Kaiser Toro
Native Mod
Would not mind him coming in as a UDFA.
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Would not mind him coming in as a UDFA.
TexansSeminole
Hall of Fame
That's the guy from Elkins High right? If so, he put me on my ass in high school football.
CloakNNNdagger
Hall of Fame
Familiar scenario?????
Ole Miss Texan
Hall of Fame
I think I've got fairly similar thoughts as most here. I could see him being a late rounder or undrafted. I'm thinking of the depth we've got now at RB plus the assumption we select a guy to split carries with Slaton... he'd most likely be on the practice squad. With another injury to Chris Brown or poor play by Moats, he essentially could get activated. Playing in TX, esp. his hometown may sound good for him if he's undrafted.
Strake Jesuit... but I be he still put you on your ass.
The1ApplePie
Hall of Fame
Go BPA. There are plenty of good defenders but they will all be gone by 15
All the DEs are one-trick ponies that probably won't see the field for the first two downs (Maybin, Brown, etc). Clay can rush the passer but thats it.
I'd rather have a complete player in the first, no matter what the position
All the DEs are one-trick ponies that probably won't see the field for the first two downs (Maybin, Brown, etc). Clay can rush the passer but thats it.
I'd rather have a complete player in the first, no matter what the position
bah007
Hall of Fame
Ogbonnaya gives great value as a pass blocker and receiver out of the backfield.
I would have absolutely no problem bringing that guy in as a UDFA.
He is one of those guys that just does whatever he can to help his team. Played WR, LB, S, FB, and HB at different times while he was at Texas.
I would have absolutely no problem bringing that guy in as a UDFA.
He is one of those guys that just does whatever he can to help his team. Played WR, LB, S, FB, and HB at different times while he was at Texas.
The1ApplePie
Hall of Fame
With McDaniels spread offense every RB is basically a 3rd down back. Any Rb on the Denver roster that cannot catch will be gone (possibly to the Texans). If it wasn't for the Cutler boondogle, I would also say with 100% certainty that the Broncos would trade down in the first to take Percy Harvin
jppaul
Cut and Dry
Maybe he would go well with Slaton, but there is the issue of value. Why buy a 90 Chrysler LeBaron for 25,000 when you can buy one for $ 450?
Although I will admit that without a doubt, there is not a slicker ride out there than a Cherry Red LeBaron Convertible with faded paint, and a windshield perfectly engineered to allow the wind to caress the bald spot of your average mid-life crisis burdened chicken hawk.
Anyway you get my point.
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Polo
Guest
ahem.....
So anybody wanna re-think their stance on this?
So anybody wanna re-think their stance on this?
HOU-TEX
Ah, Football!
Ole Miss Texan
Hall of Fame
With the offseason additions, we've filled some needs/depth. I think we're going into the draft in a good position to select the best players available.
I can see RB being selected anywhere from 1st thru 4th rounds, due to our 'need' for another RB and the talent in this class. Good but not exceptional.
Donald Brown is still my hands down favorite RB in the draft. I think he provides us with a guy similar to Slaton (not quite the same long speed) but he's quick and I think has a little more power. I think they are very similar and Kubiak would be able to really use both of them as starters.
I also want to let you know I'm coming around on Beanie Wells. I still don't want him or another RB at 15- but if that's how the board sets up for us, I can't get that upset. Brown > Wells though imo.
Sure we can address RB later in the draft (which is something I usually would rather do). It's just a matter of how the board is set up when it's our pick at 15. We do know Kubiak has said he wants someone to compliment Steve (would prefer a bigger guy) but this RB obviously has to fit this teams scheme. He's also going to be a RB that isn't a true #2 backup... he's a guy that will get a decent number of carries each game and will most likely be used as a starter in some cases, giving Steve extra rest.
People who are against a RB in rounds 1 or 2, usually provide the reasoning that the guy is strictly going to be a backup to Slaton. I don't think that's the case. I think the two RBs will be used interchangeably, thus arises the need for a RB you can count on to start. I would rather pay the guy 3rd round money than 1st round money, that's for sure though. Steve's going to get a pay day in a year or two. We'll see if Kubiak/Smith keep him on the team at that point or not. All I know is if we get one of the early RBs, I think our RB committee would be one of the best in the league.
I can see RB being selected anywhere from 1st thru 4th rounds, due to our 'need' for another RB and the talent in this class. Good but not exceptional.
Donald Brown is still my hands down favorite RB in the draft. I think he provides us with a guy similar to Slaton (not quite the same long speed) but he's quick and I think has a little more power. I think they are very similar and Kubiak would be able to really use both of them as starters.
I also want to let you know I'm coming around on Beanie Wells. I still don't want him or another RB at 15- but if that's how the board sets up for us, I can't get that upset. Brown > Wells though imo.
Sure we can address RB later in the draft (which is something I usually would rather do). It's just a matter of how the board is set up when it's our pick at 15. We do know Kubiak has said he wants someone to compliment Steve (would prefer a bigger guy) but this RB obviously has to fit this teams scheme. He's also going to be a RB that isn't a true #2 backup... he's a guy that will get a decent number of carries each game and will most likely be used as a starter in some cases, giving Steve extra rest.
People who are against a RB in rounds 1 or 2, usually provide the reasoning that the guy is strictly going to be a backup to Slaton. I don't think that's the case. I think the two RBs will be used interchangeably, thus arises the need for a RB you can count on to start. I would rather pay the guy 3rd round money than 1st round money, that's for sure though. Steve's going to get a pay day in a year or two. We'll see if Kubiak/Smith keep him on the team at that point or not. All I know is if we get one of the early RBs, I think our RB committee would be one of the best in the league.
painekiller
All Pro
I have been a big supporter of Brown and Matthews, so this hard for me. I watched the Indy game again yesterday and Diles looked real good at SAM. That was only his 4th game as a starter.
So I am again going to start the Brown in the 1st banter. Because Kubiak and company seem to be talking about everything else in the 1st I see a trade down or two and Donald Brown as our RB who shares the load with Slaton.
Then a guy like Javarris Williams later in the draft to cement the position. Three young studs at RB and this team is set for a few years until they start to break down.
P
Polo
Guest
That's what I'm hoping for as well..
Well, not those players...but I want us to draft a back in the first or second and then take another one in the 5th,6th or 7th...
WolverineFan
Hall of Fame
So you want to take 2 RB's in the draft including one on the first day of the draft? So what do you plan on doing about the defense?
rollinstone18
let it bleed
I wouldn't be oppossed to drafting Wells or Moreno even if we can't trade back. Both are good value at 15, perhaps a bit of a reach but no more of a reach than Cushing or Matthews. A back that can run inside, consistently pick up 3rd and short and punch it in on the goaline will help our defense. And if Slaton goes down and misses a few weeks, we'd still have a top shelf back.
Still, I think the plan should be to target Jenkins. Even if we have to trade up ahead of New Orleans.
Still, I think the plan should be to target Jenkins. Even if we have to trade up ahead of New Orleans.
P
Polo
Guest
Beides the other 6 picks we have, I have no clue.
threetoedpete
Hall of Fame
http://ourlads.com/2009nflmockdraft.cfm?MockDraftID=6
http://www.nfl.com/draft/story?id=09000d5d80f974f3&template=with-video-with-comments&confirm=true
It'd have to be a very special back for them to pull the trigger on one that early.
This crew has never done it. They believe Steve is a front line seventeen touches a game back.....there will only be one, and only one, in the end making first round elite back money.
threetoedpete
Hall of Fame
Or...having a seventeen point lead with eight eight teen left in the game....over a team you've only defeated once in twelve tries....only to watch the lead melt away into oblivion ?
P
Polo
Guest
That sounds like something a dependable running game can cure.
P
Polo
Guest
I agree with you there...And that is why I initially thought there was no way they'd pick a back before the third...
Simply because they wouldn't want to pay a rookie more than they are paying Steve. But the more I thought about it the more I realized that is silly. Since Kubiak has gotten here he's tried to get the best players on the field. Not too many times where I thought a back-up should have been playing over a starter...To me that means that while Kubiak likes certain players, he doesn't really put any of them over whats best for the team..
Goldensilence
hipster elite
Good points. The other thing I keep in mind is how much better this offense looks with a not only a viable running game but, an explosive one. Even when it was Ron Dayne Kubiak is dedicated to the running game and passing from it. We take a huge step back offensively if Slaton( I'm not even religious but i pray he doesn't) go down, who takes up the carries? We can hope Brown is healthy enough to go, and as much as i like Moats(even since he was with the Eagles) he's not a guy who can carry the load. That's what concerns me the most regarding drafting a RB.
If we want to keep a top 5 offense I think the staff needs to think hard about where and who they draft at RB.
P
Polo
Guest
Yep...
As of right now, we are more thin at RB than we were at this time last year...
I am not ruling out the Texans waiting until the third to grab a back and I wouldn't be upset if that's where they decided to go...But If they did wait until the third I'd definitely want another one sometime after that...
threetoedpete
Hall of Fame
This all assumes that even when you have them all back.....they will approach the middle of the pack and make all sixteen games.....something just judging by their free agent signings they are not prepared to do. Every indication so far....the hiring of Kollar, the singing of the defensive depth, suggests that they will put their money early on the defensive side of the ball. And the last thing they are going to do is draft a RB high..on the first day. They are set up to hold the model Gibbs has been using ...like forever. Now if Slaton was dinged and they were uncertain what his status was for September, you'd have a case. But he isn't and you don't. The reason they lost the rosencopter game, wasn't Rosencopter....the reason they lost the rosencoter game, as with all the other seven...they had no speed in the front seven on defense and they could not defend the edges on third, fourth and short. They had no speed on the outside.....and when they sent five and six....with Dilles and Adibi there ....no one got there. The colts loaded the box....and shut down the attempt to run out the clock. Beaner Wells or No beaner Wells, Knowshown Moreno no Moreno,Donald Brown no Donald Brown , the results would of been the same with nine guys in the box. Once the OC quit throwing on first down to set up the run, the game was lost. Now you are suggesting that we live with the two injuries of Dilles and Adibi...and try to luck this thing out. We've done this before and it hasn't worked out for us. I can't remember a time it did work out for us when we gambled that way. And I can't believe now....for what ever reason you believe it will work out of us now in '09. You're crying for DB, a better safety.......well there he is sitting at fifteen....all 240 pounds of him running a 4.6 forty, with great hands....elite TE hands. If he's there and they pass him by....take the big power o back believing he can grind it out behind a ZBS blocking o-line at the end of a game.....we'll deserve what we're fixing to receive.
Can't argue against Moreno or Donald Brown....they are both great backs....Our problem isn't a front line back. It's protecting the QB and becoming quicker on the outside on defense....allowing our young DBs to make more Plays. And they both do not fit the model that this staff has used for fifteen years. Brown fits one cut and go.....but unless he slips to 46...Possible sure.....probable....not a chance.
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threetoedpete
Hall of Fame
Well Polo....they dominated the game from the start of the second quarter....until the eight eighteen mark of the forth quarter... running the ball....I'm just trying to figure out how anyone of the highly rated backs from this class...under your arguments, would of changed the results of that game as well as the other games where we struggled on defense, like in Oakland. Now they could redraft the o line and switch to a power o game like the Giants, Steelers, and Dallas uses. No chance.
My point is there is only a hand full of guys who have the chance to come in on defense and make the defense have a significant jump in production. And you and cheese heads argument is that with a front line back....behind this o line....we will be able to protect the defense....which you both are assuming ...everyone will be there and at 100% by September.... and with the system and the coaching switch....we will get better. Sorta like HWSNBN in reverse ? And what I'm saying do not gamble....draft defense play makers. Then you will not have to worry about protecting anything. Give the new guy better weapons above and beyond what the last guy had ? Then you don't have to gamble on anything. The second day backs will be fine.
So Texans Chick....If we're that concerned about injuries....under your scenario, shouldn't the move be trade two high picks and draft the best QB we can get our hands on ? That is what you saying with Slaton. I didn't say it. Kubiak said it. Steve Slaton is a twenty touches per game front line RB. I got it.
And more importantly....as long as that Aggie has his neck bowed and he believes it....there's not a chance in hades we'll draft a RB in the first.
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P
Polo
Guest
I don't think our defense will be better because of the co-ordinator switch. I didn't really have a problem with Smith although I felt like an upgrade would be beneficial. I think our defense will be better for one reason....No Morlon. I didn't care for Weaver either, but Morlon really sucked @ WLB...
And I actually can see what you mean about picking talent on defense and hoping that trumps possibly bad coaching...But there is no guarantee that the defensive player you draft will produce any more than the coach you hire...
What I have seen though is that the Texans have replace almost the entire defensive staff. They've signed two LB's, a starting DE and they've resigned some safeties...If they thought that the coaching last year was a big problem, then they may infact like a lot of the players over there...who knows...
If you are going to take Kubiak at face value like you are with the Slaton 22 carry thing, then why not take him at face value when he talks about the defense...He's pretty much said Diles is the starter at SLB and Adibi and June will compete at Will...
That could very well be a smoke screen, but couldn't saying Slaton is his "front-line" 22 carry a game back be one as well?
dalemurphy
Hall of Fame
5 of our past 6 first round picks have been on the defense. The two highest dollar free agents have been on defense. Demeco was the first pick of the second round. Jacques Reeves was our highest paid FA acquisition last year. Antonio Smith was our highest paid FA acquisition this year. Clearly, the reason why our defense has struggled so much is not because of a lack of resources going into the personnel.
Now, that doesn't mean that we should ignore the defensive personnel to get better. What I think it does mean is that our problem on defense hasn't primarily been the lack of talent. As fans, I think it is extremely difficult for us to accurately assess individual players ability that have been playing in our system. It's difficult because it's hard to know the details of how much impact poor coaching and gameplanning has had on their performance. Clearly, though, we can say, as a general rule, the poor coaching has led to some of the players underforming. Well, the organization has now addressed the coaching on defense.
I think the prudent thing to do in the draft is to:
1. take the best players available that fit our system
2. draft players at positions where we don't have adequate talent/depth.
From my limited perspective, it appears to me that the one position on the team where we have the least amount of talent/depth is at RB, followed closely by interior Oline, and then safety. So, what does that mean we should do in the draft?
1. We need to exit the draft with a RB that we are confident will contribute this season and compliment Steve Slaton.
2. We need another RB with enough ability to serve as a ST player and a guy that can step in and get 12 carries in a week where Slaton and our primary backup is banged up.
3. There are some excellent C prospects in the 2nd-4th rounds... many of them could also play guard. It makes a lot of sense to purpose to get one of these guys to backup Briesel and Myers and eventually be able to push one of those players for playing time... or, be able to take over for Pitts if we don't re-sign him next year.
4. Right now, Brandon Harrison is the primary FS backup and our top two SS are a 6th rounder from last season with questionable speed and a guy approaching his mid 30s. We need to come out of the draft with an athletic playmaker who is ready to see significant playing time by 2010.
5. We need defensive playmakers. If they see a difference maker on the board at any defensive position other than MLB, he should seriously be considered.
Where I disagree with you and others, is the idea that because our defense was bad last year, we have to take a defensive player in the first round. To me that is a very simplistic and unthoughtful rule to follow. I think there are many variables that should go into a decision for any draft pick. Certainly, though, they need to come out of the draft confident that the talent level on defense has been improved.
threetoedpete
Hall of Fame
And I agree with that....what we are arguing about here is where you place the risk. Polo and cheese are saying send the draft capitol on the guy getting 10 to twelve touches a game.....Texan Chick is saying it's only a matter of time untill Steve Slaton is injured. And I'm saying ...what makes sense to me....is spend the draft capitol, the high draft capitol, on the guys who have the best chance to make this defense as close to the middle of the pack as we can get. All of them have a bust factor. No Matter where you draft them. I just believe with our staffs history...it is much more likely they can find a running back who can fit in the second day....than it will be that they will find defense play makers. I do not see the point of drafting second day guys who'll struggle in the first place to make a roster spot ...much less start for us.
I have no problem with Dilles except for the freak nature of the injury. Adibi is reported up twenty pounds. Until I see it on the field.....you fix the deficiencies on the edge on the front seven....first above all else. It killed us all year long. And MJD and Chirs Johnson are both still in the division. I draft to defeat that first....above all else. Because if we do not sweep two of three division foes....we can't win the division. And unless we win the division , they aren't going to the dance.
El Tejano
Hall of Fame
No joke with like 4 something left in that game our defense had Indy 4th and 7 at the 15 yard line and we give up the TD. The one thing the announcer did say was " Houston has to feel good about getting pressure from the front 4 and being able to drop everyone back in coverage." Of course it was a TE who scored the TD. Wanna guess whose man? Let's just say if Adibi was there, this game would've been won.
threetoedpete
Hall of Fame
So are you saying now...with what we know.....you believe that Babins and Travis Johnson were elite players. Not only you...I see this argument all over the web. Can we now agree that Babin was an out right bust and that T.J. was a guy who got drafted at least twenty picks too High ? I'm sorry this argument is old and misleading. And when you factor in the first two picks, an out right lie.
The only two players which panned out the first two drafts we A.J. and Pitts....both offensive players.
And what is simplistic Dale is watching the defense for a year....reading the year end stats....and trying to make an argument for an offensive player. Except for the green zone and short yardage,....the offense is fine.
What is not fine is the number of times we were were attacked on fourth ond one and third and one and they didn't have the speed on defense on the outside to defeat that. They attacked the edges on us Dale....not the middle. And....if you do not address this...you're going to get to relive all over again in 2009.
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Kaiser Toro
Native Mod
Our defense was bad last year? How about our defense has never been good in our franchise's history. Moreover, in our short history we went from a 3-4 to a 4-3 and are going on DC #3 while having to deal with Casserly in charge and Greer's team scouting talent. Bush is as unproven a commodity as any of our defensive players drafted early or acquired via FA.
I concur with your opinion on needs and rationale. However, your consistent narrative on the defense being fine based on spend and draft picks is interesting, yet directionally askew.
If the first pick is on offense I hope it is Unger, Pettigrew, Moreno or an OT that drops. But as I have opined I do not see Robinson and/or Ryans back with us next year, and therefore believe that we will be looking at a playmaker on D.
dalemurphy
Hall of Fame
Exactly. So, there is a danger in being determined to draft a player at a certain position simply because that side of the ball was poor the year before. And, Babin and TJ prove the fallacy of your argument. Drafting a defensive player in the first round doesn't mean that he will improve the defense. I believe that draft picks are too important to an organization to add risk to them by pre-determining what position or what side of the ball a particular pick will address. Instead, the organization needs to take a holistic view of the draft and make sure it comes out of the draft with players it feels good about, particularly at the positions where we need the most help... Why on earth do I care if we get a LB in the 1st or the 4th round if he is someone that will make the team better?
dalemurphy
Hall of Fame
That's not my argument. My argument is that the reason the defense is bad is not because the organization has not spent adequate resources on the defensive personnel.
If the defense's poor play is not a result of the organization neglecting players in the early rounds of the draft, then I think it's a fallacy to assert that the solution to the defense's poor play is to continue the same trend in the draft (drafting defensive players in the 1st round).
WolverineFan
Hall of Fame
6 picks means nothing if you don't use them for the right reason. We could have three 1st round picks, but if we used them all on offense it would do nothing to help out the team. Yea we would have an explosive offense, but our defense would still suck.
We need a CB or LB in the 1st round and a CB or LB in the 2nd round. We need immediate impact players on defense and drafting a RB on the 1st day would seriously hinder that. You can find good defenders later in the draft, but they will most likely not start. I'm all for getting depth late in the draft, but we need to get some impact guys on the defensive side of the ball early.
I actually like WalterFootball's scenario where we trade our 1st rd pick (#15) & 2nd rd pick (#46) to the Eagles for their two 1st's (#21 & #28). That way we could take a LB like Matthews and a CB like Butler or Smith in the 1st round. Immediate impact.
dalemurphy
Hall of Fame
I am assuming you're going for hyperbole here. Because this is a ridiculous statement. Our offense committed too many turnovers and we were 17th in the NFL in points scored. Not only that, we were very fortunate that our starting RB, starting WRs, entire starting OL, starting TE played all 16 games. That will not happen again. We are going to have injuries. Not only that, but even healthy, we didn't score that many points. Drafting an elite RB, drafting the best C/G in the draft, and adding a weapon like Maclin would certainly help this team.
All that being said, I want the team to draft a defensive player if he's the top guy on their board. I think your expectations are pretty silly if you expect any CB in this draft to immediate take over and upgrade the defense. Reeves and Dunta Robinson are better CBs at this point in their careers than any CB in this draft will be as a rookie.
And again, it would be poor management on the part of Rick Smith if he were to pre-determine what position he was going to draft in round one and round two. And it would be even more ridiculous if he pre-determined not to draft anyone on offense on the first day no matter who was there. If you can't see that, then clearly you've pre-determined to ignore reason.
Texecutioner
Hall of Fame
Good post Dale Murphy. Very good analysis.
WolverineFan
Hall of Fame
I was merely trying to prove a point. I forgot who mentioned it, but somebody was talking about drafting 2 RB's in the draft and I asked him what about the defense and his repsonse was we have 6 other picks. I was merely pointing out to him that just because we will have 6 leftover picks does not mean we can fix our defense with those picks.
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WolverineFan
Hall of Fame
Malcolm Jenkins would walk in and take Reeves starting job no problem. Reeves is more suited to being a nickel CB. He has excellent coverage skills, but very poor ball skills. He always sticks to his man, but rarely knocks down a pass.
As for me determined to ignore reason that is not the case. It is my philosophy that you need to go into the draft with a plan and if I were the Texans GM my plan would be to leave the first day of the draft with a CB and a LB.
However that does not mean that those are the only 2 positions that I care about. If we took a CB in round 1 and there were no good LB's in round 2 I would not reach for a 3rd round prospect. I would go BPA at a position of need. If it is a RB or an offensive lineman so be it, but my main priorites are CB and strongside LB.
dalemurphy
Hall of Fame
Perhaps that's true but a lot of NFL people think he doesn't have the speed to play CB in a system like ours. People, experts included, get so enamored with college football players as they enter the NFL. And, so often, they end up dead wrong about them. I think, with very few exceptions, that it is unrealistic to assume any college player can come in and be an above average NFL starter early in his career.
Looking at 2007's 1st round, I count 12-14 quality NFL starters out of 32. So, it seems a stretch to think that the Texans can draft in the middle or later part of the 1st round, limiting their choices to the defensive side of the ball, and get a player that immediately upgrades their starting defense. Of course it could happen, and I hope it does. I think the Texans should do one of two things when they're selecting in the first 3 rounds:
1. take the BPA, period!- that will limit mistakes and allow for a premium amount of talent to be on the roster and/or
2. Move into position to get good value for a player/players at a position with poor depth. With this method, perhaps the Texans don't draft a guy that wins the starting job his first year or two but he immediately improves the depth of the team and has upside that could make him a good NFL starter down the road. For example, I like the idea of the Texans drafting someone like Eric Wood in the second round. And, while perhaps he doesn't win a starting job over Briesel or CMyers, he has a chance to be very good in a couple years. In the meantime, when Briesel goes down with an ankle injury in week #4, instead of replacing him with Kasey Studdard we replace him with Eric Wood- and everyone is breathing a sigh of relief, especially Matt Schaub! This is the genesis for the argument to take a RB early. Our depth at RB is non-existent! And, not only are RBs prone to injury but the primary backup should be in the game for close to 30% of the snaps. On the other hand, if we draft a CB in the first round, that player will have very little positive impact on the team unless we are ravaged by injury or if the pick is a home run (see #1)... If the guy is a home run, in theory, he would be the BPA on our board. Our CB situation is very interesting. We have 4 players under 28 years old, with a lot of athleticism, and all of them should be ascending players. So, I don't take a CB unless he is BPA. LB is similar in this respect. DRyans, Adibi, and Diles are all 26 yrs old or young, they all have at least flashed on the field and are ascending players. Behind them we have some quality depth. So, I don't take a LB unless he's BPA. If you want to immediately improve the team, then you address the positions that lack depth: OC/OG, RB, Safety... does that make sense?
2007 First round
1(1) Oakland JaMarcus Russell QB LSU
2(2) Detroit Calvin Johnson WR Georgia Tech
3(3) Cleveland Joe Thomas OT Wisconsin
4(4) Tampa Bay Gaines Adams DE Clemson
5(5) Arizona Levi Brown OT Penn State
6(6) Washington LaRon Landry DB LSU
7(7) Minnesota Adrian Peterson RB Oklahoma
8(8) Atlanta (from Houston) Jamaal Anderson DE Arkansas
9(9) Miami Ted Ginn, Jr. WR Ohio State
10(10) Houston (from Atlanta) Amobi Okoye DT Louisville
11(11) San Francisco Patrick Willis LB Mississippi
12(12) Buffalo Marshawn Lynch RB California
13(13) St. Louis Adam Carriker DE Nebraska
14(14) NY Jets (from Carolina) Darrelle Revis DB Pittsburgh
15(15) Pittsburgh Lawrence Timmons LB Florida State
16(16) Green Bay Justin Harrell DT Tennessee
17(17) Denver (from Jacksonville) Jarvis Moss DE Florida
18(18) Cincinnati Leon Hall DB Michigan
19(19) Tennessee Michael Griffin DB Texas
20(20) NY Giants Aaron Ross DB Texas
21(21) Jacksonville (from Denver) Reggie Nelson DB Florida
22(22) Cleveland (from Dallas) Brady Quinn QB Notre Dame
23(23) Kansas City Dwayne Bowe WR LSU
24(24) New England (from Seattle) Brandon Meriweather DB Miami (FL)
25(25) Carolina (from N.Y. Jets) Jon Beason LB Miami (FL)
26(26) Dallas (from Philadelphia) Anthony Spencer LB Purdue
27(27) New Orleans Robert Meachem WR Tennessee
28(28) San Francisco (from New England) Joe Staley OT Central Michigan
29(29) Baltimore Ben Grubbs OG Auburn
30(30) San Diego Craig Davis WR LSU
31(31) Chicago Greg Olsen TE Miami (FL)
32(32) Indianapolis Anthony Gonzalez WR Ohio State
The1ApplePie
Hall of Fame
I am of the belief that we should follow the Colts model. We build the offense to elite status, then get just enough defense to get by. Using a ton of high picks to try and turn the defense into something it will never be is pointless. The Texans will not be a No. 1 defense + power run team.
I'm not sold on Harvin but a guy like Maclin could do wonders to open up the offense. If Maclin, Matthews, and Cush are all three there at 15, Maclin is BPA by a significant margin
I'm not sold on Harvin but a guy like Maclin could do wonders to open up the offense. If Maclin, Matthews, and Cush are all three there at 15, Maclin is BPA by a significant margin
The Pencil Neck
Hall of Fame
You really think that Maclin is going to drop to 15?
TexansSeminole
Hall of Fame
I think it is possible. Depends on how many of these tackles and defensive end/linebackers come off the board. If Oher, Monroe, Smith (1 and 2), Orakpo, and Brown are all off the board by 15, Maclin could be the guy to fall. Add Maybin in there and the possibly only increases.
TexansSeminole
Hall of Fame
I'm not sure I agree with that. Reeves is much faster than Jenkins and while he did give up some long plays last year he broke alot of passes up as well. I think he is more suited for deep routes and man coverage than Jenkins. Jenkins is a guy I'd like to see play nickel his rookie year and sit in the flats on cover 3 and cover 2. He can break on passes when he is facing the quarterback and he is a good tackler.
Despite my ideas for Jenkins, I haven't been interested in a first round cornerback unless we were going to get rid of Dunta. I think Molden still needs to be tested and I still think Bennett and Reeves can develop into quality starters. Bennett was a quality starter in the end of his rookie year and during some stretches of his sopohmore year, he just needs to be more consistent.
P
Polo
Guest
I can see that.
But I still kinda disagree. If there is no defensive "playmaker" available when they are up to pick, then it makes no sense to grab a guy just because he plays defense...It really all depends on how the Texans rate these guys...
Besides that, Kubiak doesn't really have the luxury to worry about "next year"...If he doesn't do something "this year" HE might not be around...He needs to pick a young guy that can immediately come in and make an impact as he himself has said repeatedly.
I'm in no way shape or form against drafting a defensive player in the first or second round...I'm not even against drafting d players in the first AND second round...I'm just not convinced that's where the best value is for our team.
El Tejano
Hall of Fame
I think a CB, unless he has the superior talent like Deion Sanders did, is worth taking in the first because it takes about 3 years to develop. It would be different if we had a Pro Bowl CB on the roster but DRob is the closest we have to that. We drafted him in the first but Aaron Glenn was there to show the ropes and really that was the best season Dunta's had with us.
P
Polo
Guest
Well using that logic, I guess the Colts should never had picked Joseph Addai or Gonzo...
And I'm not sure why you think all these guys are gonna come in and start...I don't see one sure fire starter on either side of the ball from where I'm sitting...And if Kubiak is looking to start a bunch of new guys and rookies on defense, then he isn't expecting to do much IMO.
Ole Miss Texan
Hall of Fame
Each season, hypothetically, it should be tougher and tougher for a rookie to start. We've got a lot of players (rookies and young guys) to start because we drafted wisely, they fit the bill of what the coaches wanted and there was a previous lack of talent at that position respective to the direction the coaches wanted to go in. So looking back to the '06 draft, where we've got 4 starters, it can be an unfair comparison to expect each draft to have a similar kind of result. It's also unfair to think that the front office can fill all of our holes in an offseason. It's an ongoing process and that's why you select BPA (and hope that fits with the need positions). If you strictly draft to fill holes, you will reach on lesser talent and you'll end up having a mediocre team all over.
I'm not sure how many true "starters" we'll get... but I fully believe we'll get a good number of players from this draft who will contibute on this team. They'll get the snaps and be an important part of our success even if they're not starters their rookie season.
I'm not sure how many true "starters" we'll get... but I fully believe we'll get a good number of players from this draft who will contibute on this team. They'll get the snaps and be an important part of our success even if they're not starters their rookie season.
badboy
Hall of Fame
It is possible that Jenkins could beat out Reeves but I am with you on this one. I think Reeves in his 2nd season with Texans will be more confident and relaxed. I am expecting a very good year for him. I would take Jenkins at #15 (barring my man Raji being there) as Jenkins can play FS and CB. I would move Wilson to back up CB to take Faggins former spot and allow Molden to get minutes without pressure. Moldin may be the replacement for Dunta and I'm sure I'll get some boos for that. I am really excited about our CBs and see a FS in draft, expectations of Moldin and Barber strengthening the D.
dalemurphy
Hall of Fame
Thanks to John McClain, I can quickly some up what has many of us so frustrated with this LB in the first round talk.... From today's chat, I'm going to post 2 of his responses, both within 10 minutes of each other.
The first question asked him, "any chance the Texans take BPA after signing Cato June?"
McClain: " They'll take the best player available at a need position. June was cut by the Bucs remember. I don't see him starting over Adidi unless Adibi's injured. Which could happen."
second question: "If Beanie Wells falls to them, any chance the Texans take him or trade down?"
McClain: "They wont take a back in the first round..."
Okay, that's crazy! McClain is saying that RB isn't a need position. What planet am I on that a team could be content with Ryan Moats getting 10 carries a game and have no backupa? What's even more humorous is that I could also show you many McClain quotes that state the Texans want to keep Slaton's touches under 20 per game. Add to that, I could show you quotes from McClain to the effect that the Texans want to average over 30 rushes per game. So, you do the math! McClain is also adamant that the Texans won't take a RB in the second round.
My suggestion is that he, and anyone else that agrees with him, rewatch the Chicago game. Watch the offense suck up the joint when Slaton was pulled from the game and Moats was in the game. Then, watch the offense with Slaton in the game... Then, come back to this message board and explain to me how RB isn't a need. Realize also, that if the Texans rush the ball 30 times a game (very conservative estimate, by the way), that would equate to 480 carries. I would like someone to tell me how many of those carries to they expect Slaton to handle and what the heck is the team to do if he gets injured!?
The first question asked him, "any chance the Texans take BPA after signing Cato June?"
McClain: " They'll take the best player available at a need position. June was cut by the Bucs remember. I don't see him starting over Adidi unless Adibi's injured. Which could happen."
second question: "If Beanie Wells falls to them, any chance the Texans take him or trade down?"
McClain: "They wont take a back in the first round..."
Okay, that's crazy! McClain is saying that RB isn't a need position. What planet am I on that a team could be content with Ryan Moats getting 10 carries a game and have no backupa? What's even more humorous is that I could also show you many McClain quotes that state the Texans want to keep Slaton's touches under 20 per game. Add to that, I could show you quotes from McClain to the effect that the Texans want to average over 30 rushes per game. So, you do the math! McClain is also adamant that the Texans won't take a RB in the second round.
My suggestion is that he, and anyone else that agrees with him, rewatch the Chicago game. Watch the offense suck up the joint when Slaton was pulled from the game and Moats was in the game. Then, watch the offense with Slaton in the game... Then, come back to this message board and explain to me how RB isn't a need. Realize also, that if the Texans rush the ball 30 times a game (very conservative estimate, by the way), that would equate to 480 carries. I would like someone to tell me how many of those carries to they expect Slaton to handle and what the heck is the team to do if he gets injured!?
Texecutioner
Hall of Fame
I'm all for BPA really. It is looking more and more to me like the BPA will be an offensive player at this point and Wells or Moreno should both be there. I would rather have Wells since he would be a bruiser to Slaton's quickness. If we couldn't get Wells with our 15th pick I wouldn't mind them going after Shonn Greene with a late 1st round pick either or unless he ends up being there with their 2nd pick but I doubt he falls that far. Then use the rest of the draft on defense practically. We will need another RB for sure. I would hate to go back to the awful running game we had before Slaton got here.