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Ray Rice arrested in Atlantic City

thunderkyss said:
Except that only pertains to the law & court... this is the NFL
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I hear what you're saying but I don't think the NFLPA wants to let Goodell just change his mind and give our stiffer penalties on whatever because he's feeling public pressure (or behind the scenes pressure from some group of owners). If Roger the First is allowed to change his mind about this thing unchallenged, then he could expand that precedent to any penalty he metes out..
I'm not saying they'll win, but the Player's Union shouldn't just let it ride without some pushback.
 
ObsiWan said:
I hear what you're saying but I don't think the NFLPA wants to let Goodell just change his mind and give our stiffer penalties on whatever because he's feeling public pressure (or behind the scenes pressure from some group of owners). If Roger the First is allowed to change his mind about this thing unchallenged, then he could expand that precedent to any penalty he metes out..
I'm not saying they'll win, but the Player's Union shouldn't just let it ride without some pushback.
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I do not think Roger Goodell is making decisions in a vacuum. He is the tip of the spear that is 32 ownership groups. While they certainly let him appear as the NFL's emperor, I think that is by design. It takes the heat off of owners to let him deal with it, which is why they pay him more than $40 million a year.

But I have no doubt that he is representing the interests of his bosses, and they let him do the dirty work.
 
Apologies in advance, but..

Rice's new jerseys are now on sale
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toronto said:
If someone can find me a worse week (Belcher was bad, but this week feels worse) than this one in the last 25 years of the NFL, lemme know.
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The public outcry is worse with these 2 incidents only b/c there's video and pictures & the day and age we live in.... but Rae Carruth's ordeal was way worse although it took a little longer than a week to play out. His case essentially has everything both these cases & belcher's case have combined...It's really something out of a movie when you mix in the hitman and how they captured this clown in the trunk of a car. & that happened on Paul Tagliabue's watch.

His son is still alive today..but b/c of his POS biological, he is severely handicapped.
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What many of us expected.
NFLPA files Ray Rice appeal
Posted by Mike Florio on September 16, 2014, 9:16 PM EDT


As expected (but a day later than expected), the NFLPA has filed an appeal of the NFL’s indefinite suspension of Ray Rice.

“This action taken by our union is to protect the due process rights of all NFL players,” the NFLPA said in a statement.

“The NFLPA appeal is based on supporting facts that reveal a lack of a fair and impartial process, including the role of the office of the Commissioner of the NFL,” the union added. “We have asked that a neutral and jointly selected arbitrator hear this case as the Commissioner and his staff will be essential witnesses in the proceeding and thus cannot serve as impartial arbitrators.”

The union is right, on both counts. Regardless of Rice’s behavior, he has rights. He has been suspended twice for the same conduct. The NFL arguably knew or should have known all it needed to know about the details of Rice’s behavior when levying the initial two-game suspension.

The league contends Rice lied about what happened. The hearing will sort out what he said about what he did, to the team and to the league. Apart from the testimony from witnesses like Rice, Commissioner Roger Goodell, Ravens G.M. Ozzie Newsome (who has said Rice didn’t lie), and others, the appeal will attack the league’s failure to secure the video of the incident. If there was any doubt or ambiguity or inconsistency or perceived lie, all the league had to do was get the tape.

“Under governing labor law, an employee cannot be punished twice for the same action when all of the relevant facts were available to the employer at the time of the first punishment,” the union said in its statement. “The hearing will require a neutral arbitrator to determine what information was available to the NFL and when it was available.”

Amen to that. At a time when the investigator hired by the NFL isn’t as independent as he could have been, this process will create another avenue for getting to the truth. By rule, a hearing date must be set within 10 days.

Wouldn’t it be nice to get to the truth? After eight days of no one from the NFL or a handful of its teams wanting to confront the truth in a variety of cases, this appeal could eventually get to The Truth about the Rice video - and it could end up being far more relevant and useful to determining the future of the league office than a not-so-independent investigation overseen by two of the NFL’s owners who necessarily support the status quo.
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It will still come down to the "Personal Conduct" portion of the policy.
 
handswarmer said:
Does the video make him "Guilty-ER"???
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The Ravens cut him when he only had a two game suspension. Ask them. It seems they also leaned on the DA to get Rice deferred adjudication. When the video surfaced, even though had seen it and knew exactly what was on it, they cut him and inferred he lied.

Bisciotti is a dirtbag.

handswarmer said:
Ravens subsequently terminate Rice from his contract
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This delusion you have is interesting, considering the Ravens cut ray rice before any suspension. The only reason he was suspended was they cut him. He could be on the exempt commissioner's list.
 
If all things were truly equal, I'd like to see equal coverage in the media.

We DEFINITELY do not see equal commission of abuse when it comes to certain groups of citizens vs others.

marlene-pinnock-o.gif


Am I to believe the media cares about Black women?

Do I acknowledge what my eyes are showing me, which has historically proven to be an opportunity to associate domestic violence with Black men? White femenist lobbyists get paid, and Black men get painted as brutes. Meanwhile, cases like this image occur and remain in the background. A white man beats the crap out of an elderly black woman on an open highway, video of it is everywhere, yet the coverage is not the same. He's "SAVAGELY" pounding her, yet such terms are only reserved for Black people.
 
ObsiWan said:
so how did this story conclude?
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So far, the man who beat Ms. Marlene Pinnock has not faced charges. The officer's name is Daniel Andrew. As far as I know, the man who shot Mike Brown in Ferguson, Missouri has yet to be arrested, either.

I'm reading Richard Williams' book right now. He almost didn't get to father Venus and Serena. When he was a child, Black children were shot down like livestock, lynched, castrated, mutilated, run over, and no one batted an eye.

These days, the attitudes of the dominant society are exactly the same. The only difference is, they must now put forth the facade of seeing American Africans as human. Many of them, resent this requirement.

History didn't happen "back then," as it is a continuation of right now. The fear our grandparents had, when it came to discussing their childhoods with us, has allowed the dominant society to play on our fear and ignorance of the pure savage behavior of their people towards ours, historically and currently.
 
What the Ravens did today was hilarious.

10 minutes before a 4PM presser with Bisciotti they release a 7 page statement refuting ESPN's story and expected the press to have read that before the Q and A started. Man.
 
ESPN/Grantland's Bill Simmons goes off on Godell
ESPN commentator and Grantland.com editor-in-chief Bill Simmons ...took his criticism to the next level...

“Goodell, if he didn’t know what was on that tape, he’s a liar,” Simmons said Monday. “I’m just saying it. He is lying. I think that dude is lying. If you put him up on a lie detector test that guy would fail. For all these people to pretend they didn’t know is such f#@king bu!!sh!t. It really is - it’s such f#@king bu!!sh!t. And for him to go in that press conference and pretend otherwise, I was so insulted. I really was.”

Later, Simmons dared someone at ESPN to penalize him for speaking out against the NFL. “I really hope somebody calls me or emails me and says I’m in trouble for anything I say about Roger Goodell,” he said. “Because if one person says that to me, I’m going public. You leave me alone. The commissioner’s a liar and I get to talk about that on my podcast.”

“Please, call me and say I’m in trouble,” he added. “I dare you.”
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ObsiWan said:
I heard him this morning... I think the 8 o'clock guys on 790 played it.

I just wonder if he's got any proof?
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Let the NFL and Goodell sue for defamation. I bet they would LOVE to expose everything that they did or didn't do during discovery. And that's why you won't hear a peep from the league offices.

ESPN is a just being a lapdog to league offices, which is a lapdog to league owners. The whole system is scared of anyone rocking the boat.

We'll note that Simmons got suspended for longer than Ray Rice did initially. Does anyone think that the NFL or its lackeys have any interest in doing the right thing? If they did, Goodell would be gone.
 
CBS Sports reports former Baltimore Ravens RB Ray Rice remains suspended indefinitely following the publication of the video of him striking his now-wife, Janay, in a casino elevator, but he could be reinstated within the next four weeks, sources said.

An appeal hearing date has been set, with a final decision expected to come in an expeditious manner thereafter, and all of that could be resolved by mid-November, which would conceivably allow Rice to sign with another team this season. Perhaps, even if reinstated, teams will find him too controversial to sign, but there is every expectation his playing status will be resolved before the NFL's investigation into its handling of his case, being conducted by former FBI chief Robert Mueller, is completed.
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Andrew Brandt @adbrandt
Key to hearing was whether “starkly different sequence of events” than captured on the “inside-the-elevator” video. There was not.

Note from ruling: when DV policy changed to 6 games, Goodell called RR to assure him new policy would not affect him, was forward looking

Rice team argument was that indefinite suspension was an NFL knee-jerk reaction to public outrage over the video. Ruling supports it.

Judge Jones used the word that NFL lawyers feared in defending Goodell's punishment: "arbitrary." It was the buzzword of Rice case.

Judge Jones agreed with Rice team that what was shared in the June 16th disciplinary meeting "did not mislead the Commissioner."

The NFL has to accept Jones' decision as binding. They agreed on her as arbitrator and always praise the system outlined in the CBA.

Yes, Ray Rice playing requires a team wanting to sign him. Seems unlikely, but as I always say: he doesn't need 32, he just needs one.

Key to appeal, to me, was whether Goodell expanded on what he referred to as "ambiguities" re Rice's account. Evidently not enough.

The transcript of the Rice appeal will certainly be scrutinized by Robert Mueller in his ongoing investigation into Rice discipline.

As to whether the NFL further pursues Ray Rice punishment, it will not. Am told by league, as to the ruling, "We accept it as binding."

Rice claimed he told Goodell everything (pre-video); Goodell claimed there was ambiguity/inconsistency. Judge sided with player.

Rice's (winning) appeal arguments: (1) collective bargaining version of double jeopardy; (2) no precedent for length of suspension.

Judge Jones has lifted the suspension on Rice, thus making him eligible for signing with any NFL team, should there be interest.

Ray Rice has won his appeal of his indefinite suspension. Judge Barbara Jones issued ruling today.
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Janay Rice, in her own words
WE KNEW it was a possibility that some video would come out. We definitely feared it.

The day after everything happened, we met with Ray's manager and the lawyers. They all warned us it could come out and told us it was something they couldn't control, though they would try. They told us to be prepared for it.

News of our arrests broke the next day, February 16. The first video followed on February 19 and no, we weren't prepared. I was sick to my stomach. I just broke down in tears.

I said to him, "I don't think I should have seen that." He said, "me either."

The video didn't make me rethink our relationship, but I did want more of an explanation from him. I asked him why he left me on the floor like that. I asked him how he felt when he saw that I was unconscious. He told me he was in shock. I asked him what happened when we got out of the elevator. He told me he was terrified because security was there. I asked him how he felt seeing me like that. He said he was thinking, "What did I just do?"

I didn't watch the video again...
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What a joke God'ell is

Got his a** handed to him again, guess Tagliabue can bail him out this time.

Guess this ruling says it's better to beat the crap out of your wife than it is to get carried away spanking your child. Free AP, God'ell is such a liberal he should run for president in 2016.
 
steelbtexan said:
What a joke God'ell is

Got his a** handed to him again, guess Tagliabue can bail him out this time.

Guess this ruling says it's better to beat the crap out of your wife than it is to get carried away spanking your child. Free AP, God'ell is such a liberal he should run for president in 2016.
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This ruling says when you make a decision and hand out a punishment, be a man of your word. Don't bend to perceived public opinion and change your mind. Stick by your word.
 
ObsiWan said:
This ruling says when you make a decision and hand out a punishment, be a man of your word. Don't bend to perceived public opinion and change your mind. Stick by your word.
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yep. In the future, the NFL should come down hard on these a-holes that beat their wives. I mean extreme no-tolerance, because this whole thing deflected from the real villain of the story with the NFL's mishandling of it.

And let's be honest about it: Goodell is not making these decisions by himself. He takes the heat, which he's paid handsomely for it, but the truth is that there are a whole lot of folks at NFL HQ that dropped the ball on this one.

I hope Rice is blacklisted, to be honest. His wife is another sad case of an abused wife putting up with inexcusable behavior because she loves his paycheck....errrr...her husband. I find it pitiful when women put up with these jerks.
 
Personally it's a legal issue, not a NFL issue the easiest way for the NFL to win here is to simply let the law handle it.
 
Double Barrel said:
yep. In the future, the NFL should come down hard on these a-holes that beat their wives. I mean extreme no-tolerance, because this whole thing deflected from the real villain of the story with the NFL's mishandling of it.

And let's be honest about it: Goodell is not making these decisions by himself. He takes the heat, which he's paid handsomely for it, but the truth is that there are a whole lot of folks at NFL HQ that dropped the ball on this one.

I hope Rice is blacklisted, to be honest. His wife is another sad case of an abused wife putting up with inexcusable behavior because she loves his paycheck....errrr...her husband. I find it pitiful when women put up with these jerks.
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I have a problem with this type of thinking. Your heart is in the right place, but its a horrible precedent. You have any idea how many instances players are involved in domestic disputes? Or even non athletes around the country? 98% of them won't have some video like this one did. You have to remember how badly women lie to the police and how quickly police are to take the woman's word over a man in these situations and will just hall a guy off to jail.

Would you want this administered after a guy goes to trial to where the facts and the investigation are laid out? Because right now the NFL is on this horrible precedent of punishing guys without examining anything since the Ray Rice situation got screwed up. A lot of these players marry a lot of twisted women who never married these guys for their looks and enjoyed the life of being married to an NFL player with a lot of money. A lot of these players cheat on their wives all of the time. That in itself is a perfect storm to have a lot of domestic violence instances and there is no avoiding that. I'm with you on the stance, but only if it is being pushed "after" the trial to where all of the facts have been laid out and the athlete has had his day in court. Putting out hard line stances and suspensions on an arrest that might have been completely bogus from the jump could get a lot of players careers screwed really bad.
 
Texecutioner said:
I have a problem with this type of thinking. Your heart is in the right place, but its a horrible precedent. You have any idea how many instances players are involved in domestic disputes? Or even non athletes around the country? 98% of them won't have some video like this one did. You have to remember how badly women lie to the police and how quickly police are to take the woman's word over a man in these situations and will just hall a guy off to jail.

Would you want this administered after a guy goes to trial to where the facts and the investigation are laid out? Because right now the NFL is on this horrible precedent of punishing guys without examining anything since the Ray Rice situation got screwed up. A lot of these players marry a lot of twisted women who never married these guys for their looks and enjoyed the life of being married to an NFL player with a lot of money. A lot of these players cheat on their wives all of the time. That in itself is a perfect storm to have a lot of domestic violence instances and there is no avoiding that. I'm with you on the stance, but only if it is being pushed "after" the trial to where all of the facts have been laid out and the athlete has had his day in court. Putting out hard line stances and suspensions on an arrest that might have been completely bogus from the jump could get a lot of players careers screwed really bad.
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I have several large corporate clients that terminate the employment of people if they just get arrested for domestic violence.

Not charged. Not convicted. Just arrested.

Why does the NFL, another large corporation with massive public exposure, have to play by another set of rules?

Here's a novel idea: don't be in a situation that would get you arrested for domestic violence. Normal wives in normal marriages do not get their husbands arrested for this sort of stuff. Take care of your personal life and realize that it can have an immediate and direct impact on your professional life.

Just like if you were an executive or employee at Exxon or any other Fortune 500 company.

Quit holding the NFL to double standards. That is a precedent that I think needs to be set. Quit coddling men who beat their wives. They do not deserve the PRIVILEGE of playing in the NFL. This is a fundamental flaw in our culture, allowing entertainers to get away with things that the rest of us cannot. Quit worshiping these people. We should have higher standards as a society.
 
Double Barrel said:
yep. In the future, the NFL should come down hard on these a-holes that beat their wives. I mean extreme no-tolerance, because this whole thing deflected from the real villain of the story with the NFL's mishandling of it.

And let's be honest about it: Goodell is not making these decisions by himself. He takes the heat, which he's paid handsomely for it, but the truth is that there are a whole lot of folks at NFL HQ that dropped the ball on this one.

I hope Rice is blacklisted, to be honest. His wife is another sad case of an abused wife putting up with inexcusable behavior because she loves his paycheck....errrr...her husband. I find it pitiful when women put up with these jerks.
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One thing Ray Rice is not is serial abuser....this was a one time incident.

greg Hardy on the other hand, now that's a different story....
 
handswarmer said:
One thing Ray Rice is not is serial abuser....this was a one time incident.
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You don't know that. This may be the first time that he's been busted, but in most cases of domestic abuse, it is an on-going cycle of violence and co-dependence.

It's okay, man. You don't have to defend the guy. He's no longer a Raven.
 
Double Barrel said:
I have several large corporate clients that terminate the employment of people if they just get arrested for domestic violence.

Not charged. Not convicted. Just arrested.

Why does the NFL, another large corporation with massive public exposure, have to play by another set of rules?
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And you like these rules??? Why the hell should we have a court system then based on this playing field. You're suggesting that it should be okay to let cops on sight be the judge and jury on every case all of a sudden which is a contradiction to many arguments you've made as far as people getting equal treatment from the system. Anyone can get arrested or falsely accused especially with the lack of fundamentals of law enforcement that we have in the US currently.

Double Barrel said:
Here's a novel idea: don't be in a situation that would get you arrested for domestic violence. Normal wives in normal marriages do not get their husbands arrested for this sort of stuff. Take care of your personal life and realize that it can have an immediate and direct impact on your professional life.
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Come on man, that is completely unrealistic and you know it. You can't just sit here and say don't be in a situation like that as if people can look through a crystal ball and know what a women is going to act like 5 to 10 years down the road in every situation.



Double Barrel said:
Quit holding the NFL to double standards. That is a precedent that I think needs to be set. Quit coddling men who beat their wives. They do not deserve the PRIVILEGE of playing in the NFL. This is a fundamental flaw in our culture, allowing entertainers to get away with things that the rest of us cannot. Quit worshiping these people. We should have higher standards as a society.
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Don't you even try to suggest that I've been worshipping any of these guys. I'm the one that is consistently telling others not to do that. You're suggesting that these same law enforcement officers that make the news every single day for corruption and mistakes should have the right to determine a player's career all of a sudden all because a video tape showed up behind Ray Rice. You're acting as if it is that simple to just throw away the system of "due process" when there are tons of domestic violence cases that get thrown out all of the time. This isn't some easy issue that you can just demand some sort of zero tolerance policy on without being able to let the facts play out. These are people's careers and lives on the line here.

Duke Lacrosse boys were considered rapists all over the public and then were innocent of all charges. Had they been pro athletes, you'd want a system that would have had them ruined without any real investigation of the facts. Big Ben is already considered a rapist by tons of people and he never raped anyone and was never even charged with a crime. He almost was though, all behind some women that lied and tried to get him in trouble. There are tons of examples man.
 
Joy Diaz, a reporter for NPR affiliate KUT, was waiting to interview with head of the local police union when she was approached by Officer Andrew Petrowski who, unprompted, began ranting about how the Ray Rice fallout was blown out of proportion by the media.

Here’s what Petrowski said to Diaz:

“Now, stop and think about this. I don’t care who you are. You think about the women’s movement today, [women say] ‘Oh, we want to go [into] combat,’ and then, ‘We want equal pay, and we want this.’ You want to go fight in combat and sit in a foxhole? You go right ahead, but a man can’t hit you in public here? Bulls–t! You act like a whore, you get treated like one!”
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“Somebody [who] has that mentality, has no business being a cop,” Austin Police Chief Art Acevedo told Diaz.

And it seems like Petrowski took that to heart. He retired from the force on Friday, December 12th, after learning that KUT was planning on airing his comments.
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Link

That's the definition of self-inflicted.
 
Texecutioner said:
Come on man, that is completely unrealistic and you know it. You can't just sit here and say don't be in a situation like that as if people can look through a crystal ball and know what a women is going to act like 5 to 10 years down the road in every situation.
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I didn't see this when you wrote it. But, give me a ****in' break.

You think it is unrealistic to expect a man to exert some self control and not beat his wife????

My wife could never do anything that would cause me to knock her the **** out.

Pathetic. Nothing else to say, just pathetic.
 
Double Barrel said:
You don't know that. This may be the first time that he's been busted, but in most cases of domestic abuse, it is an on-going cycle of violence and co-dependence.

It's okay, man. You don't have to defend the guy. He's no longer a Raven.
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Not defending the player, defending the man.

We should all be so harsh on ourselves when not in the public light.
 
handswarmer said:
Not defending the player, defending the man.

We should all be so harsh on ourselves when not in the public light.
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Some of us do hold ourselves to higher standards. My grandfather lived over 90 years without laying a hand on his wife of 65+ years. He's the guy that set a standard that I live up to on a daily basis.

I do not expect anyone to be perfect. But, that said, I'm not going to elevate a POS to a higher position that he neither deserves nor earned.
 
Vance87 said:
I wonder if there was anything you could do that would cause her to knock you the **** out...:kitten:
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It is not possible to imagine every conceivable circumstance that would ever be faced. What if knocking her out was the only way to save her life? It's not likely, but you never know. But saying you can't reasonably anticipate anything which would cause you to do this is probably the norm.

My only physical encounters were when I was unconscious. I toss and kick occasionally in my sleep and accidentally bruised my ex a time or two. But that can be treated. Unfortunately the snoring did me in.
 
I'm generally in agreement with DB. The slight difference is I don't think all acts are thought out. Some are reflex. That statement wouldn't even be controversial if we were talking about a story where AJ punched Finnegan and it came out Finnigan spit on him right before it happened.

Not an approval. Just an observation that not every act is thought out.
 
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