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Kirk Cousins better fit for Gruden's offense than RGIII

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Kirk Cousins better fit for Gruden's offense than RGIII
The ease with which Cousins moved the chains has left Redskins fans wondering if New England Patriots officials were correct in their training-camp assessment that he is a better fit than Griffin for coach Jay Gruden's offense.

According to Mike Wise of the Washington Post, Gruden himself has wrestled with the same conundrum since taking over the team.

Wise reports, via a person with knowledge of Gruden's thinking, the rookie head coach realized this summer Cousins was better suited to run the West Coast offense even if the exorbitant draft-pick investment in Griffin mandated staying the course.

While Griffin was struggling to master the offense and still working through obvious mechanical flaws dating back to a disastrous 2013 season, Gruden insisted there was no quarterback controversy and publicly backed RGIII as the face of the franchise.

Rather than washing his hands of a uniquely talented quarterback who just two years ago authored the best rookie quarterback season in NFL history, Gruden was resigned to taking a few early-season lumps as he transformed Griffin into a legitimate pocket passer.

Now that Cousins is doing his best Andy Dalton impression in Griffin's stead, Gruden can concentrate on winning games as opposed to holding his quarterback's hand through an arduous developmental phase.

"I feel like we can win any game with Kirk Cousins," Gruden said after Sunday's game. "Kirk is a special guy. He started four games last year and didn't have great success, but obviously has a skill set that I feel like is very much suited for what we do. He can handle it mentally, and obviously, physically. I feel that he can make every throw in the book and we are going to move forward with Kirk."

NFL Media's Aditi Kinkhabwala reported from team headquarters Monday there is no quarterback controversy because the Redskins understand Cousins doesn't share Griffin's dynamism. Privately, the team's brass has to wonder if Griffin will ever fulfill that potential.
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Was only a matter of time. I said when he came out that he would never make it to that 2nd contract. They drafted Griffin to carry a horrible team for a couple years and then, once the surrounding talent was better, Cousins could take over and be the QB they need to get over the hump.

Don't have anything personal against Griffin but I always felt he wouldn't do much. Thought he was so overrated coming out. Can't believe people were putting him on the same level as Luck.
 
WolverineFan said:
Was only a matter of time. I said when he came out that he would never make it to that 2nd contract. They drafted Griffin to carry a horrible team for a couple years and then, once the surrounding talent was better, Cousins could take over and be the QB they need to get over the hump.

Don't have anything personal against Griffin but I always felt he wouldn't do much. Thought he was so overrated coming out. Can't believe people were putting him on the same level as Luck.
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Agree. Like DB said, his body can't hold up to the way he wants to play. And I don't think he has the appropriate skill set to play a different style.

I did like him coming out of college but I also agree that people putting him on the same level as Luck was ridiculous. He wasn't even close.

This kind of thing is also why I can't help but laugh when people try to say that dual threat QBs are the wave of the future. Not gonna happen folks.
 
Double Barrel said:
RGIII's body is too fragile for his kind of game.
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giphy.gif


I liked him his first year, but I feel like he's a bit of a diva who got his coach fired in the end. I bet he'd be happiest if the Redskins hired Art Briles.
 
htownfan32 said:
I feel sorry for RGIII. Shanny and injuries killing what could have been a promising career.
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Let's get it right, RGIII couldn't learn to slide is what killed his career, and going back into a game when he was injured, sorry he doesn't have his coach to blame.
 
I'm chalking this up as "everybody loves the backup QB"


Griffin is an elite talent Cousins is not. It's going to be tough for RGIII to get away from what works for him & become a pocket passer, but he's smart, he's accurate, & he's got a good arm. He's got a good work ethic & he wants to get better. Washington would be foolish to give up on him.
 
thunderkyss said:
I'm chalking this up as "everybody loves the backup QB"


Griffin is an elite talent Cousins is not. It's going to be tough for RGIII to get away from what works for him & become a pocket passer, but he's smart, he's accurate, & he's got a good arm. He's got a good work ethic & he wants to get better. Washington would be foolish to give up on him.
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sometime being an "elite athlete" isn't good enough. Cousins does not have to be an elite athlete to efficiently run an offense. What works for RG3 has been proven not to translate to the NFL.

sometimes you just gotta cut your losses and move on....
 
BullNation4Life said:
sometime being an "elite athlete" isn't good enough. Cousins does not have to be an elite athlete to efficiently run an offense. What works for RG3 has been proven not to translate to the NFL.

sometimes you just gotta cut your losses and move on....
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In as much as it's gotten him hurt I'll agree. I'm not convinced this is an issue of him being too frail though... had he got hit on his most recent injury I'd be leaning that way... as it stands this is a freak injury. Against us he was reluctant to throw the ball, I don't know why... this past Sunday looked like he was off to a great start.

I'd like to see more from the young'n before saying he can't transition.
 
Maybe part of it was was that the defense watched game film of RG abnd prepared for him and not Cousins? Give him another good game and defenses and DCs will be as prepared for him as they are for RG III.
 
thunderkyss said:
I'm chalking this up as "everybody loves the backup QB"


Griffin is an elite talent Cousins is not. It's going to be tough for RGIII to get away from what works for him & become a pocket passer, but he's smart, he's accurate, & he's got a good arm. He's got a good work ethic & he wants to get better. Washington would be foolish to give up on him.
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Interesting contrast in tones you have with regards to RG3 and Luck...:hmmm:
 
He was on the same level as Luck when both were rookies. Due to Shanny keeping him in thee playoff game, that he lead his undermanned team into as a ROOKIE QB, (Just like Luck) he blew out his other ACL and will probably never be the same again unless he can change his game.

Sad that Shanny ruined RG3's career. The question I've got is whether if you were BOB would you gamble that you could take RG3's undeniable talent are mold his game into the kind of QB that BOB wants and what would you be willing to trade the Redskins to take this gamble?
 
steelbtexan said:
He was on the same level as Luck when both were rookies. Due to Shanny keeping him in thee playoff game, that he lead his undermanned team into as a ROOKIE QB, (Just like Luck) he blew out his other ACL and will probably never be the same again unless he can change his game.

Sad that Shanny ruined RG3's career. The question I've got is whether if you were BOB would you gamble that you could take RG3's undeniable talent are mold his game into the kind of QB that BOB wants and what would you be willing to trade the Redskins to take this gamble?
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I blame the team doctor more than Shanahan. If the doctor and player both say he can play what is the coach supposed to do?

I don't think he and Luck were on the same level as much as I think that the league just wasn't quite sure how to defend him until they got more tape on him. His athletic talent is undeniable.

I do think the injury altered his career but it was something I saw coming when he came out. Dual threat QBs will only be successful as long as they are injury free. Whenever that first big injury was going to happen, it was going to change him.

That's why I wouldn't risk anything on him. The main reason I don't like dual threat QBs is because sooner or later you are either going to have to change them or they are going to have to change themselves. It's inevitable. And I would rather take a guy that I know I'm not going to have to worry about that.

I don't think Griffin would ever be the kind of QB O'Brien wants. Since we don't have a QB I would be willing to trade a 4th or 5th round pick to see if it would work, but I wouldn't give anything more than that.
 
infantrycak said:
Dr. Andrews was on the sideline for that game.
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I remember that. I remember that he cleared Griffin to play in that game, but I was fuzzy on the details so I looked up some old articles.

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap10...ffers-knee-injury-in-washington-redskins-loss

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/9...w-robert-griffin-iii-used-washington-redskins

Turns out, Andrews did clear Griffin to play but made Washington aware of some concerns that he had.

I retract my previous statement. It does sound like the coaching staff deserves some blame too. But part of me does wonder why you would clear a guy to play if you are so worried about his risk to get reinjured?
 
True,

Andrews deferred to Shanny and it looks like it may cost RG3 his career. Andrews/Shanny share in the blame. The reason I think Shanny is more to blame is the falling out the he and RG# had last yr. Prior to the injury RG3/Shanny had a love fest going on. After the injury RG3 turning his back on Shanny is the main reason Shanny got fired. Why do you think RG3 turned his back on Shanny? Could it be that Shanny failed to protect RG3 form himself and RG3 placed the blame for his injury directly on Shanny?
 
bah007 said:
I remember that. I remember that he cleared Griffin to play in that game, but I was fuzzy on the details so I looked up some old articles.

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap10...ffers-knee-injury-in-washington-redskins-loss

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/9...w-robert-griffin-iii-used-washington-redskins

Turns out, Andrews did clear Griffin to play but made Washington aware of some concerns that he had.

I retract my previous statement. It does sound like the coaching staff deserves some blame too. But part of me does wonder why you would clear a guy to play if you are so worried about his risk to get reinjured?
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Because team Dr.'s whore themselves out to teams. Excluding Green Bay.
 
Michael Vick was an elite athlete, and he was a good QB for exactly ONE year. Athleticism and that ill defined word "talent" don't cut it.
 
steelbtexan said:
He was on the same level as Luck when both were rookies. Due to Shanny keeping him in thee playoff game, that he lead his undermanned team into as a ROOKIE QB, (Just like Luck) he blew out his other ACL and will probably never be the same again unless he can change his game.

Sad that Shanny ruined RG3's career. The question I've got is whether if you were BOB would you gamble that you could take RG3's undeniable talent are mold his game into the kind of QB that BOB wants and what would you be willing to trade the Redskins to take this gamble?
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The only reason he was on Luck's level performance wise is because of what each team was asking them to do. Luck ran the entire offense his rookie year. Calls, checks, audibles, reads, everything. Literally ran the offense Peyton style as a rookie. Meanwhile, Griffin was running a hybrid version of his college offense and Shanahan's offense with Shanahan making calls from the sideline. They used a ton of zone read stuff to utilize his legs against the defense and ran a ton of their passing game off of playaction from that.

Now, I have no problem with that. He can run and you utilize that. They built the offense around his strengths (unlike the Colts, who gave Luck trial by fire). However, they also immediately hindered his development as a passer by basing the passing game around his running ability. That much became very clear after he got injured.

Now, we get to their 2nd years. Luck plays way better in his 2nd year. Production (yards/TD) stays about the same, completion percentage goes way up, and turnovers go way down. That was the plan. They felt he could handle it so they loaded his plate as a rookie and he struggled, but he came back his next year and was much improved. The team improved as a result. Won the division again but advanced in the playoffs this time.

Meanwhile, Griffin's production dropped. His accuracy went down and his turnovers went way up. Why? Because he couldn't run anymore and he had no development in an NFL passing game. All you had to do was watch the guy. He would get through 2 reads and then bail, but he couldn't run good and would usually get tracked down before he got the edge. He didn't adjust his playing style. A team that had made the playoffs the year before now won 3 games and they QB position was a big reason why (sound familiar Texans fans). Now you can blame Washington for this. For trying to develop him a certain way and getting him hurt. Or you could chalk it up to Griffin just being Griffin. Perhaps that was the only way he was ever going to be successful in the NFL.

Personally, I say it's both. I don't think Griffin had an elite skill set coming in. His success was based off the dual threat ability and once that was gone he really struggled. I think Washington did what they did because the staff realized he would never be a traditional drop-back passer. However, I also blame Washington for basically serving him up to the injury gods and riding him for all he was worth. The team around him was old and not very good and they rode him for 3 years until the surrounding talent was better. Then, once he was injured and useless, they could ride into the sunset with Kirk Cousins.
 
eriadoc said:
Michael Vick was an elite athlete, and he was a good QB for exactly ONE year. Athleticism and that ill defined word "talent" don't cut it.
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No doubt about it. So was McNabb, McNair, Elway, etc... even guys like Plummer (who I've always liked)... talent isn't enough, athleticism isn't enough. They have to have intangibles as well.
 
So if you are Rick Smith do you pick up the phone and ask about an RGIII trade? He is better than Fitz.
 
After today's performance by Cousins, I think he will be the new starter in Washington even when RGIII gets well.
 
TEXANRED said:
So if you are Rick Smith do you pick up the phone and ask about an RGIII trade? He is better than Fitz.
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I think people will want to see what Mallet can do before anyone even considers this. And even at that RGIII would not be high on everyones list.
 
gwallaia said:
After today's performance by Cousins, I think he will be the new starter in Washington even when RGIII gets well.
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Cousins shows class (from PFT)

“I won’t change my statement that this is Robert’s team. I still stand by that. He was drafted high for a reason. He’s had success here. He’s done a lot of good things. He’s done nothing to have that be any different,” Cousins said, via the Washington Times. “This is his team and it’s my job as a backup on this team, hopefully when he comes back, give him a team with a good record and put him in a good spot to have success down the stretch. By no means does that say I can’t go in there, as a backup, and hopefully get the job done.”
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Griffin III's support with players, however, is not as strong as it is with the highest levels of the organization, according to sources.

When Griffin began addressing the media in the locker room on Friday for the first time since dislocating his left ankle in Week 2, about 15 teammates began shouting. It was so loud and distracting, the franchise quarterback -- and reporters -- had to leave the locker room so Griffin could speak someplace where he could be heard. That's when the cheering got even more boisterous.

A source who familiar with the incident told ESPN's Britt McHenry that Griffin has "alienated himself" from the locker room.
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http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/1...bert-griffin-iii-washington-redskins-came-top
 
Chris Cooley: RGIII was so bad, I can’t assess the rest of the Redskins’ offense

This week, during his weekly look at the team’s offense, [former Redskins TE Chris] Cooley changed things up. He spent an entire half-hour dissecting the play of just one man: the quarterback, Robert Griffin III.

“What we are going to do is we are going to give incomplete to the entire offense,” Cooley said. “Because I don’t know how to grade them….I can’t grade the pass game. Our quarterback does not allow a proper grading of the pass game, because there was something I’ve never seen go on on a football field before.

“There was a game plan initially installed, which was not run or operated in any way shape or form the way it should have been,” Cooley went on. “There was a quarterback not reading the field when he should have been, there was a quarterback scrambling when he [shouldn't have been]….You can’t grade anyone else around Robert because of the way Robert played.

“And I want this to be really clear as we move forward with this breakdown,” Cooley said. “I’m not making fun of Robert. I like Robert. I like him as a person. This is not a personal attack. I am not going to make fun of him. I think he handled the media afterward improperly; we’ve discussed that. And I think he played poorly. And because of that, I’m going to now walk you through the game.”

What followed was 24 minutes of detailed criticism of Griffin’s performance, and it was ugly, far uglier than any analysis of Griffin’s leadership or social-media missteps or news conference hiccups. Cooley said Griffin often looked to the wrong part of the field. He said Griffin repeatedly failed on basic fundamentals. He said Griffin missed what should have been easy reads, didn’t see open receivers, didn’t interpret defensive formations correctly, didn’t understand basic game-management principles, could not allow his team to run any semblance of its offense.

In the second half, things bottomed out.

“At this point in the game, our coaching staff came up with the conclusion, now we will run simple, Day-One offense,” Cooley said. “This is all we can do. We have eliminated the game plan. We’ve [gone] back to Day One of training camp install.”

It’s kind of impossible to go through the entire half-hour in this space, and I’d encourage you to listen yourself. But I did go grab a few images to pair with Cooley’s analysis of some particularly bad moments.

Here’s the first play of the game, an interception...
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Very good breakdown of where RG3's decision-making is totally off. Sad.
 
Thanks for the link. That was brutal.

Followed by Colt McCoy starting this coming weekend for Washington. Amazing that Washington gave up the farm for this player; and now could be parting ways after 3 years. What a disaster.
 
Troy Chapman said:
Thanks for the link. That was brutal.

Followed by Colt McCoy starting this coming weekend for Washington. Amazing that Washington gave up the farm for this player; and now could be parting ways after 3 years. What a disaster.
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Granted, Washington's a dumpster fire right now, but in spite of that (or more likely, for the same reason), I'll believe Snyder will let them cut RGIII when I see it.
 
Troy Chapman said:
...Amazing that Washington gave up the farm for this player...
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I want to meet the guy at St. Louis who had the Redskins at 3 first round picks for that 2012 #2 overall pick and said... "Nope, I need a sweetener. Not doing it without your 2nd rounder, too." with a straight face. :highfive:
 
Playoffs said:
Chris Cooley: RGIII was so bad, I can’t assess the rest of the Redskins’ offense

Very good breakdown of where RG3's decision-making is totally off. Sad.
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It seems that more often than not, these read-option QBs are unable to comprehend the cerebral aspects of being an NFL QB. They have relied on their physical skills for so long that they never needed to develop the abilities required to understand the complexities of defensive schemes and apply them in real-time at the speed of the pro level.

Some are able to rise above and meet the challenge, but more often than not, it seems like they want to use their running ability before their brains. RGIII is obviously struggling to understand what is required to be a passing QB, and I wonder if he's another one of those over-hyped guys that eventually fade away.
 
Double Barrel said:
...more often than not, it seems like they want to use their running ability before their brains.
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Bingo.

If, when you get in trouble, your first instinct is to use your legs to get out of it instead of your arm you'll miss out on learning the subtleties of playing QB that are more often than not required to have success in the NFL. RG3 has little pocket presence skills. Didn't learn it with Shanihans, and now it's a foreign language to him when Gruden asks it of him.
 
Double Barrel said:
It seems that more often than not, these read-option QBs are unable to comprehend the cerebral aspects of being an NFL QB. They have relied on their physical skills for so long that they never needed to develop the abilities required to understand the complexities of defensive schemes and apply them in real-time at the speed of the pro level.

Some are able to rise above and meet the challenge, but more often than not, it seems like they want to use their running ability before their brains. RGIII is obviously struggling to understand what is required to be a passing QB, and I wonder if he's another one of those over-hyped guys that eventually fade away.
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MSR. Right on target as usual.

I've been saying this for years now. The mental aspect of playing QB is probably the most important part of it. And yet time after time, teams fall in love with these guys who are elite at all the things that don't matter but lack the one thing that matters most of all.

I don't care how fast you can run. I don't care how high you can jump. Hell, beyond a minimum baseline I don't care how far you can throw either. What I do care about is your ability to grab necessary information in a short amount of time and be able to correctly interpret what that information means and how you need to react to it.
 
Norg said:
I'm sure the Colts or steelers will, pick him up has, there backup lol
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I'm sure the Colts or Steelers will pick him up as their back-up.

Just trying to help Norg learn English. His football intelligence can't be fixed but I'm still hoping he can learn something someday.
 
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