Ole Miss Texan
Hall of Fame
Brace is a run stuffer only. He will not collapse the pocket and will not get in the backfield. While Peria Jerry may be Amobi Okoye, Ron Brace is Frank Okam. Raji can do both, Brace can do one.
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With DE-Smith signed, who @ 15?
- Thread starter PhilpW
- Start date
MojoMan
Hall of Fame
We already have Okoye and Okam. And we are not going to get Raji.
I don't understand why you guys think the Texans might want to draft a DT in the first round. Don't get me wrong, I have been in favor of every first round DL pick the Texans have made up until now, except for Jason Babin. But the coaches like Travis Johnson at one DT, and it is too soon to give up on Amobi Akoye. Okoye played well as a rookie after being drafted #10 overall, slacked off last year in a classic sophomore slump, and will turn 22 years old in June of this year. Also, Frank Okam is just entering his second year.
I really cannot imagine how the Texans would want to spend their top pick on a defensive tackle this year. The team has other needs, and they have spent a lot of top draft picks on defensive lineman over the last few years. Our current guys are not busts by any means. Perhaps we should try and show a little patience with our defensive tackles.
threetoedpete
Hall of Fame
And prey Miami doesn't jump you and fill a need position for them....a will with some pass rush abilities. I'm sure the tuna is watching the same guys we're watching. Mathews is a tuna kind of guy. I could live with Butlers numnbers....can never have too many corners correct ? But you can only play three at a time. Defiantly send Petie packing.
Big Poundcake
Waterboy
Cushing or Malcolm Jenkins(if he's available) at #15.
threetoedpete
Hall of Fame
If it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck, flies like a duck ....it's probably a duck. Rey is an inside guy. Great college player.....But the other two USC guys are flying by him for a reason.
The two guys who have probably fallen the most post combine is Maybin and Jenkins. And Andre Smith needs to have a monster proday. He's young. And he appears to be immature. There's no denying he is a road grader. It's gong to come down to can he convince the scouts and GMs how badly he wants it?
Or if he wants it at all.
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beerlover
Hall of Fame
I'm staying w/English @ 15 
I'm telling you Larry could be dynamic @ SLB positon in this scheme, standing up or off the edge in three point stance. the Texans need his particular skill set, great first step, cat quick can drop his hips & go, excellent frame to grow & get only stronger absolute beast, disruptive in backfield. looks like a NFL LB right now! Maybe that coveted RDE later-
I'm telling you Larry could be dynamic @ SLB positon in this scheme, standing up or off the edge in three point stance. the Texans need his particular skill set, great first step, cat quick can drop his hips & go, excellent frame to grow & get only stronger absolute beast, disruptive in backfield. looks like a NFL LB right now! Maybe that coveted RDE later-
BattleRedToro
Thread Killer
MojoMan
Hall of Fame
What about Deuce McAllister? The Deuce is loose.
Benson would have been a good add. Most of the rest look like reaches for us, as many are on the downside of their careers, or they just don't fit into our system. If we are going to bring in McAllister, we might as well invite Ahman Green in for another go at the same time.
We only have two RB's on the roster right now. They will bring at least six into camp. W are going to have to sign a number of people, including free agents, draft picks, and undrafted free agents.
TexansFan33
DW33
If somehow andre smtih fell to us @ 15 would ya'll want to get him over say a brian cushing or a rey malauga?
I'm staying w/English @ 15
I'm telling you Larry could be dynamic @ SLB positon in this scheme, standing up or off the edge in three point stance. the Texans need his particular skill set, great first step, cat quick can drop his hips & go, excellent frame to grow & get only stronger absolute beast, disruptive in backfield. looks like a NFL LB right now! Maybe that coveted RDE later-
I'm very much a fan of English. WOuld be a great pick.
Zero chance. He in no way fits what we do, blocking wise.
TexansFan33
DW33
Larry English sure forces alot of fumbles. That's a plus. The Vertical just shows how explosive this guy really is.
40 time: 4.77
Broad Jump: 8'11"
Vertical: 36" (7th best DL or 4th best LB)
Bench Reps: 24
3-Cone Drill: 7.26 (7th best DL)
20-yard Shuttle: 4.38 (4th best DL)
40 time: 4.77
Broad Jump: 8'11"
Vertical: 36" (7th best DL or 4th best LB)
Bench Reps: 24
3-Cone Drill: 7.26 (7th best DL)
20-yard Shuttle: 4.38 (4th best DL)
bah007
Hall of Fame
His vertical is impressive.
But the vertical jump isn't a test of football power if you ask me. Rarely is a football player exploding up like that unless it is a WR or DB going for a jump ball.
The broad jump is a better indication of football power. Basketball players explode up (vertical) but football players explode forward (broad jump).
Mr teX
Hall of Fame
Some scouts speculated Mauluga might be able to play OLB, but most knew he'd more than likely be playing mlb in the NFL & in that regard he's still a great prospect to keep an eye on at 15. The only reason the other 2 USC guys are flying by him is b/c he pulled his hammy at the combine & didn't get to finish as opposed to the other 2 imo. Demeco's done a great job for us at MLB, but when we drafted him we didn't have the luxury to sit back & see him play in his natural sam lb position. As good as he's been in the middle for us, it's really scary to think that he might be better on the edge If we found someone that could replace him in the middle. Mauluga could be that guy.
i don't think it'd be a slight towards Meco if we moved him back to his natural area on the outside. He could still be the leader of the defense & it just might benefit him more in his contract negotiations with us if he were moved & he started making more plays as a result.
El Tejano
Hall of Fame
I'll pass on Maclin. He gets hurt alot. I understand that he is pretty polished and most likely will not have to come in and make an impact on our team right away but I think you can get a guy to do what he would do on our team in the later rounds.
A few mentioned that with the A Smith signing the needs are not as glaring anymore. Our defense was ranked pretty low last year. So there are defensive needs. However, there was one thing our defense showed us, it was the more athletic the linebackers the better our defense became. This was evident when Adibi played, and then the drop off was clear when he didn't play against the Raiders. So if we can get a pass rushing LB that has good cover skills and he's there at #1 you take him. Our current depth doesn't dictate that he contribute right away but he can and most likely will.
The other part that has me concerned is the RB depth. I'm the first guy to say that Steve Slaton will be awesome this year but all we know of now is that he had a great rookie season. There have been sophmore seasons in the past that didn't do as well as their rookie seasons. Not only that but we are going to go up against some pretty good defenses this year and if Slaton proves to not be a one year wonder, we need someone to spell him. Even in a back up role, this guy could get alot of carries. If a Shonn Greene is available or Knowshawn Moreno (my overall favorite) then I wont get mad at this kind of pick up.
CB/DBs - there just isn't anyone that wows me to take at #15. If we trade down, I'm all about a CB/DB.
A few mentioned that with the A Smith signing the needs are not as glaring anymore. Our defense was ranked pretty low last year. So there are defensive needs. However, there was one thing our defense showed us, it was the more athletic the linebackers the better our defense became. This was evident when Adibi played, and then the drop off was clear when he didn't play against the Raiders. So if we can get a pass rushing LB that has good cover skills and he's there at #1 you take him. Our current depth doesn't dictate that he contribute right away but he can and most likely will.
The other part that has me concerned is the RB depth. I'm the first guy to say that Steve Slaton will be awesome this year but all we know of now is that he had a great rookie season. There have been sophmore seasons in the past that didn't do as well as their rookie seasons. Not only that but we are going to go up against some pretty good defenses this year and if Slaton proves to not be a one year wonder, we need someone to spell him. Even in a back up role, this guy could get alot of carries. If a Shonn Greene is available or Knowshawn Moreno (my overall favorite) then I wont get mad at this kind of pick up.
CB/DBs - there just isn't anyone that wows me to take at #15. If we trade down, I'm all about a CB/DB.
P
Polo
Guest
SAM isn't really his natural position...
According to him he's played MLB all of his life with the exception of playing it because they needed him to at Alabama. Kubiak and Demeco have both expressed strong feelings about not wanting him to move outside, so he might not be all on board with that move.
Mr teX
Hall of Fame
ahh..did not know that...good looking out. I guess it then becomes known quantity vs. unknown.
You think his verticle is impressive?? Jaron Gilbert At 6-5, 288 pounds ran a 4.81 40-yard dash at the combine and vertical jumped 35 1/2 inches. He also became a YouTube sensation by jumping out of a swimming pool. Yes the pool had water in it if you havent seen the video. I posted it awhile back.
bah007
Hall of Fame
I've seen it. It's impressive.
Honestly, unless a guy is a WR, TE, or DB, I don't care how high he can jump.
Show me his broad jump numbers. That gives me a better indication of his power moving forward.
El Tejano
Hall of Fame
That's insane.
swtbound07
Jackass of Day!
i thought, and still think its william moore.
threetoedpete
Hall of Fame
Lawrence Sidbury Richmond 6-2 266, 35 3/8 arm 10 3/4 hands 4.64 forty 28 Bench
Call me crazy but I'd like to see that chasing down stuff sideline to sideline.
source Scouts inc. post combine numbers.
http://cfn.scout.com/2/841851.html
threetoedpete
Hall of Fame
That's a pretty bold statement. I've always considered how far and how high a guy jumps....at any position on the field, a direct indication how explosive a player is....at any position....and how strong he is....at any position. When the numbers match...you've got a pretty sure bet. When they don't...pretty safe bet you've got a problem there....at any position. Do you really want to take a full back or an offensive guard who isn't explosive with the first step. Or a DT? You're pretty hot on Raji correct ? Battles along the o-line are one and lost with the first step. Better get the most explosive players you can lay your hands on. I assume that is why you're targeting Raji ?
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threetoedpete
Hall of Fame
Yeah the Kid went from being a "take a chance project guy for the fourth round"....to a bunch of barracudas thinking he might just be the next Buck Buchanan.
http://www.nfl.com/players/buckbuchanan/profile?id=BUC158204
And there's the Wolf in New England sitting there with a couple of seconds...and an aging Richard Seymore on the roster. Gonna be a hoot to see who takes the guy.
Jarron Gilbert SJSt. 6-6 288 36 3/4 AL, 10 3/4 hands, 4.87 40, 28 bench
the kid made himself some money at the combine.
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threetoedpete
Hall of Fame
You can keep throwing the pearls at them if you wish. The man love is building . We've seen it before. And there will be no stopping it until April 24th.
threetoedpete
Hall of Fame
Move him to Will backer ?
My favorite LB that might re there when we draft is Barwin
The 2 guys with the most potential are Sidbury & Gilbert. IMO
If Smithiak want one of them they better be willing to take them in the 2nd rd.
The 2 guys with the most potential are Sidbury & Gilbert. IMO
If Smithiak want one of them they better be willing to take them in the 2nd rd.
Did you just wake up from hybernation???
bah007
Hall of Fame
If a guy only has a 6 inch vertical then that's a problem. But I really don't care about the difference between a 35 & 37 inch vertical for a defensive lineman.
We aren't talking basketball. The vertical is a test of power, but it is a test of upward power. The broad jump is a test of forward power, which is a better test for football players.
About Raji, I wouldn't say I'm hot for him. I think he is a good prospect, but if I'm "hot" for anyone it is Orakpo.
Blake
MMQB
Aaron
Noob
If Orakpo miraculously falls to 15 do you take him even with the signing of Antonio Smith???
As a strength coach I can tell you you are kind of splitting hairs with the whole "upward" vs "forward" power thing. Typically athletes that can put up big numbers in either jump are explosive period.
If you want to look at specific power for football look at 10 yd and 20 yd splits and you'll have all the info you'll need.
BTW, I'd be happy with either Raji or Orakpo
mr. peebs
gig 'em
With the 15th pick this year, there are so many different ways the Texans can take this that it's nearly impossible to predict, so I will just say what I would like to happen...
Depending on who is still on the board... trade down with Detroit to #20 and pick up their 3rd or 4th, whichever they're willing to give us... at #20, we then take either Matthews or Jenkins if he's still on the board, and if not, we try to trade the #20 pick to New England for their #34 pick and then switch our 2nd 3rd rounder with their last second rounder.. While I know this series of events has a .0001% chance of ever happening, I would love for it to happen, because then we would have 3 2nd round picks, enabling us to pick up one of the solid second tier LBs like Barwin or possibly English if he's still on the board; also we could go after Sean Smith, and then if everything in this hypothetical draft falls our way, pick up Max Unger with the last 2nd rounder.
I don't want to even attempt to predict what we're going to do in the second day so I won't try, but I hope we take a flyer on Gartrell Johnson from CSU.
Please remember this is completely hypothetical and I know this is never going to happen, but it would be great if it did, at least in my opinion.
Depending on who is still on the board... trade down with Detroit to #20 and pick up their 3rd or 4th, whichever they're willing to give us... at #20, we then take either Matthews or Jenkins if he's still on the board, and if not, we try to trade the #20 pick to New England for their #34 pick and then switch our 2nd 3rd rounder with their last second rounder.. While I know this series of events has a .0001% chance of ever happening, I would love for it to happen, because then we would have 3 2nd round picks, enabling us to pick up one of the solid second tier LBs like Barwin or possibly English if he's still on the board; also we could go after Sean Smith, and then if everything in this hypothetical draft falls our way, pick up Max Unger with the last 2nd rounder.
I don't want to even attempt to predict what we're going to do in the second day so I won't try, but I hope we take a flyer on Gartrell Johnson from CSU.
Please remember this is completely hypothetical and I know this is never going to happen, but it would be great if it did, at least in my opinion.
The Pencil Neck
Hall of Fame
If Orakpo drops to 11 or 12, you go up and get him.
ThruThick&Thin
learning2forum
Its too difficult to predict precisely who will fall to whom, so I've been reading everyone's posts and the draft database with this question in my mind for almost a sense of sanity:
Which players can we all here agree upon to be gone in the first 14?
I would like to think Kubiak and the war room will take THE BEST PLAYER AVAILABLE no matter what position, however we all agree that the Texans can use a spark on D to give us a lil bit sharper teeth.
MY OWN OPINION THUS FAR:
Trade down for Ayers. =) I don't like the idea of linebackers anyways, its true they like Adibi and Zak. They can get another LB somewhere much later for cheaper. Its the same situation with a RB. We have a lot of people at corner, so i dont think you take a CB here either.
You don't need a tackle; is there a guy out there who plays all the O-line positions? Maybe look at him? Safety is a waste of a pick if they aren't a proven headhunter (See Sean Taylor, Ed Reed) otherwise you can grow one in a farm of a program.
What's left? Certainly not a QB in any higher than the round we received in compensation for Sage. A WR like Percy would be good, especially if we got a steal in the 3rd round for a RB. Slaton + Percy + Boss Hog.
AYERS OR HARVIN MATES
EITHER WAY ITS A TRADE DOWN & PILLAGE~ 
Which players can we all here agree upon to be gone in the first 14?
I would like to think Kubiak and the war room will take THE BEST PLAYER AVAILABLE no matter what position, however we all agree that the Texans can use a spark on D to give us a lil bit sharper teeth.
MY OWN OPINION THUS FAR:
Trade down for Ayers. =) I don't like the idea of linebackers anyways, its true they like Adibi and Zak. They can get another LB somewhere much later for cheaper. Its the same situation with a RB. We have a lot of people at corner, so i dont think you take a CB here either.
You don't need a tackle; is there a guy out there who plays all the O-line positions? Maybe look at him? Safety is a waste of a pick if they aren't a proven headhunter (See Sean Taylor, Ed Reed) otherwise you can grow one in a farm of a program.
What's left? Certainly not a QB in any higher than the round we received in compensation for Sage. A WR like Percy would be good, especially if we got a steal in the 3rd round for a RB. Slaton + Percy + Boss Hog.
AYERS OR HARVIN MATES
EITHER WAY ITS A TRADE DOWN & PILLAGE~ threetoedpete
Hall of Fame
As a strength coach I can tell you you are kind of splitting hairs with the whole "upward" vs "forward" power thing. Typically athletes that can put up big numbers in either jump are explosive period.
If you want to look at specific power for football look at 10 yd and 20 yd splits and you'll have all the info you'll need.
BTW, I'd be happy with either Raji or Orakpo
Bull dung. Shovel that some where else please.
BattleRedToro
Thread Killer
If I remember correctly, the Texans drafted DeMeco to play WILL, not SAM, but that doesn't really matter anymore because from everything I have read about him, there is almost zero chance that the Texans will actually move him from his current position as MIKE.
Even if your proposed move makes sense, you are just wasting your time suggesting it, because the Texans will never do it.
Personally, I think if the Texans could find a great MIKE in free agency, that they should take him and move DeMeco to the WILL, and then draft a SAM with their first, but I accept that this will never happen, so I don't waste my time thinking about it anymore.
Even if your proposed move makes sense, you are just wasting your time suggesting it, because the Texans will never do it.
Personally, I think if the Texans could find a great MIKE in free agency, that they should take him and move DeMeco to the WILL, and then draft a SAM with their first, but I accept that this will never happen, so I don't waste my time thinking about it anymore.
I am not sure I follow what you mean? Are you saying there is a significant difference between vertical and broad jump in showing power, or are you disagreeing with the importance of 10 and 20 yd splits?
I think this draft is very fluid as far as BPA at #15 goes.
There's no telling who will be available there.
Those who wants a big DT in the middle would be tempted by Raji.
However, I don't think the Texans are ready to count out Okam yet.
(I can't believe he's listied at 342 lbs at HT.com)
Those who wants pass rush would have to consider Orakpo, Everett Brown or Michael Johnson. I don't think the Texans will be looking for a DE in the first round though.
A case can be made for those who wants another monster at LB.
I don't think it matters that much about the position. We'll be in plenty of nickle and dime packages besides the LB blitzes. Mauluga or Cushing or Maybin... The coaches will make it work. (I don't study enough on the LBs so I don't know who's worth #15.)
I think the Texans will draft a safety as well as a CB.
In that scenario, I can see them trade back to get one late in the first and the other early in the second (or thereabout.)
As much as I like another stud LB, if we can find 2 long-term starters in the D-backfield, I'd say go for it!
There's no telling who will be available there.
Those who wants a big DT in the middle would be tempted by Raji.
However, I don't think the Texans are ready to count out Okam yet.
(I can't believe he's listied at 342 lbs at HT.com)
Those who wants pass rush would have to consider Orakpo, Everett Brown or Michael Johnson. I don't think the Texans will be looking for a DE in the first round though.
A case can be made for those who wants another monster at LB.
I don't think it matters that much about the position. We'll be in plenty of nickle and dime packages besides the LB blitzes. Mauluga or Cushing or Maybin... The coaches will make it work. (I don't study enough on the LBs so I don't know who's worth #15.)
I think the Texans will draft a safety as well as a CB.
In that scenario, I can see them trade back to get one late in the first and the other early in the second (or thereabout.)
As much as I like another stud LB, if we can find 2 long-term starters in the D-backfield, I'd say go for it!
P
Polo
Guest
There is no way I'd move Demeco to Will at this point. If I'm the Texans I'm giving Adibi as many chances as I can to succeed.
Ole Miss Texan
Hall of Fame
Well using your line of thought, we have 2 great WRs with Andre Johnson and Kevin Walter. Andre Davis has a decent sized contract and David Anderson was just given a raise. No need to address WR in the 1st round because we can get a #3 in later rounds and groom him in.
TE? nobody worth the 15th. Daniels is a stud and Dreesen is a good back up.
FB? nope we got a great one with Leach.
DL? WE've got DE pretty much shored up, a pass rusher may be found later. We've already spent high picks on our DTs and our rotation looks good.
All this tells me that we shouldn't select anyone in the 1st round and skip it all together!!
badboy
Hall of Fame
I am open to Atlanta's #25 + a 3rd and 5th. I'd then trade 25th to Detroit for a 2nd and 4th and then we have no 1st and everybody's HAPPY!.Well using your line of thought, we have 2 great WRs with Andre Johnson and Kevin Walter. Andre Davis has a decent sized contract and David Anderson was just given a raise. No need to address WR in the 1st round because we can get a #3 in later rounds and groom him in.
TE? nobody worth the 15th. Daniels is a stud and Dreesen is a good back up.
FB? nope we got a great one with Leach.
DL? WE've got DE pretty much shored up, a pass rusher may be found later. We've already spent high picks on our DTs and our rotation looks good.
All this tells me that we shouldn't select anyone in the 1st round and skip it all together!!
Ole Miss Texan
Hall of Fame
That would be great! I'm actually starting to think if we can get a couple more FA signings that, if nothing else, provide good depth... I'd like to trade down for a 1st in next years' draft. Who with, I don't know. But I'd love to trade our 1st this year for an early to mid 2nd round pick and then pick up that team's 1st round pick in the 2010 draft.
badboy
Hall of Fame
Now you talking, but..Kube's really need's to have a very good year and he will probably want picks this year.
mr. peebs
gig 'em
Do that with the Lions, trading #15 for their second rounder and next years 1st rounder, then take Eric Berry or Taylor Mays with their pick.. there's a very small chance the Lions improve so much they aren't within the top 10 picks next year.. might have to throw something else on our end in to even out the trade a little though, maybe a 3rd, I lost that value chart so I can't equate it exactly.
Ole Miss Texan
Hall of Fame
That's exactly what I would want to happen.
Nothing should be set in stone, now, OleMiss!
Watch that young guy who play opposite Michael Johnson.
#91 Derrick Morgan, Soph, 6'4 - 270 lbs.
7 sacks, same as MJ with 3 more solos and 2 more assists.
You never know.
There might be other guys who can emerge!
ThruThick&Thin
learning2forum
I hope they don't get involved with Michael Johnson.
If you take any D-line, TRADE DOWN and take Ayers. He's proven that not only is he an end, he can move inside and REALLY cause havoc. He also proved he could pick balls at the combine.
Who else showed something like this? Forget Michael Johnson's 40 time, I think we should pick a beast like this man and allow him to do his thing. Allow him to congregate with the boys we have like demeco, bulman, and really get the gang goin.
You really can't beat a big, pissed off D-lineman especially if he has hands in a division with Peyton? I REALLY HOPE, they trade down.
If you take any D-line, TRADE DOWN and take Ayers. He's proven that not only is he an end, he can move inside and REALLY cause havoc. He also proved he could pick balls at the combine.
Who else showed something like this? Forget Michael Johnson's 40 time, I think we should pick a beast like this man and allow him to do his thing. Allow him to congregate with the boys we have like demeco, bulman, and really get the gang goin.
You really can't beat a big, pissed off D-lineman especially if he has hands in a division with Peyton? I REALLY HOPE, they trade down.
Ole Miss Texan
Hall of Fame
To play devil's advocate, Michael Johnson does a very good job of getting his hands up in the passing lane and intercepting or deflecting the pass.
I like Ayers as well and would have been a fan of trading down and taking him in the 20's. However, he kind of reminds me of Antonio Smith... they may be fairly similar. For better or worse I don't know.
BattleRedToro
Thread Killer
Since you state that no TE is worth #15, when should Brandon Pettigrew, Jared Cook, and Cornelius Ingram go, and in what order?
Ole Miss Texan
Hall of Fame
I havn't studied the TEs very much, if at all. Most likely Pettigrew goes first. There's a whole list of players I'd take over him for the Texans though.