Potential reasons for not drafting a FS

[Ole Miss Texan]

You on the otherhand would be fine with 7-9,9-7. As long as the right kind of guys are playing on the team.

I don't think adding good human beings on this team necessarily means we will always be a .500 ball club.

Let's look at some of the "good guys" we have on this team and relate it league-wide:

QB: Matt Schaub - One the top at his position in the league.
WR: Andre Johnson - THE best WR in the entire NFL.
TE: Owen Daniels - One the top at his position in the league.
DE: Mario Williams - One of the top 4-3 DE's in the league.
MLB: Demeco Ryans - Arguably the best 4-3 MLB in the league.
SLB: Brian Cushing - Arguably the best overall LB in the league.

I say keep up the good work. Continue building this team with All-Pro calibre talent. We still have a lot of positions to upgrade but we have 6 of 22 starters that are near the best at their position.... and they happen to be quality individuals and not thugs.

 

[Carr Bombed]

I don't think adding good human beings on this team necessarily means we will always be a .500 ball club.

Let's look at some of the "good guys" we have on this team and relate it league-wide:

QB: Matt Schaub - One the top at his position in the league.
WR: Andre Johnson - THE best WR in the entire NFL.
TE: Owen Daniels - One the top at his position in the league.
DE: Mario Williams - One of the top 4-3 DE's in the league.
MLB: Demeco Ryans - Arguably the best 4-3 MLB in the league.
SLB: Brian Cushing - Arguably the best overall LB in the league.

I say keep up the good work. Continue building this team with All-Pro calibre talent. We still have a lot of positions to upgrade but we have 6 of 22 starters that are near the best at their position.... and they happen to be quality individuals and not thugs.

I have no problem with adding good guys as long as they're football players and we have plenty of "good" football players on this team. It's the crappy ones that I can do without, Myers is not a starting caliber center on a team that wishes to make the playoffs.

 

[CloakNNNdagger]

It's not just the 3-4 tackles we face.... We also face Haloti Ngata and Terrence Cody....as well as our old friend Albert Haynesworth. Yep, we'll be seeing the Raggedy Andy act again.

With all the big NT/DTs that we'll be facing this season, Meyers may shortly be recognizable on the sideline as the one wearing a Wounded Warrior Project tee shirt. Hence, a universal solution by default.

 

[Ole Miss Texan]

We got our asses handed to us in the home opener, mainly because Myers couldn't maintain Kris Jenkins. (the reason why we NEEDED a tie breaker). We struggled to run the ball all year, mainly because Myers and the interior line couldn't open up holes and that cost us alot more games. How many times were we turned away on the goal line and in short yardage situations?

Also lets not act like last year's schedule wasn't easy and ALOT easier than this one will be.

I'll be the first to say that I was not happy with out depth on the OL last offseason. I LOVE that we have Cushing - best possible pick in the world... but there were a few of us that threw out the idea of draft Michael Oher. Could play 4 of the 5 positions on the OL. In case of injury to any player, we'd have the flexibility to fill that spot. '08 was good because we had the same OL every game, that doesn't happen every year. So I am completely on board in beefing up this OL. Wade Smith and Shelley Smith are progress, but they're probabaly not the longterm answer. Smith will start of Studdard, Caldwell/Brisiel will start at RG - and while Myers isn't a super duper C, I think he'll be fine with better talent and more seasoned players on either side. I don't know that we could necessarily upgrade him RIGHT NOW unless its with Smith or Caldwell.

 

[Lucky]

That being said, it doesn't change the fact that Schaub layed 16 games last season and was hit relatively few times- in comparison with other NFL Qbs.

There was a stat floating around after the season that had Shaub among the most hit QBs. It may have been posted on either Texan Chick's or McClain's blog at the Chronic. There was debate regarding how much this was due to the o-line, how much due to the lack of a running game, and if Schaub holding on to the ball looking to make a play was a factor.

Look, even Kubiak admitted in an offseason interview that the interior line play needed to improve. What he didn't say was how that would be accomplished. Wade Smith was signed. Caldwell is a year older. Briesel is returning. Maybe he feels that will do the trick? Who really knows if Myers will be the starter on opening day? No need to get panties in a wad before we actually know what will happen.

What does this have to do with a FS? This thread is too long to find out how/when/where it became diverted.

 

[dalemurphy]

I'm blaming Chris Myers more than the organization and I guess you could say I'm blaming Kubiak for believing that Myers is "the guy" after clearly seeing he's not. To be fair though, they did draft Caldwell and signed Wade Smith, but they should be more proactive at filling the biggest hole on the offensive side of the ball (and yes, that was even before we drafted Tate), especially when that hole directly effects the health of your QB.

Look I know this is the NFL and players get hurt, that's just stating the obvious, but you can also do things to lower the risk that your players will get hurt and asking your QB who has a history of getting hurt to lineup behind the weakest center in the league for a 3rd straight year is NOT LOWERING ANY RISK TO HIS HEALTH

Also don't give the line too much credit for those low sack #s....Schaub does a fantastic job of giving rid of the ball and Kubiak also does a good job at moving his release platform. He moves him around and doesn't keep him throwing from the same spot.

If you were an Indy fan, how much would you be complaining about Bill Polian's refusal to upgrade their OLine. After all, it is a very pedestrian line and only Peyton's ability to get rid of the ball keep his sack total so low.

Pouncey was the only highly regarded center in the draft and he was selected before our pick. It's perfectly reasonable to suggest that Shelly Smith could be the 2nd best center selected in the draft (who knows). Wade Smith was probably the highest rated free agent interior lineman. That seems like a pretty good effort to me, especially considering the Caldwell pick last season. What would you have done?

 

[Carr Bombed]

What does this have to do with a FS? This thread is too long to find out how/when/where it became diverted.

LOL, it must suck being a mod during the offseason.

 

[dalemurphy]

We got our asses handed to us in the home opener, mainly because Myers couldn't maintain Kris Jenkins. (the reason why we NEEDED a tie breaker). We struggled to run the ball all year, mainly because Myers and the interior line couldn't open up holes and that cost us alot more games. How many times were we turned away on the goal line and in short yardage situations? How many times have we watched this team struggle in the redzone over the years, because we couldn't move people around when it mattered?

Also lets not act like last year's schedule wasn't easy and ALOT easier than this one will be.

The running game needs to improve. The interior line struggled. There is reason to expect/hope for improvement this year. All success/failure doesn't rest entirely on Chris Myers. That's just silly! We have 5 centers on the roster right now and most of them are under 30 with some athletic ability: Myers, W.Smith, S.Smith, Caldwell, C.White... As Lucky said, it doesn't seem like time to freak out.

 

[dalemurphy]

There was a stat floating around after the season that had Shaub among the most hit QBs. It may have been posted on either Texan Chick's or McClain's blog at the Chronic. There was debate regarding how much this was due to the o-line, how much due to the lack of a running game, and if Schaub holding on to the ball looking to make a play was a factor.

Look, even Kubiak admitted in an offseason interview that the interior line play needed to improve. What he didn't say was how that would be accomplished. Wade Smith was signed. Caldwell is a year older. Briesel is returning. Maybe he feels that will do the trick? Who really knows if Myers will be the starter on opening day? No need to get panties in a wad before we actually know what will happen.

What does this have to do with a FS? This thread is too long to find out how/when/where it became diverted.

If I recall, the stat was simply number of times hit. Relative to passing attempts, he wasn't hit that often.

Regarding FS: According to SteelbTexan, even if Troy Nolan turns into Ronnie Lott, it still won't help us make the playoffs if Chris Myers is on the team.

 

[Carr Bombed]

If you were an Indy fan, how much would you be complaining about Bill Polian's refusal to upgrade their OLine. After all, it is a very pedestrian line and only Peyton's ability to get rid of the ball keep his sack total so low.

Pouncey was the only highly regarded center in the draft and he was selected before our pick. It's perfectly reasonable to suggest that Shelly Smith could be the 2nd best center selected in the draft (who knows). Wade Smith was probably the highest rated free agent interior lineman. That seems like a pretty good effort to me, especially considering the Caldwell pick last season. What would you have done?

If I was a Indy fan, I'm not complaining anything about Bill Polian, because Bill Polian has constructed a roster that has won more games this past decade then any other team.....a team that has pretty much won ever divisional title since the AFC South's inception, a team that has had 8 consecutive playoff appearances, and a team that has been to two SBs, while winning one.

I don't see any comparison between the Colts and the Texans....and you do realize that Bill Polian has drafted alot of interior lineman over the years and Jeff Saturday has been one of the best centers in the league.

Also I wasn't upset with not getting Pouncy this year, I was more upset with not drafting Max Unger last season, who flourished in Oregon's zone blocking scheme (the same system we run here) and who is now the starting center of the Seahawks.

 

[Carr Bombed]

The running game needs to improve. The interior line struggled. There is reason to expect/hope for improvement this year. All success/failure doesn't rest entirely on Chris Myers. That's just silly! We have 5 centers on the roster right now and most of them are under 30 with some athletic ability: Myers, W.Smith, S.Smith, Caldwell, C.White... As Lucky said, it doesn't seem like time to freak out.

I have no problem with placing most of the blame at the feet of Myers....he's the one who consistently gets owned on the field and I'm not just talking about getting beat, but embarrassed. Your center should be the anchor of the interior line and he can't even hold the point of attack.

I don't think we have 5 centers on the team...that's nieve at best. They played Caldwell at guard last season so they might see his future there. Same thing with W. Smith...I think they also see him playing guard for them. C. White is okay, but he isn't a starter either...great depth who can play multiple positions. We don't even know enough about S. Smith to call him a viable option.

 

[dalemurphy]

If I was a Indy fan, I'm not complaining anything about Bill Polian, because Bill Polian has constructed a roster that has won more games this past decade then any other team.....a team that has pretty much won ever divisional title since the AFC South's inception, a team that has had 8 consecutive playoff appearances, and a team that has been to two SBs, while winning one.

I don't see any comparison between the Colts and the Texans....and you do realize that Bill Polian has drafted alot of interior lineman over the years and Jeff Saturday has been one of the best centers in the league.

Also I wasn't upset with not getting Pouncy this year, I was more upset with not drafting Max Unger last season, who flourished in Oregon's zone blocking scheme (the same system we run here) and who is now the starting center of the Seahawks.

Well, I'm thrilled with Connor Barwin.. and, since that pick the Texans have acquired:

Caldwell, Wade Smith, and Shelley Smith.


I was hoping for one of the top 3 centers last season also, but then again, I was worried about the Cushing pick. It's not as if we didn't need help at LB and DL.

 

[Carr Bombed]

Well, I'm thrilled with Connor Barwin.. and, since that pick the Texans have acquired:

Caldwell, Wade Smith, and Shelley Smith.


I was hoping for one of the top 3 centers last season also, but then again, I was worried about the Cushing pick. It's not as if we didn't need help at LB and DL.

I liked the Cushing pick, but when Unger fell to our second round pick it should've been a no brainer. He was the best zone blocking center in the draft and when he was at Oregon all that school did was churn out dominant rushing numbers. I like Barwin, but I could do without him if we had a bonified young starting center who could hold the position down for the next decade.

 

[Second Honeymoon]

I liked the Cushing pick, but when Unger fell to our second round pick it should've been a no brainer. He was the best zone blocking center in the draft and when he was at Oregon all that school did was churn out dominant rushing numbers. I like Barwin, but I could do without him if we had a bonified young starting center who could hold the position down for the next decade.

totally agree, but not surprising. after all, Barwin played TE. Advantage: Barwin.

we have been a franchise for almost a decade and we have yet to field a quality NFL center

mckinney was serviceable but still a weak link and Flanny couldn't stay healthy

its their jobs on the line with this whole 'not addressing FS and C' thing. its like the elephant in the room that no one wants to talk about. I hope things turn out good but they are just setting themselves up for an epic fail.

the schedule is the schedule. its tough every year. but we have some serious question marks going into this year. more than we had last year and we barely squeaked out 9 wins. i just wish we would have been a bit more proactive on addressing some of our offseason needs. tate could be special. jackson looks to be a solid pro DB, but that wasn't enough imho.

They should have taken a few more risks this offseason to try and get over the hump before the whole labor agreement BS blows up the 2011 season. For the fans.

oh and everyone say a prayer for the oil leak in the Gulf. we need a miracle.

 

[steelbtexan]

We were 9-7 with 6 starters on IR and lost out on the playoffs by a tie-breaker... Yet, you assert it is virtually impossiple for the team to make the playoffs with Myers playing center. You don't see any errancy in that logic?

Excuses for $1000 please.

You're doing a great job Dale.

 

[Wolf]

bottom line is that we had arguably 4 needs CB,C,RB,FS in the draft, so something wasn't going to get filled.

so no matter how the Texans drafted this year, some discussion would have came up.. if we took CB and Center in the first 2 rounds .. we'd be talking about a lack of one of the top RB's in the draft. We draft a CB and RB .. well we are talking about FS and Center in this thread

pick your poison.

 

[steelbtexan]

If I recall, the stat was simply number of times hit. Relative to passing attempts, he wasn't hit that often.

Regarding FS: According to SteelbTexan, even if Troy Nolan turns into Ronnie Lott, it still won't help us make the playoffs if Chris Myers is on the team.

Where do you recall this stat coming from?

Can I guess? It came out your butt

I wouldn't count on Nolan being Lott.

But my thoughts about Myers stand. If he improves to average that will be an improvement. IMHO

 

[steelbtexan]

bottom line is that we had arguably 4 needs CB,C,RB,FS in the draft, so something wasn't going to get filled.

so no matter how the Texans drafted this year, some discussion would have came up.. if we took CB and Center in the first 2 rounds .. we'd be talking about a lack of one of the top RB's in the draft. We draft a CB and RB .. well we are talking about FS and Center in this thread

pick your poison.

Trading the 4th Rd picks to move up ad take the highest S (Burnett) or C (Walton) would've helped. Smithiak decided to take Graham and Sharpton (who didn't fill a major need) instead. Time will tell if they made the right call.

 

[thunderkyss]

AGAIN....AS LONG AS CHRIS MYERS IS BLOCKING FOR MATT AND ESPECIALLY WITH OUR SCHEDULE AND THE 3-4s(BIG DTS) THAT WE WILL BE FACING, I'M NOT CONFIDENT IN MATT'S ABILITY TO LAST A FULL SEASON WITH MR. DROP CLOTH IN FRONT OF HIM.

Does anyone know of a sight that breaks down how offensive linemen did in regards to stats?

I could have sworn Winston gave up more sacks than Myers.

I thought Winston gave up more sacks than anyone.

 

[thunderkyss]

All of the stats in the world dont mean a thing.

logically, the case can be made that the stats show obvious improvement on the team. A steady progression on the offensive side of the ball. A dramatic step up on the defensive side of the ball.

It would follow, the teams goals are within reach, which should give even the casual fan reason to be optimistic of the upcoming season.

I don't have a problem with fans expressing anger and dislike about the direction and management of the team. But I am curious, if the outlook is so poor, why spend so much time on this message board talking about team? Do you believe your comments here will some-how change the direction the team is going?

If your outlook of the team is so bad, why do you put yourself through this every year??

If Myers is the starting Center in 2010 (& I don't think he will be) are you going to invest any more time watching the Texans?

 

[JB]

logically, the case can be made that the stats show obvious improvement on the team. A steady progression on the offensive side of the ball. A dramatic step up on the defensive side of the ball.

It would follow, the teams goals are within reach, which should give even the casual fan reason to be optimistic of the upcoming season.

I don't have a problem with fans expressing anger and dislike about the direction and management of the team. But I am curious, if the outlook is so poor, why spend so much time on this message board talking about team? Do you believe your comments here will some-how change the direction the team is going?

If your outlook of the team is so bad, why do you put yourself through this every year??

If Myers is the starting Center in 2010 (& I don't think he will be) are you going to invest any more time watching the Texans?

NO you didn't!

Don't be bringing no logic or common sense around heah!

 

[Honoring Earl 34]

logically, the case can be made that the stats show obvious improvement on the team. A steady progression on the offensive side of the ball. A dramatic step up on the defensive side of the ball.

It would follow, the teams goals are within reach, which should give even the casual fan reason to be optimistic of the upcoming season.

I don't have a problem with fans expressing anger and dislike about the direction and management of the team. But I am curious, if the outlook is so poor, why spend so much time on this message board talking about team? Do you believe your comments here will some-how change the direction the team is going?

If your outlook of the team is so bad, why do you put yourself through this every year??

If Myers is the starting Center in 2010 (& I don't think he will be) are you going to invest any more time watching the Texans?

Yep ... if you can't be happy and optimistic now , when can you be .

Things that are more important than a new FS and C going into 2010 .

1. Schaub remains healthy .
2. AJ remains healthy
3. Ryans " "
4. Cushing " "
5. Mario " "
6. Pollard " "
7. Mario returns to form
8. Tate takes off
9. Kareem is the real deal
10. Kris starts hitting Fgs again
11. Okoye steps up
12 . Glover avoids soph jinx
13. JJ remains focussed .
14. Slaton regains form
15. Daniels gets 100%
16. Caldwell steps up at G/C
17. Briesel gets healthy.
18. Studdard turns into Larry Allen
19. Barwin becomes a beast
20. Antonio starts like he finished
21. Eugene is ready
22. Walter keeps playing well.
23. Cedric makes Meyers into Dermonti Dawson .

 

[Texan_Bill]

logically, the case can be made that the stats show obvious improvement on the team. A steady progression on the offensive side of the ball. A dramatic step up on the defensive side of the ball.

It would follow, the teams goals are within reach, which should give even the casual fan reason to be optimistic of the upcoming season.

I don't have a problem with fans expressing anger and dislike about the direction and management of the team. But I am curious, if the outlook is so poor, why spend so much time on this message board talking about team? Do you believe your comments here will some-how change the direction the team is going?

If your outlook of the team is so bad, why do you put yourself through this every year??

If Myers is the starting Center in 2010 (& I don't think he will be) are you going to invest any more time watching the Texans?

Don't know, but the Texans ranked 5th for sacks allowed (in a good way). Considering the fact that the Tinnbreds ranked ahead of us and the number of passing attempts, the Texans O-line generally did pretty well. As far as Myers goes, I have no hate for the guy, but he flat out can be manhandled at times.

 

[Texan_Bill]

Furthermore, the Texans ranked 29th with regards to:

Rush Pwr = Percentage of rushes on 3rd or 4th down with 2 or fewer yards to go that achieved a first down or TD. Also includes rushes on 1st-and-goal and 2nd-and-goal from the opponent's 2-yard line or closer

Linkage: NFl.com

 

[steelbtexan]

logically, the case can be made that the stats show obvious improvement on the team. A steady progression on the offensive side of the ball. A dramatic step up on the defensive side of the ball.

It would follow, the teams goals are within reach, which should give even the casual fan reason to be optimistic of the upcoming season.

I don't have a problem with fans expressing anger and dislike about the direction and management of the team. But I am curious, if the outlook is so poor, why spend so much time on this message board talking about team? Do you believe your comments here will some-how change the direction the team is going?

If your outlook of the team is so bad, why do you put yourself through this every year??

If Myers is the starting Center in 2010 (& I don't think he will be) are you going to invest any more time watching the Texans?

Because I have and will remain a Texan fan. I enjoy the back and forth banter. You are a realistic Texan fan. People cant see the problems with the organization are the ones who I call out. This doesn't mean I'm not a fan.

Look at the Texans and the progress they are making. It's a good thing but they dont seem to be willing to step out of their comfort zone. Are the Texans improved this year? Sure

But ask me if the Colts, Tacks, Ravens,Redskins,Eagles heck even the Raiders have improved.

Have the Texans improved enough this offseason to make the playoffs? No IMHO But I'm still a fan. I will remain a fan long after Smithiak are gone.

The Texans take on the personality of McNair (overly conservative) Smithiak and on down to the ushers getting on fans at the stadium for standing or banging beer bottles together.

I dont buy what Smithiak are selling and hope the next management team that are brought in will be a Parcells type guy. A proven winner, Somebody that will say to McNair if you want a winner you cant be so conservative.

McNair hasn't gotten over being burned by Casserly. He's going to have to get over that if the Texans are going to be a successful organization.

I believe the talent was good enough to make the playoffs last year. But on field coaching and a conservative FO killed their playoff chances.

In short I will remain a fan because I believe the Texans will eventually become a really good playoff team. Just not with Smithiak.

 

[JB]

So basically SteelB, you are looking for the Phoenix, while McNair & co. are raising the Roc?

 

[steelbtexan]

So basically SteelB, you are looking for the Phoenix, while McNair & co. are raising the Roc?

Never heard it put that way.

But you're correct sir.

 

[JB]

Never heard it put that way.

But you're correct sir.

And you do understand that the phoenix flames out just as fast as it flares to brilliance, correct?

 

[Carr Bombed]

Does anyone know of a sight that breaks down how offensive linemen did in regards to stats?

I could have sworn Winston gave up more sacks than Myers.

I thought Winston gave up more sacks than anyone.

I can live with the sacks by Winston, because atleast he's good with run blocking and he isn't absolutely atrocious with his pass blocking.

But also when you're center allows a pocket to get pushed back towards the QB, that doesn't exactly help out your tackles. It's the same thing we want on our defense.....a DT that can push the pocket back into the QBs face so our end (mainly Mario) can get to the QB more. Well on offense we have a center who doesn't maintain the integrity of the pocket.

 

[Carr Bombed]

logically, the case can be made that the stats show obvious improvement on the team. A steady progression on the offensive side of the ball. A dramatic step up on the defensive side of the ball.

It would follow, the teams goals are within reach, which should give even the casual fan reason to be optimistic of the upcoming season.

I don't have a problem with fans expressing anger and dislike about the direction and management of the team. But I am curious, if the outlook is so poor, why spend so much time on this message board talking about team? Do you believe your comments here will some-how change the direction the team is going?

If your outlook of the team is so bad, why do you put yourself through this every year??

If Myers is the starting Center in 2010 (& I don't think he will be) are you going to invest any more time watching the Texans?

I thought the point of a message board was to discuss the team. Just because I can't stand the performance of our starting center that doesn't mean I'm not excited about next season and am not a "fan". It just means I can identify a glaring hole....a glaring hole that I think is going to rear it's ugly head, because well.....it has time and time again in the past.

I hope I'm wrong about my "the Texans won't make the playoffs with Myers as their starting center" prediction, but until that happens, I'm not changing that prediction. Hopefully we don't even have to see them try to make the playoffs with him snapping the ball....hopefully someone beats him out in camp.

 

[steelbtexan]

And you do understand that the phoenix flames out just as fast as it flares to brilliance, correct?

After 8 yrs I will take a pheonix.

Then rebuild and have another pheonix within 5 yrs. Just because you invest in FA doesn't mean your team will flame out. (Vikings)

But that's just me.

I wish we could be talking about a Texans playoff experience and how they could improve to get over the top.

Unfortunately that will have to wait until another offseason.

 

[thunderkyss]

People cant see the problems with the organization are the ones who I call out. This doesn't mean I'm not a fan.

Everybody sees problems with the organization. You're not alone. We can't all be right. Personally, I just don't like your "stats don't mean anything" or whatever. They don't mean what you think we are saying it means. We don't think they mean anything other than what they mean.

I'm not questioning your "fan-hood" I tried to not give off that impression.

Look at the Texans and the progress they are making. It's a good thing but they dont seem to be willing to step out of their comfort zone. Are the Texans improved this year? Sure

Great, let's go find a thread where we can go talk about how our team has improved. Then you'll be like the rest of us, sharing in the good and the bad.

But ask me if the Colts, Tacks, Ravens,Redskins,Eagles heck even the Raiders have improved.

True. Offensively, I think we were as good as any of them... moving the ball, scoring... we're right there. Need to get better at running the ball. Defensively, I think we're as good as any of them.

We had some maturity issues, some coaching issues, a lot of choking issues...
But I think the growth we've seen, maturity wise, through-out the season (on the field, and on the side lines) will be the x factor that will finally put us on even footing with the best in the NFL.

Have the Texans improved enough this offseason to make the playoffs? No IMHO But I'm still a fan. I will remain a fan long after Smithiak are gone.

& that's what I'm asking about. If your outlook is so low, what are you going to be watching? Are you going to be hoping they prove you wrong, and send Chris Myers to the Pro-Bowl? Are you going to be watching, hoping to be proven right, and Myers get Schaub killed? Are you going to notice Winston give up more sacks than Myers, which he has the last two years?

I dont buy what Smithiak are selling and hope the next management team that are brought in will be a Parcells type guy. A proven winner, Somebody that will say to McNair if you want a winner you cant be so conservative.

Technically, we were winners last year. I like that Kubiak isn't so conservative that he won't start a rookie... Wali Lundy, Glover Quinn, to name a couple. I hope we can see more 2 minute offense... but if they keep screwing it up, I hope Kubiak pulls them back before we get into "missing the play-offs again" jeopordy. I have no problem not wanting to pay Haynesworth $100 mil. I have no problem passing on Cedric Benson (at least they've done their due dillegence, brought him in, and looked at him twice..) I don't understand not bringning Larry Johnson in, even if we had to sign him to a crazy 1 year deal.

In short I will remain a fan because I believe the Texans will eventually become a really good playoff team. Just not with Smithiak.

So what are you expecting to see in 2010? Good football? A joke? Is it going to be close?

 

[Carr Bombed]

Let's put it this way.......I'd gladly take the experience and toughness a 39 year old Kevin Mawae would bring over a 29 (when the season starts) Chris Myers. At worst (if he's fallen off due to age) he'd atleast push Myers and would give us a great option to stick out there when we need tough rushing yards.

 

[dalemurphy]

Excuses for $1000 please.

You're doing a great job Dale.

Excuse for what? I'm simply arguing that they could realistically make the playoffs with Myers at center.

 

[Carr Bombed]

Excuse for what? I'm simply arguing that they could realistically make the playoffs with Myers at center.

They could and I hope to god it happens...but with this schedule where we play all the type of players our starting center struggles against I don't see it happening. Again, I hope I'm wrong......I'd LOVE TO BE WRONG. But I'm not going to ignore past shortcomings/results, watch the team do the same thing AGAIN, and expect a different result. Still hope against hope somehow we get a different result though...just won't expect it.

 

[thunderkyss]

I thought the point of a message board was to discuss the team. Just because I can't stand the performance of our starting center that doesn't mean I'm not excited about next season and am not a "fan". It just means I can identify a glaring hole....a glaring hole that I think is going to rear it's ugly head, because well.....it has time and time again in the past.

Let's not play the, "don't question my fan-hood" stuff. That's not where I'm going. If you don't think we have a chance... what are you going to be watching? Are you going to pay to go see a pathetic excuse of a team aimlessly trot around the field for 3 hours? Are you going to be zeroed in on Myers?

I honestly think if we had a center, who was capable to start for an offense that threw for 4000 yards, or can start for a team with a 1300 yard rusher, with a better than average defense, we can go deep into the play-offs.

If only we could find a guy like that.

 

[Carr Bombed]

Let's not play the, "don't question my fan-hood" stuff. That's not where I'm going. If you don't think we have a chance... what are you going to be watching? Are you going to pay to go see a pathetic excuse of a team aimlessly trot around the field for 3 hours? Are you going to be zeroed in on Myers?

I honestly think if we had a center, who was capable to start for an offense that threw for 4000 yards, or can start for a team with a 1300 yard rusher, with a better than average defense, we can go deep into the play-offs.

If only we could find a guy like that.

LMAO.......dude give me a break.

You're going to ask what I'm going to be doing on Sundays when I've watched every game this team has ever played (even when I knew we couldn't do crap with David Carr) and then type the "let's not play the don't question my fanhood card...that's not where I'm going" Umm, that's exactly where you're going.

And don't even try to give Myers all the props for what we've been able to do on offense, we've done that in spite of him. AGAIN......HOW MANY TIMES HAS THIS TEAM COME UP SHORT IN THE RED ZONE BECAUSE THEY WEREN'T ABLE TO GET A IMPORTANT YARD UP THE MIDDLE. or....HOW MANY TIMES HAS MYERS BEEN BLOWN OFF THE BALL AND EMBARRASSED. If you're just going to sit there and ignore his obvious shortcomings, you're just ignoring the obvious.

Where have all those 4,000+ passing seasons and the one good rushing season we did have with him get us (have we've been to the playoffs yet?...no we haven't and we've only had one...ONE WINING SEASON..(a season where we should've and were expected to make the playoffs), one winning season when everybody expected us to break through and become a dominant team the last couple of years and we weren't able to, because we were unable to convert goal line/short yardage situations when it mattered the most (like we've done the entire time he's been our starter even with a 1,200 yard rusher) and we've completely sucked in the red zone the entire time he's been our starting center......THAT'S THE MAIN PROBLEM WITH THIS TEAM. We have no problem putting up great #s in between the 20s, but as far as being able to put up and get the meat and potatoes numbers (red zone) with Myers....yeah we suck at that and he's a BIG problem in that area.

I question all of this, because I'M A FAN of this team and care about the direction of this team. If I didn't care, I wouldn't be so critical and wouldn't spend my time typing all this crap. Myers needs to be replaced and I've been saying that for like 2 years now. He's not a starting caliber center on a playoff caliber team and has been one of the main reasons why this team year in and year out doesn't live up to preseason expectations and happens to come up short year in....and year out, but we're just supposed to watch the same thing every year and expect something different with him. If it happens GREAT!, but like I said above, I will not expect it. I hope like hell it happens and like I said last season....I hope like hell this opinion/post gets bumped with a big giant "I TOLD YOU SO", because that means the Texans had a great year with Myers at center (a year that extends past the regular season) and that means everybody is happy (even me). I just don't expect it to get bumped....that is all.

 

[dalemurphy]

They could and I hope to god it happens...but with this schedule where we play all the type of players our starting center struggles against I don't see it happening. Again, I hope I'm wrong......I'd LOVE TO BE WRONG. But I'm not going to ignore past shortcomings/results, watch the team do the same thing AGAIN, and expect a different result. Still hope against hope somehow we get a different result though...just won't expect it.

He's got a lot of players to beat out... only 3 of these guys will play: Wade Smith, Caldwell, Studdard, Shelly Smith, Chris White, Briesel, Chris Myers.

 

[Carr Bombed]

He's got a lot of players to beat out... only 3 of these guys will play: Wade Smith, Caldwell, Studdard, Shelly Smith, Chris White, Briesel, Chris Myers.

That's fine....I hope he gets beat out. I was excited when we drafted Caldwell, because he was a solid prospect who played in the SEC. Hopefully he's the guy, but it was kind of a let down when they went with Myers after he got completely owned week one and then stuck Caldwell at guard. It just seems this coaching staff has some kind of infatuation with Myers at center...and if they keep on doing it, it's going to be their undoing.

 

[thunderkyss]

LMAO.......dude give me a break.
Umm, that's exactly where you're going.

Let's try it this way.

You're a fan. I get it. I don't doubt it.

What get's you excited on Sunday? Let's talk about that, instead of the same old crap that has you pissing vinegar all the time.

And don't even try to give Myers all the props that we have had on offense, we've done that in spite of him.

definitely one way to look at it. But when Schaub is one of the least sacked QBs in the league, when the stats show Myers doing his job, and not giving up sacks, maybe we should give the man a little credit.

& saying Slaton ran for 1,282 yards inspite of his Center, is like saying Chris Johnson would have rushed for 2000 yards on any NFL team. If you want to say Slaton would have ran for 2000 if that was Mawae in front of him, I can go with... but in spite of... I'm not seeing it.

AGAIN......HOW MANY TIMES HAS THIS TEAM COME UP SHORT IN THE RED ZONE BECAUSE THEY WEREN'T ABLE TO GET A IMPORTANT YARD UP THE MIDDLE.

Twice, maybe three times... I don't know how many times?

or....HOW MANY TIMES HAS MYERS BEEN BLOWN OFF THE BALL AND EMBARRASSED.

Once?

If you're just going to sit there and ignore his obvious shortcomings, you're just ignoring the obvious.

I'm all for replacing Chris Myers, I'm not saying he's our best option. I'm just saying he's started on some pretty potent offenses.

Where have all those 4,000+ passing seasons and the one good rushing season we did have with him get us (have we've been to the playoffs yet...no we haven't and we've only had one...ONE WINING SEASON),

Give me the 4000 yard season, with a 1200 yard rusher, and a 13th rank defense, all in the same year, and we'll have a winning season every time.

because we were unable to convert a goal line/short yardage situation when it mattered and we've completely sucked in the red zone the entire time he's been our starting center......THAT'S THE MAIN PROBLEM WITH THIS TEAM.

Has anyone seen the numbers of our 2009 Redzone efficiency?? I couldn't find it.

I question all of this, because I'M A FAN of this team and care about the direction of this team.

I'm not questioning this.

If I didn't care, I wouldn't be so critical and wouldn't spend my time typing all this crap.

obvious

Myers needs to be replaced and I've been saying that for like 2 years now. He's not a starting caliber center on a playoff caliber team and has been one of the main reasons why this team year in and year out doesn't live up to preseason expectations, but we're just supposed to watch the same thing every year and expect something different with him.

well, we did get a 1282 yard rusher with him as the starting center one year, and a 4000 yard passer another. We led the league in passing actually. In 2009, only 9 teams scored more points if that means anything.

 

[Carr Bombed]

Let's try it this way.

You're a fan. I get it. I don't doubt it.

What get's you excited on Sunday? Let's talk about that, instead of the same old crap that has you pissing vinegar all the time.

LMAO, how the hell am I always "pissing vinegar all the time"? I'm not a "negative Nancy" with every position with this team, I just don't agree with one position/decision with the roster. (it's just a positon/decision that I think is going to hold us back next year, because it has the past two years) And frankly I don't have enough time left tonight to talk about "what gets me excited about next year".

definitely one way to look at it. But when Schaub is one of the least sacked QBs in the league, when the stats show Myers doing his job, and not giving up sacks, maybe we should give the man a little credit.

Umm, check a previous post, I already explained this...props need to be given to Schaub for not being sacked alot, not his interior line.

& saying Slaton ran for 1,282 yards inspite of his Center, is like saying Chris Johnson would have rushed for 2000 yards on any NFL team. If you want to say Slaton would have ran for 2000 if that was Mawae in front of him, I can go with... but in spite of... I'm not seeing it.

LMAO, please post where I said that? I NEVER said Slaton got 1,200 yards despite Myers. I said Myers sucked in the red zone and he did....EVEN with Slaton. NEWSFLASH Houston still SUCKED running the ball in the red zone last year with a 1,200 yard Slaton.

I'm all for replacing Chris Myers, I'm not saying he's our best option. I'm just saying he's started on some pretty potent offenses..

And I said that too, but that's not a reason to keep him when we haven't done crap with that "potent offense". The reason why this team isn't and hasn't gone anywhere is because of the red zone/short yardage deficientcies.....THAT'S WHERE MYERS STRUGGLES, THAT'S WHERE I HAVE A PROBLEM WITH HIM.

Give me the 4000 yard season, with a 1200 yard rusher, and a 13th rank defense, all in the same year, and we'll have a winning season every time.

With Chris Myers we'll never have all of that in a same season...I really don't understand this post. One of our main problems last season wasn't just the runningbacks, it was our runningbacks getting tackled behind the line of scrimmage and not even having a hole to run through. Hell give me a million dollars....I'll throw kick ass parties every weekend. The proof is in the production...and that production hasn't been there consistently with Myers.

Has anyone seen the numbers of our 2009 Redzone efficiency?? I couldn't find it.

I haven't but I'm going to go out on a limb and say it wasn't all that great seeing that's the reason why we lost alot of games.

well, we did get a 1282 yard rusher with him as the starting center one year, and a 4000 yard passer another. We led the league in passing actually. In 2009, only 9 teams scored more points if that means anything.

Yeah, we did have a kick ass rusher ONE YEAR......how did we do in redzone/short yardage situations that year? Umm not good. Again...meat and potatoes. I don't give a crap about in between the 20's anymore. We've kicked ass at that the last couple of season...where has it gotten us? Even with this 1,200 yard rusher, how did we do in the redzone? NOT GOOD.

I also don't care about how many points we scored.....what DID WE DO IN THE RED ZONE OR IN SHORT YARDAGE SITUATIONS TO CLOSE OUT GAMES? That is what's killing us.

 

[thunderkyss]

I also don't care about how many points we scored.....what DID WE DO IN THE RED ZONE OR IN SHORT YARDAGE SITUATIONS TO CLOSE OUT GAMES? That is what's killing us.

I just happened to be watching the Nov 29 game against the Colts. I know this is an isolated incident, but I thought I'd share anyway.

2:20 left in the 1st Qtr. We have the ball on the 6 yard line. 2nd & 2. We run the ball straight up the middle, for 6 yards and a touchdown.

Chris Brown is the Tailback, Myers at Center, and White at guard.

 

[76Texan]

The same week that Myers was slapped by Jenkins, Unger was slapped just as badly by a reserve DT and played a very poor game at Guard.

While long term he may become a decent center, if you just take one example (one game - a few plays) to define a player, then you should cross out Max Unger.

....

Mawae played horrible last year.
He allowed penetration all over the place.
The QBs had to scramble a lot.
It was one of the reasons of Collins' undoing.

Also, the Tacks ranked 27th in running up the middle while the Texans ranked 11th
http://www.footballoutsiders.com/stats/ol

......

Myers had done well against a lot of big 3-4 NT, including Hampton, Ngata, Rogers, Haynesworth.
In those games, it would be either Brisiel or Pitts that were ummaned, mostly Brisiel.

.....
At any rate, if the main concern is with Schaub getting hit, you guys who pick on Myers for that don't have much beef.
Especially against the 3-4, our tackles haven't done good enough of a job picking up the blitz.
Or they would get beat by the DEs.
That's where the worries should lie.

 

[76Texan]

I just happened to be watching the Nov 29 game against the Colts. I know this is an isolated incident, but I thought I'd share anyway.

2:20 left in the 1st Qtr. We have the ball on the 6 yard line. 2nd & 2. We run the ball straight up the middle, for 6 yards and a touchdown.

Chris Brown is the Tailback, Myers at Center, and White at guard.

In the game against the Jags, the fumble by Brown on the goal line was due to his own fault.
But Brisiel couldn't get hardly any push, and Walter was manhandled by Mathis.

 

[Carr Bombed]

I just happened to be watching the Nov 29 game against the Colts. I know this is an isolated incident, but I thought I'd share anyway.

2:20 left in the 1st Qtr. We have the ball on the 6 yard line. 2nd & 2. We run the ball straight up the middle, for 6 yards and a touchdown.

Chris Brown is the Tailback, Myers at Center, and White at guard.

That's like me pulling up a "isolated incident" of Okoye getting penetration in the backfield. What's the point? It doesn't prove anything, especially when INDY fields one of the smallest Dlines in the league.

 

[Carr Bombed]

The same week that Myers was slapped by Jenkins, Unger was slapped just as badly by a reserve DT and played a very poor game at Guard.

While long term he may become a decent center, if you just take one example (one game - a few plays) to define a player, then you should cross out Max Unger.

....

Mawae played horrible last year.
He allowed penetration all over the place.
The QBs had to scramble a lot.
It was one of the reasons of Collins' undoing.

Also, the Tacks ranked 27th in running up the middle while the Texans ranked 11th
http://www.footballoutsiders.com/stats/ol

......

Myers had done well against a lot of big 3-4 NT, including Hampton, Ngata, Rogers, Haynesworth.
In those games, it would be either Brisiel or Pitts that were ummaned, mostly Brisiel.

.....
At any rate, if the main concern is with Schaub getting hit, you guys who pick on Myers for that don't have much beef.
Especially against the 3-4, our tackles haven't done good enough of a job picking up the blitz.
Or they would get beat by the DEs.
That's where the worries should lie.

Yeah, I'd love to see a video of "Unger being slapped just as bad".... I doubt he was tossed aside like a child the way Myers was.

Even so, he was a rookie. I'd be able to deal with that, because he's going to improve and get better. Unlike a 28 year old who's still getting beat down and tossed aside like a rag doll.

P.S.

It doesn't matter how bad Mawae was last season......he was still better than Myers and our tackles haven't been the main problem when facing 3-4s either. Anybody remember Slaton getting tackled by Myers his rookie season? Remember when Myers was thrown into the backfield at Slaton?

 

[thunderkyss]

Myers had done well against a lot of big 3-4 NT, including Hampton, Ngata, Rogers, Haynesworth.
In those games, it would be either Brisiel or Pitts that were ummaned, mostly Brisiel.

.....
At any rate, if the main concern is with Schaub getting hit, you guys who pick on Myers for that don't have much beef.
Especially against the 3-4, our tackles haven't done good enough of a job picking up the blitz.
Or they would get beat by the DEs.
That's where the worries should lie.

Which was the case in the Jets game. Myers was rag-dolled that one time, it got put on TV & the commentators couldn't stop talking about it. But every other time (or most every other time) Jenkins was on Matt, it was Pitts that got beat, and pushed around. But he's a hero around here????

 

[Honoring Earl 34]

Which was the case in the Jets game. Myers was rag-dolled that one time, it got put on TV & the commentators couldn't stop talking about it. But every other time (or most every other time) Jenkins was on Matt, it was Pitts that got beat, and pushed around. But he's a hero around here????

Isn't the centers main job to make the line calls ? That the #1 thing is smarts and most are not big .

The Cowboys of the 90's had Mark Stepnoski at C and he may have weighed 265 . He was flanked by Nate Newton and Larry Allen , who weighed about 330 a piece .

The prototype for ZBS centers is Tom Nalen who was small but strong as an ox .

 

[Second Honeymoon]

are people actually trying to pretend that Myers is decent? really?

Myers is garbage. utter garbage.

as for McNair, he is not doing what it takes to put the best team on the field
his penny pinching ways have made this team less competitive than last year

we had less holes going into last season than we will this year
they say they are building through the draft and too cheap to sign decent FAs this year, but then in teh draft they neglect critical areas of need

i hope the Texans season works out but if it doesn't, at least we can finally get rid of Gary the flatliner and get a decent head coach...but thanks largely to McNair's greed, we probably wont have a season in 2011 anyway....

...but whatever, McNair donated the team to the city out of the kindness of his heart and for that he should be worshipped and given long sensual massages by the Sunshine Crew. Oh wait, he has increased the value of his franchise over half a billion and has still called for a bailout and cried poverty. maybe it wasn't a donation after all, mensas.

just put a winning product on the field or get rid of these clowns and put together a team that can win. when we are 7-9 or worse this year, all the Sunshine kids can thank McNair for bringing football back to Houston...again. and while they are at it they can thank him for a decade of losing football....which is all that he has brought us. period.

 

[dalemurphy]

are people actually trying to pretend that Myers is decent? really?

Myers is garbage. utter garbage.

as for McNair, he is not doing what it takes to put the best team on the field
his penny pinching ways have made this team less competitive than last year

we had less holes going into last season than we will this year
they say they are building through the draft and too cheap to sign decent FAs this year, but then in teh draft they neglect critical areas of need

i hope the Texans season works out but if it doesn't, at least we can finally get rid of Gary the flatliner and get a decent head coach...but thanks largely to McNair's greed, we probably wont have a season in 2011 anyway....

...but whatever, McNair donated the team to the city out of the kindness of his heart and for that he should be worshipped and given long sensual massages by the Sunshine Crew. Oh wait, he has increased the value of his franchise over half a billion and has still called for a bailout and cried poverty. maybe it wasn't a donation after all, mensas.

just put a winning product on the field or get rid of these clowns and put together a team that can win. when we are 7-9 or worse this year, all the Sunshine kids can thank McNair for bringing football back to Houston...again. and while they are at it they can thank him for a decade of losing football....which is all that he has brought us. period.

SH, didn't you predict a 6-10 season for last year?

who are these magic free agent centers that McNair should've spent money on? I'm curious what all your research and scouting on Wade Smith uncovered. Apparently, you've determined that he is not very good and there were better options available... who?

When has McNair cried poverty? I have never heard him complain about his financial situation or the Texans' financial situation.

Chris Myers is "utter garbage" because he has a weakness in his game? wow! Nevermind the fact that the guy is a very good second level blocker, very good on screen passes, very good making line calls, and servicable in most areas except handling a one on one bull rush against an elite NT.

I'd love to quiz you on your knowledg of centers around the NFL. I'm sure you've really studied up on them. LOL!