The Medic01
Waterboy
Where would you put him?
Me it's #2 behind Willis and in front of Lewis by 1.
What about you?
Me it's #2 behind Willis and in front of Lewis by 1.
What about you?
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Where would you put him?
Me it's #2 behind Willis and in front of Lewis by 1.
What about you?
Brian Cushing doesn't go where you put him, he goes where he wants.
Call me a homer, but I say #1.
So are you calling yourself a homer or do you truly believe he's #1 and acknowledge that your opinion may be the target of homer claims?
I think Willis is the clear cut #1. And Cushing is battling for #2 with tier that includes Beason, Mayo, and Johnson.
Players like Lewis and Urlacher are a shell of their former shelf and have more value with their leadership and familiarity. But I think many teams would take any of the names I listed above over these two if they were to start a team today.
How many of them are 3 down players .... I'd put Cushing at the very top of the list because he never comes off the field.
Willis might be a better run stopper but Cushing is better in both coverage and getting after the QB.
Cushing had more sacks , more INT's and more tackles than either Lewis or Willis - only Urlacher had more INT's but had 0 sacks or FF.
They are all playmakers , thats for sure , its the nature of the position. Who you place #1 is very subjective.
ProFootballFocus had Cush rated #2 overall to Navarro Bowman and just ahead of Willis in 2011. #1 Rush ILB, #9 Coverage, #19 Run
From their Signature Statistics -- custom combined/weighted
#3 in Run Stop Percentage
#5 in Pass Rush Productivity
#7 in Tackling Efficiency
#21 in Pass Coverage
It's an underline -- rankings/signature stats are subscription only.Your link doesnt link.
It's an underline -- rankings/signature stats are subscription only.
ProFootballFocus had Cush rated #2 overall to Navarro Bowman and just ahead of Willis in 2011. #1 Rush ILB, #9 Coverage, #19 Run
From their Signature Statistics -- custom combined/weighted
#3 in Run Stop Percentage
#5 in Pass Rush Productivity
#7 in Tackling Efficiency
#21 in Pass Coverage
Yeah, that's their version of the Top 101 players in the league. They don't clarify how they rank the Top 101 or how the parameters for their signature stats. But the general idea comes through. There's a broad range of specific stats they keep.According to the thread you started in the NFL forum, they have both Willis (#20) and Derrick Johnson (#28) ranked ahead of Cushing (#32) in addition to Bowman (#14).
Yeah, that's their version of the Top 101 players in the league. They don't clarify how they rank the Top 101 or how the parameters for their signature stats. But the general idea comes through. There's a broad range of specific stats they keep.
Johnson & Bowman are significantly ahead of the other top ILBs against the run.
It's all in post #7. I fixed a mis-type in that post.Where does Cushing rank in comparison Vs the pass and rushing the QB?
Willis gets to plays that Cushing wishes he could get to. I like Cush quite a bit, so this ain't a cut down...just reality.I like Cushing over Willis. I realize that puts me in the minority, but I'm OK with that. Tackles are a funny stat. To me, Cush makes more game changing plays. His rookie season was definitely more full of game changing plays, like turnovers (and a badass safety), and last year was a return to that form, for the most part.
1. Patrick Willis - I am a Texans fan but I have to give this guy credit. To me he is the best, no 1 & 1a. Patrick Willis is a Monster, period. In 2007 he had 174 tackles and is averaging 138.4 tackles in his 5 year career. That is insane.
Middle linebacker Patrick Willis of the San Francisco 49ers was the NFL Defensive Rookie of the Year in 2007.
If you trust his statistics, he should have been the NFL's Defensive Player of the Year as well. Maybe even the NFL Defensive Player of the Decade.
Willis was credited with 226 tackles by the 49ers – a staggering 42 more than the league's next most prolific tackler, Ray Lewis of the Baltimore Ravens.
Willis collected 117 more tackles than the starting NFC middle linebacker in the Pro Bowl (Lofa Tatupu, Seattle Seahawks) and 99 more than the AFC starter (Demeco Ryans, Houston Texans). Was Willis that much more active, that much more proficient than any other defensive player in the NFL?
But I don't trust the statistics – not tackle stats, anyway.
Each NFL team employs a stat crew for its home games. That crew's final statistics are deemed official by the league office: yardage for rushing, passing, receiving and various kick returns plus field goal and punting distances, sacks, interceptions, touchdowns ...
But 28 of the 32 NFL teams do not acknowledge the press box tackle stats as official. On the Monday following games, NFL defensive coaching staffs break down the films on their own and award a new set of tackle numbers. Those are listed by each team as its "official" tackle count.
Willis was credited with 174 tackles by NFL stat crews in 2007. Upon further review, the San Francisco coaches gave him credit for 52 more tackles, bumping his "official" count to 226.
San Francisco linebacker Patrick Willis wrapped up Minnesota's Adrian Peterson for one of his NFL-leading 226 tackles last season. But was it a legitimate total?
found it.... i remembered it because i started a thread on it at the time. dont know how relevat it is as you seem to have quoted his press box tackles figure
http://www.texanstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=52378
Brian Cushing doesn't go where you put him, he goes where he wants.
Call me a homer, but I say #1.
Willis gets to plays that Cushing wishes he could get to. I like Cush quite a bit, so this ain't a cut down...just reality.
I understand the Willis v. Cushing debate. I can't believe anyone would rank the current Lewis over either of them.
I think just as we are a bit biased, I'd say the ole 49er fan is a bit biased as well. I mean no doubt, Willis is no worse than #3 on the list and personally I'd give him the top spot, but by no means is it a landslide victory as you suggest. Cushing is definitely better in coverage and seems to be a more well rounded ILB. Willis is simply the best tackler in the NFL. He flat out doesn't miss and when he hits guys, he smashes them.
I do question just how good Bowman is. I mean for him to step in like he did when Willis went down just seems a bit suspicious. Perhaps the ILB numbers are a result of the scheme and as is suggested above, maybe the numbers are inflated. If he does it again next year, I'll be a believer but as of now, I'm skeptical.
1. Willis
2a. Cushing
2b. Lewis
I understand the Willis v. Cushing debate. I can't believe anyone would rank the current Lewis over either of them.