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Signings - When do we start to worry?

Just saw this on Adam Caplan's Twitter:

"RT @JasonLaCanfora: Texans CB Dunta Robinson prepared to miss the start of camp tomorrow, and perhaps beyond, according to a source."
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I wasn't sure who Jason LaCanfora was, but he is a
NFL reporter, blogger, TV dude, father and failed athlete, in no particular order
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I am tired of Dunta's contract dispute. He came back early and admirably last year and helped to emotionally lift our team to finish off the year strong. However, he wasn't the player he was before the injury and there is no guarantee that he will be again. I understand he wants to lock up a long term contract because he had a career threatening injury and he wants to ensure that he has financial security for life after football. But making $9 Mil next year isn't bad, instead of worrying about down the line I wish he had the attitude of "hey I am going to shut up, make my $9 mil, make the pro bowl, and earn more than 9 mil the following year and get locked up for more than 3 years."

Ahhh...Dunta pisses me off!

I hope that OD and DeMeco get their deals done!

It's a good problem to have as the players we drafted have become Pro Bowl talent, but it's frustrating as hell trying to make everyone happy.
 
JWarren14 said:
I hope that OD and DeMeco get their deals done!
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Didn't Owen Daniels sign a contract? Actually, I'm VERY confused on his issue. He signed then missed the last day or two of OTAs if I'm correct. Why is he continuing to hold out? Will he report tomorrow?
 
NitroHonda said:
Didn't Owen Daniels sign a contract? Actually, I'm VERY confused on his issue. He signed then missed the last day or two of OTAs if I'm correct. Why is he continuing to hold out? Will he report tomorrow?
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IIRC, he signed the tender. So he'll at least get paid that. But he's holding out trying to get a long term deal.

Don't expect him to report.
 
If you are not worried yet, now is the time to worry. Camp starts in the morning and still nothing on Barwin or Cush.
 
Barwin better be there. He has a lot to learn. Cushing I am not to worried about, he was one of the more pro ready prospects in the draft.
 
Honestly, about 11 of the 32 first rounders have agreed/signed and most of the 2nd rounders so the ranges have been established for both so it should not be difficult at the point to get them signed.
 
Clint Sintim--the pick right before Barwin--just signed with the Giants, but no details yet on the terms. This tightens the bracket around Barwin as he is one of only five unsigned second round picks. By the time we wake up in the morning, his deal should be done.
 
Thorn said:
OK, it's the morning of the 31st now. Does this mean we have to start worring?
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I think now is a good time. I'm mystified why Barwin isn't signed. His salary slot is pretty well bracketed right now.

Cushing is a little more complicated. Between Heyward-Bey's deal at #7 and Alex Mack's deal at #21, the only disclosed agreement is Josh Freeman's at 17 (the terms of Orakpo's deal are not yet available), and Freeman is getting the QB premium. Agents and GMs are loathe to screw up there slot, so everything is going to be slow going until there is more certainty.

No point in worrying about Dunta: he's not reporting for awhile. My guess is Daniels will report. Hopefully we can work out deals with him and Ryans during camp.
 
Guys, I'm stuck in India right now. I just walked back through rain* and Bangalore traffic after a LONG brutal day at work.

I NEED GOOD NEWS.

And if I don't get it. I'm blaming all of you.

* Most of the Indians were staying indoors waiting for it to pass and I told them, "Come on, guys. I'm from Texas. This isn't even a sprinkle." And I left them behind.

I might have exaggerated the sprinkle thing. Now I'm wet and tired and want good news. If I haven't made myself clear.
 
Hooston Texan said:
Cushing is a little more complicated. Between Heyward-Bey's deal at #7 and Alex Mack's deal at #21, the only disclosed agreement is Josh Freeman's at 17 (the terms of Orakpo's deal are not yet available), and Freeman is getting the QB premium.
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not to mention DHB is getting the raiders premium ($4m more garunteed than ellis got at the same spot last yr smh). i presume the texans can get details of orakpo's deal from the skins/nfl office. as hess being moved to LB that'd be a pretty good marker for us
 
Link to this morning's chron story about signings.

It seems like Barwin is almost signed at least. Cushing might take a while because of his agents who also are the agents for Moreno (pick 12), Orakpo (pick 13 signed), and Jenkins (pick 14). My guess is that the agents will work on getting those guys signed before getting to Cushing unless Cushing tells them to hurry up.
 
just saw on the .com that its reported on 610 that neither barwin or cushing were seen going out on the field
 
The Pencil Neck said:
Guys, I'm stuck in India right now. I just walked back through rain* and Bangalore traffic after a LONG brutal day at work.

I NEED GOOD NEWS.

And if I don't get it. I'm blaming all of you.

* Most of the Indians were staying indoors waiting for it to pass and I told them, "Come on, guys. I'm from Texas. This isn't even a sprinkle." And I left them behind.

I might have exaggerated the sprinkle thing. Now I'm wet and tired and want good news. If I haven't made myself clear.
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It Is football Season
 
Maddict5 said:
good stuff
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come on rick...I know you can do this!!!!!!!!

wanna get this "In Rick We Trust!" thing going like we got with Morey and the rockets!!!!!!...........Love the cities GM's right now!!!!

Lets go Rickie!!!....Lets GO!!!!!!(chant):fans:
 
I do not see what the worry is all about, They have just been hired to play for millions, think they are turning that down, not.

It is an attitude thing with Dunta, He was told by his agent that he should get 25 million and they franchise him. I think he is causing himself a problem now by not going to work. If you perform in the nfl you get paid period, show your self. As long as Dunta is a Texan he gets my everything so lay off him. It is his agent doing the talking right now.

So Couch Coaches, What I am saying is we will be ok, the deals will get done and I will not worry till you see Coach worrying, and I mean Kubiak.
 
Ok, so Orakpo has now signed a deal. So the agents for Cush still have Moreno and Jenkins to slot before him. Maybe Orakpo's signing gives the slot number since they play in the same part of the field(front 7) vs Jenkins being a DB and Moreno is a RB.
 
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The only issue I see is that #14 - Malcom Jenkins and #15 - Cushing are sharing the same agents (Tom Condon and Ben Hogra.) That gives the agency just a touch more sway as they control both contracts.
 
cland said:
The only issue I see is that #14 - Malcom Jenkins and #15 - Cushing are sharing the same agents (Tom Condon and Ben Hogra.) That gives the agency just a touch more sway as they control both contracts.
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I think Moreno also has Condon and Hogra. Plus they had Orakpo.

So they had #12, #13, #14, and #15!
 
I don't see much of a reason why Cushing won't get a deal done soon, unless Condon just wants to get his deals done in order. Cushing is smack dab in the middle. I'd assume his deal would be around 5 years, $18.75M (10.7M guarranteed)

13. Brian Orakpo DE Washington Agreed 5 years, $20M ($12.1M guaranteed)

14. Malcolm Jenkins CB New Orleans Unsigned

15. Brian Cushing LB Houston Unsigned

16. Larry English DE San Diego Unsigned

17. Josh Freeman QB Tampa Bay Signed 5 years, $36M ($10.245M guaranteed)
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http://myespn.go.com/blogs/nflnation/0-9-192/Signing-status-of--09-first-round-draft-picks.html
 
HOU-TEX said:
I don't see much of a reason why Cushing won't get a deal done soon, unless Condon just wants to get his deals done in order. Cushing is smack dab in the middle. I'd assume his deal would be around 5 years, $18.75M (10.7M guarranteed)



http://myespn.go.com/blogs/nflnation/0-9-192/Signing-status-of--09-first-round-draft-picks.html
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profootballtalk.com

English lessons will start on time
Posted by Gregg Rosenthal on July 31, 2009 4:39 PM ET
Here's one report that won't contain any conflicting information.

The Chargers and first-round pick Larry English have agreed to terms on a contract, according to NFL.com's Steve Wyche.

The Northern Illinois product is expected to work in pass rushing situations as an outside linebacker.

His arrival gives San Diego some leverage if Shawne Merriman hits free agency after the season - if a new collective bargaining agreement is worked out.

English played defensive end in college, so there will be a transition period as he learns to play with his hand off the ground.

He'll have two of the best teachers at the position: Merriman and Shaun Phillips.
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HOU-TEX said:
Great! I expect to see Brian in the morning.
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Just because, here are the financials

The San Diego Chargers and rookie outside linebacker Larry English reached an agreement today on a five-year contract. The National Football Post has just been informed the deal is worth $13.4 million, which is a 6.5% increase over Cardinals’ cornerback Dominique Rodgers-Cromartie’s contract from 2008. Both players were drafted in the first round, No. 16 overall.

In addition, English will receive $9.9 million guaranteed (a 10% increase over Rodgers-Cromartie) and $3.6 million in playing time escalators.
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Moving back to the contract negotiations with OD Dunta and Demeco, i've been thinking this for a while but haven't posted for fear of crucifixion. but, after reading the first of the camp quotes i've just about had it. This is the first year that Rick Smith has had to re-sign any major players and he has proceeded to ******* it up royally. i sincerely doubt that Dunta will trust him again and with Demeco now saying that it sets a bad example when key players and both defensive emotional leaders are upset with the GM it would surprise me if any young up and comers that we draft (Cush Barwin and Glover to point out this years) will want to deal with him. i'm not saying its pink soap time but he better get his ******* together. I'm tired of this "its a process" line he keeps using for EVERY situation.

-why didn't you draft a back up for Slaton?
-its a process.
-Why'd you franchise Dunta?
-its a process.
-whats happening with OD?
-its a process.
-what do you want for Christmas?
-its a process.

ok the last one i made up but seriously hes turning into a god damn politician. i know that the common perception on this board is that Dunta is just being greedy but i'd be pissed too if you didn't allow me to look and see what team were willing to pay me to show you that i command money. but lets say that this is true. that D-Rob is greedy. what about Demeco? this guy fires an agent to come to practice and HE doens't get a contract. OD went to the pro bowl last year and HE doesn't get a contract. get these guys signed Smith or step aside for someone who can.
 
V3rm0nt3r said:
Moving back to the contract negotiations with OD Dunta and Demeco, i've been thinking this for a while but haven't posted for fear of crucifixion. but, after reading the first of the camp quotes i've just about had it. This is the first year that Rick Smith has had to re-sign any major players and he has proceeded to ******* it up royally. i sincerely doubt that Dunta will trust him again and with Demeco now saying that it sets a bad example when key players and both defensive emotional leaders are upset with the GM it would surprise me if any young up and comers that we draft (Cush Barwin and Glover to point out this years) will want to deal with him. i'm not saying its pink soap time but he better get his ******* together. I'm tired of this "its a process" line he keeps using for EVERY situation.

-why didn't you draft a back up for Slaton?
-its a process.
-Why'd you franchise Dunta?
-its a process.
-whats happening with OD?
-its a process.
-what do you want for Christmas?
-its a process.

ok the last one i made up but seriously hes turning into a god damn politician. i know that the common perception on this board is that Dunta is just being greedy but i'd be pissed too if you didn't allow me to look and see what team were willing to pay me to show you that i command money. but lets say that this is true. that D-Rob is greedy. what about Demeco? this guy fires an agent to come to practice and HE doens't get a contract. OD went to the pro bowl last year and HE doesn't get a contract. get these guys signed Smith or step aside for someone who can.
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Well,
Lets all take a breath and achieve a moment of clarity. Everyone take a deep breath. Ok, good. Smith offered OD, Demeco, and DR a contract in the off season. We do not know what the contract numbers are but none of them wanted it.

1. RS HAD to use the franchise tag on DR. It was his only recourse. If he did not do it, another team may have signed DR and we would have been left with nothing. As is, DR will waltz in a few days before the start of the season needing to prove himself. If he does, he will get his big contract, if not, he gets much less. Simple.

2. I thought RS did a great job drafting. Yes he did not draft a RB, but he was shrewd enough to realize that he did not need to. He picked up Foster as an UDFA. This kid is money and will be a GREAT powerback for us. Plus we also have Moats, who was picked up off the scrap heap last year.

3. Whats happening with OD is the same as is happening with Demeco. They want a new contract, as every NFL player does. Do they deserve one, sure. The thing everyone needs to remember is that there is a hard Salary Cap in football. Its not like baseball where you can spend as much as you want or a soft cap in basketball where you can go over the cap as long as you pay a luxury tax. Simply put you have a max total of how much $ you can spend. In theory you want to have a core group that is built around. At this point Schaub, Mario, and AJ are that group. I want to keep both OD and Demeco, but we need to be wary about cap ramifications. Players need to think about themsleves. GMs need to think about teams. RS is concerned with making the Texans the best team it can be. OD and Demeco are looking out for OD and Demeco, as they should.

I think once Cush signs RS will turn his attention to OD and Demeco. Both sides will need to give a little and in the end a deal can be reached. If both sides are cool, calm, and collected, new deals can be done by the end of preseason.
 
TexanSam said:
Is there always this large amount of unsigned 1st round picks this time of year?
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NO. The uncertainty of the CBA has left several players unsigned. I THINK THE CBA IS THE #1 ISSUE THAT HAS KEPT US FROM LOCKING UP ALL THESE GUYS LONG TERM.
 
awtysst said:
Well,
Lets all take a breath and achieve a moment of clarity. Everyone take a deep breath. Ok, good. Smith offered OD, Demeco, and DR a contract in the off season. We do not know what the contract numbers are but none of them wanted it.

1. RS HAD to use the franchise tag on DR. It was his only recourse. If he did not do it, another team may have signed DR and we would have been left with nothing. As is, DR will waltz in a few days before the start of the season needing to prove himself. If he does, he will get his big contract, if not, he gets much less. Simple.

2. I thought RS did a great job drafting. Yes he did not draft a RB, but he was shrewd enough to realize that he did not need to. He picked up Foster as an UDFA. This kid is money and will be a GREAT powerback for us. Plus we also have Moats, who was picked up off the scrap heap last year.

3. Whats happening with OD is the same as is happening with Demeco. They want a new contract, as every NFL player does. Do they deserve one, sure. The thing everyone needs to remember is that there is a hard Salary Cap in football. Its not like baseball where you can spend as much as you want or a soft cap in basketball where you can go over the cap as long as you pay a luxury tax. Simply put you have a max total of how much $ you can spend. In theory you want to have a core group that is built around. At this point Schaub, Mario, and AJ are that group. I want to keep both OD and Demeco, but we need to be wary about cap ramifications. Players need to think about themsleves. GMs need to think about teams. RS is concerned with making the Texans the best team it can be. OD and Demeco are looking out for OD and Demeco, as they should.

I think once Cush signs RS will turn his attention to OD and Demeco. Both sides will need to give a little and in the end a deal can be reached. If both sides are cool, calm, and collected, new deals can be done by the end of preseason.
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Mario Schaub and AJ are all great but three players don't win championships. right now we are 10 million under the cap with one more player to sign. now i think it goes without saying that Dunta wouldn't command the 9 million a year he gets for being franchised if it were a long term deal.

and i think Smith makes it quite clear that he feels that it is past the times for negotiations and it should just be time to focus on football. as he put it in the link in my previous post "he's (in this instance it was OD that he was talking about) under contract this year, and we're not discussing his contract at this time." now i would like to believe him that he just believes that the players should be concentrating on football now but the fact that none of the three contracts got done speaks to me that he is more interested in keeping the pocketbook light this year than in keeping the young talent on this team. i'm petrified when next year comes around because all three of these guys won't have contracts and then if you throw on top of them Chester Pitts and KW i'm just not conviced that he will have the credibility to keep all of them.
 
V3rm0nt3r said:
Mario Schaub and AJ are all great but three players don't win championships. right now we are 10 million under the cap with one more player to sign. now i think it goes without saying that Dunta wouldn't command the 9 million a year he gets for being franchised if it were a long term deal.

and i think Smith makes it quite clear that he feels that it is past the times for negotiations and it should just be time to focus on football. as he put it in the link in my previous post "he's (in this instance it was OD that he was talking about) under contract this year, and we're not discussing his contract at this time." now i would like to believe him that he just believes that the players should be concentrating on football now but the fact that none of the three contracts got done speaks to me that he is more interested in keeping the pocketbook light this year than in keeping the young talent on this team. i'm petrified when next year comes around because all three of these guys won't have contracts and then if you throw on top of them Chester Pitts and KW i'm just not conviced that he will have the credibility to keep all of them.
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You are absolutely right. We need more than 3 good players. What i am saying is those are the three are our corner stone players. We could certainly use a few more core players and I would love to keep both Meco and OD.

See, I was thinking RS meant that now was time to worry about getting the rookies under contract and into camp. I was thinking once he got that done he could shift back to OD and Meco.

I like DR but lets be honest, he really is not worth Chris Gamble money. Preinjury his greatest value was playing near the box as opposed to covering. He likely is playing out of position. Now, I think meco and and OD are both quality players that I would build around. As you said we have 10 mill+ dollars left. I don't know enough about cap hits in order to structure two contracts that are amicable to both sides.

Chester Pitts and KW are great players but you have to ask yourself how much will they want/can we get similar production elsewhere cheaper? Pitts has been an original Texan, but is he expendable? Can one of the younger OGs line up in his spot for less? How about Walter?
These are questions we need to ask. Good teams pay their talent appropriately. Bad Teams overpay. We need to pay appropriately and realize that as we become a better team, it will be hard to keep ALL of our players. The key is to keep the right ones and supplement our holes with solid plug ins.
 
awtysst said:
You are absolutely right. We need more than 3 good players. What i am saying is those are the three are our corner stone players. We could certainly use a few more core players and I would love to keep both Meco and OD.

See, I was thinking RS meant that now was time to worry about getting the rookies under contract and into camp. I was thinking once he got that done he could shift back to OD and Meco.

I like DR but lets be honest, he really is not worth Chris Gamble money. Preinjury his greatest value was playing near the box as opposed to covering. He likely is playing out of position. Now, I think meco and and OD are both quality players that I would build around. As you said we have 10 mill+ dollars left. I don't know enough about cap hits in order to structure two contracts that are amicable to both sides.

Chester Pitts and KW are great players but you have to ask yourself how much will they want/can we get similar production elsewhere cheaper? Pitts has been an original Texan, but is he expendable? Can one of the younger OGs line up in his spot for less? How about Walter?
These are questions we need to ask. Good teams pay their talent appropriately. Bad Teams overpay. We need to pay appropriately and realize that as we become a better team, it will be hard to keep ALL of our players. The key is to keep the right ones and supplement our holes with solid plug ins.
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i can honestly say that Pitts is our second best lineman at this point only behind Eric Winston. other than that you make a lot of good points. the only problem is that we aren't a good team yet. we're average. i feel hopeful for this year like all fans but maybe you're counting your chickens before they hatch. the fact remains that we are very short at some of the positions that they are gambling on. without Pitts we have Studdard and Briesel starting. without DRob who do we have in our entire secondary? Reeves played well last year but i wouldn't count on anything above where he was at and Quin and Molden have promise but promise doesen't win games. he's gambling too much on players that we NEED.
 
I wouldn't be surprised if a deal was reached with Cushing as we speak, with the reports coming out some time in the morning. 1 day of missed camp oh well right?
 
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