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Your interest in Texans' 2014 draft

badboy

Hall of Fame
I am always pumped for Texans choices and do many mocks, individually and with my two partners Beerlover and Rmartin 65. Has the roster & management changes, 2013 record, the depth of this draft or anything else impacted or changed your usual opinions on draft?

I long for the future day when we can draft best player each round but that may be some time. The roster & coaching changes has really ramped up my interest if that is possible.
 
Love ya brother but when it comes to the draft, meh....... :yawn:

I have all sorts of theories and ideologies but at the end of the day, it means nothing. OR MORE IMPORTANTLY what it is that I think would improve this team, means nothing...

Whether or not the Texans draft who I want the bottom line is that I'll be at all 10 games this season.
 
Love ya brother but when it comes to the draft, meh....... :yawn:

I have all sorts of theories and ideologies but at the end of the day, it means nothing. OR MORE IMPORTANTLY what it is that I think would improve this team, means nothing...

Whether or not the Texans draft who I want the bottom line is that I'll be at all 10 games this season.
your theories & ideologies could be important Bill. Your comments can make me think & change opinions or lead to more research. I wished you would put more here about your thoughts on team draft. :clap:
 
Love ya brother but when it comes to the draft, meh....... :yawn:

I have all sorts of theories and ideologies but at the end of the day, it means nothing. OR MORE IMPORTANTLY what it is that I think would improve this team, means nothing...

Whether or not the Texans draft who I want the bottom line is that I'll be at all 10 games this season.

True

But you must have some favorites that you would like to see drafted and it's frustrating to see the Texans org pass on them and see them turn into successful players on other teams. (See: A.Jeffery/J.Houston)
 
Lots of moving parts to draft day and lots of changes in the off season already. To me this draft has lots of intrigue because you had ideas last year, but it's really all over the place and a deep draft.

Biggest question of course is what does this staff do long term at qb? Bridgewater has a high floor, but you wonder about the ceiling. I have him somewhere between Matt Ryan and Russell Wilson.

Bortles has the size you want and possibly highest ceiling. Maybe a more athletic Big Ben.

Manziel is a gamble. Guy can be lightening in a bottle, but can it translate to the NFL?

Quite a pack lurking behind, questions about are the so called top there that much better?
 
I'm always interested in the draft, because I know it's a pretty big building block towards the success/failure of this team. But I can't follow college football. By nature, when I get into something, I get all in & college football... there's just way too much.


I long for the future day when we can draft best player each round but that may be some time. The roster & coaching changes has really ramped up my interest if that is possible.

I don't know what to think. The Patriots have got their way of approaching the draft that leaves a lot of people scratching their heads. Guys fit their program & guys don't fit their program & sometimes those guys... like I said, are real head scratchers.
 
I am always pumped for Texans choices and do many mocks, individually and with my two partners Beerlover and Rmartin 65. Has the roster & management changes, 2013 record, the depth of this draft or anything else impacted or changed your usual opinions on draft?

I long for the future day when we can draft best player each round but that may be some time. The roster & coaching changes has really ramped up my interest if that is possible.
I'm extremely interested in the 2014 draft, just like every other year. I'm a big proponent of BPA, but not naïve enough to think that actually happens, except rarely.

I think the roster changes are exacerbated by the new labor agreement. The coaches can't spend enough time actually learning the current players to know the positions that actually need to improve. I see this as a flaw in the current labor agreement and it needs to be addressed. Especially with new HC's.
 
I'm always interested in the draft, because I know it's a pretty big building block towards the success/failure of this team. But I can't follow college football. By nature, when I get into something, I get all in & college football... there's just way too much.




I don't know what to think. The Patriots have got their way of approaching the draft that leaves a lot of people scratching their heads. Guys fit their program & guys don't fit their program & sometimes those guys... like I said, are real head scratchers.
The Patriots have as many misses as hits under BB. He's no more of a guru than anyone else. So much of drafting a player is gut instinct.
 
I could easily be wrong but I don't remember as much discrepancy in evaluation of top 10-12 players as this year. Players always move around and 2-3 really drop surprisingly and of course there is often one guy taken way above where most predicted (Dallas last year and Oakland in past).
 
I could easily be wrong but I don't remember as much discrepancy in evaluation of top 10-12 players as this year. Players always move around and 2-3 really drop surprisingly and of course there is often one guy taken way above where most predicted (Dallas last year and Oakland in past).
This is also a very deep draft, as far as talent goes. Probably as deep as we've ever seen. Any number of players could be taken at any number of draft spots, depending on how a particular team views a particular player.
 
Lots of moving parts to draft day and lots of changes in the off season already. To me this draft has lots of intrigue because you had ideas last year, but it's really all over the place and a deep draft.

Biggest question of course is what does this staff do long term at qb? Bridgewater has a high floor, but you wonder about the ceiling. I have him somewhere between Matt Ryan and Russell Wilson.

Bortles has the size you want and possibly highest ceiling. Maybe a more athletic Big Ben.

Manziel is a gamble. Guy can be lightening in a bottle, but can it translate to the NFL?

Quite a pack lurking behind, questions about are the so called top there that much better?

Bridgewater's upside = Matt Schaub/ Downside = Christian Ponder

Bortles upside = Roethlisberger/Rivers/ Downside = Sanchez

Maziel upside = Steve Young/Theismann Downside = Bubby Brister/Alex Smith
 
The Patriots have as many misses as hits under BB. He's no more of a guru than anyone else. So much of drafting a player is gut instinct.

I think they have more misses than "normal" & I think it's because of the way they go about setting up their board. "We" like to believe that there's somewhat of a consensus as to player rankings. Right now, our "good boy" policy drives people up the wall.

Well I don't think anyone knows what it takes to qualify for the Patriots list.
 
Bridgewater's upside = Matt Schaub/ Downside = Christian Ponder

Bortles upside = Roethlisberger/Rivers/ Downside = Sanchez

Maziel upside = Steve Young/Theismann Downside = Bubby Brister/Alex Smith
You're awful optimistic about Manziel. His downside is much, much greater than Brister/Smith. Think JaMarcus Russel/Akili Smithy/Ryan Leaf.

Upside would be Young/Tarkington

Except smaller and possibly more fragile.

The interesting part for me ( and it would be much better if it was another team) is how much stock do you put in upside/downside.
 
This is also a very deep draft, as far as talent goes. Probably as deep as we've ever seen. Any number of players could be taken at any number of draft spots, depending on how a particular team views a particular player.
Agreed. I can happily find good players deep into 6th round. A trade down or two in first and the possibility of other trades in other rounds looks very good. We should be able to resolve key needs and also depth with our 11 selections
 
Having the 1.1 is the least interesting draft position for me. Basically, the Texans are going to be forced into taking a guy that they don't really want because the single worse place to trade down from in the entire draft is pick 1.1 in a year with no clear overall number 1 pick.

We have been talking the same tired handful of players since around Halloween. My interest starts at pick 2.1 ( unless the less than 10% chance of a trade down happens). in short, the Texans can't declare (or make silly obvious) who the number 1 pick is and bleeping move on.
 
Wait, someone used Theisman as a positive example of an upside?

Damn, thought I'd have lived a little longer before having heard everything.
 
We have been talking the same tired handful of players since around Halloween. My interest starts at pick 2.1 ( unless the less than 10% chance of a trade down happens). in short, the Texans can't declare (or make silly obvious) who the number 1 pick is and bleeping move on.

I believe our chances of trading the #1 pick would go up if St. Louis wasn't so tight lipped. We need the media to start generating some buzz so other teams can start thinking about leap frogging them.
 
You're awful optimistic about Manziel. His downside is much, much greater than Brister/Smith. Think JaMarcus Russel/Akili Smithy/Ryan Leaf.

Upside would be Young/Tarkington

Except smaller and possibly more fragile.

The interesting part for me ( and it would be much better if it was another team) is how much stock do you put in upside/downside.
In considering upside/downside one must also consider percentage of each happening. For example, IMO there is less chance of JM busting so while there could be downside it is less risky for me. That is why I finally came around to him.
 
In considering upside/downside one must also consider percentage of each happening. For example, IMO there is less chance of JM busting so while there could be downside it is less risky for me. That is why I finally came around to him.
You should be drug tested. Often. As in hourly.
 
or you and I could debate? (Manziel not my drug testing)
Yes we could debate Manziel. Drug testing to be debated later. LOL

Manzeil is a college phenom and there have been many more college phenom's fail at the NFL level than make it. At the NFL level, every single player is faster, smarter and stronger than the average player a college player faces every week. Too many college phenoms have proven to be NFL busts for me to feel very comfortable with naming Manziel a sure thing, or even a good bet, in the NFL. His downside is as out of this world as his upside is, which makes him a no-go for me.
 
I believe our chances of trading the #1 pick would go up if St. Louis wasn't so tight lipped. We need the media to start generating some buzz so other teams can start thinking about leap frogging them.

The last trade down from the overall number 1 was 10 years ago and was basically forced by a dude with real life family pull. it really does not matter what the Rams or the media does. If the Texans get to move out of that spot, it is good fortune and probably taking less than history and the value chart says that it should.
 
or you and I could debate? (Manziel not my drug testing)

I don't like that Manziel only played two years in college. I like to see 4 years, but I'm ok with 3 years. I'd feel better about a guy's ability to consistently play at a high level after three years of solid play.

A big part of that is expectations change over time & most people tend to try to be that guy they were, or try to recreate whatever magic they had before, while trying to live up to those expectations.

But JFF set the bar pretty high pretty quick as a redshirt freshman & he at least met the expectations people had of him.

Then in John Gruden's Football Camp, he was trying to explain something (I never could figure it out) but he started about never winning a highschool championship, then never winning a NCAAF championship... So I'm wondering, if it's important to him to win a Championship, why didn't he go back for his Jr year?

I'm sure A&M would have been in the conversation, at least before the season started, if he had decided to go back to A&M.
 
Yes we could debate Manziel. Drug testing to be debated later. LOL

Manzeil is a college phenom and there have been many more college phenom's fail at the NFL level than make it. At the NFL level, every single player is faster, smarter and stronger than the average player a college player faces every week. Too many college phenoms have proven to be NFL busts for me to feel very comfortable with naming Manziel a sure thing, or even a good bet, in the NFL. His downside is as out of this world as his upside is, which makes him a no-go for me.
and probably every single Texans' player will be better than what JM had at A&M. I try not to focus too much when comparing a college player to a pro. rather I observe skill set and decide if it translates. People comparing Manziel to Tebow make me chuckle.
 
I kind of have some guys I want the team to draft but if they don't do what I want I don't really care. I really don't follow it in the kind of detail that many here do so I'm more likely to wait and see who they took, then go do some research on those guys and decide after the fact whether to get excited about what's coming up or not.

I used to spend more time looking at the college prospects but I've been drifting away from NCAA ball for some time and rarely watch more than a few games a year now. I also don't get as fired up over the draft. When they did it on the weekend and had three picks on the first day it was kind of a big deal to me. As they've spread it out over three days and moved it into Friday and then Thursday (if I am remember thing correctly) I've stopped making a big deal out of it. I'm not sure what they were trying to accomplish by doing that. One day of picks 1-3 is like a BBQ-Draft watching party to me. One week night waiting on a single pick isn't really worth my time. I'll wait until it's over and just check the list. To my mind they broke the draft trying to turn it into a TV special to sell advertising through.
 
I don't like that Manziel only played two years in college. I like to see 4 years, but I'm ok with 3 years. I'd feel better about a guy's ability to consistently play at a high level after three years of solid play.

A big part of that is expectations change over time & most people tend to try to be that guy they were, or try to recreate whatever magic they had before, while trying to live up to those expectations.

But JFF set the bar pretty high pretty quick as a redshirt freshman & he at least met the expectations people had of him.

Then in John Gruden's Football Camp, he was trying to explain something (I never could figure it out) but he started about never winning a highschool championship, then never winning a NCAAF championship... So I'm wondering, if it's important to him to win a Championship, why didn't he go back for his Jr year?

I'm sure A&M would have been in the conversation, at least before the season started, if he had decided to go back to A&M.
usually I like to see a player stay in college football or basketball but I think each of these QBs would do better under O'Brien than their college coach. Of course $ is a powerful factor and would be for me also. You could say the same for Jameis Winston if he comes out next year.
 
I kind of have some guys I want the team to draft but if they don't do what I want I don't really care. I really don't follow it in the kind of detail that many here do so I'm more likely to wait and see who they took, then go do some research on those guys and decide after the fact whether to get excited about what's coming up or not.

I used to spend more time looking at the college prospects but I've been drifting away from NCAA ball for some time and rarely watch more than a few games a year now. I also don't get as fired up over the draft. When they did it on the weekend and had three picks on the first day it was kind of a big deal to me. As they've spread it out over three days and moved it into Friday and then Thursday (if I am remember thing correctly) I've stopped making a big deal out of it. I'm not sure what they were trying to accomplish by doing that. One day of picks 1-3 is like a BBQ-Draft watching party to me. One week night waiting on a single pick isn't really worth my time. I'll wait until it's over and just check the list. To my mind they broke the draft trying to turn it into a TV special to sell advertising through.
I've gone the other way and watch probably 3-4 times college than I use to. The 3 day draft I understand you but the possibility of trades still hooks me for round one and who picks who adds to excitement for players falling to me ..er Texans.
NFL went to three days as interest keeps climbing and old man money keeps rollin, rollin along.
 
I think they have more misses than "normal" & I think it's because of the way they go about setting up their board. "We" like to believe that there's somewhat of a consensus as to player rankings. Right now, our "good boy" policy drives people up the wall.

Well I don't think anyone knows what it takes to qualify for the Patriots list.
Perhaps this article will provide a little insight...
1. Building a team, not collecting talent. "That's one of his favorite sayings. By that he means putting players in the right role, how they can contribute to the team, and defining that role."

2. Never fall in love with one player. "Bill is very analytical. Bill is all about not falling in love with a player. Bill is looking at value. He wants the correct definition of the player and the correct value of the player. When he determines that, then he understands where he can move around in the draft [with trades]. ... His whole approach is value -- 'if I trade down, I get better value.' But the key component as to why he's traded down all these years was the rising cost of rookie draft picks. He did not want to bring somebody into his locker room that was going to be in the top 5 payroll of his team."

3. Small draft room. "He's one of the best listeners that I've ever been around. The draft room will be very small. ... It will only be four people. Belichick's big thing is that he's not looking for more opinions, he's looking for right opinions. The scouts do their job, which is prepare him for the draft, then ... there is only one decision-maker in New England. He doesn't want any confusion on draft day."

4. Trade reputation is well-known. "People know it's one-stop shopping. All you have to do is make a phone call to him and he's easy to make a trade with. He's very good at sensing what is going to happen. I would say around the 15th pick in the draft this year, he'll have an idea of what player he's going to get, and if he'll have to move."
 
Next you'll be telling us Dilfer is a positive outcome example.

Old time Cowgirls hater fan?

I respect the hate that we share for the Redskins.

Check out Theisman's career at Pro football reference. Much better than Dilfer
 
In considering upside/downside one must also consider percentage of each happening. For example, IMO there is less chance of JM busting so while there could be downside it is less risky for me. That is why I finally came around to him.

Manziel has less chance of busting in comparison to who?

IMO, Manziel might have the highest bust potential in this entire draft. He also might have the most potential. He's an absolute wildcard.
 
2014 is indeed a very deep draft. Personally, I would like the Texans draft Clowney and take Garopollo with the 33rd pick.
 
I kind of have some guys I want the team to draft but if they don't do what I want I don't really care. I really don't follow it in the kind of detail that many here do so I'm more likely to wait and see who they took, then go do some research on those guys and decide after the fact whether to get excited about what's coming up or not.

I used to spend more time looking at the college prospects but I've been drifting away from NCAA ball for some time and rarely watch more than a few games a year now. I also don't get as fired up over the draft. When they did it on the weekend and had three picks on the first day it was kind of a big deal to me. As they've spread it out over three days and moved it into Friday and then Thursday (if I am remember thing correctly) I've stopped making a big deal out of it. I'm not sure what they were trying to accomplish by doing that. One day of picks 1-3 is like a BBQ-Draft watching party to me. One week night waiting on a single pick isn't really worth my time. I'll wait until it's over and just check the list. To my mind they broke the draft trying to turn it into a TV special to sell advertising through.
I could have posted this exact same train of thought; especially the part about going away from the original 1-3 picks on one day and the rest of the draft on the second day. I absolutely HATE the new format. Like Herv, I refuse to blow a whole evening watching each team make one damned pick on the first day. (MSR by the way)
Not when there's an app for that. :)

Seriously, put it back the way it was Roger; damn you.:foottap:

I'm beginning to suspect that its the networks who are actually running the NFL.
 
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I'm normally pretty interested in the draft, but I'm having trouble getting into it this year.

Part of this is that my life is much busier, so I don't have time to read about players as much as I used to.

Part of it is the draft timing - Coming a week into May just feels really really late, and the offseason seems to be taking forever. Why are they waiting so long? It's killed my enthusiasm more than it's helped it.

Part of it is that I am feeling more and more depressed about the Texans. I wrote a post about this somewhere a while back so I won't rehash the whole thing here, but it seems the team must be planning a big rebuilding effort, and yet the lack of any signifiant free agency moves, or much else that shows the team has a plan in place to really improve, worries me. I feel we're losing ground this offseason instead of gaining.

Part of it is that I'm more depressed than excited about the opportunities for the #1 pick. Normally there's some excitement to see who will be available at our pick, whether we might move up or down, etc. This year, we are likely stuck at #1 (or will get a less-than-great deal), and none of the likely picks excite me as a #1 overall pick. As I said, I haven't had time to look at others players much at all, so I have little sense of what things look like for our later round options.

Probably my interest will pick up again over the next 4 weeks, but for the moment, it's way lower than usual.
 
My interest in the draft has slowing declined after the Mario/Bush/Young debate. I knew it didn't matter who I wanted - I wanted Young - sue me! I felt that the fans couldn't be as wrong as the Texans made them seem. Fans wanted either Bush or Young. Sure there was a microscopic portion that wanted someone else but the vast majority were locked into one of those 2 players. Even as bad as Young's career ended up, I still feel he'd have made a bigger positive impact on the team than Mario. It also just really dawned on me just how much time I spent watching college players "scouting" them for my team. I still watch enough to not be completely lost but won't "scout" or dissect games.

Now fast forward to 2014. Looks like we are in a similar situation to 2006. Clowney as Mario (defensive physical specimen), Manziel as Young (local college phenom) & Bortles/Bridgewater as Bush (talented but with question marks). This board is divided at least among 4 large camps and there's way more "other" camps than in 2006. When the 1st pick is finally announced it will be booed by 1/2 the fans. That's what will be shown on ESPN over and over. This will be really ugly. Mark my words.

Also - I'm with Herv. The draft was an "event" when rounds 1-3 were on the first day. Even the second day's picks went so fast it made it interesting. Now I'll watch around the time the Texans are supposed to pick if I watch at all.
 
What's the over/under on the number of times they go to commercial when the Texans pick?

I was wondering how they were going to pull that off, when we've got the first pick. Then it dawned on me that they should have plenty of practice... third time in 12 years that we had the #1 pick.
 
I kind of have some guys I want the team to draft but if they don't do what I want I don't really care. I really don't follow it in the kind of detail that many here do so I'm more likely to wait and see who they took, then go do some research on those guys and decide after the fact whether to get excited about what's coming up or not.

I used to spend more time looking at the college prospects but I've been drifting away from NCAA ball for some time and rarely watch more than a few games a year now. I also don't get as fired up over the draft. When they did it on the weekend and had three picks on the first day it was kind of a big deal to me. As they've spread it out over three days and moved it into Friday and then Thursday (if I am remember thing correctly) I've stopped making a big deal out of it. I'm not sure what they were trying to accomplish by doing that. One day of picks 1-3 is like a BBQ-Draft watching party to me. One week night waiting on a single pick isn't really worth my time. I'll wait until it's over and just check the list. To my mind they broke the draft trying to turn it into a TV special to sell advertising through.

MSR

We have had a crawfish boil on the last Saturday in April for a decade. Before that draft days were changed we could stand around, have a few beers/eat crawfish and talk about who the Texans had draft or who we hoped they would draft. People planned their last weekend in April around the crawfish boil. Then God'ell changed the draft to a 3 day event and that made the draft talk at the crawfish boil anti climatic.

Now God'ell has changed the draft to May 10th and who knows how the party will turn out. I do believe God'ell is the worst thing that could've ever happened to the NFL. His liberal stances on to hard of hits, defenseless WR's, he** RB's cant even lower their heads now, removing kickoffs from game etc... Now God'ell has decide to mess with the very successful model that Tags left him by moving the draft. One day he's going to lose the diehard fans htat he takes for granted now. When that happens and the game is in trouble the owners will all be asking how they let God'ell kill the golden goose. When in truth the Kraft/Mara/Jones/McNairs of the world will have nobody to blame but themselves.

The killing of the game is already happening all in the name of ego/power/$$$$/greed. In a way I hope the death of the NFL is quick and painfl, the owners/God'ell deserve what they get.
 
This off season has not been as bad as I feared it was going to be, '06 will probably always be the worst; but that may be a function more of how little time I spend on the board these days. My interest is also lessened by the draft being over 3 days. Hate the now format.
 

Got him for ya.

I kind of have some guys I want the team to draft but if they don't do what I want I don't really care. I really don't follow it in the kind of detail that many here do so I'm more likely to wait and see who they took, then go do some research on those guys and decide after the fact whether to get excited about what's coming up or not.

I used to spend more time looking at the college prospects but I've been drifting away from NCAA ball for some time and rarely watch more than a few games a year now. I also don't get as fired up over the draft. When they did it on the weekend and had three picks on the first day it was kind of a big deal to me. As they've spread it out over three days and moved it into Friday and then Thursday (if I am remember thing correctly) I've stopped making a big deal out of it. I'm not sure what they were trying to accomplish by doing that. One day of picks 1-3 is like a BBQ-Draft watching party to me. One week night waiting on a single pick isn't really worth my time. I'll wait until it's over and just check the list. To my mind they broke the draft trying to turn it into a TV special to sell advertising through.

This is almost where I am. I still look forward to it...and I will be watching every Texans pick...but it's less important to me then it used to be. I used to feel like it was my own personal holliday weekend. I guess watching countless years of busted picks...and rarely seeing the Texans select who I want them to pick has taken its toll. Re-visiting some of the early Texans drafts (Casserley era) is about the worst. Why was it so important to me when it clearley wasnt to the team's gm? I will be watching and I want to be excited about it...but i'm just not.
 
Of course it would be great to have the Draft of 2012 with Luck and RGIII, but we could have had last years "talent" where an OLT who's not rated among this years top 3 players at his position went #1 overall. And make no mistake, we are in the catbirdes seat with the #1 as long as we don't have unreasonable expectations about the value of our pick.
And oh yea, I'm totally into the Draft !
 
MSR
His liberal stances on to hard of hits, defenseless WR's, he** RB's cant even lower their heads now, removing kickoffs from game etc...



How big a part did all the lawsuits and outcry from concussions have to do with this?
 
I love the draft. It's like Christmas.

I love doing some research to get a feel for where guys are going to go and I love trying to figure out what steps we're going to take to improve our team.

With the regime change, there are a lot more questions this year than there are normally. With Kubiak, I knew what sorts of players he was looking for on offense although I never could tell what sort of defensive players they were going to be looking for. And for all the research I'd put into things, they always found a way to draft guys I didn't expect.

With the OB/RAC offense/defense, I have no idea what's going to happen. In a way, that's very scary and in another way, that's very exciting.

With 11 picks, I'm hoping we upgrade our roster. And I'm hoping that the other teams in our division make mistakes.
 
Manziel has less chance of busting in comparison to who?

IMO, Manziel might have the highest bust potential in this entire draft. He also might have the most potential. He's an absolute wildcard.
Did you miss the part where I said I don't like to compare college players to NFL guys? IMO, Manziel has low bust factor. I am only concerned about his running & I think Gruden really got his attention in his critique.

Bold, you can say exact same about Bridgewater, Bortles or Clowney. Safest pick Watkins or Mosley.
 
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