BullNation4Life
All Pro
yup cause shorty got no job, shorty about have no car, and shorty gonna have a hard time paying the rent....
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Ray Rice arrested in Atlantic City
- Thread starter texan279
- Start date
yup cause shorty got no job, shorty about have no car, and shorty gonna have a hard time paying the rent....
atomictelephone
Waterboy
Goodell isn't but Tagliabue was.
toronto
Hall of Fame
He isn't. His top VP is.
atomictelephone
Waterboy
So with the new policy in place does this mean Ray Rice will be suited up and in uniform with another NFL team by game 7?
Goodell can only suspend him indefinitely for so long, right?
Goodell can only suspend him indefinitely for so long, right?
toronto
Hall of Fame
No team will pick him up this season. Collusion is in place, not outrage. There is NO DOUBT there is a memo that has been sent to every team that he is not to be signed.
Its sad when I trust TMZ more than the NFL.
BigBull
Rookie
You're right it was his father that was a lawyer. He has a degree in economics.
Sent from the future...
toronto
Hall of Fame
And hence his job is to make his billionaire owners even more rich. That he does a good job at. The problem is he has botched this, as well as other issues so much, that the owners may feel compelled optics-wise to get rid of him.
Playoffs
Hall of Fame
Unless you marry them.
Baltimore Ravens @Ravens
Seems to me the Ravens/NFL are behind the curve at every step...
First they rally to Rice's defense while willfully ignoring known evidence available to them apparently for the asking, and the league passes judgement/levies a light punishment (allegedly) before viewing the video...
And now that the video surfaces as everyone knew it eventually would they swing entirely in the other direction and give Rice a death sentence, with the team announcing today they're willing to help fans erase anything that speaks to ever the existence of Ray Rice.
The violence in the video is shocking and the act/callous behavior despicable, without question. But throwing these people, this marriage, away like trash at this time is in my opinion wrong-headed once again. Now, with everything out in the open, is the opportunity for the right people to mentor this couple into a healthier relationship for the rest of their lives... forget about football.
As for Goodell/NFL, I have little sympathy.
If the NFL really wants to make a statement & get ahead of this, they need to run a police report on all their players. Anyone with domestic violence issues should be brought in for a one on one & enrolled into family & marriage counseling.
BullNation4Life
All Pro
but how far back do you run that report and would there be a statue of limitations on those issues?
could make it case by case basis. I like the idea but then I am sure you are going to run into legalities of this plan.
RazorOye
Ayo
I'd gladly explain why I think someone in the NFL and/or Ravens organization has seen the video (interestingly enough, I'd invoke Occam's razor, too - big fan of it and why it's part of my handle), but I don't know what to make of the Building 7 comment. If it's just some categorical dismissal by way of a 9/11 tinfoil hatted generalization, I'd rather save myself time, DB.
and just to be clear... I'm no truther
edit: and I'll add that I personally think both perspectives are logical and reasonable. Something echoed in this Grantland piece by Andrew Sharp:
What Does it take to get Roger Goodell Fired?
Mr teX
Hall of Fame
You're getting a little to emotional about this...I can believe that the NFL is in spin control behind this whole thing b/c it makes them & Goodell look bad....As DB pointed out however, what's hard for me to believe is them seeing the 2nd video in all its brutality and still only thinking that his actions deserved only a 2 game suspension......
& since we're going full on conspiracy theory, ..the mere fact that this video surfaced when it did (opening weekend of the NFL) when the incident itself happened in mid freaking febuary.......That just screams someone got paid lots of money & was probably in negotiations with many different folks to release it. It also tells me that whomever released it had an agenda of sorts...they waited to see what Rice's suspension actually was & would likely release it if they didn't agree with it. It was also a casino where everything is recorded...why is this the only footage we see of them in the casino? There's already talk that TMZ edited the video... With all of this, it's not that far-fetched to believe that perhaps the NFL nor the Ravens saw the 2nd video...even though they may have half-heartedly tried to get hold of the video from that night.
Also, as Icak pointed out, this video is private property, the casino could've flatly refused to issue it to the NFL.
toronto
Hall of Fame
I have zero emotion on this - and with my profession have the ability to see a bit more than the average fan, so don't assume. I just do not trust the NFL when it comes to issues like this. This is a league that has a long history of attempting to sweep things under the rug, and this represents the latest example. Only difference was the video surfaced, and only when the public and media were predictably outraged, did they suddenly become outraged as well.
Do you believe NFL execs when they discuss concussions? I'm still waiting on the next Jevon Belcher, only the next time it happens, I fear it won't be just a family annihilation.
My building 7 comment was more about people not seeing potential conspiracy about something extremely serious but seeing massive conspiracy about this story. I do not go by labels like 'truther', but rather see inconsistencies in the building 7 story. But, that said, I do not fill in the blanks. I just admit seeing inconsistencies, and I keep my standard distrust of bureaucracy separate from it.
I do not see those types of inconsistencies in this Ray Rice story, but rather see a witch hunt because people do not like Goodell.
Case in point:
His article is titled "What Does It Take to Get Roger Goodell Fired?", which automatically tells me it is biased agenda.
Then, to further elaborate, he starts "I dont know if I believe...", which tells me the rest of the article is going to speculation and connect-the-dots assumptions based on conjecture.
The fact of the matter is that he simply does not KNOW - without a doubt - that the NFL definitely saw the video, but will use this story to advance his agenda.
His opinion is worth no more than anyone on the radio or this forum, as far as I'm concerned. You are welcomed to put more weight than I do, though, but let's all agree it is a choice of perception.
My thoughts, as well. How do we know that the NFL didn't try to get this video? What if TMZ was asking for $500 million or something crazy? Should the NFL pay that kind of money - or any huge amount - to investigate one player?
That sets a really bad precedent that is ultimately bad for the bottom line. You know, the reason the NFL is a business and not a charity.
I just do not ASSUME that the NFL knew all of this and has been actively covering up the entire time. It does not pass the smell test, much less make any logical sense.
And painting with a broad brush because of the concussion issue is jumping off the deep end, IMO. Two completely different issues that have nothing to do with each other.
How about the city of Atlantic City? Are they culpable here in any way? I'm sure Jana may have changed her mind, but is there any reason the city of Atlantic City didn't investigate further & bring charges against Ray Rice?
Personally I don't expect the NFL to conduct a thorough investigation in matters such as these, but I think our gov't should if domestic abuse is the problem we say it is & I have no reason to believe it is not. Too many times the victim is too scared to speak out or press charges. .. too many times the cops say they can't do anything without evidence... well we've got the evidence on this one & it looks like they didn't do their due diligence.
Mr teX
Hall of Fame
The concussion situation is apples and oranges for a variety of reasons..not gonna discuss that with you..I also don't think the NFL tried to sweep the Jevon Belcher thing under the rug either...
In regards to the bolded...sure they do...but so does every multi-million dollar institution...Hell if you're being truthful, them trying to sweep it under the rug is pretty much SOP as far as im concerned. That's sad, but its also why this "outrage" everyone is having about whether or not who knew & did what is really being over done. This isn't a once lifetime thing & noone not even the feminist said much of anything about these kinds of things in the past until now...
This isn't Bernie Madoff swindling baby boomers out of millions in retirement money they worked for decades to accumulate.....
Nor is it a decade plus child sex scandal that happened at one of the most prominent universities in the nation...
It's the domestic violence situation of a mid level star that just happened to be captured on video. That stuff happens everyday and twice on sundays..probably quadruple when athletes are involved.
Yet the media and people who look for opportunities to get their name out there & make money off this stuff are using this run of the mill type situation to further agendas against Goodell and the NFL.
Mr teX
Hall of Fame
That's the thing..people are getting so caught up in trying to place blame on the NFL and Goodell, the prosecutor who supposedly had this 2nd video also..(at least according to TMZ) is escaping unscathed from this. If he supposedlyhad this video from the jump as TMZ alleges he and the NFL did, he should've been able to use it and nail Rice to the wall with it...Instead he just dropped the case.
So that makes 3 different entities: the ravens organization, the NFL and the prosecutor whose response to this situation wasn't appropriate for what the 2nd tape shows. When you look at it from that perspective, it strengthens the case for maybe none of them having seen the 2nd video until yesterday as TMZ alleges.
klockWork
Rookie
Everytime an NFL player gets in trouble with the law it's a reflection to the company as a whole. With the Aaron Hernandez murder case and now this, especially of its graphic nature, the NFL were looking at themselves through the public eyes. And they don't like what they saw, and then asked themselves, "Do we want the public to see this monster?"
THAT is motive to keep this whole thing quiet.
chicagotexan2
Easterby = Little Finger/Cal = Fredo Corleone
A local Mexican restaurant should offer an exchange too. Trade in your ray rice jersey for a free burrito.
gary
Hall of Fame
Maybe I am wrong but perhaps the media went a bit too far with this. Ray's wife did not this video to go this far. Now she is still supporting him more than anyone else right now. Why that is I do not know. He was wrong. His punishment should be decided by the owners, players, and even his wife. The sad part up until now money has bought love it seems. I feel all involved parties should meet and decide whether or not to ban Rice. The public and press might be making matters worse.
RazorOye
Ayo
I'm obviously not making myself clear. I didn't cite his article as fact. I wasn't using his opinion piece as evidence or definitive, incontrovertible proof of knowledge on the part of anyone in the Ravens or the NFL.
I was trying to point out that I believe that someone in the Ravens organization and/or the NFL saw the tape. At the very least, knew of the disturbing nature of the contents. So I have a hard time buying the shock that's rippling across front offices in Baltimore and NFLHQ. And I think that's reasonable. You don't. That's the difference I was trying to highlight. I don't see tinfoil hats in one and place my faith in the other. I'm content accepting either as reasonable until we know more.
And the article I linked to was pretty clearly an opinion piece. So I don't think there was trickery or deception involved in trying to make it sound declarative; his opening paragraphs were - I thought - a pretty clear indication of that.
Occam's Razor? The casino and the NFL both said the NFL didn't try to secure the tape from them.
Curious why both parties would say that if the opposite were true? Particularly if acknowledgment on the part of the NFL might help vindicate them a bit and mitigate some of the damage. Goodell just begrudgingly (and awkwardly) admitted to some knowledge of the tape's existence but indicated there was no pursuit except through law enforcement channels.
We could follow this one down another conspiratorial rabbit hole, I suppose - but one's enough for me in a day
So as we exchange "conspiracies" on lies, I guess there's all sorts of ways to pick and choose when and where we think the NFL is being straightforward.
As I said before, though, I can understand the logic behind your position even if you don't see it in mine.
que sera, sera
You do realize a law was broken right?
gary
Hall of Fame
Isn't that over with? Some kind of punishment he had. Shameful.
EllisUnit
Vote RED!!!
Hell yeah she is supporting him, he will lose MILLIONS, and i'm sure she wants her cut when she does divorce him.....
gary
Hall of Fame
We'll see what happens Ray has an issue in order to do this and go got away with it as far as the law is concerned.
God'ell should be fired over this. He was either A. Lying about whether he saw the tape. (Probably) B. Ran a very inept investigation.
1. God'ell has run inept investigations before. (Bountygate, where Tagliabue had to pull his inept butt out of the fire.)
2. Turning the NFL into somekind of AFL game where he gets to be Kraft/Mara's lackey.
3. Is okay with this type of behavior, but treats the Gordon's/Welker's/Browner's etc... of the world like common criminals and plays favorites to help his favorite team. (Giants/Pats,) see the collusion farce against the Cowboys/Redskins. Speaking of the Redskins God'ell appears to care more about them changing their name than laying down the law against a player that lande a left hook that Joe Frazier would've been proud of hitting a WOMAN.
None of this will matter because Mara/Kraft will carry God"ell's water because the owners are making $$$$ hand over fist while God'ell is letting said owners bastardize the great game I grew up with.
Not that Rog cares about what true football fans like myself and many other on this MB rtc.... think.
1. God'ell has run inept investigations before. (Bountygate, where Tagliabue had to pull his inept butt out of the fire.)
2. Turning the NFL into somekind of AFL game where he gets to be Kraft/Mara's lackey.
3. Is okay with this type of behavior, but treats the Gordon's/Welker's/Browner's etc... of the world like common criminals and plays favorites to help his favorite team. (Giants/Pats,) see the collusion farce against the Cowboys/Redskins. Speaking of the Redskins God'ell appears to care more about them changing their name than laying down the law against a player that lande a left hook that Joe Frazier would've been proud of hitting a WOMAN.
None of this will matter because Mara/Kraft will carry God"ell's water because the owners are making $$$$ hand over fist while God'ell is letting said owners bastardize the great game I grew up with.
Not that Rog cares about what true football fans like myself and many other on this MB rtc.... think.
infantrycak
Hall of Fame
I don't find anything likely in the NFL having the tape before the original suspension. If that's the case then not just Rice had to lie but the NFL, Ravens AND whoever they got the tape from since everyone is currently denying they gave them the tape AND everyone involve had to be stupid enough that no reporter would ever track the tape down when EVERYONE knew one existed and now still nobody is breaking ranks on the story. I'm more cynical than most on the stupidity of people but I'm not buying it. Too many people who are too business savvy and in cases with no reason to trust each other.
Incompetent in not insisting on finding a way to get the tape on something everyone wished had never happened and would go away. Yeah, that I can buy and that is Occam's Razor not the grand conspiracy.
Incompetent in not insisting on finding a way to get the tape on something everyone wished had never happened and would go away. Yeah, that I can buy and that is Occam's Razor not the grand conspiracy.
Can you imagine Rice, Goddell, & Harbaugh smoking cigars watching this video, cutting up?, "Damn Ray... whoooo hoooo. That btch got what she deserved. Don't worry though, we're going to take care of this. No one will ever see this video... dammmmmnnn, rewind that part."
Texan_Bill
Hall of Fame
...................
I think another well-known woman beater should challenge Ray Rice to a fight.... Floyd "Money Maker" Mayweather v. Ray Rice would be a good fight of cowardly men.
eriadoc
Texan-American
Or, put another way, they didn't see the tape because they didn't want to see the tape.
toronto
Hall of Fame
Correct. This is the under the rug exercise. They weren't counting on this coming back to bite them hard.
infantrycak
Hall of Fame
In effect yes.
No. It's human nature to ignore both consciously and subconsciously that which we do not want to see. If you step back from this conversation and think of a million political conversations you have been in you know it's true. Conscious requires the conspiracy which just isn't credible. Subconscious decision to not push the matter gets the same result and a simpler explanation.
CloakNNNdagger
Hall of Fame
The NFL and Goodell just need to keep their traps shut.
Goodell based second Rice suspension on facts the league already had
Goodell based second Rice suspension on facts the league already had
infantrycak
Hall of Fame
How exactly is that possible? They are being hounded by press and they have no 5th amendment rights not to answer. How many people in this thread would accept "no answer"?
The thing that gets me about the "second suspension" is that it came out after the "league policy" which states a 6 game suspension for a first offense... which technically this still is, & a lifetime ban for a second, which Ray Rice has yet to do.
Ray Rice is probably going to fight it, but I hope the teams stand in unity & not pick him up.
I think Rice is going to take the NFL to the cleaners.
Bulls on Parade
2017 Astros: Earn It!
Was a video showing Ray Rice punching his wife, or then fiancee, really necessary? What did people think happened when the first video surfaced of him dragging her seemingly lifeless body out of the elevator? Roger Goodell and the Baltimore Ravens both blew it. They should have done what they did a few days ago "several months" ago after the first video came to fruition.
toronto
Hall of Fame
So will Roger Goodell in his upcoming severance package.
eriadoc
Texan-American
This has been answered, but they thought there might be a chance that Rice was telling the truth when he said his wife assaulted him and he defended himself by pushing her. His story was that the subsequent fall against the handrail is what knocked her out. Of course, that leads to a debate about the appropriate level of defense against a woman that's hitting you, but it's a debate. There's no debate when Rice just cold cocked her.
Regardless, the NFL should have known the real story instead of listening to his. They didn't find out the real story because they didn't really want to. It's clear that the video was available for the NFL to obtain if they really wanted it.
toronto
Hall of Fame
When this is all said, done and forgotten as games resume (like always), my hope is that real attention is applied to the one real issue here - domestic violence. Every marriage or relationship, and man is mine included, goes through good times and bad. But I'll be damned if I even think of striking my wife. Its repugnant and just frigging wrong, forget the legal ramifications.
What's even more wrong to me is how women like her stand by their man, even after being knocked out cold. The mind of a woman that goes back for more is one I can never get. I'd think their survival instincts would take over first, before their addiction to their relationship.
What's even more wrong to me is how women like her stand by their man, even after being knocked out cold. The mind of a woman that goes back for more is one I can never get. I'd think their survival instincts would take over first, before their addiction to their relationship.
I can't remember the specifics, but I remember Goodell being harshly criticized for levying a fine/suspension before any formal charges were even brought against the player.
At the time, it seemed prudent that Goodell would wait to find out if the guy is even guilty to begin with.
I had no idea what happened in that elevator, & though unlikely, there are reasons that Janay could have been knocked clean out without Ray Rice ver doing anything wrong.
At the same time, that was pretty bold of John Harbaugh to back his player the way he did, without having seen that video.
But this is the problem with domestic abuse:
[IMGwidthsize=200]http://photos1.blogger.com/blogger/3745/1997/1600/000008-domestic_abuse.jpg[/IMG]
[IMGwidthsize=200]http://www.newsytype.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/10/Domestic-violence.jpg[/IMG]
[IMGwidthsize=200]http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_nOzO60s0QaE/TSuI8isfbeI/AAAAAAAAADk/y10zaDmaz7I/s1600/domestic_violence8-300x227.jpg[/IMG]
Can't ever find enough evidence to convict.
[IMGwidthsize=200]http://photos1.blogger.com/blogger/3745/1997/1600/000008-domestic_abuse.jpg[/IMG]
[IMGwidthsize=200]http://www.newsytype.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/10/Domestic-violence.jpg[/IMG]
[IMGwidthsize=200]http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_nOzO60s0QaE/TSuI8isfbeI/AAAAAAAAADk/y10zaDmaz7I/s1600/domestic_violence8-300x227.jpg[/IMG]
Can't ever find enough evidence to convict.
I don't think I could close my eyes, much less go to sleep next to a woman I knocked out like that.
I have no idea how that works.
yep, I agree. Incompetence I can buy. Not understanding the explosive nature of this act and subsequent reaction in the fanbase is explainable.
But, multiple people in different places seeing the video and lying in unison? I just don't buy it. Someone somewhere would leak it that it had been seen.
And there is still no plausible explanation from the witch hunters on why the NFL - a global multi-billion dollar empire - would see such a video and purposefully hide a wife beater? That makes no sense and is something that I think is being completely ignored in trying to present a logical theory.
I'm no fan of Goodell, but I think there is a herd mentality on piling on right now. Seems like years of grievances toward the man is culminating in spite and vengeance.
I will never understand it. Honestly, I lose respect for any woman that takes a beating and then returns to the wife-beater. And even worse for a woman that let's a man beat her child and stays with him.
kingtexan
All Pro
The fact he could sit there and lie like that on CBS should cost him his job.
He first learned about it when he got to his office and his staff told him?
Bullshit. He is gone, or at least should be.
Mr teX
Hall of Fame
you're forgetting how all this unfolded. If i recall, the 1st video only showed him dragging her out of the elevator...that's it. Now If you saw only the video and read or saw nothing else..which is how i initially came across it, there was at least 1 other plausible scenario of what could've happened in there...drawing off my experiences with girls and close friends in my younger days she could've been stone cold drunk and/or passed out....You factor in his previously sterling rep of being a good guy with no infractions....easy to come to that alternative conclusion.
I know at least 1 other person on this forum related to me in this thread about my initial reaction of her being drunk.
I took it to mean that the first he learned about the second tape's release was when he arrived at the office.
They clearly knew that an elevator tape existed prior to its release. But, since it was evidence in a grand jury investigation, they were unable to legally obtain a copy.
BullNation4Life
All Pro
her ball are bigger than most men....
Having a woman as the commish and then a player be involved in domestic violence....
damn, hell hath no fury....