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FIRE BILL O'BRIEN NOW!!!

OptimisticTexan

Go Texans!!!
Let's assume for the sake of discussion that musso is correct. The year before OB came on board, the Texans were 2-14. Now, with less talent, OB is getting 10 wins out of the team. Not bad.
Not sure that had anything to do with OB and more to do with the regression of the AFCS and the defenses Romeo put together.
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
this is a blatant falsehood thats already been dissected ad nauseum. The rosters that Kubiak and OBrien inherited have been broken down PLAYER FOR PLAYER and its not even close how much talent OBrien had to begin with.

Stop spreading lies if you want an even conversation.
LMAO, Lies? the numbers speak for themselves
 

Uncle Rico

Ur apology should be as loud as Ur disrespect was
O’Brien didn’t have a QB when took over. Not that I am giving him any credit for finding one. Just that without a QB, whatever talent gap there was is meaningless.
You're right .. he had 10.

The QB whisperer was never able to mold one of them .. not until Deshaun Watson was FORCED upon him that the position became settled.

If it wasnt for such a well staffed defense OBrien may have not made it out of his first contract.

I agree with the "QB is most important position" take though.
 

austins23

Hall of Fame
Regardless of who had what when they inherited the team, it should be obvious to a certain owner that Billy O ain't the man. I think he's tied to him now for at least the next 3 years to see if he can get a handle on this GM thing. So far, not off to a roaring start.

Back to the thread, Fire Billy O. I've said it a few times before the Hopkins trade, this team appears that it plays its ass off for him. After this trade, we'll see. Hopkins was a huge leader on offense and the team. Four out of five championships is not bad. "It's hard to win in the NFL, Brian." As it has been discussed, how many of those wins/AFCSC came from beating up on division foes? How many "signature" wins does this team have under Billy O?
2014 - I didn't see any
2015 - Beat up on the Saints at home. Saints were bad that year though (7-9)
2016 - Beat the Chiefs at home. Chiefs were 12-4 that year, 1st place AFCW. Texans 2nd AFCSC in three years, third year at 9-7
2017 - ooof…..
2018 - Beat Cowboys at home. Cowboys were 10-6, 1st in NFCE.
2019 - Beat Chiefs on road, Pats at home. Lots will say that the Pats had a down year. True, but it was Tom Brady and the Pats.

So five "signature" wins in 6 seasons. And all the playoff loses were horrible. Billy Os record against + .500 teams isn't very impressive.
I think he can/could be a good coach. He just needs to concentrate on that alone though. His ego seems to get in his way lots of times. I just don't see this team, with Billy O, going any further than it has already. It's time to let him go. When a team gets outscored 51-7 after being up 24 ON THE ROAD in a playoff game....well, that ship has sailed.
 

OptimisticTexan

Go Texans!!!
Regardless of who had what when they inherited the team, it should be obvious to a certain owner that Billy O ain't the man. I think he's tied to him now for at least the next 3 years to see if he can get a handle on this GM thing. So far, not off to a roaring start.

Back to the thread, Fire Billy O. I've said it a few times before the Hopkins trade, this team appears that it plays its ass off for him. After this trade, we'll see. Hopkins was a huge leader on offense and the team. Four out of five championships is not bad. "It's hard to win in the NFL, Brian." As it has been discussed, how many of those wins/AFCSC came from beating up on division foes? How many "signature" wins does this team have under Billy O?
2014 - I didn't see any
2015 - Beat up on the Saints at home. Saints were bad that year though (7-9)
2016 - Beat the Chiefs at home. Chiefs were 12-4 that year, 1st place AFCW. Texans 2nd AFCSC in three years, third year at 9-7
2017 - ooof…..
2018 - Beat Cowboys at home. Cowboys were 10-6, 1st in NFCE.
2019 - Beat Chiefs on road, Pats at home. Lots will say that the Pats had a down year. True, but it was Tom Brady and the Pats.

So five "signature" wins in 6 seasons. And all the playoff loses were horrible. Billy Os record against + .500 teams isn't very impressive.
I think he can/could be a good coach. He just needs to concentrate on that alone though. His ego seems to get in his way lots of times. I just don't see this team, with Billy O, going any further than it has already. It's time to let him go. When a team gets outscored 51-7 after being up 24 ON THE ROAD in a playoff game....well, that ship has sailed.
100% agree.....players have floors and ceilings and so does OB. He's hit his ceiling and now that he wants to wear both the HC and GM cap, the elevator is moving back down. Time to start a new chapter but Cal and Mama McNair seem like they want to read that last chapter over again.......pssst, the ending is the same no matter how many times you re-read the same chapter.
 

welsh texan

All Pro
I have a really silly question to ask which I know is going to sound really insensitive in some way, but what exactly is the racial side of comparing Hopkins to Hernandez? They are of different ethnic backgrounds so it isn’t a certain stereotype? I see it as a terrible put down that isn’t a professional way to address anyone, but don’t see the racism?
I know I’m probably missing something here due to living in a different culture, just curious to learn not wishing to cause offence.
 

JB

Old Curmudgeon
Contributor's Club
I have a really silly question to ask which I know is going to sound really insensitive in some way, but what exactly is the racial side of comparing Hopkins to Hernandez? They are of different ethnic backgrounds so it isn’t a certain stereotype? I see it as a terrible put down that isn’t a professional way to address anyone, but don’t see the racism?
I know I’m probably missing something here due to living in a different culture, just curious to learn not wishing to cause offence.
There is no racial side except for OB being a different race from either and some having an agenda.
 

Earl34

Veteran
I have a really silly question to ask which I know is going to sound really insensitive in some way, but what exactly is the racial side of comparing Hopkins to Hernandez? They are of different ethnic backgrounds so it isn’t a certain stereotype? I see it as a terrible put down that isn’t a professional way to address anyone, but don’t see the racism?
I know I’m probably missing something here due to living in a different culture, just curious to learn not wishing to cause offence.
If O'Brien starts the conversation with, "In our time together, I've never felt the need to have this meeting with you" or "I haven't had a meeting like this since I was with the Pats". Maybe, Hopkins views the meeting in a totally different light.

I think Michael Irvin started the comparing Hopkins to Hernandez narrative which leads to a juicier story, but might have taken Hopkins' quote out of context. I don't think O'Brien's intent was to compare Hopkins' character to Hernandez.
 

JB

Old Curmudgeon
Contributor's Club
I think Michael Irvin started the comparing Hopkins to Hernandez narrative which leads to a juicier story, but might have taken Hopkins' quote out of context. I don't think O'Brien's intent was to compare Hopkins' character to Hernandez.
Yep, but we will never know just what was said or how
 

Uncle Rico

Ur apology should be as loud as Ur disrespect was
I have a really silly question to ask which I know is going to sound really insensitive in some way, but what exactly is the racial side of comparing Hopkins to Hernandez? They are of different ethnic backgrounds so it isn’t a certain stereotype? I see it as a terrible put down that isn’t a professional way to address anyone, but don’t see the racism?
I know I’m probably missing something here due to living in a different culture, just curious to learn not wishing to cause offence.
in urban settings African Americans and Latinos share a similar experience and in that regard can empathize with one another and will ultimately have some of the same societal baggage. Gang murders and the street life Hernandez was living was a common theme in both AA and Latino inner city/urban communities (and even trickles out to rural/suburban settings according to statistics) so its not so much the race thing in addressing Hernandez its the presumption that there would be anything whatsoever that would lead OBrien to believe that Hopkins was some thug or gang member .. the dude wears scarfs and Balenciaga slippers!! LOL

the racial attack came when OBrien couldnt contain himself and addressed Hopkins girlfriends/ex-girlfriends as the "baby mamas" .. I would think thats a fairly easy and obvious distinction to make.
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
I’m talking overall talent. i Realize the only thing keeping this team afloat is Watson.
Here's where the difference is, you think DW4 is keeping the team afloat. Some like me think he's holding the team back and of course there's a racial element to this.
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
What OB’s mistake was comparing a murderer to a guy who’s been an outstanding citizen so far. Yay we deserve such a HC here. :dance2:
Well, Hernandez did bring a bunch of his baby momma's around the Pats. Nuk took that ouyt of context, which really isn't surprising since (Giving him the benefit of the doubt) he's not the sharpest tool in the shed. At worst he was sharp as a tack and very vindictive. (I dont believe this to be true since he is going to get the new contract he wanted.) Although he did inadvertently do damage to his buddy DW4's chances to win a championship.
 

santo

All Pro
Contributor's Club
Well, Hernandez did bring a bunch of his baby momma's around the Pats. Nuk took that ouyt of context, which really isn't surprising since (Giving him the benefit of the doubt) he's not the sharpest tool in the shed. At worst he was sharp as a tack and very vindictive. (I dont believe this to be true since he is going to get the new contract he wanted.) Although he did inadvertently do damage to his buddy DW4's chances to win a championship.
Well, there were other players on the team that maybe OB could have used the example of. I doubt Hernandez was the only Pats player with "baby mommas".
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
Well, there were other players on the team that maybe OB could have used the example of. I doubt Hernandez was the only Pats player with "baby mommas".
Your point is?

And you dont know this to be a fact. But you're right BOB should've known who he was talking too and realized this is how that conversation would turn out.

I'm sure if BOB had this to do over again, he would've just traded Nuk and not tried to give him baby momma's advice.
 

santo

All Pro
Contributor's Club
Your point is?

And you dont know this to be a fact. But you're right BOB should've known who he was talking too and realized this is how that conversation would turn out.

I'm sure if BOB had this to do over again, he would've just traded Nuk and not tried to give him bay momma's advice.
I guess that's my point. No need to add more to it, just trade him if you don't want him on the team anymore. Nothing wrong with that.
 
I think BOB was trying o give him some good advice and it backfired on him.
I really think this was the case as well. I really don't think he was so much comparing them as he was trying to relate it. Subtle difference yes but its a big one. I think back to some of the conversations I've had as a manager and sitting in as the second to a manager and there are more than a few that I wish I could do different and I'm sure OB feels that way about this one. Santo is right he should have taken a page out of his mentors book and just treated him like an asset to be used for the benefit of the team and traded him without talking to him.

It was a stupid thing to say but as anybody that has raised a teenager will tell you sometimes the stupidest things we say are said with the best of intentions.
 

zshawn10

All Pro
New #Texans from Houston Chronicle — McClain's Mailbag: Concern for Deshaun Watson's future with Texans? https://t.co/4m3ZLwTFMC
— Greg Rajan (@GregRajan) March 24, 2020



Q: My question to you is simple: Do you think Bill O’Brien will trade Deshaun Watson? After reading some of your comments, you seem overly confident that he won’t, so I’ll ask you one more question: Did you have that same confidence about O’Brien not trading Hopkins before he was traded? — Rafael P.

A: I wrote a column, Rafael, asking if money would cause the Texans to trade Hopkins, so I wasn’t surprised. I was surprised O’Brien didn’t get more for him. They weren’t going to redo his deal with three years left. I guarantee you O’Brien won’t be trading Watson, the most important player on the team.

Q: If Watson and Tunsil don’t sign long-term contracts, could you see them being traded? I don’t believe they will sign. I believe most of the team is very upset with OB, especially Watson. — Glen K.

A: I agree about players being upset, especially Watson, Glen. I also believe if they pay Watson and Tunsil what they believe they’re worth, they’ll re-sign. I also know if Watson doesn’t sign, he’s got two years left on his contract, including this one, and they could franchise him for two years after that. So, they could be guaranteed of having him through the 2023 season. Tunsil’s in the last year of his contract. He could be franchised for two years. I believe O’Brien better get these deals done.

Q: Do you get to speak to Bill O’Brien? When will you get to ask him what was he thinking with the Hopkins trade? Your story yesterday, and we all agree, we aren’t better now. How does O’Brien think so? — Cynthia H.

A: Cynthia, if I’d spoke to O’Brien about the trade, I would have written a story with his comments. He hasn’t spoken to anyone in the media since the trade. We may not get to question him until his predraft news conference. If that’s the case, a lot of questions will be about the trade.

Q: When will the McNairs get the message this city needs OB gone? This is getting crazier and crazier. — Ruben L.

A: The McNairs are aware of how the fanbase feels about O’Brien, Ruben.

Q: I’ve really enjoyed your columns over the years and appreciate your unbiased reporting and thoughtful analysis. You’ve devoted a couple of Mailbags to O’Brien rants since the disastrous Hopkins trade. I’d be interested in any thoughts into these O’Brien behaviors that haven’t had near the discussion as his unpopular trades and game mismanagement. I’m sure you remember when a heckler yelled at O’Brien at halftime of the Denver game and how O’Brien responded to him. At any job I worked in my 45-year career — and I suspect in your employment, too? — an employee would have been instantly fired for cursing a customer. Seems like tolerance for this behavior indicates a disdain for the organization’s customers at the highest levels. Also, it blew my mind to hear O’Brien played the Aaron Hernandez card in a meeting with DeAndre Hopkins. Hopkins was a player that played all-out, every game, and had never been in any trouble. I’d love to hear what you think the incidents say about O’Brien’s character and what they say about Cal McNair’s standards (or lack thereof) for tolerable corporate behavior. — Vern M.

A: Vern, I wrote, tweeted and talked about O’Brien’s blowup when TMZ showed the video. It didn’t surprise me because O’Brien’s got a terrible temper. Interesting in the video Hopkins is the one pulling him away from the fan as they went into the tunnel to the dressing room. O’Brien has blowups with players, coaches, media and people at the office. As for what Michael Irvin said Hopkins told him, that’s the only time I heard anything like that. I wonder what the context was that O’Brien would bring that up with Hopkins. What caused it? We’ll ask OB about it when we get to interview him. Hopkins said all the right things after the trade and the next day after Irvin reported their conversation.

Q: Is there any way this trade can be rationalized other than Bill has trouble getting along with other people? All I can reason is Bill already has a bad temper and isn’t easy to work with. Then you add on he is now in charge of players’ money. If Hopkins had some contract disagreement, Bill can’t just deflect to the front office now. It’s all him, so coaching becomes very difficult if there is tension over money. This whole thing and the previous history of players leaving like Brandon Brooks, Duane Brown, Jadeveon Clowney boils down to O’Brien can’t get along with top-level NFL talent. Which seems to me to be a detrimental character trait. — Dylan R.

A: Dylan, if Hop didn’t want to get his contract redone, I believe he still would have been here. Brown’s contract dispute was with former GM Rick Smith. As for Clowney, they weren’t going to pay him more than $100 million. As far as O’Brien not getting along with top-level talent, I’d say Watson, Watt and a few others are pretty talented.
 

Texansballer74

Hall of Fame
In what matter?

A defender of the 1st Amendment? Hopefully people have respect for it.

People should respect others by not saying stupid stuff. You don’t say those things the late McNair said nor what O’Brien told Hopkins. He’s suppose to be this highly smart guy, so he could’ve came up with something better to get his point across.
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
People should respect others by not saying stupid stuff. You don’t say those things the late McNair said nor what O’Brien told Hopkins. He’s suppose to be this highly smart guy, so he could’ve came up with something better to get his point across.
I think people should have the right to say whatever they want. McNair used a bad metaphor and BOB meant well but neither one of them meant anything racist by their statements. IMHO

However in today's race baiters/SJW world we currently live in I'm certainly not surprised that things turned out like they did.
 

Texansballer74

Hall of Fame
What does respect (or lack of) have to do with saying something stupid? I challenge you to name 1 person (not a mute) that has never said something stupid
If you don’t understand why, then there’s no point in talking to you. And if you’re following along with the convo, then you should know exactly what I’m talking about.
 

Texansballer74

Hall of Fame
I know exactly what you are talking about. Nice way of avoiding the question which I posed because imho, you said something stupid

And you’re missing the point. I don’t say **** that is borderline racist. But hey typical of you to attempt to spin it on me. If you think im saying something stupid, how about you either by pass my post. Or better yet put me on ignore.
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
And you’re missing the point. I don’t say **** that is borderline racist. But hey typical of you to attempt to spin it on me. If you think im saying something stupid, how about you either by pass my post. Or better yet put me on ignore.
I must be missing the point too, what's the point you're trying to make?

BOB/McNair didn't say anything racist either unless you're all aboard the SJW train.
 

Uncle Rico

Ur apology should be as loud as Ur disrespect was
Those were Irvin’s words. We don’t know how O’Brien addresses them.
Because history of being tactful and PC is on OBriens side? Lol. Nah cmon man. How many examples of being a complete buffoon do you need to draw a conclusion? Bless your heart. That man said all that and then some.

Quack like a duck, walk like a duck...
 

Texansballer74

Hall of Fame
I must be missing the point too, what's the point you're trying to make?

BOB/McNair didn't say anything racist either unless you're all aboard the SJW train.

You might think so but to the African American community it was pretty darn racist. That's why it was such a big uproar. Bill Obrien should'nt have used that Hernandez example either. You're comparing Hop to a gang member who killed people and then committed suicide.

But hey I don't expect you are JB to understand.
 
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steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
You might think so but to the African American community it was pretty darn racist. That's why it was such a big uproar. Bill Obrien should've used that Hernandez example either. You're comparing Hop to a gang member who killed people and then committed suicide.

But hey I don't expect you are JB to understand.
He was comparing Hernandez bringing his baby mommas to practice.

There's plenty of racism out there. No need to make a life of SJW over things that aren't racist. It make people not take things that are truly racist to heart as much as they should.

BTW, I grew up where I was the only white kid around many minorities on a daily basis. You know what I call some of those guys/girls today? Friends and I'm lucky to have them as friends. Some of the best people I've met in my life.
 

Uncle Rico

Ur apology should be as loud as Ur disrespect was
You might think so but to the African American community it was pretty darn racist. That's why it was such a big uproar. Bill Obrien should've used that Hernandez example either. You're comparing Hop to a gang member who killed people and then committed suicide.

But hey I don't expect you are JB to understand.
Do you really expect 70 year old white males to understand an urban term and how it originated and why it’s used?? Lol. It’s why OBrien finds himself in this pickle now. White folks telling black folks what not to be offended by is a pretty old standard in this country and the current climate makes them think it’s a Wayans Bro’s movie.

The bigger picture on this subject isn’t captured by the 20 or so active contributors here on this topic now and especially not by the most vocal ones. The prevailing sentiment universally was that at the least it was racially insensitive use of language and at worst it did originate from a racist agenda.

Good for Nuk to take the high road - OBrien is in his rear view and will just be another one of “those coaches” while he fills his bag with another 50Ms by a team who values who he is first and what he can do secondly.
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
Do you really expect 70 year old white males to understand an urban term and how it originated and why it’s used?? Lol. It’s why OBrien finds himself in this pickle now. White folks telling black folks what not to be offended by is a pretty old standard in this country and the current climate makes them think it’s a Wayans Bro’s movie.

The bigger picture on this subject isn’t captured by the 20 or so active contributors here on this topic now and especially not by the most vocal ones. The prevailing sentiment universally was that at the least it was racially insensitive use of language and at worst it did originate from a racist agenda.

Good for Nuk to take the high road - OBrien is in his rear view and will just be another one of “those coaches” while he fills his bag with another 50Ms by a team who values who he is first and what he can do secondly.
3-2-1

Who could've guessed this post was coming?

Yep, Nuk's gonna get his $$$$. Good for him, He took the high road? We have a very different definition of the high road. Shocking.

BTW, A coach that cares more about him as a person than a player? Let him get hurt and I'm prepared for you to be shocked.
 


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