Patriots under investigation

[WolverineFan]

Haven't heard this. Can you elaborate?

PFT Link

Neither team was punished. Instead, a league wide memo was sent informing teams that this sort of thing was "frowned upon".

The difference is, when the NFL found out about CAR and MIN they told the teams to stop it. When they found out about NE they set a trap intending to catch them in the act. Once "caught" they hired an "impartial" investigator who had recently been paid millions of dollars by the NFL for winning their concussion case.

 

[toronto]

The Panthers and Vikings were both caught on camera tampering with game balls during games this season....neither team was punished.

The Wells Report cleared the Pats organization of any wrongdoing and placed the blame at "probably" the feet of Tom Brady and the two equipment guys. The NFL then gave out the harshest team punishment in recent memory to an organization its investigation team had just cleared.

The NFL also stated that the Pats impeded the investigation and did not fully cooperate...which is completely false as stated by the Wells Report. They fully complied with the investigation and the only thing they refused was a fifth follow-up interview for one of the equipment guys.

The NFL also suspended Brady despite zero evidence that he took part in the acts. In all probability is not evidence of guilt. Brady got a bigger suspension for being linked to this controversy than Ray Rice got for KO'ing his wife on camera.

There was a clear agenda in this case against the Patriots and the league is punishing the Pats organization for not bending over and taking one for the team.

Great points. Repped.

 

[JB]

PFT Link

Neither team was punished. Instead, a league wide memo was sent informing teams that this sort of thing was "frowned upon".

The difference is, when the NFL found out about CAR and MIN they told the teams to stop it. When they found out about NE they set a trap intending to catch them in the act. Once "caught" they hired an "impartial" investigator who had recently been paid millions of dollars by the NFL for winning their concussion case.

It's a reach to call the two incidents related. Warming footballs on a cold day may have been frowned upon but show me a rule that implicitly addresses that.

The Patriots were caught tampering the balls they played with in direct disregard for stated rules. Then they tried to cover up their wrong doing. If there was no explicit rule about air pressure standards and if they wouldn't have tried to hide what they did I doubt a big deal would have been made of it.

 

[WolverineFan]

It's a reach to call the two incidents related. Warming footballs on a cold day may have been frowned upon but show me a rule that implicitly addresses that.

It is a rule...

Vice president of officiating Dean Blandino said on NFL Network on Monday that once the league noticed, both the Panthers and Vikings were warned of the rule against using a heater on the football to make it easier to handle during a game. Blandino also said the league will remind all teams that the practice is not allowed.

Neither team was punished thereafter. Just warned.

The Patriots were caught tampering the balls they played with in direct disregard for stated rules. Then they tried to cover up their wrong doing. If there was no explicit rule about air pressure standards and if they wouldn't have tried to hide what they did I doubt a big deal would have been made of it.

What did they cover up exactly? They fully cooperated with the investigation, as stated by the Wells Report. The only thing they refused was a 5th follow-up interview for one of the equipment guys. The organization was cleared of wrongdoing in the report. What did they cover up?

 

[JB]

It is a rule...

Vice president of officiating Dean Blandino said on NFL Network on Monday that once the league noticed, both the Panthers and Vikings were warned of the rule against using a heater on the football to make it easier to handle during a game. Blandino also said the league will remind all teams that the practice is not allowed.

Neither team was punished thereafter. Just warned.




What did they cover up exactly? They fully cooperated with the investigation, as stated by the Wells Report. The only thing they refused was a 5th follow-up interview for one of the equipment guys. The organization was cleared of wrongdoing in the report. What did they cover up?

ok, I didn't see anything in the link you posted that he had talked on NFL Network. Both teams were warned during the game. It was both teams, not one team trying to get an advantage over the other. Maybe that's the difference.

The Patriots covered up the fact that anyone in their organization had any knowledge of it. Clearly that is not true

 

[Playoffs]

The NFL then gave out the harshest team punishment in recent memory to an organization its investigation team had just cleared.

Ignorance is not an excuse. -- NFL standard, see ATL GM and noise and others.

They fully complied with the investigation and the only thing they refused was a fifth follow-up interview for one of the equipment guys.

"The area that the Patriots weren’t willing to cooperate with was a second interview with the Jim McNally after the text conversations were discovered." They refused to even inform McNally of the request.

"Fully complied"≠"refused"​

The NFL also suspended Brady despite zero evidence that he took part in the acts.

"Jastremski mentioned speaking to Brady the previous night, saying the quarterback knew McNally was stressed out by needing to deflate the balls.

'That is not circumstantial evidence,' Wells said. 'That is two of the participants in a scheme discussing what has taken place.'"

Brady got a bigger suspension for being linked to this controversy than Ray Rice got for KO'ing his wife on camera.

Which football games were called into question by Rice battering his girlfriend?

In all probability is not evidence of guilt.

That is the standard in the NFL...

Regarding the term 'more probable than not' Wells said: “I believe the conclusions have been proven. I used the words “more probable than not” because that is what’s in the rules.”

There was a clear agenda in this case against the Patriots and the league is punishing the Pats organization for not bending over and taking one for the team.

"And all of this discussion that somewhere people at the league office wanted to put some kind of hit on the most iconic, popular player in the league, the real face of the league, it just doesn't really make any sense. It's really a ridiculous allegation."

The Panthers and Vikings were both caught on camera tampering with game balls during games this season....neither team was punished...

Ballboys on both sides were warming the balls on the sidelines of a cold game. Where is the competitive imbalance? BTW, warming the balls increases the PSI.


Eli Manning, Mike Pereira talk about integrity of game after Deflategate: http://foxs.pt/1EC8Uoj

If you think this is the one and only time they deflated footballs after they had been checked and approved by game officials you're naive. It's like the guy who got a DWI on the first only single ever time he drank and drove.

Rick Gosselin: Here's another Deflategate question for Tom Brady ... how long has this cheating been going on?

 

[WolverineFan]

ok, I didn't see anything in the link you posted that he had talked on NFL Network. Both teams were warned during the game. It was both teams, not one team trying to get an advantage over the other. Maybe that's the difference.

The Chargers were caught tampering balls in 2012. They were clearly trying to gain a competitive advantage over their opponent. They received a $20k fine.

The league has proven in the past that they don't care about this. Teams were not really punished in any fashion after being caught. Until everybody's least favorite team got "caught" and a PR nightmare blew up in the NFL's face. Then they really cared. And they made sure they made a statement in response. Just like they made a statement after the Ray Rice thing blew up in their face and they tried to scapegoat Ray Rice in response.

Like I said before, I'm not here to defend the Patriots. I'm just here to call out the NFL on their hypocritical bullshit.

 

[silvrhand]

The Panthers and Vikings were both caught on camera tampering with game balls during games this season....neither team was punished.

The Wells Report cleared the Pats organization of any wrongdoing and placed the blame at "probably" the feet of Tom Brady and the two equipment guys. The NFL then gave out the harshest team punishment in recent memory to an organization its investigation team had just cleared.

The NFL also stated that the Pats impeded the investigation and did not fully cooperate...which is completely false as stated by the Wells Report. They fully complied with the investigation and the only thing they refused was a fifth follow-up interview for one of the equipment guys.

The NFL also suspended Brady despite zero evidence that he took part in the acts. In all probability is not evidence of guilt. Brady got a bigger suspension for being linked to this controversy than Ray Rice got for KO'ing his wife on camera.

There was a clear agenda in this case against the Patriots and the league is punishing the Pats organization for not bending over and taking one for the team.

I'm glad you were there and witnessed all this right? Because you know right?

 

[JB]

Like I said before, I'm not here to defend the Patriots. I'm just here to call out the NFL on their hypocritical bullshit.

Of course they're full of hypocritical bullshit, always have been and always will be.


Not excusing them but hopefully they will use this as a learning tool and get a little better about how they conduct business but I wouldn't count on it with nothing more than public opinion to hold them accountable

 

[WolverineFan]

I'm glad you were there and witnessed all this right? Because you know right?

Yea you're going to have to expand on this. Except for my final point, everything I stated in that post is a fact.

Of course, on that final point, it's my opinion that the NFL "in all probability" has an agenda regarding this decision.

 

[CloakNNNdagger]

Once this mess is concluded, the only fair and decently reliable solution I see going forward is to have a a pregame/half-time standard football bank that the refs check and distribute to both teams from the same pot. Let the QBs within reason have a say in the standards, and let the games begin.

 

[ObsiWan]

Once this mess is concluded, the only fair and decently reliable solution I see going forward is to have a a pregame/half-time standard football bank that the refs check and distribute to both teams from the same pot. Let the QBs within reason have a say in the standards, and let the games begin.

Umpires in MLB prep each and every baseball used during a game. I see no reason why the officiating crew for each game cannot be responsible for the condition of footballs in much the same way.

 

[JB]

Umpires in MLB prep each and every baseball used during a game. I see no reason why the officiating crew for each game cannot be responsible for the condition of footballs in much the same way.

They were, until Brady and P Manning led the charge to change in 2007

 

[infantrycak]

Interesting reading. Come to find out the NFL loves the Patriots, won't do anything to them,..they'll take back what they did give them, move the suspension to when it's best for them.......and at the same time they are the most hated team in the league.

What did they cover up exactly? They fully cooperated with the investigation, as stated by the Wells Report. The only thing they refused was a 5th follow-up interview for one of the equipment guys. The organization was cleared of wrongdoing in the report. What did they cover up?

The Wells Report most certainly does not say they fully cooperated. The 5th number is spin. NFL officials talked to the equipment guy 3 times before Wells was appointed. Kraft specifically asked Wells to start the investigation independently as if that hadn't happened. Wells conducted 1 in person interview of the guy early on. After going through the texts, etc. he wanted to do a 2nd in person interview and the Pats refused. Also Brady's phone wasn't handed over.

I guess you mean Belichick was cleared. The organization employed 3 people who in the course of their work routinely broke the rules and therefore got fined and lost picks. That's the opposite of being cleared.

 

[JB]

Also Brady's phone wasn't handed over.

He would've have accepted a list of communications, but Brady refused that, so it wasn't fear of Giselle nude pics that drove that lack of cooperation

 

[Marshall]

The Panthers and Vikings were both caught on camera tampering with game balls during games this season....neither team was punished.

The Wells Report cleared the Pats organization of any wrongdoing and placed the blame at "probably" the feet of Tom Brady and the two equipment guys. The NFL then gave out the harshest team punishment in recent memory to an organization its investigation team had just cleared.

The NFL also stated that the Pats impeded the investigation and did not fully cooperate...which is completely false as stated by the Wells Report. They fully complied with the investigation and the only thing they refused was a fifth follow-up interview for one of the equipment guys.

The NFL also suspended Brady despite zero evidence that he took part in the acts. In all probability is not evidence of guilt. Brady got a bigger suspension for being linked to this controversy than Ray Rice got for KO'ing his wife on camera.

There was a clear agenda in this case against the Patriots and the league is punishing the Pats organization for not bending over and taking one for the team.

You are confused about what constitutes evidence.

Bottom line is WHO BENEFITTED?

 

[disaacks3]

The Chargers were caught tampering balls in 2012. They were clearly trying to gain a competitive advantage over their opponent. They received a $20k fine.

Factually inaccurate. They were fined for not turning over a towel promptly. Link

The towels were provided by Gorilla Gold, and includes a wax-based substance similar to the tacky surface of gloves players wear. The league conducted a three-week investigation, and found the towels were widely used and gave no competitive advantage. However, they won’t be allowed on game days the rest of the season, and the league’s competition committee may review their use later.

Link

You have Brady in a keeper league or what?

 

[Double Barrel]

PFT Link

Neither team was punished. Instead, a league wide memo was sent informing teams that this sort of thing was "frowned upon".

The difference is, when the NFL found out about CAR and MIN they told the teams to stop it. When they found out about NE they set a trap intending to catch them in the act. Once "caught" they hired an "impartial" investigator who had recently been paid millions of dollars by the NFL for winning their concussion case.

The INTEGRITY of the sport has been compromised!!!!

It dawned on me last night that "integrity" is not the same as "ethical". They might try to protect the "integrity" at all costs, but they are such an unethical league sometimes that it often reeks of hypocrisy that clearly has one agenda in serving the bottom line.

But, I do not look for sports leagues to be an ethical barometer. Too bad more Americans don't feel the same way. We no longer have ethical leaders in this country, and it certainly should not be left to entertainers to fill that void.

Colt balls may have been underinflated due to a bad guage and/or weather.

Like Playoffs quoted:

Ignorance is not an excuse. -- NFL standard, see ATL GM and noise and others.

He would've have accepted a list of communications, but Brady refused that, so it wasn't fear of Giselle nude pics that drove that lack of cooperation

What happens if he's like me and deletes e-mails and texts after they are read? What is to turn over at that point?

 

[ObsiWan]

What happens if he's like me and deletes e-mails and texts after they are read? What is to turn over at that point?

I thought the investigating team just wanted his phone records to see who communicated with whom and when it happened.

Wells should have just gone to the NSA.

 

[steelbtexan]

Yea you're going to have to expand on this. Except for my final point, everything I stated in that post is a fact.

Of course, on that final point, it's my opinion that the NFL "in all probability" has an agenda regarding this decision.

In all probability I will be repping you.

 

[infantrycak]

Like Playoffs quoted:

Not an ignorance issue. The teams initially set the pressure, the refs adjust them until they say they are good to go and then the teams aren't supposed to alter them. The Patriots altered them. The Colts did not.

The NFL does not impose ANY obligation on the teams to retest/reinflate during the game.

What happens if he's like me and deletes e-mails and texts after they are read? What is to turn over at that point?

What's that have to do with anything? If you've got nothing, you say "I've got nothing" not "NO." Happens every day in litigation. And as JB points out, deleting has nothing to do with the records being available rather than the content.

 

[Marshall]

Factually inaccurate. They were fined for not turning over a towel promptly. Link

Link

You have Brady in a keeper league or what?

That's got to be it.

 

[steelbtexan]

Not an ignorance issue. The teams initially set the pressure, the refs adjust them until they say they are good to go and then the teams aren't supposed to alter them. The Patriots altered them. The Colts did not.

The NFL does not impose ANY obligation on the teams to retest/reinflate during the game.



What's that have to do with anything? If you've got nothing, you say "I've got nothing" not "NO." Happens every day in litigation. And as JB points out, deleting has nothing to do with the records being available rather than the content.

How do you know that the Colts did not?

Brady was advised by the NFLPA not to turn over his cell phone/records.

Great job, DeMaurice.

 

[TD]

Not an ignorance issue. The teams initially set the pressure, the refs adjust them until they say they are good to go and then the teams aren't supposed to alter them. The Patriots altered them. The Colts did not.

The NFL does not impose ANY obligation on the teams to retest/reinflate during the game.

Yeah...too easy. I don't know why "intent" is such a hard concept grasp in this situation.

 

[Playoffs]

Stop whining, Boston; the Pats got what they deserved
|USA Today

(Excuses self to dry heave. Returns, dabbing at mouth and apologizing.) Uh, I don’t know; maybe because of crap like this?

I’m sorry. You’re not 2pac. It’s not Boston against the world. No one is “out to get you.” No one “set you up.” This was a mess entirely of the Patriots own making, but now we’re supposed to believe it’s some vast conspiracy that one will day have its own Seymour Hersh story debunking the facts and fiction.

Ugh...

 

[infantrycak]

How do you know that the Colts did not?

Well if they did, they did a **** ass job of it since only 4 of 12 balls were under at all and those in tiny amounts as disaack has listed.

Brady was advised by the NFLPA not to turn over his cell phone/records.

Great job, DeMaurice.

Great job if he had a guilty client.

 

[Playoffs]

Ed Bouchette, Pittsburgh Post-Gazette (2014 McCann winner)

I thought it was appropriate, considering Brady did not cooperate fully. As for the Patriots, those two employees represent the team, and they conspired to alter the footballs. In light of the Patriots being convicted once before (for Spygate), it upped the ante, as far as I saw, and made this punishment the right thing.

I thought [coach Bill] Belichick should have been punished somehow. The man who supposedly knows everything under his watch knew nothing? I don’t get that. But I thought the Brady punishment was right.

Moving forward, I think the league has to change how the footballs are handled for games. I think the NFL ought to take control of all the footballs, and everybody should have to throw the same ball. Have the league get some volunteers to get the sheen off and both sides play with the same ball. What other sport allows individual players to control the condition of the ball in play?

Vito Stellino, Florida Times Union (1989 McCann winner)

I don’t understand why Belichick wasn’t suspended. Ignorance is not supposed to be an excuse. Roger Goodell suspended Sean Payton, and he tossed Rich McKay off the competition committee for three months. I find it amazing Brady was doing this under his nose and Belichick had no idea. Belichick is accountable for his team. He wasn’t suspended for Spygate, and he skates here? I don’t understand that. With the culture of cheating in New England, did that let Brady think he could get away with it?

I probably would have gone six to eight games for Brady.

Another chapter in the nightmare year of the NFL.

As far as for Goodell, it was a good move.

They’ve got to do something about the balls in the future. Some league official is going to have to make sure nobody walks off with the balls between the time they’re tested and the game starts.

One other thing that bothers me. The Ted Wells report praised the ref, Walt Anderson, for his diligence. Wells praises Anderson, and Anderson lets the balls disappear before the game? That is puzzling. There’s a lot of puzzling things here.

John McClain, Houston Chronicle (2006 McCann winner)

I believe if Brady had come out and said he did it, and taken it all upon himself, it might have been one game. I still believe, after the appeal, he will not be suspended four games. It does not affect my opinion at all that he is one of the four greatest quarterbacks I have ever seen. And I will vote for him on the first ballot for the Hall of Fame. He deserves it.

I thought what the league gave them was harsh. This sets a precedent. Everybody wondered if Goodell would be tough on [Patriots owner Robert] Kraft. It reminded me when you’re a Little League parent, coaching your son, and he does something wrong and you’re going to be tougher on your son than you would be on the other players. Goodell with Kraft, that was like the Little League coach being tougher on his kid. The rest of the league saw it, and it sets a precedent.

Rick Gosselin, Dallas Morning News (2004 McCann winner)

I think Tom’s image has taken a hit. I don’t think it’ll keep him out of the Hall of Fame, but I do think it will jeopardize first ballot. You want the biggest names in the sport to come across as heroes. Tom came across as less than that. I expected four games. If [Cleveland GM] Ray Farmer got four for violating the integrity of the game for texting his coaches during games, Brady has to get four. You’ve got to be consistent. Farmer’s actions didn’t cross the white lines. Brady’s actions did.

I understand the big [sanction] against the team. It was the second offense. If there’s no Spygate, maybe this time it’d be a $100,000 fine and a fourth-round pick.

Now, I think the league will hire yet another person to work at the game, with a regulator to measure the pressure in the balls, and then measure the balls and walk them out to the field.

 

[Marshall]

Stop whining, Boston; the Pats got what they deserved
|USA Today

BoSton has a unique perspective. That of the guilty party.

 

[ChampionTexan]

You have Brady in a keeper league or what?

His screen name could possibly provide a clue.

 

[Double Barrel]

Pretty much what Thorn and I have been asking (which is different than the actual act of breaking rules, rather it is questioning the point of the rule itself):

Let Brady Deflate the Ball

For the past nine years, NFL quarterbacks have been allowed to doctor game balls in all sorts of ways. So why does air pressure have to be regulated?

The most important question about Deflategate has yet to be answered: Why does the NFL even have a rule about how much air can be in a football? At the behest of Tom Brady and Peyton Manning, the league in 2006 started allowing teams to bring their own footballs to games. Quarterbacks break in these balls how they see fit. Essentially, it became legal to doctor the footballs.

Why can’t the amount of air in a ball be part of that doctoring? There’s no reason to regulate such a thing.

Brady prefers a slightly deflated football. So let him play with a slightly deflated football. Science already provides natural parameters here. Deflating a football is not like, say, using steroids. To put it in crude, elementary terms: A player on steroids could theoretically receive more and more injections and have his testosterone levels climb higher and higher. A quarterback can only deflate a football so much. Eventually the ball becomes completely flat. No quarterback would choose to play with a completely flat ball. So why does the NFL have to tell Tom Brady how much (or little) air can be in the football when the laws of physics already do?

Just about every recent rules change in professional football has centered around making the game more comfortable for the offense. Fans want to see big gains and points. A ball that is easier to throw and easier to catch is a great avenue to this—and an avenue that in itself is not intrusive to the integrity of the game. Defensive and offensive schemes are not significantly altered because a quarterback is throwing strikes with an under-inflated football. If anything, the schemes become sharper because the action on the field has become sharper. With football being so much about strategy, the more comfortable the ball is for a quarterback and his receivers, the more entertaining the game becomes.

The NFL already agrees with this. Why do you think officials and ball boys go to such lengths to try to keep a football dry during a rainy game? Or, bringing it back to the inflate/deflate issue (or inflate/deflate controversy, since America has decided to be dramatic, if not hysterical, about this), why did the NFL permit quarterbacks to prepare their own balls before games in the first place?

The problem is, the league didn’t go far enough here. It should abolish all parameters regarding the ball’s air. Tom Brady didn’t cheat. Tom Brady’s job is to throw the football. Unfortunately, he had to go too far out of his way to do his job well.

Full article

 

[Lucky]

Let Brady Deflate the Ball

Can we also allow receivers to use stickem? And ball carriers wear tearaway jerseys? It's not like using steroids.

To be fair, the d-linemen should be able to grease their uniforms. And we'll let DBs use stickem, too.

Or, everyone can play by one set of rules. Even the Great Tom Brady.

 

[WolverineFan]

You have Brady in a keeper league or what?

I like Brady although I could care less about the Pats. That being said, as I've stated multiple times already ITT, I am not using my stance to defend Brady or the Patriots. This is a team that, despite appearing in 9 AFC Championship Games and 6 Super Bowl's over the last 15 years, is continually trying to cut corners to find an edge on the fringe of the rulebook.

My stance is against the NFL in what I find to be a ridiculous and hypocritical punishment that is completely agenda driven by PR and public perception.

 

[Playoffs]

Or, everyone can play by one set of rules. Even the Great Tom Brady.

What a concept!

 

[Marshall]

Pretty much what Thorn and I have been asking (which is different than the actual act of breaking rules, rather it is questioning the point of the rule itself):

I think this is a valid point. Rescind the 2006 rule allowing for doctoring of the balls by the teams. Limit the changes to requests, not demands, that they be prepared like umpires do in baseball where it is their responsibility to provide the balls (scuffed by formula) and check them as needed. Get rid of separate footballs for kicking. Keep them uniform. If kicking changes their shape, then bring in a new one to replace the old.

 

[Marshall]

What a concept!

That would never work in the NBA. Imagine calling traveling on MJ just because he never put the ball on the floor after crossing mid court. Heaven forbid.

 

[thunderkyss]

Just for the record, I've never liked Brady. It's only recently (last five years maybe) that I've conformed to the belief that he belongs in the GOAT conversation & even more recently since I've begrudgingly admitted he's probably more than likely in the lead.

Now, I can put an asterisk by his name.

 

[disaacks3]

How do you know that the Colts did not?

Brady was advised by the NFLPA not to turn over his cell phone/records.

Great job, DeMaurice.

Really? http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2015/05/07/nflpa-didnt-advise-or-represent-brady-in-wells-investigation/

My stance is against the NFL in what I find to be a ridiculous and hypocritical punishment that is completely agenda driven by PR and public perception.

Fair enough, but when the Patriots constantly push the boundaries, this is the push-back they should expect. Let's not forget we have another rule change, specifically to offset Belichick's (now) illegal formation shifts.

 

[Double Barrel]

Can we also allow receivers to use stickem? And ball carriers wear tearaway jerseys? It's not like using steroids.

To be fair, the d-linemen should be able to grease their uniforms. And we'll let DBs use stickem, too.

Or, everyone can play by one set of rules. Even the Great Tom Brady.

Not all of those are equal.

A ball is a ball. No outside substance required to inflate it to a given psi. It has to be inflated regardless of some arbitrary standard.

Sorry to question the almighty rule book. I figured you more for a maverick than a rule book nazi, but whatever. I'm still going to question authority in spite of your corncob.

 

[WolverineFan]

Brady was not advised by the NFLPA in any capacity during the investigation. He declined their help and let his agent handle everything. I personally think his agent did a pretty shoddy job of assisting him and gave him poor advice. Brady has now accepted NFLPA help during the appeals process and they will take over this process with Brady's agent sitting on the sidelines.

Also, one of the PFT guys (can't remember which) said he thinks it is possible the NFLPA will produce the withheld Brady text messages if Goodell, Wells, and one of Goodell's cronies (can't remember the name) produce their text messages as well in order to prove their impartiality during the process.

Keep in mind that last part is all speculation on how the Pats/NFLPA might attack the NFL during the appeals process.

 

[Double Barrel]

What a concept!

I'm not advocating anyone breaking the rules, but the perceived butthurt from some (not you) about even questioning specific rules is just silly. The owners and coaches do it every year and almost always make alterations, updates, and changes to the almighty rule book.

Besides, I am an antipop, going against he grain until the day I drop.

 

[TD]

A ball is a ball. No outside substance required to inflate it to a given psi. It has to be inflated regardless of some arbitrary standard.

I agree. It is more akin to the rules on cleats which allow wide latitude depending on player preference. i don't see the big deal in making a change.

 

[paycheck71]

Not all of those are equal.

A ball is a ball. No outside substance required to inflate it to a given psi. It has to be inflated regardless of some arbitrary standard.

Sorry to question the almighty rule book. I figured you more for a maverick than a rule book nazi, but whatever. I'm still going to question authority in spite of your corncob.

I get your point to a degree, but some acceptable range has to exist. What if someone wants to play with a completely deflated ball? If there are no restrictions, that's a possibility. And if you're going to impose restrictions to avoid that ridiculous scenario, what's wrong with the current restrictions?

 

[TD]

I get your point to a degree, but some acceptable range has to exist. What if someone wants to play with a completely deflated ball? If there are no restrictions, that's a possibility. And if you're going to impose restrictions to avoid that ridiculous scenario, what's wrong with the current restrictions?

PLEASE - Go deflate a ball and play of game of punt, pass, and kick in your front yard and post a video of the results. I could use a good laugh right now.

 

[paycheck71]

PLEASE - Go deflate a ball and play of game of punt, pass, and kick in your front yard and post a video of the results. I could use a good laugh right now.

You may have missed the word "ridiculous" in my message, but if it's not made illegal by the league, someone will find a way to take things too far.

Do your own front yard tricks.

 

[TD]

You may have missed the word "ridiculous" in my message, but if it's not made illegal by the league, someone will find a way to take things too far.

Do your own front yard tricks.

When you said "possibility" its hard to take serious...its like saying an MLB player would take advantage the rule on bats to use one 12" long with a 1" diameter. Could they? Absolutely. But nobody is that stupid or "ridiculous".

Anyway, I have no problem either way. I seriously doubt there would be much difference in the product on the field.

 

[gary]

Shame. There will always be someone cheating somewhere just some get caught and some do not.

 

[Thorn]

I wonder if our QBs would be any better with a flat piece of leather rather than a real football.

 

[CloakNNNdagger]

I wonder how many here understand what the rules were on doctoring the balls prior to the new 2006 rules.......and thus the real reason that Manning and Brady petitioned the NFL to change the rules. As opposed to what most fans believe, there was no "standard" footballs that were distributed each game to both teams. In fact, the home town QB was given the balls to break in as was to their liking...........and the visiting team's offense had to play with those same balls...........a little-known facet of the home-field advantage.

 

[infantrycak]

I wonder how many here understand what the rules were on doctoring the balls prior to the new 2006 rules.......and thus the real reason that Manning and Brady petitioned the NFL to change the rules. As opposed to what most fans believe, there was no "standard" footballs that were distributed each game to both teams. In fact, the home town QB was given the balls to break in as was to their liking...........and the visiting team's offense had to play with those same balls...........a little-known facet of the home-field advantage.

A.J Feely doesn't remember it that way:

Former NFL quarterback A.J. Feeley says the Patriots were breaking the rules about properly preparing footballs long before Deflategate.

Feeley said on 97.5 The Fanatic that when he was playing for the Dolphins in 2004, he saw Patriots quarterback Tom Brady using old, broken-in balls at a time when NFL rules said that teams had to use new balls provided by the league.

“Prior to Tommy and Peyton Manning going to the league and saying, ‘Let us doctor our balls’ we used to all play with the same balls,” Feeley said. “Somehow this beat-up ball from the ball boy was getting thrown in on offense for New England, yet when we were on offense this orange brand new ball was getting thrown in.”

Feeley says Brady was getting an advantage, and Feeley had a problem with it.

“He’s getting his own balls thrown in on offense,” Feeley said. “That was an issue to me at the time. . . . We saw it then.”

Link

 

[disaacks3]

I wonder how many here understand what the rules were on doctoring the balls prior to the new 2006 rules.......and thus the real reason that Manning and Brady petitioned the NFL to change the rules. As opposed to what most fans believe, there was no "standard" footballs that were distributed each game to both teams. In fact, the home town QB was given the balls to break in as was to their liking...........and the visiting team's offense had to play with those same balls...........a little-known facet of the home-field advantage.

Yep. Though in theory the balls were (supposed to be) "consistent" as they came from a common pool.

Unlike the whole kicking ball fiasco where teams would doctor the balls unmercifully...usually to the visiting teams' disadvantage.