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Texans make contract offer to Shelton

Ibar_Harry said:
I can't remember, but I believe it was on ESPN were I read that. In fact what I read I believe referred to the minimum. The only reason I remember was I was surprised that the Texans wanted to low ball this position. If indeed the figure is a low ball then there must be some nervousness on the part of the Texans for some reason.
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The only place I have seen discussions about low offers from the Texans for Shelton were by fans here and at hpf and it was stated in a positive light as in "sure bring him in for competition but only at a small possibly heavily incentive ladden contract." That approach isn't low-balling the guy. He is a 1st rounder who played one year on a new 5 year contract and the team was so disappointed in him they didn't want to keep him even for depth and took a $3.3 mil cap hit to do so. That is something the Texans need to avoid. Sure, give him incentives that would let him get up to a decent salary but do it on top of a very small signing bonus (so he can be cut without too much dead money) and make him compete for the spot. The problem with your low-ball take is it is typically slanted negative to the Texans and overlooks the biggest piece of the equation--the actual player. It is all fine and dandy to say they should look for upgrade LT's, but you don't just haul off and sign a huge risk player to a big contract so you can prove you spent money on a need.
 
Vinny said:
Facts are easy to prove. Prove it. Otherwise it is writer speculation or musings - making logical assumptions. Show me where Charley Casserly has disclosed an offer. I haven't seen anything that says we offered him a minimum contract yet. If you can prove it, great. Then it will be a fact. Frankly it probably is a fact soon (they will likely offer him a contract soon) because he is a bust 1st rounder who just got cut. Probably incentive laden.
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I think calling him a bust is a bit harsh. He may not have lived up to his draft position, but that doesn't neccessarily equate to bust. Afterall, he started something like 68 out of 70 games at LT. Most busts don't do that, and then get rewarded with a large 5 yr contract extension. He was coming off a couple of injuries last year, and showed up out of shape, landing him squarely in Green's doghouse. He used him as an example, because he is trying to instill a different paradigm and mindest on a sad sack team. I'll be the first to admit he isn't likely to be the second coming of Anthony Munoz, but I feel the guy is at least a legit starting LT. And, that is an upgrade from what we have had in the past. As discussed, I would feel better about it if he is signed with a low cap figure, and a heavily incentized contract.
 
Porky said:
I think calling him a bust is a bit harsh. He may not have lived up to his draft position, but that doesn't neccessarily equate to bust. Afterall, he started something like 68 out of 70 games at LT. Most busts don't do that, and then get rewarded with a large 5 yr contract extension. He was coming off a couple of injuries last year, and showed up out of shape, landing him squarely in Green's doghouse. He used him as an example, because he is trying to instill a different paradigm and mindest on a sad sack team. I'll be the first to admit he isn't likely to be the second coming of Anthony Munoz, but I feel the guy is at least a legit starting LT. And, that is an upgrade from what we have had in the past. As discussed, I would feel better about it if he is signed with a low cap figure, and a heavily incentized contract.
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You pretty much summed up my view. :)
 
Vinny said:
Facts are easy to prove. Prove it. Otherwise it is writer speculation or musings - making logical assumptions. Show me where Charley Casserly has disclosed an offer. I haven't seen anything that says we offered him a minimum contract yet. If you can prove it, great. Then it will be a fact. Frankly it probably is a fact soon (they will likely offer him a contract soon) because he is a bust 1st rounder who just got cut. Probably incentive laden.
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As I have stated I read it somewhere, but I can't recall where right now. However, for further verification of what might have happened go to the Justice and McClain report on the Offensive Line. Listen to what John McClain says at the beginning. I was following a post from someone else and wound up at a site with comments on L J Shelton. I was going to mark it and didn't, but that's the way it goes. When I say comments it was an article. Again I wished I would have flagged it....................
 
Didn't he leave H-Town a couple of days ago? If he is back, THAT is a very good sign. I for one didn't think we would be able to get him. Just had a feeling he was stringing us along. So, if we do manage to land him, ya'll can ignore my feelings from here on out. Keep the up dates coming and your fingers and toes crossed.
 
edo783 said:
Didn't he leave H-Town a couple of days ago? If he is back, THAT is a very good sign. I for one didn't think we would be able to get him. Just had a feeling he was stringing us along. So, if we do manage to land him, ya'll can ignore my feelings from here on out. Keep the up dates coming and your fingers and toes crossed.
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I believe he was in town around last Wednesday/Thursday, and left at that time. If he is back, as the report suggests, it's because he is coming to sign imo. There may be a few details to work out, but I would bet a dollar to a dougnut hole, that the major parameters are worked out, and I imagine we'll have an annopuncement tomorrow, or Thursday at the latest. Good news!
 
edo783 said:
Didn't he leave H-Town a couple of days ago? If he is back, THAT is a very good sign. I for one didn't think we would be able to get him. Just had a feeling he was stringing us along. So, if we do manage to land him, ya'll can ignore my feelings from here on out. Keep the up dates coming and your fingers and toes crossed.
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I to thought that he left town but if Vinny heard him on the radio and said he was in town then I also agree with you that its a good sign.

GO GET EM CC!!!!!!!
 
I would expect if he is it will be an incentives contract as I believe Vinny said. That would be a win-win situation. It would be nice to be able to see David have a chance to look down field. I still say an O-line is the missing piece to the Texan's puzzle. Just think we would have AJ,LJ and TJ. Kind of interesting when you think about it. If Bennie ever gets well we could add BJ to that mix.
 
This is the good news that I have been waiting for. There are mixed opinions about this guy, but one thing I think we can all agree on, is that he will surely add competition to the line, which we all know is never a bad thing, and I feel he is at least somewhat of an upgrade over what we have now.
 
I'm not going to lie, I know almost nothing about Shelton. But I have read in several bits and pieces he has athleticism. Put that into our zone blocking scheme, throw in the incentive filled contract if we sign him, and it could be a recipe for a solid young LT for the next several years.
 
KPRC-TV reported that the Texans spoke with Shelton's agent (Eric Metz) today, but no progress was made. :shrug:
 
Lucky said:
KPRC-TV reported that the Texans spoke with Shelton's agent (Eric Metz) today, but no progress was made. :shrug:
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Vinny you did hear Shelton on the radio and he did say he was in Houston and close to signing, right???? Please update.
 
Maybe we should try plugging Matt Stone into the O-line. I don't suppose he could block worth a damn, but he might just freak the defense out to the point where they just didn't want to go near him.
 
Pardonez-moi for the green question....

What is holding up the signing, is it money or the fine print? This is a "what do you speculate" answer that I am looking for. Signing finesse is something I haven't paid much attention to. :)
 
FILO_girl said:
Pardonez-moi for the green question....

What is holding up the signing, is it money or the fine print? This is a "what do you speculate" answer that I am looking for. Signing finesse is something I haven't paid much attention to. :)
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Well, I guess it depends if him and his agent are here in town, as 790 apparently reported. I haven't been able to find another media outlet reporting this. If he isn't here, I jumped the gun. Assuming he is here, I would speculate it's just down to minor stuff, like incentives and such. Just a guess though. If he isn't here, then there could still be a major divide in base money, years, signing bonus, etc.
 
Porky said:
Well, I guess it depends if him and his agent are here in town, as 790 apparently reported. I haven't been able to find another media outlet reporting this. If he isn't here, I jumped the gun. Assuming he is here, I would speculate it's just down to minor stuff, like incentives and such. Just a guess though. If he isn't here, then there could still be a major divide in base money, years, signing bonus, etc.
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If you listen to McClain it would appear the initial offers were not that high. McClain talked about minimum plus perhaps a little. Vinny was all over me for that, but what can I say. I believe I read that somewhere else also. The Texans are acting like there's something bothering them about Shelton, but may be that's a ploy. He might come here and be great simply because of how he feels and how he fits in and then again he could be a big bust. This is not a clear cut decision. Its not like the Pace situation. It does look like it has some potential, however.
 
Ibar_Harry said:
The Texans are acting like there's something bothering them about Shelton, but may be that's a ploy.
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I don't beleive it's a ploy. The guy was released by the Cards for crying out loud. Do you want them to break the bank on a high risk guy who was just cut by his former team? What kind of ploy would the Texans be employing?

By the way, I found an interesting article written today out of Cleveland entitled
Ex-Card Shelton may interest Browns.

A few key quotes:

“At this point, L.J. has visited Houston and Chicago,” Shelton’s agent, Vance Larimer, said Tuesday. “We’re contemplating whether to visit elsewhere.

“It’s still kind of preliminary, and we haven’t talked to Cleveland at this point.”

The 6-foot-6, 335-pound giant was thrown into competition for the right-tackle job, and won it. But he missed the last three games with a left-knee injury.

“He’s got a lot left,” Larimer said. “Certainly he played at a high level at left tackle two years ago.”


If it asks you to register to view the article, try using:
wally@trashmail.net
wally
 
Ibar_Harry said:
If you listen to McClain it would appear the initial offers were not that high. McClain talked about minimum plus perhaps a little. Vinny was all over me for that, but what can I say.
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You stated you had 'facts', and I told you to prove facts, otherwise it is speculation. As to the rest of your speculation, odds are the sky isn't falling.
 
Vinny said:
You stated you had 'facts', and I told you to prove facts, otherwise it is speculation. As to the rest of your speculation, odds are the sky isn't falling.
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Have you listened to McClain? Seems like he's quite definite in his statement of the facts. There are written as well as spoken statements of fact - Vinny. I guess you are saying McClain is not telling the truth.
 
If Casserly laid out his Shelton offer to McClain you can prove it pretty easy. Everything is speculation until the real facts come out.
 
Vinny said:
If Casserly laid out his Shelton offer to McClain you can prove it pretty easy. Everything is speculation until the real facts come out.
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Again, you have made your statement, but did you listen to John McClain Vinny? Is the source the Texans or Shelton's agent? I don't think it is clear, but it is clear what was probably offered. I think I have offered ample proof of what I have said from a reasonable source. I think he has some inside info on a number of these issues. Is he always right, NO. But you certainly do have to listen to what he says even when we don't like what he says.
 
He says "I think they offered the mimimum or a little more". That is speculation. We really don't know what they are discussing. This chicken little stuff just gets old. Justice doesn't know much about football, he should stick to baseball.
 
Vinny said:
He says "I think they offered the mimimum or a little more". That is speculation. We really don't know what they are discussing. This chicken little stuff just gets old. Justice doesn't know much about football, he should stick to baseball.
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Again, Vinny, its not Justice who says how much, its McClain. In any event folks go list to the Justice and McClain show on the Texans offensive line and listen for yourself. Vinny my statements are not made up and correct as stated. Is this the gosspel? No, but I think you mistakenly thought I made up these facts and I did not.
 
I heard it Ibar. He is doing what is commonly referred to as 'speculating'....either way its not a big deal. I just want real facts portrayed as real facts for the other fans, and speculation portrayed as speculation.
 
Ibar_Harry said:
Again, Vinny, its not Justice who says how much, its McClain. In any event folks go list to the Justice and McClain show on the Texans offensive line and listen for yourself. Vinny my statements are not made up and correct as stated. Is this the gosspel? No, but I think you mistakenly thought I made up these facts and I did not.
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Ibar, if it's "speculation" than it is not "fact"- that's the point. Vinny wasn't calling you a liar. He was saying that you were misrepresenting conjecture as something much more than that.

The fact that McClain commented that he thinks the Texans probably made a contract offer of a certain amount is not evidence that it did happen and happened the way he says. It's just an hypothesis of his that will or will not be proven over time. So, it would be premature to react to this conjecture as if it is what happened.
 
dalemurphy said:
Ibar, if it's "speculation" than it is not "fact"- that's the point. Vinny wasn't calling you a liar. He was saying that you were misrepresenting conjecture as something much more than that.

The fact that McClain commented that he thinks the Texans probably made a contract offer of a certain amount is not evidence that it did happen and happened the way he says. It's just an hypothesis of his that will or will not be proven over time. So, it would be premature to react to this conjecture as if it is what happened.
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what he said
 
McClain's comments were basically specaultion, but mixed with some facts. McClain obviously has inside contacts and didnt have the figures in front of him, but he commented that at first.

here is a little summary of some comments

"The Texans were not interested in Shelton because his agent Eric Mentz wanted too much money. And then they offered the minimum or maybe a little more and Shelton came in."

"He will get a job somewhere in the NFL because LT are needed. The Texans are not going to spend a lot of money on a guy they are not sure will be starting"

Thats what McClain said - no figures.

I posted the link to the radio show a few pages back for those interested.
 
"...And then they offered the minimum and maybe a little more ."

what exactly would be "a little more"... Well, according to McClain "a little more" will be whatever he gets signed to, if it happens. Of course there aren't any numbers, if there were then it would be harder for McClain to assure himself the ability to say "I told you so".
 
This is just another bandage to our offensive line. Pitts and Wand? Really, can anyone expect them to be better than average? Here we are trying to bring in a LT with 2 months to go before training camp, that IS alarming. This isn't just for depth, this is to fix a broken leak. Who said Boselli is still not affecting us?
 
How is it that there are no quality Tackles that are not on teams in the NFL right now. I know that the play overseas, but it is ridiculous that we are having this much difficulty fielding a starting unit.
 
wrestler4life said:
How is it that there are no quality Tackles that are not on teams in the NFL right now. I know that the play overseas, but it is ridiculous that we are having this much difficulty fielding a starting unit.
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Difficulty? We have a starting unit: Wand, Pitts, McKinney, Weigert, Wade... Stop condemning the organizations for attempting to upgrade the position, either with potential starters or depth... That's what we want them to do....

If you want to complain about the OL then complain about Weary and MBrown... when they are filling in is when the OL looks so bad: Cleveland!!

Wand is 24 and Pitts is 25? and they both have 1 year experience at their positions. The pessismism on this board is amazing, especially considering the team has improved every season as is the youngest team in the NFL going into season #4.
 
dalemurphy said:
Difficulty? We have a starting unit: Wand, Pitts, McKinney, Weigert, Wade... Stop condemning the organizations for attempting to upgrade the position, either with potential starters or depth... That's what we want them to do....

Sorry, I meant "quality" starting unit.
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SESupergenius said:
Who said Boselli is still not affecting us?
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The fact is Boselli never affected us. Casserly and Capers knew very well that he might never play. We had a deal worked out with Jacksonville that if we took Boselli then we could also take Walker and Payne.
 
Hey, I have an idea. . . How about that unless anyone has any NEW news about signing this guy, we don't post here. Every time I see a new post I get all excited thinking there is something new. . . Only to find out there is no news....I'm going crazy over here :hairpull: :hairpull:

I'm just giving everyone a hard time here...Relax, please don't feel the need to flash on me lol
 
Speaking of Cleveland, I just heard Shelton (or his agent) is there tonight (790am again). I don't know what was accomplished here yesterday if anything.
 
Vinny said:
Speaking of Cleveland, I just heard Shelton (or his agent) is there tonight (790am again). I don't know what was accomplished here yesterday if anything.
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Thanks, Vinny. It will be interesting to see what transpires. This is getting to be a real game.
 
TexansTrueFan said:
from the looks of things he wont be with us next season. I mean if its gonna happen i think it woulda happened already.
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May be the're trying to see who blinks 1st. It might go either way, but again if our offer is at the minimum levels as stated that could be the problem. But that could be because of the way the Texans feel about him. It looks like he wants money and we aren't willing to part with what he wants. So be it.....
 
Ibar_Harry said:
As an added note, could this be speculation on 790 AM's part.
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Actually, they reported that as a fact. This stuff is not as hard as it looks Ibar. :)
 
Vinny said:
Actually, they reported that as a fact. This stuff is not as hard as it looks Ibar. :)
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That was a little tongue in cheek, Vinny. Take it easy, we just disagree a lot. We both want the same we just differ on how we are going to get there. I don't think not getting Shelton bothers you and I'm not so certain it bothers me. Perhaps this is not the right guy.......
 
Ibar_Harry said:
May be the're trying to see who blinks 1st. It might go either way, but again if our offer is at the minimum levels as stated that could be the problem. But that could be because of the way the Texans feel about him. It looks like he wants money and we aren't willing to part with what he wants. So be it.....
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yah well i'll live if we dont get him, plus i feel the coaches want the same guys on the line this year that they had last year, otherwise we woulda heard about it.
 
yah well i'll live if we dont get him, plus i feel the coaches want the same guys on the line this year that they had last year, otherwise we woulda heard about it.
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I doubt if they wanted the same guys on the line they would have gone after Pace and now Shelton...
 
if they had really wanted pace they coulda made an offer he woulda taken, its not like at the time we were in any kinda cap trouble. It was an opportunity to get a good guy they took it and lost, i wouldnt pass on any kinda all star player either, no matter who i had at the postioion already.
 
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