Matt Leinart is better than Vince Young

[texplayer2]

thats a false arguement. its like saying the colts should be nfl champions because vic carruci has them #1 in his power rankings. USC wasnt in the BCS championship game. Period. Thats the closest thing you have in college football to a playoff. USC wasnt playing for the national championship, and the AP poll violated their agreement to recognize the bcs champion. LSU won it fair and square, and the split championship was bs. Then, that shoe didnt apply the next year when they won the bcs game and auburn went undefeated...where is the split national championship game? USC=1 BCS Championship, LSU= 1 BCS championship, UT=1 BCS Championship. Thats the only way you crown a champion right now. The Associated Press has no bearing, and no Trophy.

Auburn Was not ranked #1 last year. USC and Oklahoma were seen as the best two teams by actual people. The year before SC was ranked ahead of both LSU and Oklahoma in both Polls that were not computer generated. The coaches were made to agree because they said they would, but the AP was not involved in that obligation. They should have done an error check on their program before it was implimented, but with most programming now days they put it out there and provide patches as you go. Along these lines if you put your taxes in a program and you know you should only pay $500 dollars, but the program says you owe $2000 dollars, you go ahead and pay it .......don't you?

 

[texplayer2]

thats a false arguement. its like saying the colts should be nfl champions because vic carruci has them #1 in his power rankings. USC wasnt in the BCS championship game. Period. .

The NFL settles all the speculation on the Field, BcS does not. I do not always agree with poll makers as I said in regards to UT's current place at less than #1. But having all the coaches and AP say a team is #1 before being REQUIRED to vote another way doesn't work for me. You are the Best until some beats you. Ask Mac Brown about that, he voted for SC in the final poll of the regular season and then went out and took that spot.

 

[swtbound07]

Auburn Was not ranked #1 last year. USC and Oklahoma were seen as the best two teams by actual people. The year before SC was ranked ahead of both LSU and Oklahoma in both Polls that were not computer generated. The coaches were made to agree because they said they would, but the AP was not involved in that obligation. They should have done an error check on their program before it was implimented, but with most programming now days they put it out there and provide patches as you go. Along these lines if you put your taxes in a program and you know you should only pay $500 dollars, but the program says you owe $2000 dollars, you go ahead and pay it .......don't you?

it doesnt matter though...the point is that you cant set up a system, and then disregard the result of the system when it delivers an undesireable result. Its not about the #1 ranking by people polls...people are BIASED, thats why computers are used in the system. The thing is, you cant just arbitrarily award USC a national championship...its insulting to the system, and its quite demeaning to what LSU accomplished on the field that year. Im by no means saying the BCS is perfect, cause it aint, but if you are going to say USC got screwed by the computers, i can make that same arguement for auburn, for Utah, for boise state pre bowl game. You agree to be a part of the system, you be a part of the system. The system was designed to do one thing, which is prevent split national championships. You dont get to make a split national championship when you dont like what the system does. USC has one championship. Period.

 

[thunderkyss]

the ap poll basically laughed in the face of the bcs system and went completely against what they said they would...that would be the same as the ap poll declaring auburn national champions last year. USC's first was bogus...oklahoma game was the only legit championship

I think it should've been Auburn & USC....... I really don't believe that Oklahoma team should've been #2.

 

[texplayer2]

it doesnt matter though...the point is that you cant set up a system, and then disregard the result of the system when it delivers an undesireable result. Its not about the #1 ranking by people polls...people are BIASED, thats why computers are used in the system. The thing is, you cant just arbitrarily award USC a national championship...its insulting to the system, and its quite demeaning to what LSU accomplished on the field that year. Im by no means saying the BCS is perfect, cause it aint, but if you are going to say USC got screwed by the computers, i can make that same arguement for auburn, for Utah, for boise state pre bowl game. You agree to be a part of the system, you be a part of the system. The system was designed to do one thing, which is prevent split national championships. You dont get to make a split national championship when you dont like what the system does. USC has one championship. Period.

If the system gives you a result contrary to the truth I will always go with the truth. The Coaches agreed because they were obligated and probably forced to comply. The AP which was also recognized by the BCS was not obligated and was based on reporting a ranking rather than establishing one. Just because you belong to BCS establishment, doesn't mean the majority are. Fact is I believe most people have found many problems with the BCS and you have to trust the system to follow it. If a large group of people didn't believe a three-peat was possible, then where did it come from?

 

[swtbound07]

If the system gives you a result contrary to the truth I will always go with the truth. The Coaches agreed because they were obligated and probably forced to comply. The AP which was also recognized by the BCS was not obligated and was based on reporting a ranking rather than establishing one. Just because you belong to BCS establishment, doesn't mean the majority are. Fact is I believe most people have found many problems with the BCS and you have to trust the system to follow it. If a large group of people didn't believe a three-peat was possible, then where did it come from?

Here is the problem with your arguement...the truth is very subjective in this case...could USC have beaten LSU on the field that year? could they have beaten auburn? You never know...its impossible to know. USC could have 3 peated the AP championship. However, they didnt, and they only got one BCS championship. I dont belong to a BCS establishment, but the point is again that people are more biased than computers. LSU got the nod, and USC would have done well to just accept that. When you change the system to a playoff, then you can make a case for USC, but until then, i gotta say, you work the system you have. A lot of people have a problem with the electoral vote system of electing president....Gore won 1 part of it in 2000, but not the other. He doesnt get to go around calling himself the president. You use the system you have, or you change it. You dont subvert it.

 

[BlueThunder]

Oh,I don't agree with this post at all.Wheres the rest of Vince's stats


The other half of his game thats missing.All them rushing yards and the 10 rushing TDs.

Vince Young is ranked above Matt Leinart in total yards and Vinve had to run for his also..

Vince averaged 159 yards passing a game and Matt averaged 156

Matt Leinart threw 3 ints in the Rose Bowl and if it wasn't for his all american WR there would have been more..

 

[MorKnolle]

Oh,I don't agree with this post at all.Wheres the rest of Vince's stats


The other half of his game thats missing.All them rushing yards and the 10 rushing TDs.

Vince Young is ranked above Matt Leinart in total yards and Vinve had to run for his also..

Vince averaged 159 yards passing a game and Matt averaged 156

Matt Leinart threw 3 ints in the Rose Bowl and if it wasn't for his all american WR there would have been more..

What are you talking about with this post?

 

[texplayer2]

Here is the problem with your arguement...the truth is very subjective in this case...could USC have beaten LSU on the field that year? could they have beaten auburn? You never know...its impossible to know. USC could have 3 peated the AP championship. However, they didnt, and they only got one BCS championship. I dont belong to a BCS establishment, but the point is again that people are more biased than computers. LSU got the nod, and USC would have done well to just accept that. When you change the system to a playoff, then you can make a case for USC, but until then, i gotta say, you work the system you have. A lot of people have a problem with the electoral vote system of electing president....Gore won 1 part of it in 2000, but not the other. He doesnt get to go around calling himself the president. You use the system you have, or you change it. You dont subvert it.

If you believe the BCS works you are part of the system. I will question the results of any system that doesn't work. BCS was not meant to pit #1vs #2 or it would have all the time. It was meant to establish certain conferences and bowls as the power brokers in college football. The way I see it the computers actually deprived LSU of a REAL NC because they had to play Oklahoma in a consulation game and didn't get to face the REAL #! team at that point. So this year the Texas Longhorns beat the two-time defending national champs.

 

[texplayer2]

..could USC have beaten LSU on the field that year? could they have beaten auburn? You never know...its impossible to know. .

By the way USC 23 Auburn 0 the year you think they weren't #1. First game of the season.

 

[swtbound07]

By the way USC 23 Auburn 0 the year you think they weren't #1. First game of the season.

2 different teams, 2 different years...no way to know. By the way...they werent number 1. I guess we could debate this until eternity, but i spose we should just agree to disagree

 

[kbourda]

Keep in mind this post started before the college football season.

http://www.houstontexans.com/fan_zone/messageboards/showthread.php?t=10438on.

 

[YoungnotBush]

Plain and simple, I'd rather have Leinart than Young here.

What does VY have going for him?
Heart of a champion
Accurate Passer
Very mobile

What does Leinart have?
Same champions heart
More accurate passer
Not mobile, but doesn't need to be because of superior pocket presence
Calls his own plays

VY had a good junior year, true, but Leinart had 3 incredible seasons. I'd take consistency over 1 good game any day.

Matts stats:
2003 255/402 (63.4%) for 3556 38 TDs and 9 INTs
2004 269/412 (65.3%) for 3322 33 TDs and 6 INTs
2005 283/431 (65.7%) for 3815 28 TDs and 8 INTs

VY stats:
2003 84/143 (58.7%) for 1155 6 TDs and 7 INTs
2004 148/250 (59.2%) for 1849 12 TDs and 11 INTs
2005 212/325 (65.2%) for 3036 26 TDs and 10 INTs

If all you Longhorn fans really think we need a QB, why isn't Leinart even being considered? Because he's not from Texas? Thats ridiculous. He has shown for his ENTIRE career that he is a winner who gets it done. His worst season was still better than VYs best season as a passer. Sure he doesn't move around as much, but NFL quarterbacks aren't supposed to move around. Thats how you get hurt, just look at Vick. The fact of the matter is, Leinart is a MUCH BETTER NFL prospect than VY. He throws the ball perfectly. He is smart. He is calm. He reads defenses better, and he even calls his own plays. VY is a gamble, and may turn out great, but also may turn out badly

You said it:

"Not Mobile"

Do you mean drew bledsoe "Not Mobile" or peyton manning "Not Mobile"?

And don't even think about saying Brady.

You have to have some mobility at the QB spot.

 

[tulexan]

You don't have to have some mobility at the QB spot.

Dan Marino was one of the least mobile QBs in league history. Are you telling me that he wasn't a good QB. And why not include Brady? He isn't a mobile QB at all.

 

[YoungnotBush]

If all you Longhorn fans really think we need a QB, why isn't Leinart even being considered? Because he's not from Texas? Thats ridiculous. He has shown for his ENTIRE career that he is a winner who gets it done. His worst season was still better than VYs best season as a passer. Sure he doesn't move around as much, but NFL quarterbacks aren't supposed to move around. Thats how you get hurt, just look at Vick. The fact of the matter is, Leinart is a MUCH BETTER NFL prospect than VY. He throws the ball perfectly. He is smart. He is calm. He reads defenses better, and he even calls his own plays. VY is a gamble, and may turn out great, but also may turn out badly

B/c Leinart isn't a Texas legend.

Do you think that the Oilers should have passed on Earl Campbell?

Let's face it Vince is going to sell season tickets. His face is going to be everywhere nationwide.

He has already started by hosting an All-star special for TNT on NBA.com during the week before the All-star game. He is going to be the most marketable guy out there.

Vick has still been further than LT. And won more playoff games.

 

[YoungnotBush]

You don't have to have some mobility at the QB spot.

Dan Marino was one of the least mobile QBs in league history. Are you telling me that he wasn't a good QB. And why not include Brady? He isn't a mobile QB at all.

Dan Marino never won a Super Bowl. Brady gets the tough yards. He is mobile, he is not a scrambler by any means though. Peyton Manning and those "Not Mobile" QB's don't get the tough yards and those 6 or 7 yard first downs. Brady does.

the only problem is, that you can't teach anyone how to run like Vince Young, but Imagine if you could teach Vince Young to throw like a Brady. That is at least possible.

A whole lot easier than teaching David Carr how to win.

 

[tulexan]

And Reggie Bush won't sell tickets and merchandise?

Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't there a Bush Bowl in December? Wasn't Reggie the Heisman winner? Reggie Bush will be just as marketable, if not more, than Vince nationwide. Outside of the Houston bubble, almost everyone agrees that Reggie is the best player in the draft. The argument isn't so much Reggie v. Vince, it is Reggie v. Trade down.

 

[MorKnolle]

And Reggie Bush won't sell tickets and merchandise?

Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't there a Bush Bowl in December? Wasn't Reggie the Heisman winner? Reggie Bush will be just as marketable, if not more, than Vince nationwide. Outside of the Houston bubble, almost everyone agrees that Reggie is the best player in the draft. The argument isn't so much Reggie v. Vince, it is Reggie v. Trade down.

Vince Young will be more marketable around the Houston area and most of Texas, Reggie Bush will be as marketable if not more marketable than Vince nationwide and will draw more national attention to the Texans. No matter who the Texans draft, they will fill the stadium every week. There are over 4 million people in the Houston area and I"m pretty sure we can find 72,000 to fill the stadium every Sunday, last time I checked there was a 7-8 year waiting list for season tickets, so I'm hoping that after we don't draft Vince half of those people drop off and I can get my tickets sooner, but either way we will still sell tickets. As for merchandise sale, again we will sell more stuff around Texas if we get Vince, probably sell more nationally if we get Bush, but either way merchandise sale and all that goes under the shared revenues so it's not going to really help our team at all to sell a bunch more jerseys.

As for the original argument, if people sincerely believed the main problem with our team was David Carr and that we really needed a new QB, then they would have to mention Matt Leinart as an option because right now he clearly is the better QB between the two. Vince is more athletic and has more upside potential than Matt, but as of now Leinart is the better QB. This leads me to believe that many of these people don't really think Carr is the big problem and has to be replaced, they are just fans of Vince Young and want to see him come here, and there's nothing wrong with wanting your favorite player to come to your team, but some people do need to evaluate the situation a little more realistically than they are (i.e. people saying that the Texans will always suck if we don't get Vince or that Vince will instantly come in and we will be playoff contenders just from his presence on the team, etc.)

 

[swtbound07]

Vince Young will be more marketable around the Houston area and most of Texas, Reggie Bush will be as marketable if not more marketable than Vince nationwide and will draw more national attention to the Texans. No matter who the Texans draft, they will fill the stadium every week. There are over 4 million people in the Houston area and I"m pretty sure we can find 72,000 to fill the stadium every Sunday, last time I checked there was a 7-8 year waiting list for season tickets, so I'm hoping that after we don't draft Vince half of those people drop off and I can get my tickets sooner, but either way we will still sell tickets. As for merchandise sale, again we will sell more stuff around Texas if we get Vince, probably sell more nationally if we get Bush, but either way merchandise sale and all that goes under the shared revenues so it's not going to really help our team at all to sell a bunch more jerseys.

As for the original argument, if people sincerely believed the main problem with our team was David Carr and that we really needed a new QB, then they would have to mention Matt Leinart as an option because right now he clearly is the better QB between the two. Vince is more athletic and has more upside potential than Matt, but as of now Leinart is the better QB. This leads me to believe that many of these people don't really think Carr is the big problem and has to be replaced, they are just fans of Vince Young and want to see him come here, and there's nothing wrong with wanting your favorite player to come to your team, but some people do need to evaluate the situation a little more realistically than they are (i.e. people saying that the Texans will always suck if we don't get Vince or that Vince will instantly come in and we will be playoff contenders just from his presence on the team, etc.)

Its a faulty arguement to say that if we were serious about needing a qb change that leinart is an option. You need a mobile quarterback if your offensive line is going to be atrocious. Im sorry if you dont feel that way, but i do. The ability to throw on the run, and escape pressure is key to success when your o-line is as porous as your average spaghetti strainer. Matt Leinart would have no more success in houston than david carr or peyton manning. The only other person you could reasonably put in the discussion with vince young is mike vick, and he isnt as good a passer. Im going to pose the same question i've posed for a long time. The arguement for david carr is "he has never had a chance to succeed, namely no offensive line". You know what? what if he NEVER gets those things...how long are you going to let him fail without accepting some of the blame for his own failure. Eventually if we are going to win somebody is going to have to step up and win with the personnel we have in place...and david has shown it wont be him.

 

[texplayer2]

Its a faulty arguement to say that if we were serious about needing a qb change that leinart is an option. You need a mobile quarterback if your offensive line is going to be atrocious. Im sorry if you dont feel that way, but i do. The ability to throw on the run, and escape pressure is key to success when your o-line is as porous as your average spaghetti strainer. Matt Leinart would have no more success in houston than david carr or peyton manning. The only other person you could reasonably put in the discussion with vince young is mike vick, and he isnt as good a passer. Im going to pose the same question i've posed for a long time. The arguement for david carr is "he has never had a chance to succeed, namely no offensive line". You know what? what if he NEVER gets those things...how long are you going to let him fail without accepting some of the blame for his own failure. Eventually if we are going to win somebody is going to have to step up and win with the personnel we have in place...and david has shown it wont be him.

Vince will do no better behind a porus line than Lienert. Young has had an excellent line to work behind and the few plays where SC got through the line with a blitz I saw hurried throws and at least one fumble that Texas recovered. It will take him (awhile) to get up to speed with NFL defenses.

 

[MorKnolle]

Its a faulty arguement to say that if we were serious about needing a qb change that leinart is an option. You need a mobile quarterback if your offensive line is going to be atrocious. Im sorry if you dont feel that way, but i do. The ability to throw on the run, and escape pressure is key to success when your o-line is as porous as your average spaghetti strainer. Matt Leinart would have no more success in houston than david carr or peyton manning. The only other person you could reasonably put in the discussion with vince young is mike vick, and he isnt as good a passer. Im going to pose the same question i've posed for a long time. The arguement for david carr is "he has never had a chance to succeed, namely no offensive line". You know what? what if he NEVER gets those things...how long are you going to let him fail without accepting some of the blame for his own failure. Eventually if we are going to win somebody is going to have to step up and win with the personnel we have in place...and david has shown it wont be him.

That's why you fix the OLine finally, especially in a draft with so many good OLinemen and all these high picks for us. VY will not be able to succeed behind our OLine either if we don't improve it, that is the single biggest need for our team. We shouldn't have most of this personnel in place, this team was built with a lot of lousy guys that are special teams-type players because our previous coaching staff didn't know how to assemble good players. That has hopefully changed now.

Many VY supporters keep saying that we can draft VY (or Bush supporters saying we can draft Bush) and still fix up our OLine and other holes later in the draft, but you seem to think we are stuck with all the rest of our team and only have this one pick to change things. As has been duly pointed out several times by people in both the VY and Bush camps, we have three other picks in the top 66, we have free agency, we can add better players to our team. Other people argue that we can afford to draft Bush/VY because we can fix our other team needs later in the draft, while you argue that we are stuck with the rest of our roster (mainly our OLine) and therefore we cannot afford to draft anyone but Vince because we need a more mobile QB behind our bad OLine. This is very entertaining seeing all these argument thrown out here for one guy or another.

 

[swtbound07]

That's why you fix the OLine finally, especially in a draft with so many good OLinemen and all these high picks for us. VY will not be able to succeed behind our OLine either if we don't improve it, that is the single biggest need for our team. We shouldn't have most of this personnel in place, this team was built with a lot of lousy guys that are special teams-type players because our previous coaching staff didn't know how to assemble good players. That has hopefully changed now.

Many VY supporters keep saying that we can draft VY (or Bush supporters saying we can draft Bush) and still fix up our OLine and other holes later in the draft, but you seem to think we are stuck with all the rest of our team and only have this one pick to change things. As has been duly pointed out several times by people in both the VY and Bush camps, we have three other picks in the top 66, we have free agency, we can add better players to our team. Other people argue that we can afford to draft Bush/VY because we can fix our other team needs later in the draft, while you argue that we are stuck with the rest of our roster (mainly our OLine) and therefore we cannot afford to draft anyone but Vince because we need a more mobile QB behind our bad OLine. This is very entertaining seeing all these argument thrown out here for one guy or another.

Yes, and here is why. i completely agree we have several picks in which we COULD address our offensive line. However, im going on 4 years of history where we completely fail to address the offensive line. Just because the elephant is in the room doesnt mean the team will talk about it. If the team is proactive in addressing the biggest weakness in our franchise history, then i will back down off my arguement, but you have to admit, we have NEVER made that a priority, and i fail to see how this year will be different. This board is a place for assumptions, like last year most (not all, but a large percentage) of us assumed that if DJ somehow fell to us, we would take him in a heartbeat...welllll, he did and we didnt. Most of us this year are assuming we address the line through the draft or free agency. Well.....we might not.

 

[kastofsna]

The ability to throw on the run, and escape pressure is key to success when your o-line is as porous as your average spaghetti strainer.

funny because that's one of matt leinart's biggest strengths

 

[stevo3883]

funny because that's one of matt leinart's biggest strengths

are you joking?

Leinart is best when hes in the pocket with good protection.

 

[Coach C.]

I think he was talking about Leinhart's pocket prescense which is quite good. Yes, even better than Vince, no he is not going to beat anyone with his legs but he will buy extra time with his movement and then make an accurate throw.

 

[LikeABoss]

Matt Lienart has Tom Brady like pocket awareness.

He is not a statue in there, he sidesteps the pressure very well while never taking his eyes off his WRs. He does not get rattled by the pressure at all.

Matt can also throw well on the run as well, USC has also used him in alot of QB bootlegs and he would still place the ball exactly where it needed to be with pinpoint accuracy while on the move.

 

[stevo3883]

I think he was talking about Leinhart's pocket prescense which is quite good. Yes, even better than Vince, no he is not going to beat anyone with his legs but he will buy extra time with his movement and then make an accurate throw.

he said one of leinart's biggest strengths is throwing on the run and using his mobility to escape pressure.

thats just not true.

 

[thunderkyss]

If you guys can see the difference between Matt Lienart & Vince, then you can see the reason one guy would want to take Vince, and not Matt. Even on draft day, while you might think Lienart is the best QB in the draft, the team that picks the first QB, might not pick him for their team.

Will Matt be something in the NFL, or will he opt out, like Jason White??? I don't know. But Vince has something I want on my team. I'll admit, I've watched more Vince than Matt this year, so my judgement may be cloudy(or ernge). I do expect the NFL teams to sit down with these players, before they make their decision, soooo, there is no way I could tell you who will pick who. I can only tell you who I want them to pick.

David Carr is more to blame than anyone else on our team, for our 2-14 season. It wasn't all his fault, but he is the Quarterback..... the Defacto Leader. I think this would be the perfect time, to go a different route. Carr isn't costing us an arm and a leg... he's almost cheap as far as starting QBs go. We've got Kubiak & Sherman setting up camp on offense.... Car may bery well be gone in three years....

Vince will be ready in three years...

 

[MorKnolle]

Yes, and here is why. i completely agree we have several picks in which we COULD address our offensive line. However, im going on 4 years of history where we completely fail to address the offensive line. Just because the elephant is in the room doesnt mean the team will talk about it. If the team is proactive in addressing the biggest weakness in our franchise history, then i will back down off my arguement, but you have to admit, we have NEVER made that a priority, and i fail to see how this year will be different. This board is a place for assumptions, like last year most (not all, but a large percentage) of us assumed that if DJ somehow fell to us, we would take him in a heartbeat...welllll, he did and we didnt. Most of us this year are assuming we address the line through the draft or free agency. Well.....we might not.

We have indeed ignored it in the past, but we have a new group of guys running the team now. If Kubiak and his group deem our current OLinemen to be subpar then I'm sure they will make it a point to bring in new guys. If they feel their main problem was in coaching last year then maybe they won't bring many in and will just work on improving the guys we have. Either way I trust Kubiak's judgment.

 

[swtbound07]

We have indeed ignored it in the past, but we have a new group of guys running the team now. If Kubiak and his group deem our current OLinemen to be subpar then I'm sure they will make it a point to bring in new guys. If they feel their main problem was in coaching last year then maybe they won't bring many in and will just work on improving the guys we have. Either way I trust Kubiak's judgment.

i agree with you in trusting our new establishment, but im not going to believe it until i see it....i've thought this problem is too big an issue to ignore for several offseasons, and now im a bit jaded. We dont disagree on the needs of the club or the main points, maybe im just lacking a little faith that it will actually get done.

 

[YoungnotBush]

We have indeed ignored it in the past, but we have a new group of guys running the team now. If Kubiak and his group deem our current OLinemen to be subpar then I'm sure they will make it a point to bring in new guys. If they feel their main problem was in coaching last year then maybe they won't bring many in and will just work on improving the guys we have. Either way I trust Kubiak's judgment.

Casserly is still running the show.

 

[LikeABoss]

Casserly is still running the show.

Didn't Mr. McNair strip Casserly of alot of his duties as the team's GM when he decided to keep him on the staff?

From my understanding, Casserly just has the GM title along side his name, but he will no longer have final say on personnel decisions.

 

[edo783]

Didn't Mr. McNair strip Casserly of alot of his duties as the team's GM when he decided to keep him on the staff?

From my understanding, Casserly just has the GM title along side his name, but he will no longer have final say on personnel decisions.

Pretty much true. CC isn't THE major player anymore, but he is still A player. This is going to be a much more collabrative draft IMO, and Kubes will be A/THE major player and McNair will be part of the team. I look for a much more conventional draft after the 1st with a probable trade down in the 1st. Focusing on needs and well rated players, but the O-line guys may not fit the conventional mode as the type of zone blocking scheme will have lighter more mobile players (DBrick fits well).

 

[MorKnolle]

If you guys can see the difference between Matt Lienart & Vince, then you can see the reason one guy would want to take Vince, and not Matt. Even on draft day, while you might think Lienart is the best QB in the draft, the team that picks the first QB, might not pick him for their team.

Will Matt be something in the NFL, or will he opt out, like Jason White??? I don't know. But Vince has something I want on my team. I'll admit, I've watched more Vince than Matt this year, so my judgement may be cloudy(or ernge). I do expect the NFL teams to sit down with these players, before they make their decision, soooo, there is no way I could tell you who will pick who. I can only tell you who I want them to pick.

David Carr is more to blame than anyone else on our team, for our 2-14 season. It wasn't all his fault, but he is the Quarterback..... the Defacto Leader. I think this would be the perfect time, to go a different route. Carr isn't costing us an arm and a leg... he's almost cheap as far as starting QBs go. We've got Kubiak & Sherman setting up camp on offense.... Car may bery well be gone in three years....

Vince will be ready in three years...

Leinart isn't about to opt out. One huge difference is that Jason White had 6 different knee surgeries during his college career, Leinart hasn't. White also was not picked high in the draft at all (I don't remember if he was even drafted, and if so it was in the 6th-7th round), so Leinart isn't about to give up a $40 million contract as a top 3 pick to retire this early. He also has a much better pro-style game than White ever had, although White was certainly a great college QB.

 

[MorKnolle]

Casserly is still running the show.

Casserly was never really running the show to begin with, and as LikeABoss said Cass has been stripped of some of his duites.

 

[Big B Texan Fan]

Casserly was never really running the show to begin with, and as LikeABoss said Cass has been stripped of some of his duites.

Sounds like posturing for a firing if you ask me.

 

[jerek]

You said it:

"Not Mobile"

Do you mean drew bledsoe "Not Mobile" or peyton manning "Not Mobile"?

And don't even think about saying Brady.

You have to have some mobility at the QB spot.

Yeah, guys like Peyton Manning and Dan Marino sure sucked. The list of "not mobile" QBs who have won Super Bowls is a hell of a lot longer than the list of "mobile QBs" and that is even when you are being generous and listing guys like Montana - who could run, but usually didn't - as "mobile."

 

[kastofsna]

he said one of leinart's biggest strengths is throwing on the run and using his mobility to escape pressure.

thats just not true.

yeah it is. watch some USC games. they run a ton of rollouts and he rarely sets his feet on those passes. and he has plenty of mobility to escape pressure. not 4 guys barring down on him, but as much as the great ones, i.e. montana, brady, etc.

 

[YoungnotBush]

Casserly was never really running the show to begin with, and as LikeABoss said Cass has been stripped of some of his duites.

Then why is even there? A GM that doesn't really run the show, and now has been stripped of his duties.

What exaclty is he doing, if not personnel?

 

[YoungnotBush]

Tell me what yall think about this:

If the Texans pass on Vince and he goes to Tennessee, which is the most likely spot, that means the we have to play him twice a year AND beat him out every year for the division. Now, not only do we have to beat Peyton Manning twice a year, but also Vince. That doesn't sound to good for me.

Now think about this, because Tennessee wants Vince real bad.

For all you people that think Reggie is really the answer, then wouldn't the smart thing to do be to draft Vince and hold the Titans hostage, then trade him for the world to the titans.

New Orleans will still take Matt, because that is their biggest need. That means we could then draft Reggie at 3rd.

See I think Reggie will be around at 3. As long as we don't trade with anyone outside of 1-3, then we could get either one at 3, since Matt is pretty much a lock at 2.

Now I wouldn't care which one we got a the 3rd spot and we could still get something else also, which we need so desperately.

The 3rd spot is ideally where we wan't to pick, not only to save money on the pick, but also, because we could get something for trading down and if Reggie is there, then take Reggie, if Vince is there then take Vince. If the Titans did decide to take Reggie then we could still get Vince at the 3.

Everybody might be able to argue one or the other, but no one can argue with one and another pick or an up and coming DL or OL.

At that point, even if Leinart is there, which he won't be, it would still work out in the Texans favor.

 

[dat_boy_yec]

Tell me what yall think about this:

If the Texans pass on Vince and he goes to Tennessee, which is the most likely spot, that means the we have to play him twice a year AND beat him out every year for the division. Now, not only do we have to beat Peyton Manning twice a year, but also Vince. That doesn't sound to good for me.

Now think about this, because Tennessee wants Vince real bad.

For all you people that think Reggie is really the answer, then wouldn't the smart thing to do be to draft Vince and hold the Titans hostage, then trade him for the world to the titans.

New Orleans will still take Matt, because that is their biggest need. That means we could then draft Reggie at 3rd.

See I think Reggie will be around at 3. As long as we don't trade with anyone outside of 1-3, then we could get either one at 3, since Matt is pretty much a lock at 2.

Now I wouldn't care which one we got a the 3rd spot and we could still get something else also, which we need so desperately.

The 3rd spot is ideally where we wan't to pick, not only to save money on the pick, but also, because we could get something for trading down and if Reggie is there, then take Reggie, if Vince is there then take Vince. If the Titans did decide to take Reggie then we could still get Vince at the 3.

Everybody might be able to argue one or the other, but no one can argue with one and another pick or an up and coming DL or OL.

At that point, even if Leinart is there, which he won't be, it would still work out in the Texans favor.

I'm sorry, but why do you say that the Titans are really high on Vince. If Fisher were high on any QB I would assume it would be Cutler after he was able to work with him at the senior bowl, also from what I've read on their message boards they are also real high on all the other prospects, such as D'brick and Williams or Hawk so please tell me why the Titans would be so likely to pick Young. QB is not exactly a weakness on their team.

 

[YoungnotBush]

I'm sorry, but why do you say that the Titans are really high on Vince. If Fisher were high on any QB I would assume it would be Cutler after he was able to work with him at the senior bowl, also from what I've read on their message boards they are also real high on all the other prospects, such as D'brick and Williams or Hawk so please tell me why the Titans would be so likely to pick Young. QB is not exactly a weakness on their team.

Not exactly a weakness on a team that is rebuilding?

Most teams that rebuild want a QB like McNair to do it.

Come on, the only reason they would even keep McNair is to Mentor Vince. They are full blown rebuilding and a QB like Vince is perfect to replace McNair.

Also the word is that when Fisher was watching tape on Benson last year, he couldn't ever take is eyes of the person handing off the ball.

Don't let the hype on Cutler fool you. He is going to be good, but is not in the Vince's or Matt's ballpark right now. Imagine if Vince or Matt played in the Senior Bowl, how much hype there would be right now, not that there isn't enough anyway.

Tennessee needs a QB to hang their hat on and Vince would be the perfect replacement for McNair, not only are they similar QB's, but they are very much aquainted with each other anyway and McNair could play a couple of years in front of Vince and maybe splitting time the 2nd year or the 3rd. It is really setting up nicely for them, except they wouldn't want the Texans to know how high they were on Vince though, would they?

 

[dat_boy_yec]

Not exactly a weakness on a team that is rebuilding?

Most teams that rebuild want a QB like McNair to do it.

Come on, the only reason they would even keep McNair is to Mentor Vince. They are full blown rebuilding and a QB like Vince is perfect to replace McNair.

Also the word is that when Fisher was watching tape on Benson last year, he couldn't ever take is eyes of the person handing off the ball.

Don't let the hype on Cutler fool you. He is going to be good, but is not in the Vince's or Matt's ballpark right now. Imagine if Vince or Matt played in the Senior Bowl, how much hype there would be right now, not that there isn't enough anyway.

Tennessee needs a QB to hang their hat on and Vince would be the perfect replacement for McNair, not only are they similar QB's, but they are very much aquainted with each other anyway and McNair could play a couple of years in front of Vince and maybe splitting time the 2nd year or the 3rd. It is really setting up nicely for them, except they wouldn't want the Texans to know how high they were on Vince though, would they?

You still didn't really answer the question, McNair may know Young. But Chow worked with Leinart and Cutler, Fisher also worked with Cutler at the Bowl. Hype or no hype they would be more comfortable with either of these two guys or trading down. The argument you pose works both ways, they wouldn't want anybody to know who they're really high on would they.