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All encompassing Rick Smith thread

JB said:
That draft was loaded with talent....

Most of it that we drafted was either injured or stupid, but it was loaded
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Yep

And yet, Smith still has a job. If the org is set up the way Texian says, then the McNair's need to take a serious look at how they run their org. IMHO
 
steelbtexan said:
Yep

And yet, Smith still has a job. If the org is set up the way Texian says, then the McNair's need to take a serious look at how they run their org. IMHO
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well the scouting dept did undergo a full overhaul correct? We can only hope the problem was there at this point because Smith does still have a job.
 
JB said:
well the scouting dept did undergo a full overhaul correct? We can only hope the problem was there at this point because Smith does still have a job.
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Hope and Change?

Where have I heard that before?
 
Based on Clowney and Nix alone, and of course the quarterback fiasco, we need a new GM 2015. It's time for him to be held responsible for the past and current mediocre team we have in Houston.
 
So what's Rick going to do to finish out the season? He may have to find a couple of QB's just to finish the season.

:wadepalm:
 
is rick smith fired yet

and is the astrodome blown up yet we gotta lift this old indian Burial Curse we need to spill the blood of 100 bulls on the grounds of the astrodome parking lol
 
Rick smith has been here for 8 years. He got Kubiak fired on the premise that the team has a talented roster. That clearly isn't the case. Buh bye Rick.
 
I heard Mike Meltser predict on the 610 postage show Sunday that Smith will be fired after the season.

For a host to say that on the team's flagship station was surprising, to say the least.

I hope he (Meltser) keeps his job...
 
Someone lay out what Smith did this year (you know, since the last time he didn't get fired) that will be anything that would make McNair change that decision and fire Smith this year?

He sure isn't going to be gazing in hindsight awe at Bortles or Manziel. He isn't going to have recriminations about Clowney if you believe the heavy finger of alma mater made that decision.
 
infantrycak said:
Someone lay out what Smith did this year (you know, since the last time he didn't get fired) that will be anything that would make McNair change that decision and fire Smith this year?

He sure isn't going to be gazing in hindsight awe at Bortles or Manziel. He isn't going to have recriminations about Clowney if you believe the heavy finger of alma mater made that decision.
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he didn't get my favorite player, he let OB get rid of my favorite player, our salary cap is in a mess cuz some old dude gets too much, too many players got injured this year and he just plain sucks :D

:swatter:

:kitten:

edit: Oh yeah! and our #1 pick was a total bust and he should have seen that coming... and he should have got rid of the entire medical staff and the astrodome too
 
gafftop said:
Just my opinion of Rick Smith based on situation the Texans are in presently.
The GM has to be concerned with the long term view of the team. Rick has been year to year worried about saving his job. He should have traded Tate this year when we might have got a 1st round draft choice for him just to point out most recent example.

See Morey for Rockets he built up talent and used them as chips to continuously make the Rockets a force. Smith just rents his players or overpays for others. (See Reed, Schaub, and others)

I can hear it now " Rick Smith just can't improve this team because of the cap."
Guess what Smith is the reason the Texans are in this situation.

McNair thinks this team is much more talented than it really is. That is the main reason I guess McNair hasn't gotten rid of Smith. Seriously Smith is the person in the brain trust with the most football knowledge on this organization? We are still drowning then.

See his resume and highlights
http://www.houstontexans.com/team/st...3-5f875710e9b2

Schaub, Yates, Brooks Reed, Mercilus, trading DeMeco, KJ, and Crick are mentioned as a few of his GREAT moves. SERIOUSLY!!!!?????

I am still pissed because I see at BEST intermittent success for this franchise.

Kind of like "Even a blind hog finds an acorn" I think sums up our time with Smith in charge.

Also don't like snakes. The right thing was for Smith to fall on the sword also instead of using it to stab Kubiak.

Tired of the excuse that maybe he didn't make the decisions. His role should have been to make the decisions. If he didn't make the decisions then what did he do, and why all of the sudden is he going to be qualified now to make decisions. If he did make the decisions then they were bad. Either way for his tenure here he has done nothing but make friends with McNair.

Just my opinion. I hope I am wrong.
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Don't think I was wrong. His background change has been removed I guess.

I felt not trading Mario and keeping the core of the Texans together was the biggest Smith blunder but I think drafting Clowney will top that.
 
infantrycak said:
Someone lay out what Smith did this year (you know, since the last time he didn't get fired) that will be anything that would make McNair change that decision and fire Smith this year?

He sure isn't going to be gazing in hindsight awe at Bortles or Manziel. He isn't going to have recriminations about Clowney if you believe the heavy finger of alma mater made that decision.
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:cricket::cricket:

Don't hold your breath on that one, Cak.

They won't confess it, but they just want him gone because it will make them feel better. No logic required.
 
Marcus said:
:cricket::cricket:

Don't hold your breath on that one, Cak.

They won't confess it, but they just want him gone because it will make them feel better. No logic required.
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There is plenty of logic. The Texans are mired in perpetual mediocrity: a couple of good seasons, a very bad season, and a bunch of disappointing seasons hovering around .500. Smith is by title the GM. So either:

1) He has a real GM role with authority and responsibilities and can be held accountable for the state of the team over the past few seasons.

2) He does not have a real GM authority and responsibility, so he can't be held accountable for the state of the team the past few seasons.

I'd believe either at this point.

If it is option 1, he should be fired for poor performance.

I'll meet you halfway if it is option 2. If he has no GM authority/responsibility, then the Texans are operating without a GM and are at a disadvantage to the well run NFL teams. In that case the Texans should acknowledge his contributions to the team, promote him to a harmless Vice President of Staying Out of the Way position, hire a real GM, and try to be more than a .500 franchise.

I can't find the logic in an option 3 though - that Rick is a fantastic GM and the Texans flail around season after season in spite of his exceptional contributions.
 
I don't see us getting a new GM unless McNair changes what he's doing. I don't see that happening soon. We just went from 2-14 to probably 9-7, 8-8 or 7-9. McNair will see that as improvement and everything will be great in his eyes because people will still fill the seats every home game.
 
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Runner said:
There is plenty of logic. The Texans are mired in perpetual mediocrity: a couple of good seasons, a very bad season, and a bunch of disappointing seasons hovering around .500. Smith is by title the GM. So either:

1) He has a real GM role with authority and responsibilities and can be held accountable for the state of the team over the past few seasons.

2) He does not have a real GM authority and responsibility, so he can't be held accountable for the state of the team the past few seasons.

I'd believe either at this point.

If it is option 1, he should be fired for poor performance.

I'll meet you halfway if it is option 2. If he has no GM authority/responsibility, then the Texans are operating without a GM and are at a disadvantage to the well run NFL teams. In that case the Texans should acknowledge his contributions to the team, promote him to a harmless Vice President of Staying Out of the Way position, hire a real GM, and try to be more than a .500 franchise.

I can't find the logic in an option 3 though - that Rick is a fantastic GM and the Texans flail around season after season in spite of his exceptional contributions.
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To put it more succinctly - you wanted him fired last season and still do.

Look I understand that opinion. My question though was what in the world makes you think it's going to happen this year? You should at least have an arguable last straw on which to pin your hopes. Either that or sit down with a really nice scotch and realize it ain't happening.
 
infantrycak said:
Look I understand that opinion. My question though was what in the world makes you think it's going to happen this year? You should at least have an arguable last straw on which to pin your hopes. Either that or sit down with a really nice scotch and realize it ain't happening.
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I should be clear - I doubt he will be fired this year, unless he was on a "one last chance" performance improvement program. And no, I don't think he was. He didn't do anything different this year, just contributed (or not contributed) to another mediocre team. Year after year of just adequate performance in the ultra-competitive NFL is logical reason to be fired for some teams. It happens all the time. There is logic to it.

Thinking he should be gone and thinking he will be gone are two different things obviously. At this point I can't imagine what he would have to do to actually be fired. He could well be a Texan for life.

Knowing that Smith being fired is not an option made me wonder what else the Texans could do. Promoting him out of the way is a tried and true method in many companies. They should do it. Big raise, new office, impressive title - everybody is happy!

infantrycak said:
To put it more succinctly - you wanted him fired last season and still do.
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Yes. Undoubtedly. I don't want to mislead anyone into thinking otherwise.
 
Runner said:
2) He does not have a real GM authority and responsibility, so he can't be held accountable for the state of the team the past few seasons.
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Looks like he got the players the HC wanted. Those guys got hurt. Even if he had all the GM power he should, he still can't be held accountable for the medical staff screwing the pooch.

I'm all for firing Rick Smith. I may not have a good reason to do so, or to want him gone, but... I want him gone. Has nothing to do with what happened last year, I'm blaming him for the cap hell from 2010 & the roster at that time. He hasn't done anything IMO to save his job this year. He didn't do anything to lose his job, but he didn't do anything to save it either.
 
The only way Rick Smith gets fired is if Bob McNair decides to hire a GM in the mold of Ted Thompson or Ozzie Newsome and I don't see that happening anytime soon. Until then Smith will continue to do what the Owner and HC ask of him. As long as Smith continues in this capacity there is absolutely no reason to fire him and the reason why he hasn't been fired earlier.
 
santo said:
I don't see us getting a new GM unless McNair changes what he's doing. I don't see that happening soon. We just went from 2-14 to probably 9-7, 8-8 or 7-9. McNair will see that as improvement and everything will be great in his eyes because people will still fill the seats every home game.
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yep. Anyone paying attention to the history of this franchise knows that Mr. McNair is not a knee-jerk reaction kind of guy. It takes a 2-14 season for him to change head coaches, which he feels is a traumatic experience and prefers long term stability over short term demands. He's a "slow and steady wins the race" kind of guy, and whether we fans like it or not, it's just the way it is on Kirby.

I'm not as down on Rick Smith as other folks, but I'm not a huge supporter. My only thought is that I think EVERY aspect of the team should be open for analysis and potential upgrade, including the GM. I'm just not sure if Rick Smith gets that kind of scrutiny due to various aspects of the organization (ie how much power and decisions does he really possess, personal relationships, etc.).
 
infantrycak said:
To put it more succinctly - you wanted him fired last season and still do.

Look I understand that opinion. My question though was what in the world makes you think it's going to happen this year? You should at least have an arguable last straw on which to pin your hopes. Either that or sit down with a really nice scotch and realize it ain't happening.
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I'm not saying he'll get fired either, but he didn't do anything to impress. He brought in another draft class that didn't produce. Jacksonville has more rookies making an impact than we do. Our most productive rookies were Prosch and Blue, everyone else was basically a non-factor this season. This is a reoccurring problem and probably will be an ongoing problem.
 
JB said:
he didn't get my favorite player, he let OB get rid of my favorite player, our salary cap is in a mess cuz some old dude gets too much, too many players got injured this year and he just plain sucks :D

:swatter:

:kitten:

edit: Oh yeah! and our #1 pick was a total bust and he should have seen that coming... and he should have got rid of the entire medical staff and the astrodome too
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Pretty much covers it, I do wish he could get better in the draft. I
mean he's pretty much struck out on the draft the last 3 yrs. Now if you want to talk Brian Gaine that's another story. That guy found enough talent on the waiver wire to help rebuild the seconday. He's awesome, I wish BOB would lock Smith in the bathroom for 3 days and let Gaine run the draft.
 
TexansSeminole said:
I'm not saying he'll get fired either, but he didn't do anything to impress. He brought in another draft class that didn't produce. Jacksonville has more rookies making an impact than we do. Our most productive rookies were Prosch and Blue, everyone else was basically a non-factor this season. This is a reoccurring problem and probably will be an ongoing problem.
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Well if you put our draft class in the Jags, I'm sure everyone is starting and being more productive. Bad teams tend to have more rookies contributing.
 
steelbtexan said:
Pretty much covers it, I do wish he could get better in the draft. I
mean he's pretty much struck out on the draft the last 3 yrs. Now if you want to talk Brian Gaine that's another story. That guy found enough talent on the waiver wire to help rebuild the seconday. He's awesome, I wish BOB would lock Smith in the bathroom for 3 days and let Gaine run the draft.
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Not to take anything away from what Gaine has done this year, but that takes completely different evaluation skills. It's difficult to scout college. Those players flourish within a system, or leverage athleticism that is closer to NFL baseline (or as they sometimes painfully discover, below it).

Scouting the wire gives you access to preseason tape, training camp press, and other information that measures the player outside of his element.

santo said:
I don't see us getting a new GM unless McNair changes what he's doing. I don't see that happening soon. We just went from 2-14 to probably 9-7, 8-8 or 7-9. McNair will see that as improvement and everything will be great in his eyes because people will still fill the seats every home game.
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It's not just that McNair sees that as improvement. It is improvement.

Rick Smith gets an end-of-year review just like everyone else in the club. In that review, McNair will offer his observations on what was done right, what should be improved, then give a summary rating. Based on the net accomplishment of this year, Smith has earned his stay for 2015. Firing him wouldn't just be illogical, it would be a near scandal in sports media.

On the subject of the 2014 draft class, no one can declare a draft a bust after one year. Even Clowney doesn't deserve that designation yet.
 
steelbtexan said:
Pretty much covers it, I do wish he could get better in the draft. I
mean he's pretty much struck out on the draft the last 3 yrs. Now if you want to talk Brian Gaine that's another story. That guy found enough talent on the waiver wire to help rebuild the seconday. He's awesome, I wish BOB would lock Smith in the bathroom for 3 days and let Gaine run the draft.
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You're a tough customer... struck out in the last 3 drafts? The 2012 draft has 4 starters, not to mention our starting returner & kicker.
 
Improvement of the physical evaluation and treatment of injured players seems to be in order, but I do not consider the last three drafts busts. I also don't place the blame, if any, on the GM. He is a facilitator more than a ruler in this system and that's a good thing in this era.
 
TexansSeminole said:
I'm not saying he'll get fired either, but he didn't do anything to impress. He brought in another draft class that didn't produce. Jacksonville has more rookies making an impact than we do. Our most productive rookies were Prosch and Blue, everyone else was basically a non-factor this season. This is a reoccurring problem and probably will be an ongoing problem.
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dream_team said:
Well if you put our draft class in the Jags, I'm sure everyone is starting and being more productive. Bad teams tend to have more rookies contributing.
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^^^^
THIS!!
It's amazing how we forget in 2006 WE were the Jags and just about everyone we drafted made an impact.
Why? Because the 2005 roster sucked. This team needed a nearly complete makeover.
We're not that bad any longer. This year and, hopefully, for the next couple of years it's going to be hard for a rookie to crack the starting line up. Especially where we need a talent infusion the most, at QB. And really especially with a head coach that doesn't seem to be inclined to start rookies at QB.

But other than that, you can't compare the impact the Jags rookies to the impact of our rookies. Who would the Jags' rookies unseat? Foster? Duane Brown? A.J.? Myers? Pickett? KJ or J-Jo? And if we had picked Bortles, would O'Brien be inclined to start him?
 
ObsiWan said:
^^^^
THIS!!
It's amazing how we forget in 2006 WE were the Jags and just about everyone we drafted made an impact.
Why? Because the 2005 roster sucked. This team needed a nearly complete makeover.
We're not that bad any longer. This year and, hopefully, for the next couple of years it's going to be hard for a rookie to crack the starting line up. Especially where we need a talent infusion the most, at QB. And really especially with a head coach that doesn't seem to be inclined to start rookies at QB.
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3rded. Number of starters as rookies is a horrible indicator of draft success.

...and as you note, especially where the HC is disinclined to start rookies.
 
If you want to fire Rick Smith for something you can fire him for poor performance of the Pro and College Scouting Staffs. This is the one area that Rick Smith is responsible. Smith is responsible for hiring this staff and for over seeing their performance. IMO the Texans scouting staffs have achieved a below average performance, especially when compared to other teams who consistently perform well. The scouting staffs should be fired along with their boss Rick Smith.
 
Texian said:
If you want to fire Rick Smith for something you can fire him for poor performance of the Pro and College Scouting Staffs. This is the one area that Rick Smith is responsible. Smith is responsible for hiring this staff and for over seeing their performance. IMO the Texans scouting staffs have achieved a below average performance, especially when compared to other teams who consistently perform well. The scouting staffs should be fired along with their boss Rick Smith.
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I thought a whole new scouting staff was brought in earlier this year
 
A lot of Smiths problems come from bad deals with free agents. He lets good players go sign elsewhere for friendly deals then turns around and over pays for older/injured players. It is his entire history of bad deals that makes it time to move on. No reason to let him screw up the salary another couple years.
 
ObsiWan said:
^^^^
THIS!!
It's amazing how we forget in 2006 WE were the Jags and just about everyone we drafted made an impact.
Why? Because the 2005 roster sucked. This team needed a nearly complete makeover.
We're not that bad any longer. This year and, hopefully, for the next couple of years it's going to be hard for a rookie to crack the starting line up. Especially where we need a talent infusion the most, at QB. And really especially with a head coach that doesn't seem to be inclined to start rookies at QB.

But other than that, you can't compare the impact the Jags rookies to the impact of our rookies. Who would the Jags' rookies unseat? Foster? Duane Brown? A.J.? Myers? Pickett? KJ or J-Jo? And if we had picked Bortles, would O'Brien be inclined to start him?
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Blake Bortles would have been the starter and a positive player moving forward.

Allen Robinson, Marquise Lee, and Hurns would have been huge upgrades over what we have now.

Telvin Smith would have been a 3 down startig ILB for us, he's playing well for them.

Aaron Colvin would have been solid DB depth, pass rusher Smith would have been a nice addition as well.

Much better than what we got.
 
TexansSeminole said:
Blake Bortles would have been the starter and a positive player moving forward.

Allen Robinson, Marquise Lee, and Hurns would have been huge upgrades over what we have now.

Telvin Smith would have been a 3 down startig ILB for us, he's playing well for them.

Aaron Colvin would have been solid DB depth, pass rusher Smith would have been a nice addition as well.

Much better than what we got.
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Got a new team to root for?
 
Runner said:
It's OK to admit there are good players in the league besides those that play for the Texans. Really. It is.
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yeah, but kinda funny to be wistfully thinking another team's entire draft class would not only be starting for us, but better than anyone we currently have
 
Marshall said:
Improvement of the physical evaluation and treatment of injured players seems to be in order, but I do not consider the last three drafts busts. I also don't place the blame, if any, on the GM. He is a facilitator more than a ruler in this system and that's a good thing in this era.
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Who should the blame be placed on and why is having a GM as a facilitator a good thing. After all Smith facilitated a 2-14 season and put the team in bad cap shape. It might be that I'm jealous that Smith can be terrible at his job, but still not be held accountable. I wish I was held to the same standards as Smith. I could do a crappy job and make a lot more $$$$.
 
TexansSeminole said:
To be honest, you'd be hard pressed to find a draft class that produced less than what ours did.
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no argument from me on that... injuries aren't predictable so if anyone hold the medical staff accountable.

The myth that Smith controls the draft has been debunked.
 
JB said:
yeah, but kinda funny to be wistfully thinking another team's entire draft class would not only be starting for us, but better than anyone we currently have
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Truth hurts sometimes, although I do believe do believe once healthy the Texans last draft class has the ability to be as good as the Jags class.

I really like Bortles/Lee/Robinson and Smith though. Those guys are going to be really good in a few yrs.
 
JB said:
no argument from me on that... injuries aren't predictable so if anyone hold the medical staff accountable.

The myth that Smith controls the draft has been debunked.
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Agreed

The medical staff just plain sucks.

Smith controls nothing, He's the epitome of a yes man. He does speak well and dress well though.
 
steelbtexan said:
Truth hurts sometimes, although I do believe do believe once healthy the Texans last draft class has the ability to be as good as the Jags class.

I really like Bortles/Lee/Robinson and Smith though. Those guys are going to be really good in a few yrs.
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Agreed! The Jags are going to be scary in a few years
 
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