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Thoughts on getting there from here - texans

badboy

badboy

Hall of Fame
I see little that changes 2018 season. Watson coming back healthy & playing well all year [could argue history rarely works that way for Houston] is exciting. However, we have opportunity now with all of us knowing we have no QB to begin shaping roster to be supportive of Watson's skills. I propose we look at team loyalty rather than specific player loyalty. I want (similar to off season of 2016) to utilize draft, UDFA, very selective vet FA and what we rarely see with this team...trades. There are players I really, really like but if trading them can improve roster proportionately I want to make that move. Open to other suggestions but I would start with Watson who in a few games proved he was real deal even if not a Brady or Manning type could keep us on target for final 4 teams annually with better roster. He is untouchable. Everyone else is 'movable'. Some like Hop, Will Fuller (5) & N. Martin I keep unless awesome trade is offered..these are pretty much untouchable and that's it for offense. Some like Mancz who is FA eligible have proved worth but would have to sign for reasonable $. He's 25 can play center but not paying him much to backup. He or Martin need to move to OG as we need that filled desperately. So guys like Mancz are on fence for me but prefer them back; CB Joseph goes here. Jeff Allen is a ? for me as he played best vs Colts. PFF ranked him best Olineman, he's 27 decent contract but must play next 8 games as if his roster spot is in jeopardy..it is. L Miller the same, needs to ball out or bye bye. $14 million cap hit with $3 m dead (18 & 19) for what he brings can go elsewhere. I want CB Joseph back as not much else out there.
Defense is where the screaming begins. Watt (yeah I said it) and Clowney need to be shopped. I'm not clinging to past stats but how will player perform 2018 & beyond versus what a trade could bring. Mercilus probably fits there also; 5 games 2017 he had one sack. Can OLB Lamar Houston or a low round draft pick + cap savings make roster better? How healthy can we expect Mercilus to be next year, not saying just chop him but shop him.

What we have draft: two thirds, a fourth, no fifth, a six and seventh does not move needle much; comps could change that some but not get us past about #50 or so and nothing we could get above that screams "pick me". I would not trade our top three 2019 picks (first & two seconds) for this crop, need them more in '19. Walter has Mason Rudolph Qb available # 92 since his last game (don't look at just his stats vs OK) & I'd take him in third. I still have him ranked first round.
 
Quite simply and some really big ifs to say the least: We all hope to have a healthy Deshaun Watson, J.J. Watt and Whitney Mercilus in 2018. If that happens we may be able to make a deep playoff run to the AFC Championship Game and maybe Super Bowl. It's all a long shot, I understand, but it helps to have some hope. Feeling all doom and gloom isn't healthy for anybody.
 
I won't rule out trades of JJ, Clowney or Mercilus out of hand. But I'm demanding top value for them.

Definitely want JJo signed to a 2 year deal. May even get him for less than this year but the same is fine.
 
I was looking at JJo as a cap causality this offseason but he's more than proven he can still play. I would extend him with a mutually beneficial contract.
I agree with everyone but DW4 being tradeable; some guys would take a king's a ransom tho.

Lamar Miller, Cushing, and Newton I'd cut.
Kareem Jackson isn't getting a fat contract here, I'd look at moving him as well.
We have to look at a future without JJ Watt. It sucks but this is a business. I'm not saying cut him, I'm saying we should explore all options.
Clowney...Idk what to do about him. He seems to play better without JJ but injuries are a huge concern.
 
Bulls on Parade said:
Quite simply and some really big ifs to say the least: We all hope to have a healthy Deshaun Watson, J.J. Watt and Whitney Mercilus in 2018. If that happens we may be able to make a deep playoff run to the AFC Championship Game and maybe Super Bowl. It's all a long shot, I understand, but it helps to have some hope. Feeling all doom and gloom isn't healthy for anybody.
Click to expand...
Having Dylan Cole and Christian Covington back in the ranks will help too.
As will CJ Fedorowicz. He was playing good football.
 
Deshaun is the only truly untouchable, imo.

And I wouldn't hold my breath for very long that Mason Rudolph gets much into the 2nd, much less the 3rd.
 
infantrycak said:
I won't rule out trades of JJ, Clowney or Mercilus out of hand. But I'm demanding top value for them.

Definitely want JJo signed to a 2 year deal. May even get him for less than this year but the same is fine.
Click to expand...

What would you say a fair value contract for Jjo is at this point in his career?

$6M per?
 
justmy2cents said:
Just the picks in each round .... I tend to think it was 4-3rds, 1-4th. 2-6ths, and a 7th .... does that sound close to anyone ?
Click to expand...

Like I've said before in another thread, I've seen this attempt ...
Round 3

Round 3 (via Seattle)

Round 3 Compensatory (A.J. Bouye)

Round 4

Round 6

Round 6 Compensatory (John Simon)

Round 6 Compensatory (Quintin Demps)

Round 7

Round 7 Compensatory (Don Jones/Oday Aboushi)
Click to expand...

link

Where are you getting 4 3rds?
 
I thought part of the Brown deal included our giving them our 5th and them giving us a 3rd .... but my memory is horrible.
 
justmy2cents said:
I thought part of the Brown deal included our giving them our 5th and them giving us a 3rd .... but my memory is horrible.
Click to expand...

Sure, that being the 'via Seattle' pick from the quote above. And that plus our own 3rd plus a likely comp pick 3rd for Bouye gives us 3 3rds. Where are you getting a 4th from?
 
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Mollywhopper said:
Like I've said before in another thread, I've seen this attempt ...


link

Where are you getting 4 3rds?
Click to expand...

I think he just miscounted. :)

I do think that article probably has it right on what round and how many Compensatory Picks the Texans will get but you never know until the NFL makes their decision. I wouldn't be surprised if they only got 3 picks instead of 4 and I wouldn't be surprised if they got only one of the 6th rounders. You just never can tell what the committee will decide based on their rules. One thing is almost a sure thing and that's a 3rd round pick for Bouye. It would be a crime if they didn't award a 3rd for him!
 
infantrycak said:
I won't rule out trades of JJ, Clowney or Mercilus out of hand. But I'm demanding top value for them.

Definitely want JJo signed to a 2 year deal. May even get him for less than this year but the same is fine.
Click to expand...

Don't think trading JJ would be smart due to the lack of value we'd get for him. His upside coming back is way to high to get poor value for him. Plus, he's a great leader and ambassador for the team. I'd consider trading him possibly once he comes back and gets on the field and shows what his value truly still is. Clowney will get a ton of money, and Watt's injuries make him hold more value to us now for sure. Mercilous could be the guy more likely traded if you ask me, but who knows. I think we've got Merci on a pretty good contract that's friendly to the team.
 
I mentioned something similar to this before this season started. I think the time has arrived for a complete tear-down and rebuild which includes the GM and HC...and I'd probably include the scouting staff since this team has missed on so many picks from the 4th round on.

I would take the schwedest path to get this organization back on a path similar to the one Crane and Luhnow have so successfully paved.

1. GM / Owner Buffer- Bill Polian **This is a must. This man has been successful at every stop and even though he's retired I'd be curious as to how many zero's would need to be on a contract offer for him to consider coming out of retirement for a short stint of mentorship and keeping McNair's (Bob or Cam) hands off the rebuild.

2. Asst GM- Eliot Wolf (GB) or Peyton Manning (RET). **Wolf has the ability to be an excellent GM and by all appearances, the Packers organization is grooming him for the position. Manning just has the mental makeup in my opinion to handle this type of career move. Either guy could do this job and getting 2-3 years as a Polian protege would be the way to learn the job for the long term, mostly watching and learning how to handle a owner. Typically, playing a big part in identifying talent and working hand in hand with the HC to create a winning environment would endear a solid FO to the owner....so I'm totally at a loss for the words to describe how RS has gotten his hooks so deep into this McNair.

3. HC- Woukld be Polian's and the Asst GM's call. Just want to see a HC that would embrace a fast up-tempo spread type offense that could capitalize on Watson's talent.

4. Core Players for Rebuild-

QB: Watson (Keeper), simply the best offensive weapon to hit the NFL in a long time. I wanted to give him a season to learn and correct things in his game but he went out delivered and made the shortcomings that so many experts identified look like he was sandbagging to get selected by the Texans. I'm glad it worked out and would look forward to seeing what he's going to do in the long run if a proper team was built around him.

RB: Foreman (Keeper), has got to be put on the field and let him get his OJT. If he's got areas to work on...then make it a work in progress. Bottom line, I think this guy could hit a different gear after 12-15 carries and he's completely into the flow of the game. I've always thought seriously about what it might've been like for Earl's career had he been the RB for the Oilers during their Run-N-Shoot days versus his pounding the ball 30+ times a game during Bum's tenure. Now, am I trying to compare Foreman to Campbell...no, but I did see some similar attributes when he was coming out of UT and just don't think O'Brien has taken the time to try and capitalize on those skills.

FB: May not have a need for a FB in this type of offense.

TE: Anderson (Tweener) could be ok but in all reality, there are TE available that are bigger, just as fast, can block and catch the ball. Fiedorowicz and Griffin just haven't delivered the way in the current system and surely wouldn't fit the concept I have in mind. I could see moving Anderson into an H-Back roll and carrying 2 maybe 3 TE's in the future versus a FB that are closer to the Gates mold.

WR: Hopkins and Fuller (Keepers) are the perfect pair for an up-tempo spread type of offense. Fuller brings the speed to take the top off and Hopkins the talent to work the field from any point. Could Miller ever become the WR he was drafted to be...probably not. The rest just haven't taken advantage of their opportunity. Look deep into the talent pool to find WR's that have the size, speed and hands to be effective in this type of offense. Polian did this just fine in Buffalo and Indy.

OL: Martin and Mancz (Keepers) need to swap positions. Mancz had a really effective year at center and was moved to backup this season with some time at OG. I would've given Mancz the C position this season to build off 2016 and had Martin go full bore at RG. I would like to see that at least once this year to confirm that these guys should be on the field at the same time b/c they're the teams two best OL. The rest of the OL have been misses from every standpoint...or should I say the jury is still out on Fuller and Davenport.

DL: Reader and Watkins (Keepers) are better than advertised and delivered well with the injuries to the DL. Watt (Body is beginning to fail him) and Clowney (Knees could fail him after big contract) might be the best assets this team has in landing the required picks to hurry this rebuild along. I could see many teams willing to take a look-see but the Steelers and Packers could be interesting in a couple of ways. Steelers might have some interest in getting the Watt brothers together...not only on the field but from a marketing standpoint. I would love to use Clowney with Green Bay as a way for the Texans to gain access to talks with Wolf but for the draft picks that could be gained as well. Finding replacements won't be easy but playing without these guys is becoming common or could be more common in the future.

LB: McKinney and Cunningham (Keepers) are solid at the ILB position. Mercilus could be kept but may bring more to the table in the way of picks. He like a lot of the other players I've mentioned in moving for the overhaul should get their chance elsewhere versus going through a rebuilding process that in all fairness may take until 2020 to be fully set.

DB: This is a full scratch rebuild.

K: Fairbarn (Keeper) has done his job.

P: This is also the time to find Lechler's replacement since he should be done this season.

I'd be willing to take picks in 2018, 2019 and possibly high 2020 picks in conjunction with a 2018 pick. Again, this process would take time to be done right and there would be nothing wrong with stock-piling picks.

And in response to another poster who questioned my idea of picking Baker Mayfield if he were to slip to RD3...Watson will be coming into the 2018 season on a set of bad knees and no real backup that plays the position like he does...enter Mayfield. He has a similar skill set to Watson and may be holding the Heisman hardware as well. He's could be entering the NFL Draft with some of the same concerns that plagued Watson.....but with the expectations of the 2018 QB Class, Mayfield could slip to RD3. I'd be just fine with the first pick of RD3 being used for a QB like Mayfield. The Texans can sign a FA or 2 and grab another OL with the 2nd or 4rd pick in RD3.
 
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OptimisticTexan said:
I mentioned something similar to this before this season started. I think the time has arrived for a complete tear-down and rebuild which includes the GM and HC...and I'd probably include the scouting staff since this team has missed on so many picks from the 4th round on.

I would take the schwedest path to get this organization back on a path similar to the one Crane and Luhnow have so successfully paved.

1. GM / Owner Buffer- Bill Polian **This is a must. This man has been successful at every stop and even though he's retired I'd be curious as to how many zero's would need to be on a contract offer for him to consider coming out of retirement for a short stint of mentorship and keeping McNair's (Bob or Cam) hands off the rebuild.

2. Asst GM- Eliot Wolf (GB) or Peyton Manning (RET). **Wolf has the ability to be an excellent GM and by all appearances, the Packers organization is grooming him for the position. Manning just has the mental makeup in my opinion to handle this type of career move. Either guy could do this job and getting 2-3 years as a Polian protege would be the way to learn the job for the long term, mostly watching and learning how to handle a owner. Typically, playing a big part in identifying talent and working hand in hand with the HC to create a winning environment would endear a solid FO to the owner....so I'm totally at a loss for the words to describe how RS has gotten his hooks so deep into this McNair.

3. HC- Woukld be Polian's and the Asst GM's call. Just want to see a HC that would embrace a fast up-tempo spread type offense that could capitalize on Watson's talent.

4. Core Players for Rebuild-

QB: Watson (Keeper), simply the best offensive weapon to hit the NFL in a long time. I wanted to give him a season to learn and correct things in his game but he went out delivered and made the shortcomings that so many experts identified look like he was sandbagging to get selected by the Texans. I'm glad it worked out and would look forward to seeing what he's going to do in the long run if a proper team was built around him.

RB: Foreman (Keeper), has got to be put on the field and let him get his OJT. If he's got areas to work on...then make it a work in progress. Bottom line, I think this guy could hit a different gear after 12-15 carries and he's completely into the flow of the game. I've always thought seriously about what it might've been like for Earl's career had he been the RB for the Oilers during their Run-N-Shoot days versus his pounding the ball 30+ times a game during Bum's tenure. Now, am I trying to compare Foreman to Campbell...no, but I did see some similar attributes when he was coming out of UT and just don't think O'Brien has taken the time to try and capitalize on those skills.

FB: May not have a need for a FB in this type of offense.

TE: Anderson (Tweener) could be ok but in all reality, there are TE available that are bigger, just as fast, can block and catch the ball. Fiedorowicz and Griffin just haven't delivered the way in the current system and surely wouldn't fit the concept I have in mind. I could see moving Anderson into an H-Back roll and carrying 2 maybe 3 TE's in the future versus a FB that are closer to the Gates mold.

WR: Hopkins and Fuller (Keepers) are the perfect pair for an up-tempo spread type of offense. Fuller brings the speed to take the top off and Hopkins the talent to work the field from any point. Could Miller ever become the WR he was drafted to be...probably not. The rest just haven't taken advantage of their opportunity. Look deep into the talent pool to find WR's that have the size, speed and hands to be effective in this type of offense. Polian did this just fine in Buffalo and Indy.

OL: Martin and Mancz (Keepers) need to swap positions. Mancz had a really effective year at center and was moved to backup this season with some time at OG. I would've given Mancz the C position this season to build off 2016 and had Martin go full bore at RG. I would like to see that at least once this year to confirm that these guys should be on the field at the same time b/c they're the teams two best OL. The rest of the OL have been misses from every standpoint...or should I say the jury is still out on Fuller and Davenport.

DL: Reader and Watkins (Keepers) are better than advertised and delivered well with the injuries to the DL. Watt (Body is beginning to fail him) and Clowney (Knees could fail him after big contract) might be the best assets this team has in landing the required picks to hurry this rebuild along. I could see many teams willing to take a look-see but the Steelers and Packers could be interesting in a couple of ways. Steelers might have some interest in getting the Watt brothers together...not only on the field but from a marketing standpoint. I would love to use Clowney with Green Bay as a way for the Texans to gain access to talks with Wolf but for the draft picks that could be gained as well. Finding replacements won't be easy but playing without these guys is becoming common or could be more common in the future.

LB: McKinney and Cunningham (Keepers) are solid at the ILB position. Mercilus could be kept but may bring more to the table in the way of picks. He like a lot of the other players I've mentioned in moving for the overhaul should get their chance elsewhere versus going through a rebuilding process that in all fairness may take until 2020 to be fully set.

DB: This is a full scratch rebuild.

K: Fairbarn (Keeper) has done his job.

P: This is also the time to find Lechler's replacement since he should be done this season.

I'd be willing to take picks in 2018, 2019 and possibly high 2020 picks in conjunction with a 2018 pick. Again, this process would take time to be done right and there would be nothing wrong with stock-piling picks.

And in response to another poster who questioned my idea of picking Baker Mayfield if he were to slip to RD3...Watson will be coming into the 2018 season on a set of bad knees and no real backup that plays the position like he does...enter Mayfield. He has a similar skill set to Watson and may be holding the Heisman hardware as well. He's could be entering the NFL Draft with some of the same concerns that plagued Watson.....but with the expectations of the 2018 QB Class, Mayfield could slip to RD3. I'd be just fine with the first pick of RD3 being used for a QB like Mayfield. The Texans can sign a FA or 2 and grab another OL with the 2nd or 4rd pick in RD3.
Click to expand...


So you want to fire the GM who got you "the best offensive weapon to hit the NFL in a long time" and then fire the Coach who helped make him that way! Hey, makes sense to me! As for all these "Keepers" you have I guess RS, BOB, and the scouts had nothing to do with selecting them, right? I hate to burst your bubble there chief but it ain't going to happen! I think that most, if not all of them, will be back next season. McNair is not going to fire the GM that moved up in the draft and got Watson the pick before Arizona would have taken him (supposedly), and he's not going to fire the Coach who has the Offense that Watson flourished under. It's just not going to happen. I know people on here are mad at what has happened and they want to blame Rick, BOB, the Scouts, McNair, etc..... OK that's fine, I get it. They should share the blame for not shoring up the O-line enough and putting Savage in a no win situation, not to mention the issues with the secondary. But, I just think McNair sees the potential with the Offense under Watson and the potential of the Defense with Watt, Mercilus, Cushing, etc... coming back next season that I don't think he fires Rick or BOB. I think McNair, Rick, and BOB all believe that just a few new additions to the O-line and Secondary along with a new backup QB and they will be right back in the thick of the AFC race.

And yes, I was one of those "who questioned" your idea of picking Mayfield if he's there in the 3rd round and I still question it! I realize the situation with Watson coming off the injury and that Savage isn't the answer but you cannot use your 1st pick in the Draft on a backup QB (That may never see the field.) when you have other critical holes to fill! First off, Mayfield should be gone in the 1st round unless he gets seriously injured in his last few games. But, even if he was there in the 3rd, I just don't think it would be sensible to pick a backup QB and not take an O-lineman or Safety that should start. JMO.
 
Insideop said:
So you want to fire the GM who got you "the best offensive weapon to hit the NFL in a long time" and then fire the Coach who helped make him that way! Hey, makes sense to me! As for all these "Keepers" you have I guess RS, BOB, and the scouts had nothing to do with selecting them, right? I hate to burst your bubble there chief but it ain't going to happen! I think that most, if not all of them, will be back next season. McNair is not going to fire the GM that moved up in the draft and got Watson the pick before Arizona would have taken him (supposedly), and he's not going to fire the Coach who has the Offense that Watson flourished under. It's just not going to happen. I know people on here are mad at what has happened and they want to blame Rick, BOB, the Scouts, McNair, etc..... OK that's fine, I get it. They should share the blame for not shoring up the O-line enough and putting Savage in a no win situation, not to mention the issues with the secondary. But, I just think McNair sees the potential with the Offense under Watson and the potential of the Defense with Watt, Mercilus, Cushing, etc... coming back next season that I don't think he fires Rick or BOB. I think McNair, Rick, and BOB all believe that just a few new additions to the O-line and Secondary along with a new backup QB and they will be right back in the thick of the AFC race.

And yes, I was one of those "who questioned" your idea of picking Mayfield if he's there in the 3rd round and I still question it! I realize the situation with Watson coming off the injury and that Savage isn't the answer but you cannot use your 1st pick in the Draft on a backup QB (That may never see the field.) when you have other critical holes to fill! First off, Mayfield should be gone in the 1st round unless he gets seriously injured in his last few games. But, even if he was there in the 3rd, I just don't think it would be sensible to pick a backup QB and not take an O-lineman or Safety that should start. JMO.
Click to expand...

Somehow, the Patriots always make the Brady backup pick(s) in the draft work in their favor. Texans have Watson but that's all they have and if he goes down again, the offense will return right back to unit we are currently witnessing on Game Day. If the Texans draft Mayfield b/c he was available at an early RD3 pick and Watson stays healthy and productive for the next 3 seasons, there should be considerable upside from a trade value standpoint since he will have gotten bigger and better prepared to compete in the NFL.

RS, O'Brien and Kubiak are the horses that got this organization to this point....a spectacular point if I summarize your statement. In RS's tenure Kubiak got this the team closet to being an NFL statement and that was simply derailed by an injury to Schaub. During O'Brien's tenure, they have failed at putting a better team on the field....sure, 9-7 is nice and all but those division crowns came on the shoulders of a very weak division. Jags and Titans have started the big turnaround which will result in their organizations being relevant for several years b/c of good drafts and smart FA signings. The Colts like the Texans have an owner who has a desire to be involved (heresay) in the teams decisions when he should be leaning on the guy he hired to handle this.

So RS jumped up in the draft and got Watson...kudo's but that doesn't erase the blunders of his previous years....sorry, but that's the reality. Nor does it make-up for the absolute blunder of signing Osweiler only to realize the mistake and then compounded it by mortgaging the teams 2018 draft to unload the mistake. With a very weak 2018 FA list of OT's and no picks in the first 2 rounds, the primary issues at OL and in the DB may not get answered unless RS and his scouts pull a rabbit out of their hats and have an amazing draft in 2018 with the bounty of picks falling out of his wheelhouse of success. This area of the draft has resulted in a lack of adequate depth and urination-poor ST's for more than a few years under his watch.

I know Polian is up there in age but the guy didn't go blind or become incapable of identifying talent but one of the biggest reasons I'd like to see him with the Texans...is to educate McNair on how to be owner of an NFL franchise without having to be involved in all facets of the decision making, especially when he hasn't shown much improvement in that area after 15 years. Just isn't his bag of cookies but he does have the money to look extremely smart if the right people were in place. Plus Polian should be old enough and wise enough to reach McNair on seniors or mutual level of respect. Again, this move would mostly be there to buffer the development of the Assistant GM for a couple of seasons.

And I will give you this, you're probably correct in saying nothing is going to change from a personnel standpoint and I would venture to say that kicking out both ends of a grave is called a rut. If McNair has any desire to get out of this 15 year rut...he needs to cut his losses and start the rebuilding process with wiser and smarter personnel.
 
OptimisticTexan said:
Somehow, the Patriots always make the Brady backup pick(s) in the draft work in their favor. Texans have Watson but that's all they have and if he goes down again, the offense will return right back to unit we are currently witnessing on Game Day. If the Texans draft Mayfield b/c he was available at an early RD3 pick and Watson stays healthy and productive for the next 3 seasons, there should be considerable upside from a trade value standpoint since he will have gotten bigger and better prepared to compete in the NFL.
Click to expand...

Here is one option that the Texans could pursue during the off season that would be better than using their 1st pick on a backup QB: http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap30...yrod-taylor-shocked-buffalo-bills-benched-him There is a good chance Taylor will be let go at the end of the season......

"These moves are common as teams stumble down the stretch, but benching Taylor is packed with future implications. This Bills regime -- unafraid to make sweeping changes -- has made it clear he isn't the long-term answer in Buffalo."
 
Idk that Tyrod is our solution but for the right price I sure would bring him in for a try out. I know he struggles with accuracy and coming off his first read. He's basically all the warts people tried to pin on DW4. Maybe he fits better in our offense but his stats don't tell the true story of his tenure in Buffalo.
 
Came across this in a thread about Tyrod and his issues. Looks very much like the same issues he had in Baltimore. He lacks consistency. You'd think after 6 years in the NFL he'd be solid on footwork and the details that make or break QBs.

 
Ok...getting from this season to 2018 is going to take a lot of luck. The team doesn't start draft day until RD3 and the FA Class looks pretty weak in regards to the teams areas of need. I'm giving it shot anyhow:

FA Signings:

1. LT / Greg Robinson / Lions / Auburn - RD1 (RAMS) / Only hope that he has the desire to rescue his career. There were big expectations of him coming into the NFL.

2. OT / Seantrel Henderson / Bills / Miami - RD7 / Stupid decisions caused his failed career to date. Should've been a RD1 or RD2 pick. Again, you can only hope he wants to rescue his career.

3. CB / DJ Hayden / Lions / Houston - RD1 (OAK) / Injured a lot. Not horrible when he's been on the field but he hasn't been on the field consistently enough to help his development. He still possesses decent speed and the ability to cover...just needs the time.

**These 3 players represent low cost high potential value. If they fail, Texans should see no major financial hits. All 3 contracts could easily come cheap, short term and loaded with incentives**

Players to Resign:

1. OT / Chris Clark / Veteran ST

2. OLB / Lamarr Houston / Would like to see him for a full season.

3. RB / Alfred Blue / Cheap insurance who can play on ST's.

**This group should be affordable and keep the cap in good shape**

2018 NFL Draft:

RD3 - PK1: LT / Tyrell Crosby / Oregon / 6-5 @ 310 lbs.

RD3 - PK2: OC-OG / Frank Ragnow / Arkansas / 6-5 @ 317 lbs. **Could start at C and allow Martin to move to OG**

RD3 - COMP: SS / Cole Reyes / North Dakota / 6-2 @ 215 lbs.

RD4 - PK: OT-OG / Bentley Spain / North Carolina / 6-6 @ 310 lbs.

RD5 - COMP: CB / Jaylan Dunlap / Illinois / 6-1 @ 190 lbs.

RD6 - PK: OLB / Andrew Trumbetti / Notre Dame / 6-3 @ 260 lbs.

RD6 - COMP: TE / Ethan Wolf / Tennessee / 6-6 @ 258 lbs. **Conflicting reports but in RD6 we're expecting what? Worth the roll.**

RD7 - PK: FS-KR / Evan Berry / Tennessee / 5-11 @ 207 lbs. **KR Specialist who knows where the endzone is.**

RD7 - COMP: QB / Anu Solomon / Baylor via Arizona / 6-2 @ 206 lbs. **Runs and throws...not the same as Watson but similar.**

Before anyone mentions that I'm crazy for Mocking that many OL, I wouldn't have had to do this if the team had signed an OL via FA or drafted more than a RD4 project. Desperate times demand desperate measures. There are plenty of answers and some reaches in the areas of need in this draft.
 
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Texecutioner said:
Don't think trading JJ would be smart due to the lack of value we'd get for him. His upside coming back is way to high to get poor value for him. Plus, he's a great leader and ambassador for the team. I'd consider trading him possibly once he comes back and gets on the field and shows what his value truly still is. Clowney will get a ton of money, and Watt's injuries make him hold more value to us now for sure. Mercilous could be the guy more likely traded if you ask me, but who knows. I think we've got Merci on a pretty good contract that's friendly to the team.
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I know we are all wanting to get higher in the draft but getting rid of JJ, Clowney or Merci is not smart in my book - not if you want a dominant dline.
I say cobble two or even all 3 of our thirds if it gets us into position to nab a top olineman.
A second and thrid won't be too bad compensation for getting Watson. Maybe they will swing a trade with the lower picks to move up and get another decent prospect.
I have a bit more confidence in Texans drafting nowadays and RS seems good at finding a good FA also so it's not all doom and gloom.
I expect we will have a very busy off season.
 
PapaL said:
Idk that Tyrod is our solution but for the right price I sure would bring him in for a try out. I know he struggles with accuracy and coming off his first read. He's basically all the warts people tried to pin on DW4. Maybe he fits better in our offense but his stats don't tell the true story of his tenure in Buffalo.
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I must admit I am intrigued by Taylor as his game is very similar to DW.
He is already an upgrade over Savage.
 
OptimisticTexan said:
2018 NFL Draft:

RD3 - PK1: LT / Tyrell Crosby / Oregon / 6-5 @ 310 lbs.

RD3 - PK2: OC-OG / Frank Ragnow / Arkansas / 6-5 @ 317 lbs. **Could start at C and allow Martin to move to OG**

RD3 - COMP: SS / Cole Reyes / North Dakota / 6-2 @ 215 lbs.

RD4 - PK: OT-OG / Bentley Spain / North Carolina / 6-6 @ 310 lbs.

RD5 - PK: CB / Jaylan Dunlap / Illinois / 6-1 @ 190 lbs.

RD6 - PK: OLB / Andrew Trumbetti / Notre Dame / 6-3 @ 260 lbs.

RD6 - COMP: TE / Ethan Wolf / Tennessee / 6-6 @ 258 lbs. **Conflicting reports but in RD6 we're expecting what? Worth the roll.**

RD7 - PK: FS-KR / Evan Berry / Tennessee / 5-11 @ 207 lbs. **KR Specialist who knows where the endzone is.**

RD7 - COMP: QB / Anu Solomon / Baylor via Arizona / 6-2 @ 206 lbs. **Runs and throws...not the same as Watson but similar.**

Before anyone mentions that I'm crazy for Mocking that many OL, I wouldn't have had to do this if the team had signed an OL via FA or drafted more than a RD4 project. Desperate times demand desperate measures. There are plenty of answers and some reaches in the areas of need in this draft.
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Texans don't have a 5th round pick in the 2018 Draft. We gave that to Seattle in the "amended" Duane Brown trade. :(
 
Insideop said:
Texans don't have a 5th round pick in the 2018 Draft. We gave that to Seattle in the "amended" Duane Brown trade. :(
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Sorry about that...I meant for that to be a COMP Pick in RD5. I'm hoping that the success Simon is having with the Colts returns the team a RD5 COMP. Demps was injured and put on IR after 3 games but could still play 6 games to end the season, which would give him 9 starts...this could equate to a RD6 COMP. Aboushi (starter in Seattle) and another FA (name escapes me as I'm typing this) might give the Texans a very good chance at a RD7 COMP. They should get the 4 COMP Pick max.
 
OptimisticTexan said:
Sorry about that...I meant for that to be a COMP Pick in RD5. I'm hoping that the success Simon is having with the Colts returns the team a RD5 COMP. Demps was injured and put on IR after 3 games but could still play 6 games to end the season, which would give him 9 starts...this could equate to a RD6 COMP. Aboushi (starter in Seattle) and another FA (name escapes me as I'm typing this) might give the Texans a very good chance at a RD7 COMP. They should get the 4 COMP Pick max.
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I'm not holding my breath on that one, but man, that would be great if we could get that 5th rounder back.
 
Texansphan said:
I know we are all wanting to get higher in the draft but getting rid of JJ, Clowney or Merci is not smart in my book - not if you want a dominant dline.
I say cobble two or even all 3 of our thirds if it gets us into position to nab a top olineman.
A second and thrid won't be too bad compensation for getting Watson. Maybe they will swing a trade with the lower picks to move up and get another decent prospect.
I have a bit more confidence in Texans drafting nowadays and RS seems good at finding a good FA also so it's not all doom and gloom.
I expect we will have a very busy off season.
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Which Watt, Clowney will we get? Watt has not played much in 2 years. Clowney has another injury per CnnnD, so ...
 
badboy said:
Which Watt, Clowney will we get? Watt has not played much in 2 years. Clowney has another injury per CnnnD, so ...
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Watt at 75% is as good as most other dlinemen.
Clowney will have all off-season to heal so I really don't see much of a problem.
I would wager that 75% of all nfl players that have been in the league 3 or more years have suffered a significant injury in their career.
Acquiring another guy at their talent level will cost a packet - money better spent on the oline.
The depth of dline talent we have will be plenty enough to get us through a season.
 
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Texans will have a few questions facing the franchise after this season is in the books:

1. Can this team find the required pieces in the off-season to make them legitimate contenders in 2018?

2. Does McNair go into 2018 status quo while forgoing this failed season?

3. Could McNair really pull the strings on a complete overhaul if it what's best for his franchise?

4. Can RS put this team together in time to take advantage of his premier players before injuries or contracts do the opposite?

I have answers in mind but it would be far more interesting to see what others think.
 
OptimisticTexan said:
Texans will have a few questions facing the franchise after this season is in the books:

1. Can this team find the required pieces in the off-season to make them legitimate contenders in 2018?

2. Does McNair go into 2018 status quo while forgoing this failed season?

3. Could McNair really pull the strings on a complete overhaul if it what's best for his franchise?

4. Can RS put this team together in time to take advantage of his premier players before injuries or contracts do the opposite?

I have answers in mind but it would be far more interesting to see what others think.
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1. Maybe not all - the oline could be the biggest problem.
2. I really think McNair wants to win it all. There is also a lot of luck in a winning season - for example, if a strong team can get through a season without any major injury issues, they should be very dangerous come playoff time.
3. Maybe. Getting rid of RS might be difficult for him.
4. I don't see why not.
Just needs a season where his key players can stay reasonably healthy or have them available for a playoff run.
 
Will we get 75% of Watt when he returns? We didn't this year brief time he played. I am not dogging JJ, hope he heals; he and Clowney have had more than one significant injury. Even without JJ & JD, too much talent for over haul. Had disagreement with friend (again). Her: a fan is fanatic, never complains or criticises. Me: root for team but see problem call for corrective measures.
 
Not sure what JJ you were watching. Can't remember which game but it started with a stop for no gain and then a tfl. Not all the way back but still damn good.

But maybe we are merely disagreeing over %. IMO the jump from hero to superhero is in the last couple %.
 
infantrycak said:
Not sure what JJ you were watching. Can't remember which game but it started with a stop for no gain and then a tfl. Not all the way back but still damn good.

But maybe we are merely disagreeing over %. IMO the jump from hero to superhero is in the last couple %.
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It was the Pats game.
 
infantrycak said:
Not sure what JJ you were watching. Can't remember which game but it started with a stop for no gain and then a tfl. Not all the way back but still damn good.

But maybe we are merely disagreeing over %. IMO the jump from hero to superhero is in the last couple %.
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yes but would you not want more than a few plays to evaluate how good Watt will be for entire 2018 season?
 
It just keeps getting worse each game, I get hopeful and then Fairbern has his second and third field goals..what were those hooks to left? Allen at left tackle? Well...one WR and one TE then oh never mind.
 
badboy said:
It just keeps getting worse each game, I get hopeful and then Fairbern has his second and third field goals..what were those hooks to left? Allen at left tackle? Well...one WR and one TE then oh never mind.
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Yeah, this team is just a shell of what it was at the beginning of the season and I don't think any team has been hit harder by injuries. Building quality depth in the off season will help with this of course, but they have to hit on more of their picks and FA's than not. And, we all know how easy that is! :shades:
 
OK, the 1st step "on getting there from here" is done with the hiring of Gaine as GM. The next step will be extending BOB and then he can hire the assistant coaches he wants to fill out his staff. I have no idea who BOB is looking at to fill the openings but I wish he would look at hiring the OC from Seattle (Bevell) that just got fired and put him in as OC here. That would free up BOB to concentrate on being a HC (and Time Management), but I know this will probably not happen since BOB is BOB and probably can't wait to get his hands on Watson and "his" offense next season.

After BOB fills out his staff it will be time for the Senior Bowl and evaluating the players that are there. This is where Gaine should start earning his money. Next will be the Combine, then the Pro Days, then FA, and finally the Draft. It sounds like this will be a busy and eventful off season! Get the popcorn ready! :popcorn:
 
Seems like there was lots of disagreement here on Gaines. I did read he was 1st choice and since Ray remains I guess there will be continuity...if that's a good thing. Wonder if Smith will be in war room?
 
This offense must be fixed going into next season. The defense could rebound with a healthy return of Watt, Clowney, Mercilus and the signing of a couple of FA DB's. So, with that in mind the five picks are going to relegated to helping this offense.

RD3 / RD4 Options:

LT- Brian O'Neil- Pitt- 6-6 @ 305 lbs.

LT- Tyrell Crosby- Oregon- 6-5 @ 310 lbs.

LT- Jamarco Jones- Ohio St- 6-5 @ 310 lbs.

LG- Maea Teuhema- SE Louisiana- 6-5 @ 315 lbs.

OC/OG- Frank Ragnow- Arkansas- 6-5 @ 317 lbs.

LG/OC- Will Clapp- LSU- 6-5 @ 309 lbs.

TE- Mike Gesicki- Penn St- 6-6 @ 252 lbs.

TE- Dallas Goedert- South Dakota St- 6-4 @ 260 lbs.

RB- John Adams- Norte Dame- 6-2 @ 225 lbs.

RB- Bo Scarborough- Alabama- 6-2 @ 228 lbs.


RD6 1st Pick Options:

LT- Bentley Spain- North Carolina- 6-6 @ 300 lbs.

LG- Taylor Hearn- Clemson- 6-5 @ 330 lbs.


I could be very satisfied if:

RD3
1. LT- O'Neil
2. OC- Ragnow
3. TE- Gesicki

RD4
1. RB- Scarborough

RD6
1. LT- Spain

If this grouping couldn't happen, then I could be just as happy if the majority of this talent was available and grouped in a manner that gives the Texans the best bang for the buck. The defense / ST would get the final 3 or maybe 4 picks (if the Texans are given a COMP RD7) for depth and ST upgrades.
 
O'Neil is getting top-50 pick hype right now. He's a former TE and looks pretty athletic. If he confirms it at the Combine in tests then we will have no shot at him. Gesicki is a very very good receiver but one of the worst blocking TE's I've ever seen in my life. That doesn't bother some people but to me you have to at least be passable as a blocker to play TE in the NFL.

JMO but there is nothing enticing about Scarborough as an NFL prospect. Yeah he's an incredibly impressive physical specimen but he has slow feet and average vision. He only had one 100-yard game in his career and got passed on the depth chart this year by younger guys. I'd take Josh Adams over him in the 4th any day but Adams won't make it that far. Give me Royce Freeman or John Kelly instead.
 
WolverineFan said:
O'Neil is getting top-50 pick hype right now. He's a former TE and looks pretty athletic. If he confirms it at the Combine in tests then we will have no shot at him. Gesicki is a very very good receiver but one of the worst blocking TE's I've ever seen in my life. That doesn't bother some people but to me you have to at least be passable as a blocker to play TE in the NFL.

JMO but there is nothing enticing about Scarborough as an NFL prospect. Yeah he's an incredibly impressive physical specimen but he has slow feet and average vision. He only had one 100-yard game in his career and got passed on the depth chart this year by younger guys. I'd take Josh Adams over him in the 4th any day but Adams won't make it that far. Give me Royce Freeman or John Kelly instead.
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I wonder if Kellen Ballage will be there in the 4th rd.

The TE I really like is Fumagalli.
 
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