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Cardale Jones, QB, OSU

Don't blame him for striking while the iron is hot. He won't be the starter next year at OSU, and he would have to transfer down to play right away.
 
ObsiWan said:
Just for discussion's sake, let's say some team takes a 4th round flyer on Jones like we did on Savage.

Savage's contract:


That's $630K he could pocket for his wife and little baby vs. possibly riding the pine behind Braxton Miller or J.T. Barrett next season.

Is he NFL ready? Heck no!

Could he be made NFL ready with a year (or two) of OTAs, mini-camps, training camps, and specialty QB camps? Possibly.

But he'd be getting paid to learn.
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I agree. If he doesn't secure the starting spot next season, he likely won't be drafted.
 
Mr teX said:
Find this hard to believe since he doesn't have much else other than his measureables to point to.
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Going round in circles now that you don't value as much what it was for him to step and perform the way he did under the circumstances he did.

His combine numbers weren't the only factor.
 
Mollywhopper said:
Teams are interested in more than his measurables.
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Yes they are. They are interested in his potential. His ceiling. I'm not knocking the player. I'm knocking the hype.

He completed 61% of his passes in his 3 starts. That's 2 points lower than Braxton Miller completed as the starter last year and it's a pretty universal opinion that Miller will have to change positions in the NFL. His QB Rating of 161 was almost 10 points lower than the freshman starter who got injured.

There are things to like, but all of this hype stems straight from his measureables. It's a great story yes. 3rd string QB "wins" national title after 2 starters injured. That sounds great. But if he were 6-1, 210 then nobody would care. That's all I'm saying. This is where people start getting into trouble when evaluating talent. They let things like height, weight, and speed supersede talent.
 
Also, I'm a full advocate for him to enter the draft. With this hype he is likely to be drafted before the 4th round. He's going to be in a three way competition at OSU next year against guys with more experience and, to be honest, better numbers. He can sit on the bench at OSU or he can sit on the bench in the NFL and get paid. I'm not against my team drafting him. But it's under the premise that it's not before the 4th-5th round and we are dedicated to sitting him for at least 2-3 years.
 
xtruroyaltyx said:
I didn't say anything about who'd be what, but simply what type of qb id rather take a late round flyer on.

No need to make things up skippy.
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I was just asking a question, no offense was intended. If the Texans want Jones they better take him in rds1-2. Because you know the Browns will take the hometown guy.

Would you take that risk? I wouldn't.
 
How Cardale Jones and the Texans can make me a Millionaire:

First, I buy up all of the Jacoby Jones retro jerseys

th


Next, the Texans draft Cardale.

th


Then, let it rain!

th
 
Staying at school. Smart decision.

He had good reasoning and his Q and A sounds pretty good.
 
Runner said:
The main quality Savage has that makes him (seem to) have such high potential is that he was drafted by the Texans. If he was on another team, I doubt posters would have such a high opinion of him, if they remembered he existed at all. The mere fact that the Texans drafted him seems to make him better than any other long shot, and in the eyes of some better that most blue chip prospects. Savage doesn't have "hype" he gets blind trust.
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I bet if not for a phantom holding call and Savage injury that if the Texans had beaten the Colts for the 1st time in INDY and made the playoffs you would be singing a different tune when it comes to Savages ability.
 
Blake said:
Is that really something you said often? Were you dumb enough to tweet it out, or back in your day etch it onto a stone tablet? Kidding.

Look, we disagree, you dont think he is dumb, I dont think he is smart enough to run an NFL offense.

Ill make you a bet right now that he will fail in the NFL as a QB.
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Trust me nobody ever pays off bets on this MB. Looking at you DM.
 
steelbtexan said:
I bet if not for a phantom holding call and Savage injury that if the Texans had beaten the Colts for the 1st time in INDY and made the playoffs you would be singing a different tune when it comes to Savages ability.
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Don't assume what I'd think. If he played at the same skill level he still wouldn't have looked like a good quarterback.

This is funny. Some posters don't give Jones any credit for the three big wins he contributed to, and others seem to want to evaluate Savage (or want me to evaluate Savage) on wins that didn't occur.
 
WolverineFan said:
Yes they are. They are interested in his potential. His ceiling. I'm not knocking the player. I'm knocking the hype.

He completed 61% of his passes in his 3 starts. That's 2 points lower than Braxton Miller completed as the starter last year and it's a pretty universal opinion that Miller will have to change positions in the NFL. His QB Rating of 161 was almost 10 points lower than the freshman starter who got injured.

There are things to like, but all of this hype stems straight from his measureables. It's a great story yes. 3rd string QB "wins" national title after 2 starters injured. That sounds great. But if he were 6-1, 210 then nobody would care. That's all I'm saying. This is where people start getting into trouble when evaluating talent. They let things like height, weight, and speed supersede talent.
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Let him play against Buffalo, San Diego St., Indiana, Navy, Kent St., Cincinnati, and Rutgers, like Miller or Barrett, before equivocating his stats.

His size and whatnot his clearly helping his stock, as it should, but to say teams would gloss over a smaller prospect who did exactly what Jones did is just wrong. A dwarf like Manziel rode the hype train all the way to a first round pick.

And while I agree hype can get out of hand, all anyone around here was hyping was he may be a better prospect than Savage. This isn't exactly crowning the kid, is it?
 
Mollywhopper said:
Let him play against Buffalo, San Diego St., Indiana, Navy, Kent St., Cincinnati, and Rutgers, like Miller or Barrett, before equivocating his stats.

His size and whatnot his clearly helping his stock, as it should, but to say teams would gloss over a smaller prospect who did exactly what Jones did is just wrong. A dwarf like Manziel rode the hype train all the way to a first round pick.

And while I agree hype can get out of hand, all anyone around here was hyping was he may be a better prospect than Savage. This isn't exactly crowning the kid, is it?
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Playing just three games against very tough competition, including the top two ranked teams in the country, isn't enough to show that he did a good job. They are enough, however, to quibble about his stats against some of the best defenses in the country.
 
Runner said:
Well, let's look at that.

Multi-year starter at multiple schools - sometimes winning the starting job, sometimes losing it. Someone who makes snap decisions might consider his inability to follow through at one school a negative. Some who give it more consideration might also come to the same conclusion. Others might consider that a strength.

A year of NFL experience - good point; since this is a plus we don't have to consider the "he's just a rookie" excuse. When he was put into a game he couldn't even hand off properly among other questionable actions. I was not impressed during the small amount of time he played; others seem to think he showed great potential. Do I hate Savage? No. I just don't think he has shown as much as others think he has.

Drafted in the NFL - I think Jones will probably be drafted in the NFL at some point, so that is a wash.

=================

College quarterback with three starts to his name - blowout win in conference championship, solid win over #1 ranked Alabama, comfortable win over #2 Oregon for NCAA Championship. He is inexperienced, but I take those wins as a positive since he was able to perform under pressure without those multi-year starter qualifications. I hardly think "only three starts" makes him a bad player. He might actually get better with more experience and coaching. In other words, he has potential, just as others claim for Savage.

He was surrounded by an extremely talented team, so he didn't "win" those games by himself. However, he did his fair share - he didn't just ride the coattails of the rest of the team, nor did he play so badly his team was at risk of losing.

=======================

Therefore, I think it does make sense to consider Jones over Savage if a team is looking to develop a third string quarterback with potential.
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Fair post

Jones will fail in the NFL. IMHO

So I hope the Texans don't draft him. He does have more NFL skills than Miller/Barrett. However he was 3rd string for a reason. Meyer knows what he's doing?
 
I'm glad this whole silly episode can be put to rest now. It drives me nuts how reactionary media and fans are. Btw, I would have had no problem taking him in the fourth round had he come out.

The way he handled the whole ordeal actually made me like him more. What people are forgetting here is that he is a redshirt sophomore, so not only does he have two years left, but he is also one year closer to a degree than a true sophomore would be. He has a legitimate shot at the starting job next year. If he doesn't win it he could be the backup for a year and then transfer to any program in the country as a graduate. Either way he is getting at least one year of starting experience at OSU or he's getting one year at the program of his choice as a senior.

Both of those options are better for his development than jumping to the NFL after three games.
 
steelbtexan said:
Fair post

Jones will fail in the NFL. IMHO

So I hope the Texans don't draft him. He does have more NFL skills than Miller/Barrett. However he was 3rd string for a reason. Meyer knows what he's doing?
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Thanks. I didn't think anyone read that post. Not enough mudslinging.

Most QBs fail in the NFL.

I wouldn't have wanted the Texans to waste a flyer on him this year anyway. They have enough mid level quarterbacks (also likely failures in the NFL) on the roster.

Now - if he plays enough next year it might be a different story. Then there will be plenty of tape to look at. Personally, I think it is between Barrett and Jones. I don't think Miller is going to be part of the equation.
 
I'd like to take this time to announce I will not be selling my house, moving out of Houston, or shutting down my trading operation. Thank you all for being here.

:bubbles:
 
Runner said:
Don't assume what I'd think. If he played at the same skill level he still wouldn't have looked like a good quarterback.

This is funny. Some posters don't give Jones any credit for the three big wins he contributed to, and others seem to want to evaluate Savage (or want me to evaluate Savage) on wins that didn't occur.
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I'm not assuming anything. Although I would like to know who you think this yrs QB/savior is in this yrs draft.

I haven't seen enough of Savage/Jones to make a fair eval. (Neither have you) Although I do believe that you enjoy talking about stuff that you know little about. This subject qualifies because of the above.
 
bah007 said:
Both of those options are better for his development than jumping to the NFL after three games.
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Development? Yeah, probably. But, he could still end up with the same draft position after that (and a year or 2 without a NFL paycheck). Whatever was in his heart was the right decision. And his heart was still in Columbus.
 
nero THE zero said:
Declaring for the draft I understand.
Transferring schools I understand.
Going back to OSU I don't understand.
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With Miller and Barrett still injured, Jones will be the starter going into the spring. I don't think it's crazy that Meyer sticks with Jones when it's all said and done.
 
bah007 said:
I'm glad this whole silly episode can be put to rest now. It drives me nuts how reactionary media and fans are. Btw, I would have had no problem taking him in the fourth round had he come out.
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I think things like this are good every now & then. There's a clear line drawn & we all get to see who's on which side of that line.

You probably already knew who was on your side of the line & there were no doubts about some who were on the other side, but there's a few you didn't know what to make of one way or the other.


Now you do.
 
steelbtexan said:
Although I do believe that you enjoy talking about stuff that you know little about.
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Huh? I know "little about" stuff why? Sorry I don't have the message board cred of all the draftniks who have obviously spent hundreds of hours studying "film".

:rolleyes:
 
steelbtexan said:
I was just asking a question, no offense was intended. If the Texans want Jones they better take him in rds1-2. Because you know the Browns will take the hometown guy.

Would you take that risk? I wouldn't.
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I don't know honestly. I'd consider it if he was going to be the franchise guy.

But if they don't deem him worthy of that, probably not.

No more projects. 1 is enough. If we go qb I want him to be the guy.
 
PapaL said:
Some of us have grown up since 2012...and from our Freshman year in college.
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While true, most learn it before they get to college. While there, you may act stupid, but the basic respect for education has already formed. But very few who have not already learned it by college will get it while in college. AFTER college, when the real world hits home, will there be regret for wasting the opportunity by those who had not learned the benefits of basic education. Of course, some are too dumb to ever regret their stupidity.
 
steelbtexan said:
I'm not assuming anything. Although I would like to know who you think this yrs QB/savior is in this yrs draft.

I haven't seen enough of Savage/Jones to make a fair eval. (Neither have you) Although I do believe that you enjoy talking about stuff that you know little about. This subject qualifies because of the above.
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Everyone always argues we haven't seen enough to not like a guy, but let's flip the coin, why has everyone else seen enough to love the guy? Everyone seems to just want to do everything they can to chop down people's opinions, but no one really bothers explaining why the other side of the opinion is the correct side to be on.

And as for Savage, I watched him be mediocre in college, lose his job, then go be mediocre elsewhere. I (although many can call me unfair) pretty much wrote him off before he even began in the NFL. He had an uphill battle to climb for me, and during the preseason and actual NFL regular season games, not only did he NOT climb up my hill, I think dug a hole at the bottom of it and stood in that instead. He's got a long way to go for me personally.

There is something like 250 college football teams or something like that. That means there are around 250 QBs that play college. If you aren't setting the world on fire and really setting yourself from those other 250, you got a big uphill battle to climb. And when I have to explain to all my casual College Football Friends who this Tom Savage guy is after we drafted him, it means he probably wasn't setting the world on fire before he came to the big show, so now I expect him to do it now?

As for Jones, I'm pretty sure he got a 4th round grade from the Advisory Board and decided he would try to improve upon it. Good luck.
 
Marshall said:
Are you sure?
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Yep.

even as an UDFA on the practice squad, he would make $107,100 for a season. If he made the 53, that goes up to $420K, minimum. Savage was drafted in the fourth round and inked a 4-yr, $2.5 million deal with a $300+K signing bonus. And I've heard some talking heads say that he could have gone as high as the 2nd round. Personally, I think the 4th round was about right for a developmental guy; which is what Jones would have to be.

Link for Salary Info

The boosters may be "helping him out" with expenses but I doubt they match even the UDFA paycheck let alone what he would make had he decided to declare and been drafted.
 
ObsiWan said:
Yep.

even as an UDFA on the practice squad, he would make $107,100 for a season. If he made the 53, that goes up to $420K, minimum. Savage was drafted in the fourth round and inked a 4-yr, $2.5 million deal with a $300+K signing bonus. And I've heard some talking heads say that he could have gone as high as the 2nd round. Personally, I think the 4th round was about right for a developmental guy; which is what Jones would have to be.

Link for Salary Info

The boosters may be "helping him out" with expenses but I doubt they match even the UDFA paycheck let alone what he would make had he decided to declare and been drafted.
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But it is OKLAHOMA...
 
ObsiWan said:
but, but... PapaL said "Ohio State" in the post you quoted...
:thinking:
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Which put's me squarely in a senior moment scenario. My bad. I should have made the connection anyway since I knew he was the Ohio QB, but failed miserably to connect.

ps I can't get the phrase "Oh How I Hate Ohio State" out of my head from ex-wife #2, a former Michigan student.
 
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