Texans Schemes?

Discussion in 'Texans Talk' started by RT22, Mar 26, 2019.

  1. austins23

    austins23 Hall of Fame

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    I checked back into this thread because I haven't received ANY PM's on this. I read through it and just what I thought....nope, no scheme!
     
  2. TheKDog

    TheKDog Hall of Fame

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    I think runs the Erhardt-Perkins offense, or at least tries to. But what has always confused me is how OBrien is run first despite belichick not having been run first in a long time. Even when OBrien had a good OL when he first got here he was run first.

    From Wikipedia:


    The Patriots run a modified "Ron Erhardt-Ray Perkins" offensive system[1] first installed by Charlie Weis under Bill Belichick. Both Ron Erhardt and Ray Perkins served as offensive assistant coaches under the defensive-minded Chuck Fairbanks while he was head coach of the Patriots in the 1970s.[1] This system is noted for its multiple formation and personnel grouping variations on a core number of base plays. Under this system, each formation and each play are separately numbered. Additional word descriptions further modify each play.

    Running gameEdit
    The Erhardt-Perkins system traditionally had a reputation[citation needed]of being a smash-mouth offense that maximizes a team's time of possession and does not frequently call upon its running backs to serve as receivers.[2] Erhardt often said, "throw to score, run to win."[3]This may have been especially true during the years Bill Parcells ran this system as the head coach of the New York Giants.[4] This system was thought[by whom?] to be particularly well suited for teams playing in harsh outdoor weather conditions of the northeast of the United States.[citation needed]

    An example of a running play under this system is Zero, Ride Thirty-six. Zero sets the formation. Thirty indicates who will be the ball carrier running with the ball. Six indicates which hole between the offensive linemen the ball carrier will attempt to run through (see Offensive Nomenclature).[citation needed]

    Passing gameEdit
    This offense traditionally used the run to set up the pass via play-action passing, faking the run in order to throw deep downfield when the defense is least expecting it. Despite its earlier reputation, this system is no longer a run first offense. Erhardt commonly ran the system in his later years spread wide open with multiple receivers (earning the moniker "Air Erhardt"), as NFL rules evolved to benefit the passing game. As a result of this influence, the Patriots will frequently run this offense with five potential receivers and an empty backfield should a favorable matchup present itself or as a function of available personnel. With the addition of Randy Moss and Wes Welker to the Patriots offense in 2007, the Patriots placed an emphasis on a wide open passing attack (with record setting results).[5] As rules of the NFL have loosened to favor the offense, the Patriots have increasingly adopted a wide open approach, to the point that they are often now thought of as a short pass first team. The Patriots have also made good extensive use of the non huddle offense to tire out defensive personnel and to disallow substitutions.
     
  3. FuzzyLogic

    FuzzyLogic Mathematically Possible

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    The scheme was to get you to check this thread again - it worked.

    On a side note and completely unrelated to your post - there are some folks on here that seriously need to evaluate if being a fan of anything is worth the amount of stress and angst it seems to cause them.
     
  4. Mr teX

    Mr teX Hall of Fame

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    The stats as shown here in several gameday threads and elsewhere in other ways show that he is more of a balanced playcaller that actually leans more towards the pass than the run. This falls in line with 2 guys that he's gone on record and said he learned alot of his offensive stuff from in George O'leary & Ralph Friedgen at GT/Maryland..the latter being legendary for his balanced attack-type playcalling. He spent just as much time there as he did with Belichick in NE.

    As for the Pats, it hasn't been Brady just dropping back 30+ times a game for the last 15 years. they have been run heavy/1st.......whatever when they've needed to be. That's why guys like Steven Ridley & Legarette Blount can come out of nowhere for them 1 year & rush for 1400 yards and double digit TD's on 300 attempts as recently as 2016 and be noone the next year. why an off-brand dude like Jonas Gray can run for 4 TD's in a game & never be heard from again.

    They run a modified E-P scheme that is heavily influenced by what Brady can do & the match up nightmare Gronk presented.

    Reid runs a modified WCO scheme & is known as a "genius" playcaller/designer. His scheme looked ok with Alex Smith. It absolutely exploded with a Mahomes level talent running it & the talent all over it.
     
  5. Earl34

    Earl34 All Pro

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    It’s a nebulous mixture of the original E+P scheme, with a dash of the modified version being run by the Patriots, with a sprinkle of concepts from O’Leary’s Georgia Tech offenses.

    At the end of the day, it’s a multiple formation offense designed to disguise a run up the middle with WRs winning their one on one matchups with minimum combination routes or pick plays to take advantage of the modern NFL passing rules.
     
  6. TheKDog

    TheKDog Hall of Fame

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    Lots of ISO routes for the WRs
     
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  7. HaveMercy

    HaveMercy Passing Through

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    Those are some excellent posts, thank you, Gentlemen. Maybe you can comment on something I've been wondering. With an ever-growing number of NFL players with extensive experience in and suitability for wide open College offenses, why don't we see more of that in the NFL? Is it because guys like BoB are older guys sticking to old ways?
    Sorry, I'm not sure what specifically to call those College offenses...spread? ...but I know they have names and different concepts. I guess that's why guys like Kliff Kingsbury are getting HC jobs. Can't BoB adapt and adopt?
     
    Last edited: Apr 19, 2019
  8. Rich Schmidt

    Rich Schmidt Myopicone

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    I think the NFL dreads the turnover, and wide open seems more risky. Also can hurt your TOP and tire out your defense, so they go wide open in spots. In the NFL, guys are not near as open, and wide open also means your franchise QB may be getting whacked with minimal protection. So probably TOP, turnovers, and QB lifespan
     
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  9. ATXtexanfan

    ATXtexanfan Site Contributor

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    Outside of OB scheming an extension I got nothing
     
  10. Earl34

    Earl34 All Pro

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    Agree with your comments. Also, Chip Kelly tried it with his offense, a nutrition program and even sports science. It didn't matter because NFL rosters do not have the depth of college rosters. The 16 game schedule, the defensive speed and the ability of opposing defenses to adjust. It's just not sustainable.

    It will be interesting to see what Kingsbury incorporates into the Cardinals offense
     


  11. HaveMercy

    HaveMercy Passing Through

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    Knowing that Watson will learn and expand his skillset, I still want the offense to incorporate what he does best and what comes most naturally. Modify it a bit, tweak it here and there, but too much too fast will be counter-productive. I wonder how wise and adaptable...maybe even innovative...BOB will prove to be.
     
  12. HaveMercy

    HaveMercy Passing Through

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    So, will BOB copy and borrow and adapt what works with Mahomes and a few others, along what will be tried by Kingsbury? Our scheme obviously needs a lot of work. I also wonder if BOB is already inclined to try new ideas but has been held back by personnel limitations. I guess we'll find out. I can hardly wait to see what the newly drafted players will allow BOB to do with the scheme...if he's so inclined. The buck does stop at his desk, right?
     
    Last edited: Apr 19, 2019
  13. Texansballer74

    Texansballer74 Hall of Fame

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    No he is not about to run what's being ran in KC. He is hell bent on running his version of the E+P.
     
  14. HaveMercy

    HaveMercy Passing Through

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    To be clear, I'm not advocating for O'Brien to be fired right now, because that's not going to happen no matter what this MB has to say. I am advocating that he grows as a coach and takes his scheme forward with him.
    I guess I've kicked that horse enough for now. But tomorrow is a new day and I like stating the obvious with great authority. That's why my MB name is what it is.
     
  15. infantrycak

    infantrycak Admin & Mod Staff Member

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    What scheme?
     
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  16. JB

    JB Old Curmudgeon

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    I don't know why everyone wants a set scheme... OB told us when he was hired that he was going to run a 'game plan' offense that would change every week depending on opponent. Most seemed to like it at the time, but now they want consistency?
     
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  17. ArlingtonTexan

    ArlingtonTexan Moderator Staff Member

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    The Texans could run the wing-T or the veer and if the Texans put up 30 points a game most fans (even on this board) would not be worried about the darn scheme. There is the naive negative crowd always find something bytch about, but that's their problem.
     
  18. HaveMercy

    HaveMercy Passing Through

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    Coach OB has a plan in his mind, but because we can't categorize it, we're just not sure what it is. He knows what he wants to do week to week, based on the opponent and what he sees as the Texans strengths and weaknesses. All of those things shift at least a bit from week to week. But he does have conceptual ideas he wants to implement, and that constitutes a bag of schemes, a hodge-podge of schemes, so to speak, from which he picks and chooses. He thinks being flexible gives his team an advantage. The results of that approach have been hit or miss, for sure. Only time will tell if he gets better at it.

    As many here have said, much better than I can, I'd really like to see more 3 step drops with quick releases to crossing patterns, RBs, and WRs before the defense locks in. But he has a scheme...a plan...in his mind... it's just not what most of us on this MB want to see.
     
    Last edited: Apr 20, 2019
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  19. JB

    JB Old Curmudgeon

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    I think he depends on everyone on the offense seeing the same thing (the defense) is doing a bit too much and we have never had consistent players across the board to grow together. E-P is not simple to learn when pieces are changing year to year and sometimes game to game. Everyone has to see the same and think the same, and that clearly has not been happening... ie. Hopkins failing to look for the quick pass on an obvious blitz, or Watson not recognizing an obvious free blitzer from the CB/S position. He can call great plays, but if all 11 don't do their job it fails and looks worse than high school offense
     
  20. Speedy

    Speedy Yeller Dweller

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    Don't know why people think OB is going to change after 5 years.

    Can't say I ever thought much of that idea. Do something, be good at it and make teams adjust to you. This game plan bullshit is just that, bullshit. Sure, you tweak things depending on your opponent, try to exploit their weaknesses, but identify with something, get good at it, and be that.

    For 5 years, whatever "scheme" OB is trying to run he either hasn't brought in the personnel to run it and/or the personnel he does bring in doesn't fit what he's trying to do. So afraid Watson's career will be wasted away because OB won't adapt to what Watson does well and instead forces him to run this game plan no identity bullshit that he's determined as **** to run.

    OB is crap for innovation, adaptability, and design. And he hasn't proven to be much better in talent evaluation either. How this guy got a freaking 4 year extension just blows me away.
     
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