Personnel or coaching? Chicken or the egg?

Discussion in 'Texans Talk' started by TheRealJoker, Sep 27, 2009.

  1. TheRealJoker

    TheRealJoker Hall of Fame

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    What's the problem with this team? Is it the lack of a DT who can hold the LOS or a SS that can tackle? Or is it poor coaching decisions? Why does Steve Slaton only get 12 carries in a close game when he averages 6 yards a carry. You go into pass mode like the run wasn't going anywhere and let Schaub take unnecessary punishment.

    It seems like the lack of a DT/SS personnel wise is holding the defense back. If Kubiak wants to save his job he's gonna have to trade a high draft choice to get an NFL starter to take over one of those positions or else its gonna mean we need to score 30+ points to win a game this year which is a recipe for yet another mediocre season.

    Coaching wise we still have inconsistency across the board and head scratching play calls throughout. We had absolutely no answer for Del Rio's misdirection WR reverse/RB handoff/QB keeper plays they ran repeatedly and did I mention we unnecessarily let our QB take too much punishment when we could've ran the ball with success in a close game?

    This team is the Jekyll and Hyde of the NFL, that mainly falls on the coaching staff. But they also dont have NFL talent at DT or SS which is why teams can notch 200+ rushing yards on us routinely and that falls at Rick Smith's feet for not supplying us with the proper talent at those positions. You tried to hit on Amobi and thus far have failed but at SS and with the rest of the DTs you rely on either street FAs or late round picks. That tells me we severely undervalue two positions that have proven to be extremely important to winning championships.

    This aint late 90s Denver and we dont have an Alex Gibbs equivalent coaching defense. You cant take anyone and put them in at DT or SS and expect them to be studs like you could with RBs back in your heyday Houston Broncos coaches and FO!!!
     
  2. TexanBacker93

    TexanBacker93 Hall of Fame

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    I think it is a combination of both. I know that's the easy way out, but I don't think a coaching change by itself would make the ultimate difference and I don't think replacing a couple of weak links would push us over the top.
     
  3. TexansFanatic

    TexansFanatic Extremist

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    The answer, of course, is it's both. The problem is both coaching and personnel.

    Having said that, I think a really solid defensive coordinator could make something respectable of the talent the Texans already have.
     
  4. TheRealJoker

    TheRealJoker Hall of Fame

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    So you mean if we actually hired a bonafide NFL DC and paid him top dollar we'd see a real defense? That sounds very similar to what a similar style team did in the offseason...they're 3-0

    For those who dont get the reference i'm talking about last year's all offense no defense 8-8 team the New Orleans Saints who are now 3-0 and look great.
     
  5. texanhead08

    texanhead08 Hall of Fame

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    This defense needs talent. The Texans knew this defense needed a lot and in the draft they draft 2 TE's. I still don't understand that and I never will either.
     
  6. TexansFanatic

    TexansFanatic Extremist

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    I hear you. I got the reference. And it sort of makes me sick that Gregg Williams was there for the taking and the Texans promoted an assistant from their own crappy defensive staff.
     
  7. TexanBacker93

    TexanBacker93 Hall of Fame

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    Kubiak doesn't seem to be willing to go off his myspace friends list for a coach. I guess Koller would count, but all the others seem to be guys he played with or coached with or coached.
     
  8. Mr teX

    Mr teX Hall of Fame

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    Kinda helps when your offense drops damn near 50 every game. Besides, Greg Williams was Jax's D-coordinator last year & jax on defense was garbage. Having said that, i guess you know what side i fall on. It's personnel, it just has to be. The signs are obvious.

    you're expecting run so you call a play that packs the box with 8-10 guys and you still can't stop it....

    Guys missing tackles left and right....

    Blitzing all kind of ways..........and still not getting good pressure....

    Do i even have to mention the musical chairs in the secondary?

    guys who would be special teamers elsewhere are getting signifcant time playing with us.

    This has been the case through 2 defensive coordinators so far and 1 guy who, league wide is thought to be one of the better defensive minds in the game (Capers) & we still can't get it right. We've drafted horribly on that side of the ball with the exception of a couple of guys and every FA we've brought in hasn't worked out.
     
    Last edited: Sep 27, 2009


  9. LonerATO

    LonerATO Hall of Fame

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    Saints D looks great with pretty much Jenkins as their best player in the secondary and the Saints LB's aren't as good as the Texans. The Saints have a good front four.
     
  10. Runner

    Runner Hubcap Diamond Staff Member

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    Talent and coaching, IMO.

    I think the term Smithiak is turning from an "in Kubes we trust" euphemism to a one word sarcastic summary.
     
  11. Carr Bombed

    Carr Bombed Hall of Fame

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    The Saints have the 11th ranked defense (which would've been more than enough here) and they've been making plays all season so far...(they pretty much shut down Buffalo and TO today).....it's not just the high powered offense. Our offense might drop damn near 50 points a game if they got the ball back more often.

    Also Gregg Williams gets a pass in Jax. He was only there for 1 season, the team's chemistry was in the dumpster, and since they have a defensive head coach, I question how much of the defense JDR actually let Williams control.

    Williams is a PROVEN defensive coach, who has had great defensive success elsewhere....to not even give a guy like that a interview (or interview ANYBODY) was completely stupid by Kubiak and the FO.
     
    Last edited: Sep 27, 2009
  12. LonerATO

    LonerATO Hall of Fame

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    I can only assume that the FO expects Daniels to walk and not pay him, so they drafted Casey to take his place. Hill was drafted to block in the RZ since the Texans sucked so bad in the RZ last year in rushing TD's
     
  13. Goldensilence

    Goldensilence hipster elite

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    Answer. A coaching staff that doesn't know how to get proper personnel.
     
  14. LonerATO

    LonerATO Hall of Fame

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    Since Smith was a DB and a DB coach he seems to think that he can find those amazing gems for the secondary in the later rounds.
     
  15. Marcus

    Marcus Ruthless pragmatist

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    Blaming the problems on defense on the fact that we didn't hire a "a bonafide NFL DC" is not only the easy way out, it is the cheap 'looking for the quick-fix way' out.

    I know there is a strong group here that is collectively pissed off that they hired Frank Bush, so I realize that anytime that they lose a game, the same song with the "they didn't hire an experienced DC, so that's why they lost" lyrics will played over and over like a record with a scratch in it.

    Yes, it's up to the coaches to get the players ready to play, and it's up to the coaches to select the right players.

    But once that is done, it's up to the players to perform. Yes, there is talent on the team. But those players who do have the talent are young, raw, and inexperienced. Missed tackles combined with missed assignments?

    Anyone who wants to lay this all on coaching, and not hold players accountable, is of the mindset of "well, you can't fire the players, and coaches are the only ones that can be fired, so let's fire them, so we can all feel better".

    That's just the way I see it.
     
  16. Norg

    Norg Hall of Fame

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    hmmm

    - we are still soft in the middle IMO in the D line Amobi & cody are just not getting it done

    - Antinto Smith is SLighty Better then Weaver :P Mario cant do it by himself Casey is still just a rookie and Bullman is up and down

    -Our secondary Vets and rookies are not getting it done i can name off the list Mcain Quinn Bushing WIlson Barber BENNENT and even Dunta are all playing ZONE and leaving a cushion and not playing smart football

    Our linebackers are FINE IMO ... and thats pretty much sums up our D talnted on paper not getting it done on the field
     
  17. Mr teX

    Mr teX Hall of Fame

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    To put it in another perspective about personnel, we're only considered strong in one area on defense which is at Lb. we absolutely stink as far as talent everywhere else.. 1.5 of our guys on the d-line are considered good & .5 in the secondary. That's pathetic.
     
  18. TexansSeminole

    TexansSeminole Hall of Fame

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    It's both.

    What I keep coming back to is that the coaches had enough time to improve the personnel. Not addressing DT and the two safety spots this past offseason is the latest example. So, even though some of it is personnel it still reflects poorly on the coaches/GM. People may say that the GM is the one that makes all those decisions but I don't see it that way. If your a coach and you need a position or two or three upgraded to be successful you need to make yourself heard.
     
  19. Carr Bombed

    Carr Bombed Hall of Fame

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    It's also on the coaches to develop talent........something we've done a HORRIBLE job at over the years. Not every team spends 1st rounders every single year on defense. Good defensive teams develop talent......when's the last time you heard of a player that we drafted late who actually turned into something? (we have plenty on the offensive side of the ball)....there's Diles annnnd that's about it. That's the reason why you can't just give the coaches a pass and say "well the talent wasn't very good" yada yada yada.

    The correct answer is both, but I'm leaning more towards coaching at the moment. When you're making the same stupid mistakes week after week after week and you just look flat out unprepared........that's coaching.
     
  20. Norg

    Norg Hall of Fame

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    and u would think our O would stink since we rarely ad anything to it



    Capers era our O sucked and D was average

    Kubes era our O is Great and our D right now is Below Average


    What cant we have both :(
     

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