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bah007 Updated Position Rankings - Offense

It takes King Henry extra time to get up to speed, a luxury he will not be afforded in the NFL. He also runs upright making him an easy target.
 
You will probably want to wipe Shawn Oakman...........looks like O'brien was right.

From PFT:

Baylor’s Shawn Oakman arrested on sexual assault charge
Posted by Michael David Smith on April 13, 2016, 5:17 PM EDT


Former Baylor defensive lineman Shawn Oakman, who was once considered a strong NFL draft prospect, has been arrested on a sexual assault charge.

The Waco Tribune-Herald reports that Waco police arrested Oakman today. He is accused of sexually assaulting a female Baylor student early on Sunday morning. The woman says Oakman forced her into a bedroom in his home, forcibly removed her clothes and sexually assaulted her.

According to a police report, Oakman says he had consensual sex with the woman.

A 6-foot-8, 287-pounder with good athletic ability, Oakman was once considered a potential first-round pick. But he did not have a good senior season last year, and he has a history of off-field issues. He began his college career at Penn State, but coach Bill O’Brien kicked him off the team after he was accused of attempting to steal food from a campus store and grabbing the wrist of a cashier who tried to stop him.

The sexual assault charge means Oakman will almost certainly not be drafted, and may never play in the NFL.
Click to expand...
 
I would like to get to the point we can use RB for his rookie contract and have him replaced by another rookie player. IMO RBs need less time to be ready for NFL yet can be impact guys controlling ball, scoring and getting yardage. There is the pull of offering huge second contract to very good player but this position offers so much risk of injury, I would rather use that money elsewhere. If we did have a RB in his final year having great season, it should encourage others to trade.
 
Final update before the draft. I actually made more changes than I thought I would in my final edit. Obviously, this is just a hobby of mine. I do not have the resources that the professionals do so I have to make due with what I can find. Our annual mock draft is always a very useful exercise for me. We have a lot of knowledgeable posters here who bring their own unique points of view to each draft. I was able to get different perspectives on some players, better ideas of value, and even some new players to do homework on. This is going to sound insane but I have done research on 372 players for this draft. I have not done full scouting reports on each one obviously. I do have a (boring) life. But I have at least made an effort to dig into each of the players that I have listed here. If they aren't listed here then I haven't looked into them at all.

I'm actually going to do something unique with the format of the rankings. Instead of listing the positions in traditional order I am instead going to list them in the order of how comfortable I feel scouting each position. This will probably make things harder to read, but it will give y'all a better idea of which rankings I am particularly confident in and which ones should probably be taken with a grain of salt. Having coached WR, CB, and S in the past that is obviously my comfort zone, although CB is insanely difficult to project to the pro level. My K/P rankings are a shot in the dark. I am obviously still familiar with OL and DL but just don't have the experience working with those groups to feel as confident there as I do in other areas.
 
S
  1. Jalen Ramsey – Florida St, 1
  2. Karl Joseph – West Virginia, 1
  3. Vonn Bell – Ohio St, 2
  4. Jeremy Cash – Duke, 2
  5. Justin Simmons – Boston College, 3
  6. Sean Davis – Maryland, 3
  7. Darian Thompson – Boise St, 4
  8. Keanu Neal – Florida, 4
  9. K.J. Dillon – West Virginia, 4
  10. T.J. Green – Clemson, 5
  11. James Bradberry – Samford, 6
  12. D.J. Hunter – Marshall, 6
  13. Deon Bush – Miami, 6
  14. Tyvis Powell – Ohio St, 7
  15. DeAndre Houston-Carson – William & Mary, 7
  16. Juston Burris – North Carolina St, FA
  17. Derrick Kindred – TCU, FA
  18. Jordan Lucas – Penn St, FA
  19. Brian Poole – Florida, FA
  20. Leshaun Sims – Southern Utah, FA
  21. Jordan Lomax – Iowa, FA
  22. Lamarcus Brutus – Florida St, FA

SLOT WR
  1. Sterling Shepard – Oklahoma, 2
  2. Corey Coleman – Baylor, 2
  3. Will Fuller – Notre Dame, 2
  4. Malcolm Mitchell – Georgia, 3
  5. Leonte Caroo – Rutgers, 3
  6. Pharoh Cooper – South Carolina, 4
  7. Daniel Braverman – Western Michigan, 5
  8. Kolby Listenbee – TCU, 5
  9. Aaron Burbridge – Michigan St, 6
  10. Jalin Marshall – Ohio St, 6
  11. Bralon Addison – Oregon, 7
  12. Jakeem Grant – Texas Tech, 7
  13. Roger Lewis – Bowling Green, 7
  14. Devin Lucien – Arizona St, 7
  15. D.J. Foster – Arizona St, FA
  16. Hunter Sharp – Utah St, FA
  17. Byron Marshall – Oregon, FA
  18. KJ Maye – Minnesota, FA
  19. Demarcus Ayers – Houston, FA

WR
  1. Josh Doctson – TCU, 1
  2. Laquon Treadwell – Mississippi, 1
  3. Michael Thomas – Ohio St, 2
  4. Tyler Boyd – Pittsburgh, 2
  5. Braxton Miller – Ohio St, 3
  6. Tajae Sharpe – Massachusetts, 4
  7. Jordan Payton – UCLA, 4
  8. Keyarris Garrett – Tulsa, 4
  9. Trevor Davis – California, 5
  10. Chris Moore – Cincinnati, 5
  11. Charone Peake – Clemson, 5
  12. Geronimo Allison – Illinois, 6
  13. Rashard Higgins – Colorado St, 6
  14. Marquez North – Tennessee, 6
  15. Cody Core – Mississippi, 7
  16. Ricardo Louis – Auburn, 7
  17. De’Runnya Wilson – Mississippi St, 7
  18. Cayleb Jones – Arizona, FA
  19. Chris Brown – Notre Dame, FA
  20. Paul McRoberts – Southeast Missouri St, FA
  21. Kenny Lawler – California, FA
  22. Mekale McKay – Cincinnati, FA
  23. Jay Lee – Baylor, FA
  24. Nelson Spruce – Colorado, FA
  25. Alonzo Russell – Toledo, FA
  26. Johnny Holton – Cincinnati, FA
  27. Rashawn Scott – Miami, FA
  28. Demarcus Robinson – Florida, FA

TE
  1. Austin Hooper – Stanford, 2
  2. Hunter Henry – Arkansas, 2
  3. Jerrell Adams – South Carolina, 3
  4. Tyler Higbee – Western Kentucky, 4
  5. Nick Vannett – Ohio St, 5
  6. Beau Sandland – Montana St, 6
  7. Temarrick Hemingway – South Carolina St, 7
  8. Ben Braunecker – Harvard, 7
  9. David Morgan – UTSA, FA
  10. Jake McGee – Florida, FA
  11. Steven Scheu – Vanderbilt, FA
  12. Bryce Williams – ECU, FA
  13. Henry Krieger Coble – Iowa, FA
  14. David Grinnage – North Carolina St, FA
  15. Ryan Malleck – Virginia Tech, FA
  16. Darion Griswold – Arkansas St, FA

FLEX TE
  1. Devon Cajuste – Stanford, 4
  2. Thomas Duarte – UCLA, 5
  3. Stephen Anderson – California, 7
  4. Tanner McEvoy – Wisconsin, 7
  5. Sean Price – South Florida, FA
  6. Duke Williams – Auburn, FA

QB
  1. Jared Goff – California, 1
  2. Carson Wentz – North Dakota St, 1
  3. Paxton Lynch – Memphis, 2
  4. Connor Cook – Michigan St, 2
  5. Kevin Hogan – Stanford, 3
  6. Christian Hackenberg – Penn St, 3
  7. Dak Prescott – Mississippi St, 3
  8. Jeff Driskel – Louisiana Tech, 5
  9. Jacoby Brissett – North Carolina St, 5
  10. Brandon Allen – Arkansas, 5
  11. Vernon Adams – Oregon, 6
  12. Jake Rudock – Michigan, 6
  13. Jake Coker – Alabama, 6
  14. Cardale Jones – Ohio St, 7
  15. Nate Sudfeld – Indiana, FA
  16. Cody Kessler – USC, FA
  17. Joel Stave – Wisconsin, FA
  18. Josh Woodrum – Liberty, FA
  19. Brandon Doughty – Western Kentucky, FA
  20. Trevone Boykin – TCU, FA

RB
  1. Ezekiel Elliott – Ohio St, 1
  2. Kenneth Dixon – Louisiana Tech, 2
  3. Jordan Howard – Indiana, 3
  4. C.J. Prosise – Notre Dame, 3
  5. Devontae Booker – Utah, 3
  6. Paul Perkins – UCLA, 4
  7. Alex Collins – Arkansas, 4
  8. Derrick Henry – Alabama, 4
  9. Wendell Smallwood – West Virginia, 5
  10. Kenyan Drake – Alabama, 5
  11. Tyler Ervin – San Jose St, 5
  12. Jonathan Williams – Arkansas, 5
  13. Keith Marshall – Georgia, 6
  14. Daniel Lasco – California, 6
  15. DeAndre Washington – Texas Tech, 6
  16. Josh Ferguson – Illinois, 7
  17. Kenneth Farrow – Houston, 7
  18. Aaron Green – TCU, 7
  19. Kelvin Taylor – Florida, 7
  20. Keenan Reynolds – Navy, FA
  21. Peyton Barber – Auburn, FA
  22. Marshaun Coprich – Illinois St , FA
  23. Brandon Wilds – South Carolina, FA
  24. Travis Greene – Bowling Green, FA
  25. Tra Carson – Texas A&M, FA
  26. Tre Madden – USC, FA
  27. Shad Thornton – North Carolina St, FA

CB
  1. Mackensie Alexander – Clemson, 1
  2. Vernon Hargreaves – Florida, 1
  3. William Jackson – Houston, 1
  4. Kendall Fuller – Virginia Tech, 2
  5. Eli Apple – Ohio St, 2
  6. Artie Burns – Miami, 2
  7. Xavien Howard – Baylor, 3
  8. Jalen Mills – LSU, 3
  9. Zack Sanchez – Oklahoma, 4
  10. Cyrus Jones – Alabama, 4
  11. Will Redmond – Mississippi St, 4
  12. Deiondre Hall – Northern Iowa, 4
  13. Daryl Worley – West Virginia, 5
  14. Rashard Robinson – LSU, 5
  15. Tavon Young – Temple, 5
  16. Eric Murray – Minnesota, 5
  17. D.J. White – Georgia Tech, 5
  18. Harlan Miller – Southeastern Louisiana, 5
  19. Kalan Reed – Southern Miss, 5
  20. Keivarae Russell – Notre Dame, 6
  21. Kevon Seymour – USC, 6
  22. Morgan Burns – Kansas St, 6
  23. Cleveland Wallace – San Jose St, 6
  24. DeAndre Elliott – Colorado St, 6
  25. Maurice Canady – Virginia, 6
  26. Ken Crawley – Colorado, 7
  27. Jonathan Jones – Auburn, 7
  28. Brandon Williams – Texas A&M, 7
  29. Briean Boddy-Calhoun – Minnesota, 7
  30. Jimmy Pruitt – San Jose St, 7
  31. Anthony Brown – Purdue, 7
  32. Ryan Smith – North Carolina Central, FA
  33. De’Vante Harris – Texas A&M, FA
  34. Kevin Peterson – Oklahoma St, FA
  35. Taveze Calhoun – Mississippi St, FA
  36. A.J. Stamps – Kentucky, FA

INTERIOR LB
  1. Myles Jack – UCLA, 1
  2. Reggie Ragland – Alabama, 1
  3. Nick Kwiatkoski – West Virginia, 3
  4. Kentrell Brothers – Missouri, 4
  5. B.J. Goodson – Clemson, 4
  6. Joe Schobert – Wisconsin, 4
  7. Josh Forrest – Kentucky, 5
  8. Steven Daniels – Boston College, 5
  9. Scooby Wright – Arizona, 6
  10. Luke Rhodes – William & Mary, 6
  11. Steve Longa – Rutgers, 6
  12. Jared Norris – Utah, 7
  13. Cassanova McKinzy – Auburn, FA
  14. Curt Maggitt – Tennessee, FA
  15. Kris Frost – Auburn, FA

DL (3/5/7)
  1. DeForest Buckner – Oregon, 1
  2. Chris Jones – Mississippi St, 1
  3. Robert Nkemdiche – Mississippi, 1
  4. Bronson Kaufusi – BYU, 2
  5. Jonathan Bullard – Florida, 2
  6. Jihad Ward – Illinois, 3
  7. Dean Lowry – Northwestern, 4
  8. Matt Ioannidis – Temple, 5
  9. Ronald Blair – Appalachian St, 5
  10. Anthony Zettel – Penn St, 5
  11. Adam Gotsis – Georgia Tech, 6
  12. Aziz Shittu – Stanford, 7
  13. Quinton Jefferson – Maryland, 7
  14. Giorgio Newberry – Florida St, 7
  15. Shawn Oakman – Baylor, 7
  16. Joel Heath – Michigan St, FA
  17. Ufomba Kamalu – Miami, FA
  18. Lawrence Thomas – Michigan St, FA
  19. Sterling Bailey – Georgia, FA
  20. Mehdi Abdesmad – Boston College, FA
  21. Devaunte Sigler – Jacksonville St, FA
 
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INTERIOR DL (0/1/3)
  1. Sheldon Rankins – Louisville, 1
  2. Vernon Butler – Louisiana Tech, 1
  3. Andrew Billings – Baylor, 1
  4. Jarran Reed – Alabama, 1
  5. A’Shawn Robinson – Alabama, 1
  6. Kenny Clark – UCLA, 2
  7. Austin Johnson – Penn St, 2
  8. Javon Hargrave – South Carolina St, 3
  9. Sheldon Day – Notre Dame, 3
  10. Hassan Ridgeway – Texas, 3
  11. Willie Henry – Michigan, 4
  12. Adolphus Washington – Ohio St, 4
  13. D.J. Reader – Clemson, 4
  14. Maliek Collins – Nebraska, 5
  15. Darius Latham – Indiana, 6
  16. Connor Wujciak – Boston College, 7
  17. Nile Lawrence-Stample – Florida St, 7
  18. Justin Zimmer – Ferris St, FA
  19. Vincent Valentine – Nebraska, FA
  20. Chris Mayes – Georgia, FA
  21. Antwaun Woods – USC, FA
  22. Luther Maddy – Virginia Tech, FA

EDGE (7/9)
  1. Joey Bosa – Ohio St, 1
  2. Shaq Lawson – Clemson, 1
  3. Kevin Dodd – Clemson, 1
  4. Emmanuel Ogbah – Oklahoma St, 1
  5. Leonard Floyd – Georgia, 2
  6. Yannick Ngakoue – Maryland, 2
  7. Kamalei Correa – Boise St, 2
  8. Kyler Fackrell – Utah St, 2
  9. Noah Spence – Eastern Kentucky, 2
  10. Shilique Calhoun – Michigan St, 3
  11. Stephen Weatherly – Vanderbilt, 3
  12. Carl Nassib – Penn St, 3
  13. Jordan Jenkins – Georgia, 3
  14. Charles Tapper – Oklahoma, 3
  15. Joshua Perry – Ohio St, 4
  16. Matt Judon – Grand Valley St, 5
  17. Ron Thompson – Syracuse, 5
  18. Tyrone Holmes – Montana, 6
  19. James Cowser – Southern Utah, 6
  20. Drew Ott – Iowa, 6
  21. Jonathan Woodard – Central Arkansas, 7
  22. Jason Fanaika – Utah, 7
  23. Victor Ochi – Stony Brook, 7
  24. D.J. Pettway – Alabama, 7
  25. Alex McCalister – Florida, 7
  26. Trent Corney – Virginia, FA
  27. Romeo Okwara – Notre Dame, FA
  28. Jimmy Bean – Oklahoma St, FA
  29. Branden Jackson – Texas Tech, FA

LB
  1. Jaylon Smith – Notre Dame, 1
  2. Darron Lee – Ohio St, 2
  3. Tyler Matakevich – Temple, 3
  4. Dominique Alexander – Oklahoma, 3
  5. Nick Vigil – Utah St, 3
  6. Blake Martinez – Stanford, 4
  7. Travis Feeney – Washington, 4
  8. De’Vondre Campbell – Minnesota, 5
  9. David Perkins – Illinois St, 6
  10. Antonio Morrison – Florida 6
  11. Elandon Roberts – Houston, 6
  12. Terrance Smith – Florida St, 7
  13. Beniquez Brown – Mississippi St, 7
  14. Dadi Nicolas – Virginia Tech, FA
  15. C.J. Johnson – Mississippi, FA
  16. Devante Bond – Oklahoma, FA
  17. Raphael Kirby – Miami, FA
  18. Zeek Bigger – ECU, FA
  19. Cory Littleton – Washington, FA
  20. Gionni Paul – Utah, FA
  21. Jake Ganus – Georgia, FA

HYBRID LB (NICKEL LB/S)
  1. Su’a Cravens – USC, 2
  2. Miles Killebrew – Southern Utah, 3
  3. Deion Jones – LSU, 3
  4. Jatavis Brown – Akron, 4
  5. Jayron Kearse – Clemson, 5
  6. Kavon Frazier – Central Michigan, 5
  7. Kevin Byard – Middle Tennessee, 6
  8. Eric Striker – Oklahoma, 6
  9. James Burgess – Louisville, 7
  10. Montese Overton – ECU, FA
  11. Elijah Shumate – Notre Dame, FA
  12. Tevin Carter – Utah, FA

FB
  1. Dan Vitale – Northwestern, 4
  2. Glenn Gronkowski – Kansas St, 5
  3. Derek Watt – Wisconsin, 7
  4. Sione Houma – Michigan, 7
  5. Andy Janovich – Nebraska, FA
  6. Alan Cross – Memphis, FA
  7. Soma Vainuku – USC, FA
  8. Quayvon Hicks – Georgia, FA
  9. Devon Johnson – Marshall, FA

C
  1. Ryan Kelly – Alabama, 2
  2. Isaac Seumalo – Oregon St, 2
  3. Nick Martin – Notre Dame, 2
  4. Graham Glasgow – Michigan, 3
  5. Austin Blythe – Iowa, 4
  6. Evan Boehm – Missouri, 4
  7. Jack Allen – Michigan St, 4
  8. Max Tuerk – USC, 5
  9. Joe Thuney – North Carolina St, 6
  10. Jake Brendel – UCLA, 7
  11. Mike Matthews – Texas A&M, FA
  12. Alex Redmond – UCLA, FA

OG
  1. Cody Whitehair – Kansas St, 1
  2. Josh Garnett – Stanford, 2
  3. Christian Westerman – Arizona St, 3
  4. Joe Dahl – Washington St, 3
  5. Vadal Alexander – LSU, 3
  6. Fahn Cooper – Mississippi, 4
  7. Sebastian Tretola – Arkansas, 4
  8. Rees Odhiambo – Boise St, 4
  9. Landon Turner – North Carolina, 5
  10. Denver Kirkland – Arkansas, 5
  11. Connor McGovern – Missouri, 5
  12. Avery Young – Auburn, 6
  13. Dominique Robertson – West Georgia, 6
  14. Matt Skura – Duke, 7
  15. Jordan Walsh – Iowa, FA
  16. Darrell Greene – San Diego St, FA
  17. Nila Kasitati – Oklahoma, FA

OT
  1. Laremy Tunsil – Mississippi, 1
  2. Jack Conklin – Michigan St, 1
  3. Ronnie Stanley – Notre Dame, 1
  4. Jason Spriggs – Indiana, 1
  5. Taylor Decker – Ohio St, 2
  6. Willie Beavers – Western Michigan, 2
  7. Germain Ifedi – Texas A&M, 2
  8. Shon Coleman – Auburn, 2
  9. Kyle Murphy – Stanford, 3
  10. Joe Haeg – North Dakota St, 3
  11. Le’Raven Clark – Texas Tech, 3
  12. John Theus – Georgia, 4
  13. Caleb Benenoch – UCLA, 4
  14. Brandon Shell – South Carolina, 4
  15. Alex Lewis – Nebraska, 5
  16. Cole Toner – Harvard, 5
  17. Jerald Hawkins – LSU, 6
  18. Spencer Drango – Baylor, 6
  19. Stephane Nembot – Colorado, 7
  20. Halapoulivaati Vaitai – TCU, 7
  21. Tyler Johnstone – Oregon, 7
  22. Tyler Marz – Wisconsin, FA
  23. Joseph Cheek – Texas A&M, FA
  24. Pearce Slater – San Diego St, FA
  25. Dominick Jackson – Alabama, FA
  26. Parker Ehinger – Cincinnati, FA

P
  1. Drew Kaser – Texas A&M, 6
  2. Tom Hackett – Utah, 7
  3. Will Monday – Duke, FA
  4. Lac Edwards – Sam Houston St, FA
  5. Nick O’Toole – West Virginia, FA
  6. Riley Dixon – Syracuse, FA

K
  1. Roberto Aguayo – Florida St, 4
  2. Ka’imi Fairbairn – UCLA, 6
  3. Brad Craddock – Maryland, 7
  4. Marshall Koehn – Iowa, FA
  5. Jaden Oberkrom – TCU, FA
  6. John Lunsford – Liberty, FA
 
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  1. Adam Schefter ‏@AdamSchefter 5h5 hours ago
    One NFL head coach even predicted this morning that Notre Dame LB Jaylon Smith could go "at the end of (round) 1, maybe round 2."

    Adam Schefter ‏@AdamSchefter 5h5 hours ago
    [*] Even with the catastrophic knee injury, Notre Dame LB Jaylon Smith is expected to gone by end of round 3, maybe earlier, per league sources.
    Click to expand...
    I notice you have Smith as the #1 LB to go.........and some NFL "sources" having him going quite high. I still remain very guarded about future regarding his peroneal nerve foot drop, which reportedly has not shown any signs of improvement since his surgery 4 months ago.
 
CloakNNNdagger said:

  1. I notice you have Smith as the #1 LB to go.........and some NFL "sources" having him going quite high. I still remain very guarded about future regarding his peroneal nerve foot drop, which reportedly has not shown any signs of improvement since his surgery 4 months ago.
Click to expand...

Smith's issue is out in the open so I could take it into account, but I'm sure there are other guys out there that failed medicals and we won't find out about it until after the draft. I look at it this way. I'm playing pretend scout and I'm grading the players by what I see on the field. If I worked for a team it would be up to the doctors and decision makers to determine if his injury prognosis is too much risk. I just tell them what he can do on the field.
 
CloakNNNdagger said:

  1. I notice you have Smith as the #1 LB to go.........and some NFL "sources" having him going quite high. I still remain very guarded about future regarding his peroneal nerve foot drop, which reportedly has not shown any signs of improvement since his surgery 4 months ago.
Click to expand...
Hey doc what's your prognosis on Karl Joseph?
 
mussop said:
Hey doc what's your prognosis on Karl Joseph?
Click to expand...
NFL players have an ~85% chance of return to play (one study found ~ 66%)..........vets having 4 years or more experience and players taken in the 1st 3 rounds are more likely to return. Approximately 5% risk of the same ACL rupturing within 2 years with an approximate additional similar risk for rupture of the opposite ACL................so essentially an approximate risk of 10% rupture of one or the other ACL. [Edit addition: Younger age and return to a pivoting or cutting sport increased the chance of an ipsilateral graft tear or contralateral ACL injury.]

Although there have been cases well publicized of players returning in 6 months, the majority do not return functionally before 10-12 months. For those players who have returned, performance has been all over the place in studies ranging anywhere from ~90-100% to 33%, at one year following the surgery.
 
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It was a long season, and I haven't had nearly as much free time as I normally do to watch and scout games. But here is an early look at my take on this year's draft class on offense:

QB
1. Mitch Trubisky – North Carolina
2. DeShone Kizer – Notre Dame
3. Mason Rudolph – Oklahoma St
4. Brad Kaaya – Miami
5. Chad Kelly – Mississippi
6. Deshaun Watson – Clemson
7. Cooper Rush – Central Michigan
8. Nathan Peterman – Pittsburgh
9. Davis Webb – California
10. Zach Terrell – Western Michigan
11. Josh Dobbs – Tennessee
12. Seth Russell – Baylor
13. C.J. Beathard – Iowa
14. Sefo Liufau – Colorado


RB
1. Leonard Fournette – LSU
2. Jeremy McNichols – Boise St
3. D’Onta Foreman – Texas
4. Dalvin Cook – Florida St
5. Wayne Gallman – Clemson
6. Christian McCaffrey – Stanford
7. Elijah Hood – North Carolina
8. Nick Chubb – Georgia
9. Brian Hill – Wyoming
10. Royce Freeman – Oregon
11. Kareem Hunt – Toledo
12. Corey Clement – Wisconsin
13. Samaje Perine – Oklahoma
14. Justin Davis – USC
15. Joe Williams – Utah
16. Jamaal Williams – BYU
17. De’Veon Smith – Michigan
18. Russel Shell – West Virginia
19. Leon Allen – Western Kentucky
20. Brandon Radcliff – Louisville


FB
1. Freddie Stevenson – Florida St
2. Sam Rogers – Virginia Tech
3. Michael Zunica – Kansas


WR
1. Corey Davis – Western Michigan
2. Mike Williams – Clemson
3. John Ross – Washington
4. Dede Westbrook – Oklahoma
5. Isaiah Ford – Virginia Tech
6. JuJu Smith-Schuster – USC
7. Travis Rudolph – Florida St
8. Amara Darboh – Michigan
9. Cooper Kupp – Eastern Washington
10. Curtis Samuel – Ohio St
11. Malachi Dupre – LSU
12. James Quick – Louisville
13. Zay Jones - ECU
14. James Washington – Oklahoma St
15. Amba Etta-Tawo – Syracuse
16. Austin Carr – Northwestern
17. Fred Ross – Mississippi St
18. Artavis Scott – Clemson
19. Josh Reynolds – Texas A&M
20. Quincy Adeboyejo – Mississippi
21. Darren Carrington – Oregon
22. Stacy Coley – Miami
23. Greg Ward – Houston
24. Gabe Marks – Washington St
25. Ryan Switzer – North Carolina
26. Jehu Chesson – Michigan
27. Travin Dural – LSU
28. Taywan Taylor – Western Kentucky
29. Jamari Staples – Louisville
30. Michael Rector – Stanford


TE
1. Bucky Hodges – Virginia Tech
2. Jordan Leggett – Clemson
3. O.J. Howard – Alabama
4. Jake Butt – Michigan
5. Jeremy Sprinkle – Arkansas
6. Cole Hikutini – Louisville
7. Durham Smythe – Notre Dame
8. Evan Engram – Mississippi
9. Josiah Price – Michigan St
10. Pharaoh Brown – Oregon
11. Blake Jarwin – Oklahoma St
12. George Kittle – Iowa
13. Colin Jeter – LSU
14. Sam Cotton – Nebraska


OT
1. Cam Robinson – Alabama
2. Adam Bisnowaty – Pittsburgh
3. Taylor Moton – Western Michigan
4. Ryan Ramczyk – Wisconsin
5. Garett Bolles – Utah
6. Dion Dawkins – Temple
7. Chad Wheeler – USC
8. Roderick Johnson – Florida St
9. Dan Skipper – Arkansas
10. Mike McGlinchey – Notre Dame
11. Avery Gennesy – Texas A&M
12. Will Holden – Vanderbilt
13. Jon Heck – North Carolina
14. Conor McDermott – UCLA
15. J.J. Dielman – Utah
16. Erik Magnuson – Michigan
17. Clint Van Horn – Marshall


OG
1. Dan Feeney – Indiana
2. Dorian Johnson – Pittsburgh
3. Braden Smith – Auburn
4. Tyrone Crowder – Clemson
5. Nico Siragusa – San Diego St
6. Forrest Lamp – Western Kentucky
7. Chase Roullier – Wyoming
8. Zach Banner – USC
9. Scott Quessenberry – UCLA
10. Kyle Kalis – Michigan
11. Sean Harlow – Oregon St
12. Greg Pyke – Georgia
13. Jake Eldrenkamp – Washington
14. Alex Kozan – Auburn
15. Blake Belcher – Tulsa
16. Johnny Caspers – Stanford
17. Josh Boutte – LSU


C
1. Pat Elfein – Ohio St
2. Ethan Pocic – LSU
3. Jon Toth – Kentucky
4. Tyler Orlosky – West Virginia
5. Kyle Fuller – Baylor
6. Brandon Kublanow – Georgia
7. Cameron Tom – Southern Miss
8. Jamaal Clayborn – Mississippi St
 
I see you do not have Billy Price listed. He is a junior in eligibility but on track to graduate in spring.

IMO, he is the top rated offensive lineman in the class and the best guard prospect since Kevin Zeitler. I could see him returning but what could he gain?
 
bah007, in your opinion, is the OT class as bad as "they" say it is this year? If so, do you think the OT's will fall in the draft or do you think teams in need of OT's will reach (especially in the 1st round)?
 
This isn't just to @bah007 , but rather to everyone. I just didn't feel like making a new thread for my question.

What do you all think about Chad Kelly? After doing some studying, I think he might have the best arm talent in the draft. He is mobile, tough, and I like his on-the-field attitude (sue me... gunslingers make for entertaining football).

On the downside, the kid is a moron. A lot of the off-the-field concerns are the same reservations I had with Manziel, and we all know how that turned out. On the field, I wonder about the offense he is in. I saw a lot of throws to wide open targets (granted, most of the throws were on point), and I did not see a lot of Kelly having to work through his progressions.

Anyway, long story short, I think he is a late 1st/early 2nd talent. But with the off-the-field stuff, I am thinking I wouldn't chance a pick on him before the 4th.

Thoughts?
 
If Chad Kelly acted like this when he was a lighting JUCO, how do you think he'd act if someone handed him to the keys to the franchise?

Wiki:
In December 2014, Kelly was arrested following an altercation outside of a Buffalo, New York nightclub in which he got into a fight with bouncers, reportedly threatened to return with an AK-47, and resisted arrest. His plea deal resulted in criminal charges being dropped in favor of a guilty plea to disorderly conduct and 50 hours of community service.[14]
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rmartin65 said:
This isn't just to @bah007 , but rather to everyone. I just didn't feel like making a new thread for my question.

What do you all think about Chad Kelly? After doing some studying, I think he might have the best arm talent in the draft. He is mobile, tough, and I like his on-the-field attitude (sue me... gunslingers make for entertaining football).

On the downside, the kid is a moron. A lot of the off-the-field concerns are the same reservations I had with Manziel, and we all know how that turned out. On the field, I wonder about the offense he is in. I saw a lot of throws to wide open targets (granted, most of the throws were on point), and I did not see a lot of Kelly having to work through his progressions.

Anyway, long story short, I think he is a late 1st/early 2nd talent. But with the off-the-field stuff, I am thinking I wouldn't chance a pick on him before the 4th.

Thoughts?
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Another Ryan mallet. Bought said.
 
Guess I would have to disagree rating Deshaun Watson #6 QB prospect in this upcoming draft. Take it your not a fan? What's difference between him & Dak Prescott? How could Texans possibly pass him up if sitting there #22?
 
Moton is looking very good right now.

Big powerful guy.

Looks to be very serviceable RT/RG.

Could get him in the 3rd rd.
 
Insideop said:
bah007, in your opinion, is the OT class as bad as "they" say it is this year? If so, do you think the OT's will fall in the draft or do you think teams in need of OT's will reach (especially in the 1st round)?
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I don't think it's bad at all. I don't think there are any elite guys so that might be where the perception is coming from, especially since last year the class was so strong at the top. But I wouldn't say it's bad. There will be some solid players and there is pretty decent depth at the position in this class.

I wouldn't be surprised to see some teams reach up for OTs if they need one in the first. But I think those picks will happen in the middle or back of the 1st instead of near the front like we usually see.
 
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rmartin65 said:
This isn't just to @bah007 , but rather to everyone. I just didn't feel like making a new thread for my question.

What do you all think about Chad Kelly? After doing some studying, I think he might have the best arm talent in the draft. He is mobile, tough, and I like his on-the-field attitude (sue me... gunslingers make for entertaining football).

On the downside, the kid is a moron. A lot of the off-the-field concerns are the same reservations I had with Manziel, and we all know how that turned out. On the field, I wonder about the offense he is in. I saw a lot of throws to wide open targets (granted, most of the throws were on point), and I did not see a lot of Kelly having to work through his progressions.

Anyway, long story short, I think he is a late 1st/early 2nd talent. But with the off-the-field stuff, I am thinking I wouldn't chance a pick on him before the 4th.

Thoughts?
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On pure arm talent I think he's the top guy in the class. But I don't think I could trust him, and that's a big deal to me. Somebody will pull the trigger. Personally, I wouldn't.
 
beerlover said:
Guess I would have to disagree rating Deshaun Watson #6 QB prospect in this upcoming draft. Take it your not a fan? What's difference between him & Dak Prescott? How could Texans possibly pass him up if sitting there #22?
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I don't think he's a first round QB at all. I wouldn't say that I'm not a fan. He's a winner. I like his mentality. I like his arm. Don't like the offense he's coming from. Relies on his athleticism too much. Don't love his accuracy. Numbers look great but he gets a ton of wide open looks. Not as accurate as I'd like on contested throws.

Watson - 32 INTs in 33 career starts.

Prescott - 23 INTs in 37 career starts.

Then again, I had Prescott rated in the 3rd round and he looks pretty solid so far so what do I know..
 
bah007 said:
I don't think it's bad at all. I don't think there are any elite guys so that might be where the perception is coming from, especially since last year the class was so strong at the top. But I wouldn't say it's bad. There will be some solid players and there is pretty decent depth at the position in this class.

I wouldn't be surprised to see some teams reach up for OTs if they need one in the first. But I think those picks will happen in the middle or back of the 1st instead of near the front like we usually see.
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My guess is that the Texans will be picking around 25. Do you think that one of Ramczyk/Robinson/Bolles will be available? Because if not I would rather draft a LB like Watt of Foster in Rd.1 and Wheeler/Moton in rd.3.
 
Need to study film of what will certainly go down in history as one of the greatest College Football game ever played! 36/56 (unblanced) 420 tough yards, only 7.5 avg. per catch 3 TD's. 0 INT's. 21 carries (majority scrambling to escape & extend plays, some designed) 43 yards & 1 TD. I don't know, like I said got to find some time to review film. He did declare himself eligible for the 2017 NFL Draft forgoing his Senior season @ Clemson.
Bottom line nothing has changed for me, if available as you say around 25, even though I doubt 5 other QB's are taken by then, I would make him my selection not Kelly. It's about leadership, getting the job done & having respect of your teammates not just arm strength, accuracy, blah, blah, blah, blah, :violin
 
beerlover said:
Need to study film of what will certainly go down in history as one of the greatest College Football game ever played! 36/56 (unblanced) 420 tough yards, only 7.5 avg. per catch 3 TD's. 0 INT's. 21 carries (majority scrambling to escape & extend plays, some designed) 43 yards & 1 TD. I don't know, like I said got to find some time to review film. He did declare himself eligible for the 2017 NFL Draft forgoing his Senior season @ Clemson.
Bottom line nothing has changed for me, if available as you say around 25, even though I doubt 5 other QB's are taken by then, I would make him my selection not Kelly. It's about leadership, getting the job done & having respect of your teammates not just arm strength, accuracy, blah, blah, blah, blah, :violin
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Being a winner is a big deal for me in drafting a QB. This guy just wins football games. Everyone understands he's got a lot of talent around him and he makes his share of mistakes, but when the game is on the line he doesn't throw that pick 6, he picks up 6.
 
steelbtexan said:
My guess is that the Texans will be picking around 25. Do you think that one of Ramczyk/Robinson/Bolles will be available? Because if not I would rather draft a LB like Watt of Foster in Rd.1 and Wheeler/Moton in rd.3.
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Watt fits the mold physically and production wise. I like simon, but can't stay on the field. I like Watt alot.
 
I'd take Pat Mahomes before Watson.

Same high risk, but I like his potential more.

Probably need to sit at least a year or two unless some HC is willing to tailor to his game.

His footwork is all over the place, yet his TD/INT ratio is better than 3 to 1.

I'm going Trubisky, Kizer, Mahomes.
 
76Texan said:
I'd take Pat Mahomes before Watson.

Same high risk, but I like his potential more.

Probably need to sit at least a year or two unless some HC is willing to tailor to his game.

His footwork is all over the place, yet his TD/INT ratio is better than 3 to 1.

I'm going Trubisky, Kizer, Mahomes.
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Man your off but not alone. Watson is a great kid (young man) if he falls I'd be all in for the city of Houston. Cut another Cancer, take your lumps & move on.
 
beerlover said:
Man your off but not alone. Watson is a great kid (young man) if he falls I'd be all in for the city of Houston. Cut another Cancer, take your lumps & move on.
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I'm not all that optimistic on Watson's skill set translating but there is zero doubt that he is a home run on intangibles. I don't really like any of the QB's this year but if we had the pick of the litter at 25 I'd probably take Watson because of the intangibles and just hope our guys could coach him up.
 
WolverineFan said:
I'm not all that optimistic on Watson's skill set translating but there is zero doubt that he is a home run on intangibles. I don't really like any of the QB's this year but if we had the pick of the litter at 25 I'd probably take Watson because of the intangibles and just hope our guys could coach him up.
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Same here. Plus it would make me feel better about the fact this team is gonna trot Osweiler as QB to start the season most likely. You put him and #1 draft pick like Watson to be ready to take over, then as a fan base, I would be with the understanding that we are trying to correct a mistake at QB.
 
WolverineFan said:
I'm not all that optimistic on Watson's skill set translating but there is zero doubt that he is a home run on intangibles. I don't really like any of the QB's this year but if we had the pick of the litter at 25 I'd probably take Watson because of the intangibles and just hope our guys could coach him up.
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Coach him up on reads. He already goes through his progressions, same thing I said about Dak last year but he has better pocket presence and ability to escape & extend plays with his legs. Accuracy seems on point with Cam when he came out & he improved as you say, coached him up. It's really a basket of intangibles he brings, people seem to gravitate towards him and that's something Texans sorely lack. I really don't like drafting QB based on potential, even though they all are, projects in almost every sense of the word, but he is the most battle tested, most ready to step into a starting role.
 
76Texan said:
I'd take Pat Mahomes before Watson.

Same high risk, but I like his potential more.

Probably need to sit at least a year or two unless some HC is willing to tailor to his game.

His footwork is all over the place, yet his TD/INT ratio is better than 3 to 1.

I'm going Trubisky, Kizer, Mahomes.
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It's not like the Big 12 plays a whole lot of defense though. Probably the worst major conference when it comes to total defense. iirc, the highest rated D in the B12 was OU at ~49.
 
bah007 said:
I'm up to date on most of the offensive prospects in this class. There are a few guys that weren't at the combine that I want to get pro day info for, and there are a few guys that I need to watch more of before I feel totally comfortable with their grade. But here is where we are for now. If you don't see a player listed then I don't have a draftable grade on them right now.

QB
1. Jared Goff, California
2. Carson Wentz, North Dakota St
3. Connor Cook, Michigan St
4. Paxton Lynch, Memphis
5. Dak Prescott, Mississippi St
6. Christian Hackenberg, Penn St
7. Vernon Adams, Oregon
8. Kevin Hogan, Stanford
9. Jake Coker, Alabama
10. Jacoby Brissett, North Carolina St
11. Brandon Allen, Arkansas
12. Nate Sudfeld, Indiana

RB
1. Ezekiel Elliott, Ohio St
2. Alex Collins, Arkansas
3. Kenneth Dixon, Louisiana Tech
4. C.J. Prosise, Notre Dame
5. Devontae Booker, Utah
6. Jordan Howard, Indiana
7. Paul Perkins, UCLA
8. Derrick Henry, Alabama
9. Wendell Smallwood, West Virginia
10. Keith Marshall, Georgia
11. DeAndre Washington, Texas Tech
12. Tyler Ervin, San Jose St
13. Kenyan Drake, Alabama
14. Daniel Lasco, California
15. Josh Ferguson, Illinois
16. Marshaun Coprich, Illinois St
17. Jonathan Williams, Arkansas
18. Peyton Barber, Auburn

FB
1. Dan Vitale, Northwestern
2. Sione Houma, Michigan
3. Soma Vainuku, USC
4. Quayvon Hicks, Georgia

WR
1. Laquon Treadwell, Mississippi
2. Josh Doctson, TCU
3. Tyler Boyd, Pittsburgh
4. Michael Thomas, Ohio St
5. Charone Peake, Clemson
6. Keyarris Garrett, Tulsa
7. Tajae Sharpe, Massachusetts
8. Braxton Miller, Ohio St
9. Chris Moore, Cincinnati
10. Ricardo Louis, Auburn
11. Jordan Payton, UCLA
12. De'Runnya Wilson, Mississippi St
13. Geronimo Allison, Illinois
14. Mekale McKay, Cincinnati
15. Cayleb Jones, Arizona
16. Cody Core, Mississippi
17. Chris Brown, Notre Dame
18. Marquez North, Tennessee
19. Rashawn Scott, Miami
20. Paul McRoberts, Southeast Missouri St

WR S
1. Sterling Shepard, Oklahoma
2. Will Fuller, Notre Dame
3. Malcolm Mitchell, Georgia
4. Corey Coleman, Baylor
5. Aaron Burbridge, Michigan St
6. Trevor Davis, California
7. Leonte Caroo, Rutgers
8. Pharoh Cooper, South Carolina
9. Rashard Higgins, Colorado St
10. Roger Lewis, Bowling Green
11. Daniel Braverman, Western Michigan
12. Jalin Marshall, Ohio St
13. Kolby Listenbee, TCU
14. Bralon Addison, Oregon
15. Byron Marshall, Oregon
16. Johnny Holton, Cincinnati

TE Y
1. Hunter Henry, Arkansas
2. Austin Hooper, Stanford
3. Jerrell Adams, South Carolina
4. Tyler Higbee, Western Kentucky
5. Beau Sandland, Montana St
6. David Morgan, UTSA
7. Nick Vannett, Ohio St
8. Jake McGee, Florida
9. Ryan Malleck, Virginia Tech
10. Bryce Williams, ECU

TE F
1. Devon Cajuste, Stanford
2. Glenn Gronkowski, Kansas St
3. Thomas Duarte, UCLA
4. Ben Braunecker, Harvard
5. Henry Krieger Coble, Iowa
6. Sean Price, South Florida
7. Stephen Anderson, California

OT
1. Laremy Tunsil, Mississippi
2. Jason Spriggs, Indiana
3. Ronnie Stanley, Notre Dame
4. Jack Conklin, Michigan St
5. Willie Beavers, Western Michigan
6. Jerald Hawkins, LSU
7. Shon Coleman, Auburn
8. Halapoulivaati Vaitai, TCU
9. Joe Haeg, North Dakota St
10. Taylor Decker, Ohio St
11. Germain Ifedi, Texas A&M
12. Kyle Murphy, Stanford
13. Stephane Nembot, Colorado
14. Le'Raven Clark, Texas Tech
15. Spencer Drango, Baylor
16. Caleb Benenoch, UCLA
17. Brandon Shell, South Carolina
18. Tyler Johnstone, Oregon
19. John Theus, Georgia
20. Alex Lewis, Nebraska
21. Parker Ehringer, Cincinnati
22. Tyler Marz, Wisconsin

OG
1. Josh Garnett, Stanford
2. Nick Martin, Notre Dame
3. Cody Whitehair, Kansas St
4. Vadal Alexander, LSU
5. Denver Kirkland, Arkansas
6. Landon Turner, North Carolina
7. Rees Odhiambo, Boise St
8. Christian Westerman, Arizona St
9. Sebastian Tretola, Arkansas
10. Fahn Cooper, Mississippi
11. Avery Young, Auburn
12. Matt Skura, Duke
13. Darrell Greene, San Diego St
14. Connor McGovern, Missouri
15. Dominique Robertson, West Georgia

C
1. Ryan Kelly, Alabama
2. Graham Glasgow, Michigan
3. Isaac Seumalo, Oregon St
4. Max Tuerk, USC
5. Austin Blythe, Iowa
6. Joe Thuney, North Carolina St
7. Jack Allen, Michigan St
8. Jake Brendel, UCLA


Still working on the defense. There were some guys that looked great at the combine that I haven't watched enough of yet to have an opinion on and I'm trying to track them down.
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I had noticed that you don't have Mahomes on the list?
Reasons?
Any change in evaluation?

P.S. - Wrong quote, but you know what I mean.
 
@bah007 I know you do tier rankings. I see that you have 2 guys in between Fournette and Cook and my question is, where do you rate those 4 in tiers and what rounds do you project them?
 
If Ramczyk, Bolles and Robinson are gone -- is there anyone we could draft later at RT who's an upgrade that can start day 1?

edit: Is there ANYONE that you covet enough at 25 that you wouldn't trade out of the 1st for? It's feeling like there's many good options at 25 but nothing great -- just thinking that this may be a year we trade down and accumulate some picks.
 
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TexansSeminole said:
@bah007 I know you do tier rankings. I see that you have 2 guys in between Fournette and Cook and my question is, where do you rate those 4 in tiers and what rounds do you project them?
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My evaluation of Cook is still the same, but my projection of those skills is actually changing. I previously believed that his game would not translate 100% to the pros because it is too predicated on speed. I still do think that he will have more trouble than expected going up the middle at the next level but his explosion on the edge and in the passing game will more than balance that out.


When I update, he will be squarely in the first tier of RBs with Fournette. I actually don't have Fournette as a top 5-10 guy as most do. Too much injury history for me, and too easy to find talent at the position later in the draft. I think Fournette is a top 20 guy and Cook is top 30.
 
Max said:
If Ramczyk, Bolles and Robinson are gone -- is there anyone we could draft later at RT who's an upgrade that can start day 1?

edit: Is there ANYONE that you covet enough at 25 that you wouldn't trade out of the 1st for? It's feeling like there's many good options at 25 but nothing great -- just thinking that this may be a year we trade down and accumulate some picks.
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I think Moton in the 2nd or Holden in the 3rd could start at RT for us pretty early on.

If Malik Hooker, Zach Cunningham, or Bolles were there I would take them without hesitation. I wouldn't even entertain a trade back. I would actually trade up for Hooker to a certain point, which is something I usually advise heavily against.
 
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bah007 said:
I think Moton in the 2nd or Holden in the 3rd could start at RT for us pretty early on.

If Malik Hooker, Zach Cunningham, or Bolles were there I would take them without hesitation. I wouldn't even entertain a trade back. I would actually trade up for Hooker to a certain point, which is something I usually advise heavily against.
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I would trade up for hooker. I can't see him falling to 25. Bolles would be a great pick @ 25. Have feeling he will be gone also.
 
bah007 said:
It was a long season, and I haven't had nearly as much free time as I normally do to watch and scout games. But here is an early look at my take on this year's draft class on offense:

QB
1. Mitch Trubisky – North Carolina
2. DeShone Kizer – Notre Dame
3. Mason Rudolph – Oklahoma St
4. Brad Kaaya – Miami
5. Chad Kelly – Mississippi
6. Deshaun Watson – Clemson
7. Cooper Rush – Central Michigan
8. Nathan Peterman – Pittsburgh
9. Davis Webb – California
10. Zach Terrell – Western Michigan
11. Josh Dobbs – Tennessee
12. Seth Russell – Baylor
13. C.J. Beathard – Iowa
14. Sefo Liufau – Coloradot
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No mahomes??
 
mussop said:
No mahomes??
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He has the physical tools but I'm not a big fan. I think it would be very possible to teach him a pro offense but I don't think that you can teach a guy how to change his style of play without taking away his special traits. Mahomes is way too off-schedule for me. He gets nicked up a lot. I don't like his footwork in the pocket at all. And he misses way too many reads, even in an easy-read system. I get the appeal. Just not for me. To me he is Manziel with better size and no off-field issues. A lot of people would say that sounds great. Not me. I don't see the transition. Backyard football doesn't work consistently in the NFL.
 
JB said:
What are your thoughts on Kizer? Would he fit?
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Kizer would need a ton of work but I do like him as a project. I would hesitate greatly to use a 1st on him because I do not see him getting onto the field anytime soon, but I could still be swayed into using a high pick if I had confidence that he was going to be coached up and developed correctly.
 
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