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Badboy, rmartin65 & beerlover Final 2012 Group Mock

beerlover

Hall of Fame
Final Texan Group Mock Draft of 2012

Here is our annual final version 2012 Texan Mock Draft, compliments of Badboy, rmartin65 & beerlover. No big reaches early, solid middle with low risk high reward prospects late. This was a group effort with multiple edited versions, starting with #26 & finishing with a total redo proposal trashed. Need really drove this draft, from giving Schaub protection, more targets in passing game, along with depth behind him & Yates. Wade Phillips didn't come away empty handed either, addressing OLB to provide depth/rotation & interior NT to develop. Even pushed a kicker for Joe Marciano to break in.

FIRST ROUND, #26: Coby Fleener TE Stanford. 6’6” 247, arm length 33 3/8”, hand size 10”
We have all identified that a huge need for the Texans is a second option in the passing game, and Fleener fits the bill nicely. While he is not a WR, Coby should provide match-up problems (size and strength vs DBs, speed vs LBs) that no WR in the draft can. Fleener possesses excellent body control and soft hands, both of which are musts in today’s NFL. We are not expecting him to be the next Gronkowski, but we do think he has the potential to be a premier receiving TE sooner rather than later. Fleener has steadily improved during his time at Stanford and turned into a technical, effective route runner who is able to separate at the top of routes. He would fast become Schaub’s #2 receiving option in double set TE formation Kubiak favors. Coby will go up for the ball in traffic, people will discover he is more physical than expected & willing blocker that will improve in time just like he showcased steady improvement while @ Stanford. He is a smooth athlete who looks natural running deep down the field, even at his height something Texans need & covet along with 2nd rounder Brian Quick this not only stretches the field it creates multiple match-up problems for defensive coordinators & Arian Foster should continue his ground assault without teams crowding the box.
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SECOND ROUND, #58: Brian Quick, WR Appalachian State. 6’4” 220, 34 ¼” arm length, hand size 9 ¾”
Former Basketball player & High Jumper Quick passes the eye test looking the part of a NFL 1st rd. WR. If not for his late start (played only one year of High School Football) he would have been heavily recruited by a bigger school other than a NCAA Division I FCS level school, but then probably doesn’t make it to 58th overall selection after developing four years into a 1st team All American. 71 receptions, 1096 yards & 11 TD’s his senior year. Quick has also proven to be durable with no recent nagging injuries to speak of, no ACL tears or hamstring issues, you have to go back 2007, his second year playing football, that he redshirted because of back pain, but not before helping Mountaineers upset Michigan in that memorable upset when young Brian used his length & vertical jump to block what would have been a game winning field goal for that devastated Wolverine team. Check off the Texan requirements in both size & speed departments, ran in low 4.5’s w/outstanding length, over 80” wingspan. Clean on/off field. Willing blocker, special teams standout & does not have diva attitude, someone for Andre to help groom to reach his potential.
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THIRD ROUND, #76: Ronnell Lewis DE/OLB Oklahoma. 6'2" 253, 32 ½” arm length, hand size 9 ¼”
Early-entry Junior nicknamed "The Hammer" by teammates. Although he only played in 10 games, stats good: 59 T with 13 TFL (5.5 sacks) 5 passes batted down with a forced fumble and 1 INT. Solid Combine benched 36, ran 7.09 short shuttle which showcased his natural strength & change of direction speed, leading us to believe talent is there to stand-up & fit in Wade Phillips 3-4. He plays physically with violence & aggressive hand use. *Note he outplayed Seminole OT’s Datko and Sanders late in season. Sharp footwork, fluid quickness & keeps eyes up locating ball fast & have smooth change of direction. Teams impressed with his interviews during the combine & how he explained how his grades kept him from bowl game. He possess a strong will with high motor, similar to Brooks Reed & Connor Barwin which leads one to believe he cannot be held in check a whole game & will get to the QB.
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FOURTH ROUND, #99: Phillip Blake C/OG Baylor. 6'2" 311, arm length 33" hand size 9 3/4"
Senior, three year starter, already played in a pro-style offense with RG3. Needs an NFL conditioning program to keep weight but change some flab to muscle. Regardless, he is a man. Combine bench was 22 which belies his strength. Did well against much heavier Ta'Amu (DT) & brains will allow him to back up Myers calling the Oline and should contest for RG if not start. He has low center of gravity with strong anchor that allows him to maintain position against big DTs. Hand placement could be better but few got by him. Texans' QBs ability to take snap from center rather than shotgun like RG# will benefit this man mountain as will the ZBS. Some mention his age but not an issue as he should last 5-6+ years. Oh BTW? Myers just signed long term deal & he turns 31 Sept 15th. Top Offensive line performer @ Combine in both vertical (29.5”) & long jump (105”).
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FOURTH ROUND, #121: Levy Adcock, OT/OG Oklahoma State. 6’5” 322, 33” arm length, hand size 9 ½”
Snubbed by the combine, despite selected to Big 12 First Team & not allowing a single sack all year playing LT in the Cowboys high profile passing offense. Adcock is your classic late bloomer, who added 30 pounds his senior year as his frame filled out. Levy is more athletic than given credit for & can line up multiple positions (LT/RT or LG/RG) adding plus value to his draft stock. Plays with attitude, confidence & brings his lunch pail to work every day. In the mold of a more talented, diverse prospect than recently departed Mike Brisel. While far from a finished product Levy possess natural knee bend, technique, size & experience to start in a pinch if needed. Impressed scouts at OSU Pro-Day running a fluid 5.18 forty, benched 26 times, with 27 ½” vertical. Along with Center /OG Phillip Blake early in 4th Texans can rebuild interior of their OL vacated by Brisel/Winston, back-up for Myers & replacement swing tackle for Butler.[/QUOTE]
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FIFTH ROUND, #161: Ryan Lindley, QB San Diego State. 6’3 3/4” 229, 32 ¼” arm length, hand size 10 1/8”
Looking at the Texans roster, there are only 2 QBs listed- Schaub and Yates. Matt is coming off a serious injury, and will be a highly paid free agent after this coming season, while we all like Yates, it is simply not prudent to put all of our eggs in one basket. Therefore, we have decided to draft Ryan Lindley at this spot in the draft. Lindley boasts excellent size for the position, and is quite adept at throwing on the move, but is even better in the pocket. A 4 year starter, Lindley exhibits great maturity. So why does he fall this far? The answer is simple- competition and accuracy. Playing in the MWC is obviously not the same as playing in the SEC, and as for accuracy, Lindley needs some work. The ability is there, but he is just not consistent. All in all, he should be a great 3rd QB this season, with the potential to be a starting QB down the line. Texans need to use Kubiak’s feel & developmental abilities @ the QB position, someday instead of just letting coveted free agents walk, where they have depth these young, developed QB’s have great trading value down the road if they so choose.
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SIXTH ROUND, #195: Randy Bullock, Kicker Texas A&M. 5’10” 205, 100 PAT% 2009-10
Bullock won the Lou Groza Award as College Football’s top kicker in 2011. 29 of 33 Field Goal attempts made, increasing FG 87.9% from 76.2% in 2010 while increasing length. His trend line is a positive one, that is important to a kicker’s confidence & proving track record based on sound fundamentals moving forward to the NFL. His range is currently already in the 50 yard territory with a 52 yard FG this past season setting a new personal best . With strengthening & more technical work he can be expected to extend his range into the mid to high 50 yard range on a consistent basis. Scouts came away impressed with his leg strength both at the Combine & Pro-Day. http://blog.chron.com/ultimatetexans/2012/03/texans-check-out-texas-am-kicker/ Randy already looks the part of a NFL kicker, both quality of character, work ethic & maturity. We feel it’s time special teams coach grooms a young 10-15 year starter to become the Texans long term answer & closer.

SEVENTH ROUND, #233: Ishmaa’ily Kitchen, NT Kent State. 6’3” 334, 35 reps 31” vertical
Our last pick is going towards a developmental player that flashed brilliance at the college level, but needs to be coached up to his talents. Yes, the Texans are now using a system where the NT is a penetrator, and that is not really Kitchen’s game. However, Wade has proven over the years to design his scheme around his talent. And we believe Kitchen has talent, it is just a matter of uncovering it. Kitchen’s biggest strength is, well, his strength. He is a bear to move inside, and consistently occupies 2 blockers, effectively neutralizing the run game. There was a very noticeable difference when Kitchen missed a couple games due to a dislocated elbow, and when he was in the game. Even if he never pans out to be a starting caliber player (it is a 7th rounder, after all), he should still be a useful player in short-yardage situations. http://www.wytv.com/content/news/he...-Pro-Day/i4lVi306Z0WS6yVig5gcow.cspx?rss=1666[/QUOTE]
 
Outside of the Fleener pick , I love them all .... I could warm up to Fleener at some point , but with OD it just seems like a luxury pick when there are so many pressing needs - Tho most were addressed in this mock.

I might be in the minority but Im leaning twards the Bama ILB Hightower if one of the top WR's doesnt fall to 26. He'd make the middle of that defense very difficult to penetrate on the ground .... and an already solid LB corps a top tier group.


I know the Texans ran a lot of 2-3 TE sets .... but I find it difficult to make that selection.
 
I'd be happy with this haul. Good work guys. My only switch might be if Gannaway is available in the 6th, I'd love to give him a shot at the 3rd RB slot. I think our 3rd QB this year will be a vet
 
You guys should do more drafts together because this one blows away any that you have done on your own. Grade A+++++!!!!
 
Fleener fits well I think.

My only concern is Quick... I'm wary of another small school project, specially another one so early.

If I had to be bluntly honest, this staff has not proven itself capable of developing WRs at all. Which is part of the appeal to me in taking Fleener in the first.

Far as the rest of the draft... honestly I'd cream myself if this was the haul.
 
Fleener fits well I think.

My only concern is Quick... I'm wary of another small school project, specially another one so early.

If I had to be bluntly honest, this staff has not proven itself capable of developing WRs at all. Which is part of the appeal to me in taking Fleener in the first.

Far as the rest of the draft... honestly I'd cream myself if this was the haul.

Hell , not liking Fleener (not the player , just the position / pick) I'd be thrilled with this draft.

I would have to look at UDFA's or vet FA's to fill out the ILB spots.
 
I'de be very happy with the majority of this draft. I just don't see the texans drafting a tight end with their first pick when they already have Daniels and Graham who people said was a Daniels clone when we drafted him. idk if Quick and Lewis would still be there for our 2nd and 3rd round pick but if so,i'de be ecstatic. I wouldn't be surprised at all if Brian Quick gets drafted by the texans and i think there was a rumor going around that the texans might draft him in the first.. Like the 2 O line picks and they can be solid depth for a year and potentially start next year if we don't re-sign Caldwell and Butler. I would be very happy with 2-7 picks but i really don't think the texans will be drafting a tightend in the first round when there are more pressing needs.
 
1. Fleener- Love this pick
2. Quick, I would like him better in the 4th. Give me Toon,M.Jones or Streeter. Dont know why I dont like him. I consider him to be a small school version of Jeffery. Ok to good hands and Quick doesn't appear to be fast or Quick (LOL) out of his breaks. I will admit I haven't seen much of Quick other than the Sr Bowl, (The stage appeared to be to big for him) and the Combine. (He was OK but nothing special)

3. Lewis- Good pick
4. Blake- Great pick, He's a stud who has experience playing C/RG/RT in college. Hope he's there.
4. Adcock- I understand the pick, Give me more depth at WR/PR. Matthews/Broyles would be my pick.
5. Lindley, Good pick, I like B.J. Coleman more as a developmental QB. I thought Yates was supposed to be this guy last yr.
6. Bullock- Good pick
7. Kitchen- Like this pick. I also like Myles Wade from Portland St. They're both good late rd fliers.
 
Fleener is better than any of the wide receivers that will available to us at #26. That is at least my rationale and has been for a while. Glad to see others are on board as well. But like I keep saying I don't think the Texans will make a bold pick like that. They'll more than likely draft a guy like Stephen Hill or Kendall Wright who might turn out to be good players, but with Fleener you can really do some serious damage.
 
Outside of the Fleener pick , I love them all .... I could warm up to Fleener at some point , but with OD it just seems like a luxury pick when there are so many pressing needs - Tho most were addressed in this mock.

I might be in the minority but Im leaning twards the Bama ILB Hightower if one of the top WR's doesnt fall to 26. He'd make the middle of that defense very difficult to penetrate on the ground .... and an already solid LB corps a top tier group.


I know the Texans ran a lot of 2-3 TE sets .... but I find it difficult to make that selection.
Corrosion as you know on my last individual mock I have Hightower #26 & agree with your opinion of him. However, the recent signing of Brady James reduces the need for an ILB that high. We have other issues that have to be addressed so again we draft for need. sigh. We have to have someone to take pressure off AJ.
 
1. Have no problem at all with the Fleener pick. Would give the offense great versatility in the passing game and would really help out in the redzone. He needs to work on his blocking, but I think he's worth the pick.

2. Not a fan of taking Quick if he's the only WR we take. He needs to be developed a bit and I would prefer a guy who can come in and contribute now. If we only take one WR and it's in the 2nd then give me Marvin Jones. Guy will be the #2 in week 1 and for years to come.

3. Good pick with Lewis because we do need to add another pass rusher. That said, I think he's gone at this pick. Won't get outta the 2nd IMO.

4. I do agree that we need to address the Center position at some point soon regardless of re-signing Myers. Blake is a good pick though I'd prefer Molk.

4. I think it's early for Adcock here although I see the logic behind the pick. Could be your swing tackle and compete with Butler at RT.

5. Fantastic pick with Lindley. If there's one guy in this draft that I could take late and develop it's him.

6. Once again, I see the logic behind this pick but I'm meh on drafting Kickers. That's just me though.

7. Not a fan of this pick because I think Wade's proved what he wants at NT and this is not it. I have no doubts that he would adjust his style if we had someone like Kitchen, but I don't see us intentionally going out and grabbing him.

Overall, good stuff. With a few minor changes I'm a huge fan.
 
I'de be very happy with the majority of this draft. I just don't see the texans drafting a tight end with their first pick when they already have Daniels and Graham who people said was a Daniels clone when we drafted him. idk if Quick and Lewis would still be there for our 2nd and 3rd round pick but if so,i'de be ecstatic. I wouldn't be surprised at all if Brian Quick gets drafted by the texans and i think there was a rumor going around that the texans might draft him in the first.. Like the 2 O line picks and they can be solid depth for a year and potentially start next year if we don't re-sign Caldwell and Butler. I would be very happy with 2-7 picks but i really don't think the texans will be drafting a tightend in the first round when there are more pressing needs.
Chris we are not drafting a TE, we are drafting a 6' 6"guy 250 lb flash who busted 4.5 who can replace OD if necessary and be WR2 if necessary. Texans love guys that can play more than one spot. In Coby they get a guy who can start in more than one spot.
 
this has already been discussed in THIS thread.

Here are the pro Fleener comments for those that don't want to read the whole thread.



Fleener is a better TE than any of the receivers that will available for us to draft. We need a red zone guy and with Dressen gone, we'll need someone to fill his gap.


Fleener was much quicker then expected at his pro day. Truth is most of our Te's are more conventional, but Fleener is the type of
TE that would create mismatches.

With all the 2 TE sets we run and the pending cap problems/huge contract OD has going into next year, getting a top flight TE should be important. Fleener is the best TE in this draft period and is as close as you get to can't miss.

I don't see Graham as anything but depth. If he had any ability I think he wold of made more than one catch in the last couple of years. Hope I'm wrong on that one for sure! As I stated in my mock, I believe there is a high possibility that OD could be let go next year. Fleener would be great insurance if that were to happen.

We have to have another reliable red zone threat or we are going to be in big trouble. The last thing we need is to start kicking field goals over and over in the red zone again. Remember that? Maybe we can find that later in the draft I don't know but IMO Fleener looks like he comes in and contributes right away in that role.



He could wind up being the next Jimmy Graham. That doesn't intrigue you at all? Him and OD on the field together would be scary. We do have more pressing needs but TE could use a boost and why limit the first round pick to a dire need anyway, all you do is wind up with an inferior player who starts early. Picking at 26 in the draft with a talented team already in place gives us the opportunity to really go BPA. I won't cry if we pass on him but Fleener is definitely on my short list.



If we can find a TE that can split out and/or play in the slot it's just as good as getting a WR in the first round. Maybe even better.

It's not like he'd struggle to get on the field.




Graham was a fourth round pick. It happens! The guy hardly seen the field in two years. One catch! TE may not be our biggest need but it is a need. You can't go into the draft saying position a is our biggest need so we have to spend our first round pick on it. You have to take the combination BPA that fills a need and generally you want your first two picks to start. You want your 3rd round pick to start year two and your expectations should lessen by round after that.

A big time playmaker at the TE position is just as valuable (maybe even more at times) than a WR.

i think the main this is if is a "willing" blocker. that can't be taught


OD our starting TE 54 receptions 677 yards and a whopping 3 td's[/quote] And on top of that will be 30 this year, has a huge contract and has missed 13 games in the last 3 years.


At 6'6" and almost 250 lbs, Fleener has natural TE size, so it is not like he is a WR/TE hybrid. You can split him out wide, or line him up as a traditional TE. While he is not a strong blocker, it is not a weakness. Just because he is known for his play in the pass game does not mean he is a liability in the run game.

Where Fleener makes his money is with the ball in his hands. He runs a 4.5 40- that is WR speed. He has good explosion numbers as well, better than many receiver prospects. At most importantly, he has soft hands. I do not remember seeing a lot of drops from Fleener. He is good at getting open, and good at catching the ball. And that is what you want to see.




Would love to add Fleener. I view him as a weapon, plain and simple regardless of his position. His speed makes him a tough match up for LBs and his size makes him tough for DBs. He could absolutely spilt out wide as well. So many possibilities. There are other players I like as well, but at this point I favor Fleener over Hill or Randle.


Drafting a TE while maybe not an immediate huge need, could pay off big next year if cap problems continue like they have. And Fleener is good enough that he would make significant contributions this year IMO and could possibly be a major player for us in the near future. Add to that that this is a late first the risk is worth the potential reward.
 
1. Fleener- Love this pick
2. Quick, I would like him better in the 4th. Give me Toon,M.Jones or Streeter. Dont know why I dont like him. I consider him to be a small school version of Jeffery. Ok to good hands and Quick doesn't appear to be fast or Quick (LOL) out of his breaks. I will admit I haven't seen much of Quick other than the Sr Bowl, (The stage appeared to be to big for him) and the Combine. (He was OK but nothing special)

3. Lewis- Good pick
4. Blake- Great pick, He's a stud who has experience playing C/RG/RT in college. Hope he's there.
4. Adcock- I understand the pick, Give me more depth at WR/PR. Matthews/Broyles would be my pick.
5. Lindley, Good pick, I like B.J. Coleman more as a developmental QB. I thought Yates was supposed to be this guy last yr.
6. Bullock- Good pick
7. Kitchen- Like this pick. I also like Myles Wade from Portland St. They're both good late rd fliers.
SteelB just a thought on Senior Bowl. I have always used it to evaluate players on a bigger "stage". This bowl was a joke imo. I am not sure if it was the coaching or what but many players just looked lost. Many were playing out of position & not just to show their adaptability but more to say that each player had some minutes. Reminded me of Little League where every kid gets to play but these guys are not 8-10.
I watched Toon extensively mostly due to having watched his dad play and I was just not impressed. Too inconsistent like Jeff Fuller. Streeter is on my individual mock and he could be a WR1 in his second year but Quick is more now than Tommy.
 
The fact that people are worried about using a LATE first round pick on Fleener because of his blocking ability is laughable. Blocking is more about effort than anything else. OD, Graham and anyone else we have drafted at TE other than Anthony Hill has been a poor blocker coming out of college. Hell Shannon Sharpe wasn't a good blocker early on in his career.

This offense relies on the TE position more than some of you realize and its not because of their blocking ability.
 
1. Have no problem at all with the Fleener pick. Would give the offense great versatility in the passing game and would really help out in the redzone. He needs to work on his blocking, but I think he's worth the pick.

2. Not a fan of taking Quick if he's the only WR we take. He needs to be developed a bit and I would prefer a guy who can come in and contribute now. If we only take one WR and it's in the 2nd then give me Marvin Jones. Guy will be the #2 in week 1 and for years to come.

3. Good pick with Lewis because we do need to add another pass rusher. That said, I think he's gone at this pick. Won't get outta the 2nd IMO.

4. I do agree that we need to address the Center position at some point soon regardless of re-signing Myers. Blake is a good pick though I'd prefer Molk.

4. I think it's early for Adcock here although I see the logic behind the pick. Could be your swing tackle and compete with Butler at RT.

5. Fantastic pick with Lindley. If there's one guy in this draft that I could take late and develop it's him.

6. Once again, I see the logic behind this pick but I'm meh on drafting Kickers. That's just me though.

7. Not a fan of this pick because I think Wade's proved what he wants at NT and this is not it. I have no doubts that he would adjust his style if we had someone like Kitchen, but I don't see us intentionally going out and grabbing him.

Overall, good stuff. With a few minor changes I'm a huge fan.
Thanks for your compliments and your faithfulness in giving us honest feedback that we do listen to. On Lewis, we were also concerned he might be gone but our research led us to believe he should be there. Blake is a center that eliminates concern that Myers could go out and we'd have to depend on Caldwell (shudder) but he can also challenge for RG. If he beats out Caldwell @ RG, that is one less FA we have to worry about after the season. We should see instant benefits from a conditioning coach. Molk is good but don't see him as an OG. You should maybe evaluate which would fit better in Texans high octane passing game in ZBS, a Baylor center or Michigan?

Adcock may be there later but when you have 9 point buck in your sight, pull trigger. Don't keep looking for a 10 when the 9 could be on someone else's tag. Same with Bullock. Could be a UDFA but if he is, what guarantee you offering he will sign with Texans? An Aggie may be smart enough to go for more money elsewhere. lol

Again, thanks for your feedback.
 
Thanks for your compliments and your faithfulness in giving us honest feedback that we do listen to. On Lewis, we were also concerned he might be gone but our research led us to believe he should be there. Blake is a center that eliminates concern that Myers could go out and we'd have to depend on Caldwell (shudder) but he can also challenge for RG. If he beats out Caldwell @ RG, that is one less FA we have to worry about after the season. We should see instant benefits from a conditioning coach. Molk is good but don't see him as an OG. You should maybe evaluate which would fit better in Texans high octane passing game in ZBS, a Baylor center or Michigan?

Adcock may be there later but when you have 9 point buck in your sight, pull trigger. Don't keep looking for a 10 when the 9 could be on someone else's tag. Same with Bullock. Could be a UDFA but if he is, what guarantee you offering he will sign with Texans? An Aggie may be smart enough to go for more money elsewhere. lol

Again, thanks for your feedback.

I don't see Molk as an OG at all, strictly a C prospect. That said, I don't see Myers finishing his new contract. We gave him that deal because we need him, but Molk could make him expendable in 2-3 years.

I also don't see the Texans as a high octane passing attack. They led the league in rushing (or were top 3, whichever) and will continue that trend with Foster locked up and Tate still in the fold. Molk is as good as it gets as a run blocker in a ZBS system, but I would consider Blake more balanced because his pass pro is better.

If you're looking for a guy who can play both positions then you take Molk off the table but, strictly as a C, Molk is the superior prospect IMO.
 
I don't see Molk as an OG at all, strictly a C prospect. That said, I don't see Myers finishing his new contract. We gave him that deal because we need him, but Molk could make him expendable in 2-3 years.

I also don't see the Texans as a high octane passing attack. They led the league in rushing (or were top 3, whichever) and will continue that trend with Foster locked up and Tate still in the fold. Molk is as good as it gets as a run blocker in a ZBS system, but I would consider Blake more balanced because his pass pro is better.

If you're looking for a guy who can play both positions then you take Molk off the table but, strictly as a C, Molk is the superior prospect IMO.
Not picking but 2010 & '11 averaged 4500 yds and last season projected to 4,000. 2009 was over 3K. Molk is good but I see Blake better fit. Respect your opinion.
 
Not picking but 2010 & '11 averaged 4500 yds and last season projected to 4,000. 2009 was over 3K. Molk is good but I see Blake better fit. Respect your opinion.

I'm not disagreeing with your numbers, but I just don't see us as a pass happy team in today's NFL. Probably one of the most balanced offenses in the league. 4,000 yds is about average when half the QB's in the league are throwing for 5,000+ yds. Doesn't really matter in the end, if you think Blake or Molk is the better guy that's who you take. Good stuff.
 
I've gone back and forth with the Fleener pick. I Think if we want a TE primarily be a receiver we'd be better served picking up ladarius green in the third.

I'd much rather have worthy or a trade down instead of fleener. Worthy is a stud and would add awesome to the dine. A trade down would give us additional picks.

I really like quick and Lewis. I like the o line picks.

Not a fan of the qb pick and would rather add a vet and udfa's for camp arms and practice squad and let them compete for qb #3. Draftwise I'd rather have a safety or another offensive weapon.

I love the kicker. Would like to get battering ram at full back.
 
JMO, don't kill the messenger.

1. Fleener, I know he's a great player but I don't like him for the Texans, maybe a late round TE for some depth but even that's a stretch for me. I'd prefer some D-line like Still, Reyes, Worthy, Thompson, or Nick Perry-OLB. I could endorse this pick only if he replaced OD this year.
2. Quick, I've read alot of good things about this guy and he's got all the measurable's but I worry about his ability to transition to the NFL due to the level of competition he faced in college. It's a huge step up for him.
3. Lewis, I like this pick here, good value if available.
4a. Blake, I like the pick, O-line depth is always a good thing.
4b. Adcock, see above, I see him as an OG in a couple years.
5. Lindley, I think he's got some potential but I don't think we'll be drafting a QB, I think we'll look for a vet that gets cut at the end of training camp.
6. Bullock, I love this pick, might be the best one on the list as it should solidify K for the next decade at least.
7. Kitchen, I don't know much about him but I'm glad to see some size being added to the D, probably goes to the PS where he hopefully can develop quickly.
 
I'm not disagreeing with your numbers, but I just don't see us as a pass happy team in today's NFL. Probably one of the most balanced offenses in the league. 4,000 yds is about average when half the QB's in the league are throwing for 5,000+ yds. Doesn't really matter in the end, if you think Blake or Molk is the better guy that's who you take. Good stuff.

That's quite an exaggeration.
 
That's quite an exaggeration.

It's called sarcasm...

Texans were 18th in passing offense last year. Yes, Schaub being hurt definitely contributed to that but I don't see us as a top 5 passing offense anymore. I think Kubiak sees the value of the running game after last year and we'll go forward more balanced.
 
I'm not disagreeing with your numbers, but I just don't see us as a pass happy team in today's NFL. Probably one of the most balanced offenses in the league. 4,000 yds is about average when half the QB's in the league are throwing for 5,000+ yds. Doesn't really matter in the end, if you think Blake or Molk is the better guy that's who you take. Good stuff.
Totally agree with the balance team statements and something I really like to see in NFL team. Hopefully both Schaub & AJ will come back healthy and we can kick some butt. Enjoyed the discussion!
 
I am a big fan of this mock...

I love Fleener at #26. A package with AJ, Fleener, OD, Casey at FB and Arian out of the backfield would cause HUGE matchup problems for secondaries. It would also be ideal for running the ball.
 
Señor Stan;1936778 said:
I am a big fan of this mock...

I love Fleener at #26. A package with AJ, Fleener, OD, Casey at FB and Arian out of the backfield would cause HUGE matchup problems for secondaries. It would also be ideal for running the ball.

The entire reason WR is a huge need for the Texans is that if AJ goes down we have ZERO #1 options at the WR spot. And Fleener or Quick wont fix that.

Without trading for a big time WR, I cannot get on-board with drafting a TE in the first round.
 
The entire reason WR is a huge need for the Texans is that if AJ goes down we have ZERO #1 options at the WR spot. And Fleener or Quick wont fix that.

Without trading for a big time WR, I cannot get on-board with drafting a TE in the first round.

This doesn't make any sense. Explain who in this entire draft we could draft that would be a number one option at WR if AJ went down? There is no one! The TE position is becoming more and more important in todays NFL. Having a huge, fast TE with great hands to add to this offense for Schaub to throw to (which is his strength) would do more for this offense than you are realizing.

For starters it stops opposing defenses from putting safeties in the box which in turn helps the running game. He also would instantly become a top red zone target. That alone is worth the #26 pick.
 
I like the mock overall, but I just can't see Ronnell Lewis being there in the 3rd. If he is, that would be a steal. Walter's consensus ranking of him is around 50. LINK However, Brian Quick is ranked at 75. So if you swapped those two, it would be more realistic.

Anyways, good effort to you all, keep up the good work!
 
I like the mock overall, but I just can't see Ronnell Lewis being there in the 3rd. If he is, that would be a steal. Walter's consensus ranking of him is around 50. LINK However, Brian Quick is ranked at 75. So if you swapped those two, it would be more realistic.

Anyways, good effort to you all, keep up the good work!

Agreed, if the Texans are even considering Lewis. If they were going for a headcase OLB grab Bruce Irvin who has can't-teach-that speed. Upside is much higher.

Diggin Fleener. It's not need or BPA (well, maybe BPA). It's strength beyond strength. Sledgen von Hammertime. Power. Another blanket to keep Schaub upright. A possible #2 receiver.

I think they may want a veteran backup as #3 QB. Would open up a pick for a DB or return man.

Nice effort fellas and may I say, best mock yet.
 
I like the mock overall, but I just can't see Ronnell Lewis being there in the 3rd. If he is, that would be a steal. Walter's consensus ranking of him is around 50. LINK However, Brian Quick is ranked at 75. So if you swapped those two, it would be more realistic.

Anyways, good effort to you all, keep up the good work!
Agreed BUT CSSPORTS.com has Lewis as 65th so...


http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/prospectrankings

At some point, you identify the player you want and get him when you know you can rather than hope all the points add up; same with trades on draft day.
 
Coby Fleener? We're talking about a dude who has almost the exact same stats in college as Garrett Graham did, except that the Badgers are in the Big Ten, and Stanford is in the...well...Pac-12, which might or might not equal out in competition.

The facts are, I wouldn't crap on the Texans if they took Fleener that high, but I still think the best TE in this years draft is James Hanna from Oklahoma, from the standpoint of how the Texans use the TE. Plus, Hanna is more well versed as a blocker while Fleeners stats are inflated because of Luck.

Big 12. Let's have some Hanna in a later round for a better value. He's a superb athlete, who blocks and can catch well.

After all, our need for TE really won't show itself until after next year.
 
What does that even mean? :wadepalm:

It means these guys were playing pitch and catch all over a few suspect defenses. Often you have a good WR or TE who looks like a monster if the QB is aces and can lay it right int o them. Pitch and catch.

Fleener is great. Just not great enough for the Texans in the 1st round, however. At least, that's my opinion. If the Texans take him at #26, fine.
 
Fleeners stats are inflated because of Luck.

Im concerned that his stats arent greater considering Luck .... If he was a world beater , he'd have a lot more than 34 catches in a season.


I get the idea that because of the success of New England this past season , many are putting too much stock in the position. This is a copy cat league ... but its hard to copy when you dont have the personel.
 
This doesn't make any sense. Explain who in this entire draft we could draft that would be a number one option at WR if AJ went down? There is no one!

Blackmon, Floyd and Wright all have a better shot at being our #1 WR than Fleener has at starting TE. They tore up the college level. Something Fleener has not done.

The TE position is becoming more and more important in todays NFL. Having a huge, fast TE with great hands to add to this offense for Schaub to throw to (which is his strength) would do more for this offense than you are realizing.

For starters it stops opposing defenses from putting safeties in the box which in turn helps the running game. He also would instantly become a top red zone target. That alone is worth the #26 pick.

Fleener had 34 freaking catches in 13 games last season. If he is so HUGE and FAST then tell me why his stats are so weak? Stop trying to boast him as an all world TE because he is not. He is becoming one of the most overrated prospects in this draft due to Gronk and Hernandez in NE. Not to mention, Gronk went in the 2nd round and Hernandez in the 4th.

Bottom line Fleener is a luxury pick with Daniels and Graham on the roster.
 
I would not be disappointed with Fleener being selected. However, durability and blocking ability are a concern for me. Moreover, it is one thing to have a big target in the Red Zone, it is another thing to get the ball to that target - I have yet to see anything from Schaub or Yates that give me confidence we would be able to leverage Fleener's size and hands in tight space.
 
The entire reason WR is a huge need for the Texans is that if AJ goes down we have ZERO #1 options at the WR spot. And Fleener or Quick wont fix that.

Without trading for a big time WR, I cannot get on-board with drafting a TE in the first round.
Blake, gonna disagree with you as I think the main reason WR is needed is to take pressure off AJ and give QB another option. JJ and Walter are not the WR 2-3 that we need. A starter can go down at any position and it would be nice to have a good replacement for AJ but there is not one at #26 imo. We will not trade for a big time WR due to cap costs or we would have gone after one of the FA receivers.

It is as possible for Fleener to eventually be WR1 as anyone else available.
 
Blackmon, Floyd and Wright all have a better shot at being our #1 WR than Fleener has at starting TE. They tore up the college level. Something Fleener has not done.



Fleener had 34 freaking catches in 13 games last season. If he is so HUGE and FAST then tell me why his stats are so weak? Stop trying to boast him as an all world TE because he is not. He is becoming one of the most overrated prospects in this draft due to Gronk and Hernandez in NE. Not to mention, Gronk went in the 2nd round and Hernandez in the 4th.

Bottom line Fleener is a luxury pick with Daniels and Graham on the roster.

Hindsight is 20-20 but if other teams projected Gronk or Hernandez to become what they are today do you seriously feel ski is still a 2nd rounder or dez a 4th? seriously dude, be realistic & this is just part of the attraction. The fact Kubiak probably knows how to utilize TE skill sets better than any head coach in the NFL makes a lot of us Texan fans drool :drool:

Now combine this with Fleener is faster 4.4's & stronger 27 reps to 23 to Gronk. 47 receptions, 672 yards 14.3 average per catch & 10 TD's his last season in Arizona, year before 28 rec 525 yds 18.75 avg. 8 TD's. I just don't see a disturbing difference here to Coby's production, actually very similar more a function of two conservative head coaches. 34 receptions, 667 yards (within 5 yards) 19.62 average per catch 10 TD's the freaking same. Very similar numbers previous season, 28 receptions (same) 434 yards 15.5 avg. 7 TD's. Also Coby had two previous seasons of development @ Stanford under Harbaugh. Vernon Davis is another excellent receiving TE, his last two most productive seasons track right along with Gronk & Fleener 52 receptions, 871 yards, 17.1 average per catch & 6 TD's. Previous year, 28 receptions, 439 yards 15.7 average pre catch & 3 TD's. Selected 6th overall based not as much on his production, cause both Gronk & Fleener compare favorably but based off his combine workout. Faster & stronger than both, but lacks size/length or TD production. Size does matter in the NFL (so does speed & strength) but Fleener may be the best combination of all three of these tremendous players, especially in Kubiaks offense & some people still don't feel his value is worth 26th pick :kubepalm:
 
but I still think the best TE in this years draft is James Hanna from Oklahoma, from the standpoint of how the Texans use the TE. Plus, Hanna is more well versed as a blocker while Fleeners stats are inflated because of Luck.

Big 12. Let's have some Hanna in a later round for a better value. He's a superb athlete, who blocks and can catch well.


Hannah is who I'd target over Fleener. Will be cheaper, and quite possibly better.
 
Hindsight is 20-20 but if other teams projected Gronk or Hernandez to become what they are today do you seriously feel ski is still a 2nd rounder or dez a 4th? seriously dude, be realistic & this is just part of the attraction. The fact Kubiak probably knows how to utilize TE skill sets better than any head coach in the NFL makes a lot of us Texan fans drool :drool:

Now combine this with Fleener is faster 4.4's & stronger 27 reps to 23 to Gronk. 47 receptions, 672 yards 14.3 average per catch & 10 TD's his last season in Arizona, year before 28 rec 525 yds 18.75 avg. 8 TD's. I just don't see a disturbing difference here to Coby's production, actually very similar more a function of two conservative head coaches. 34 receptions, 667 yards (within 5 yards) 19.62 average per catch 10 TD's the freaking same. Very similar numbers previous season, 28 receptions (same) 434 yards 15.5 avg. 7 TD's. Also Coby had two previous seasons of development @ Stanford under Harbaugh. Vernon Davis is another excellent receiving TE, his last two most productive seasons track right along with Gronk & Fleener 52 receptions, 871 yards, 17.1 average per catch & 6 TD's. Previous year, 28 receptions, 439 yards 15.7 average pre catch & 3 TD's. Selected 6th overall based not as much on his production, cause both Gronk & Fleener compare favorably but based off his combine workout. Faster & stronger than both, but lacks size/length or TD production. Size does matter in the NFL (so does speed & strength) but Fleener may be the best combination of all three of these tremendous players, especially in Kubiaks offense & some people still don't feel his value is worth 26th pick :kubepalm:


Owen Daniels - 62 receptions, 852 yards, 8 TDs - 3 years - Wisconsin

Coby Fleener - 96 receptions, 1543 yards, 18 Tds - 4 years - Stanford

Garrett Graham - 121 receptions, 1492 yards, 16 TDs - 3 years - Wisconsin


Maybe Garrett Graham will be the next Gronk, too. :kitten:

:fingergun:
 
Blackmon, Floyd and Wright all have a better shot at being our #1 WR than Fleener has at starting TE. They tore up the college level. Something Fleener has not done.



Fleener had 34 freaking catches in 13 games last season. If he is so HUGE and FAST then tell me why his stats are so weak? Stop trying to boast him as an all world TE because he is not. He is becoming one of the most overrated prospects in this draft due to Gronk and Hernandez in NE. Not to mention, Gronk went in the 2nd round and Hernandez in the 4th.

Bottom line Fleener is a luxury pick with Daniels and Graham on the roster.

Difference is Fleener was productive in a fairly conservative offense at Stanford. I would compare his ability to a guy like Stephen Hill. Freakish athletic ability, but in an offense that doesn't fully utilize it. Luck is also great at ball distribution.

To me I think his production is ok, but what I am really looking at is this: OD and Graham don't create physical mismatches the way Gronk or Hernandez do and never will. They are the more typical old school TE, which I don't have a problem with. Fleener is going to create mismatches in the NFL.

Of the 3 WRs you mentioned obviously we're not going to have a shot at the first two, and Wright is a Desean Jackson clone. I'm not saying that's a bad thing by any means, but he just doesn't have the size to be a true #1 like AJ.

For comparison sake:

OD's # last year: 54 677 12.5 34 3

3 TDs for an elite TE?

His backup:

Joel Dressen 28 353 12.6 6

Half the yards and catches...but double the TD production?


Coby Fleener 34 667 19.6 10

A little over half the catches, but a whopping 20 yards per catch, I'd say that's big play ability. Not to mention even with that low reception count he had the EXACT amount of yards and still eclipsed BOTH our top two TEs in TD production.

For giggles Jacoby Jones our #3

16 10 31 512 16.5 2
 
How is Fleener any more a luxury pick than Perry?

We absolutely need more big time pass rushing linebackers. We dont need more pass catching tight ends. But if you have to have one then take one in the 3rd-4th rounds.
 
We absolutely need more big time pass rushing linebackers. We dont need more pass catching tight ends. But if you have to have one then take one in the 3rd-4th rounds.

TE - Currently we have

OD - who will be 30 years old this year, is in the second year of a 4 year 22 million dollar contract, has missed 14 games in the last 3 years, only has 5 total TD's in the last 2 years and has never averaged over 13 yards a catch in any of his 6 seasons as a pro.

Garret Graham - 1 catch in his career. Enough said!!!!!

But in your infinite wisdom we don't need anymore pass catching tight ends. :lol:


OLB - Currently we have

Connar Barwin - A young third year stud that had a career year last year with 11.5 sacks.

Brooks Reed - Another young stud that had 9.5 sacks last year.


And 2 promising young guys who have at least shown flashes of the talent it takes to become solid depth at OLB in Nading and Braman.

But again in your infinite wisdom this is where we should spend our first round pick? On a player who will seldom see the field and will probably only really contribute this year if there is an injury? :wadepalm: We dont need to spend our first round pick on this type a player, but if you have to have one then take one in the 3rd-4th rounds. Don't waste a first round pick on one. Use that on a player that can and will have the most impact on the team. A player like Fleener that because of the mismatches he will create and his abilities, will make an instant impact.
 
Owen Daniels - 62 receptions, 852 yards, 8 TDs - 3 years - Wisconsin

Coby Fleener - 96 receptions, 1543 yards, 18 Tds - 4 years - Stanford

Garrett Graham - 121 receptions, 1492 yards, 16 TDs - 3 years - Wisconsin


Maybe Garrett Graham will be the next Gronk, too. :kitten:

:fingergun:

Brilliant!!!!!!!:wadepalm:
 
Hannah is who I'd target over Fleener. Will be cheaper, and quite possibly better.
6th rounders often don't make roster so you're willing to give up the chance to strengthen your passing options? WHo is your WR choice?
 
Hannah was a nobody before the combine. Definition of a workout warrior, and this is coming from an OU fan. 381 yards and 2 TDs on the season, only 52 catches for his career. He can block ok, but hardly a WOW blocker.
 
Hannah was a nobody before the combine. Definition of a workout warrior, and this is coming from an OU fan. 381 yards and 2 TDs on the season, only 52 catches for his career. He can block ok, but hardly a WOW blocker.

I agree! If we are going to take a late round TE there are better ones to choose from.
 
6th rounders often don't make roster so you're willing to give up the chance to strengthen your passing options? WHo is your WR choice?

I think there are better options to strengthen the passing game than fleener in the first.

And honestly, the passing game hasn't been bad. I don't think it's been great, but it's been very good when schaub has been at qb.

I'd rather trade down or draft worthy over fleener and grab receiving help in the second and/or later.
 
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