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Houston Texans 2017 1st round pick, Deshaun Watson, QB, Clemson

Uncle Rico

Ur apology should be as loud as Ur disrespect was
I know I'm jumping in late, but they have weekly QB sessions with Kelly, OB, all the QB's, and I don't know who else, where they discuss game plan, etc. Something just feels out of kilter that this play would remain in the play book and not.discussed in any of these meetings.
Yes most of the offensive staff have meetings about implementation while OBrien is masquerading as a GM Monday - Friday, but its also been rumored that what the offense practices and prepares for has a tendency to be changed by OBrien at the 11th hour during Friday/Saturday walk throughs. You ever wonder why the team looks out of sorts to start most games? Hard to change your whole approach at the last minute and expect EVERYONE to be on the same page.

GMs should manage
HCs should coach

Overlap causes terrible hierarchical issues.
 
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dream_team

Hall of Fame
Yes most of the offensive staff have meetings about implementation while OBrien is masquerading as a GM Monday - Friday, but its also been reported that what the offense practices and prepares for has a tendency to be changed by OBrien at the 11th hour during Friday/Saturday walk throughs. You ever wonder why the team looks out of sorts to start most games? Hard to change your whole approach at the last minute and expect EVERYONE to be on the same page.

GMs should manage
HCs should coach

Overlap causes terrible hierarchical issues.
Honest question about those that have done the GM/HC combo in the past. Does this imply GM & HC is actually a part-time job? Or said person is working "16-hour days"? Another words, working twice as hard to do two jobs.
 

Uncle Rico

Ur apology should be as loud as Ur disrespect was
Honest question about those that have done the GM/HC combo in the past. Does this imply GM & HC is actually a part-time job? Or said person is working "16-hour days"? Another words, working twice as hard to do two jobs.
Only a handful of men have been given those types of roles and been successful at both .. guys like Belichek, Parcells, Mike Shanahan, Andy Reid, Bill Walsh, Sean Payton, Mike Holmgren, and a handful of washout guys like Marvin Lewis who were given the dual job and failed miserably.

Correlation? Most of the guys were given the GM job AFTER showing success as a coach usually resulting in a SB win.

Quick Answer - Yes .. it is infinitely hard to do both jobs .. let alone be successful at both. Football coaches already put in long days, adding the managerial stuff to the plate is crazy, but shows how much egotistical power and control some guys need in order to "flourish".
 

Number19

Hall of Fame
Some of you guys would benefit from reading about high level progressions and coverage reads. What should be the catalyst for the next defining moment in a developing play, and ultimately execution of the proper "read" and success of a passing play. We can use everybody's favortite example in Tom Brady and Peyton for this particular article (outdated but still shows what QBs are taught). Its not as easy as saying "there was a player open on that play, Watson should have seen him!!!"

Good read.
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
Steve Young led his team to three consecutive NFCCG against the Jimmy Johnson coached Cowboys. He lost to the Cowboys in 1992, 1993 and beat them on the way to winning the Super Bowl in 1994.

Are you implying Young didn't win more championships because he relied too much on Rice? Because when Young and his 49ers lost to the Cowboys, Irvin had 122 of the 246 targets to WRs in 1992 and then 121 of the 210 targets to WRs in 1993. It seems like Aikman relied on Irvin as much as Young relied on Rice. Because...that's what QBs do when they have HOF #1 WRs.

Try again... :kitten:
I'm implying that Montana didn't play that way and was much more successful than Young
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
Honest question about those that have done the GM/HC combo in the past. Does this imply GM & HC is actually a part-time job? Or said person is working "16-hour days"? Another words, working twice as hard to do two jobs.
Some can do both jobs some can't.

Hopefully Kelly taking over OC job helps take alot off of BOB's plate and he becomes a better HC. I liked GM BOB's 1st draft.
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
Honest question about those that have done the GM/HC combo in the past. Does this imply GM & HC is actually a part-time job? Or said person is working "16-hour days"? Another words, working twice as hard to do two jobs.
If you have good people around you, the job isn't that hard.

Mike Brown kept Marvin Lewis from doing a better job. Lewis was short staffed.
 

OptimisticTexan

Hall of Fame
Good breakdown from all that has participated.

I really don’t dive into all the semantics like that but I will say this again.!! That’s the problem with Bill O’Brien’s offense, NO CREATIVITY.
.......and the extreme lack of a solid OL. This OL thingy is getting really long in the tooth. Maybe none of these conversations would be needed if the Texans organization had made building a top 10 OL a priority.
 

OptimisticTexan

Hall of Fame
Do you think Brady/Brees could have completed a pass on that play?
Brady probably gets sacked. Brees might buy additional time and run for the 1st down. Neither may have found themselves in this position b/c their LT's aren't usually beat this bad. I'd say both have much more faith in their LT's and OL's as a whole.
 

CloakNNNdagger

Hall of Fame
McClain in his Facebook "mailbag" was asked the question: "Is there ever any consideration on letting Deshaun Watson call the plays? I know that’s rare in the NFL?"

His answer: "There’s not, Jimmie. Watson has a lot of freedom to make changes and consider his options once he reads the defense, and he should be even better at it this season because it’ll be his fourth with the Texans and he’s playing in the same system."
 

Earl34

Veteran
McClain in his Facebook "mailbag" was asked the question: "Is there ever any consideration on letting Deshaun Watson call the plays? I know that’s rare in the NFL?"

His answer: "There’s not, Jimmie. Watson has a lot of freedom to make changes and consider his options once he reads the defense, and he should be even better at it this season because it’ll be his fourth with the Texans and he’s playing in the same system."
We sometimes forget that Manning (Air Coryell), Brady (EP), Favre (WCO) and even Rodgers (WCO) have spent the majority of their careers in one system and it has been tweaked. Two to three years in the system, they were game managers (Brady) or turnover prone QBs (Favre, Manning).

Shoot when Marvin Harrison played with Manning, he only stayed on the right side of the formation. In today's offenses, I don't think any coach would allow a WR to play only one side of the field. My point? In today's fast food, want now society, when these young QBs do not get the luxury of sitting behind a veteran for 1-3 years or don't have organizational stability they will struggle or have bouts of inconsistency during this learning period. So here is hoping the supporting cast improves and another year in the system enables Watson to grow, become more consistent and take the next steps in his development.
 
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OptimisticTexan

Hall of Fame
If they sign Watford there will be no excuses for not having a top 10 OL.

Hopefully having all 5 guys back will help too.
I've been running crazy since arriving here in Monterey, CA. Sitting here at Carl's Jr and responding to post(s) while enjoying breakfast burrito and unsweetened tea....doesn't get any better than this. Good news, picking up our new SUV on Saturday. Moving into our 14 month apartment on the 9th....then it'll be 3 years in Paris before we can move into our Atascocita home.
 

santo

All Pro
Contributor's Club
I've been running crazy since arriving here in Monterey, CA. Sitting here at Carl's Jr and responding to post(s) while enjoying breakfast burrito and unsweetened tea....doesn't get any better than this. Good news, picking up our new SUV on Saturday. Moving into our 14 month apartment on the 9th....then it'll be 3 years in Paris before we can move into our Atascocita home.
They closed down almost all the Carls Jr here in Houston. There used to be one in Pasadena that was down the street where I live. :(

I love whataburger but I do miss the variety of Carl’s Jr.
 

Lucky

Moderator
Staff member
I love whataburger but I do miss the variety of Carl’s Jr.
You can customize a Whataburger six ways from Sunday. Toasted bun, jalapenos, grilled peppers, avocado. 4 different cheeses, 6 different dressings.

Still, the meat Whataburger uses isn't the same quality as when I was a kid. When I lived in Austin, there was a burger place off MoPac called Backyard Burgers. They tasted just like a burger off your grill. They've since closed down, but I believe are still around in the South.
 

santo

All Pro
Contributor's Club
You can customize a Whataburger six ways from Sunday. Toasted bun, jalapenos, grilled peppers, avocado. 4 different cheeses, 6 different dressings.

Still, the meat Whataburger uses isn't the same quality as when I was a kid. When I lived in Austin, there was a burger place off MoPac called Backyard Burgers. They tasted just like a burger off your grill. They've since closed down, but I believe are still around in the South.
Carl’s Jr. had a jalapeño popper burger I loved. lol
 

Texansballer74

Hall of Fame
You can customize a Whataburger six ways from Sunday. Toasted bun, jalapenos, grilled peppers, avocado. 4 different cheeses, 6 different dressings.

Still, the meat Whataburger uses isn't the same quality as when I was a kid. When I lived in Austin, there was a burger place off MoPac called Backyard Burgers. They tasted just like a burger off your grill. They've since closed down, but I believe are still around in the South.
Man you’re right about that. That’s why I rarely eat Whatabutger now.
 

OptimisticTexan

Hall of Fame
You can customize a Whataburger six ways from Sunday. Toasted bun, jalapenos, grilled peppers, avocado. 4 different cheeses, 6 different dressings.

Still, the meat Whataburger uses isn't the same quality as when I was a kid. When I lived in Austin, there was a burger place off MoPac called Backyard Burgers. They tasted just like a burger off your grill. They've since closed down, but I believe are still around in the South.
They had a Backyard Burger in Chesapeake, VA but I believe it closed while we were overseas.
 

badboy

Hall of Fame
Nuk was the only guy Watson trusted yet he had TD throws to Fells, Stills, Fuller and Akins. Things that make you go hmmm.
Yet everyone knows and many have commented on Hopkins being Watson's go to receiver. Hopkins was heir apparent to AJ. I once had hope Fuller could be that to Nuk. Coulter? Love his size and speed. I'm looking for him to replace Fuller 2021.
 

santo

All Pro
Contributor's Club
Yet everyone knows and many have commented on Hopkins being Watson's go to receiver. Hopkins was heir apparent to AJ. I once had hope Fuller could be that to Nuk. Coulter? Love his size and speed. I'm looking for him to replace Fuller 2021.
About 90% of the qbs have that one guy they go to. This wasn’t new, but to say it’s a good thing for Hopkins to be removed so Watson can learn is asinine.
 

Texansballer74

Hall of Fame
About 90% of the qbs have that one guy they go to. This wasn’t new, but to say it’s a good thing for Hopkins to be removed so Watson can learn is asinine.
A lot of fans try to find some type of confirmation with unorthodox moves like this. So they go around believing the crap that comes out. Example one : Nuk refusing to practice. Example two: Nuk purposely running the wrong routes. And like you stated some are really convinced this was a good move.
 
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thunderkyss

Just win baby!!!
Staff member
Contributor's Club
Example one : Nuk refusing to practice. Example two: Nuk purposely running the wrong routes. And like you stated some are really convinced this was a good move.
& sometimes fans make stuff up to confirm their beliefs.

No one said Hopkins refused to practice. They said he didn't practice.

No one said he purposely ran the wrong routes. They said he didn't run the correct route.

But you're twisting their words & they have to argue something they never said.

& those people saying what they said aren't happy that Hopkins was traded away & they aren't happy with the return.

Steelbtexan may be. But he is not the one with "inside information" about not practicing or running the wrong routes.
 

Texansballer74

Hall of Fame
& sometimes fans make stuff up to confirm their beliefs.

No one said Hopkins refused to practice. They said he didn't practice.

No one said he purposely ran the wrong routes. They said he didn't run the correct route.

But you're twisting their words & they have to argue something they never said.

& those people saying what they said aren't happy that Hopkins was traded away & they aren't happy with the return.

Steelbtexan may be. But he is not the one with "inside information" about not practicing or running the wrong routes.
I’m not specifically talking about this site. But some members on here are attempting to paint Nuk as the bad guy.

And where did I say a member on here said any of that Thunder?
 

OptimisticTexan

Hall of Fame
I've been running crazy since arriving here in Monterey, CA. Sitting here at Carl's Jr and responding to post(s) while enjoying breakfast burrito and unsweetened tea....doesn't get any better than this. Good news, picking up our new SUV on Saturday. Moving into our 14 month apartment on the 9th....then it'll be 3 years in Paris before we can move into our Atascocita home.
Today I’m enjoying a late breakfast at Sonic and decided to listen to the NFL Network on my free 6 month Sirius trial and what am I treated to.....the frickin 1992 Oilers at Bills playoff game!!!!! The nice part, as I listen I can confirm without a doubt Moon is the last guy I’d be blaming for this comeback loss. Defense completely fell apart, receivers let some big throws go through their hands, and tried to run far too often versus doing what gave them the lead in the first half.

The announcers just mentioned, if the Bills win it would be b/c of their defensive adjustment after the half when they went 3-4 Defense on 1st down and Zone Defense on 2nd and 3rd down. In all seriousness, the Oilers helped that defensive adjustment tremendously by moving away from their offensive attack and to a protect the lead running game approach.

Still frickin hurts....even after 28 years.
 

Corrosion

Idealist
Staff member
A lot of fans try to find some type of confirmation with unorthodox moves like this. So they go around believing the crap that comes out. Example one : Nuk refusing to practice. Example two: Nuk purposely running the wrong routes. And like you stated some are really convinced this was a good move.
Way to misquote a quote.

No one said he ran the wrong routes on purpose. That was you and Rico adding BS to what was said.

And this wasn't "just something that came out" ..... It was directly from a minority owner of the team. Not some BS from media.

& sometimes fans make stuff up to confirm their beliefs.

No one said Hopkins refused to practice. They said he didn't practice.

No one said he purposely ran the wrong routes. They said he didn't run the correct route.

But you're twisting their words & they have to argue something they never said.

& those people saying what they said aren't happy that Hopkins was traded away & they aren't happy with the return.

Steelbtexan may be. But he is not the one with "inside information" about not practicing or running the wrong routes.
Yeah , that ....
 

Texansballer74

Hall of Fame
Way to misquote a quote.

No one said he ran the wrong routes on purpose. That was you and Rico adding BS to what was said.

And this wasn't "just something that came out" ..... It was directly from a minority owner of the team. Not some BS from media.



Yeah , that ....
You’re got darn lie. Y’all started crap and I said I highly doubt he was.
 

badboy

Hall of Fame
Today I’m enjoying a late breakfast at Sonic and decided to listen to the NFL Network on my free 6 month Sirius trial and what am I treated to.....the frickin 1992 Oilers at Bills playoff game!!!!! The nice part, as I listen I can confirm without a doubt Moon is the last guy I’d be blaming for this comeback loss. Defense completely fell apart, receivers let some big throws go through their hands, and tried to run far too often versus doing what gave them the lead in the first half.

The announcers just mentioned, if the Bills win it would be b/c of their defensive adjustment after the half when they went 3-4 Defense on 1st down and Zone Defense on 2nd and 3rd down. In all seriousness, the Oilers helped that defensive adjustment tremendously by moving away from their offensive attack and to a protect the lead running game approach.

Still frickin hurts....even after 28 years.
So you believe you just had to share that with us? Thanks for the Memories! Here's a poke in the eye back at you LOL!
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
& sometimes fans make stuff up to confirm their beliefs.

No one said Hopkins refused to practice. They said he didn't practice.

No one said he purposely ran the wrong routes. They said he didn't run the correct route.

But you're twisting their words & they have to argue something they never said.

& those people saying what they said aren't happy that Hopkins was traded away & they aren't happy with the return.

Steelbtexan may be. But he is not the one with "inside information" about not practicing or running the wrong routes.
Nope, I didn't say any of this. We're on the same page. This is just more of UR/TB's twisting things around crap.

I did say I think the WR corps will be better if healthy but that has nothing to do with Hopkins.
 

Corrosion

Idealist
Staff member
You’re got darn lie. Y’all started crap and I said I highly doubt he was.

Y'all didn't start anything …..

I made the statement that he blew up plays by running the wrong routes - You and Rico interpreted that as intentionally.

There was not even the insinuation that it was done intentionally on my part.

Ran the wrong routes turned into intentionally running the wrong routes thru he said she said.
 

Corrosion

Idealist
Staff member
For a guy running the wrong routes, he sure put up some kick ass numbers.

Why the game of a 3 time All-Pro 3 years running is being picked apart in the negative way it has by those who are, I'll never understand, but whatever helps them sleep at night.

I don't recall picking his game apart at all ….

All I did was relay a piece of information that wasn't reported anywhere else. Can't help if you don't like that information ….

It's not often we get inside information from this franchise (Actually we do , we just aren't at liberty to discuss it very often) , figured you guy's would appreciate the "news" for what it was …. Apparently that isn't the case.

Next time I won't pass it along.
 

Number19

Hall of Fame
It's kind of amazing how well Deshaun has looked in this offense considering everyone keeps running wrong routes.
No one has yet mentioned, and this is significant, both the EP offense and the WCO requires receivers to run precise routes. This doesn't mean if a receiver is off route, the QB can't find him and complete a pass. Perhaps Hopkins communicated with Watson what to expect.

But still, it's the OFFENSE and not individual players which is important. Any offensive coordinator expects the play to be run as designed. This is not playground football. If Hopkins was not running the routes as designed, for whatever reason, then he was a cancer and the organization made the right decision to let him go.
 
I don't recall picking his game apart at all ….

All I did was relay a piece of information that wasn't reported anywhere else. Can't help if you don't like that information ….

It's not often we get inside information from this franchise (Actually we do , we just aren't at liberty to discuss it very often) , figured you guy's would appreciate the "news" for what it was …. Apparently that isn't the case.

Next time I won't pass it along.
Won’t speak for anyone else but I personally love the behind the scenes info, but then I’m a logo fan that’s just want the team to win no matter who is coaching or playing. I get how frustrating it is Corrosion but please don’t let a couple of poster who have emotionally invested themselves in hating OB and Watson as the greatest QB to ever pick up a football stop you from sharing with the rest of us.

Remember this is the crowd that paints anyone that agrees with ANY decision OB makes as an OB defender and any post with ANY critique of Watson as being a Watson hater. They abandoned logic and reason, and with it civil discourse, long ago so now all they have is emotion.
 
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It's kind of amazing how well Deshaun has looked in this offense considering everyone keeps running wrong routes.
I would say part of that is due to the fact that Hopkins maybe one of the best WRs in NFL history at winning his match ups. Even if he did run the wrong route he’s not really trying to get open, because he can’t, so as long as he is found you can throw it to him and odds are good he will catch it. Likewise Fuller, when his wheels work, can burn most of his defenders and he is the fastest guy on the team so just look for the only Texan down field.

Just going off he top of my head I believe most of the passes to other receivers are in short game or end zone where there is less area a QB has to scan and can spot a receiver faster whether they are running the correct route or not.
 

OptimisticTexan

Hall of Fame
It's kind of amazing how well Deshaun has looked in this offense considering everyone keeps running wrong routes.
Wow......could all this bad route running be at the heart of Watson holding the ball too long? Ever tried to anticipate a route throw and in the back your mind, you don’t have the warm and fuzzies regarding the receiver being where he needs to be.

Sorry guys (some), you can’t have it both ways.
 


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