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Luck, Mahomes, or Watson

Chris

Chris

Waterboy
If you are a NFL GM and you were to start a franchise right now who would take as your QB as your 1st RD pick?
 
Mahomes.

Injury history and arm talent would be the deciding factors for me.

But I love all three. Think all of them are capable of leading teams to rings with the right pieces and coach.
 
The teams with good QB's would not leave them unprotected. Some have a dazzling 1st year and then settle back as fallible humans: Prescott, Watson, Mahomes(?)....
 
Luck just seems 'good' at best these days, so, meh.

Had Mahomes ahead of Watson by a good margin prior to the draft, and Watson has done plenty to shrink that gap, but Patrick has only solidified what I liked about him coming out, and done so in spades.

Wouldn't trade them straight up now, because Deshaun is simply 'ours' now and I'm completely confident he can hold up his end of the bargain to bring the big one home and the guy is nothing if not easy to root for, but if the idea is to get in a time machine and all that I still prefer Mahomes as the better young franchise qb.
 
Mollywhopper said:
Luck just seems 'good' at best these days, so, meh.

Had Mahomes ahead of Watson by a good margin prior to the draft, and Watson has done plenty to shrink that gap, but Patrick has only solidified what I liked about him coming out, and done so in spades.

Wouldn't trade them straight up now, because Deshaun is simply 'ours' now and I'm completely confident he can hold up his end of the bargain to bring the big one home and the guy is nothing if not easy to root for, but if the idea is to get in a time machine and all that I still prefer Mahomes as the better young franchise qb.
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That’s fair. You also must consider system fit. Mahomes seems better w/Reid’s offense, not saying Watson couldn’t either, maybe better? But we’ll never know, just hope O’Brian figures it out before it’s too late.
 
Chris said:
If you are a NFL GM and you were to start a franchise right now who would take as your QB as your 1st RD pick?
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If there was an expansion team forming up, which Texans would you initially protect from piracy?
 
Texecutioner said:
This is a passer's league and Mahomes is far and away better than the other two arm wise. He also hasn't thrown an INT so far, so at this point he looks like the most mistake free QB out of the three.
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Trying to separate for scheme and personnel

Mahomes has him on the arm strength...Mahomes arm strength is hard to comprehend. I saw vid of him casually launching the bar over 80 yds....

Playmaking i'll call it a push -- Watson is a more dynamic runner and can still make big time throws....Mahomes can seed the ball anywhere downfield when he scrambles

Mahomes has a cleaner injury history

Watson has rare poise

I'll give the edge to Wats because the poise is gonna carry him through some tough situations
 
edromeo said:
Trying to separate for scheme and personnel

Mahomes has him on the arm strength...Mahomes arm strength is hard to comprehend. I saw vid of him casually launching the bar over 80 yds....

Playmaking i'll call it a push -- Watson is a more dynamic runner and can still make big time throws....Mahomes can seed the ball anywhere downfield when he scrambles

Mahomes has a cleaner injury history

Watson has rare poise

I'll give the edge to Wats because the poise is gonna carry him through some tough situations
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So far Mahomes has shown a better tendency to get the W. Watson played great last season, but still was losing several games. Part of that is due to his TO's. Mahomes has thrown zero picks and has also had his defense put their team in tough situations, but his lack of TO's made a difference. Watson still hasn't even found his groove yet this season. We'll see what happens.
 
Texecutioner said:
So far Mahomes has shown a better tendency to get the W. Watson played great last season, but still was losing several games. Part of that is due to his TO's. Mahomes has thrown zero picks and has also had his defense put their team in tough situations, but his lack of TO's made a difference. Watson still hasn't even found his groove yet this season. We'll see what happens.
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We're seeing different things then. A QB doesn't get the W the team gets the W. I was looking at the QB as prospects trying to divorce them form team related stuff as if both played for the Chiefs

But you are right that Mahomes has thrown fewer INTs but then again when you've only been sacked 4 times? A QB is going to have an easier go of things.

I think Watson is playing better then many people give him credit for....but the bar was set at such a ridiculously high level last year that his production this years 'seems' tepid by comparison even though it most certainly isn't.
 
Only because of Watson's injury history, I'm leaning Mahomes.

Many people mentioned INTs as a difference between Watson and Mahomes. What's funny is that going into the season, the Chiefs had major concerns about Mahomes and turnovers. During training camp, he threw seven INTs. The regular season starts and he hasn't thrown one. I think he is due for

Right now, Mahomes has the advantage because Andy Reid is a better offensive coach and teacher than O'Brien. However, similar to O'Brien, Reid has the bad habit of making questionable time management decisions at the most crucial times. That might be the equalizer in the playoffs.

I don't recall a time where so many teams had so many young, promising QBs. I'm just glad we seem to have one on our favorite team.

https://arrowheadaddict.com/2018/08/01/concerning-patrick-mahomes-interceptions-training-camp/
 
If we're using time machines, I'd take a pre injury, pre bad coaching Andrew Luck. That dude understands the game & has all the tools in spades. Had he been with a strong offensive teaching coach, he'd have won a couple of Super Bowls by now.

I think.

But I've been watching Luck a lot longer than the other two & right now I'm not too sure what either of them are, or could be.
 
thunderkyss said:
If we're using time machines, I'd take a pre injury, pre bad coaching Andrew Luck. That dude understands the game & has all the tools in spades. Had he been with a strong offensive teaching coach, he'd have won a couple of Super Bowls by now.

I think.

But I've been watching Luck a lot longer than the other two & right now I'm not too sure what either of them are, or could be.
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That would be my take exactly. You couldn't build a better QB - but coaching, injuries and a bad offensive line took their toll quickly. Sounds familiar.
 
I had Mahomes rated higher in the draft than Watson - By Far and away.

Watson has played better than I thought he would , good enough to make me believe you can win the ultimate goal with him.

Mahomes has showed exactly what I liked in the evaluation process …. in spades.


Luck doesn't fit this conversation …. but he's been hurt too much and I wonder if he has HWWNBM disease (gun shy from the beatings) cause he's not the same guy.


I'd take Mahomes …. wouldn't think twice.
 
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Texansphan said:
You could also add Jared Goff or Carson Wentz to that list.
Personally, good coaching, including a suitable scheme, will make a decent QB out of any of these guys.
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That's the Jon Gruden way. Find someone, even a yeoman, who can understand his playcalling and run with it.
 
Mahomes, better a talent, no injury history.

Pf course Mahomes was my favorite qb in that draft.

I would've given up the second round pick that was Cunningham to get Mahomes.
 
Mahomes, better a talent, no injury history.

Pf course Mahomes was my favorite qb in that draft.

I would've given up the second round pick that was Cunningham to get Mahomes.
 
infantrycak said:
That's the Jon Gruden way. Find someone, even a yeoman, who can understand his playcalling and run with it.
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infantrycak said:
That's the Jon Gruden way. Find someone, even a yeoman, who can understand his playcalling and run with it.
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Perhaps. If you have a useful "yeoman", like a Case Keenum or Ryan Fitzpatrick, then my criteria, plus a competent oline will make for a decent offense.
The thing is, in this league, if you don't luck into a top 5 QB in a draft (which does not happen all too often), then it is wise to employ a continguency plan such as I outlined to give your guy the best chance.
After all, how many seasons do we see 32 elite QB's playing? Or even 5 for that matter.
They are just not that common.
 
Texansphan said:
Perhaps. If you have a useful "yeoman", like a Case Keenum or Ryan Fitzpatrick, then my criteria, plus a competent oline will make for a decent offense.
The thing is, in this league, if you don't luck into a top 5 QB in a draft (which does not happen all too often), then it is wise to employ a continguency plan such as I outlined to give your guy the best chance.
After all, how many seasons do we see 32 elite QB's playing? Or even 5 for that matter.
They are just not that common.
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Not entirely disagreeing with you. Schaub succeeded out of no great talent because he was in a system that fit. Against all odds really because the coach adapted. That's the point I'm trying to make. It's a two way street as the saying goes. Schaub was a smart sloth with one redeeming value, a play fake to die for. Kubiak worked with that.

You see OB working to Watson's strengths (which include a fantastic play fake)?
 
infantrycak said:
Not entirely disagreeing with you. Schaub succeeded out of no great talent because he was in a system that fit. Against all odds really because the coach adapted. That's the point I'm trying to make. It's a two way street as the saying goes. Schaub was a smart sloth with one redeeming value, a play fake to die for. Kubiak worked with that.

You see OB working to Watson's strengths (which include a fantastic play fake)?
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We did last week
 
infantrycak said:
Not entirely disagreeing with you. Schaub succeeded out of no great talent because he was in a system that fit. Against all odds really because the coach adapted. That's the point I'm trying to make. It's a two way street as the saying goes. Schaub was a smart sloth with one redeeming value, a play fake to die for. Kubiak worked with that.

You see OB working to Watson's strengths (which include a fantastic play fake)?
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What I would really like to see is an OC.
It's pretty obvious OB can't do HC and OC at the same time.
 
Better comparision would be with Goff and Wentz included. We have the worst OC/HC out of all those options, a worse o-line, and no solutions into protecting Deshaun and Deshaun is still putting up these stats
 
Watson has "it" and you can (I think) win it all with him. It's just too bad that Bill O'Brain is slowly going to get "it" beaten out of him before he can get to the summit. This offense is a joke and I'm not just talking about things like the play calling. O'Brain admits weekly that he needed to call better plays and we should take him at his word on that but it's not the only aspect of the job where he is without question the limiting factor.

Players play and coaches coach but when you see guys come in here year after year and not execute what they've been practicing for in some cases years you gotta start wondering if the coaches just aren't teaching. They can't all be morons who just won't get it. When you see players show up exciting and slowly morph into the usual 17-19 points a week that we get out of guys in this system that's on O'Brain. If his subordinates are falling short he should be the one spotting that. This is no different than how Gary Kubiak should have been dealing with his DC problem all those years he was burning up the best seasons of guys like Mario Williams, Brian Cushing and DeMeco Ryans.

There's not a thing wrong with Watson that a better head coach wouldn't be able to work around. You could give O'Brain rookie Steve Young and he'd turn him into some kind of David Carr/Tom Savage mashup in a few seasons all while keeping Big Enos & Little Enos dreaming of Tom Brady-like performances being just around the corner.
 
Mahomes... hard for me to get a real take on him with all those weapons around him & that scheme. He looks better than Alex Smith, by far. How would he look if he only had one dependable receiver?

I mean how much better would Watson look if we'd run pick routes?
 
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I say Watson, yeah Mahomes looks better right now but a lot that is how good his team also is making him look. Don't get me wrong he's talented no question but it's also no question that KC just has a better overall team. We've beaten who's fault that is to death but the fact is that Watson has done less with more. He's has basically gone onto the field this year with no real target other than Nuk and that's while having to run for his life almost every play. Mahomes been sacked like 26 times his whole season, at times it felt like Watson was sacked 26 times in one game.
 
thunderkyss said:
Mahomes... hard for me to get a real take on him with all those weapons around him & that scheme. He looks better than Alex Smith, by far. How would he look if he only had one dependable receiver?

So your saying they need more talent in their receiving corps.
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Thorn said:
They're both good QBs. The difference is one has a good support staff and players around him, the other doesn't.
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Another thing to consider is injury history. Taking that away I’d still give the slight edge to Mahomes due to greater arm strength of the two.
 
The question is unfair on Watson, because we've seen the other two in good offenses. From what we have seen though you can't really pick against Mahomes. Watson may be the best, but we also may never find that out.
 
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