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i'm getting a little pissed.

EllisUnit

EllisUnit

Vote RED!!!
We have cut some players i think we needed. Players that made an impact, and then we have some free agents who we havent even thrown offers to. We're just setting back and letting division foes (TITANS) talk to one of the best Centers in the NFL.

What does the FO think ? Just cause we have arian foster we dont need an o-line to block for him and our fragile QB ?

I know its the first day of free agency but,,,,,,,seriously. What the hell is going on ? We won the division last season,,,,whoopty F'ing Doo. Try to get better. McNair and Smith sure know how to make us Sweat !!!
 
EllisUnit said:
We have cut some players i think we needed. Players that made an impact, and then we have some free agents who we havent even thrown offers to. We're just setting back and letting division foes (TITANS) talk to one of the best Centers in the NFL.

What does the FO think ? Just cause we have arian foster we dont need an o-line to block for him and our fragile QB ?

I know its the first day of free agency but,,,,,,,seriously. What the hell is going on ? We won the division last season,,,,whoopty F'ing Doo. Try to get better. McNair and Smith sure know how to make us Sweat !!!
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I don't think Rick Smith are letting these guy go without offers because they think it makes us better. I think they're doing it because we're in a pretty bad salary cap situation. Worse than originally thought which is bad news.

Worse case scenario, we go from a team who had talent to a team who still has talent but lots of holes to fill. If Mario and Myers are gone, we go from not only having to upgrade at WR, but also finding two new offensive lineman, depth at O-line, and depth on the D-line/linebacker. That's 5 major losses at least, and not enough money to spend in free agency to actually upgrade those positions. I hope this scenario doesn't happen. If so, well, we better hope we knock it out of the fking park in the draft (and say a few Hail Mary's while we're at it).
 
In order to get more cap space, I hear the Texans FO will soon be extending a new offer to teams interested.

layaway.jpg


:toropalm:
 
TexanSam said:
I don't think Rick Smith are letting these guy go without offers because they think it makes us better. I think they're doing it because we're in a pretty bad salary cap situation. Worse than originally thought.
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we all know we are not resigning mario. The could of kept Winston and signed myers. We have had one of the top O-Lines in football the past 2 seasons. I just dont get it.
 
i remember only like 3 years ago when Chris myers was called the worst player on our Oline getting like 4 flags a game getting Straight Beat by monster NT

and now look at him

I sure hope Rick and kubes know WTF there doing LOL

Im on the Lets keep CHris myers by the way unless they can for see a Badass Center that falls to us in the draft ???? who knows
 
They might not have just "sat back" and let the tits talk to Myers. It's possible that the Texans made him an offer, but he wanted to test the FA market.
No matter what they night have offered him, he is a free agent, and the Texans have zero control over what he does, or who he talk to.

If he decided he 100% wanted to test the market, not offer, at any time in the last year, would stop him from doing it.
 
michaelm said:
They might not have just "sat back" and let the tits talk to Myers. It's possible that the Texans made him an offer, but he wanted to test the FA market.
No matter what they night have offered him, he is a free agent, and the Texans have zero control over what he does, or who he talk to.

If he decided he 100% wanted to test the market, not offer, at any time in the last year, would stop him from doing it.
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i understand that, but explain winston. The guy was not that big of a hit on the cap. I know a lot of people didnt like him, but outside of us drafting a guy who in the hell is going to replace him.

UNLESS they want to get a guy who can protect the QBs blind side, hence Yates in a season or 2. i dunno.
 
EllisUnit said:
i understand that, but explain winston. The guy was not that big of a hit on the cap. I know a lot of people didnt like him, but outside of us drafting a guy who in the hell is going to replace him.

UNLESS they want to get a guy who can protect the QBs blind side, hence Yates in a season or 2. i dunno.
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I can't explain Winston. Totally stumped on that one.
It makes so little sense to me, that I'm going to have faith that it makes perfect sense to someone in the FO that knows more than me. Does that make any sense at all? lol
 
u know this is our first taste of PLayer loyalty to a team this is what its like to be a good team LOL ya know

seeing players we made run off looking for a BIg ol payday because they earned it IMO


Mario could of said u know what i might make less money staying with the texans but dammit i care more about winning im stayin

Winston could of been like im not talkin to no one im going to resign with the texans with like a 2 million dollar deal

all the players could be like that ..... but everyone is different i guess
 
Certain players (mario) have an offer on the texans table waiting for him. Meyers deal is there too, but think he's worth more. In terms of winston, kubiak said he wanted competition at tackle and I'm sure he wasn't talking about brown either. Or maybe its the 17 sacks winston gave up the last 2 yrs.
 
Kind of feel like a kid invited to a Christmas party where's there's presents under the tree for everyone but me -- just watching the other kids open theirs.
huh.gif
 
I dont know why some of yall are getting sad or mad that we Cut winston the dude was straight Garbage IMO
 
Playoffs said:
Kind of feel like a kid invited to a Christmas party where's there's presents under the tree for everyone but me -- just watching the other kids open theirs.
huh.gif
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No doubt man, i have not heard the texans mentioned ONE time today except when they talk about players from the texans going/talking to other teams. This is sad.

To me Mario was not a priority, dont get me wrong i would of loved to of gotten him back for a not back breaking price, but that wont happen.

Maybe McNair, Smith and Kubiak were still celebrating from "MAKING" the play-offs that they forgot all about free agency.
 
Norg said:
I dont know why some of yall are getting sad or mad that we Cut winston the dude was straight Garbage IMO
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think back to 02 and 03, that my friend was garbage. 17 sacks in 2 seasons ??? Think back we gave up like 150 sacks in those 2 seasons.

The grass aint always greener on the other side.
 
as i said elsewhere, i'm worried, but i cant be angry or upset with what we're doing until i see the whole picture. as a bad example ... if we sign peyton manning it makes sense to drop our run only offensive members like winston and vickers as well as balanced mario and run focused demeco. that would allow us to retool without losing anything we'd miss next season.

i dont believe that to be the case, but if such an example is available, i want to believe that something more probable and feasible is in the works until proven otherwise.
 
Yes, I'm aggravated that after the cutting and restructuring we let every single one of our UFA hit the free market. I really don't like the fact that a team owned by Bud Adams is talking numbers with Myers and or his agent. My mom had a friend who was his neighbor in Houston many years ago and said that Bud Adams was the biggest turd he had ever met.
 
Well i'm going to sleep, and hopefully Rick smith will wake up tomorrow with his hang over from the still celebrating from the play-offs and so. "oh damn free agency ? What the hell........"

And then and only then i might be a little more content, but as of now this is the lowest i have felt since the middle of our 2-14 season.
 
I said this a couple of times already today but La Confora said around 1 pm that we were sitting at 650,000 under the salary cap. If he is correct, than we really don't have any other options but to let guys go. The fact that we are extremely quiet on a busy day makes me believe there is some truth to us being extremely cash strapped in cap space. It's the bed we made
 
The Cush said:
I said this a couple of times already today but La Confora said around 1 pm that we were sitting at 650,000 under the salary cap. If he is correct, than we really don't have any other options but to let guys go. The fact that we are extremely quiet on a busy day makes me believe there is some truth to us being extremely cash strapped in cap space. It's the bed we made
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He's wrong! I've crunched the numbers. There is no way that is correct. We are currently close to $30 million under the cap... Believe it!
 
I'm in a wait and see mode. I don't necessarily like the cuts we've made so far, but I have no control over it either.
 
dalemurphy said:
He's wrong! I've crunched the numbers. There is no way that is correct. We are currently close to $30 million under the cap... Believe it!
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honest question bud, how can there be so much of a swing between the numbers? i dont think either are exactly correct, but i believe your number to be much closer than la confora's regurgitation. all offseason folks worked on the known numbers and gave us a 5-10mil under the cap number (not counting the extra 1.6 from dallas/washington), which after cuts and changes and foster make your 30mil appear right on. are you and the general public missing a poison pill or something?
 
dalemurphy said:
He's wrong! I've crunched the numbers. There is no way that is correct. We are currently close to $30 million under the cap... Believe it!
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I hope your right but the Eric Winston cut doesn't make any sense if that's the case. What's the point of cutting him yesterday? Even if he doesn't deserve that contract, why not wait and hang on to him with so much uncertainty surrounding 2/5th of your O-line? If you end up reaching an agreement with Myers, then you can cut Winston if you truly need the extra cap space. Having 25 million or whatever already in cap space then extending it by cutting Winston seems to be overkill, makes more sense to cut as you sign. I have also seen a couple of sites that say we are on the hook for close to 8 million in dead money this year, don't know if that's accurate either but that's out there.

http://torotimes.com/2012/02/12/hou...ion-and-possible-offseason-approaches-part-1/

That site believes we were to have 25 million in cap space back in Feb. so maybe you are right, but the Winston cut seemed like a move to get under
 
lots of cuts will be made leading up to training camp. probably want to bring in some veterans that have lots of playoff experience to help our young team out
 
Scooter said:
honest question bud, how can there be so much of a swing between the numbers? i dont think either are exactly correct, but i believe your number to be much closer than la confora's regurgitation. all offseason folks worked on the known numbers and gave us a 5-10mil under the cap number (not counting the extra 1.6 from dallas/washington), which after cuts and changes and foster make your 30mil appear right on. are you and the general public missing a poison pill or something?
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I'm worried about a poison pill but I see no indications of one:

LaConfora is focused on 32 teams... I'm focused on one. If you didn't read the article, here's my theory substantiated by information and common sense:

2011 cap was about $120 million. We were right up against but not over it. Any cuts the Texan made before the 2011 season, the cap hits were distributed evenly between 2011 and 2012 or were all taken in 2011... There is no mechanism to cut a player before the 2011 season and push the entire cap penalty forward to the next season...

Looking at all the salary increases heading into 2012 (Cushing, Brown, Schaub, Ryans, and Foster's $8 million) the team would add abut $11 million to the cap.

Subtract Mario's $15 million to $18 million and further subtract the other 13 free agent contracts (Myers, Biscuit, Allen, Delhomme, etc...), I conservatively figure a $10 million cap subtractions. Beyond that, the Texans restructed AJ for a savings of at least $4 million and cut Winston, Vickers, and Leinart for a savings of at least $9 million... Once you add all the savings up ($34 million) and subtract the ($11 million) in additions... that's $23 million below the cap. From that, figure the $1.6 million gift from the Skins/Boys, the fact that Manning's deal apparently decreased for 2012, Cody's deal decreased, and Mario's deal was probably for more than $15 million.... What other conclusion can be drawn?
 
EllisUnit said:
Well i'm going to sleep, and hopefully Rick smith will wake up tomorrow with his hang over from the still celebrating from the play-offs and so. "oh damn free agency ? What the hell........"

And then and only then i might be a little more content, but as of now this is the lowest i have felt since the middle of our 2-14 season.
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Calm down, dude. It's day ONE...ONE of Free Agency. In fact, the period has only been open for TEN HOURS.

For the love of God, wait for everything to shake out before declaring that this is the lowest you've felt since 2006. That's a freakin' joke of a feeling.
 
dalemurphy said:
What other conclusion can be drawn?
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the billion dollar question. not only have we allowed our under 30 studs to hit free agency, we've released (or "plan to") a handful of starters within an improving team. either the known cap info is FUBAR, or we're about to swing and miss towards a grand slam, or we went pathetically "all in" with joseph and manning last year.
 
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Let's also remember the free agency decisions the team has to make next year. If I remember correctly, Arian is just the start of a series of resigning our younger guns. I hope these cuts yield a major signing this season, but the team could be swallowing the bitter pill now for decisions they have to make a year from now. Better to be proactive than be in desperation mode in a season.

Patiently, watching...
 
Scooter said:
the billion dollar question. not only have we allowed our under 30 studs to hit free agency, we've released (or "plan to") a handful of starters within an improving team. either the known cap info is FUBAR, or we're about to swing and miss towards a grand slam, or we went pathetically "all in" with joseph and manning last year.

kubiak catches hell for most of these choices (somewhat justified for picking smith), but unless we get a major surprise we're about to get a clear picture of why we can acquire talent but doing so is expensive and taking a very long time. if we're in a dump/rebuilding year, daniel snyder would laugh ... how do you screw up so many contracts of a team that tops out at 9-7 - when all are your own draft picks.
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It can't be. The numbers don't add up. The Texans are cutting the bait it wants to. Then, the media is freaking out and confusing numbers... For instance, it is quoting salary cap numbers that include Mario even though he is a free agent. There is no way the Texans are not at least $25 million under right now. Either McNair has decided to pocket some cash or the Texans are waiting out this market and are going to get some bargains in a few days... I think the latter.
 
dalemurphy said:
It can't be. The numbers don't add up. The Texans are cutting the bait it wants to. Then, the media is freaking out and confusing numbers... For instance, it is quoting salary cap numbers that include Mario even though he is a free agent. There is no way the Texans are not at least $25 million under right now. Either McNair has decided to pocket some cash or the Texans are waiting out this market and are going to get some bargains in a few days... I think the latter.
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nothing on this planet could convince me that mcnair is sitting on any spare funds, not when so close to changing his last name to midas with a winner ... so where is this money going?

is this really what happens when adam schefter leaves the nfl network and everyone quotes blogs for their scoops? this ignorance is probably the discrepancy we're seeing.
 
EllisUnit said:
i understand that, but explain winston. The guy was not that big of a hit on the cap. I know a lot of people didnt like him, but outside of us drafting a guy who in the hell is going to replace him.

UNLESS they want to get a guy who can protect the QBs blind side, hence Yates in a season or 2. i dunno.
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For Matt Leinart lefty option? However, there were enough times that Winston whiffed and almost got our right-handed QBs killed.
 
Im not getting pissed about it, but being left in the dark about our cap situation and ability or lack thereof to sign FA's or even retain our FA's is a little frustrating.
 
TheMatrix31 said:
Calm down, dude. It's day ONE...ONE of Free Agency. In fact, the period has only been open for TEN HOURS.

For the love of God, wait for everything to shake out before declaring that this is the lowest you've felt since 2006. That's a freakin' joke of a feeling.
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I think last years rapid fire free agency period spoiled us.
 
dalemurphy said:
He's wrong! I've crunched the numbers. There is no way that is correct. We are currently close to $30 million under the cap... Believe it!
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Just reporting, not making a statement

https://twitter.com/#!/LanceZierlein


LanceZierlein Lance Zierlein
According to John Clayton, Texans and Chargers didn't have enough cap space to carryover so that answers that question.
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LanceZierlein Lance Zierlein
Texans have 6.3 million in cap space, but remember that it also includes what they have to spend in rookie pool.
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LanceZierlein Lance Zierlein
I need someone from Texans to explain why they didn't carry over cap space from last year. It sure would help to have every little bit
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http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/7570116/nfl-plenty-cap-room-improve

The Houston Texans and San Diego Chargers didn't have enough remaining room to push money over into 2012, so Houston has $3.3 million of cap space and San Diego has $9.2 million
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.
 
Scooter said:
the billion dollar question. not only have we allowed our under 30 studs to hit free agency, we've released (or "plan to") a handful of starters within an improving team. either the known cap info is FUBAR, or we're about to swing and miss towards a grand slam, or we went pathetically "all in" with joseph and manning last year.

kubiak catches hell for most of these choices (somewhat justified for picking smith), but unless we get a major surprise we're about to get a clear picture of why we can acquire talent but doing so is expensive and taking a very long time. if we're in a dump/rebuilding year, daniel snyder would laugh ... how do you screw up so many contracts of a team that tops out at 9-7 - when all are your own draft picks.
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Why do you say contracts were screwed up? The guys wanted to see what is available on the market and refused to sign offered deals. Why is that on FO? Let's put responsibility where it belongs. You just don't overpay without it coming back to get you. Let's wait to see what happens in the free agency period.
 
michaelm said:
I'm not sure where LZ gets the 6.3 million. The Clayton article he quoted was from FEBRUARY 13, and at that time, Clayton claimed the Texans had 3.3 million in cap space. That was before expiring contracts, and cuts.
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Yeah I just posted that on the same link. Maybe it was freeing up some other cash since then. Again, I don't work these numbers, just reporting. Way off from Dale's 30 mil.
 
TheMatrix31 said:
Calm down, dude. It's day ONE...ONE of Free Agency...
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Speaking of "one", or being number 1, I think we as Texans fans can finally revel in the fact the we will surely be #1 in 2012: Biggest losers in 2012 Free Agency -- Texans!!!
number-one-043.gif


Comes with the territory, but I do think we robbed Peter to pay Paul last year ... now he's collecting.
 
Playoffs said:
Speaking of "one", or being number 1, I think we as Texans fans can finally revel in the fact the we will surely be #1 in 2012: Biggest losers in 2012 Free Agency -- Texans!!!
number-one-043.gif


Comes with the territory, but I do think we robbed Peter to pay Paul last year ... now he's collecting.
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Who "won" free agency last year? How did they do?

What Day 1 free agents did the Giants or the Pats sign last year?

I understand the concerns about the cap situation, but people need to chill about signing Day 1 FAs.
 
With the cap situation coming out, its clear that the Texans wasted big opportunities between 2007-2010 seasons. The climax was last season, where we were a Fat Albert away from going to the Super Bowl. We can't keep our young studs together like we thought. Hopefully we have a great draft.
 
I definitely think there could have been some better cap management. The Cowboys and Skins got in trouble but they also locked some guys in that they aren't dealing with now. So from that standpoint I think there were some cap mismanagements.

It amazes me how the whole cap makes or breaks these FA year. Look at TB signing Jackson and Carl Nicks...top WR and OL.
 
michaelm said:
I'm not sure where LZ gets the 6.3 million. The Clayton article he quoted was from FEBRUARY 13, and at that time, Clayton claimed the Texans had 3.3 million in cap space. That was before expiring contracts, and cuts.
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Because that 3.3 million was including expiring contracts, but not including Fosters new deal and the recent cuts. I know it's hard to believe, but read about the other teams cap situations listed in that article and tell me they aren't taking expiring deals into account. These guys do this for a living and have connections around the NFL, I'm sure they have a much better idea of what the actual cap situation is than the average message board poster using Rotoworld.

As much as people would like to believe the Texans have 30+ million free, their actions certainly don't seem to indicate they have that kind of money. I don't understand how the hell they currently have 114 million in cap obligations this year, but it sounds about right given their recent actions. We just gotta hang on and hope for the best.
 
It's too early to be in panic/pissed or histeria mode yet IMO. And believe me I am the king of instant emotional response but even I am sitting back and just observing calmly right now.

The reality is we were effed cap wise. I knew MW was probably gonzo, and that in all honety there was a real shot at Myers leaving. This is gonna be the dudes last contract and he is highly wanted right now so like any player, he wants to test the market and will probably take the highest money he can get. Not really the Texans fault there if that is what he is determined to do since the Texans are cap strapped.

Now, IMO if we let Briesel get away and if Myers leaves in addition to Winston being released (no he was not phenominal but I will defend him before I make a clown of myself and defend KJ and that would be 3/5's of our OLine) then I start to excrete fecal matter into my pants.

Winston being released was an absolute shock BTW.

My only concern is I hate to see losing these guys if that is what happens yet players like KJ and Jacoby remain on the squad. I have no idea what JaJo and KJ's cap hits are but if we need money, these 2 need to be gonzo like yesterday to keep the other players.

Either way, too early to shlart the pants just yet.
 
Kubiak will not release Jacoby, no matter his cap relief. He's been Kubes WR project for a few years now and it would be a total shot to his ego if the kid doesn't "get it" at some point.

Coaches do stuff like this sometimes. They let their ego's control who stays and who goes and they think they're "the guy" who can fix a certain player.
 
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