ProFootballfocus.com says Texans' top 2 picks among 10 biggest "Reaches" in the Draft

[thunderkyss]

Jerrah saw him as Cowboy worthy and the Cowboys will be better off with Collins signing with them.

"The Cowboys...." is like saying "The Bills..." or "The Jags..." they win one play off game in the last 15 years & you're all over Jerrah's knutz. McNair can win two play off games in the last 5 seasons, & somehow he isn't doing everything possible.

It upsets you that McNair doesn't do everything you think he should do to ensure a winner, even though clubs like the Browns & the Cowboys have... & still aren't winning (Cowboys most recent success aside).

Does anybody really thinking the Texans were seriously looking at signing Collins?

Recruiting & landing Wilfork was big, imo. Hopefully Wilfork will prove that he's still got some game left. I hope we'll be able to recruit really good players to the Texans in the future.

I have no doubt we put our name in the hat, but we can't compete with the storied franchises in the NFL, not yet.

 

[ObsiWan]

Coach's always believe they can turn coal into gold , then draft coal to prove it .
Very little help was given the offense because OB believes he can turn trash into an NFL team .

Hmmmm.... guess that sort of 'splains our QB situation too

 

[bah007]

Simply put the McNair's deemed Collins not Texans worthy. Otherwise a 7th rd pick would've been used on Collins.

By that logic, Jerry didn't think he was Cowboys worthy either.

And yet, there he is.

 

[speedfreek]

Better go 9-7 or better next year, or the luster will be off of BoB.

He's stockpiled lots of talent no one else really wanted in free agency
and the draft (lots of reaches).

No way to shine this turd if they go 8-8 or worse..

I'm still scratching my head, and it's been a long time since draft day..

 

[bah007]

Better go 9-7 or better next year, or the luster will be off of BoB.

He's stockpiled lots of talent no one else really wanted in free agency
and the draft (lots of reaches).

No way to shine this turd if they go 8-8 or worse..

I'm still scratching my head, and it's been a long time since draft day..

No, it really hasn't.

Have the new rookies been given any time at all to show what they are capable of?

Sounds like you've decided you don't like our draft class this year. Fine, that's your opinion. But it's certainly not based on anything that's happened since their names were called.

 

[steelbtexan]

By that logic, Jerry didn't think he was Cowboys worthy either.

And yet, there he is.

If the Texans had wanted Collins they could've had him is the point. Another case of the Texans org not doing everything possible to put the best product on the field as possible.

This isn't directed at you, but at posters who think the Texans are doing their best gosh darnit and they just don't have any luck.

 

[steelbtexan]

"The Cowboys...." is like saying "The Bills..." or "The Jags..." they win one play off game in the last 15 years & you're all over Jerrah's knutz. McNair can win two play off games in the last 5 seasons, & somehow he isn't doing everything possible.

It upsets you that McNair doesn't do everything you think he should do to ensure a winner, even though clubs like the Browns & the Cowboys have... & still aren't winning (Cowboys most recent success aside).



Recruiting & landing Wilfork was big, imo. Hopefully Wilfork will prove that he's still got some game left. I hope we'll be able to recruit really good players to the Texans in the future.

I have no doubt we put our name in the hat, but we can't compete with the storied franchises in the NFL, not yet.

I'm far from a Jerrah fan, even though since they started drafting the Randle/Dez/Brent's of the world they have improved the on field product. The last step is firing Kubiak/ I mean Garrett.

 

[beerlover]

If the Texans had wanted Collins they could've had him is the point. Another case of the Texans org not doing everything possible to put the best product on the field as possible.

This isn't directed at you, but at posters who think the Texans are doing their best gosh darnit and they just don't have any luck.

Texans show difficulty making their own luck, seems harder the better.

 

[JB]

If the Texans had wanted Collins they could've had him is the point. Another case of the Texans org not doing everything possible to put the best product on the field as possible.

This isn't directed at you, but at posters who think the Texans are doing their best gosh darnit and they just don't have any luck.

How do you know this? All 32 teams passed on him in the draft. I believe it was reported that 24 teams contacted him afterward. He had his choice on where to go, what makes you think he would have chosen the Texans? Do you have inside info or any facts to support your argument or is this just another line of your witch hunting?

 

[mussop]

I find it funny they list Bud Dupree as an even bigger reach.

He was highly over rated on this board.

 

[The Pencil Neck]

He was highly over rated on this board.

He was very highly rated on several sites.

Whether he was over-rated or not will have to be decided after he's actually done something.

 

[Thorn]

There'll be plenty of time and opportunities to praise and discredit draft choices once we see them in action. For now, without seeing any of them in real live NFL action, I like the draft.

That doesn't mean I'll like it this November though.

 

[infantrycak]

I really like an overlap of a year so JJo can teach KJo. Not every player is a coach. I don't see it in KJ. Glenn and JJO are/were professors.

I'll trust Vrabel and Cush to coach McKinney. Both have played inside and out.

Strong...well this gets back to my JJo comment. Would have preferred a year overlap with AJ. He doesn't play to his size. Neither does Hopkins. AJ had value adding that to their repertoire.

After that we got intriguing. Who knows. Nobody knew DD was going to be our hard nosed little bowling ball RB when we drafted him.

 

[Insideop]

Once he fell below 3rd, his people made it known that he's not signing with anyone who picks him, sits out the year and enters the draft again next year. Would have been a waste of a 7th rounder.

According to the NFL he could not re-enter the draft next year. I heard that stated several times on 610 radio throughout the draft day coverage. The only choice he had was to be an UDFA this year.

 

[thunderkyss]

According to the NFL he could not re-enter the draft next year. I heard that stated several times on 610 radio throughout the draft day coverage. The only choice he had was to be an UDFA this year.

If he had gotten drafted, he could refuse to sign & enter next year's draft. Going undrafted, he would not be allowed to reenter the draft.

It got a little convoluted for a while there, but those are the option for any prospect entering the draft.

What Collins people wanted was for the NFL to allow him to pull out of this year's draft, before the draft, then enter next year's draft. The NFL wasn't going to do him any favors. That's when he said if he were drafted, he wouldn't sign, which was his right... but no one drafted him. Then his only option was to sign as an undrafted free agent.

 

[Uncle Rico]

I really like an overlap of a year so JJo can teach KJo. Not every player is a coach. I don't see it in KJ. Glenn and JJO are/were professors.

I'll trust Vrabel and Cush to coach McKinney. Both have played inside and out.

Strong...well this gets back to my JJo comment. Would have preferred a year overlap with AJ. He doesn't play to his size. Neither does Hopkins. AJ had value adding that to their repertoire.

After that we got intriguing. Who knows. Nobody knew DD was going to be our hard nosed little bowling ball RB when we drafted him.

Cush looks great by the way. We had our boy in the Cushing football camp up in Conroe this weekend and I couldnt help but notice how light on his feet he looked out there playing with the kids.

Granted... its with kids, it was just something I picked up on. He looked to be in GREAT shape too. Looking for a big year from him.

 

[Mollywhopper]

Strong...well this gets back to my JJo comment. Would have preferred a year overlap with AJ. He doesn't play to his size. Neither does Hopkins. AJ had value adding that to their repertoire.

From what I've watched of Strong, using his body to get in between himself and defenders is one of his strengths. Quite the good 'rebounder'. To your point though I would have liked to have had AJ give him some tips on steering his routes and on his footwork in and out of breaks. Not the easiest skills to master for guys their size. Hopefully between DHop, Shorts, Washington, and Coach Hixon he'll find all those nuances.

 

[infantrycak]

From what I've watched of Strong, using his body to get in between himself and defenders is one of his strengths. Quite the good 'rebounder'. To your point though I would have liked to have had AJ give him some tips on steering his routes and on his footwork in and out of breaks. Not the easiest skills to master for guys their size. Hopefully between DHop, Shorts, Washington, and Coach Hixon he'll find all those nuances.

I may not express this perfectly, but. ...

AJ thinks of himself as a 250 lb man. He plays bigger than he is. Hopkins and Strong (so far, this is why I wanted AJ aound) play like 150 lb really athletic men. It's a style thing I am having a hard time describing. Hopkins goes up for a ball and hopes to get it with his large mitts. AJ goes up and says this is my ball beotch.

AJ has always struck me as a better version of a hall of famer - Michael Irvin. He's a giant usually nice but on the field dominant version of Irvin.

 

[JB]

I may not express this perfectly, but. ...

AJ thinks of himself as a 250 lb man. He plays bigger than he is. Hopkins and Strong (so far, this is why I wanted AJ aound) play like 150 lb really athletic men. It's a style thing I am having a hard time describing. Hopkins goes up for a ball and hopes to get it with his large mitts. AJ goes up and says this is my ball beotch.

AJ has always struck me as a better version of a hall of famer - Michael Irvin. He's a giant usually nice but on the field dominant version of Irvin.

I think the TD against the Cardinals sums up your point pretty well when combined with the TD against Wash. Too late at night for me to pull up the clips but you know which ones I mean

 

[Marshall]

According to the NFL he could not re-enter the draft next year. I heard that stated several times on 610 radio throughout the draft day coverage. The only choice he had was to be an UDFA this year.

A drafted player can sit out a year and re-enter the following year because he can only sign with the team that drafted him until then, but an undrafted player cannot because he is already a FA who can sign with anyone.

Thus the threat was valid, though the decision would have been suspect.

 

[Mollywhopper]

I may not express this perfectly, but. ...

AJ thinks of himself as a 250 lb man. He plays bigger than he is. Hopkins and Strong (so far, this is why I wanted AJ aound) play like 150 lb really athletic men. It's a style thing I am having a hard time describing. Hopkins goes up for a ball and hopes to get it with his large mitts. AJ goes up and says this is my ball beotch.

AJ has always struck me as a better version of a hall of famer - Michael Irvin. He's a giant usually nice but on the field dominant version of Irvin.

I think what you're alluding to is not so much technique, of course, and more raw attitude towards the ball and opponent. And it sure wouldn't have hurt to see if any of that could rub off from watching and being around Dre. Just think that's more of a either you got it or ya don't thing though.

It's almost like every time the Rockets get a big man they're hopeful about they bring in Olajuwon and go "ok, be this guy". Which never is going to work. That thing about AJ is just what separated him from everyone else and made him, him.

 

[noxiousdog]

A drafted player can sit out a year and re-enter the following year because he can only sign with the team that drafted him until then, but an undrafted player cannot because he is already a FA who can sign with anyone.

Thus the threat was valid, though the decision would have been suspect.

This is correct. It's the same reason Elway was traded from Baltimore to Denver. He said he'd never sign with them and would play baseball and re-enter the draft the following year.

 

[disaacks3]

Neither Hopkins, nor TY Hilton get behind defenses without a #1 guy taking the heat. The Colts replaced their #1. The question to ask yourself is did the Texans replace theirs?

 

[infantrycak]

Neither Hopkins, nor TY Hilton get behind defenses without a #1 guy taking the heat. The Colts replaced their #1. The question to ask yourself is did the Texans replace theirs?

Spot on.

 

[JB]

Neither Hopkins, nor TY Hilton get behind defenses without a #1 guy taking the heat. The Colts replaced their #1. The question to ask yourself is did the Texans replace theirs?

Spot on.

We can only hope

 

[michaelm]

If the Texans had wanted Collins they could've had him is the point. Another case of the Texans org not doing everything possible to put the best product on the field as possible.



This isn't directed at you, but at posters who think the Texans are doing their best gosh darnit and they just don't have any luck.

Based on your logic, 30 other teams aren't doing their best gosh darn it.

 

[JB]

Based on your logic, 30 other teams aren't doing their best gosh darn it.

he's only asking 1 team to do just as he wants... the others are perfect as they are

 

[silvrhand]

[/6. Benardrick McKinney, LB, Mississippi State
#43 Overall to HoustonThis pick may have received the loudest howls of anguish in the PFF Draft War Room™. Linebacker in this draft class is a fantastic example of a position that contrasts production with athleticism. McKinney has the athleticism, but Paul Dawson, still on the board at this point, has the production. McKinney was the 42nd-graded linebacker in this class, Dawson was the first. McKinney notched 30 defensive stops over the season, Dawson notched 94. In coverage McKinney allowed a passer rating of 96.4 while Dawson just 50.7.

Even on the blitz, McKinney tallied four sacks and 11 total pressures while Dawson notched seven sacks and 28 total pressures. McKinney trounces Dawson when it comes to athleticism and measurables, but is a vastly inferior player on the field judging by college production.
***8. Kevin Johnson, CB, Wake Forrest
#16 Overall to Houston
Houston’s second big reach on this list was the first pick they made, selecting Kevin Johnson mid way through the first round.

It’s easy to see on tape what people like about Kevin Johnson. He’s a smooth athlete who mirrors receivers well and can definitely play. You also see some issues, though. Despite 4.5 timed speed, he looks to struggle to keep up with receivers, even those that run 4.5 themselves. He is routinely playing with a larger cushion than his teammate in off-coverage, perhaps buying himself room against speed he can’t live with. This all results in some very iffy coverage numbers. Johnson was the 65th-ranked draft-eligible corner by coverage grade this year. He allowed almost 60% of passes thrown his way to be caught (59.6, 91st among CBs), and yielded a passer rating of 74.6.

Add in a pretty ugly 14 missed tackles over the season and you’ve got a lot of question marks for a guy who was taken mid way through the first… at least a round or two higher than we believe he should have gone based on the tape.


QUOTE]
https://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/2015/05/06/10-biggest-draft-reaches/
****
I dunno, does this merit a separate thread ? Maybe not - maybe they should be broken out to the individual threads for McKinney & Johnson ?
*****
I especially like the comments about Johnson's long speed something that does also concern some of us. Two positions where top-end speed can be a factor: WR & the corners who have to cover them. For example, Indy is now gonna have not one but two 4.3 receivers for our guys to cover. Yikes !

Hmm SEC conference level competition every week vs. TCU ILB? I'll take the SEC LB every day of the week, the odds are just better.

http://www.deseretnews.com/article/...ence-produces-the-most-NFL-talent.html?pg=all

 

[steelbtexan]

I may not express this perfectly, but. ...

AJ thinks of himself as a 250 lb man. He plays bigger than he is. Hopkins and Strong (so far, this is why I wanted AJ aound) play like 150 lb really athletic men. It's a style thing I am having a hard time describing. Hopkins goes up for a ball and hopes to get it with his large mitts. AJ goes up and says this is my ball beotch.

AJ has always struck me as a better version of a hall of famer - Michael Irvin. He's a giant usually nice but on the field dominant version of Irvin.

This post I agree with.

However Irvin had better hands.

Both should be HOF'ers. Hope AJ makes it. It will be a while before he gets in though.

 

[Dean1818]

Mckinney will be fine

just after the season, he was a late first, early 2nd on many "experts" boards


To me, a guy can play or not...... Combine should be second.....

Good value pick


I just dont see Cushing as the long term answer. He was amazing when he first came out.
But either he has become much more tentative, or he has lost the speed that made him great

 

[Vance87]

But either he has become much more tentative, or he has lost the speed that made him great

Did you miss the two catastrophic injuries to his knees the past few years?

 

[sandman]

This post I agree with.

However Irvin had better hands.

Both should be HOF'ers. Hope AJ makes it. It will be a while before he gets in though.

We'll sure, just like it will be a while before Brady and Manning get in.

 

[Dean1818]

Did you miss the two catastrophic injuries to his knees the past few years?

Not at all...... you are taking my post out of context


Many people on this site still think Cushing is the same player he was before these injuries....... IMHO, he is not... not even close

I believe McKinney will do very well in this defense

 

[Marshall]

Not at all...... you are taking my post out of context


Many people on this site still think Cushing is the same player he was before these injuries....... IMHO, he is not... not even close

I believe McKinney will do very well in this defense

Cushing is different from the injuries, getting off the steroids and natural maturity which comes from being a family man.

The question is how he can do once he is as physically recovered as he can be at this point. Is that last year or is there additional room for improvement in the second (and third) year after a catastrophic injury?

I'm hoping that he shows up better, but I'm not expecting pre injury peak.

 

[cland]

Cushing is different from the injuries, getting off the steroids and natural maturity which comes from being a family man.

The question is how he can do once he is as physically recovered as he can be at this point. Is that last year or is there additional room for improvement in the second (and third) year after a catastrophic injury?

I'm hoping that he shows up better, but I'm not expecting pre injury peak.

His injuries remind me of DeMeco Ryans, when he came back the 1st year it looked like he lost all of his quickness. However one year later he looked like the DeMeco of old. Not a guarantee on Cushing, but I definitely want to see him in year 2 of his recovery.

I also annoys me that people keep saying that Cushing is "injury-prone." Neither of his knee injuries were fluke non-contact plays. Instead in both cases an OLmen actually targeted the side of his knee on a cut-block.

 

[infantrycak]

Not at all...... you are taking my post out of context


Many people on this site still think Cushing is the same player he was before these injuries....... IMHO, he is not... not even close

Name a single person who thinks he has returned to pre-injury play?

What some have said is that we haven't yet seen what Cushing's final recovery level will be. He was progressing week by week from the Slausen injury when the Charles injury occurred. Then he was just getting comfortable early last year and his knee flared, had to be drained, etc. and he never played on it healthy for the rest of the season. So maybe if he stays healthy this year we'll see him finally recover to show his new healthy high point.

Instead in both cases an OLmen actually targeted the side of his knee on a cut-block.

One - Matt Slausen illegal cut block. 2nd was a legal straight ahead blow to the knee by Jamaal Charles lunging from his knees.

 

[Marshall]

His injuries remind me of DeMeco Ryans, when he came back the 1st year it looked like he lost all of his quickness. However one year later he looked like the DeMeco of old. Not a guarantee on Cushing, but I definitely want to see him in year 2 of his recovery.

I also annoys me that people keep saying that Cushing is "injury-prone." Neither of his knee injuries were fluke non-contact plays. Instead in both cases an OLmen actually targeted the side of his knee on a cut-block.

I have a DREAM!

That this year and next, Cushing returns to form.
That Mallet becomes the next GREAT QB.
That KJ becomes the cover safety that gets us off the field on 3rd down.
That Foster stays healthy throughout the season and playoffs.
That JJ plays up to his high standard and wins the MVP he deserves.
That the Line, both offensive and defensive gell quickly and dominate the LOS.
That we DESTROY the myth of Colt invincibility at Indianapolis once and for all.
That all the disappointments in the last two drafts prove insightful this season as they all live up to the predraft hype.

That our children will say that this was their finest HOUR.

 

[DX-TEX]

Matt Miller ‏@nfldraftscout · 10m10 minutes ago
The Texans had a quietly good offseason. Loved their draft and they added capable veterans in free agency. A QB away from the playoffs.

Matt Miller loved our draft and off season.


BTW, if you are on twitter you should be following him. Great insight

 

[Lucky]

A QB away from the playoffs.

Is he talking 2014 or 2015?

 

[Doppelganger]

Does not take into account the scheme each player was in during their college years. Does not take into account how each would potentially fit into the Romeo Crennel Defense. You can draft the greatest 4-3 OLB in the draft, but if you play 3-4 he will struggle.