Considering our draft picks, I believe we could become competitive much more quickly, if we went back to a ZBS - spread offense, and focused on lighter, quicker, athletic linemen. They're more fun to watch ... IMHO !
Keep Texans Talk Google Ad Free!
Venmo Tip Jar | Paypal Tip Jar
Thanks for your support! 🍺😎👍
State of the O-line
- Thread starter jradMIT
- Start date
Yeah, I heard this on 610 this evening while driving in the car. It's good to see DQ finally get an opportunity for some action in a game. To bad Martin and Reader had to go on IR though.
badboy
Hall of Fame
Setting aside my respect and pride in Q's recovery and handling himself during the diagnosis and treatment of cancer, IMO it is time for him to produce or be moved off roster/practice squad. My concern is I am not sure if he has the strength,skills or whatever is needed to be an offensive lineman. I'm glad he has been moved onto roster & hopefully to get some significant playing time to determine his status 2018. If he is not ready to be at minimum a solid backup he needs to go & allow another to take his spot. I hope he succeeds but that is still in question.
It would be nice if Slade & Fuller could 'own' RG. Either or together in some type of rotation. I also think an OG like Auburn's Braden Smith who is evaluated as both run and pass blocking sound could start sometime during 2018 at RG and quickly move to LG at some point if needed. I have not seen enough of Hernandez to say much but he will probably be gone. Manz cannot be successful at OG. Martin maybe but no effort made this year which says something.
I personally think Davenport will see significant time at LT but if available and I think he might be in third LT Tyrell Crosby @ Oregon could be a ten year starter. Another LT that at minimum be depth is Memphis' Trevon Tate who could begin at RT and move to LT eventually. He is not ranked higher than day three that I can find but my research indicates a decent player with high ceiling. I have as our 4th. Gia, Lamm should be gone and most likely X.
Many are focusing on Smith's history and as usual it can & has been
. I understand that but moaning and groaning does not accomplish anything. Smith is going anywhere. I have O'Brien at 90% here for his last contract year 2018. So I choose to accept that (whether it is best or not) and post accordingly. I don't see any FA that will satisfy need at LT or right side either. It would be great if someone would research if there is a player we could trade for to fill that need. Doesn't have to be a super star just a better than avg player who could hold the spot for 1-2 years & not get our QB hurt. This leads to Watson making our 2018 line better than what we have had this season. I would not trade our 1st three picks 2019 as going to be very valuable.
This is not going to be resolved 100% this off-season & we should be realistic about that. Focus for me is OL and one S and one CB for depth in draft with FA for possible starters. I like Keenum, we have $ and he should be willing to come home with high likelihood DW goes down.
It would be nice if Slade & Fuller could 'own' RG. Either or together in some type of rotation. I also think an OG like Auburn's Braden Smith who is evaluated as both run and pass blocking sound could start sometime during 2018 at RG and quickly move to LG at some point if needed. I have not seen enough of Hernandez to say much but he will probably be gone. Manz cannot be successful at OG. Martin maybe but no effort made this year which says something.
I personally think Davenport will see significant time at LT but if available and I think he might be in third LT Tyrell Crosby @ Oregon could be a ten year starter. Another LT that at minimum be depth is Memphis' Trevon Tate who could begin at RT and move to LT eventually. He is not ranked higher than day three that I can find but my research indicates a decent player with high ceiling. I have as our 4th. Gia, Lamm should be gone and most likely X.
Many are focusing on Smith's history and as usual it can & has been
. I understand that but moaning and groaning does not accomplish anything. Smith is going anywhere. I have O'Brien at 90% here for his last contract year 2018. So I choose to accept that (whether it is best or not) and post accordingly. I don't see any FA that will satisfy need at LT or right side either. It would be great if someone would research if there is a player we could trade for to fill that need. Doesn't have to be a super star just a better than avg player who could hold the spot for 1-2 years & not get our QB hurt. This leads to Watson making our 2018 line better than what we have had this season. I would not trade our 1st three picks 2019 as going to be very valuable.This is not going to be resolved 100% this off-season & we should be realistic about that. Focus for me is OL and one S and one CB for depth in draft with FA for possible starters. I like Keenum, we have $ and he should be willing to come home with high likelihood DW goes down.
Setting aside my respect and pride in Q's recovery and handling himself during the diagnosis and treatment of cancer, IMO it is time for him to produce or be moved off roster/practice squad. My concern is I am not sure if he has the strength,skills or whatever is needed to be an offensive lineman. I'm glad he has been moved onto roster & hopefully to get some significant playing time to determine his status 2018. If he is not ready to be at minimum a solid backup he needs to go & allow another to take his spot. I hope he succeeds but that is still in question.
It would be nice if Slade & Fuller could 'own' RG. Either or together in some type of rotation. I also think an OG like Auburn's Braden Smith who is evaluated as both run and pass blocking sound could start sometime during 2018 at RG and quickly move to LG at some point if needed. I have not seen enough of Hernandez to say much but he will probably be gone. Manz cannot be successful at OG. Martin maybe but no effort made this year which says something.
I personally think Davenport will see significant time at LT but if available and I think he might be in third LT Tyrell Crosby @ Oregon could be a ten year starter. Another LT that at minimum be depth is Memphis' Trevon Tate who could begin at RT and move to LT eventually. He is not ranked higher than day three that I can find but my research indicates a decent player with high ceiling. I have as our 4th. Gia, Lamm should be gone and most likely X.
Many are focusing on Smith's history and as usual it can & has been
This is not going to be resolved 100% this off-season & we should be realistic about that. Focus for me is OL and one S and one CB for depth in draft with FA for possible starters. I like Keenum, we have $ and he should be willing to come home with high likelihood DW goes down.
I don't know how everything will play out for Smith and Crosby and where they will fall in the Draft, but if RS were able to get both without moving up I would call that a very good draft for the Texans! Personally, I would keep Davenport at LT at least until he proves if he can handle it or not. Put Crosby at RT unless Davenport fails at LT. Put Smith at LG and either Allen or a FA at RG. Keep Martin at Center with Mancz as backup. This would give you an O-line of:
LT---Davenport, Clark
LG---Smith, Fuller
OC---Martin, Mancz
RG---Allen or FA, Slade or DQ
RT---Crosby, Clark
As I've said before, this is just one option. But, this would revamp the O-line and give it an injection of new blood but also keep enough experience.
As for getting Keenum back, I don't know if that would be possible anymore. I think he will be looking to be a starter somewhere and making bank. He's proven himself now and a lot of QB needy teams will be ready to throw mega-bucks at him and make him their starter. Arizona and Cleveland are 2 teams that come to mind. Heck, if he takes the Vikings to the Super Bowl they might sign him to a big deal and trade Teddy or Sam instead!
adama51
Walk-on
You lost me right there. I don't wanna see Jeff Allen on the field unless another lineman gets hurt. Keep Martin and Mancz together
That's OK if you don't want to see Allen on the field. That's why I said Allen or FA. Options brother, options! And, after all, does it really matter who we put in there? It's up to RS, BOB, and the Staff who they want in those positions. All we can do is speculate and hope!
Well, Davenport is getting ready to be tested big time this Monday against the Steelers. If he does well then maybe the Texans have found their LT for the next 10 years. Personally, I expect him to struggle some and possibly give up a sack, some hurries, and some pressures in the final 2 games. Maybe 2 games won't be enough to see what they have in Davenport but it's a start and now is the time for him to start developing and honing his skill so he will be ready for next season. Here's a short article in the chron.com that mentions Davenport starting: http://www.chron.com/sports/texans/...Miller-returns-Julie-n-Davenport-12448405.php
Quote from Davenport:
"I definitely feel ready," Davenport said. "I'm ready to get balling. I want to go out there and have the best game I can."
Quote from Davenport:
"I definitely feel ready," Davenport said. "I'm ready to get balling. I want to go out there and have the best game I can."
Brisco_County
Apples and roadmaps
Knowing that Davenport wasn't much worse than Clark, they should have thrown him into the fire and kept him there as soon as Watson was lost.
It's amazing how these coaches have never demonstrated any instinct for developing offensive linemen.
It's amazing how these coaches have never demonstrated any instinct for developing offensive linemen.
Big Dave is getting a chance to start, that's great news and I'm pumped for his inaugural NFL start. Bet his whole family is really excited.
The Steelers will be really stiff competition but this is invaluable experience for him. This will be A Christmas to remember for the Bucknell rookie.
I was just thinking the same thing as I read the post above yours .... For the life of me I cant understand why they keep running Breno Guacamole out there when he's the worst OT in the league all season. then they moved him to the left side ... WTF ?!
I've been very critical of Davenport but damn , he cant be any worse than Breno , may as well run him out there and see what you have , get him some experience and maybe you find a gem. , aint got nuttin to lose.
I do expect Davenport to get his ass handed to him by a pissed off and very good Steelers defense this week .... but he cant be any worse than an old and slow Breno Guacamole.
Agreed, But Davenport has been hurt the last month, Before that he was getting a little time. Kinda like Gibbs did breaking in DB while also playing Salaam.
Honoring Earl 34
Something Witty !
Being consistent is important to the Texans .
Well, after watching most of the "slaughter" today I would say Davenport did a respectable job for most of the game. I'm not sure how many, if any, of the 7 sacks will be assigned to him. Three sacks came from CB Mike Hilton and I think at least 2 of them he came through untouched with no one there to block him on the left side. Davenport did get called for a facemask penalty when Watt made a move to the inside of Davenport and he just reached across and tried to grab Watt and got his mask. There were a number of times I remember seeing Davenport do a good job in pass protection and look like a decent NFL LT. This gives me hope. They also had DQ in there a number of times on run plays and I thought he did well. This gives me hope too! As a matter of fact I thought the whole line did well in the run plays (176 yds rushing).
The pass plays though are another story. It was wretched for the most part. Slade and Giacomini are just flat out bad in pass pro and the pocket would collapse pretty fast on that side from what I was seeing. Yates had almost no time at all on some plays. A few times he was able to step up and squeeze through a hole and gain some yards on the ground but mostly the pocket would just disintegrate and Yates would go down in a heap.
They have one more game left to see what Davenport and DQ can do and give them more game experience. At this point, I feel that Davenport will be the LT for this franchise going forward and this last game's experience, along with his off season development, should only help to solidify his position on this team. Then it will be up to RS, BOB, and Staff to get the rest of the O-line pieces in place!
The pass plays though are another story. It was wretched for the most part. Slade and Giacomini are just flat out bad in pass pro and the pocket would collapse pretty fast on that side from what I was seeing. Yates had almost no time at all on some plays. A few times he was able to step up and squeeze through a hole and gain some yards on the ground but mostly the pocket would just disintegrate and Yates would go down in a heap.
They have one more game left to see what Davenport and DQ can do and give them more game experience. At this point, I feel that Davenport will be the LT for this franchise going forward and this last game's experience, along with his off season development, should only help to solidify his position on this team. Then it will be up to RS, BOB, and Staff to get the rest of the O-line pieces in place!
Just saw this in chron.com: http://www.chron.com/sports/texans/...ks-bombarded-in-loss-to-Steelers-12454746.php Davenport said one of the times Hilton blew through there was his fault. Here is a quote from the article:
"Making his second career start, rookie left tackle Julién Davenport had his moments. He also guessed wrong when he thought Hilton was pretending to blitz, but was actually running into the backfield."
"We've got to do a good job of correcting that," Davenport said. "One of them was on me. I called it out and the guy bluffed. I thought they were bluffing. I got screwed on that one. We've got to do a better job of making sure everybody is good and protecting our quarterbacks."
I hope he learns from this and doesn't let it happen again, especially next season!
It was everything I dreamed of when I was going through my treatments,” Quessenberry said. “Getting out there and playing a full-speed game today was exactly how I had hoped it to be.”
*********
http://www.houstontexans.com/news/a...r-Texans/0efb8f14-f838-4f50-814e-440df3813781
*********
That's great. I'm happy for DQ as he sounds like a little boy on Christmas day who's Christmas dreams came true. That's great !
Davenport was not that bad as he had his moments and I'm' pretty sure he pancaked JJs little brother at least once. Big time experience for him and next week it should not be quite as difficult against the Cols D instead of the Steelers D. This was his second start in the regular season, don't remember the first time ?
I'm encouraged but Jonathen Ogden he's not right now but it's a start.
*********
http://www.houstontexans.com/news/a...r-Texans/0efb8f14-f838-4f50-814e-440df3813781
*********
That's great. I'm happy for DQ as he sounds like a little boy on Christmas day who's Christmas dreams came true. That's great !
Davenport was not that bad as he had his moments and I'm' pretty sure he pancaked JJs little brother at least once. Big time experience for him and next week it should not be quite as difficult against the Cols D instead of the Steelers D. This was his second start in the regular season, don't remember the first time ?
I'm encouraged but Jonathen Ogden he's not right now but it's a start.
dream_team
Hall of Fame
I want to like BOB, but there are numerous decisions that just make me SMDH. There’s only one player on the Texans that has played every snap on their side of the ball. Can you guess who? That’s right, our buddy Breno. Rick deserves some blame for bringing him in, but I blame BOB even more for playing him EVERY snap.
I almost give Tricky Rick a pass for Breno .... He was the best player available in free agency , that's just how slim the pickings were last offseason for OL help.
They really should have done more thru the draft if they had any idea that the Brown saga was going to turn out as it did.
There will only be 2-3 quality OL hit the FA market this offseason .... which with the lack of high draft picks and general lack of talent on the OL doesn't bode well for this team next season. I don't know if they can fix the OL in one offseason. (Sure , even this OL looked competent when Watson was under center but that isn't fixing the lack of talent).
I didn't much care for BoB from the get go .... but gave him the benefit of the doubt.
At this point , I don't care to see him back as he was responsible for each of the disasters that were the Texans QB's ..... From Fitzy to Hoyer , Mullet , Osweiler & Savage.
He's culpable for the disaster that is the OL too .... Why he keeps running Martin out there at C instead of leaving Mancz there and playing Martin at a guard spot is silly when he has two of the worst OG's in the league playing (XSF & Allen) & Mancz played better at C than Martin has .... Get your best players on the field.
Wont go into playcalling as its pointless .... better not go into clock management cause we aren't gonna discuss that failure ....
The scheme is too ... complicated accept its not , its totally vanilla , predictable and boring ..... unless you have Watson chucking balls to DHop and Fuller while running for his life because of the garbage OL.
I don't think any coach has done less with more since he arrived - This team WAS a QB away from being a contender the day he rolled up .... Today its a shell of that with the defense aging and beat up by the injury bug (Not his fault) and lacking talent on the back end.
Time for OB to move on , time for McNair to change course , dare to do something outside his comfort zone. Don't know who I'd want right this minute , don't really know who's available .... but @Texan_Bill could call a better game sloppy drunk with boobs in his face at the local topless establishment.
Flyingfish
Waterboy
And I'll bet Texan Bill is willing to accept that challenge! 
Atleast this is about the Oline which is what this thread is supposed to be about but it's a very important point you've made. This is so obvious with the bad Oline this year and it is so critical to improve it at all, if just incrementally.
There were decent OT's to be had in FA last yr.
Whitworth/Reiff/Reemers just off of the top of my head. Ricky chose not to invest in the OL and is now paying for that decision. (Is he really going to pay? Doubtful)
This yrs FA OL class isn't very good. (Figures)
Whitworth/Reiff/Reemers just off of the top of my head. Ricky chose not to invest in the OL and is now paying for that decision. (Is he really going to pay? Doubtful)
This yrs FA OL class isn't very good. (Figures)
OptimisticTexan
2024 / Rebuilding Block 4 After Playoffs / Texans
It's funny that you mention this but what has happened to the defense...is exactly what's happened to great RB's who were relied on to carry an offense. The Texans have over-used their defense by leaning on them far too much to keep games winnable while ignoring the offense and what their contribution should be to a successful season. The Texans...eerrr, RS has "Earl Campbell'ed" their defense.
PolarBear
Noob
Any interest in 7-year vet Nate Solder (Pats LT)? His contract is up at the end of the season:
https://www.patspulpit.com/2017/12/23/16801940/nate-solder-new-england-patriots-annual-resurgence-coming-at-a-great-time-wallet-nfl-contract
https://overthecap.com/player/nate-solder/1235/
PFF Scores for the past six years: 83.4, 84.7, 74.8, 66.7, 81.7, 73.3
I'd also consider the Steeler's backup Tackle, Chris Hubbard
https://overthecap.com/player/christopher-hubbard/2708/
https://www.patspulpit.com/2017/12/23/16801940/nate-solder-new-england-patriots-annual-resurgence-coming-at-a-great-time-wallet-nfl-contract
https://overthecap.com/player/nate-solder/1235/
PFF Scores for the past six years: 83.4, 84.7, 74.8, 66.7, 81.7, 73.3
I'd also consider the Steeler's backup Tackle, Chris Hubbard
https://overthecap.com/player/christopher-hubbard/2708/
infantrycak
Hall of Fame
They collect stats as a means of checking that the seat of your pants ain't lying. The Texans D is on the field 29:48, just less than half the game. That is not overuse.
And lol at ignored the offense. They have spent more resources trying to hand OB tools than they have RC. Who's had more success?
I saw this list on Twitter
1- Justin Pugh NYG
2- Nate Solder NE
3- Chris Hubbard PITT
4- Cameron Fleming NE
5- Seantrel Henderson BUFF
6- LaAdrian Waddle NE
7- Greg Robinson DET
8- Michael Schofield LAC
9- Andre Smith CIN
10- Matt Tobin SEA
Hubbard and Fleming are also intriguing because they are young.
One decent game in 16 doesn't change the fact that he's been one of the worst OG's in the league the previous 15 , Just hope Tricky Rick doesn't see that and think its reason to hope he turned a corner ....
This is the stat Tricky Rick needs to be looking at ..... and take action because of. If not , he may as well fit Watson for a body cast and sign 2-3 quality backups ....
RS has turned us into the Colts
Most of these guys, if they are any good, will be resigned by their teams unless their teams think they are past their prime and just not worth a new contract. That's the kind of player you can pick up and use as a stop-gap until you draft and develop his replacement. Kinda like Whitworth last off season going to the Rams. He really solidified the LT spot for them this year but at 36 they will probably be looking for a replacement soon. The 3 from NE, well, they know the scoop with Belichick so, they will either sign there and make less money or decide to go somewhere else and probably get a better contract but not have a chance to win a Super Bowl again.
Robinson is still young (25) but he's been with 3 teams in 4 years. He's a bust at this point but who knows, maybe if the Texans signed him he could come in here and get coached up by the Texans O-line staff and turn he's career around!
If they did sign him they better make sure they have a good backup plan! Smith from the Bengals could be a good pickup. He's 30 yrs old and can play either OG or OT. He played a number of years in Cincinnati then signed with the Vikings for a year, and then back to Cincinnati this season. He could be a good stop-gap player that can play several positions along the line until the Texans can get all the pieces in place. Also, if Lewis is fired in Cincinnati, like most think he will be, then Smith may not want to stay there.
PolarBear
Noob
Most of these guys, if they are any good, will be resigned by their teams unless their teams think they are past their prime and just not worth a new contract. That's the kind of player you can pick up and use as a stop-gap until you draft and develop his replacement. Kinda like Whitworth last off season going to the Rams. He really solidified the LT spot for them this year but at 36 they will probably be looking for a replacement soon. The 3 from NE, well, they know the scoop with Belichick so, they will either sign there and make less money or decide to go somewhere else and probably get a better contract but not have a chance to win a Super Bowl again.
Robinson is still young (25) but he's been with 3 teams in 4 years. He's a bust at this point but who knows, maybe if the Texans signed him he could come in here and get coached up by the Texans O-line staff and turn he's career around!
Speaking of former #2 pick Greg Robinson. I found this article to be interesting on his situation, as well as the difficult in finding college o-linemen that can transition to the NFL:
https://www.theringer.com/2017/6/16...troit-lions-offensive-line-busts-dc63ea1482f6
That's an interesting article and many of the points the author makes are valid but one shouldn't be left with the impession that offensive tackle isn't the only position that's
extremely challenging for scouts and talent evaluaters to accurately forecast the chances of college players to project and have successful NFL careers. But along with corner backs, WRs, and of course QB, OT can be a real tough position to consistantly predict with accuracy.
Honoring Earl 34
Something Witty !
I think you'll start seeing small school guys who run a more pro type offense than the big school guys you can't tell . An OT used to be an easy scouting job but not any more .
PolarBear
Noob
You may be correct. What type of offense did Bucknell operate when Julien Davenport was playing? The Texans have clearly tried to bring him along slowly (unlike what happened with Greg Robinson), to allow him to improve both strength and technique. Maybe that will pay off much like it did for the Cardinals with DJ Humphries.
On the other hand, what went so terribly wrong with XSF that after four years he's still terrible? The pre-draft experts were all wrong on him too. Is this bad coaching from O-Line coach Devlin? He seems to be generally healthy, just terribly ineffective - particularly with pass protection.
beerlover
Hall of Fame
Robinson acclamation to NFL is very disturbing given immense talent and high level of College production.
System fit and muscle memory that cannot adapt or be coached up every coaches/front office nightmare.
Maybe a good idea to place more emphasis in type of player who best fits your system over measurables.
Weight evaluations based off learned skill set, tendencies, positional coaches feedback, work ethic and passion for the game instead of imagined ceiling that may or may not be achieved. Safety over unknown
System fit and muscle memory that cannot adapt or be coached up every coaches/front office nightmare.
Maybe a good idea to place more emphasis in type of player who best fits your system over measurables.
Weight evaluations based off learned skill set, tendencies, positional coaches feedback, work ethic and passion for the game instead of imagined ceiling that may or may not be achieved. Safety over unknown
Actually, how much O-line "NFL-ready" talent is actually out in the college ranks now days? When you look at college offenses there aren't many of them running NFL-like offenses any more. Few QBs call the plays or read the defenses; that's done by the coaching staff. Same with the O-lines. How many college centers are asked to identify/call out blocking assignments. How many college O-lines are asked to pass block in the traditional form-a-clean-pocket sense these days?Robinson acclamation to NFL is very disturbing given immense talent and high level of College production.
System fit and muscle memory that cannot adapt or be coached up every coaches/front office nightmare.
Maybe a good idea to place more emphasis in type of player who best fits your system over measurables.
Weight evaluations based off learned skill set, tendencies, positional coaches feedback, work ethic and passion for the game instead of imagined ceiling that may or may not be achieved. Safety over unknown
I think a developmental league would be useful in taking these physical specimens and giving them some coaching/seasoning. Its either that or keep getting your QB killed while the O-line guys learn how to block NFL pass rushers.
CloakNNNdagger
Hall of Fame
The Giants new (less than 1 week into his hire) GM just cut starting RT Bobby Hart, one day before the end of the regular season. The Texans can pick up a locker room cancer on the cheap.
The Alabama center Kelly/Georgia, Andrews/Ohio St, Eflien/Notre Dame, Martin have all done pretty well as rookies. Also I like how Mancz performed as a rookie. Dawkins/Stanley/Robinson/Conklin/Bolles/Lane Johnson/Trent Williams/Bahktiari/Donovan Smith/Matthews/Armstead have all done well as rookie LT's.
So drafting and playing a LT can be done. It all comes down to scouting/coaching.
Luke Joeckel is another Olineman takin #2 overall but in the draft right before Robinson in '14 who has been a huge disappointment but he should be available in the offseason as he signed just a 1-year deal with Seattle. Texas native (N.Texas I think) who played at A&M - worth a shot I'd think ?
Lol. Maybe they can trade for Eli Apple too.The Giants new (less than 1 week into his hire) GM just cut starting RT Bobby Hart, one day before the end of the regular season. The Texans can pick up a locker room cancer on the cheap.
my point is that's just a hand full out of a whole college draft class. Seems like there used to be more to good quality (not just the studs but servicable guys) to pick from than there is now days. But that was back when folks used pro formations and not this spread junk.
Maybe I'm just remembering the 80s and 90s LoL
Joeckel came out of A&M with much fanfare and was supposed to be better than Jake Matthews when they signed with the Aggies under Sherman. I'm not sure how much of a pro offense Sherman ran but it was probably more than Sumlin did with Manziel in there. I think both Joeckel, who went to Jacksonville, and Matthews, who came out the next year and went to Atlanta, were like most O-linemen coming out of college in the last decade or so, they were taught how to play in a spread offense, not an NFL offense. So why is Joeckel considered a bust and Matthews not? The obvious reason would be that Matthews' dad, NFL legend and HOFer Bruce Matthews, has probably been in Jake's ear since he was in pee-wee football. It really helps when you have a coach or trainer at your call 24-7!
Another reason for Joeckel's bust status could be from his ankle injury he sustained his rookie year. I think he broke his ankle before they even played their 1st game, possibly in preseason, and missed his whole rookie year. That set him behind and I just wonder how much that may have affected his game afterwards. Maybe he doesn't have the push or drive he once had off that foot. I just don't know how much the injury has to do with his not being very good but if the Texans do look at him this off season they need to do their do diligence on his medical evaluation.
Bottom line is, that if the Texans are going after someone like Joeckel or Robinson in the off season I just hope they do it knowing these guys are not what they used to be, highly rated 1st rd draft picks, and they better have an alternate plan in case they don't pan out. Personally, I would rather they go after someone else in FA that isn't carrying a bunch of baggage around (like "1st rd bust") and that has a few good years under his belt and can be a positive on the O-line. Heaven knows they need some like that!
OptimisticTexan
2024 / Rebuilding Block 4 After Playoffs / Texans
In regards to the college OL athletes of today...for the most part they just don't have the same sound fundamentals as the lineman of the past. From a physical standpoint, these guys are bigger (and in some cases much bigger) and far more athletic than the linemen of the past.
These young athletes must be taught techniques that will help them succeed. I, like steelbtexan, have stated numerous times in the past that I would sign Bruce Mathews to a contract so he could come in and teach these young athletes the fundamentals of being an OL in the NFL. Why Mathews? He's a HOF OL who was successful at every position on the OL. He's currently available and even if the team didn't hire him as the OL Coach...I'd hire him as a Asst OL Coach who would be responsible for the ongoing education of fundamentals and technique. This could be considered a new coaching position of necessity.
These young athletes must be taught techniques that will help them succeed. I, like steelbtexan, have stated numerous times in the past that I would sign Bruce Mathews to a contract so he could come in and teach these young athletes the fundamentals of being an OL in the NFL. Why Mathews? He's a HOF OL who was successful at every position on the OL. He's currently available and even if the team didn't hire him as the OL Coach...I'd hire him as a Asst OL Coach who would be responsible for the ongoing education of fundamentals and technique. This could be considered a new coaching position of necessity.
OptimisticTexan
2024 / Rebuilding Block 4 After Playoffs / Texans
Insideop, I wouldn't necessarily be against the Texans signing both Robinson (LT) and Joeckel (LG) provided:
1. The team has hired a coach who can teach fundamentals and technique.
2. The team still invests at minimum 3 picks on OL personnel in the 2018 NFL Draft.
3. The team signs both players to prove-it type short-term contracts with incentives.
Either of these guys would be better than what was trotted onto the field this season and with their strength development already done, improving fundamentals and technique might pull their success back to the surface. Didn't this very same thing just work Justin Verlander and the Astros?
1. The team has hired a coach who can teach fundamentals and technique.
2. The team still invests at minimum 3 picks on OL personnel in the 2018 NFL Draft.
3. The team signs both players to prove-it type short-term contracts with incentives.
Either of these guys would be better than what was trotted onto the field this season and with their strength development already done, improving fundamentals and technique might pull their success back to the surface. Didn't this very same thing just work Justin Verlander and the Astros?
Astros/Verlander really isn't a good comparison when talking about the Texans OL Robinson/Joeckel. Verlander already had a HOF career before he came to Houston.
infantrycak
Hall of Fame
Nostalgia aside, Matthews has no resume as a savior. His one 3 season stint as an OL coach, for Munchak in TN, was a failure. Since 2013 either by choice or league disinterest he has done nothing. And it's not like he didn't have any phone numbers with the Texans. He was an offensive assistant for the Texans 2009-10.
Honoring Earl 34
Something Witty !
He was a coin flip with Fisher for being the #1 overall pick . He may be great with Watson as he was with JFF . Same with Robinson and I would take a flyer on both and draft two guards in the 3rd .
I can agree with your 3 points if they signed Robinson and/or Joeckel but I don't think I could compare either of them to Verlander and his situation with the Stros!
If BOB ran a spread offense only they both might do well. But, BOB doesn't run a spread offense, he runs a... a... a...
