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Houston Texans 2017 1st round pick, Deshaun Watson, QB, Clemson

Corrosion

Idealist
Staff member
Wow......could all this bad route running be at the heart of Watson holding the ball too long? Ever tried to anticipate a route throw and in the back your mind, you don’t have the warm and fuzzies regarding the receiver being where he needs to be.

Sorry guys (some), you can’t have it both ways.

Could definitely be an issue …. Poor / wrong routes wreck a play in more ways than one.

Watson expecting X and getting Y ...

Routes that work in combination with one another don't work as intended. Picks , rubs , drags …. leading defenders into passing lanes.


We did see an awful lot of plays last year where multiple receivers ended up in close proximity to one another. I don't have the give a damn to go look at every play from last season to see what percentage of those Hopkins was involved in.

Those are obvious poor routes / mistakes , how many others there were we'll never really know but we can say with some certainty that those weren't the only plays that happened on.
 

Earl34

Veteran
Wow......could all this bad route running be at the heart of Watson holding the ball too long? Ever tried to anticipate a route throw and in the back your mind, you don’t have the warm and fuzzies regarding the receiver being where he needs to be.

Sorry guys (some), you can’t have it both ways.
I have so many questions about Hopkins running the wrong routes. For example
  1. What does it say that the WR with the most experience in O'Brien's offense is still running wrong routes? Is it the system or the player?
  2. Without a regular offseason, will Cobb, Cooks and even Johnson struggle with this offense?
  3. Was O'Brien truthful when he told ownership about Hopkins' route running?
  4. If route running is a constant issue, how much is it contributing to Watson holding the ball or not always throwing with "anticipation"?
 

Texansballer74

Hall of Fame
I have so many questions about Hopkins running the wrong routes. For example
  1. What does it say that the WR with the most experience in O'Brien's offense is still running wrong routes? Is it the system or the player?
  2. Without a regular offseason, will Cobb and Cooks and even Johnson struggle with this offense?
  3. Was O'Brien truthful when he told ownership about Hopkins' route running?
  4. If route running is a constant issue, how much is it contributing to Watson holding the ball or not always throwing with "anticipation"?
Earl I talked to my boy and he said that information was false. Hopkins was not running the wrong routes.
 

thunderkyss

Just win baby!!!
Staff member
Contributor's Club
I have so many questions about Hopkins running the wrong routes. For example
  1. What does it say that the WR with the most experience in O'Brien's offense is still running wrong routes? Is it the system or the player?
I didn’t get the impression they were saying Hopkins didn’t grasp the system. I took it more as since he didn’t practice he wasn’t prepared with that weeks game plan.

But the things they put in to exploit a tendency may not have been executed as they expected
 

Earl34

Veteran
Earl I talked to my boy and he said that information was false. Hopkins was not running the wrong routes.
The owners would not have any idea if Hopkins was running the wrong routes without O'Brien or Easterby mentioning it. I guess this is another indicator of how weak the ownership group is because it doesn't appear that they asked the follow-up questions, "how can a guy get targeted 125+ times a season and be so productive while running the wrong routes?" or "why are so many WRs running the wrong routes?"
 

Texansballer74

Hall of Fame
The owners would not have any idea if Hopkins was running the wrong routes without O'Brien or Easterby mentioning it. I guess this is another indicator of how weak the ownership group is because it doesn't appear that they asked the follow-up questions, "how can a guy get targeted 125+ times a season and be so productive while running the wrong routes?" or "why are so many WRs running the wrong routes?"
Bro exactly. This stuff is so comical to me.
 

Uncle Rico

Ur apology should be as loud as Ur disrespect was
Earl I talked to my boy and he said that information was false. Hopkins was not running the wrong routes.
Its LUDICROUS to even toss that garbage out into the landscape as some sort of reasoning and explanation as to why DeAndre Hopkins was expendable. Notice how nobody wants to address your posts? Its too convenient to latch onto hearsay and HOPE that there is some redeeming qualities about Bill OBrien so they will say and do just about anything to slander the ex Texans. Mirror image of the gaslighting that has taken over our country - i'll believe what comes from the players 1000000000000000% before I ever believe anything leaked by talk show hosts and coaches who have sworn allegiance to the Chin.

Hopkins was the ONLY ONE who knew every single wideout responsibilities and route expectations - he played every single position! You would think common sense would take over some of these discussions .. but here we are. DeAndre Hopkins not knowing what routes to run! LOL
 

Uncle Rico

Ur apology should be as loud as Ur disrespect was
The only time Hop didn’t practice was when he was injured.
Skip that practice stuff - how many games did Nuk suit up while banged up? How many GAMES did he miss? Playing with broken ribs, damaged ankle ligaments .. and he gets $%!# on! Sad when practice heros and guys who can recite the Nicene Creed get more respect and admiration than the actual gamers and producers. I thought we were supposed to reward accomplishments, not just effort being misunderstood with character.
 

Texansballer74

Hall of Fame
Skip that practice stuff - how many games did Nuk suit up while banged up? How many GAMES did he miss? Playing with broken ribs, damaged ankle ligaments .. and he gets $%!# on! Sad when practice heros and guys who can recite the Nicene Creed get more respect and admiration than the actual gamers and producers. I thought we were supposed to reward accomplishments, not just effort being misunderstood with character.
Exactly when I read that crazy stuff on here I was like GTFOH. There’s nothing wrong with sharing the information you come across. But on some skit you have to call BS instead of trying to use it the way that it’s been used around here.
 

thunderkyss

Just win baby!!!
Staff member
Contributor's Club
The only time Hop didn’t practice was when he was injured.
Again, this is only my impression of what was said. Not that I believe one way or the other. Not that I think it justifies the Hopkins trade even if it were true.

But it's being said he was consistently nursing injuries. Even when he wasn't on the injured list. & not practicing. Kinda like a diva.



I think Hopkins is gone because he didn't want to be here. Doesn't matter to me how BO'b & his group want to spin it. He didn't want to be the next Andre Johnson, wasting his career here. So he's now going to be the next Larry Fitzgerald.
 
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Texansballer74

Hall of Fame
I wonder if JJ gets traded what would be said about him. Will they say he wasn’t practicing or he was freelancing too much and not holding his gap responsibilities. And will some think he was being a diva type individual as well.
 

thunderkyss

Just win baby!!!
Staff member
Contributor's Club
I wonder if JJ gets traded what would be said about him. Will they say he wasn’t practicing or he was freelancing too much and not holding his gap responsibilities. And will some think he was being a diva type individual as well.
I don't see why they wouldn't say that. I'm saying it now. He freelances too much & doesn't hold his gap responsibilities. While that worked out great for him when he was a beast. Now, not so much.
 

Texansballer74

Hall of Fame
I don't see why they wouldn't say that. I'm saying it now. He freelances too much & doesn't hold his gap responsibilities. While that worked out great for him when he was a beast. Now, not so much.
I highly doubt the masses would attempt to tarnish JJ the face like that. Meaning the coaches and front office personnel
 
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steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
I wonder if JJ gets traded what would be said about him. Will they say he wasn’t practicing or he was freelancing too much and not holding his gap responsibilities. And will some think he was being a diva type individual as well.
What are you really trying to say here?
 

Uncle Rico

Ur apology should be as loud as Ur disrespect was
I highly doubt the masses would attempt tarnish JJ the face like that. Meaning the coaches and front office personnel
LOL of course not!! I mean remember how much support Brian Cushing received when he was popped for steroids the first time?? Hell the owner came out defending the whole "over training" BS! Then the dude gets popped AGAIN and it was another set of excuses. SMH.

JJ Watt is untouchable. He hasnt been a good player for 4 years now and still every year its "JJ is gonna come back to form this year, you'll see!!" while a guy like JD Clowney gets drug through the mud and his name smeared because he "isnt worth the contract".

THESE are what double standards look like - not the insecurity issues other guys project as such.
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
LOL of course not!! I mean remember how much support Brian Cushing received when he was popped for steroids the first time?? Hell the owner came out defending the whole "over training" BS! Then the dude gets popped AGAIN and it was another set of excuses. SMH.

JJ Watt is untouchable. He hasnt been a good player for 4 years now and still every year its "JJ is gonna come back to form this year, you'll see!!" while a guy like JD Clowney gets drug through the mud and his name smeared because he "isnt worth the contract".

THESE are what double standards look like - not the insecurity issues other guys project as such.
BS, many didn't want Cushing on the team anymore.

Clowney's worth is being proven out in this yrs FA class. Although JJ's likely to not make it through the season again this yr. He's still a more impactful player than Clowney ever was or will be. 3 sacks? LMAO
 

Uncle Rico

Ur apology should be as loud as Ur disrespect was
the surface level thinkers chime in with their beloved SACKS argument!! LMAOOOOOOOOO

with that logic Terrel Suggs, Demarcus Ware and John Abraham are all better players than Lawrence Taylor.

Those pesky stats!!

For my money (seeing as to how JJ's career has basically ground to a halt) I would say that I prefer RAy Childress' steady decade of above average play than the 4 OMG years JJ has produced, and Sean Jones was a better pass rusher for his career.
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
the surface level thinkers chime in with their beloved SACKS argument!! LMAOOOOOOOOO

with that logic Terrel Suggs, Demarcus Ware and John Abraham are all better players than Lawrence Taylor.

Those pesky stats!!

For my money (seeing as to how JJ's career has basically ground to a halt) I would say that I prefer RAy Childress' steady decade of above average play than the 4 OMG years JJ has produced, and Sean Jones was a better pass rusher for his career.
You mean those surface level GM's that still haven't signed Clowney as of today? That sound you keep hearing is Clowney's market value and that must be bugging the crap out of you.
 

Double Barrel

Moderator
Staff member
Contributor's Club
I wonder if JJ gets traded what would be said about him. Will they say he wasn’t practicing or he was freelancing too much and not holding his gap responsibilities. And will some think he was being a diva type individual as well.
The JJ Watt situation is what made me realize that O'Brien is talking out of both sides of his mouth with regards to the Hopkins trade giveaway.

If it was all about money with Nuk, then how can they justify the salary of Watt when he's clearly past his prime and hurt more often than he plays?

If it was about "practice", then how do they justify Watt for the past several seasons when he's too hurt to practice?

Nuk clearly had a greater, consistent impact on the offense than JJ did on the defense considering the actual games played by both the past two seasons.

But, and this is where the rubber meets the road, JJ is a marketing superstar, easy to plaster his Captain America act on 3D souvenir soda cups and t-shirts, easier to sell Ford trucks and whatever other merchandise being pedaled by Houston Texans advertising customers.

It was personal with King Billy and Nuk. For me, it's simply Occam's razor and is the simplest explanation. Vindictive pettiness and massive ego are traits of mediocre head coaches and terrible general managers.
 

dream_team

Hall of Fame
IMO, the proper move would have been to let Clowney play on the tag last season, then let him test FA this off-season.

That means we'd be in the driver's seat right now to extend Clowney on a very team friendly deal.
 

otisbean

Veteran
Contributor's Club
LOL of course not!! I mean remember how much support Brian Cushing received when he was popped for steroids the first time?? Hell the owner came out defending the whole "over training" BS! Then the dude gets popped AGAIN and it was another set of excuses. SMH.

JJ Watt is untouchable. He hasnt been a good player for 4 years now and still every year its "JJ is gonna come back to form this year, you'll see!!" while a guy like JD Clowney gets drug through the mud and his name smeared because he "isnt worth the contract".

THESE are what double standards look like - not the insecurity issues other guys project as such.
While injuries have hampered him quite a bit I don’t think it’s fair to say he has been good for 4 years



In 2019 he had an overall grade of 89.6 for the games he played in 2019 and played well against Buffalo after coming back after the torn Pec. I believe he was top 5 for QB hits and pressures before he went out.


I won’t argue with anyone about his availability because for the past 4 seasons he’s been banged up and has missed a ton of games, BUT when he’s in the field he’s really really good
 

Decim8

Practice Squad
BS, many didn't want Cushing on the team anymore.

Clowney's worth is being proven out in this yrs FA class. Although JJ's likely to not make it through the season again this yr. He's still a more impactful player than Clowney ever was or will be. 3 sacks? LMAO
Yup probably the only thing I've agreed with was the release of Clowney. He definitely wasn't worth the money he was asking for. I was more upset with the inability to sign Kareem than anything else at the time
 

Lucky

Moderator
Staff member
I think Hopkins is gone because he didn't want to be here. Doesn't matter to me how BO'b & his group want to spin it. He didn't want to be the next Andre Johnson, wasting his career here. So he's now going to be the next Larry Fitzgerald.
Yes, Hopkins didn’t want to be here. He’s on the record. But, he never said exactly why. We can assume his relationship, or lack there of, with O’Brien has disintegrated beyond repair. It happens.

What bothers me the most is the BS that Billy is spreading through the media and ownership. Hop was uncoachable, a bad teammate, a bad character. Forget that he was one of the top 5 players to ever wear Steel Blue. Forget that he answered the bell in every game. One of the reasons I won’t shed a tear when O’Brien is gone.

Hopkins didn’t want to leave because he didn’t believe in his teammates. He left because he didn’t believe in Bill O’Brien’s character.
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
Yes, Hopkins didn’t want to be here. He’s on the record. But, he never said exactly why. We can assume his relationship, or lack there of, with O’Brien has disintegrated beyond repair. It happens.

What bothers me the most is the BS that Billy is spreading through the media and ownership. Hop was uncoachable, a bad teammate, a bad character. Forget that he was one of the top 5 players to ever wear Steel Blue. Forget that he answered the bell in every game. One of the reasons I won’t shed a tear when O’Brien is gone.

Hopkins didn’t want to leave because he didn’t believe in his teammates. He left because he didn’t believe in Bill O’Brien’s character.
Funny how he wanted to leave as soon as the guaranteed money ran out.

That speaks volumes even though I know you won't see what was going on
 


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