Kubes is the problem

[ChampionTexan]

I know that "If things happened in sports like they did in the real world..." examples are usually a bunch of crap, and this one may be too, but consider this.

You've been hired to turnaround a dept. of a major company that has suffered from it's creation with inept management. There are former employees that have been terminated due to cause, but because of legal reasons, they are still on the payroll. While you pretty much have full hiring and firing authority, you are on a budget, and those terminated folks still count against it. As time goes on, those terminated employees will begin dropping off the books, but you'll need to manage with both an eye towards bringing in top-notch folks, and not recreating the budget hell the previous management had gotten themselves into. Oh yeah - hiring in your field is incredibly competitive, between you and the other departments within your company virtually all of the folks quailified to work in your field already work for your company. You add college graduates to the workforce every year, but those folks are spread around the company evenly, and all departments will receive a relatively equal share of those folks. While folks in the other departments do periodically transfer within the company, your predecessors left your department with a reputation that will make it...let's just say challenging... to attract the best and the brightest. You do have excellent facilities, and your department is considered pretty employee friendly.

Your performance is pretty much based 100% on annual productivity as compared to the other depts in your company. As you can imagine, things are in a pretty sorry shape when you start, so the good news is the bar is pretty low. You've also been told you should focus on long-term productivity, not just a quick turnaround that will only result in temporary/unsustainable improvement. The first year, you pick the low-hanging fruit and triple productivity. While you've improved productivity by 200%, you are still in the bottom 30% on a company-wide basis. A clear cut improvement, but still a ways to go for that promotion. In year 2, you see a productivity jump of 33% from the previous year. While this isn't nearly the percentage increase of year one, only 40% (approximately) of the other departments have better productivity than you. You're still not where you want to be, but you feel good about the direction and progress of the first two years.

Year 3 rolls around, and while you are struggling to identify and correct the reason, productivity is down in a major way the first month and a half of the year. Through mid-February, everything that was a problem in the past still seems to be a problem, and some things that weren't problems before now are. For reasons your working to identify and fix, things seem to have reverted back to where they were before you got there. You recognize that there's still 10.5 months left in the year, and while you've made it tougher on yourself, you still have enough time to continue the upward movement you've started. There is some reason to believe that the first month and a half are far tougher months to produce in than most. Before you have a chance to finish February (much less the first quarter of the year), your boss calls you into his office, tells you that while your performance in the first two years were solid and encouraging, your 1+ month performance has convinced him that you're the problem, and in spite of the first two years performance, he's convinced that you are incapable of even re-creating the productivity you achieved in year two, much less improving on it.

How do you feel?

 

[Yomaine]

8-8 is great, but that doesn't make Kubiak the great coach that everyone and McNair think he is.

Let we forget we were 7-9 with a bad line, no runningback and a quarterback that had gotten sacked the most of any quarterback in history. That was with capers, we should have been 8-8 but gave a the last game away to cleveland.

So are we better than we were then? Maybe in some aspects but overall? Thats a huge NO!

 

[Runner]

You mean 7-9 isn't mediocre?

7-9, 9-7: average mediocrity.

We should have a discussion on standard deviations and bell curves and such.

 

[HJam72]

Just a general observation, but I believe we are younger now than then and still have a lot of room to improve. That 7-9 team was anchored by guys like Sharper, Foreman, and McKinney, who didn't have much time left. This team has FAR more potential.

 

[infantrycak]

8-8 is great, but that doesn't make Kubiak the great coach that everyone and McNair think he is.

Let we forget we were 7-9 with a bad line, no runningback and a quarterback that had gotten sacked the most of any quarterback in history. That was with capers, we should have been 8-8 but gave a the last game away to cleveland.

So are we better than we were then? Maybe in some aspects but overall? Thats a huge NO!

First we had a RB at that point--without DD that team would have done squat.

I think people are upset with the results and not seeing the differences. My bet is this team could play that team and go 13-3. Doesn't mean our record will be better, but the division is a whole lot better now as a whole as well.

 

[Hookem Horns]

I have to agree with you about the lack of swagger.

The question that follows is who would you like to see as the Head Coach then?

Marty Schottenheimer?

Steve Spagnolo

 

[jdog]

I know that "If things happened in sports like they did in the real world..." examples are usually a bunch of crap, and this one may be too, but consider this.

You've been hired to turnaround a dept. of a major company that has suffered from it's creation with inept management. There are former employees that have been terminated due to cause, but because of legal reasons, they are still on the payroll. While you pretty much have full hiring and firing authority, you are on a budget, and those terminated folks still count against it. As time goes on, those terminated employees will begin dropping off the books, but you'll need to manage with both an eye towards bringing in top-notch folks, and not recreating the budget hell the previous management had gotten themselves into. Oh yeah - hiring in your field is incredibly competitive, between you and the other departments within your company virtually all of the folks quailified to work in your field already work for your company. You add college graduates to the workforce every year, but those folks are spread around the company evenly, and all departments will receive a relatively equal share of those folks. While folks in the other departments do periodically transfer within the company, your predecessors left your department with a reputation that will make it...let's just say challenging... to attract the best and the brightest. You do have excellent facilities, and your department is considered pretty employee friendly.

Your performance is pretty much based 100% on annual productivity as compared to the other depts in your company. As you can imagine, things are in a pretty sorry shape when you start, so the good news is the bar is pretty low. You've also been told you should focus on long-term productivity, not just a quick turnaround that will only result in temporary/unsustainable improvement. The first year, you pick the low-hanging fruit and triple productivity. While you've improved productivity by 200%, you are still in the bottom 30% on a company-wide basis. A clear cut improvement, but still a ways to go for that promotion. In year 2, you see a productivity jump of 33% from the previous year. While this isn't nearly the percentage increase of year one, only 40% (approximately) of the other departments have better productivity than you. You're still not where you want to be, but you feel good about the direction and progress of the first two years.

Year 3 rolls around, and while you are struggling to identify and correct the reason, productivity is down in a major way the first month and a half of the year. Through mid-February, everything that was a problem in the past still seems to be a problem, and some things that weren't problems before now are. For reasons your working to identify and fix, things seem to have reverted back to where they were before you got there. You recognize that there's still 10.5 months left in the year, and while you've made it tougher on yourself, you still have enough time to continue the upward movement you've started. There is some reason to believe that the first month and a half are far tougher months to produce in than most. Before you have a chance to finish February (much less the first quarter of the year), your boss calls you into his office, tells you that while your performance in the first two years were solid and encouraging, your 1+ month performance has convinced him that you're the problem, and in spite of the first two years performance, he's convinced that you are incapable of even re-creating the productivity you achieved in year two, much less improving on it.

How do you feel?

I hear you. Imagine you are the boss. You had the previous management team go through a period of continued improvement followed by a period of regression. Now, you see your new management team appearing to fall into the same pattern, and you feel the need to call them into your office for a chat now rather than waiting for the annual review.

There is a difference between saying Kubiak is the problem and firing Kubiak. Advocating firing Kubiak now is ignorant and insane. However, expressing to Kubiak that he is the man and he needs to identify the problem and resolve it, well, it seems fair and smart.

The similar trend that I see is in the comments about execution. When it becomes a matter of players not executing, it's because the coach is not lighting a fire under their asses and holding them accountable to the point that they have a healthy fear of ****ing up.

Of course, Kubiak can always respond with the belief that there is no problem, and then we would have a difference of opinion which would have to be resolved at the end of the season or perhaps midseason.

The problem that I see is not an 0-2 start to the season. It is playing badly. It is poor tackling. It is poor decision making by the quarterback. It is horrible results in the red zone. It is a culture of excuses. Saying, "it's no excuse, but..." is still an excuse. Many fans on this messageboard argue that we should have had no expectation of winning the last two games. We need to have an expectation of winning every game.

When we lose a game, the response should be, "they played better than us today." It should never be, "we were never going to win that game anyway". We need to ask ourselves why, specifically, did they beat us? Once we identify the reasons, we need to be serious about fixing them as if our lives depend on it. This means that we can't say, "we don't have the talent" or any other response that does not foster an immediate solution because in those cases, we are doomed. Believe in now!

 

[ChampionTexan]

I hear you. Imagine you are the boss. You had the previous management team go through a period of continued improvement followed by a period of regression. Now, you see your new management team appearing to fall into the same pattern, and you feel the need to call them into your office for a chat now rather than waiting for the annual review.

There is a difference between saying Kubiak is the problem and firing Kubiak. Advocating firing Kubiak now is ignorant and insane. However, expressing to Kubiak that he is the man and he needs to identify the problem and resolve it, well, it seems fair and smart.

The similar trend that I see is in the comments about execution. When it becomes a matter of players not executing, it's because the coach is not lighting a fire under their asses and holding them accountable to the point that they have a healthy fear of ****ing up.

Of course, Kubiak can always respond with the belief that there is no problem, and then we would have a difference of opinion which would have to be resolved at the end of the season or perhaps midseason.

The problem that I see is not an 0-2 start to the season. It is playing badly. It is poor tackling. It is poor decision making by the quarterback. It is horrible results in the red zone. It is a culture of excuses. Saying, "it's no excuse, but..." is still an excuse. Many fans on this messageboard argue that we should have had no expectation of winning the last two games. We need to have an expectation of winning every game.

When we lose a game, the response should be, "they played better than us today." It should never be, "we were never going to win that game anyway". We need to ask ourselves why, specifically, did they beat us? Once we identify the reasons, we need to be serious about fixing them as if our lives depend on it. This means that we can't say, "we don't have the talent" or any other response that does not foster an immediate solution because in those cases, we are doomed. Believe in now!

I think we're pretty much on the same page here, and I'm not trying to defend Kubiak's or the teams performance in the first two games - in fact, the Titans game was probably one of the worst coached games I've ever seen, but I know professionally, I've had a few days like that myself. It doesn't change the body of work with one fell swoop.

In your words, "Advocating firing Kubiak now is ignorant and insane", and that in a nutshell was what I was saying. It was specifically in response to the original post in this thread. What we've seen in the first two games won't keep Kubiak his job past this year if it continues. But two games - however bad - don't cause you to forget what's been done over the previous two years.

 

[jdog]

I think we're pretty much on the same page here, and I'm not trying to defend Kubiak's or the teams performance in the first two games - in fact, the Titans game was probably one of the worst coached games I've ever seen, but I know professionally, I've had a few days like that myself. It doesn't change the body of work with one fell swoop.

In your words, "Advocating firing Kubiak now is ignorant and insane", and that in a nutshell was what I was saying. It was specifically in response to the original post in this thread. What we've seen in the first two games won't keep Kubiak his job past this year if it continues. But two games - however bad - don't cause you to forget what's been done over the previous two years.

I agree. I think Kubiak is on his way toward being a great head coach. In the last two years, I can't think of too many things that I don't like about the job he's done. The problem he faces seems to be specific to our team as an expansion team, and at this point, maybe it is simply a matter of our team being a losing team historically.

The challenge for Kubiak is overcoming our culture of living with losing, and this is why I think the head coach must be considered the problem. Changing the culture and raising expectations starts at the top and must be based on consistent, passionate, and demanding leadership.

 

[Second Honeymoon]

hope for the best and maybe the team can pull themselves together. if they don't, there will be plenty of time to criticize the team and leadership. I guess my point is that I don't want Cowher to be our coach in 2009 because that would mean that we had a horrible year and I am still holding out hope that wont be the case, but if we do indeed have a indisputably horrible year (4 or fewer wins), I want Cowher as HC in 2009. Does that make sense?

thoughts and prayers to those who were affected and/or still affected by Hurricane Ike.

 

[HJam72]

Beware that, if we did get a proven coach like Cowher, there are many of us who would not put up with all the "fire the HC" threads and posts every time we lose a couple games. This statement not aimed at anyone in particular.

Now, fire Richard Smith! Where is that pink soap?

 

[brickman]

Just a general observation, but I believe we are younger now than then and still have a lot of room to improve. That 7-9 team was anchored by guys like Sharper, Foreman, and McKinney, who didn't have much time left. This team has FAR more potential.

We have potential at the start of every season ..... the hell with potential ...... it's the nfl ...... what it comes down to is what did you achieve ... not what are you capable of doing.

 

[HoustonFrog]

Beware that, if we did get a proven coach like Cowher, there are many of us who would not put up with all the "fire the HC" threads and posts every time we lose a couple games. This statement not aimed at anyone in particular.

Now, fire Richard Smith! Where is that pink soap?

I agree with you. I've become used to the weekly backup QB threads and Fire coaches threads. It becomes comical. There really are 31 other perfect QBs and coaches out there.

 

[Second Honeymoon]

Beware that, if we did get a proven coach like Cowher, there are many of us who would not put up with all the "fire the HC" threads and posts every time we lose a couple games. This statement not aimed at anyone in particular.

Now, fire Richard Smith! Where is that pink soap?

I only wish it has been only a couple games we have lost. We have looked bad for some time now...oh, like since the first day of our team's existence.

If and when Cowher is brought in, I think everyone would show him more patience because he has proven he can do it. All Kubiak has proven is that he makes poor game time decisions, poor in-game adjustments, and poor talent evaluation. Cowher has shown a lot more than that so he deserves the benefit of the doubt more than Gary. I like Kubiak but I think he is over his head and isn't cut from the right cloth to be a successful NFL Head Coach.

 

[GP]

The "Bench Schaub" idea has been generating merit since last season, and it's rolled over into this season with two pretty awful performances back-to-back. That's a move that needs to be made no later than halftime of the Jags game is he's getting clobbered or can't produce points in the red zone.

The Kubiak move should be made at the end of the season if we finish with six wins or less. I don't think anything less than 8-8 is acceptable. The idea is to keep growing, not to move backward and have 8-8 as your best season.

Kubiak has a better chance of turning the team around than Schaub has of making it as a legit starter. Schaub, in the end, might be the thing that makes or breaks Kubiak's career: If Kubiak wants to get stubborn and prove that Schaub is legit, despite the lack of production, then so be it. It's his career, I guess.

Just looks like the smart move, after all the "evaluation" of course, is to put Matt on the bench and try someone different. Heck, if Sage does awful...then Matt will probably find the inner fuel he needs to get back in there and prove he can do it. Being anointed as the starter is not good.

 

[beerlover]

I only wish it has been only a couple games we have lost. We have looked bad for some time now...oh, like since the first day of our team's existence.

If and when Cowher is brought in, I think everyone would show him more patience because he has proven he can do it. All Kubiak has proven is that he makes poor game time decisions, poor in-game adjustments, and poor talent evaluation. Cowher has shown a lot more than that so he deserves the benefit of the doubt more than Gary. I like Kubiak but I think he is over his head and isn't cut from the right cloth to be a successful NFL Head Coach.

you raise some valid points. Garys biggest fault is loyalty to his players & staff that clouds his thought process. This is something he is going to have to work through if he wants to survive, he needs better support & infrastructure around him. I view Cowher more of a figure head who had a very expereinced staff around him basicly running the show for a sustained continuous amount of time which created that lunch pale work ethic culture.

Kubes needs to change the culture, if that means a new dc then so be it

 

[Polo]

I'm pretty sure Cowher had some of these same complaints against him by their fan base when they lost games too...

Everything Cowher touched didn't turn to gold....I'm pretty sure he made some poor personnel decision, poor coaching decision and poor in game adjustments along the way too...So has every other coach....

I feel like our team has gotten better and has been injected with more talent since Kubiak has gotten here. Our record has gotten better each year despite having multiple injuries to not only starters, but stars...

I think all of this talk about firing Kubes and him needing to shape up or ship out are ludicrous and very pre-mature....JMO

 

[Wolf]

besides Poor game managment, which I think a couch can learn from that with experience

I am not for the "fire Kubiak" Crowd yet... This team has changed alot, I looked at his first season as a evalutation of the team.. He had to see what Carr could do with the Texans giving him an extension.


Last season, you basically had a rookie QB at the helm and with all the injuries,it is tough to gauge


This is the first full season that we are healthy so far. so this IMO is the first real look at what Kubiak can or cannot do..(schaub in 2nd year in this offense).. now, If he doesn't get his game management improved, Schaub continues to struggle and Kubiak doesn't make a move, or even if this defense continues to play poorly and Kubiak doesnt' make any move in the offseason,then he will go down with the ship.



Right now I am disappointed with the way the team seems to be unprepared and out coached, esp after all the talk of "taking the next step" On a side note, Pitts game was pathetic, no excuse. Titans game , I will give them the benefit of the doubt that IKE was still on the players mind (even the Astros cooled off with that). I know they are all professionals but still there is the human factor of it when it comes to friends and family and trying to focus on work

 

[HOU-TEX]

I only wish it has been only a couple games we have lost. We have looked bad for some time now...oh, like since the first day of our team's existence.

If and when Cowher is brought in, I think everyone would show him more patience because he has proven he can do it. All Kubiak has proven is that he makes poor game time decisions, poor in-game adjustments, and poor talent evaluation. Cowher has shown a lot more than that so he deserves the benefit of the doubt more than Gary. I like Kubiak but I think he is over his head and isn't cut from the right cloth to be a successful NFL Head Coach.

Dude, why would Cowher ever come here?? LOL @ you thinking it would that easy. You make it sound like he'd be on a plane heading towards Houston as soon as McNair snaps his fingers. It has been said if (big if) he were to come back it'd be to Carolina (I think).

He will be here the rest of this season and next season at a minimum.

"isn't cut from the right cloth to be a successful NFL Head Coach"

Well I'll be damned, where were you when McNair was interviewing coaches.

Bill Belichick - 1 winning season in his first 6 years.

Tony Dungy - 1 winning season in his first 3 years.

Jeff Fisher - Didn't get above .500 until his 5th season

Jimmy Johnson - 1 winning season in his first 3 years.

Tom Landry - 1 winning season in his first 7 years.

Chuck Noll - 1 winning season in his first 4 years.

Dick Vermeil - 1 winning season in his first 3 years.

Bill Walsh - 1 winning season in his first 3 years.

 

[GP]

you raise some valid points. Garys biggest fault is loyalty to his players & staff that clouds his thought process. This is something he is going to have to work through if he wants to survive, he needs better support & infrastructure around him. I view Cowher more of a figure head who had a very expereinced staff around him basicly running the show for a sustained continuous amount of time which created that lunch pale work ethic culture.

Kubes needs to change the culture, if that means a new dc then so be it

BINGO.

Gary belonged to the Broncos for so long, that I think he thinks that's the way he's going to do things in Houston: Slow and steady wins the race, and be loyal to those under you (just as Shanahan was loyal to Kubiak for so long).

Cowher didn't mind having coaches on his staff who were good at what they did, who were rising in the ranks and making a name for themselves. Kubiak, to me, appears to be a guy who is afraid to surround himself with such people: He wants to be the smartest person in the room. Which, based on last Sunday's game management, is a scary thing.

I read an article on Shanny, Jr. He said when he first got to Houston, in the coach's meetings, he was blurting out what he thinks should be done on certain things. He said the other coaches stared a hole through him, smirked at him like he was stupid. Shanny Jr. said "I learned right there that I need to shut my mouth and just sit back and watch."

Uhh...watch what? Sherman botch the whole offense from top to bottom? Kubiak fail to make adjustments at halftime. Shanny Jr. protected his arse, which was smart smart smart. But that's the culture, it seems, with Gary: "I'm the brain. You're the limbs. Do what I say."

Our team seems so very American Corporate climate, which I think is a culture established by McNair and due to the inherent way he has of doing things. Appearances are everything. Nice facility, squeaky clean players, high profitability. I used to work in a place like that, right out of college, and I left it--There was no room for creativity and risk. None. This team reminds me of that place.

 

[Polo]

Kubiak, to me, appears to be a guy who is afraid to surround himself with such people: He wants to be the smartest person in the room. Which, based on last Sunday's game management, is a scary thing.

This is a really ignorant statement.

Mike Sherman
Alex Gibbs
and Ray Rhodes would like to disagree with you

 

[HOU-TEX]

This is a really ignorant statement.

Mike Sherman
Alex Gibbs
and Ray Rhodes would like to disagree with you

Does that surprise you, considering the source?

 

[ChampionTexan]

Dude, why would Cowher ever come here?? LOL @ you thinking it would that easy. You make it sound like he'd be on a plane heading towards Houston as soon as McNair snaps his fingers. It has been said if (big if) he were to come back it'd be to Carolina (I think).

He will be here the rest of this season and next season at a minimum.



Well I'll be damned, where were you when McNair was interviewing coaches.

Bill Belichick - 1 winning season in his first 6 years.

Tony Dungy - 1 winning season in his first 3 years.

Jeff Fisher - Didn't get above .500 until his 5th season

Jimmy Johnson - 1 winning season in his first 3 years.

Tom Landry - 1 winning season in his first 7 years.

Chuck Noll - 1 winning season in his first 4 years.

Dick Vermeil - 1 winning season in his first 3 years.

Bill Walsh - 1 winning season in his first 3 years.

Throw in the fact that in two of Cowher's final four seasons in Pittsburgh, his record was 8-8(2006) and 6-10(2003). The other two were 15-1(2004) and 10-6 (2005 Super Bowl Championship season). Also, the 6-10 season was sandwiched by a 10-5-1 season, and the 15-1 season, so the point is even guys who are really really good coaches (which I wholeheartedly agree that Cowher is) have some pretty dismal years.

I don't know where Kubiak's ultimate Head Coaching legacy will end up, but I do know that this team made a determination after the 2005 season that he was the best guy to coach this team. I have seen reasons in the past for optimism, and I see reasons at this time for concern, but I see no reason whatsoever to definitively say Kubes is unable to do this job.

 

[Wolf]

what was impressive with Pittsburgh is they would lose defensive guys and it was just plug and play over

when I thought they would drop by losing Chad Brown , they kept going, Joey Porter, they kept going.

 

[HOU-TEX]

Throw in the fact that in two of Cowher's final four seasons in Pittsburgh, his record was 8-8(2006) and 6-10(2003). The other two were 15-1(2004) and 10-6 (2005 Super Bowl Championship season). Also, the 6-10 season was sandwiched by a 10-5-1 season, and the 15-1 season, so the point is even guys who are really really good coaches (which I wholeheartedly agree that Cowher is) have some pretty dismal years.

I don't know where Kubiak's ultimate Head Coaching legacy will end up, but I do know that this team made a determination after the 2005 season that he was the best guy to coach this team. I have seen reasons in the past for optimism, and I see reasons at this time for concern, but I see know reason whatsoever to definitively say Kubes is unable to do this job.

I agree.

I'm not saying Kubiak's going to be as successful as the coaches I listed, but I wanted to give SH examples of very good coaches that had slow starts in their careers.

 

[Texan_Bill]

Dude, why would Cowher ever come here?? LOL @ you thinking it would that easy. You make it sound like he'd be on a plane heading towards Houston as soon as McNair snaps his fingers. It has been said if (big if) he were to come back it'd be to Carolina (I think).

He will be here the rest of this season and next season at a minimum.



Well I'll be damned, where were you when McNair was interviewing coaches.

Bill Belichick - 1 winning season in his first 6 years.

Tony Dungy - 1 winning season in his first 3 years.

Jeff Fisher - Didn't get above .500 until his 5th season

Jimmy Johnson - 1 winning season in his first 3 years.

Tom Landry - 1 winning season in his first 7 years.

Chuck Noll - 1 winning season in his first 4 years.

Dick Vermeil - 1 winning season in his first 3 years.

Bill Walsh - 1 winning season in his first 3 years.

Maybe Darrell K Royal or John Mackovic are available........

 

[HOU-TEX]

what was impressive with Pittsburgh is they would lose defensive guys and it was just plug and play over

when I thought they would drop by losing Chad Brown , they kept going, Joey Porter, they kept going.

Dick LeBeau has had alot to do with the Steelers success.

 

[Second Honeymoon]

if your happy with the product on the field, that is your prerogative. sometimes you have to **** or get off the pot. that is where I am at with Kubiak. if he can't turn it around this year, he deserves to be fired. period.

this isn't a popularity contest or charity function. this is NFL football and if you don't win and your team isn't competitive, you lose your job. kubiak's teams have not been winning and they have looked utterly pathetic. if you want another couple years of this garbage, fine. just don't expect me to sit by and make excuses for this pathetic product.

 

[hadaad]

Throw in the fact that in two of Cowher's final four seasons in Pittsburgh, his record was 8-8(2006) and 6-10(2003). The other two were 15-1(2004) and 10-6 (2005 Super Bowl Championship season). Also, the 6-10 season was sandwiched by a 10-5-1 season, and the 15-1 season, so the point is even guys who are really really good coaches (which I wholeheartedly agree that Cowher is) have some pretty dismal years.

I don't know where Kubiak's ultimate Head Coaching legacy will end up, but I do know that this team made a determination after the 2005 season that he was the best guy to coach this team. I have seen reasons in the past for optimism, and I see reasons at this time for concern, but I see no reason whatsoever to definitively say Kubes is unable to do this job.

Come ON! This is the internet. That is not spoken as an absolute or a polarizing statement. Your argument is invalid because it's too realistic.

 

[Wolf]

Maybe Darrell K Royal or John Mackovic are available........

heck if things get worse, there is always goldie

 

[Wolf]

if your happy with the product on the field, that is your prerogative. sometimes you have to **** or get off the pot. that is where I am at with Kubiak. if he can't turn it around this year, he deserves to be fired. period.

this isn't a popularity contest or charity function. this is NFL football and if you don't win and your team isn't competitive, you lose your job. kubiak's teams have not been winning and they have looked utterly pathetic. if you want another couple years of this garbage, fine. just don't expect me to sit by and make excuses for this pathetic product.

I smell a third coming

 

[HOU-TEX]

heck if things get worse, there is always goldie

We could use Finch next to Okam to stop the run.

 

[Texan_Bill]

heck if things get worse, there is always goldie

I'll see your Goldie Hawn and raise you a Coach Klein and 'Momma' Boucher:

 

[ChampionTexan]

if your happy with the product on the field, that is your prerogative. sometimes you have to **** or get off the pot. that is where I am at with Kubiak. if he can't turn it around this year, he deserves to be fired. period.

this isn't a popularity contest or charity function. this is NFL football and if you don't win and your team isn't competitive, you lose your job. kubiak's teams have not been winning and they have looked utterly pathetic. if you want another couple years of this garbage, fine. just don't expect me to sit by and make excuses for this pathetic product.

So should I go play intramurals or something?

 

[Texan_Bill]

So should I go play intramurals or something?

*ahem* Coach Gundy's rant was about his Quarterback and "I'm a man... I'm 40 years old........."

Dan Hawkins was the coach talking about "go play intramurals brother, go play intramurals"

 

[ChampionTexan]

*ahem* Coach Gundy's rant was about his Quarterback and "I'm a man... I'm 40 years old........."

Dan Hawkins was the coach talking about "go play intramurals brother, go play intramurals"

Egad - how embarrassing.

 

[HOU-TEX]

*ahem* Coach Gundy's rant was about his Quarterback and "I'm a man... I'm 40 years old........."

Dan Hawkins was the coach talking about "go play intramurals brother, go play intramurals"

Egad - how embarrassing.

Rome had a field day with those two. It was quite humerous to say the least.

Phenomenal!!

 

[HJam72]

if your happy with the product on the field, that is your prerogative. sometimes you have to **** or get off the pot. that is where I am at with Kubiak. if he can't turn it around this year, he deserves to be fired. period.

this isn't a popularity contest or charity function. this is NFL football and if you don't win and your team isn't competitive, you lose your job. kubiak's teams have not been winning and they have looked utterly pathetic. if you want another couple years of this garbage, fine. just don't expect me to sit by and make excuses for this pathetic product.

How many wins do you consider turning it around?

 

[Texan_Bill]

Rome had a field day with those two. It was quite humerous to say the least.

Phenomenal!!

When they play those clips, it still cracks me up....

OUT!

 

[Second Honeymoon]

How many wins do you consider turning it around?

for me its not a question of the number of wins, its about the team showing a pulse at this point.

if i was to put a number of wins needed to be considered 'turning it around', I would go with 7 under the circumstances. That is playing .500 ball the rest of the year with 8 of the 14 being played at home. I don't think that is asking for much but once again, its not about the wins for me. its about seeing the team play with some emotion and intensity. if Kubiak can't enlicit that out of the talent assembled, we need to find someone who has already proven that he can build a winner and instill a true fighting spirit into a team....something Kubiak has failed to prove he can do.

 

[Second Honeymoon]

When they play those clips, it still cracks me up....

OUT!

dont listen to as much Rome as I did in the old days, but enough to have heard the Leach stuff. Epic.

I am still trying to find some audio clip of his 'Corvette Guy' takes without having to pay a subscription. I have found his 'Softball Guy' takes but not 'Corvette Guy'.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uMfqbR8Ujlk
CLICK HERE FOR SOFTBALL GUY (SAFE FOR WORK)

 

[GP]

This is a really ignorant statement.

Mike Sherman
Alex Gibbs
and Ray Rhodes would like to disagree with you

You think Sherman was brought in, by Kubiak, to be a "go to" guy? Sherman was serving his obligatory 1-year-away-from-being-a-head-coach sentence that you have to serve if you want to be a HC again. it was a retirement home facility for the guy: Walking through the halls, sipping coffee, attend some meetings...you know, soaking up that Reliant Stadium feel-good complex that McNair uses to draw people in, cuz it's indicative of our winning history and tradition here. Side note: It'd be nice to play in a dump, have rats everywhere, and win playoff games all the time.

Gibbs might be a good example of someone being more gifted than Kubiak, but then again...his main emphasis is the running scheme.

Rhodes? I used to think that he was brought in to wait for the firing of Richard Smith, to get a handle on the defensive unit before taking it over. Now, with the reports that he was told to NOT be a DC again (due to health) then I can see him staying in his current role.

But come on guys, be serious: Do ANY of those three examples that Polo threw out...do anyone of them strike you as a seriously potential candidate to be Texans HC if Kubiak got fired? What "edge" to they offer that would make Kubiak look over his shoulder? None.

That's what I am saying. Kubiak, to me, isn't going to bring in a seriously-gifted coach who might also be able to be a HC. The great coaches don't have that sort of ego. They know that they win if their assistants are winning, and they know that they are going to lose those guys to bigger better jobs afterward. Theyhire guys who have aspirations of being HCs...because assistants with that mindset are going to produce in their role as assistant (to get the bump up).

Kubiak, in my view, has brought in sub-par people--This is a trademark for how he views running backs AND coaches (You don't need high-level people at either spot). Whether that's McNair being tight with the wallet, or due to Kubiak's fear of not being the superstar with no threats to the throne...I don't know. I just know that the hiring of Richard Smith as DC was curious when it was made, and it's even moreso now that we've had vanilla every Sunday.

If Kubiak would swallow his pride on some things, he might save his job.

 

[Texan_Bill]

Kubiak, in my view, has brought in sub-par people--

Sorry Polo, the guys you mention are "sub-par"

This is a really ignorant statement.

Mike Sherman
Alex Gibbs
and Ray Rhodes would like to disagree with you

Other respected coaches on this staff would also include Frank Bush and Joe Marciano.

 

[infantrycak]

Other respected coaches on this staff would also include Frank Bush and Joe Marciano.

And John Hoke who has received plenty of job offers during his time with the Texans.

 

[GP]

And John Hoke who has received plenty of job offers during his time with the Texans.

Marciano would be THE only real guy.

I posted on here, when Capers lost his job, that I wouldn't mind seeing Marciano as a HC candidate for us. People laughed me off it, saying he wasn't really a good coach; he was a rah-rah guy and good for ST but not for HC. Maybe so.

But I would definitely support a man who has HIS particular squad playing lights-out ball. He has the same talent pool that the offense and defense has access to. And he has them playing well almost every game.

Kubiak, in many ways, also did that sort of thing when he was in Denver. I'm just a fan of in-house coaches before you look elsewhere. I thought Joe would make a good HC here.

 

[Texecutioner]

Dude, why would Cowher ever come here?? LOL @ you thinking it would that easy. You make it sound like he'd be on a plane heading towards Houston as soon as McNair snaps his fingers. It has been said if (big if) he were to come back it'd be to Carolina (I think).

As much as I would love to have Cowher here, You're probably right that it would most likely be a long shot for the Texans to land him. I'm not quite sure why so many fans in here think Cowher would jump at the chance to coach here. The funny thing is, if you go to any other team's message board just about every team's fans that don't have a good team right now are screaming for Cowher as well.

Cowher will be able to go pretty much wherever he wants to go. I do think that the Texans would have a good shot though. If you were a coach, who wouldn't want to work for Mcnair in a situation like this? Most likely, I think he would go to a place where he's getting paid TOP DOLLARS and a team that is really close to winning or already is and needs that right coach to get them over the hump instead of just the playoffs.

I heard something about Carolina as well. Do you or anyone else know why that is the most likely spot that he would like to coach when he comes back? IS that where he is from or something?

 

[ChampionTexan]

As much as I would love to have Cowher here, You're probably right that it would most likely be a long shot for the Texans to land him. I'm not quite sure why so many fans in here think Cowher would jump at the chance to coach here. The funny thing is, if you go to any other team's message board just about every team's fans that don't have a good team right now are screaming for Cowher as well.

Cowher will be able to go pretty much wherever he wants to go. I do think that the Texans would have a good shot though. If you were a coach, who wouldn't want to work for Mcnair in a situation like this? Most likely, I think he would go to a place where he's getting paid TOP DOLLARS and a team that is really close to winning or already is and needs that right coach to get them over the hump instead of just the playoffs.

I heard something about Carolina as well. Do you or anyone else know why that is the most likely spot that he would like to coach when he comes back? IS that where he is from or something?

 

[Specnatz]

if your happy with the product on the field, that is your prerogative. sometimes you have to **** or get off the pot. that is where I am at with Kubiak. if he can't turn it around this year, he deserves to be fired. period.

this isn't a popularity contest or charity function. this is NFL football and if you don't win and your team isn't competitive, you lose your job. kubiak's teams have not been winning and they have looked utterly pathetic. if you want another couple years of this garbage, fine. just don't expect me to sit by and make excuses for this pathetic product.

Your the same person who called for Kubiak to be fired after the second or third game last season and the team improved. You also said after week one this season that you would still take VY over Mario, so please excuse some of us who think you do not know football from a hole in the ground. You like Cowher, and he is a fine coach been to two Super Bowls and one won. Although it is not like he took over a team that sucked. 9 - 7, 9- 7, 7 - 9 in the three years prior to him taking over. What were the Texans prior to Kubiak taking over. Going from Noll to Cowher is a hell of a lot different than going from Capers to Kubiak. Hall of Fame coach vs 2x loser.

Many around here regard Fisher as a good to very good coach and he has only been to one super bowl and lost. in his first full season he was 7-9 and then went 8-8 for 3 years in a row, by your standards he would have been fired in his second season. Sense you like to say stats do not mean anything. Rich Kotite of the Eagles went 10-6, 11-5, 8-8, and 7-9 and was fired. Of course he went to the Jets and stunk, but I am not sure if that was on him more so than the GM drafting poorly before he got there and so the team was going to stink.

Back to the Eagles .... Kotite did well the fire couple of years did that make him a good coach? From what I remember he lost the locker room and had issues with management.

This is what needs to be looked at with Kubiak. How are the players responding to him are they still trying, are they still playing hard. Of course we do have to lok at his loyalty to some of the coordinators, mainly Richard Smith. If he is just keeping Smith out of loyalty then they both need to go and this is where Rick needs to step in and look at it and figure that out. The team did improve over the course of last year, what has changed from the end of last year because there was evidence of improvement in the Denver game and the Jags game, the Colts game not so much since the team got crushed.

 

[HOU-TEX]

LOL! Right

Was Cowher the key of the Steelers success, or was it Dick LeBeau? Just something to ponder.

 

[Texan_Bill]

LOL! Right

Was Cowher the key of the Steelers success, or was it Dick LeBeau? Just something to ponder.

Or the one constant... The Rooney family