Dez Bryant Cut

[CloakNNNdagger]

Not to dismiss this, but I'd say turning down the Ravens would suggest other factors. IMHO, Dez is passionate. I don't know any truth to the notion of cancerous, which I wouldn't welcome, but he'd certainly be a force here that we need. I'm intrigued by the notion of turning 3's into 7's.

He turned down a multi-year deal...........the basis of his turning down could very well be that the Ravens offered him a low ball contract and/or a contract that allowed them to drop at the 1st hint of nonproduction.

As Ed Werder of The Doomsday Podcast reported Wednesday, the Ravens made Bryant a multiyear offer and it was declined by the three-time Pro Bowl receiver. According to Werder, Bryant only wants a lucrative one-year deal that would give him a chance to hit the free-agent market next year and be in better position to cash in if he has a strong season in 2018.

That contract structure wouldn’t work with the Ravens, who while they were negotiating with Bryant, had only about $10 million in salary cap space available and needed a chunk of that to pay their draft picks and maintain roster flexibility during the season.

It’s fair to question whether the two sides couldn’t have figured something out if the interest was mutual by both parties. However, the general feeling was that Bryant, who remains unsigned, had his eyes on other opportunities and not one in Baltimore.

LINK

 

[DocBar]

He turned down a multi-year deal...........the basis of his turning down could very well be that the Ravens offered him a low ball contract and/or a contract that allowed them to drop at the 1st hint of nonproduction.

LINK

The only way I would even consider Bryant is a vet minimum, incentive laden contract. He says he wants a prove it deal, so prove it. He could also be easily cut if he becomes a locker room cancer.

 

[CloakNNNdagger]

The only way I would even consider Bryant is a vet minimum, incentive laden contract. He says he wants a prove it deal, so prove it. He could also be easily cut if he becomes a locker room cancer.

I would not consider him unless he were to undergo 2 years of formal chemotherapy, although the prognosis for a cure is quite low.

 

[Texecutioner]

Not to dismiss this, but I'd say turning down the Ravens would suggest other factors. IMHO, Dez is passionate. I don't know any truth to the notion of cancerous, which I wouldn't welcome, but he'd certainly be a force here that we need. I'm intrigued by the notion of turning 3's into 7's.

What force is it that we need? You say this sounding like a person who hasn't watched a Cowboys game in years.

 

[paycheck71]

I've watched 2 episodes of "All or Nothing" this season (it's on Cowboys 2017 season), and I still have mixed feelings about Dez. He has almost too much passion, and doesn't know how to direct it properly into action on the field.

 

[dwight pugoy]

C'mon Gaine. We can do this.

 

[AngryNateFTW]

We need depth...not Dez.

 

[Carr Bombed]

I've watched 2 episodes of "All or Nothing" this season (it's on Cowboys 2017 season), and I still have mixed feelings about Dez. He has almost too much passion, and doesn't know how to direct it properly into action on the field.

When a outspoken player like Dez is producing like he was in his golden years, he's a "passionate leader". When his production has fallen off a cliff like Dez' has the past few years...he's a loudmouth distraction. Dez simply can't walk the walk anymore and when you can't do that people don't want to hear you talk, much less yell.

 

[Trail.Blazr]

What force is it that we need? You say this sounding like a person who hasn't watched a Cowboys game in years.

I was thinking red zone target. And for the record, I think I've watched 2

 

[gs27]

When a outspoken player like Dez is producing like he was in his golden years, he's a "passionate leader". When his production has fallen off a cliff like Dez' has the past few years...he's a loudmouth distraction. Dez simply can't walk the walk anymore and when you can't do that people don't want to hear you talk, much less yell.

Problem with Dez is his passion is almost exclusively the wrong direction. He is passionate when he does something great or a teammate/coach makes a mistake or does something he disagrees with. Very rarely do you see him passionate about teammate/coach success or his own mistakes, he is the antileader. Never seen him throw a helmet after one of his many drops.

 

[AcresHomesTexan]

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.co...yant-was-inconsistent-couldnt-win-one-on-one/

Well, the Cowboys' scouting staff speaks

“It was a collective deal,” McClay said of Bryant’s release, via Clarence Hill of the Fort Worth Star-Telegram. “The [inability] to win one-on-one, to win downfield. There was inconsistency as well as some huge things in his play. So what’s best moving forward for Dez Bryant the Cowboys, we just made that decision. It’s a production-based business.”

 

[Texecutioner]

I was thinking red zone target. And for the record, I think I've watched 2

We already have good Red zone targets. He's a big tall receiver with limited mobility and very few routes that he could run. We already have a slow WR on this team in Hopkins, but he's actually great besides that. Essentially Dez has no role on this team at all unless he'd be willing to give it a try at TE/WR. He isn't so there's no real reason to think about it.

 

[Carr Bombed]

We already have good Red zone targets. He's a big tall receiver with limited mobility and very few routes that he could run. We already have a slow WR on this team in Hopkins, but he's actually great besides that. Essentially Dez has no role on this team at all unless he'd be willing to give it a try at TE/WR. He isn't so there's no real reason to think about it.

Both players ran 4.5s coming out of college. (Dez 4.52..Hopkins 4.57) Hopkins isn't a speedster, but he's not some slow plodding receiver either. His body control/positioning and elite ball skills/hands more than make up for his lack of top end elite speed. His YPC #s are right there with the best in the league. He was #4 in receiving yards (with a good QB for 6.5 games) and #1 in TDs (3 more than the next guy)..I'll take that from a "slow receiver" every Sunday.

 

[Trail.Blazr]

We already have good Red zone targets. He's a big tall receiver with limited mobility and very few routes that he could run. We already have a slow WR on this team in Hopkins, but he's actually great besides that. Essentially Dez has no role on this team at all unless he'd be willing to give it a try at TE/WR. He isn't so there's no real reason to think about it.

I don't think we have good Red zone targets, but tbh, I'm finding myself somewhere I didn't intend to be... promoting Dez. I'm going to fold and say the rest of your statement rings true to my ears. I'd certainly not want to pay Dez what he probably wants, in lieu of putting that same funding at an area of better need, like the OL.

On the side, regarding our red zone targets... we don't have a single receiver over 6'3"...? Height may not be everything, but damn, that's a shorter realization than I would have thought.

 

[Hervoyel]

The fact that Dez Bryant is not a Houston Texan right now has me kind of feeling good about this team's decision making process right now. Since he was never a Houston Texan doesn't that mean that this thread and Dez's "not-playing-for-the-Texans-now-or-ever-before" ass belong over in the NFL forum?

He's just another retread WR out there looking to get paid one more time before he hangs it up.

 

[TheRealJoker]

I don't think we have good Red zone targets, but tbh, I'm finding myself somewhere I didn't intend to be... promoting Dez. I'm going to fold and say the rest of your statement rings true to my ears. I'd certainly not want to pay Dez what he probably wants, in lieu of putting that same funding at an area of better need, like the OL.

On the side, regarding our red zone targets... we don't have a single receiver over 6'3"...? Height may not be everything, but damn, that's a shorter realization than I would have thought.

The team signed Jester Weah and Vyncint Smith S UDFAs.

Weah is 6’2” runs 4.4 and Smith is 6’3” runs 4.3

Atleast one should make the team and other on practice squad.

 

[ObsiWan]

C'mon Gaine. We can do this.

naaah...
let's see what these youngsters can do.

signing Dez reminds me of the Eric Moulds mistake.
I'll pass.

 

[CloakNNNdagger]

I don't think we have good Red zone targets, but tbh, I'm finding myself somewhere I didn't intend to be... promoting Dez. I'm going to fold and say the rest of your statement rings true to my ears. I'd certainly not want to pay Dez what he probably wants, in lieu of putting that same funding at an area of better need, like the OL.

On the side, regarding our red zone targets... we don't have a single receiver over 6'3"...? Height may not be everything, but damn, that's a shorter realization than I would have thought.

That's why we picked the TEs we did.

 

[Bulls on Parade]

signing Dez reminds me of the Eric Moulds mistake.
I'll pass.

Not even close. Dez is 29 years old with a huge chip on his shoulder and a lot to prove. He'll also have a blossoming young star at quarterback to throw him the ball. Moulds was already what, 33 or 34 when he came here? With a 2006 David Carr throwing him the ball. Ugh. Again the situations aren't even comparable. Not even in the slightest.

Dez Bryant wants to sign a one year deal to prove himself.
If he were Eric Moulds he'd have taken the Ravens multi-year offer.

Dez is betting on himself and not taking the "easy money"...
A guy that knows he is done would take the Ravens offer.

 

[Carr Bombed]

I don't think we have good Red zone targets, but tbh, I'm finding myself somewhere I didn't intend to be... promoting Dez. I'm going to fold and say the rest of your statement rings true to mi8y ears. I'd certainly not want to pay Dez what he probably wants, in lieu of putting that same funding at an area of better need, like the OL.

On the side, regarding our red zone targets... we don't have a single receiver over 6'3"...? Height may not be everything, but damn, that's a shorter realization than I would have thought.

How is DeAndre Hopkins not a good red zone target? He just lead the league in TDs. Remember this catch?

That's not his only great end zone catch either.

As far as receiver size.. Dez Bryant and Hopkins are the same height, they're both 6'2.

My question is, why is Dez Bryant considered this great red zone target, but Hopkins isn't?

 

[Trail.Blazr]

How is DeAndre Hopkins not a good red zone target? He just lead the league in TDs. Remember this catch?

That's not his only great end zone catch either.

As far as receiver size.. Dez Bryant and Hopkins are the same height, they're both 6'2.

My question is, why is Dez Bryant considered this great red zone target, but Hopkins isn't?

I already stated I'm not here to promote Dez. I also said targets, plural. nuff said

 

[Carr Bombed]

I already stated I'm not here to promote Dez. I also said targets, plural. nuff said

Well before Watson got hurt they had the #1 offense and He lead the league in TD passes (19 in 6.5 games). So red zone target"S" or not, they were doing something right. nuff said.

I think our red zone deficiencies have more to do with shitty QB play than anything else. (That and the running game.)

 

[zshawn10]

Pat Doney

✔@PatDoneyNBC5
https://twitter.com/PatDoneyNBC5/status/991734364835901440

.@AdamSchefter says on ESPN the Ravens were willing to pay Dez Bryant about $7 million per year, and Schefter can't find any other teams willing to pay him anywhere near that amount. Says NFC East teams are not interested -- at least for now. @NBCDFW

12:41 PM - May 2, 2018

 

[Trail.Blazr]

Interesting link showing that it's Hopkins, Fuller and Miller that got more than 1 red zone TD reception last season.

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/years/2017/redzone-receiving.htm

I'll agree with shitty QB play, and even expand it outside of the RZ. Even if healthy all year, it would be nice for Watson to have more optoins, but maybe that's all we need... Hopkins, Fuller and Miller

 

[CloakNNNdagger]

Report: Most teams wouldn’t even sign Dez Bryant at the league minimum
May 2, 2018, 2:08 PM EDT

Dez Bryant's reputation in the NFL appears to be preceding him.

Bryant has indicated that he cares more about playing for the right team than making the right money, even suggesting that he cares more about staying in the NFC East so he can play the Cowboys twice than anything else. But there may not be many teams willing to sign Bryant for any amount of money.

Adam Schefter of ESPN reports that there are “far more” teams unwilling to pay Bryant the league minimum salary than there are teams that would consider signing Bryant for any contract.

That makes it all the more surprising that Bryant turned down an offer from the Ravens, which was reportedly in the neighborhood of the three-year, $21 million contract Baltimore previously gave to receiver Michael Crabtree. If most teams aren’t even willing to pay Bryant $1 million, why turn down an offer of $7 million?

If Bryant is truly willing to play for anything to stay in the NFC East, and Washington, Philadelphia and the New York Giants are all unwilling to offer him even the league minimum, that says a lot about what teams think the 29-year-old Bryant has left at this point in his career.

 

[TheRealJoker]

Maybe he should file a collusion grievance...

 

[AcresHomesTexan]

Maybe he should file a collusion grievance...

Does he have a brother the Texans could draft?

 

[Texecutioner]

Not even close. Dez is 29 years old with a huge chip on his shoulder and a lot to prove. He'll also have a blossoming young star at quarterback to throw him the ball. Moulds was already what, 33 or 34 when he came here? With a 2006 David Carr throwing him the ball. Ugh. Again the situations aren't even comparable. Not even in the slightest.

Dez Bryant wants to sign a one year deal to prove himself.
If he were Eric Moulds he'd have taken the Ravens multi-year offer.

Dez is betting on himself and not taking the "easy money"...
A guy that knows he is done would take the Ravens offer.

What world are you living in? The only low pay Dez is taking is the highest offer that might just be a low offer in general, because he has a very limited market for him and no one really wants his ass. Do yourself a favor and actually gloss over his stats last season, and watch a few Cowboys games, because clearly you're in the world that still thinks 2013 Dez Bryant still exists and not the one from 2018 that's a lot more limited. I'd argue that the current version of Moulds that came here actually brought a little more to the table to some degree.

I don't think we have good Red zone targets, but tbh, I'm finding myself somewhere I didn't intend to be... promoting Dez. I'm going to fold and say the rest of your statement rings true to my ears. I'd certainly not want to pay Dez what he probably wants, in lieu of putting that same funding at an area of better need, like the OL.

On the side, regarding our red zone targets... we don't have a single receiver over 6'3"...? Height may not be everything, but damn, that's a shorter realization than I would have thought.

Being tall does not make one red zone target. It simply means you're tall, and nothing more than that. I don't see any metrics or stats to suggest that Dez is this great RZ target from the last two seasons. I don't care what he did 5 years ago before injuries and before age took it's toll. I care about what Dez currently is capable of. Maybe he could be a good RZ target, but there is no recent history that suggests that is so for you to be acting like it's a guarantee.

He's just another retread WR out there looking to get paid one more time before he hangs it up.

It's definitely one of the dumbest football related threads I've ever seen in this forum.

 

[Texecutioner]

Both players ran 4.5s coming out of college. (Dez 4.52..Hopkins 4.57) Hopkins isn't a speedster, but he's not some slow plodding receiver either. His body control/positioning and elite ball skills/hands more than make up for his lack of top end elite speed. His YPC #s are right there with the best in the league. He was #4 in receiving yards (with a good QB for 6.5 games) and #1 in TDs (3 more than the next guy)..I'll take that from a "slow receiver" every Sunday.

He's always looked slow as hell to me. I didn't say it in a bad way in the context, nor do I think it matters much for him. There have been a lot of great slow WR's in the NFL like Fitzgerald and Boldin. Hopkins isn't a speedster. He beats guys with great moves, fakes, and superior route running skills. He has great hands, great leaping ability to grab a ball, and also great push off moves to draw defenders in for flags too. He is a great in a lot of areas. Speed isn't a strength though.

 

[JB]

He's always looked slow as hell to me. I didn't say it in a bad way in the context, nor do I think it matters much for him. There have been a lot of great slow WR's in the NFL like Fitzgerald and Boldin. Hopkins isn't a speedster. He beats guys with great moves, fakes, and superior route running skills. He has great hands, great leaping ability to grab a ball, and also great push off moves to draw defenders in for flags too. He is a great in a lot of areas. Speed isn't a strength though.

Not to mention the greatest of them all... Jerry Rice was no speedster

 

[Corrosion]

Pat Doney

✔@PatDoneyNBC5

.@AdamSchefter says on ESPN the Ravens were willing to pay Dez Bryant about $7 million per year, and Schefter can't find any other teams willing to pay him anywhere near that amount. Says NFC East teams are not interested -- at least for now. @NBCDFW

12:41 PM - May 2, 2018

I cant believe "no other team" is willing to give him more than a minimum deal .... He may not be 2013 Dez or even remotely close but I think he could help 32 teams get better. What I'm saying here is that .... there aint 120-150 WR's better than Dez even if he's lost a step.


I'd definitely bring him into camp on a minimum deal ..... you aint lost much if he's cut. There's more to this than Shefter's getting from his sauces.

 

[PapaL]

Apparently 31 other GMs disagree with you at this time. Ravens dodged a bullet there.

 

[Trail.Blazr]

Being tall does not make one red zone target. It simply means you're tall, and nothing more than that. I don't see any metrics or stats to suggest that Dez is this great RZ target from the last two seasons. I don't care what he did 5 years ago before injuries and before age took it's toll. I care about what Dez currently is capable of. Maybe he could be a good RZ target, but there is no recent history that suggests that is so for you to be acting like it's a guarantee.

So being tall means nothing more in respect to being a RZ Target? Nothing... Hmmm. I can agree to the notion it's not everything, in fact, not even the most important thing. But OK, dismiss height

I'm not acting like its a guarantee, but for stats, the link I posted would show that Dez's RZ TD's in 2016 and 2017 put him 23rd and 18th overall in the NFL. That in itself would suggest he's not this receiving turd that some would make him out to be. Is he the golden child? No. But I'd like to believe he'd be the 3rd best WR on the Texans roster in terms of productivity based on recent seasons. For a league minimum, it certainly wouldn't hurt to see him in a pre-season practice jersey. To say otherwise seems dismissive, to which there is not recent history to suggest that he's a guaranteed bum either.

 

[Corrosion]

Apparently 31 other GMs disagree with you at this time. Ravens dodged a bullet there.

It appears that way so far .... but there's a lot of offseason left , I find it hard to believe he's not in camp somewhere.

 

[TexansBull]

I find it hard to believe we are still talking about Dez.

 

[Corrosion]

We can talk about picking 6th round guys in the 3rd if you like.

 

[disaacks3]

I cant believe "no other team" is willing to give him more than a minimum deal .... He may not be 2013 Dez or even remotely close but I think he could help 32 teams get better. What I'm saying here is that .... there aint 120-150 WR's better than Dez even if he's lost a step.


I'd definitely bring him into camp on a minimum deal ..... you aint lost much if he's cut. There's more to this than Shefter's getting from his sauces.

Yep. He's better than most WR3s out there (top 96), and definitely better than any #4 I can think of (top 128).

I'm almost wondering if this is just a "locker room cancer" fear, or Dez doesn't want to go anywhere but the NFC East.

 

[Carr Bombed]

Yep. He's better than most WR3s out there (top 96), and definitely better than any #4 I can think of (top 128).

I'm almost wondering if this is just a "locker room cancer" fear, or Dez doesn't want to go anywhere but the NFC East.

Maybe Dez doesn't want to be a #3 or 4..hell he probably doesn't even want to be a #2.

This isn't about if Dez is still one of the top 64-128 WRs in the NFL. It's about if he's willing to suck up his pride and take that role and if it's worth the headache for a staff to have him on their team if he's not.

 

[OptimisticTexan]

Maybe Dez doesn't want to be a #3 or 4..hell he probably doesn't even want to be a #2.

This isn't about if Dez is still one of the top 64-128 WRs in the NFL. It's about if he's willing to suck up his pride and take that role and if it's worth the headache for a staff to have him on the team if he's not.

If anything, this little venture into FA has exposed Dez Bryant....well, to Dez Bryant. I don't think he's going to think he's anyone's #1 when and if he gets a contract, this little venture should have made this clear even to the most stubborn former #1. If Dez wants to be a #1 WR, he already knows he's going to have to suck it up for a season, at a contract far below his expectations and play lights out football while being a tremendous asset tot he locker room.....then he can fight for that payday in 2019.

 

[AcresHomesTexan]

We can talk about picking 6th round guys in the 3rd if you like.

or we talk about people believing speculation about the draft over the actual event the draft.

 

[TexansBull]

We can talk about picking 6th round guys in the 3rd if you like.

Nah. Both conversations are are worth the same.

 

[Texas Jake]

Both players ran 4.5s coming out of college. (Dez 4.52..Hopkins 4.57) Hopkins isn't a speedster, but he's not some slow plodding receiver either. His body control/positioning and elite ball skills/hands more than make up for his lack of top end elite speed. His YPC #s are right there with the best in the league. He was #4 in receiving yards (with a good QB for 6.5 games) and #1 in TDs (3 more than the next guy)..I'll take that from a "slow receiver" every Sunday.

Run in the 4.4s you are a speedster and in the 4.5s then you are slow. I think this is way overblown. The difference between the two is one tenth of a freaking second. Hopkins isn't a burner, but he is far from being slow. He sure didn't look slow on the short pass from Watson where he took it 70 plus yards into the end zone last year.

 

[ATXtexanfan]

Run in the 4.4s you are a speedster and in the 4.5s then you are slow. I think this is way overblown. The difference between the two is one tenth of a freaking second. Hopkins isn't a burner, but he is far from being slow. He sure didn't look slow on the short pass from Watson where he took it 70 plus yards into the end zone last year.

Not being an ass but how often is Hopkins running loose. He doesn't exactly separate but that not his game at all. Dude has hands and body control. He can beat a double coverage if the throw is on point. He opens it up for everyone else when people are doubling him. His YAC isn't stellar but dude can move the chains. Fuller the perfect complement and for the love of God if we ever find a true slot with Hopkins and fuller we got fantasy gold.

 

[powda]

Hopkins isn't fast. That's not his game. His yac might have improved but previous to that it wasn't noteworthy. Citing 1 play doesn't define the player.

And I agree, a legit slot (or te) could make this a really fun offense.

 

[Texas Jake]

Not being an ass but how often is Hopkins running loose. He doesn't exactly separate but that not his game at all. Dude has hands and body control. He can beat a double coverage if the throw is on point. He opens it up for everyone else when people are doubling him. His YAC isn't stellar but dude can move the chains. Fuller the perfect complement and for the love of God if we ever find a true slot with Hopkins and fuller we got fantasy gold.

Like I said, he is not a burner, but I think that tenth of a second gets over emphasized. I still would not call him slow.

 

[OptimisticTexan]

When Hopkins gets double teamed, he might have one defender up to bump him but the other defender who's going to help is playing with a 10+ yard buffer. You can't outrun that unless there's blown coverage. The only way for the Texans will see his true game speed is when there are other receivers on the field commanding attention. This hasn't been the case for Hopkins since he arrived.

 

[Texas Jake]

Hopkins isn't fast. That's not his game. His yac might have improved but previous to that it wasn't noteworthy. Citing 1 play doesn't define the player.

And I agree, a legit slot (or te) could make this a really fun offense.

I can cite more than one example, but I won't. That one play demonstrates that he has enough functional speed to be effective and the difference between him and every other players on the field speed-wise was slight. If he gets by a defender, he still has enough speed to make them pay. He doesn't have enough speed to flat-out burn them like a Fuller, but if they buy the fake and he gets a step or two behind them he is not slow enough they can immediately recover. My point is I think the "slow" tag is overplayed.

 

[austins23]

The only way for the Texans will see his true game speed

Dude turned on the jets against the Seahawks with that quick slant he caught. Looked pretty fast to me. But hell, Jason Witten looks fast compared to me.

 

[powda]

I can cite more than one example, but I won't. That one play demonstrates that he has enough functional speed to be effective and the difference between him and every other players on the field speed-wise was slight. If he gets by a defender, he still has enough speed to make them pay. He doesn't have enough speed to flat-out burn them like a Fuller, but if they buy the fake and he gets a step or two behind them he is not slow enough they can immediately recover. My point is I think the "slow" tag is overplayed.

I like the term "functional speed." I'm good with that.

 

[Texas Jake]

I like the term "functional speed." I'm good with that.

I don't think out opinions on the subject are really that far apart.