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Possible McKinney move to guard now in OL mix

So, the article starts...
With so many questions still surrounding the offensive line, the Texans are considering moving center Steve McKinney to left guard.
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and finishes with...
"I'll do whatever," he said. "Probably by me moving to guard, I can make more money. If they want me to move to guard, I have no problem with it but it's not something that's necessarily a plan. It's Plan B."
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Doesn't sound like Steve and the Texans are on the same page. If he's looking for more money, better show some worth this year.
 
I think it's finally (though probably too late now) dawning on them that they dawdled in the offseason without addressing the O-line. We may well be in panic mode in training camp trying to fix the problem as best we can.

It is interesting that the party line is that everything is just fine, no problem. Another year of the O-line playing together and everything will gel, etc. But now it's obvious there is trouble in paradise. Behind the scenes they know they've got big problems and little time left to fix it.

Let's watch what happens when training camp opens and that will tell us. If we believe what the staff says and all the O-line needs is a bit more time to work together as a unit to gel, then you would think you would want your players playing together in the position you plan for them to play this year so they can get some more time to gel. In fact, it should be the exact same positions as last year if you really believe you had the right lineup but just needed more time to gel.

On the other hand, if the Texans are spooked (as they should be) that the O-line is going to suck wind, they will be trying all kinds of combinations and moving people all around to try and figure out how to make the best of a bad situation.

Don't listen to what the staff says, watch what they do. That is how you can really tell what the staff truly believes. Actions always speak louder than words.
 
I'm all for McKinney not being our C anymore but they (Texans, not the media) are probably drumming this story up so that Pitts and Wand don't feel like they are the only ones having to make a switch. If they see a vet willing to embrace a position swap, then they'd look like big sissy babies if all they was doing was pissing and moaning about the constant movement.---On another note, Wand is probably sucking @ LT & LG and that Washington is a better C than G thus forcing McKinney out a space over to G. Makes perfect sense, and like Dom says, "We want our best combo of 5 out there". texanpride
 
Big B Texan Fan said:
I'm all for McKinney not being our C anymore but they (Texans, not the media) are probably drumming this story up so that Pitts and Wand don't feel like they are the only ones having to make a switch. If they see a vet willing to embrace a position swap, then they'd look like big sissy babies if all they was doing was pissing and moaning about the constant movement
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Thank You Oliver Stone...
 
Does anyone foresee Weary ever competing for the C position? Just seems like this guy has never gotten it together at the pro level.
 
I dunno....I'm really confused about what kind of signals we are getting from
these training sessions. Some say its just harmless experimentation, but Capers strikes me as an old school, conservative coach who would cling to
the "if it ain't broke, don't fix it" school of thought if he didn't think it was broke. I'm thinking him or some other important decision makers with the Texans have serious reservations about the status quo re the OL.
 
Mckinney was a great guard at Indy and I have said since day one he should be our guard. We still need a center but we could settle down the guad
 
nunusguy said:
I dunno....I'm really confused about what kind of signals we are getting from
these training sessions. Some say its just harmless experimentation, but Capers strikes me as an old school, conservative coach who would cling to
the "if it ain't broke, don't fix it" school of thought if he didn't think it was broke. I'm thinking him or some other important decision makers with the Texans have serious reservations about the status quo re the OL.
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Last year there was "Harmless Experimentation" in camp with Wong getting reps @ inside LB. Now look. :hmmm:
 
ledzeppelin269 said:
Does anyone foresee Weary ever competing for the C position? Just seems like this guy has never gotten it together at the pro level.
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He actually had a few snaps @ C during some reg. season games last year (or maybe the year B-4) but it just doesn't seem he has what it takes to be a C in the NFL with all the signal calling and the memorization of what the rest of the O-Line guys are supposed to do on that particular play. He didn't play C at college.
 
done88 said:
Mckinney was a great guard at Indy and I have said since day one he should be our guard. We still need a center but we could settle down the guad
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McKinney was an average guard at Indy on a passing team. McKinney would be even worse at guard than he has been at center for the Texans because the Texans want a power blocking offensive line, not a finesse line like Indy's.
 
Vambo said:
Who plays center if McKinney moves?

I would say Pitts just because it almost guarantees he will have less false starts this year. Ok, maybe not. :crying:
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More than likely Todd Washington would take over his natural position at center.
 
BornOrange said:
the Texans want a power blocking offensive line, not a finesse line like Indy's.
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It's my understanding that we are pattering our OL after Denver's OL, which
as I understand it is undersized, but a quick and athletic unit. That sounds like more of an attempt to put together a finesse unit than power unit ?
 
nunusguy said:
It's my understanding that we are pattering our OL after Denver's OL, which
as I understand it is undersized, but a quick and athletic unit. That sounds like more of an attempt to put together a finesse unit than power unit ?
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The Texans are using a zone-blocking scheme that the Broncos and also the Ravens have used with success. The Broncos use smaller linemen, the Ravens use larger linemen. The Texans are using larger linemen like the Ravens.
 
TEXANS84 said:
More than likely Todd Washington would take over his natural position at center.
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Washington does not look like he plays unless somebody is injured... not really a starter...

I guess where I was going with this is that moving McKinney just makes us weak somewhere else, right?
:homer:
 
TEXANS84 said:
More than likely Todd Washington would take over his natural position at center.
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not sure Todd has a natural position anymore since he has been moved around so much (mostly RG for an injured Weigert). does have the natural build & experience to play the position but would he really be an upgrade over McKinney in pass protection? seems like a good run blocking guard/center but not sure if he can take on the NT consistantly at the point of attack, holding the front end of the pocket in tact :confused:

what the Texans need is a clear upgrade at this position. sounds more like Center by committee :rolleyes:
 
BornOrange said:
The Texans are using a zone-blocking scheme that the Broncos and also the Ravens have used with success. The Broncos use smaller linemen, the Ravens use larger linemen. The Texans are using larger linemen like the Ravens.
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Right, but is the zone-blocking scheme more finess or power oriented ? I'm
unsure and am asking you ffor a clarification.
 
It's both, and all the teams in the NFL zone block and man block. You have to use the same skills in either blocking scheme. There are times you have to overpower your opponent in either scheme as well as slide to the second level and take on linebackers in space.
 
geofb said:
I think it's finally (though probably too late now) dawning on them that they dawdled in the offseason without addressing the O-line. We may well be in panic mode in training camp trying to fix the problem as best we can.
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It's June.
 
nunusguy said:
Right, but is the zone-blocking scheme more finess or power oriented ? I'm
unsure and am asking you ffor a clarification.
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It's kinda depends. On running plays it is more focussed on finesse 1st then power. You see they focus on areas of the field and the LB's. Not too different from most other schemes. Usually 1, sometimes 2 linemen are left to shove D-Linemen on the backside of the play then they move to the LB's in case of a cutback by the RB. That is where the infamous "Cut-Block" usually happens. There's your finesse. The other 3 to 4 O-Linemen that are blocking in the path play are just flat out mauling. On pass plays it's usually just plain ole' pass blocking unless theres a bootleg or rollout or something then it kinda resembles runblocking yet the O-Linemen can't go upfield. This might not be 100% accurate but it's close. Hope this helps.
 
Zone blocking is used by more teams than most of you guys think. Here is Bob Davie talking about the zone blocking scheme.
I think for the Penn State fans, two great examples of zone blocking can be seen when you watch Minnesota and Iowa," Davie said by phone yesterday.

"What zone blocking is, is two adjacent offensive linemen working together to block an area. It could be three linemen, too.

"It could be the tight end and the tackle, it can be a guard and a tackle," Davie continued.

"And depending upon what the defensive linemen does, one of them is ultimately responsible for handling him.

"But you don't have to use it in the passing game. You don't need to zone block on screens. And the beauty of it is once you get the zone blocking scheme in, it accounts for just about any type of defensive front. You can handle the stunts with it and you are ready for the zone blitz."


And the key to the zone blocking according to Davie: the tailback. The cutback is where the big yards are gained. As Hunt and Scott gain more experience, it should be easier for the line.
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http://www.pennlive.com/weblogs/print.ssf?/mtlogs/penn_50yardlion/archives/print032296.html
 
Big B Texan Fan said:
That is where the infamous "Cut-Block" usually happens.
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Yea, that's the dark aspect of zone-blocking that has given it a bad rep.
Heard no less an NFL authority than Madden say on TV it ought to be banned,
yet others think its great and have no reservations about its use. Very
controversial.
 
Vinny said:
It's June.
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True, it's now June. The draft is over and the best free agent O-linemen are signed. Now we get to select from those cast off O-linemen cut by other teams or stick with what we got (which ain't much). Let's celebrate!
 
geofb said:
True, it's now June. The draft is over and the best free agent O-linemen are signed. Now we get to select from those cast off O-linemen cut by other teams or stick with what we got (which ain't much). Let's celebrate!
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Looks like they weren't after anyone but Pace on the high end side. They could have drafted any NCAA tackle in the nation but they passed. Perhaps they feel better about their talent than most of you guys.
 
geofb said:
True, it's now June. The draft is over and the best free agent O-linemen are signed. Now we get to select from those cast off O-linemen cut by other teams or stick with what we got (which ain't much). Let's celebrate!
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Okay Geofb, Go on record with who you would have signed and drafted this offseason. I'd love to hear your insight.
 
Vinny said:
Looks like they weren't after anyone but Pace on the high end side. They could have drafted any NCAA tackle in the nation but they passed. Perhaps they feel better about their talent than most of you guys.
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I think the Texans (mistakenly) do feel somewhat comfortable with the talent they have on the O-line. What else could explain their unwillingness to do anything to try and improve it? Time will tell if their confidence in their O-line was warranted or not.

But, if they truly do feel good about the talent they have, I wouldn't expect them to make many changes to upset the apple cart. I would think they would keep the same players playing the same positions if they truly feel they are top quality and just need time to gel. We get to test this theory of how good they feel about their talent in training camp-if they start trying all kinds of different combinations that tells me they are not comfortable with what they have...which then begs the question of why didn't they try and do something about it while they still had the chance. For better or worse, we're pretty much stuck with what we got now.
 
geofb said:
I think the Texans (mistakenly) do feel somewhat comfortable with the talent they have on the O-line. What else could explain their unwillingness to do anything to try and improve it?
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If you are talking roster moves, we did. Last year we changed 4 of the 6 blockers if you include the TE. Good teams don't change their players that much year in-year out, and win. I've already commented a billion times about the line calls and the protection scheme changes as being "significant", but that doesn't count with you guys who only want to see the names change.
 
Vinny said:
I've already commented a billion times about the line calls and the protection scheme changes as being "significant", but that doesn't count with you guys who only want to see the names change.
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This is the second offseason in a row that we are making significant changes in our blocking schemes according to the Texans. Until those changes start to reduce the number of sacks and give Carr more time to throw, then keep changing them all you want and that plus a quarter will get you a cup of coffee.
 
geofb said:
This is the second offseason in a row that we are making significant changes in our blocking schemes according to the Texans. Until those changes start to reduce the number of sacks and give Carr more time to throw, then keep changing them all you want and that plus a quarter will get you a cup of coffee.
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Bash away, it won't hurt or help the Texans much, but it's a reflection on you the fan. This is where I leave you guys to worry about it endlessly. I don't see much point in endless finger pointing myself when the team has yet to play one single down in the next year after addressing their situation. Knock yourself out.
 
The Texans are doing things. They've practiced Wand at guard for the stated purpose of helping him react faster and learn to use his hands better to fight the D-lineman. This is one small example on how to take a "project" and help him reach his potential. It is how coaches improve the players they have.

I'd like to see the other optons some of you see so clearly. Who was the college guy we should have drafted who would come in and been an immediate impact player? Reading some of these posts, it sounds like there must have been several.

Which of the free agents should we have picked up? Those who are better now and for the next few years? Cast-offs from other teams don't include a lot of stud left tackles. Again, I must be missing some players.

Pace would have been nice, but we offfered him way to much money and still lost him. That contract would have handicapped the team, and we would have had to cut him in about 3 years because of it anyway.

What's the quick fix with the Texans have missed? Spell it out!
 
geofb said:
This is the second offseason in a row that we are making significant changes in our blocking schemes according to the Texans. Until those changes start to reduce the number of sacks and give Carr more time to throw, then keep changing them all you want and that plus a quarter will get you a cup of coffee.
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No it won't. :rolleyes:

cac: :coffee:
 
I personally like the versatlity of our line, and Verba fits in with that ability to play multiple positions across the line. Its obvious we are gonna try and go the Steelers route and have a massive running attack and our line is very well suited to that. If Davis can stay healthy he could really break out this year, which he needs to because its a contract year for him.
 
The Texans tried to upgrade the Offensive line, and made a run for Pace. It wasn't meant to be. If that would have worked out, the Texans would be looking real good.

The picks haven't worked out in the offensive line except for Pitt and Wand. And Wand is such a question mark. The past couple of years the Texans went and got Bosseli, Mckinney, Wiggert, and Wade. The Texans are trying. Who else was there whom the Texans could have gotten?

The Offensive line we've got is the line that will have to protect Carr. The talent is there, not pro bowl talent, but average NFL guys. Hopefully, they can put it together this year. Before last year, it appeared they were going to get their act together.

The Right Side is set. Pitt and Mckinney should solidify the Left side. And now the question is to fit the Right guy at Center.
 
This is the line I want for the SEASON

RT - WADE
RG - WEIGERT
C - PITTS
LG - WAND
LT - Take your pick (or sign what little is left)

or

RT - WADE
RG - WEIGERT
C - is there anyone ? Can Washington do it ?
LG - WAND
LT - PITTS

I don't know if Mckinney can play LT, but, I'm sure that he's better at LT or LG then C.

I keep reading that WADE would be a bad fit on the left side....would he be worse than WAND was ? (looking for opinions on that)

Since it does no good saying who the TEXANS should've drafted, I figured I might as well try to find the best fit for each lineman. Especially since the coaching staff seems to be taking a couple years to figure it out themselves.
For example - Mckinney and Wand seem to have played in the wrong positions for their talents, the last few years. Hey, not that that's a bad thing, since we had the holes that needed filling, but, hopefully by now, they can figure out who is best at what position.
 
I don't know where this idea came from that ANYONE other than Wand can play LT. And throwing Pitts in at C, switching everything around just assuming it will be better would be pretty reckless. Here's the line I expect we will see -

Wand, Pitts, McKinney, Wiegert, Wade.

Looks familiar doesn't it? Sorry to all those that think any random sumo combination will lead us to the super bowl.
 
ledzeppelin269 said:
I don't know where this idea came from that ANYONE other than Wand can play LT. And throwing Pitts in at C, switching everything around just assuming it will be better would be pretty reckless. Here's the line I expect we will see -

Wand, Pitts, McKinney, Wiegert, Wade.

Looks familiar doesn't it? Sorry to all those that think any random sumo combination will lead us to the super bowl.
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Barring injury or some unexpected item, I would be surprised if we used anything other than that group.
 
Well I think that we can all agree that the only two positions on the o line that are set in stone are RG and RT. When Wiegert is healthly he can hold his own and Wade will only get better than he is now as time goes on. This leaves LT, LG and C as the three positions that are "up for grabs," and Pitts will most likely be the starting LG for the rest of his career as a texans unless someone is injuried. Wand has one year left on his rookie contract I think and this year will make or break him, consisdering the amount of talent in next years draft at LT. This leaves McKinney, who has never had anyone to push him to get better. Sadly for Carr the Texan braintrust seems to like the idea of McKinney as the starting center, which means that he will be that for the rest of his contract. While the o line does have depth, its not good enough to push any of the starters for playing time. All the problems can be fixed but considering how much of a beating Carrs has taken, time is running out.
 
Just don't let Mckinney play Center, that's all I'm saying....Our line instantly improves if he isn't playing Center........put him, Left Guard, or even Left Tackle, since he supposedly has good feet and quickness.........I say put him as backup LG......but, just don't put him at Center, cuz he's proven that he sucks at it. Why give him another year to show us what we already know?

And the fans that think the line is going to be the exact same lineup this year, well, I hope your wrong, since the coaching staff is finally realizing that some of the guys are playing in the wrong positions. If the coaches thought that the guys were in their best spots on the line, then they wouldn't be playing musical chairs with the LT, LG, C spots..........now, would they.
 
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