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FIRE BILL O'BRIEN NOW!!!

steelbtexan

Hall of Fame
FIFY.

This has been OBs story the whole time he has been here.

Correlation is causation in this case.

OB can’t beat a top HC or team. Gets out-coached time and time again. Team never shows up when it matters.

He is dragging Watson down the same path.
It won't matter, if Carl Smith can't teach a QB then there is an issue. Just like with Moon you can change HC's but it didn't matter with Moon and it won't matter with Watson.

BTW, I'm not against firing BOB after the season depending on how the rest of the season goes. BPB/Watson are a bad match.
 

TexansBull

Hall of Fame
It won't matter, if Carl Smith can't teach a QB then there is an issue. Just like with Moon you can change HC's but it didn't matter with Moon and it won't matter with Watson.

BTW, I'm not against firing BOB after the season depending on how the rest of the season goes. BPB/Watson are a bad match.
I see changing head coaches more like when the Colts switched from Jim Mora to Dungy. Or the Broncos from Reeves to Shanahan. Or the (list goes on.)

The goal of a coach is to put a system in place that plays to a players strength and hides their weaknesses. Baltimore has done that. They took a project QB and turned him into a starter.

OB has a system of trying to hammer the square peg into the round hole to try to make things work when it won’t. Harbaugh didn’t do that with Jackson. He went from Flacco to Jackson.

Reid went from Alex Smith to Mahomes.

I know you get it because you agree on seeing the season through and then making an evaluation on OB.

But 6 years of the same stuff. He has one of the most talented QBs in the league and can’t make it work. His system and coaches he has chosen just aren’t working. 20% is on Watson, but 80% is on OB.

Game over man. Game over.
 

Uncle Rico

Ur apology should be as loud as Ur disrespect was
LMAO!! This gif is so applicable. Fans shouldnt be so comfy in their playoff expectation. If the Texans lose Thursday, then losing to NE is almost a foregone conclusion at this point, and that would put them at 6-6 and still having to play twice against the Tacks and I can totally see Denver AND Tampa Bay beating us right now.

What will it be to give O'Brien another pass if he misses the playoffs? Injuries? Talent? Bad GM?

Thank God we have the draft to build ... EEEEEEEEEEEEK!!
 

steelbtexan

Hall of Fame
I see changing head coaches more like when the Colts switched from Jim Mora to Dungy. Or the Broncos from Reeves to Shanahan. Or the (list goes on.)

The goal of a coach is to put a system in place that plays to a players strength and hides their weaknesses. Baltimore has done that. They took a project QB and turned him into a starter.

OB has a system of trying to hammer the square peg into the round hole to try to make things work when it won’t. Harbaugh didn’t do that with Jackson. He went from Flacco to Jackson.

Reid went from Alex Smith to Mahomes.

I know you get it because you agree on seeing the season through and then making an evaluation on OB.

But 6 years of the same stuff. He has one of the most talented QBs in the league and can’t make it work. His system and coaches he has chosen just aren’t working. 20% is on Watson, but 80% is on OB.

Game over man. Game over.
Yep, BOB/Watson are a bad match.
 

Mr teX

Hall of Fame
I see changing head coaches more like when the Colts switched from Jim Mora to Dungy. Or the Broncos from Reeves to Shanahan. Or the (list goes on.)

The goal of a coach is to put a system in place that plays to a players strength and hides their weaknesses. Baltimore has done that. They took a project QB and turned him into a starter.

OB has a system of trying to hammer the square peg into the round hole to try to make things work when it won’t. Harbaugh didn’t do that with Jackson. He went from Flacco to Jackson.

Reid went from Alex Smith to Mahomes.

I know you get it because you agree on seeing the season through and then making an evaluation on OB.

But 6 years of the same stuff. He has one of the most talented QBs in the league and can’t make it work. His system and coaches he has chosen just aren’t working. 20% is on Watson, but 80% is on OB.

Game over man. Game over.
I see changing HC's as nothing but excuses fans use to protect their rooting interests in individual players. See it all over the league...in every league...every year. Fans will continuously make excuses for the player on the field b/c they like said player, but are quick to throw the HC out to pasture & your post says it all.

BoB deserves to be fired if he can't get this team over the hump this year..& by over the hump I mean at least to the divisional round of the playoffs. But I'm under no illusions that the next guy that comes in is the guy that has the magic touch. Most of these guys are recycled anyway & have had varying degrees of success everywhere they've played/coached. So there's no reason to believe that they will fare any better than their predecessor until they actually do it HERE.
 

Mr teX

Hall of Fame
LMAO!! This gif is so applicable. Fans shouldnt be so comfy in their playoff expectation. If the Texans lose Thursday, then losing to NE is almost a foregone conclusion at this point, and that would put them at 6-6 and still having to play twice against the Tacks and I can totally see Denver AND Tampa Bay beating us right now.

What will it be to give O'Brien another pass if he misses the playoffs? Injuries? Talent? Bad GM?

Thank God we have the draft to build ... EEEEEEEEEEEEK!!
That's 1 way to look at it.....they could also win against NE or Indy and be sitting at 7-5....with 4 left against very beatable teams like Tenn, Denver and TB....win 2- 3 out of the next 4 from there and they should be ok to get in the dance with tiebreakers over anyone else that would matter...basically all of the AFC west if it came to that.

just don't see the need to be pessimistic about everything....unless you're 1 of those homers that had them getting to the SB or something.......
 

Mr teX

Hall of Fame
The Rams and 49ers as well, but let's keep doing what we're doing because it's the players, not the coaches.
Lol, Philly ran thru 2 other HC's before Pederson....Same for the Rams who went thru 5 years of Fisherball & another HC & were the dregs of the NFL before McVay arrived ....Same for the 49ers who coincidentally ran thru the same HC Philly had just fired. But by all means lets just fast forward through all that awful so we can hope to get to that great young offensive minded HC in waiting like the Rams and 49ers did with the likes of Jim Tonsula (who?)......Pat Shurmur and Chip Kelly......oh wait.

Cincy fans didn't think it could get any worse under Lewis....Then, Zac Taylor said "hold my beer"...They're on track for the donut this year.

For every 1 of these HC's you see that's had success, I can name double who failed miserably in between.

So be careful what you ask for, you just might get it.
 

TexansBull

Hall of Fame
Lol, Philly ran thru 2 other HC's before Pederson....Same for the Rams who went thru 5 years of Fisherball & another HC & were the dregs of the NFL before McVay arrived ....Same for the 49ers who coincidentally ran thru the same HC Philly had just fired. But by all means lets just fast forward through all that awful so we can hope to get to that great young offensive minded HC in waiting like the Rams and 49ers did with the likes of Jim Tonsula (who?)......Pat Shurmur and Chip Kelly......oh wait.

Cincy fans didn't think it could get any worse under Lewis....Then, Zac Taylor said "hold my beer"...They're on track for the donut this year.

For every 1 of these HC's you see that's had success, I can name double who failed miserably in between.

So be careful what you ask for, you just might get it.
So you wish we still had Casserly and Capers?
 

amazing80

Fire Billy O
Lol, Philly ran thru 2 other HC's before Pederson....Same for the Rams who went thru 5 years of Fisherball & another HC & were the dregs of the NFL before McVay arrived ....Same for the 49ers who coincidentally ran thru the same HC Philly had just fired. But by all means lets just fast forward through all that awful so we can hope to get to that great young offensive minded HC in waiting like the Rams and 49ers did with the likes of Jim Tonsula (who?)......Pat Shurmur and Chip Kelly......oh wait.

Cincy fans didn't think it could get any worse under Lewis....Then, Zac Taylor said "hold my beer"...They're on track for the donut this year.

For every 1 of these HC's you see that's had success, I can name double who failed miserably in between.

So be careful what you ask for, you just might get it.
Do you think the Bengals would want Lewis back? The Rams Fisher?

Don’t be scared of change because it might not work. What we’re doing now isn’t working. It could fail. But it could also improve.
 

Speedy

Yeller Dweller
I see changing head coaches more like when the Colts switched from Jim Mora to Dungy. Or the Broncos from Reeves to Shanahan. Or the (list goes on.)

The goal of a coach is to put a system in place that plays to a players strength and hides their weaknesses. Baltimore has done that. They took a project QB and turned him into a starter.

OB has a system of trying to hammer the square peg into the round hole to try to make things work when it won’t. Harbaugh didn’t do that with Jackson. He went from Flacco to Jackson.

Reid went from Alex Smith to Mahomes.

I know you get it because you agree on seeing the season through and then making an evaluation on OB.

But 6 years of the same stuff. He has one of the most talented QBs in the league and can’t make it work. His system and coaches he has chosen just aren’t working. 20% is on Watson, but 80% is on OB.

Game over man. Game over.
But it doesn't stop at QB. He gets a speedy Lamar Miller and tries to make him a power back. Gets Duke Johnson who excels in the pass game and doesn't use him in the pass game.

Good coaches, sure, they have their systems, their philosophies, but they adapt to the talent they have and learn to take advantage of what they do best. I haven't seen Bill O'Brien do that in 6 years. This guy doesn't put his players in a position to succeed. Sometimes those players do succeed because of their talent, but that's why it's inconsistent. They have to overcome OB putting them in less than ideal situations because he doesn't adapt, he doesn't take advantage of their strengths.
 

Mr teX

Hall of Fame
So you wish we still had Casserly and Capers?
Its neither here nor there who I would or wouldn't like. My point is that the HC is only as good as how the players on the field perform...& there are 53 guys that have a say in that & its always been utterly ridiculous to me to hold a guy on the sideline ultimately accountable for everything that happens within the white lines on Sunday...Especially when the bulk of the work those guys do happens in the 6 days prior to Sunday. They certainly have some culpability in what happens on Sunday's.....how much is up for debate. Its just funny to me how fans think that just switching the HC out is always the answer when the data pretty resoundingly says otherwise. As I stated back in 2014,15 and 16 when talking aobut the qb position, There's a helluva lot more to it than just that 1 position...in this case, this 1 coach.
 

Mr teX

Hall of Fame
Do you think the Bengals would want Lewis back? The Rams Fisher?

Don’t be scared of change because it might not work. What we’re doing now isn’t working. It could fail. But it could also improve.
touché...You are absolutely right......shouldn't be pessimistic that it would fail. But where I'm at with it is that whether it works or not, I won't be on here thinking that we're just 1 player away, like a lot of folks on here were during the qb saga...Likewise I don't think we're just "a HC away" from being serious contenders either.

They wouldn't want Lewis back b/c he was there for a decade...But you know what I do think? I think they don't want to see their team go 0-16. I think they'd take occasionally winning over putting out a **** product for 16 weeks and watching the Browns......Yes, the Browns have a better record than you....& they're only 3-7 lol.
 

thunderkyss

It's good to be me... again.
Staff member
Contributor's Club
BoB deserves to be fired if he can't get this team over the hump this year..& by over the hump I mean at least to the divisional round of the playoffs.
We've been there three times already. That's the hump we can't get over. IMO, if he doesn't get this club to the AFCCG this year it is time to move on.

But I'm under no illusion thinking Cal will move on.
 

steelbtexan

Hall of Fame
But it doesn't stop at QB. He gets a speedy Lamar Miller and tries to make him a power back. Gets Duke Johnson who excels in the pass game and doesn't use him in the pass game.

Good coaches, sure, they have their systems, their philosophies, but they adapt to the talent they have and learn to take advantage of what they do best. I haven't seen Bill O'Brien do that in 6 years. This guy doesn't put his players in a position to succeed. Sometimes those players do succeed because of their talent, but that's why it's inconsistent. They have to overcome OB putting them in less than ideal situations because he doesn't adapt, he doesn't take advantage of their strengths.
Lets see: When players dont succeed it's because of BOB

When players succeed it's in spite of BOB

See how stupid this is. There's no pleasing you guys. Short of a Lombardi.

Lunacy reigns.
 

steelbtexan

Hall of Fame
BoB has been a bad match for a number of QB’s here.

My humble opinion is, if the Texans don’t make the playoffs or are one and done again, I’d like to see what Watson can do with a different HC/OC. BoB’s had his turn with different staff/players/upper management.
You will get that chance someday and I will bet you it will be like with Moon/Glanville and Moon/Pardee. Lots of success against lesser teams and not much playoff success.
 

mws

Waterboy
Exactly. O'Brian & Pardee are pretty much cut from the same cloth. Success in the regular season & nothing in the playoffs.

Head to head comparison of Jack Pardee & Bill O'Brian through 5 years.

Pardee
1990 - 9/7 .563
1991 - 11/5 .688
1992 - 10/6 .625
1993 - 12/4 .750
1994 (after B. Adams dismantled the team) 1/9
---------------------------------
Total Regular Season: 43/31 .581

Playoff Record 1/4 .200

O'Brian
2014 - 9/7 .562
2015 - 9/7 .562
2016 - 9/7 .562
2017 - 4/12 .250
2018 - 11/5 .688
---------------------------------
Total Regular Season: 42/38 .525

Playoff Record 1/3 .250

Pardee did better in the regular season than O'Brian. But he failed in the post season just like O'Brian has. In my opinion that was the reason he was fired just like O'Brian should be.
 

Uncle Rico

Ur apology should be as loud as Ur disrespect was
I'm going back to the tried & true practice of hoping the other teams fall apart.

It's what we do.
well we're off to a good start with Marlon Mack breaking his hand. Now if Brisset can come down with the 24 hour virus and Hoyer the Destroyer of Dreams and Playoff hopes has to start then all of a sudden im whistling through the wheatfields. Colts defense is still stout. Book is out on how to stop OBrien. Will be interesting to see how that offensive side bounces back from the BAL game.
 

steelbtexan

Hall of Fame
Exactly. O'Brian & Pardee are pretty much cut from the same cloth. Success in the regular season & nothing in the playoffs.

Head to head comparison of Jack Pardee & Bill O'Brian through 5 years.

Pardee
1990 - 9/7 .563
1991 - 11/5 .688
1992 - 10/6 .625
1993 - 12/4 .750
1994 (after B. Adams dismantled the team) 1/9
---------------------------------
Total Regular Season: 43/31 .581

Playoff Record 1/4 .200

O'Brian
2014 - 9/7 .562
2015 - 9/7 .562
2016 - 9/7 .562
2017 - 4/12 .250
2018 - 11/5 .688
---------------------------------
Total Regular Season: 42/38 .525

Playoff Record 1/3 .250

Pardee did better in the regular season than O'Brian. But he failed in the post season just like O'Brian has. In my opinion that was the reason he was fired just like O'Brian should be.
And will be eventually if he doesn't win in the playoffs.

Difference is

1. Pardee had HOF Holavak and great Reese getting him talent. The Oilers were regarded as the most talented team in the NFL.

BOB had RS and they have always been regarded as a fringe Playoff team and far from the most talented team in the NFL.
 

steelbtexan

Hall of Fame
well we're off to a good start with Marlon Mack breaking his hand. Now if Brisset can come down with the 24 hour virus and Hoyer the Destroyer of Dreams and Playoff hopes has to start then all of a sudden im whistling through the wheatfields. Colts defense is still stout. Book is out on how to stop OBrien. Will be interesting to see how that offensive side bounces back from the BAL game.
Yep, keep Watson in the pocket and wait for him to do something stupid. I've read this book several times and no this isn't saying Watson's stupid
 

Mr teX

Hall of Fame
Yep, keep Watson in the pocket and wait for him to do something stupid. I've read this book several times and no this isn't saying Watson's stupid
I think its more the pressure with DW4 than keeping him in the pocket. He's shown that he can make plays from the pocket...but the quick pressure does get him rattled (like alot of qbs) & in the games he's looked the worst in his career, Carolina and Baltimore & the Indy playoff game, this has been the case. He's had quick pressure coming from somewhere via a blitz or just a guy getting beat...... & that puts him in hero ball mode. I think its also quite apparent now that in these 3 games where he's looked horrible, he hasn't had WFV & he needs that guy b/c he can win quick....

Seems to me BoB's scheme relies heavily on a credible WR threat & speedster to take the top off the defense to create space underneath for those deep over routes and seam throws we see often when the offense is on. Without that, everything is jumbled up and its hard for DW4 to find windows.
 
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steelbtexan

Hall of Fame
I think its more the pressure with DW4 than keeping him in the pocket. He's shown that he can make plays from the pocket...but the quick pressure does get him rattled (like alot of qbs) & in the games he's looked the worst in his career, Carolina and Baltimore & the Indy playoff game, this has been the case. He's had quick pressure coming from somewhere via a blitz or just a guy getting beat...... & that puts him in hero ball mode. I think its also quite apparent now that in these 3 games where he's looked horrible, he hasn't had WFV & he needs that guy b/c he can win quick....

Seems to me BoB's scheme relies heavily on a credible WR threat & speedster to take the top off the defense to create space underneath for those deep over routes and seam throws we see often when the offense is on. Without that, everything is jumbled up and its hard for DW4 to find windows.
This means KJ Hamlet should be the Rd 2 or 3 pick.
 

Mr teX

Hall of Fame
This means KJ Hamlet should be the Rd 2 or 3 pick.
I like Hamler, but all i've seen him get is free releases..I'd like to see more of him against the press...2, they've already picked up WFV's 5th year option i believe so he's here next year no matter what imo. I also think we need to go defense next year in the 2nd & look for an edge guy.
 

steelbtexan

Hall of Fame
I like Hamler, but all i've seen him get is free releases..I'd like to see more of him against the press...2, they've already picked up WFV's 5th year option i believe so he's here next year no matter what imo. I also think we need to go defense next year in the 2nd & look for an edge guy.
I was unaware that they picked up WFV's 5th yr option. I still think somewhere, (4th rd for me) they should pick up a speedy WR in this deep WR draft. This is a deep draft on the offensive side of the ball, minus the TE position.

Unfortunately the defensive side of the ball isn't as deep except for the CB/S/DT positions. Edge is pretty weak this yr. Although I do like Anae/Lewis/Weaver/Galeai/Roach as 2nd/3rd rd picks.
 

Carr Bombed

Hall of Fame
I think its more the pressure with DW4 than keeping him in the pocket. He's shown that he can make plays from the pocket...but the quick pressure does get him rattled (like alot of qbs) & in the games he's looked the worst in his career, Carolina and Baltimore & the Indy playoff game, this has been the case. He's had quick pressure coming from somewhere via a blitz or just a guy getting beat...... & that puts him in hero ball mode. I think its also quite apparent now that in these 3 games where he's looked horrible, he hasn't had WFV & he needs that guy b/c he can win quick....

Seems to me BoB's scheme relies heavily on a credible WR threat & speedster to take the top off the defense to create space underneath for those deep over routes and seam throws we see often when the offense is on. Without that, everything is jumbled up and its hard for DW4 to find windows.
That's when you need to start using TEs.. They should be your blitz beaters. God knows we've drafted enough of them.
 

steelbtexan

Hall of Fame
That's when you need to start using TEs.. They should be your blitz beaters. God knows we've drafted enough of them.
More often than not they're open. That and the RB's in the flats. This is why I hope they draft a complete RB like Najee Harris or Cam Akers in the draft.
 

Texansballer74

Hall of Fame
Lets see: When players dont succeed it's because of BOB

When players succeed it's in spite of BOB

See how stupid this is. There's no pleasing you guys. Short of a Lombardi.

Lunacy reigns.

You wasn't pleased with RS when he did things to improve this team. And you surely didn't give him his props for certain players that are the core of this team today.

So how are you calling out members for doing the same exact things you've done?

I also thought we were moving away from the personal attacks.

What players have Obrien truly developed?

One more thing, when Obrien calls a great game, he gets a lot of praise from those same guys.
 

ObsiWan

Hall of Fame
Contributor's Club
You could say the same about the Texans. Defense been chasing Deshaun.
Perhaps...
What I saw was this from each when the pocket collapses or no one is "open"...
Jackson picks a hole he thinks he can get to or a guy he thinks he can beat, makes up his mind and goes for it.
For some reason, last game, Watson, who has done that before, never did that. Ran around indecisively. Seems like his marching orders from O'B was to stay in the pocket.

now that's still no excuse for not throwing the ball away when he was trapped. Better intentional grounding than a turnover.
 

Hervoyel

BUENO!
Since Bill O'Brien took over this team I've gone to the bottle!
"You always been drinking Hervoyel"
YEAH BUT FROM CANS!

It's year 6 and this guy is 48-42 (and 1-3 in the playoffs). How in the hell is he still coaching at this level? Worst case scenario for me back when he was hired was that we'd hired Marvin Lewis in Fred Flintstone's body.

It came true.
 

ObsiWan

Hall of Fame
Contributor's Club
More often than not they're open. That and the RB's in the flats. This is why I hope they draft a complete RB like Najee Harris or Cam Akers in the draft.
What I've seen is the TEs block. And once they get beat (and they do) they fail to separate from the scrum and show their QB their numbers.
not sure if that's lack of training or failure to execute what they've been taught.
 

gafftop

All Pro
LMAO!! This gif is so applicable. Fans shouldnt be so comfy in their playoff expectation. If the Texans lose Thursday, then losing to NE is almost a foregone conclusion at this point, and that would put them at 6-6 and still having to play twice against the Tacks and I can totally see Denver AND Tampa Bay beating us right now.

What will it be to give O'Brien another pass if he misses the playoffs? Injuries? Talent? Bad GM?

Thank God we have the draft to build ... EEEEEEEEEEEEK!!
Idiot owner
 

wasntme

Practice Squad
In all BOB's infinite wisdom, he tried to give away the game yet again. Great job of calling a timeout, right after Watson fumbles to give the replay guys even more time to review the call. Luckily, they said there wasn't enough evidence to overturn the call, even though it was clearly a fumble. Thanks BOB!!
 

TexansBull

Hall of Fame
I didn’t watch the end of the game. But I did read the game day thread posts 724 through 771 to know OB did something stupid again.
 

theCATALYST

"Fake" Fan
For any of you people who like to argue that Watson has to go off script to make this offense work - Find Deandre Hopkins comments after the game. Rumor has it he said those big plays of him down field were made up in the huddle with Watson. If you find it - post it. I can’t.
I found this.

Watson said. "You got to give him that credit. He basically checked to those plays and I was on the same page with him."

 

TheKDog

Hall of Fame
Contributor's Club
For any of you people who like to argue that Watson has to go off script to make this offense work -

Find Deandre Hopkins comments after the game. Rumor has it he said those big plays of him down field were made up in the huddle with Watson. If you find it - post it. I can’t.
Even the receivers are going off script
 

TexansBull

Hall of Fame
My problem with Watson is he has converted some fans into Watson only fans and not Texans fans.

After a while you see the posting patterns and can tell they have no interest in the success of the team, only Watson.
 

amazing80

Fire Billy O
My problem with Watson is he has converted some fans into Watson only fans and not Texans fans.

After a while you see the posting patterns and can tell they have no interest in the success of the team, only Watson.
I would argue the divide is created by the anti-Watson group. It's like the rest of us have to try hard to make them see something that is obvious.

Everyone who likes Watson admitted last week he was terrible. The only difference in the argument is the fact we think OB doesn't do enough to make it easier on the OFFENSE. He has this ridiculous scheme that requires everyone to make the exact same read. When one person doesn't see it the same way, the system fails. It's an impossible system to be consistent.
 

ROO

Tweak the offense already!
Considering that some have mentioned that BOB wants Watson to run the conservative "BOB" system because it reduces the chance for injury to Watson - unfortunately, the ultimate effect is that it reduces the Texans' chances of a SuperBowl appearance to 0.01%.

I would rather see the team roll the dice by using a creative system that allows Watson and the offense to play to their strengths - yes, it increase Watson's chances of injury, but it greatly increases the odds of a SuperBowl appearance.
 


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