Death to Google Ads! Texans Talk Tip Jar! 🍺😎👍
Thanks for your support!

So our GM position is vacant? (Warning: this is a time sink)

Childress79

Childress79

Waterboy
So, today was one of those days where a very productive morning produces an afternoon where nothing needs to be done other than wasting time thinking about our favorite NFL squad. So, below you will find the plan I would lay out for Cal McNair were he to interview me for the vacant GM job. I feel like each of the steps I would take are both realistic (ie, no Lamar Miller for Saquon Barkley trades or the like) and make sense for a team looking to contend with the likes of the Pats, Chiefs and Colts for the next few years. I am interested in what others ideas are. Feel free to disagree but please offer up your alternatives. Without further ado….
 
2019 Season Questions to be Answered

  1. Oline – An obvious flaw in the way the team is built, I actually think there are pieces there that could make up a decent oline. I am hoping that we use this season to see what we have in Howard, Johnson, Scharping, and Martin. I would hope we go into the year with a starting line of Johnson – Howard- Fulton – Scharping – Henderson and end with Howard – Martin – Fulton – Rankin – Scharping. I think that could be a line that ends up allowing O’Brien to run his offense by establishing the run and then working the PA. It also would be a ton better than what we had last season at pass blocking. If I am wrong and it isn’t then the rest of my plan is kind of pointless as we have to continue focusing on oline to the detriment of other position groups. Understand, while I would love to have a line that was the envy of every other team, what I am looking for in a line that is adequate for what we are trying to do.

  2. Secondary – Again, what do we have in the new pieces? The primary pieces I am looking at are Roby and Lonnie Johnson. Is Roby a guy I want to move forward with or is he a one year rental? Is Johnson someone who can be elevated to a starter on the outside or does he lack the traits to play corner? I am hoping that Roby proves to be someone we can keep around for a few seasons, that Johnson can be a chess piece in matching up with the bigger receivers in the NFL and the rest of our corners can play a role for us moving forward. I think we are set at Safety with Reid, Gipson, Addae and then one of Chris Johnson, AJ Moore, Austin Exford.

  3. Clowney – It seems like there are 3 ways this situation could playout. The most likely is that we trade him during the offseason. The least likely is that we franchise him again and we are right back here next year. The other route is we offer him what he is looking for and he signs for a multiyear deal that all agree is in their best interest. I anticipate that he has his best year to date this season. I would try then to get him to sign a deal that makes sense for all sides and keeps him with the team moving forward.

  4. Bill O’Brien – I support O’Brien but I recognize that he has flaws that he has not adequately remedied. This is the last year that he has it all his way unless he shows that he has focused on his weaknesses and made them appreciably better. I would be looking for 10 wins and better focus on the mental/strategic aspects of the game (clock mgmt., challenges, gameplans, etc.). If all of that comes to pass then, by all means, continue running the show your way. If it doesn’t then he is going to have to accept either a real OC or the door. A finish less than 8-8 and he sees the door almost regardless.
 
Free Agency

Re-signing

Clowney – As I said, I am expecting JD to put up better numbers than ever this season. Assuming he does, and he maintains his health, I want him back. I would hit Clowney with the transition Tag (I would let it be known that I would negotiate my right to match away for a 1st and a 2nd). If he gets a contract offer I can live with then I match it. If his offer is too rich then I negotiate away my right to match. If he plays well enough it wouldn’t be much of a bluff to match his offer. If I can’t make the Clowney situation work for both sides then I bring back Mercilus instead and take my comp pick in 2021.

Martin – I do not see Martin in the same light as the coaching staff but whatever. I would like to see how he performs at LG between Fulton and Howard. Assuming that combo seems to work then I re-sign Martin to a contract similar to Fultons.

McCarron – I believe they brought McCarron in to be the long term back up. I do not particularly love him but he is better than Webb and we are counting him to do nothing more than hold a clip board and run out the clock on occasion.

Reader – Outside of Clowney he is probably the most important free agent we have on the team currently. I would be willing to pay him pretty handsomely to come back at DE/NT.

Dunn – I like our depth at NT. I want him back at Blackson money but not much more than that.

Scarlett – I bring him back. He would likely be written in in pencil as the starter at Sam going into the season.

Cole – Important depth piece at LB and on special teams.

Roby – Money will be key here. I want him back for continuity’s sake but not if he is looking to get paid premium dollars for anything less than all pro play at CB.

Joseph – I would give Joseph his choice of coming back on a team friendly deal or moving onto the coaching staff. I want him to mentor my young DBs either way.

Addae – Another guy who I want back if the money is right. He is one guy I could stand to let go if need be.

Releasing

Mercilus – As was previously mentioned, the situation with Clowney dictates what happens with Merc. If we can sign JD long term then we do so knowing Mercilus is a luxury we cannot afford.

Miller – Duke Johnson makes Lamar a little redundant and the salary I expect him to be looking for doesn’t justify what he provides in this offense.

Outside Free Agents

Joshua Garnett – Mauler RG who does not fit the Shanahan zone blocking scheme employed by the 49ers. First round pick whose option was declined, this is a perfect buy low option to help the o-line moving forward with an ass kicker.
 
Draft – I used this big board ( https://thedraftnetwork.com/prospect-rankings ) for direction in making my picks. I tried to make selections with enough room for particular guys to rise and to have some wiggle room (ie most player were selected in advance of where they end up on the big board). I gave us the 21st pick as a loser from the wild card round.

Trade: 2020 2nd and 2021 1st to Miami for their 2 2nd round picks (2.33 & 2.61) – We do the deal because we are in win now mode and we need the talent on the field. Miami does the deal so that they end up with 2 1st round picks in 2021 to either move up for Trevor Lawrence or to continue to build around Josh Rosen if they are satisfied with him as their QB.

1.21 Jeffrey Okudah – CB – Ohio State: Toolsy OSU corner whose ceiling is Marshon Lattimore and whose floor is Garreon Conley. Other options would be Kristian Fulton, Jaylon Johnson or Paulson Adebo.

2.33 K’Lavon Chaisson – Edge – LSU: Initially a replacement for Mercilus, eventually a replacement for Clowney once he bulks up. Yetur Gross-Matos, Jabari Zuniga and Anfernee Jennings are alternatives if Chaisson is gone.

2.61 Anthony McFarland – RB – Maryland: Explosive RB who provides the lightning to our other backs thunder. More traditional options would be JK Dobbins, Cam Akers, Lamical Perine or Zack Moss

3.84 Denzel Mims – WR – Baylor: Field stretcher who, along with Tyron Johnson would allow us to move on from Will Fuller after his 5th year option expires. Binjimen Victor, Kendrick Rogers and Emeka Emezie are other WRs who intrigue though they play vastly different.

4.124 Gage Cervenka – IOL – Clemson: Strong and athletic former state champion wrestler and he went to Clemson? And he has experience at all the IOL spots? Sign me up! This pick (along with Chaisson) is my favorite in the entire draft at the moment.

5.159 Michael Warren II – RB – Cincinatti: 5’11’’, 220 LB back who will be a member of arb by committee to wear down opposing defenses. Joshua Kelley, Kylin Hill, Tavien Feaster and Deejay Dallas others who could play such a role.

6.194 Tanner Muse – S – Clemson: Designated special teamer who might eventually play some safety.

7.235 Javaris Davis – CB – Auburn: KR/PR who can play some slot corner for us in a pinch. 4.24 speed
 
Super Bowl Team

QBs: Watson & McCarron

RBs: McFarland, Crockett, Warren, Johnson

WRs: Hopkins, Fuller, Coutee, T. Johnson, Mims, V. Smith

TEs: Thomas, Akins, Warring

OTs: Howard, Scharping, R. Johnson, Davenport

OGs: Martin, Garnett, Mancz, Cervenka

C: Fulton, Mancz, Martin, Cervenka


DE: Watt, Reader, Omenihu, Watkins

NT: Dunn, Reader, Blackson, Palmore

OLB: Clowney, Chaisson, Scarlett

ILB: McKinney, Cunningham, Cole, Kalambayi, Adams

CB: Roby, L. Johnson, Okudah, Joseph, Colvin, J. Adams

S: Reid, Gipson, Addae, Johnson, Muse

K: Fairbairn

P: Daniels

KR/PR: Adams

LS: Weeks
 
Hey Childress79 you put some time in on that project, and it's very impressive.
 
I agree except on the OL. Starting three rookies and Seantrel would be a disaster. Only Fulton is good there
 
Childress79 said:
Oline – An obvious flaw in the way the team is built, I actually think there are pieces there that could make up a decent oline. I am hoping that we use this season to see what we have in Howard, Johnson, Scharping, and Martin. I would hope we go into the year with a starting line of Johnson – Howard- Fulton – Scharping – Henderson and end with Howard – Martin – Fulton – Rankin – Scharping. I think that could be a line that ends up allowing O’Brien to run his offense by establishing the run and then working the PA. It also would be a ton better than what we had last season at pass blocking. If I am wrong and it isn’t then the rest of my plan is kind of pointless as we have to continue focusing on oline to the detriment of other position groups. Understand, while I would love to have a line that was the envy of every other team, what I am looking for in a line that is adequate for what we are trying to do.
Click to expand...

See, I don't think those decisions are the GMs to make. The GM should get the HC the players he wants to run his systems. GMs job is scouting, finding those types of players for his HC, doing all the trades and draft stuff, and things of that nature.

It's the head coach who decides which of those players make the roster, where they play and things of that nature. He's the one on the field with them, coaching them.

I also think it's the GM who should rank over the HC in the power structure, not the other way around. The GM should have an idea of what he wants the franchise to be and should go out and get the personnel, including HC, to get them there. Until the Texans figure that out, I don't think it's really going to matter who the GM is.

Jeff Luhnow had the analytics based operation that he wanted to run and he went and got the personnel to run it. Luhnow brought in AJ Hinch, not the other way around. Luhnow gets the players to fit his system, Hinch decides who makes the 25 and who plays when and where.
 
Childress79,

I like your professionalism but I have some skepticism about your draft and why you wouldn't trade up with those very same picks you'd allow Miami to receive to obtain (UNDOUBTLY) QB Trevor Lawrence... Also, I saw you didn't take an Olinemen until the 4th round...WOW! Ballsy move when you have the Center and BOTH Tackle position up for grabs... and you take an INSIDE linemen? I'd like to know what you'd do with some of the position coaches we have on staff as of today and BTW I LOVE the Jeffery Okuda pick... Absolutely!

I just feel that Okuda is a luxury/sexy pick and we DEFINETLY need to be doing everything in our power to make a 1st round move up our priority ASAP as of YESTERDAY....

Furthermore, I see you wanted to push towards the end of the season with Tytus Howard being the starting LT, which is cool with me... If your going to sit Deshaun Watson! Your outside free agents in ANOTHER Inside Offensive Linemen? I mean, we have Max Sharping who looks pretty good Inside... Tytus who Can't/Shouldn't play outside, so he'll inevitable be playing inside, Martin who plays inside... I just feel that we are Okay at IOL atm and don't get me wrong i'd like to get another guy like max inside but I just feel that it shouldn't be a priority over a Tackle while simultaneously admitting I would DEFNIETLY obtain a better inside Linemen... I just happened to notice you didn't do anything at the Tackle position.

The clowney situation is pretty much a free for-all so I'm not going to give any criticism, but I would like to commend your strategy on the Transition Tag, kudos...

Jonathan Joseph, while he had a good work ethic... I don't really see him being a good mentor being taken seriously as a leader enough to influence the type of DB Corps we are trying to create...

I like this thread... Hopefully you don't mind if I share some of my strategies and ideas as you did with criticism expected and encouraged
 
  1. Clowney - Jerry Jones has the win now mode mentality and I feel that if we were to lend a helping hand to one of Bob McNairs friends that he would do the same for us... so let's talk trade! A franchise tag is a great way for a team to be able to maintain CAP space (....) and that in turn keeps the Franchise dripping with oppruntunity for improvement and/or Repairs and so with that being said... I feel it is in Jerry Jones BEST INTREST and VERY VITAL for Jerry Jones to deal Zeke to us for Clowney... now is this a trade that is an even swap? no... it isn't and Clowney has a trajectory that for a higher ceiling throughout his career than even Demarcus Lawrence does... With our Running group carrying Lamar Miller, Duke Johnson and 3rd being a revolving for Rolling stone RBs... I feel that the Dallas Cowboys and the Houston Franchise could both help each other in a trade...
Dallas receives:
2022 1st
Jadeveon Clowney
Lamar Miller

Houston receives:
Ezekiel Elliot
2020 1st round

With a GENERATIONAL power back to motivate our offensive line we would could accomplish so much more on offense in the Running, as well as passing, game. The 2022 1st we would move on from wouldn't be sorely missed with the addition of OT Andrew Thomas from Georgia by moving up for him using the our "paired" 2020 1st rounders, that being our original 1st and Dallas 1st rounder as well. Not too mention the hit for money that Cal would take by having to pay a 2022 1st round pick AND Franchise MOBILE QB Deshaun Watson who by the way will be 26yrs old and will have spent 5 years in the league behind a terrible Line if we DON'T make this trade! The philosophy for this trade is "Value is based on need, not price" P.S. by the time it comes time to pay Ezekiel Elliot... J.J. Watt will be retiring...
P.S. Alternatively you could offer Whitney instead of Clowney but it seems like Clowney and this organization has ongoing issues and it'd be smarter to lift the stress versus giving up more draft capital by trading Mercilus

2. Bill O'Brien - With our Line being pretty much experimental at this point and the HC showing serious intrest in A.J. McCarreon... i'd like to ask him to go ahead and start A.J. so Deshaun Watson won't be the expense of this experiment! I'd tell him, your getting fired after this season. Show what you can do with who you want to do it with and vie for your next job because it won't be here... It should motivate him DRASTICALLY and Deshaun won't be happy with his HOF numbers seemingly being a casualty but in the long run with the addition at Tackle... He should have a longer career due to the hits he'll be evading by sitting this season at least until the end of this season anyways, this tough schedule won't allow A.J. to remain upright for TOO long... After this season Mike Tomlin should be available and I'd ask him to Coach the Houston Texans and Deshaun Watson to a SB by giving him ABSOULTE DE FACTO GM/HC power... True power for a REAL winner!

3. Secondary - I LOVE the Lonnie Johnson Jr pick... but I HATE the Aaron Colvin signing and as much as I HATE the 49ers, I'd have to call them up and ask if they'd do a trade involving Aaron Colvin and Richard Sherman.... Sherman is SB winner who i'd LOVE to bring in to be around Lonnie to bring as much potential out of him as possible... Lonnie and Sherman share the same build with Lonnie being heavier by about 20 pounds but being FASTER than Sherman... Lonnie has a EXTREMLY high ceiling and as for Sherman, I'd love it if he were to come onto our coaching staff after his career is over...Roby is a guy I gotta see this season with our pass rush falling apart to see how much heart he's got and Taushan ehh.. I mean he fills the position but as for Reid... I'm not to big on Justin Reid and would most likely use him in the trade up for OT Andrew Thomas... I need guys who are going to show up in big games not playmakers against the Browns... I'd bring in Kam Chancellor for year after trading Reid

4. Dline - I'm not very big on the Defensive Linemen... I'd stick with Mercilus DE for a Pass Rush for about 2 years maybe 3 and look to the draft to see how im going to replace Watt and overall look for Good Technique, fast closing on the QB after free from blocking and get me big fat guy at DT... with Nice closers on the Ends.. by closing I mean of course that RUN DOWN ability acceleration and speed with height not being a big factor except at DT... Miss those Vince Wilfork days

5. Linebackers - With Washington trying to trade Trent Williams but holding out on all offers... I'd try to sneak a deal for Reuben Foster and have him play MLB and put Zach Cunningham at WILL OLB, TBH i'd like to see what he could do at FS but that's irrelvant for now. Gruden and the Redskins feel they have a Flush in a poker game atm by refusing all trades for Trent... So I call them and tell them... If you like the way your S#@! stinks that much, how about trading me Reuben Foster and lifting your draft capital for the trades coming in.. Say.. 2020 5th rounder and Bmac.. He could play the same Role that Cushing had for us... and with Cushing already being on the coaching staff... He could defnitetly mentor Rueben Foster and his possible anger issues... who better than Cushing to do that?
 
Pharaohcious said:
  1. Clowney - Jerry Jones has the win now mode mentality and I feel that if we were to lend a helping hand to one of Bob McNairs friends that he would do the same for us... so let's talk trade! A franchise tag is a great way for a team to be able to maintain CAP space (....) and that in turn keeps the Franchise dripping with oppruntunity for improvement and/or Repairs and so with that being said... I feel it is in Jerry Jones BEST INTREST and VERY VITAL for Jerry Jones to deal Zeke to us for Clowney... now is this a trade that is an even swap? no... it isn't and Clowney has a trajectory that for a higher ceiling throughout his career than even Demarcus Lawrence does... With our Running group carrying Lamar Miller, Duke Johnson and 3rd being a revolving for Rolling stone RBs... I feel that the Dallas Cowboys and the Houston Franchise could both help each other in a trade...
Dallas receives:
2022 1st
Jadeveon Clowney
Lamar Miller

Houston receives:
Ezekiel Elliot
2020 1st round

With a GENERATIONAL power back to motivate our offensive line we would could accomplish so much more on offense in the Running, as well as passing, game. The 2022 1st we would move on from wouldn't be sorely missed with the addition of OT Andrew Thomas from Georgia by moving up for him using the our "paired" 2020 1st rounders, that being our original 1st and Dallas 1st rounder as well. Not too mention the hit for money that Cal would take by having to pay a 2022 1st round pick AND Franchise MOBILE QB Deshaun Watson who by the way will be 26yrs old and will have spent 5 years in the league behind a terrible Line if we DON'T make this trade! The philosophy for this trade is "Value is based on need, not price" P.S. by the time it comes time to pay Ezekiel Elliot... J.J. Watt will be retiring...
P.S. Alternatively you could offer Whitney instead of Clowney but it seems like Clowney and this organization has ongoing issues and it'd be smarter to lift the stress versus giving up more draft capital by trading Mercilus

2. Bill O'Brien - With our Line being pretty much experimental at this point and the HC showing serious intrest in A.J. McCarreon... i'd like to ask him to go ahead and start A.J. so Deshaun Watson won't be the expense of this experiment! I'd tell him, your getting fired after this season. Show what you can do with who you want to do it with and vie for your next job because it won't be here... It should motivate him DRASTICALLY and Deshaun won't be happy with his HOF numbers seemingly being a casualty but in the long run with the addition at Tackle... He should have a longer career due to the hits he'll be evading by sitting this season at least until the end of this season anyways, this tough schedule won't allow A.J. to remain upright for TOO long... After this season Mike Tomlin should be available and I'd ask him to Coach the Houston Texans and Deshaun Watson to a SB by giving him ABSOULTE DE FACTO GM/HC power... True power for a REAL winner!

3. Secondary - I LOVE the Lonnie Johnson Jr pick... but I HATE the Aaron Colvin signing and as much as I HATE the 49ers, I'd have to call them up and ask if they'd do a trade involving Aaron Colvin and Richard Sherman.... Sherman is SB winner who i'd LOVE to bring in to be around Lonnie to bring as much potential out of him as possible... Lonnie and Sherman share the same build with Lonnie being heavier by about 20 pounds but being FASTER than Sherman... Lonnie has a EXTREMLY high ceiling and as for Sherman, I'd love it if he were to come onto our coaching staff after his career is over...Roby is a guy I gotta see this season with our pass rush falling apart to see how much heart he's got and Taushan ehh.. I mean he fills the position but as for Reid... I'm not to big on Justin Reid and would most likely use him in the trade up for OT Andrew Thomas... I need guys who are going to show up in big games not playmakers against the Browns... I'd bring in Kam Chancellor for year after trading Reid

4. Dline - I'm not very big on the Defensive Linemen... I'd stick with Mercilus DE for a Pass Rush for about 2 years maybe 3 and look to the draft to see how im going to replace Watt and overall look for Good Technique, fast closing on the QB after free from blocking and get me big fat guy at DT... with Nice closers on the Ends.. by closing I mean of course that RUN DOWN ability acceleration and speed with height not being a big factor except at DT... Miss those Vince Wilfork days

5. Linebackers - With Washington trying to trade Trent Williams but holding out on all offers... I'd try to sneak a deal for Reuben Foster and have him play MLB and put Zach Cunningham at WILL OLB, TBH i'd like to see what he could do at FS but that's irrelvant for now. Gruden and the Redskins feel they have a Flush in a poker game atm by refusing all trades for Trent... So I call them and tell them... If you like the way your S#@! stinks that much, how about trading me Reuben Foster and lifting your draft capital for the trades coming in.. Say.. 2020 5th rounder and Bmac.. He could play the same Role that Cushing had for us... and with Cushing already being on the coaching staff... He could defnitetly mentor Rueben Foster and his possible anger issues... who better than Cushing to do that?
Click to expand...

They just re-signed Lawrence, no way in hell this happens
 
steelbtexan said:
They just re-signed Lawrence, no way in hell this happens
Click to expand...


Signing Lawrence to a contract has nothing to do with a player whose playing on a Franchise Tag like Clowney would be when he gets there...

After the season, Clowney would hit the FA market where the new GM would get to bid on him if he feels so inclined.
 
Pharaohcious said:
Signing Lawrence to a contract has nothing to do with a player whose playing on a Franchise Tag like Clowney would be when he gets there...

After the season, Clowney would hit the FA market where the new GM would get to bid on him if he feels so inclined.
Click to expand...

So, you're saying we should trade Clowney, and then when his Franchise Tag ends at the end of the 2019 season, our <new> GM should then bid on him in free agency so that Clowney can come play for us?

Assuming the Cowboys, in your scenario, weren't able to come to a long-term contract solution.....and they decided not to franchise tag him.....what part of our <new> GM bidding for Clowney makes sense in any scenario? Wouldn't it just make sense to retain Clowney and either sign him or tag him again?

I know you're looking at the scenario thinking about the 2020 1st rounder and Zeke....but that ain't happening.... I believe Madden 20 just came out...go try your scenario there and screenshot the results for us.

Edit: Just adding that Clowney signing with us in the scenario you stated is about 0.00000001%
 
A lot to unpack.
Speedy: Agreed that the head coach determines what happens on Sundays. That being said, the process should be collaborative in that there should be communication along the lines of "Hey, it is really hard to find a decent offensive tackle. I wonder what Howard would look like at LT? If we didn't have to devote resources there because we could move him to that spot we might be able to sign/draft player X, Y, or Z. Wouldn't that be nifty?" Perhaps O'Brien is that difficult of a person to deal with that those conversations are impossible, IDK.

Pharaohcious (I just got your handle after having to sound it out, funny): Given that the Cowboys have already signed Lawrence long term and the fact that their salary cap is already looking sparse with having to re-sign Dak, Zeke and Amari Cooper I do not see them as buyers for JD. I suspect we would be the ones kicking down a 2020 first along with JD for Zeke alone. No deal. As far as the offensive line, see below.

O-Line Rant
Our line sucks. Usually when you say something is the worst it is hyperbole. This isn't. We were the worst at protecting the QB last year and only Indy was worse the year before. We run the ball to set up the pass but we do not run the ball all that well and we do it all the time. Fixing the offensive line is the singular thing the team could do to get better. That being said, I don't think we should expect to have a line like the Cowboys unless you would rather have had Tyron Smith over JJ or Travis Frederick over DeAndre Hopkins. Anyway, the Cowboys have not sniffed a super bowl either with that line full of all pros. IDK, maybe I am wrong, but I think the best way to move forward is to add talent across the team and eventually either the line gets better with modest talent infusions, the rest of the team compensates for the oline's suckage or we ruin Deshaun's career the same way we did AJ's and Foster's.
 
Pharaohcious said:
Signing Lawrence to a contract has nothing to do with a player whose playing on a Franchise Tag like Clowney would be when he gets there...

After the season, Clowney would hit the FA market where the new GM would get to bid on him if he feels so inclined.
Click to expand...

His franchise tag doesn't mean crap.. this isn't MLB, teams aren't going to give up real draft capital for a possible one year rental. However does (if it happens) pulls the trigger on him isn't going to do so without guarantees for long team control. The trade you're proposing simply never happens in the NFL.

NBA and MLB yes.. NFL football, No.
 
Carr Bombed said:
His franchise tag doesn't mean crap.. this isn't MLB, teams aren't going to give up real draft capital for a possible one year rental. However does (if it happens) pulls the trigger on him isn't going to do so without guarantees for long team control. The trade you're proposing simply never happens in the NFL.

NBA and MLB yes.. NFL football, No.
Click to expand...


Teams dont trade 2nd round picks to the browns for cap relief either.

Oh wait...
 
Carr Bombed said:
Which doesn't have crap to do with the proposed trade..
Click to expand...


Um, actually, I tend to agree with most of what you said - but I wont put boundaries on what a trade should be. I just cited an example of what it shouldn't be. And it was our Texans that did it.
 
powda said:
Um, actually, I tend to agree with most of what you said - but I wont put boundaries on what a trade should be. I just cited an example of what it shouldn't be. And it was our Texans that did it.
Click to expand...

I know.. that was cluster____ every way in between.. but in order for his trade proposal to take place there's going to have to be two colossal morons on both ends of the phone.

Clowney isn't going to be moved without a long term deal in place... might as well keep him.
 
Carr Bombed said:
I know.. that was cluster____ every way in between.. but in order for his trade proposal to take place there's going to have to be two colossal morons on both ends of the phone.

Clowney isn't going to be moved without a long term deal in place... might as well keep him.
Click to expand...

Is 1 year of him and a 3 in 2021 compensatory better then a 1st round pick in 2020?
 
powda said:
Teams dont trade 2nd round picks to the browns for cap relief either.

Oh wait...
Click to expand...

Which BTW I'd like to point out... I came up with that idea and started posting it in Facebook groups MONTHS before that happen...
Innovative thinking is what makes the difference between a trend "SETTER" and a "FOLLOWER!"
 
BmtTXN said:
what part of our <new> GM bidding for Clowney makes sense in any scenario? Wouldn't it just make sense to retain Clowney and either sign him or tag him again?


Edit: Just adding that Clowney signing with us in the scenario you stated is about 0.00000001%
Click to expand...


Oh WOW! I didn't know that we can just SIGN HIM right now... Yeah, Let's do that!

Wait... So you mean... He'll sign a Tag again after holding out for signing the 1st one... YEAH! Let's DO that!!

If Clowney hits FA... sees a team that and sees a Franchise that has moved on from O'Brien and has a NEW
HC and GM, you don't think that his acknowledgment of our new hires won't sway him in his anticipation
for where he would like to sign long term based on the destiny of his career?

You know what's makes sense, taking Clowneys aspect of the situation seriously versus looking at it like he'll
just accept whatever deal we'll throw his way....

idk if you've noticed but we've thrown a couple deals his way,
a franchise tag AND trade destinations! He's holding out btw

I think it's time to realize, Clowney isn't a pushover.
 
texanhead08 said:
No GM
No Head Coach
No OC
No Oline
No Secondary
but we are going to win the Super Bowl....lol
Click to expand...


With this move, you don't think a GM would persuaded to come here
KNOWING he has 2 1st rounders?
A HC won't want to coach a team that JJ Watt AND Deshaun Watson?

So a OC doesn't want ANYTHING to do with an offense that has equipped
a top 3 running back... WHO IS A POWER BACK..
AND DW4, HOP, FULLER V and Keke Coutee?

So, you telling me with two 1st round picks...
We CANNOT fix up the Oline or Secondary??
 
Childress79 said:
Pharaohcious (I just got your handle after having to sound it out, funny): Given that the Cowboys have already signed Lawrence long term and the fact that their salary cap is already looking sparse with having to re-sign Dak, Zeke and Amari Cooper I do not see them as buyers for JD. I suspect we would be the ones kicking down a 2020 first along with JD for Zeke alone. No deal. As far as the offensive line, see below..
Click to expand...

Sorry, I thought the Franchise Tag was a way to pay player for his performance without having it effect the CAP.
BTW, I'm not being sarcastic, I really did think this was true.
 
Childress79 said:
Free Agency

Re-signing

Clowney – As I said, I am expecting JD to put up better numbers than ever this season. Assuming he does, and he maintains his health, I want him back. I would hit Clowney with the transition Tag (I would let it be known that I would negotiate my right to match away for a 1st and a 2nd). If he gets a contract offer I can live with then I match it. If his offer is too rich then I negotiate away my right to match. If he plays well enough it wouldn’t be much of a bluff to match his offer. If I can’t make the Clowney situation work for both sides then I bring back Mercilus instead and take my comp pick in 2021.

Martin – I do not see Martin in the same light as the coaching staff but whatever. I would like to see how he performs at LG between Fulton and Howard. Assuming that combo seems to work then I re-sign Martin to a contract similar to Fultons.

McCarron – I believe they brought McCarron in to be the long term back up. I do not particularly love him but he is better than Webb and we are counting him to do nothing more than hold a clip board and run out the clock on occasion.

Reader – Outside of Clowney he is probably the most important free agent we have on the team currently. I would be willing to pay him pretty handsomely to come back at DE/NT.

Dunn – I like our depth at NT. I want him back at Blackson money but not much more than that.

Scarlett – I bring him back. He would likely be written in in pencil as the starter at Sam going into the season.

Cole – Important depth piece at LB and on special teams.

Roby – Money will be key here. I want him back for continuity’s sake but not if he is looking to get paid premium dollars for anything less than all pro play at CB.

Joseph – I would give Joseph his choice of coming back on a team friendly deal or moving onto the coaching staff. I want him to mentor my young DBs either way.

Addae – Another guy who I want back if the money is right. He is one guy I could stand to let go if need be.

Releasing

Mercilus – As was previously mentioned, the situation with Clowney dictates what happens with Merc. If we can sign JD long term then we do so knowing Mercilus is a luxury we cannot afford.

Miller – Duke Johnson makes Lamar a little redundant and the salary I expect him to be looking for doesn’t justify what he provides in this offense.

Outside Free Agents

Joshua Garnett – Mauler RG who does not fit the Shanahan zone blocking scheme employed by the 49ers. First round pick whose option was declined, this is a perfect buy low option to help the o-line moving forward with an ass kicker.
Click to expand...
First off, terrific thread! Great work!

I’d love it if the Texans could find a way to keep Clowney, I just don’t see it happening. But the good news, if they do trade Clowney they will likely receive some nice draft capital to work out your second draft scenario.
 
Carr Bombed said:
Thank you.. never made sense at all and just like his other trades.. zero chance of ever happening.
Click to expand...


His love affair with Ezekiel Elliott is a bit too much. Would love Ezekiel here but that is not about to happen period. One main reason, the Texans don't do that type of personality.
 
Pharaohcious said:
Oh WOW! I didn't know that we can just SIGN HIM right now... Yeah, Let's do that!

Wait... So you mean... He'll sign a Tag again after holding out for signing the 1st one... YEAH! Let's DO that!!

If Clowney hits FA... sees a team that and sees a Franchise that has moved on from O'Brien and has a NEW
HC and GM, you don't think that his acknowledgment of our new hires won't sway him in his anticipation
for where he would like to sign long term based on the destiny of his career?

You know what's makes sense, taking Clowneys aspect of the situation seriously versus looking at it like he'll
just accept whatever deal we'll throw his way....

idk if you've noticed but we've thrown a couple deals his way,
a franchise tag AND trade destinations! He's holding out btw

I think it's time to realize, Clowney isn't a pushover.
Click to expand...

Nowhere did I say that we can sign him right now. That ship sailed on July 15th. My response was entirely based on your ignorant trade scenario that is never going to happen. As far as tagging him again.....if we keep him for this season....the team holds that option whether Clowney likes it or not. If he's not traded and they once again can't come to a long-term solution, then the team holds that option. Are you unaware of this possible scenario? Is that where the confusion comes from?

<You know what's makes sense, taking Clowneys aspect of the situation seriously versus looking at it like he'll
just accept whatever deal we'll throw his way....> Do you have me confused with another poster? I've never mentioned anything about money we may have offered Clowney? No wonder you're confused.

<He's holding out btw> No ****! Hadn't realized..... Good for him btw. I have no problem when a player who deserves to get paid, actually fights to get paid. Now, what I may disagree on is Clowney's perceived worth....yet I didn't mention anything of the sort in the post you quoted.

Let me clear it up for you since it went WAY over your head: Remember....my response is based SOLELY on your foolish trade scenario that is never going to happen....and the fact that you think Clowney is somehow going to be available as a FA for the 2020 NFL Year.

If Clowney is traded to the Cowboys in your scenario, what would stop the Cowboys from just Franchise tagging him next year? That is ONLY IF they couldn't get a long term deal with him done...which is unlikely given that Clowney would want that solidified for the trade to go through.

Also, no matter who the HC/GM are here....even if Clowney hit the market....the owner is still the same....so Clowney knows incompetence will follow. Can you show me any real life scenario where a STAR player left the team that drafted him under a less than ideal situation.....that team changed a HC/GM the next year.....somehow that STAR player is available the next year.......and RESIGNED with the team he was away from for 1 year only? It may take you awhile to find this scenario.

Clearly you misinterpreted my entire response to you. Nowhere did I claim Clowney was a pushover. I have no doubt he MAY acknowledge the <new>hires....I don't see why he would even care...but I just find it unlikely (not 100% impossible...but close), that he'd resign with us after a single year of being away from the Texans.

That is the scenario you created: <After the season, Clowney would hit the FA market where the new GM would get to bid on him if he feels so inclined.> These are your words.

Sure....our new GM could bid on him.....that doesn't mean Clowney would even entertain that bid. I find it unlikely that he would. You clearly disagree. Okay, fine. I just find your whole trade scenario ridiculous, especially given the fact that to trade Clowney, a new long-term deal would almost certainly have to be on the table to Clowney's liking for him to agree to the trade by signing his franchise tag in the first place....which...you may not know this....but Clowney is currently holding out btw! :)

Edit: Let me just add...with your other post about seeing what happened to Miller: We have Duke Johnson so any 1 of the 4 or 5 other RB's need only to be as good as Alfred Blue was....that doesn't seem like much of a stretch does it?
 
Last edited:
BmtTXN said:
Wouldn't it just make sense to retain Clowney and either sign him or tag him again?
Click to expand...

Yeah... It'd make a LOT of sense to retain Clowney... HOW we are going to when he hasn't even signed his FIRST Franchise Tag is
the problem... You keep speaking about tagging him a second time when the problem is that he hasn't signed his FIRST...

Or say he walks... AND GOES TO THE COLTS!?

No no no wait... Let's say he just stays in AFC... and we only have to worry
about him IF we make the playoffs and possibly see him at the AFC Championship game also

Sending him to NFC!?... NAH!.. Definitely not smart!
 
BmtTXN said:
Let me clear it up for you since it went WAY over your head: Remember....my response is based SOLELY on your foolish trade scenario that is never going to happen....and the fact that you think Clowney is somehow going to be available as a FA for the 2020 NFL Year.
Click to expand...

Really? because you kept saying "Tag him after this season"

It seems like your response is based on a Franchise Tag that isn't even signed yet!
 
BmtTXN said:
Also, no matter who the HC/GM are here....even if Clowney hit the market....the owner is still the same....so Clowney knows incompetence will follow. Can you show me any real life scenario where a STAR player left the team that drafted him under a less than ideal situation.....that team changed a HC/GM the next year.....somehow that STAR player is available the next year.......and RESIGNED with the team he was away from for 1 year only? It may take you awhile to find this scenario.
QUOTE]

This isn't "GO FISH"

It's Texas Hold'em

Maybe you only believe in following Trends and not SETTING them... Had you ever seen a trade like the Herschle Walker trade?

Ever see a QB win enough SBs to have one hand with fingers full of SB rings while ALSO having SB rings on the other?
btw that QB didn't go until latter rounds..6 to be exact... with that being said.

Find me a scenario like that!
Click to expand...
 
BmtTXN said:
Clearly you misinterpreted my entire response to you. Nowhere did I claim Clowney was a pushover. I have no doubt he MAY acknowledge the <new>hires....I don't see why he would even care...but I just find it unlikely (not 100% impossible...but close), that he'd resign with us after a single year of being away from the Texans.

That is the scenario you created: <After the season, Clowney would hit the FA market where the new GM would get to bid on him if he feels so inclined.> These are your words.

Sure....our new GM could bid on him.....that doesn't mean Clowney would even entertain that bid. "YOU" don't know "WHAT" Clowney would do!

I find it unlikely that he would. You clearly disagree. "CLEARLY" disagree that Clowney would sign here? I never even spoke on Clowneys decision to sign! Only pointed out the situation would leave the Texans GM the oppruntunity to BID!

Okay, fine. I just find your whole trade scenario ridiculous, especially given the fact that to trade Clowney, a new long-term deal would almost certainly have to be on the table to Clowney's liking for him to agree to the trade by signing his franchise tag in the first place....which...you may not know this....but Clowney is currently holding out btw! :) You don't know what would have to be on the table for Clowney to agree to anything... Only CLOWNEY does!
?
Click to expand...

Dallas has to sign Cooper and Dak... Jerry already locked up Jaylen Smith for 5 yrs...

If the Cowboys were going to have to jeopardize anyones contract in order to sign Clowney... It'd be Smiths and he's signed already!
 
BmtTXN said:
Edit: Let me just add...with your other post about seeing what happened to Miller: We have Duke Johnson so any 1 of the 4 or 5 other RB's need only to be as good as Alfred Blue was....that doesn't seem like much of a stretch does it?
Click to expand...


WRONG! at this point you're just trolling rac and I won't respond
 
Childress79 said:
Pharaohcious (I just got your handle after having to sound it out, funny): Given that the Cowboys have already signed Lawrence long term and the fact that their salary cap is already looking sparse with having to re-sign Dak, Zeke and Amari Cooper I do not see them as buyers for JD. I suspect we would be the ones kicking down a 2020 first along with JD for Zeke alone. No deal. As far as the offensive line, see below.
QUOTE]

A team in a cap situation whose owner/GM is talking making about making SB run sooner rather than later would most definitely be buyers for a Franchise Tagged DE #1 pick!

A Franchise Tag doesn't count towards CAP and the Texans would be the ones lending a helping hand by giving Clowney to
that Dallas Defense... Plus Clowney is rumored to have limited the trade destinations to a team who is trying to WIN now!


US handing the Cowboys a 1st for a RB while simultaneously handing them a DE like Clowney!? I doubt it!
Click to expand...
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top