2012 Draft- 1/4

[rmartin65]

Here is my mock/wishlist so far. It is a little outside the box, but I hope to get some good discussion/feedback from you guys.

1) Melvin Ingram, NT/DE/OLB, South Carolina, 6’2” 275 lbs
Hear me out, hear me out. This year’s class of true, big, nasty NTs sucks. So why not go outside the box? Ingram has been tearing up college football this year- 26 tackles (7.5 TFL), 5.5 sacks, 2 picks, 1 FR and 3(!) Tds. He is sudden, determined, and strong. And do you know who he reminds me of? Jay Ratliff. Ratliff also played end in the SEC, and they have a similar size as well- Ratliff was 6’4” 284 lbs at the combine. Ingram has the frame to add another 20 or so pounds and not lose any agility or quickness.

2) Ryan Broyles, WR, Oklahoma, 5’11” 185 lbs
Like the rest of my fellow mockers, I see the Texans grabbing a WR in the second. And you know what- we really can not go wrong with any of them. They all bring something different to the table. And what Broyles brings to the table is productivity. The guy just makes catches and scores touchdowns. Broyles shows great body control, can return punts, and is a willing blocker.

3)Senio Kelemete, OG, Washington, 6’3” 305 lbs
Kelemete began his career as a DT, and only made the switch to offense a couple years ago. In that time, he has been named a team captain and made the All Pac 12 honorable mention team, as well as earning the team Offensive Weightlifting award in 2010. Kelemete, while still learning the intricacies of playing on offense, has shown the athleticism to be a starter in the NFL.

4) Casey Hayward, CB, Vanderbilt, 5’11” 188 lbs
Hayward has been a real revelation this year for Vanderbilt. 4 picks in as many games, and is also a willing tackler.

5) Philip Blake, OC, Baylor, 6’2” 320 lbs
This dude is a big, strong man. He shows good mobility for his size, and should prove to be a capable starter down the line.

6) Winston Guy, SS/FS, Kentucky, 6’1” 216 lbs
Guy is another player that just makes plays (notice a pattern?). He hits, covers and leads his defense. He also brings versatility to the team, playing at some point in his career both safety spots, OLB, and CB.

7) JK Schaffer, ILB, Cincy, 6’1” 230 lbs
While he certainly does need to add another 10-15 pounds, Schaffer is another one of those players that flat out produce and make big plays when they are needed- both at/behind the line of scrimmage, and in coverage. Schaffer is a perfect fit for a fast, aggressive defense.

 

[badboy]

Am ok with all but your first round. Like that your thinking but reminds me of when we needed a back to increase our run production and most wanted lighter faster back. I wanted a big (Foster or Tate). I could be wrong about NT but I was sure right with RB.

Would you really take Ingram over Ta'amu if both available & T's hand was healed?

 

[rmartin65]

Am ok with all but your first round. Like that your thinking but reminds me of when we needed a back to increase our run production and most wanted lighter faster back. I wanted a big (Foster or Tate). I could be wrong about NT but I was sure right with RB.

Would you really take Ingram over Ta'amu if both available & T's hand was healed?

Normally I would agree: Big NT > Smaller NT

However, Ingram has that "it" factor. When I watch him play, it does not matter who he goes up against- he wins. I think Wade can turn him into a better Ratliff.

Ta'amu- you know I was really high on the guy. I had him as a late first while most had him in the 3rd or second. But, he has not had a good year thus far. We will see how it goes when his hand heals, but we have to remember- it is not like Ta'amu set the world on fire last year. His coming out party was the bowl game, which came after a so-so season. And he has weight problems in the past.

I am not by any means writing Ta'amu off my list. But at this moment, I have Ingram rated higher.

 

[badboy]

Normally I would agree: Big NT > Smaller NT

However, Ingram has that "it" factor. When I watch him play, it does not matter who he goes up against- he wins. I think Wade can turn him into a better Ratliff.

Ta'amu- you know I was really high on the guy. I had him as a late first while most had him in the 3rd or second. But, he has not had a good year thus far. We will see how it goes when his hand heals, but we have to remember- it is not like Ta'amu set the world on fire last year. His coming out party was the bowl game, which came after a so-so season. And he has weight problems in the past.

I am not by any means writing Ta'amu off my list. But at this moment, I have Ingram rated higher.

Good points on Ta'amu and why I went with Poe especially in later round. Just remember you can come back to the bigger NT wagon when you are ready. (LOL) Will the "it" factor transcend to NFL? If anyone can Wade will. WIll he start over Cody? Helpful if he could gain weight & not lose speed.

 

[rmartin65]

Good points on Ta'amu and why I went with Poe especially in later round. Just remember you can come back to the bigger NT wagon when you are ready. (LOL) Will the "it" factor transcend to NFL? If anyone can Wade will. WIll he start over Cody? Helpful if he could gain weight & not lose speed.

I like Poe as well. But this idea intrigued me a lot, so I went with it.

I hope the "it" factor translates. And I think it has a pretty good chance too- he plays in the SEC, which, while I do think is overhyped, is a damn good conference. He is as athletic as they come, and is a very smart player. As far as weight goes, look at the posted picture- there is plenty of room for growth there without adding unnecessary fat.

 

[Wolf6151]

1. I heard you out and read all of it, the answer is still Hell No. At 275 lbs. he sounds like a 4-3 DE or possibly a 3-4 OLB but we've got depth there and don't need another. Even if he played 3-4 DE, to small, we've got starters there and don't need a 1st round backup. Jay Ratliff was the exception, not the rule, and he hasn't been that effective. Ratliff had 2 good yrs. and it seems the league has either figured him out or his light frame just can't take all that pounding.

2. No, he might be a good WR but why not take a tall athletic one like Jones or Criner before a guy who's 5'11. Height is one advantage that WR's have over CB's, why give that advantage back to the defense.

3. I don't know anything about Kelemete but I like the position chosen. We need some O-line starter/depth help. Good pick.

4. Heyward, I like this guy and almost chose him for my mock but I don't think there's any way he's still around in the 4th, probably gone in the 2nd round.

5. Blake, I like the pick but have read that he's a project. I have no problem with a project in the 5th or later as long as they've got future starter potential. Good pick.

6. Guy, again good pick but I don't think he's still around in the 6th. He's got size and coverage skill that I think will translate well at FS. The fact that he kicks Barber off the team is outstanding.

7. Schaffer, don't know anything about him maybe he could be on the PS while he adds weight. I'd like ILB to be a higher priority with Demeco's injury and lack of production.

Overall, good players chosen in the 3rd-6th, but those first 2 I just couldn't pick. They don't fit our needs. I'm with BB big NT > little NT, 310 lbs. min. weight.

 

[bah007]

I love Ingram. But with his athleticism, I'm thinking he looks best as a 34 OLB who could drop down and put his hand down in some situations.

Hell, I would draft him, but not as a NT.

 

[beerlover]

I like the pics

 

[beerlover]

I like Poe as well. But this idea intrigued me a lot, so I went with it.

I hope the "it" factor translates. And I think it has a pretty good chance too- he plays in the SEC, which, while I do think is overhyped, is a damn good conference. He is as athletic as they come, and is a very smart player. As far as weight goes, look at the posted picture- there is plenty of room for growth there without adding unnecessary fat.

lets talk about this. Where is he being projected & what position?

 

[Ckw]

This isn't an insult; more of an observation.

But I just love how everyone acts like the know what they are talking about but then when the draft rolls around, hardly anyone's predictions actually come true.

 

[badboy]

This isn't an insult; more of an observation.

But I just love how everyone acts like the know what they are talking about but then when the draft rolls around, hardly anyone's predictions actually come true.

Beerlover picked JJ WATT to Texans in first before draft. Rmartin65 pick Trindon Holliday in the 6th and I picked Brandon Harris in the second. Not an insult but sounds like sometimes they do. And those are off top of my head. How you doing?

 

[Ckw]

Beerlover picked JJ WATT to Texans in first before draft. Rmartin65 pick Trindon Holliday in the 6th and I picked Brandon Harris in the second. Not an insult but sounds like sometimes they do. And those are off top of my head. How you doing?

Nice! Well, more than you guys, I was talking about the "analysts". Like I said, it was just an observation. It's just interesting to read/hear people argue about a subject that they have absolutely no way of knowing for sure what teams are going to do. Best example of this being Mel "I Have Better Hair Than You" Kiper.

Me? I've been better. Recovery from this surgery sucks.

 

[badboy]

Nice! Well, more than you guys, I was talking about the "analysts". Like I said, it was just an observation. It's just interesting to read/hear people argue about a subject that they have absolutely no way of knowing for sure what teams are going to do. Best example of this being Mel "I Have Better Hair Than You" Kiper.

Me? I've been better. Recovery from this surgery sucks.

You post in thread about mock drafts and never said anything about "analysts". If I say the girl you are with appears overly large for her bikini but no insult meant, would you feel offended if she was your wife? See where I'm coming from? Mel Kiper and the other guys on ESPN & NFL and many mocks & blogs have "absolutely no way" of knowing what teams are gonna do but people enjoy that. Isn't not knowing part of the reason we watch sports?
You just came across like one of the poster we see constantly blasting mocks but always having to post their comments.

On a personal note, I truly hope you heal quickly from whatever surgery you have. The thought of an operation makes me squirm.

 

[rmartin65]

1. I heard you out and read all of it, the answer is still Hell No. At 275 lbs. he sounds like a 4-3 DE or possibly a 3-4 OLB but we've got depth there and don't need another. Even if he played 3-4 DE, to small, we've got starters there and don't need a 1st round backup. Jay Ratliff was the exception, not the rule, and he hasn't been that effective. Ratliff had 2 good yrs. and it seems the league has either figured him out or his light frame just can't take all that pounding.

2. No, he might be a good WR but why not take a tall athletic one like Jones or Criner before a guy who's 5'11. Height is one advantage that WR's have over CB's, why give that advantage back to the defense.

3. I don't know anything about Kelemete but I like the position chosen. We need some O-line starter/depth help. Good pick.

4. Heyward, I like this guy and almost chose him for my mock but I don't think there's any way he's still around in the 4th, probably gone in the 2nd round.

5. Blake, I like the pick but have read that he's a project. I have no problem with a project in the 5th or later as long as they've got future starter potential. Good pick.

6. Guy, again good pick but I don't think he's still around in the 6th. He's got size and coverage skill that I think will translate well at FS. The fact that he kicks Barber off the team is outstanding.

7. Schaffer, don't know anything about him maybe he could be on the PS while he adds weight. I'd like ILB to be a higher priority with Demeco's injury and lack of production.

Overall, good players chosen in the 3rd-6th, but those first 2 I just couldn't pick. They don't fit our needs. I'm with BB big NT > little NT, 310 lbs. min. weight.

1) I knew it would be controversial, but the next time you watch South Carolina, just think about it. Try to project it. I too like the big NT idea, but sometimes players outside of the usual mold can play the position just as well, if not better.

2) I think size gets overrated a lot here. Sure 6'4 is nice, but a WRs job is to get open and catch the ball. Broyles does that. He (arguably) does that better than anyone in the nation.

7) Isnt it nice that our later round picks are not locks to make the team?!! I forgot to add that he is a very good special teams player, as that was his role his freshman year.

I love Ingram. But with his athleticism, I'm thinking he looks best as a 34 OLB who could drop down and put his hand down in some situations.

Hell, I would draft him, but not as a NT.

lets talk about this. Where is he being projected & what position?

I am reading that Ingram is a projected late 2nd round. I see him being a big riser though. A lot of these drafts/rankings have too many players at certain positions going early- it simply wont go down that way. Different teams have needs at different positions, and they wont all take BPA.

As for position, I see him projected as a DE or OLB. Both make sense, but I think he can be a matchup nightmare at Nose when playing in a Wade coached D, surrounded by talent like Williams, Watt, Barwin, Reed, S=Cushing, etc. Too much talent right there, and too much will.

This isn't an insult; more of an observation.

But I just love how everyone acts like the know what they are talking about but then when the draft rolls around, hardly anyone's predictions actually come true.

Oh, I dont claim to be an expert by any means. I just watch what college ball I can, and make my observations.

Rmartin65 pick Trindon Holliday in the 6th

Well, it looks like that was a mistake. But I predicted it! For the record, I had Watt last year and Barwin 2 years ago. 3 years running, lets see if I can make it 4!

 

[Ckw]

You post in thread about mock drafts and never said anything about "analysts". If I say the girl you are with appears overly large for her bikini but no insult meant, would you feel offended if she was your wife? See where I'm coming from? Mel Kiper and the other guys on ESPN & NFL and many mocks & blogs have "absolutely no way" of knowing what teams are gonna do but people enjoy that. Isn't not knowing part of the reason we watch sports?
You just came across like one of the poster we see constantly blasting mocks but always having to post their comments.

On a personal note, I truly hope you heal quickly from whatever surgery you have. The thought of an operation makes me squirm.

You are taking it way too offensively. Sensitive much? Comparing making a statement about "mock drafters" always acting like they know what they are talking about even when their predictions are routinely proven wrong to going up to someone's girlfriend and calling them fat is pretty ridiculous. As an outsider, I just found it funny that everyone was blasting the OP for his first round selection and basically were calling him a moron for not going along with the consensus that a fatty at NT is the way to go. Things no one could ever expect occur in the draft all the time and picks like the OP has in the first happen all the time.

Debate it all you want, but I just found it humorous for some of the posters to talk about this like they knew exactly what would happen and anyone that suggests an opinion that's "outside the box" is an *****.

But anyway if you still want to continue this, let's do so in a pm. I don't want to take away from the point of this thread as it is an interesting read. I probably should have never posted what I did and just kept the thoughts to myself.

 

[Ckw]

1) I knew it would be controversial, but the next time you watch South Carolina, just think about it. Try to project it. I too like the big NT idea, but sometimes players outside of the usual mold can play the position just as well, if not better.

2) I think size gets overrated a lot here. Sure 6'4 is nice, but a WRs job is to get open and catch the ball. Broyles does that. He (arguably) does that better than anyone in the nation.

7) Isnt it nice that our later round picks are not locks to make the team?!! I forgot to add that he is a very good special teams player, as that was his role his freshman year.




I am reading that Ingram is a projected late 2nd round. I see him being a big riser though. A lot of these drafts/rankings have too many players at certain positions going early- it simply wont go down that way. Different teams have needs at different positions, and they wont all take BPA.

As for position, I see him projected as a DE or OLB. Both make sense, but I think he can be a matchup nightmare at Nose when playing in a Wade coached D, surrounded by talent like Williams, Watt, Barwin, Reed, S=Cushing, etc. Too much talent right there, and too much will.



Oh, I dont claim to be an expert by any means. I just watch what college ball I can, and make my observations.


Well, it looks like that was a mistake. But I predicted it! For the record, I had Watt last year and Barwin 2 years ago. 3 years running, lets see if I can make it 4!

Cool stuff man, and I really appreciate the polite response. I really enjoy all of your commentaries (that goes for all of you mock draft gurus). Like I said, it was just an outside observation that I probably should have kept to myself.

Keep the conversation going. It's a good, fun read.

 

[steelbtexan]

I like the Ingram pick. Especially if BoBBy decides to re-sign foster and let MW walk.

With that said drafting the top WR on the board. (Floyd, Jeffery, Blackmon is the way that I would go. Talent wise) They should be able to make the biggest impact on the team next yr.

 

[beerlover]

I am reading that Ingram is a projected late 2nd round. I see him being a big riser though. A lot of these drafts/rankings have too many players at certain positions going early- it simply wont go down that way. Different teams have needs at different positions, and they wont all take BPA.
Well you know me I'm always into trading down to increase flexability & move around boards to aquire targeted players. How much is the question?
As for position, I see him projected as a DE or OLB. Both make sense, but I think he can be a matchup nightmare at Nose when playing in a Wade coached D, surrounded by talent like Williams, Watt, Barwin, Reed, S=Cushing, etc.
I could see Watt switching inside, then having Ingram & Smith as your DE's. Acutally he is the same size as Antonio when he came out, so this may be his ideal positional fit & in other roles could back-up Mario @ OLB. That is a huge plus when one pick can add mutlipe facets, improve athelticism give you quality starting depth, like Watt a pick that keeps on giving you better results..

Your outside the box may not be so outside of reality after all

 

[rmartin65]

I like the Ingram pick. Especially if BoBBy decides to re-sign foster and let MW walk.

With that said drafting the top WR on the board. (Floyd, Jeffery, Blackmon is the way that I would go. Talent wise) They should be able to make the biggest impact on the team next yr.

I could get behind this idea, but I think that there is more than enough talent at WR this year to grab an instant impact player in the 2nd. Except Blackmon. I dont know what it is, but I dont like the guy. Great college receiver, but , in my opinion, a so-so pro one.

Your outside the box may not be so outside of reality after all

I would support a trade down as well. This draft is really, really strong, especially in the first 3 rounds. If the Texans could land 4-6 picks in those 3 rounds, that is 4-6 players that should make an impact that first year.

 

[steelbtexan]

I could get behind this idea, but I think that there is more than enough talent at WR this year to grab an instant impact player in the 2nd. Except Blackmon. I dont know what it is, but I dont like the guy. Great college receiver, but , in my opinion, a so-so pro one.



I would support a trade down as well. This draft is really, really strong, especially in the first 3 rounds. If the Texans could land 4-6 picks in those 3 rounds, that is 4-6 players that should make an impact that first year.

I know what bothers you about Blackmon. Although he has great hands and runs good routes he's going to run a slow 40. This means he could be another Jerry Rice or another RaShaun Woods. Very risky pick.

Depending on where the Texans pick/who's available trading down would be an option. If a JJ Watt type pick is there when the Texans pick I would just take him. 10 yr starters are hard to find and because this draft is so deep they still should be able to find 2 more starters and another impact player like Marquis Maze or Jarius Wright in rds 4-7.

What I like about your mock is that it focuses on talent over need.

Talent should always win out over need. When it doesn't you end up with OkOye over Willis and KJ over Bryant type picks and then the next yr WR is at the top of your need list.

I'm just starting my research and plan on doing a mock next week. I'm looking forward to your response.

 

[rmartin65]

I know what bothers you about Blackmon. Although he has great hands and runs good routes he's going to run a slow 40. This means he could be another Jerry Rice or another RaShaun Woods. Very risky pick.

Depending on where the Texans pick/who's available trading down would be an option. If a JJ Watt type pick is there when the Texans pick I would just take him. 10 yr starters are hard to find and because this draft is so deep they still should be able to find 2 more starters and another impact player like Marquis Maze or Jarius Wright in rds 4-7.

What I like about your mock is that it focuses on talent over need.

Talent should always win out over need. When it doesn't you end up with OkOye over Willis and KJ over Bryant type picks and then the next yr WR is at the top of your need list.

I'm just starting my research and plan on doing a mock next week. I'm looking forward to your response.

Possibly, but I am not an "OMG 40 time!" kind of guy. It is a valuable attribute, but certainly not the end all be all. I think it is his general demeanor on the football field. I get the prima donna vibe from him, and I dont want that on the Texans.

Thank you for your kind words about the mock. I look forward to reading yours in the coming days.