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Texans 1.3 Pick Derek Stingley Jr.

Number19 said:
Is that what you would call it? I'm simply saying Caserio will not give the public an honest answer.

What has he said so far? I'll have to see what has been posted.
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He ain't gonna give anything away and I would certainly hope not!
He is still in the midst of this draft.
 
CloakNNNdagger said:
Despite anatomic reduction, approximately 20% of athletes will have radiographic evidence of arthrosis approximately two-years post-surgery. Longer follow-up is needed to see if the arthrosis becomes limiting and requires more intervention.

I have only come across a couple examples of athletes in their teens post lisfranc repair, without long-term follow up. What seems to be consistent with all repairs is that at least 20% already demonstrate significant x-ray findings of degenerative osteoarthritis by the short period of 2 years. With delay of repair, that number would be expected to quickly increase. Stingley's history reflects repeated injury and long delay in addressing it surgically. An important point as far as age is that degenerative osteoarthritis cannot be reversed (maybe sometimes it can only be slowed), so that the earlier that it is established, the sooner it becomes a functional problem.

When I post about injuries, I try to take prognosis from my own experience, the literature experience and the logical expected progressions. No one, including me, has the power to predict an ultimate outcome with absolute certainty...........including this one.
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So it sounds like there is a better than 50% chance he could be good for at least 2 years.
 
I like his potential and talent (very much seems like a Lovie pick), but I would have passed with a lisfranc injury in his history. Especially when considering the jinxed nature of this franchise with that particular injury and their history with drafting a player with a serious injury that could greatly impact their style of play.

It's like buying a new car that has already been in a serious accident.

Why even gamble with 1.3 when this team has so many holes that a number of other players in that spot would have also filled one of them?
 
It's apparent that Stingley's Lisfranc injury is not of the same degree or failure mode as Matt Schaub's, so comparing the two wouldn't be accurate. The problem is there's little available information on Stingley's injury. We have a couple of clues like his timeframe until operation and recovery, and that's all. I will say it's probably impossible for anyone to run a 4.3 or 4.4 forty with screws in their foot.
 
Hervoyel said:
I take little comfort in medical authorities clearing someone of an injury in the NFL. It's not like so much of the rest of the world when it comes to the rest of your career and your life. Also since 2001 or so we've been watching injuries wreak havoc with the Texans. Got your franchise LT to watch David Carr's back? The surgery went well and he's going to be practicing before the end of camp! Found your franchise RB and gave him a new contract? The doctors say his knee surgery went well and he should be back next season! Got another future franchise LT prospect? Career ending knee destruction. Bargain-basement Pro-Bowl QB? I'm sure he'll be back to normal next year when his Lisfranc injury has healed. Cushing was a series of injuries and don't get me started on the Bennie Joppru "saga". None of it is any of their individual faults and in most cases it could never have been predicted. It just has anyone who watched it a whole lot gun shy about injuries and so drafting one coming off an injury at 3 overall makes me nervous. If it works out he's maybe the best player in the draft you say? Well, tell me how often things "work out" in Houston football please.
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Sounds like we're due.
 
Brisco_County said:
It's apparent that Stingley's Lisfranc injury is not of the same degree or failure mode as Matt Schaub's, so comparing the two wouldn't be accurate. The problem is there's little available information on Stingley's injury. We have a couple of clues like his timeframe until operation and recovery, and that's all. I will say it's probably impossible for anyone to run a 4.3 or 4.4 forty with screws in their foot.
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Schaub's injury was November 2011 and he had 2 good seasonal stats but after the first in 2012 [4,000 yds] he deteriorated rapidly. How is it apparent that Stingley's injury is not to the degree of Matt's? A surgeon has informed us that running a 40 and game play is not the same. You said yourself little available information and you seem to depend on his dash. At some point Stingley's radiological reports will become possible to review and knowing CnnnD he will provide.

matt schaub nfl stats - Google Search

www.google.com
 
badboy said:
Schaub's injury was November 2011 and he had 2 good seasonal stats but after the first in 2012 [4,000 yds] he deteriorated rapidly. How is it apparent that Stingley's injury is not to the degree of Matt's? A surgeon has informed us that running a 40 and game play is not the same. You said yourself little available information and you seem to depend on his dash. At some point Stingley's radiological reports will become possible to review and knowing CnnnD he will provide.

matt schaub nfl stats - Google Search

www.google.com
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Stingley sprained his Lisfranc in August 2021 and continued playing on it. He aggravated it in Game 4, then had surgery on September 26. This is a completely different failure mode than Matt Schaub's injury, which may suggest a lesser severity. Schaub could not put any weight on his foot post-injury and for six weeks after surgery, resulting in muscle atrophy. He then had follow up surgery to remove screws, while one screw was left in permanently. Source: https://tinyurl.com/zj365wup

As with any ligament, there are multiple types and degrees of tears. Lisfranc injury | Radiology Reference Article

We don't know what type Stingley suffered, but a safe-money bet is that it was not comparable to Schaub's. While Stingley has not revealed details about it or his surgery, it's reasonable to assume we'd know about any follow-up surgeries to remove hardware. And again, if he required permanent screws like Schaub, or if his legs atrophied like Schaub admitted, even straight line speed would be affected. There's no way -- less than seven months after surgery -- he'd recover enough to run a sub 4.5 forty with muscle atrophy and a screw interfering with the flexibility of his foot.

We have a forum member who endured a similar Lisfranc tear as Schaub's. I believe it was Marcus. He said it took well over a year before his foot felt like a foot again. That doesn't sound comparable to someone running a sub 4.5 seven months after surgery.

Note that I don't consider his forty time a certification of health, it's just evidence we're not dealing with a Matt Schaub scenario.
 
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Double Barrel said:
I like his potential and talent (very much seems like a Lovie pick), but I would have passed with a lisfranc injury in his history. Especially when considering the jinxed nature of this franchise with that particular injury and their history with drafting a player with a serious injury that could greatly impact their style of play.

It's like buying a new car that has already been in a serious accident.

Why even gamble with 1.3 when this team has so many holes that a number of other players in that spot would have also filled one of them?
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This is me. If there was ever a time to go with the safest possible pick it's probably this draft. You realistically need almost everything. At 1.3 you can take the best of probably half a dozen positions and nobody is going to think twice about it. Need a corner, Gardner's right there. Want an OT? There they are. Edge rusher? Go for it. Hell get crazy and make a case for the S or LB you want. Just don't pick the guy whose career has a chance to be shorter and limited because he suffered an injury that comes with the strong potential for a degenerative condition! If you look at the Texans like they are in the beginnings of a rebuild you grab players that have the potential for long careers. You know like OL and DL so they are still playing well when you get later, shorter length career guys at more vulnerable positions.
 
My son is crazy mad at the Texans. He wanted Sauce as well and couldn't believe it.
"I HATE STINGLEY" and threw the remote, heading downstairs.
I told him to get back up here, pick up the remote, like the pick and shut up.
At 15, I can't begin to tell you how much he loved my approach.

Here's my take though. If it were me, I probably would have taken Sauce there if I had to have a CB.
Simply because he was probably the safer pick. However, if Stingley is truly healthy again, it's a good pick.
I still would have gone OT right there though, but I'm a build inside out kind of guy, unless they are unicorns.
 
Brisco_County said:
Stingley sprained his Lisfranc in August 2021 and continued playing on it. He aggravated it in Game 4, then had surgery on September 26. This is a completely different failure mode than Matt Schaub's injury, which may suggest a lesser severity. Schaub could not put any weight on his foot post-injury and for six weeks after surgery, resulting in muscle atrophy. He then had follow up surgery to remove screws, while one screw was left in permanently. Source: https://tinyurl.com/zj365wup

As with any ligament, there are multiple types and degrees of tears. Lisfranc injury | Radiology Reference Article

We don't know what type Stingley suffered, but a safe-money bet is that it was not comparable to Schaub's. While Stingley has not revealed details about it or his surgery, it's reasonable to assume we'd know about any follow-up surgeries to remove hardware. And again, if he required permanent screws like Schaub, or if his legs atrophied like Schaub admitted, even straight line speed would be affected. There's no way -- less than seven months after surgery -- he'd recover enough to run a sub 4.5 forty with muscle atrophy and a screw interfering with the flexibility of his foot.

We have a forum member who endured a similar Lisfranc tear as Schaub's. I believe it was Marcus. He said it took well over a year before his foot felt like a foot again. That doesn't sound comparable to someone running a sub 4.5 seven months after surgery.

Note that I don't consider his forty time a certification of health, it's just evidence we're not dealing with a Matt Schaub scenario.
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He and his dad speak to his injury and the circumstances around it. Like you alluded to, i find it remarkable he was able to play 3 games on it before he felt like he had to shut it down.

 
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Brisco_County said:
It's apparent that Stingley's Lisfranc injury is not of the same degree or failure mode as Matt Schaub's, so comparing the two wouldn't be accurate. The problem is there's little available information on Stingley's injury. We have a couple of clues like his timeframe until operation and recovery, and that's all. I will say it's probably impossible for anyone to run a 4.3 or 4.4 forty with screws in their foot.
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The hardware was removed 4 months post his lisfranc surgery.
 
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Mollywhopper said:
Dude can flat out ball..
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Yes he can. But hope Nick has double checked the medial. At 100% he has as much pure talent and ability as a guy like Walker. He is a freak. I grade this a B+ till we see how he is in OTAs and mini camp. It's an A+ if he looks as good as he has in school

CloakNNNdagger said:
The hardware was removed 4 months post his lisfranc surgery.
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Very true. All he has to do is play like his freshman year and I will be fine
 
ArmyBengal said:
My son is crazy mad at the Texans. He wanted Sauce as well and couldn't believe it.
"I HATE STINGLEY" and threw the remote, heading downstairs.
I told him to get back up here, pick up the remote, like the pick and shut up.
At 15, I can't begin to tell you how much he loved my approach.

Here's my take though. If it were me, I probably would have taken Sauce there if I had to have a CB.
Simply because he was probably the safer pick. However, if Stingley is truly healthy again, it's a good pick.
I still would have gone OT right there though, but I'm a build inside out kind of guy, unless they are unicorns.
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Too much sauce. Didn’t want to say this being a Duck, but KT is also going to kill it!
What we are dealing with is an old school approach. What did Dylan say “times they are a changing”? Hang in there, we’re Houston Texans :logo:
 
Late to the party. I don’t like the pick because I get visions of Kevin Johnson dancing on IR in my head with stingley. Hope I’m wrong. But hearing “2 years ago he was the best player” doesn’t mean Jack squat today.

Back when fat Travolta traded Hopkins for Johnson, David Johnson was a great player 2 years ago.
 
My take is he has injury concerns that could go either way. I get that. What is not going away is the emphasis on passing in the NFL. Of all the approaches to defend the pass…edge rushers, defensive schemes, DT’s collapsing pockets, good CB’s etc., seems to me the only thing that has proved the most effective has been having a generational CB to shut down the QB’s favorite target Mano a Mano. Good CB’s are just placeholders otherwise we would be talking about stopping the run, not the pass. I can really understand taking a shot on DS. Other teams were lined up to take their shot on him. He’s a risk but he can take this D to another level and it’s only those levels that go the fartherest in the playoffs. Really nothing to lose IMO unless never ending mediocrity is your thing.
 
Texansphan said:
I am alluding to the possibility of injury and/or teams scheming away from him.
Potential like that doesn't evaporate overnight.
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Did teams scheme away from Sauce? I agree that potential doesn't evaporate. Still doesn't change the fact that he looked like 2 different players in '19 and after '19.
 
Marcus said:
https://www.chron.com/sports/texans...ingley-Bomani-Foxworth-NFL-Draft-17136652.php
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Good story

Stingley graduated high school a semester early and was allowed to practice during LSU’s Fiesta Bowl preparation. Even though he was just 17 and supposed to still be in high school, Stingley covered future first-round picks Ja’Marr Chase and Justin Jefferson in those practices and when they were done, Aranda declared Stingley to be the team’s best defensive back, even though he wasn’t eligible to play in a game yet.
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steelbtexan said:
Well then, it's a good thing Lovie is making the picks.
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steelbtexan said:
Lovie is in charge.
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Clearly, he is. If you listened to Caserio PC on Thurs evening this was made pretty clear. Although I don't think it was intentional. The way Nick described the atmosphere in the draft room, and the back and forth discussion between coaches of who to take at #3 and how Lovie would have been fine and agreeable if they went in another direction and selected a different player. Surprised Lovie was engaging in such an activity an hour before the pick. I thought Lovie would have a definite plan of what he wanted to accomplish. This behavior suggests that is not the case.

So my problem with this is Lovie is placating and appeasing his coaches and kowtowing to them to make the picks. This is very much a recipe for the making of average and ordinary. This is much like Kubiak's operation and his Amobi Okoye kind of drafts. I do know Jacksonville, Tennessee and Indianapolis have gotten a lot better and the Texans have a long way to go trying to catch them.
 
Peter King:

profootballtalk.nbcsports.com

FMIA: Inside the Baltimore Ravens' Room at 2022 NFL Draft - Peter King, NBC Sports

Peter King's Football Morning In America column leads with a peek inside the Baltimore Ravens' room at 2022 NFL Draft. Plus more news, notes from weekend.
profootballtalk.nbcsports.com profootballtalk.nbcsports.com

6. Rookies of the Weekend. Offensive: Chris Olave, New Orleans. Love the pick, love the player. Precise route-runner, going to a team that wants to throw a lot and he’ll be ready to go opening day. Defensive: Derek Stingley, Houston. In five years, we’ll look back at this draft and think Stingley was the best pick of all.
 
6. Rookies of the Weekend. Offensive: Chris Olave, New Orleans. Love the pick, love the player. Precise route-runner, going to a team that wants to throw a lot and he’ll be ready to go opening day. Defensive: Derek Stingley, Houston. In five years, we’ll look back at this draft and think Stingley was the best pick of all.
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profootballtalk.nbcsports.com

FMIA: Inside the Baltimore Ravens' Room at 2022 NFL Draft - Peter King, NBC Sports

Peter King's Football Morning In America column leads with a peek inside the Baltimore Ravens' room at 2022 NFL Draft. Plus more news, notes from weekend.
profootballtalk.nbcsports.com profootballtalk.nbcsports.com
 
badboy said:
Allegedly someone in Texans war room called Kayvon Thibodeaux and told him that he would be the pick at 3.

www.newsbreakapp.com

Texans were going to draft Kayvon Thibodeaux but panicked and screwed it up - NewsBreak

The Houston Texans supposedly told Kayvon Thibodeaux they were going to take him at No. 3. Though Kayvon Thibodeaux landed in a terrific spot with the...
www.newsbreakapp.com www.newsbreakapp.com
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They had four damn months to get ready for pick #3. They are 15 minutes from making the pick and they still don't know who they are going to take. This does not bode well for the Texans, now or in the future. There is no REAL leadership in the building. I want an adult who can orchestrate a 4-year plan. I'm not sure there is a 1-year plan. Looks like they are having a difficult time living in the moment.
 
Doesn't say anything necessarily about them not knowing who they wanted. Just looks like they were taking a last minute swing to try and generate interest to trade down a couple or so spots and when Detroit hurried their pick in they simply said ok and took Stingley.. who for all we know was who they would've still wanted had they been able to pull off said trade down.
 
TheRealJoker said:
Peter King:

profootballtalk.nbcsports.com

FMIA: Inside the Baltimore Ravens' Room at 2022 NFL Draft - Peter King, NBC Sports

Peter King's Football Morning In America column leads with a peek inside the Baltimore Ravens' room at 2022 NFL Draft. Plus more news, notes from weekend.
profootballtalk.nbcsports.com profootballtalk.nbcsports.com

6. Rookies of the Weekend. Offensive: Chris Olave, New Orleans. Love the pick, love the player. Precise route-runner, going to a team that wants to throw a lot and he’ll be ready to go opening day. Defensive: Derek Stingley, Houston. In five years, we’ll look back at this draft and think Stingley was the best pick of all.
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Wow ! Awright Mr King I hope that crystal ball is right on target !
 
Mollywhopper said:
Doesn't say anything necessarily about them not knowing who they wanted. Just looks like they were taking a last minute swing to try and generate interest to trade down a couple or so spots and when Detroit hurried their pick in they simply said ok and took Stingley.. who for all we know was who they would've still wanted had they been able to pull off said trade down.
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All I know is earlier in the day Stingley became the betting favorite at 1-3. So I have my doubts this story is true. But even if it is, Lovie still got his guy.
 
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