn’t he found anyone that fits his “system”?

I love his handpicked guys too!

Lol
 
Texazan said:
I don’t see any genius in BOB. However I think people forget just how bad Ried has been in past playoffs. He’s had some bad brain farts in clock management and some oddball play calls at the biggest moments. I’m personally rooting for Ried to win it all this year
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I’m just saying the minute you bring Reid in this team is upgraded.

Not even talking about Reid’s inadequacies in the playoffs.

Just that we need a real offensive mind running our offense.
 
dream_team said:
So basically, you’re saying Houston & Ford are better than Watt & Clowney. Sad, if true.
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It’s match ups.

Watt isn’t a speed guy, he’s a finesse, hustle rusher. Clowney is supposed to be and can be a speed rusher, but they use him everywhere & when he’s is on the edge, he’s too undisciplined to set the edge as a pass rusher b/c his go to move is to dip inside.

Houston nor Ford are dipping inside like that, they rush from the outside & stay out there. Houston in particular is a true speed rusher in that his go to move is just to beat u around the corner. The results: Justin Houston 2 sacks, Ford 1 strip sack.
 
DBCooper said:
I’m just saying the minute you bring Reid in this team is upgraded.

Not even talking about Reid’s inadequacies in the playoffs.

Just that we need a real offensive mind running our offense.
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I don’t disagree with that. I think Ried has by far proven himself to be better coach. It’s an offensive league now so yea I’d like to see us not waste Hop and Watson. Whether or not BOB gets an OC or not I think next year is it for him.
 
DBCooper said:
So in 5 years why hasn’t he found anyone that fits his “system”?

I love his handpicked guys too!

Lol
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Look no further than Rick Smith For the explanation for that.

As far as the coaching moves, BoB has made changes to his coaching staff every single year he’s been here. So I don’t doubt that we have some coming this year.
 
DBCooper said:
So in 5 years why hasn’t he found anyone that fits his “system”?

I love his handpicked guys too!

Lol
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Look no further than Rick Smith For the explanation for that.

As far as the coaching moves, BoB has made changes to his coaching staff every single year he’s been here. So I don’t doubt that we have some coming this year.
ColeThornton said:
"He can take his'n and beat your'n and then take your'n and beat his'n."

A good coach get's more out of the same talent as a bad coach.

It's the most important thing a coach does!
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Maybe in college football that was true years ago when it was said...not so much on the pro level, much less in today’s game.
 
Mr teX said:
Schemes are only as good as the talent in them and the matchups they create.
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Dumb de dumb dumb. That’s a dumb way to look at it. Par for course for you. Good schemes will take advantage of your teams strengths and opposing teams weaknesses. We have plenty of talent. A Good designed scheme can also mask weaknesses. What we don’t have is coaches that know how to take advantage of it.

Go back to playing madden where you belong.
 
Mr teX said:
Look no further than Rick Smith For the explanation for that.

As far as the coaching moves, BoB has made changes to his coaching staff every single year he’s been here. So I don’t doubt that we have some coming this year.



Maybe in college football that was true years ago when it was said...not so much on the pro level, much less in today’s game.
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Where do you come up with this stupid ****? Yeah it’s all about talent. Dumbest take award nominee.
 
Mr teX said:
Look no further than Rick Smith For the explanation for that.

As far as the coaching moves, BoB has made changes to his coaching staff every single year he’s been here. So I don’t doubt that we have some coming this year.



Maybe in college football that was true years ago when it was said...not so much on the pro level, much less in today’s game.
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What’s the expiration date on the Rick Smith excuse?
 
Mr teX said:
Matchup wise, they couldn’t protect Luck all that well as the chiefs sacked him 3 times & pressured him a number of other times. Castonzo and Smith had a tough time holding up against Houston and Ford
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That's the same matchup I thought we stacked well against Indy. Clowney, Watt, & Mercilus should have been able to put more pressure on Luck than they did.

I understand they "invested" I their OL. But with Watt & Clowney playing as well as they did this season, should have been an equalizer for us.
 
Mr teX said:
Wrong. Reid didn’t build anything in 1 offseason. The credit for the turnaround in KC probably belongs more to John Dorsey b/c most of that talent Reid is utilizing Dorsey drafted. Yet Reid was still underachieving with it though up until this year.

All Dorsey has done since leaving KC however is rebuild the Browns and given them a seemingly bright future.

If anything it highlights what a good GM can do for a team.
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But... our team was drafted by Ricky
 
Mr teX said:
The difference between a good HC and bad one imo will always be the amount of talent and depth they have to work with.
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Eh... players who weren't anything go to New England & become all-pros. Players the rest of the league has given up on go to New England & have their best seasons. Playmakers leave New England & become over paid JAGs. Offensive gurus leave New England & can't manage more than three plays.
 
mussop said:
Dumb de dumb dumb. That’s a dumb way to look at it. Par for course for you. Good schemes will take advantage of your teams strengths and opposing teams weaknesses. We have plenty of talent. A Good designed scheme can also mask weaknesses. What we don’t have is coaches that know how to take advantage of it.

Go back to playing madden where you belong.
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Lol....I guess that’s why teams fall over themselves every year trying to draft this guy or get that guy in FA. And I guess that’s why HC after HC fail every year ..b/c they just aren’t creative enough scheme wise to be able to “mask” the weakenesses of their teams. you’re an idiot if u believe that scheme trumps talent. You’re even more of an idiot if you believe that coaches believe that.

But carry on...
 
thunderkyss said:
Eh... players who weren't anything go to New England & become all-pros. Players the rest of the league has given up on go to New England & have their best seasons. Playmakers leave New England & become over paid JAGs. Offensive gurus leave New England & can't manage more than three plays.
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Ok you do realize you’re talking about 1 team right...who just happens to have arguably the goat HC and qb....

And outside of 1 guy in Wes Welker, can’t think of any other player that came to New England as a JAG from somewhere else and became an all pro in NE. Most guys that go there already had a pedigree in the league, or were brought up in that system. There’s possibly a few others but let’s not act like this is a common thing.
 
Mr teX said:
"He can take his'n and beat your'n and then take your'n and beat his'n."

A good coach get's more out of the same talent as a bad coach.

It's the most important thing a coach does!

Maybe in college football that was true years ago when it was said...not so much on the pro level, much less in today’s game.
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You really don't think good coaches get more out of their talent than bad coaches at any level in any era?
 
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thunderkyss said:
That's the same matchup I thought we stacked well against Indy. Clowney, Watt, & Mercilus should have been able to put more pressure on Luck than they did.

I understand they "invested" I their OL. But with Watt & Clowney playing as well as they did this season, should have been an equalizer for us.
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Yeah it “should’ve” been but it wasn’t b/c they didn’t consistently win their 1 on 1 match ups. Crennel playing it like he did was about the best we could do b/c u can’t really play effective zone coverage blitzing heavily which is what everyone wanted up to do more of....we tried that against Philly and Foles ate us up. and with our secondary, you don’t want those guys trying to match up in man..rock and a hard place and all that...
 
ColeThornton said:
You really don't think good coaches get more out of their talent than bad coaches at any level in any era?
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I absolutely do...said as much in a previous post...which is why I believe BoB is closer to a good coach than a bad one because more often than not, he has gotten the most out of his teams.

But that saying...especially according to who said it and what level of football they said it,applies more to the lower levels than on the higher ones.
 
Mr teX said:
I absolutely do...said as much in a previous post...which is why I believe BoB is closer to a good coach than a bad one because more often than not, he has gotten the most out of his teams.

But that saying...especially according to who said it and what level of football they said it,applies more to the lower levels than on the higher ones.
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Bum Phillips said it about Don Shula, he may also have said it about others(Bear Bryant) because it is such an obvious truism at every level! To say "Maybe, in college football that was true years ago when it was said...not so much on the pro level, much less in today’s game."... "Maybe, years ago..." there's no maybe about it and it's still true today in the NFL.

https://www.nytimes.com/1992/11/01/...t-age-62-don-shula-is-still-going-strong.html
 
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