TheMatrix31
Hall of Fame
Osweiler had a couple bad throws but he was set up to fail by our terrible coaching staff.
Osweiler was not the problem Thursday night.
Osweiler was not the problem Thursday night.
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Official Brock Osweiler MVP Watch Thread!
- Thread starter 76Texan
- Start date
Hervoyel
BUENO!
ROO
Tweak the offense already!
Osweiler wasn't all that bad.
I actually think he was better in this game than the 2 previous games.
Like others above have said, it was the $&@$#$@ gameplan that was the problem.
According to OBrien, he "has gotta do a better job of coaching". No sh!T.
Here are the throws. Was he really all that bad? A few WTFs, but not many.
http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-game-...708013/Every-Brock-Osweiler-throw-from-Week-3
If you didn't know the outcome of the game, you certainly wouldn't think the game was a 27-0 shellacking. Well, except for the lack of touchdowns and plays on the Patriots side of the field.
It wasn't Osweiler that killed the drives, it was OB and Godsey running up the damn middle almost every running play. Come on coaches, get your heads out of your asses!
I actually think he was better in this game than the 2 previous games.
Like others above have said, it was the $&@$#$@ gameplan that was the problem.
According to OBrien, he "has gotta do a better job of coaching". No sh!T.
Here are the throws. Was he really all that bad? A few WTFs, but not many.
http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-game-...708013/Every-Brock-Osweiler-throw-from-Week-3
If you didn't know the outcome of the game, you certainly wouldn't think the game was a 27-0 shellacking. Well, except for the lack of touchdowns and plays on the Patriots side of the field.
It wasn't Osweiler that killed the drives, it was OB and Godsey running up the damn middle almost every running play. Come on coaches, get your heads out of your asses!
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Texansballer74
The Marine
Agreed with all of this. I would also throw in the fumbles on the special team that put the Patriots on some extremely short fields. Crazy how the entire team was out of sync on a big time game.
I just can't wrap my mind on this one. I truly thought after the owner got in that ash last season. We wouldn't see garbage like this ever again. Hmm I stand corrected.
We were winning
Brisco_County
Apples and roadmaps
Aaron Wilson of Chron.com wrote that the Patriot's capitalized on Osweiler's tendency to lock onto his target, mainly Hopkins.
Link
The purpose of drafting Will Fuller was of course to open up the long ball, but also draw coverage away from Hopkins. So the Patriots playing two deep safeties to prevent the long ball was the exact reaction that O'Brien was intending teams to have.
Well, that relaxed coverage on Hopkins can't be exploited to its potential if the QB is telegraphing when he intends to throw to Hopkins. Notice that Hopkins was never wide open, and required elite level circus catches to win his one-on-one contests.
Our receiving yards cannot be just Hopkins and Fuller. More of the short underneath throws are necessary to remain unpredictable and to keep time of possession. Unpredictability is still required in this Hopkins/Fuller pick-your-poison offense.
That video reveals two fatal flaws in the offense.
The first is what I already mentioned above. An example is at 1:23. Osweiler is acting predetermined to throw to a blanketed Hopkins instead of making his reads and throwing to an uncovered Fiedorowicz right in front of him.
The second is, as ROO said (and PDS tweeted), the running game. Those numerous completions in the video don't reveal an imploding offense because it wasn't strictly the passing game that was killing drives. It was running up the middle on 3rd down, or Miller missing the outside lane.
If the running game is impotent, then fine, that was the gamble we took on new linemen and a new RB. They'll work on it next offseason. But if this is the running game we're stuck with, then Osweiler needs to study Flacco and learn to love the dump off pass.
Link
The purpose of drafting Will Fuller was of course to open up the long ball, but also draw coverage away from Hopkins. So the Patriots playing two deep safeties to prevent the long ball was the exact reaction that O'Brien was intending teams to have.
Well, that relaxed coverage on Hopkins can't be exploited to its potential if the QB is telegraphing when he intends to throw to Hopkins. Notice that Hopkins was never wide open, and required elite level circus catches to win his one-on-one contests.
Our receiving yards cannot be just Hopkins and Fuller. More of the short underneath throws are necessary to remain unpredictable and to keep time of possession. Unpredictability is still required in this Hopkins/Fuller pick-your-poison offense.
That video reveals two fatal flaws in the offense.
The first is what I already mentioned above. An example is at 1:23. Osweiler is acting predetermined to throw to a blanketed Hopkins instead of making his reads and throwing to an uncovered Fiedorowicz right in front of him.
The second is, as ROO said (and PDS tweeted), the running game. Those numerous completions in the video don't reveal an imploding offense because it wasn't strictly the passing game that was killing drives. It was running up the middle on 3rd down, or Miller missing the outside lane.
If the running game is impotent, then fine, that was the gamble we took on new linemen and a new RB. They'll work on it next offseason. But if this is the running game we're stuck with, then Osweiler needs to study Flacco and learn to love the dump off pass.
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Osweiler seemed nervous, especially early on. Wasn't calm in the pocket. Watch his feet; lots of tap dancing early on.
Also, as Brisco said, he was not sharp at all. Too many throws off target.
Not sure how you fix nervous feet. Maybe it was just being on the big stage because I don't remember seeing that much of it in the first two games.
Also, as Brisco said, he was not sharp at all. Too many throws off target.
Not sure how you fix nervous feet. Maybe it was just being on the big stage because I don't remember seeing that much of it in the first two games.
Same Video
I don't know if I can agree with the nervous feet. On the very first throw I can see some jitters, but it looks like he decided to throw a particular pass, then after seeing something (maybe the defender undercut the receiver, I don't know) decided to throw it a different way. He threads the needle on that pass.
Every other throw, his feet look fine. He appears to go through his reads, make up his mind, then throw the ball. Look at 0:50.... he goes through his progression at least two times before dumping it off.
The next pass is the INT. Maybe he's starring down Hopkins. I think he's watching one of the three defenders on Hopkins. The guy underneath & inside. If he were to track Hopkins, the ball would have gone somewhere else. But he sat down in an underneath zone, Hopkins breaks inside... that's the kind of read really good QBs make (imo). He wasn't counting on Collins (a fourth defender) being in play. In hindsight it looks like a stupid throw, especially from the angle in that video. However, if you've got the game on your DVR, look at that throw from the QBs view. Osweiler throws that ball just before Hopkins breaks. It looks beautiful.... until Jamie Collins comes out of nowhere & picks it off.
You see #55 jump at the ball. He can't make a play on it. He's also watching Osweiler. But Brock puts enough zip on it that it's past him before he can react. Collins is much deeper & has more time to react.
I really don't see how anyone can watch that video & come away with more negatives than positives. Osweiler looks good. A few mistakes. But not a "Oh we made a terrible decision giving him $37M" kind of performance.
Have you guys ever stop to think that Osweiler has been hurting himself and the running backs (and the O-line) because his play fake is so pathetic?
Osweiler is telegraphing the play every time he touches the ball.
The defense can tell whether it's going to be a run or a pass very early; it becomes an advantage to the opponents.
Osweiler is telegraphing the play every time he touches the ball.
The defense can tell whether it's going to be a run or a pass very early; it becomes an advantage to the opponents.
We talked about it before. & it may be relevant. However, in this game the LBs were playing the run regardless. Deep middle was open all day & we had very few routes that exploited it.
He had a big throw to Fuller & Strong that were caught. Then he had a couple to Fuller & Strong that weren't. But that's about it, 4 maybe 5 throws to the middle of the field. Should have been a dozen in the 1st qtr when they saw that cover two.
xtruroyaltyx
Hall of Fame
So far so good for the Broncos. Whether or not OS ends up being a better player than Simien or Lynch is yet to be seen.....
But so far the Broncos ended up saving money and their qb is still making plays for them.
But so far the Broncos ended up saving money and their qb is still making plays for them.
Broncos were able to keep the rest of the team together. Texans had to downgrade the OL so they could afford Brock
xtruroyaltyx
Hall of Fame
xtruroyaltyx
Hall of Fame
How did the Texans downgrade the OL to get Brock?
They still have 3 of 5 starters. A lot of people liked Allen and some even figured he'd be an upgrade over Brooks. And Nick Martin was hurt.
But that aside, a significant upgrade at qb, plus significant upgrades at the offensive skill positions should be able to AT LEAST offset the loss Brandon Brooks and Ben Jones. Especially when you brought in a good free agent pick up and a high draft pick there.
TripleTap
Dead Wood
Savage would be a "significant upgrade at qb" and would not have cost what OZ cost. On the other hand, we got OZ expecting him to be great (on TV they said he called himself a "mini Peyton" down in Houston). Lord bless and keep us. Maybe he turns out great, but he's got miles to go before he gets there.
Well I was thinking of losing Brooks and Ben Jones as a downgrade. Also didn't really address Duane getting injured and older.
Brisco_County
Apples and roadmaps
The Pittsburgh Steelers are receiving a worse stomping by a rookie quarterback than what New England gave to Houston. It's currently 34-3, and Pittsburgh had a full week to prepare for this game.
Does that mean Ben Roethlisberger is over the hill? Are they no longer an AFC championship contender?
Osweiler has about 10 starts under his belt. As long as he's progressing, I'm not worried about the QB position.
Texecutioner
Hall of Fame
How dare you provide some reality in here and mention another team having a horrible performance in week 3. You mean there is another QB with even higher expectations than Brock and he is having a bad game? No way.
Thank you "pay me Rick'
I know Smith is never to blame, but a real GM would not panic buy.
Remember Brock is not a ROOKIE in the league. Anyone that is going to be a competent QB in the NFL should at least know how to look off a receiver. I said during the NE game that we are seeing the real Brock on the field. I don't think Savage is the answer. Mobility covers up so many shortcomings. Savage is slow. He seems to have a much quicker release than Brock though.
This regime will keep Brock on the field until they get fired 4 or 5 years down the road. Rick will still be here because he doesn't have anything to do with this.
The Texans are the team that ?somebody? built.
Watching the new QB of the Dallas Cowboys showing more moxie, skill, mobility, accuracy, poise, better mechanics, and....than our MVP savior .
i guess I am in the reality stage of grief.
The good thing it is the final stage.
Be Texans.
This regime will keep Brock on the field until they get fired 4 or 5 years down the road. Rick will still be here because he doesn't have anything to do with this.
The Texans are the team that ?somebody? built.
Watching the new QB of the Dallas Cowboys showing more moxie, skill, mobility, accuracy, poise, better mechanics, and....than our MVP savior .
i guess I am in the reality stage of grief.
The good thing it is the final stage.
Be Texans.
You're delusional about Savage, and never heard anything remotely like the 2nd part of your statement. Gotta link?
Texecutioner
Hall of Fame
And that's why it's so frustrating to watch.
On the other hand, the rookie QB performed such a good faked hand-off to Blount that the entire Texans front players, including the LBs and the SS, were chasing after ghost toward one side line while he (Brissett) scooted freely down the other.
Not only that, all three DBs were busy themselves with the receivers, freezing their own FS.
Not a single one Texan player was aware of the play fake.
And here, people still try to downplay the importance of it.
NUKdemboys
Practice Squad
Hilarious thread.
NUKdemboys
Practice Squad
Exactly. I think Dak is too black for this team.
We honestly get what we deserve for deciding to pay Oz without any decent starting games under his belt.
PapaL
Loose Screw
Looking at Brock's throws from that game, a few mistakes but nothing Earth shattering that we couldn't recover from (ala Hoyer playoffs). We were caught with our pants down this game. Game plans and play calling were not adjusted as the game progressed. Isn't that suppose to be our thing? They took the deep ball away and we didn't figure out to use other options until the game was well out of hand.
I'd like to see less shotgun and more under center; especially with a FB on the field. Hopefully that helps our blocking open some holes for the run game. It honestly cannot be any worse.
I'd like to see less shotgun and more under center; especially with a FB on the field. Hopefully that helps our blocking open some holes for the run game. It honestly cannot be any worse.
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So you're playing the race card? Osweiler sucks because he's white?
xtruroyaltyx
Hall of Fame
I haven't gone back and looked at the game but watching the first 2.5 quarters live it seemed like the Texans were just running up the middle just simply trying to blow their Dline back way too often. Not a lot of movement, not a lot of angles being exploited.
On the radio Seth Payne and Someone were talking about how you can't make a consistent running game like that in the NFL. I don't know if you can do that on any level TBH though it is easier at lower levels and gets a lot tougher as you move up.
The Texans should diversify their running game. Or I dunno....actually do what their offense is best at. Not sure how OB looks at his team and decides they are going to have a gameplan designed around power runs and then decides to do it out of the pistol with no FB for many of the snaps.
Which people are you talking about?
That's my biggest take away from the game. Nothing any of those players could have done (except hold on to the ball on Kick Returns) would have changed the outcome of that game. Our coaches were riding the brake the whole time.
As if they were waiting for our defense to get a turnover before we try to score.
Or they didn't want to upset Belichick.
Texansballer74
The Marine
Coach might need to scale it back a bit until Brock fully has a grasp of his complex system. Coach suppose to be a QB guru who knows how to get the best out of that position as well as help limit the turnovers. So far he is not doing that. He also might need to take a page out of Belichick, Pederson and Garrett quarterback playbooks. Those three played to their young QB's strength and didn't allow them the luxury of total control of their offenses. I know Brock is smart but he is still a young QB. So please dial it down some and bring him along slowly when it comes to this complex offensive scheme.
I really don't think the offense is too complicated for Brock. He's shown the ability to operate well within the system.
Yeah, the interception was totally on him... the defense caught us sleeping & made a great play. That's going to happen.
The problem is the predictable, run, run, pass on third & long play calling. You're setting him up to fail.
& we're not good enough, across the board to make up for our penalties & negative plays when they go gutless & call draws on every third & 10+ situation.
Texecutioner
Hall of Fame
Pretty much this ^^^^
Texansballer74
The Marine
Agreed
It seemed as if the game against New England was too fast and too much for him. It also seemed as if he was thinking too much and set on going to certain players instead of going through his progressions.
I don't know man lol I'm just thinking if coach could manage him like he did with Fitzpatrick and the rest of the QB's we've had. Just until he see he's fully ready.
TxnsJuggernaut
Veteran
A compatent coaching staff knows how to utelize talent. Not saying that Brock is the next coming of insert your great QB------->(
but it helps to have coaches that utilize thier strengths. At some point in the season we can determine whether BO has done that.
Brock is for sure a work in progress but even some of the top QB's like Ben Roethlisberger have stunk it up. At this time Brock is showing some bad habits but let's not bet against him just yet.
Our loss to the Pats was as much about the coaching staff as it was the players on the field.
Texansballer74
The Marine
This is exactly what I was eluding to with my comment. Dial it down a notch and play to Brocks strength.
The last thing I want is for "coach" to manage him like he did Fitzpatrick. That play calling Thursday night is exactly how O'b managed Fitzpatrick. Works fine against the worse defenses in the league, but a pretty good defense like the Patriots will keep you on your side of the 50.
Osweiler was not the problem. Handcuffing him was.
Don't dial down anything, let him play.
Brisco_County
Apples and roadmaps
No one tell Rick Smith or Romeo Crennel.
That post gets an A+++++. I see a bright future for you here on Texans Talk.
NUKdemboys
Practice Squad
Troll thread
NUKdemboys
Practice Squad
Not looking to be your favorite poster of the month. Just here to talk texans. Get off my nutz
Just curious... Are you looking for discussion? Because every time someone replies to your posts, you tell them to get off your nutz.
& if you're just wanting to post stupid **** with no follow up conversation, that's fine. Just need to know.
It would be helpful if you'd put something in your sig like, "Don't mind me, I'm just posting stupid **** to post stupid ****." Then no one would try to engage you in conversation about the stupid **** you post.
Just trying to help.
Actually his sig should be "Get off my nutz!"
PapaL
Loose Screw
We should all use that as our sig; "Get off my nutz!"
TxnsJuggernaut
Veteran
Thanks for the racist and ignorant post. I can use your post as an example of a racist asshat and teach my grandchildren how ignorant comments like yours are!
I sorry
I don't think he meant to quote you in that