Porky
Hall of Fame
I also heard most blitzed and I'm 99.9% sure that was what they said.No, they said most blitzed. I heard it as well & had a flash back to the Carr era.
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I also heard most blitzed and I'm 99.9% sure that was what they said.No, they said most blitzed. I heard it as well & had a flash back to the Carr era.
I agree with you 100%.Yea, I wish. The jig is up on Kubiak.
Predictable, routined. Kubiak was simply out-coached on that play.
The guys on 790's thoughts on that play at 45:53
I read this, and while I agree with what you are trying to say, I would counter with what your polar opposites in I and others think:
IF Schaub does recover, what does he recover to? I've seen enough in 7 years to know his ceiling is a borderline GREAT backup caliber QB or a mediocre starter, who has shown the ability to effectively manage a game for good stretches, but by no means has been the engine that makes the offense run. I've seen enough in the past 10 games he's started to have a reasonable expectation that his ceiling has already been realized and is in the rear view mirror.
You can put insert name here into the QB position and still see relative success from mediocrity given the complimenting players at RB, WR, TE and a decent OL. I give you Sage Rosenfels. no better, no worse than Schaub was. Just didn't have as long at the helm. I give you TJ Yates. again, we are in that fuzzy line of great backup/so so starter.
IMHO, you better load up on toilet paper, because I don't believe he's as good as he was, nor will be as good as you think he is.
gary: Get rid of the GIMP!
I'm definitely not excusing him. I even saw the DB was going to come on the blitz. I yelled (scared the crap out of my dog) once I noticed the fake hand off and Schaub turn to begin the boot. I still put a majority of the blame on Schaub even though Kubiak's a dictator when it comes to his scheme. Call a TO, run it (lol) or spike it.Doesn't excuse Schaub...he had a few options at his disposal within that play to not screw up....but it's like i've been telling everyone...this guy is as much the problem as Schaub is....removing 1 does not get us out of the woods of this mess we have right now.
I'm 100% with you on this one. I had no idea who Matt Schaub was except for a few blurbs regarding a game or two where he did "alright." I understand Vick was the golden child at the time, but they didn't spend 2 seconds on Matt. They found him in the third. If they can find a guy like that in the third, why couldn't we?Agreed.
Only difference is that Schaub has had more opportunities and more grooming. Honestly I felt we should've let sage be a stop gap and drafted a qb in the first round when we got a chance to.
Both were upgrades over Carr and if someone wants to argue Matt was better than Sage...ok, but I don't feel he was so much better that he has been worth the 2 2nds plus the contracts. Sage, a cheaper contract, keeping those 2 2nds and maybe having traded for a good young QB by now sounds a lot better in hindsight.
I agree they are not equivalent, but I do believe they had relative success.Sage is not equivalent to Schaub. If you had his performance in his best years, which were with the Texans, you get 2 more INTs than Schaub in this his worst year or you get 2 less TDs - take your pick. Sage was a 1 TD for 1 INT guy (TJ hasn't even been that good at 1 TD for 1.5 INTs).
I have little doubt that this Fisher Price approach to playcalling/offensive scheme is ultimately going to prevent great things with this team.modern day offensive coaching guru has a system where one can't change the play in a bad situation. Brilliant stuff. La Porte HS QB's have a better system than this for being in a bad play.
Sometimes it looks like the Smartest Man in the Stadium out thinks himself. I did not understand why they were not using the best one/two punch in the NFL to run down the clock and grind to a win. The lack of basic football logic with a typical ball-control coach is strange.It's also very tempting for the defense to blitz when the QB rarely checks out of the play.
I'm in no way absolving Schaub's responsibility for this mistake. But it was a "very,very poor play" call. The defense is not going to crash inside looking for a run on 3rd and 4. They're thinking pass. No one went for the fake as a top defense shouldn't. Schaub had no chance to make a positive play. All he could do was make the least negative play. Which would have been to curl into a ball and take the gift sack. How does Kubiak pour over these plays all week and then during the game, then make a ridiculous call like that?
Former Texan QB Sage Rosenfels joins MaD Radio to discuss how much control Matt Schaub has over the offense. Can he audible? Why dont we see more audibles? Is it that Matt Schaub just cant handle it or is there something more going on?
That's an interesting take considering how many championships have been won with the WCO.
Schaub may not be guilty of everything here, but there is no denying that he has missed wide open receivers dating back to last season and made some dumb ass throws. Don't go sainting Schaub just yet. He has more than enough culpability for his poor play in 2012 and 2013.
Here is some more BS from our HC. Ben Tate has 62 fewer yards than Arian Foster on 42 fewer carries.Texans head coach Gary Kubiak said there's no correlation between Tate's fumble and going exclusively with Arian Foster at running back late in Sunday's loss to Seattle, the Houston Chronicle reports.
Lol, thanks. I've been lurking here a long time. I just don't post much.How many Rep pts would that be? LOL
I just repped you
Welcome to the MB.
I would argue that Schaub at his best, 2009-2011 for reference, is above average or at least good enough to get us through the playoffs. People rag on stats, but you don't put up the sorts of numbers he did in those seasons without playing good football. In fact, I still believe that we are in the SB in 2011 if he was under center for the playoffs.I read this, and while I agree with what you are trying to say, I would counter with what your polar opposites in I and others think:
IF Schaub does recover, what does he recover to? I've seen enough in 7 years to know his ceiling is a borderline GREAT backup caliber QB or a mediocre starter, who has shown the ability to effectively manage a game for good stretches, but by no means has been the engine that makes the offense run. I've seen enough in the past 10 games he's started to have a reasonable expectation that his ceiling has already been realized and is in the rear view mirror.
You can put insert name here into the QB position and still see relative success from mediocrity given the complimenting players at RB, WR, TE and a decent OL. I give you Sage Rosenfels. no better, no worse than Schaub was. Just didn't have as long at the helm. I give you TJ Yates. again, we are in that fuzzy line of great backup/so so starter.
IMHO, you better load up on toilet paper, because I don't believe he's as good as he was, nor will be as good as you think he is.
gary: Get rid of the GIMP!
same feeling i have. i dont even think kubiak's system is the problem, its his play calling. Kyle Shanahan called great games when he was here.That's an interesting take considering how many championships have been won with the WCO.
Perhaps the Fisher Price version implemented by Kubiak is the root problem.
during tate's first full season playing he could have smashed 1,000 yards easily if given more carries.Here is some more BS from our HC. Ben Tate has 62 fewer yards than Arian Foster on 42 fewer carries.
http://fantasy.nfl.com/players/card?leagueId=2025226&playerId=497208
But...but...but...when Schaub looked, calling a time out wasn't on the list.Screw all the predetermined stuff; here's an option, call a timeout!
have you read sherman's quotes about the play? that should give you your answer.Not making excuses for Schaub, I don't believe he is the answer at QB anymore than most of the posts I have read here. One thing I would like to point out though, is why he gets all of the blame? Shouldn't OD have been more aggressive in that play? Notice it was blown and try and make a play for his QB? He lets Sherman knock him off the ball (and onto his butt). I didn't see a whole lot of fight there from OD.
Not making excuses for Schaub, I don't believe he is the answer at QB anymore than most of the posts I have read here. One thing I would like to point out though, is why he gets all of the blame? Shouldn't OD have been more aggressive in that play? Notice it was blown and try and make a play for his QB? He lets Sherman knock him off the ball (and onto his butt). I didn't see a whole lot of fight there from OD.
have you read sherman's quotes about the play? that should give you your answer.
Agreed with at his best 2009-2011 and the multiple rings part. He's not our best chance for now. He's a proven liability when pressured in the pocket. Our line is adding to his liability and it's high time Kubiak realizes the need to put someone back there that can actually withstand slight pressure on a regular basis.I would argue that Schaub at his best, 2009-2011 for reference, is above average or at least good enough to get us through the playoffs. People rag on stats, but you don't put up the sorts of numbers he did in those seasons without playing good football. In fact, I still believe that we are in the SB in 2011 if he was under center for the playoffs.
That said, I'm not arguing that he has another 5+ years in the tank and will retire a Texan with multiple rings. We do need to address the QB situation for the future, but he's our best chance for now and that it's a better chance than people think if he gets back to form.
It was, as characterized by both Kubiak and Tim Hasselbeck, a very, very poor play call & formation.That's an interesting take considering how many championships have been won with the WCO.
Perhaps the Fisher Price version implemented by Kubiak is the root problem.
Yes I read Sherman's quote about the play (and I think you may be referring to the quote from Earl Thomas where he states the DC knew what the play was going to be and called the right defense for it). Not sure of the point though... I'm sure in most games the defense guesses right and calls the perfect play to counter multiple times and sometimes it works and sometimes the offense still wins the play.have you read sherman's quotes about the play? that should give you your answer.
You are correct the ball should have never been thrown, and that is on Kubiak and Schaub. But in fact it was thrown and regardless of whose fault that was, there was a live ball in the air and OD was out fought for it. Sherman it seemed wanted the ball more than our player. That is a problem.First the ball should have never been thrown or if thrown is should have been yards short of both players. Second was it OD who was the target of a previous pick 6 where it appeared as though he gave up? I think it was a TE just cant remember if it was OD
This is not surprising because Kubiak always tends to run playaction and bootlegs on 3rd & short. He thinks he's a genius because he's breaking tendency from what most teams do. What he doesn't understand is that defenses have figured out his tendencies and they know he's going to throw the ball on 3rd & short. He always does. He's not tricking anyone anymore except for himself.Yes I read Sherman's quote about the play (and I think you may be referring to the quote from Earl Thomas where he states the DC knew what the play was going to be and called the right defense for it). Not sure of the point though... I'm sure in most games the defense guesses right and calls the perfect play to counter multiple times and sometimes it works and sometimes the offense still wins the play.
I've heard this a lot, but I'd like to see the actual breakdown. Does any one have access to that?This is not surprising because Kubiak always tends to run playaction and bootlegs on 3rd & short. He thinks he's a genius because he's breaking tendency from what most teams do. What he doesn't understand is that defenses have figured out his tendencies and they know he's going to throw the ball on 3rd & short. He always does. He's not tricking anyone anymore except for himself.
There are a lot of misconceptions out there.I've heard this a lot, but I'd like to see the actual breakdown. Does any one have access to that?
Also, playaction seems like something you'd want to do in that situation if you're you're going to pass. The run is much more believable. The bootleg depends on how hard they've been biting on the playaction.
I don't have the numbers in front of me, but I would say his tendency to throw on 3rd & short is much higher than any non-spread passing team (Saints, Pats, etc.).I've heard this a lot, but I'd like to see the actual breakdown. Does any one have access to that?
Also, playaction seems like something you'd want to do in that situation if you're you're going to pass. The run is much more believable. The bootleg depends on how hard they've been biting on the playaction.
I'm just going to piggy back on your post, even though it doesn't have much to do with the gist of what I like to say.It was, as characterized by both Kubiak and Tim Hasselbeck, a very, very poor play call & formation.
The best outcome was taking a sack. Matt should have tucked & ducked.
Exactly. Anyone harping on Kubiak being more predictable than any other coach is just hating. We shut the Seahawks down for 3 qtrs of the game. Part of that is that we're just that much better than them. Some of it is that they were missing three OL starters, & still credit goes to our coaches being able to break down their tendencies.Yes I read Sherman's quote about the play (and I think you may be referring to the quote from Earl Thomas where he states the DC knew what the play was going to be and called the right defense for it). Not sure of the point though... I'm sure in most games the defense guesses right and calls the perfect play to counter multiple times and sometimes it works and sometimes the offense still wins the play.
This. Kubes ain't the problem. It's not 100% Schaub either, but most of it is. A more competent executor of the plan Kubes draws up would go a long way towards helping us get to where we want to be.I'm embarrassed to be part of such an ignorant fan base.
Kubiak runs one of the most complex offenses in the NFL and it's widely regarded by defensive players and coaches and one of the most difficult schemes to prepare for. Considering the Texans are near the top of the league in offense basically every single year, how can any of you dispute that just because Seattle players orally stimulated their coach after guessing one play correctly?
If Kubiaggie Stupiak was so predictable and incompetent, why did his offense march up and down the field on the #1 defense in the NFL?
We actually played football for the first half. Then we remembered this is Gary Kubiak Texan Football and we scored a big whopping 0 points in the 2nd half. We have been 4-6 since we got the chance to take HFA last year. We scored 0 points against the Patriots in the 3rd quarter when our defense made the game winnable. Zero TD's against the Ravens. I'm seeing a trend and I don't know about you, but that does not pass the eye test.I'm embarrassed to be part of such an ignorant fan base.
Kubiak runs one of the most complex offenses in the NFL and it's widely regarded by defensive players and coaches and one of the most difficult schemes to prepare for. Considering the Texans are near the top of the league in offense basically every single year, how can any of you dispute that just because Seattle players orally stimulated their coach after guessing one play correctly?
If Kubiaggie Stupiak was so predictable and incompetent, why did his offense march up and down the field on the #1 defense in the NFL?
This is what's getting me. Schaub & Andre owned Richard Sherman... damn near all day....just because Seattle players orally stimulated their coach after guessing one play correctly?
"Oh, yes, and one more thing, dear Lord, about our enemies, ignore their heathen prayers and help us blow those little bastards straight to Hell. Amen."
Texans will beat NE in the AFC Championship.
Have you seen how long the ball is in the air when Schaub throws? Is there some kind of measurement of air time x yards thrown because Schaub has got to be KING of that. That was one of the worst throws he's ever made. Thrown into the Bermuda Triangle of 3 defenders just waiting. It took effort for Sherman to rip it away, but it was practically thrown up for grabs.This is what's getting me. Schaub & Andre owned Richard Sherman... damn near all day.
One play. One play....
I think it was an amazing play
But one play & he's the best CB in the game...... blah!!
Thank you for pointing this out. Kubiak's system is highly effective, and is flawed no worse than any other system in the league. And Kubiak's playcalling isn't even much worse than any other coach's. The stats speak to that. Also, the elimination of the audible shifts responsibility to the receivers, who then provide the quarterback with alternatives to the original play call. That's why this system demands so much commitment from the receivers, and why the audibling is "built in" as Chris Myers described it.Kubiak runs one of the most complex offenses in the NFL and it's widely regarded by defensive players and coaches and one of the most difficult schemes to prepare for. Considering the Texans are near the top of the league in offense basically every single year, how can any of you dispute that just because Seattle players orally stimulated their coach after guessing one play correctly?
If Kubiaggie Stupiak was so predictable and incompetent, why did his offense march up and down the field on the #1 defense in the NFL?
!Love the sig
MSR
I just posted this two pages ago, yet the conversation is continuing under the assumption that traditional audibling is superior because it unlocks a more versitile passing offense. I contend that this system makes the Texans a better road team since it reduces the impact of crowd noise.Myers: Im not going to explain how we handle audibling at the line, but nice try there. Thats the way it works in the NFL. Some teams and some quarterbacks are given that opportunity because there teams offenses are based upon them going to the line and having six different plays possible then they just give the line and the rest of offense what they are going to do. In our scheme, Matt doesnt necessarily have to do that all the time. You guys may not notice, but we audible a lot. You guys may not notice and talk about it all the time because you guys dont notice it. Its one of the things that come with the territory. Its a smooth transition for us with the zone blocking scheme and with the rollouts that we have that Matts been able to run. We dont have to audible as much because we have the potential for other things to happen. Our audibles arent the same as other teams, but we get it done just as much as they do. Everyone talking about how they need to put more pressure on Matt and how he needs to take on more of the offense. Its there, you guys just dont notice.
Schaub: If I explain what we do too much, then other teams are understanding it too. Were glad that no one out there really knows what were doing. We do have a built-in system but its something that we do at the line of scrimmage that is not as dramatic as some teams do. We do it about 30 percent of the game. We have two or maybe three plays at the line of scrimmage and then we go from there. Its all based on what the defense is doing. Sometimes its run to run, run to pass, it can be any one of those things, but its all predicated on the defense.
It was 3rd and 4 not 3rd and 2.I don't have the numbers in front of me, but I would say his tendency to throw on 3rd & short is much higher than any non-spread passing team (Saints, Pats, etc.).
And if you're going to pass on that down then yes, you want to run playaction. The problem is it's 3rd & 2 and you're throwing the ball. He always does this. We're averaging 4 yards per carry on the day and he's throwing the ball on 3rd & 2.......
Yes it is a like audible system, but it is still all pre determined, nothing like whn manning see's one on one coverage with no safety help, and he switches it to a deep route and hits his man for a long TD for example.As ObsiWan just informed me, people keep forgetting this part:
I just posted this two pages ago, yet the conversation is continuing under the assumption that traditional audibling is superior because it unlocks a more versitile passing offense. I contend that this system makes the Texans a better road team since it reduces the impact of crowd noise.
So you think Schaub can be as good as Rodgers, or Manning?Yes it is a like audible system, but it is still all pre determined, nothing like whn manning see's one on one coverage with no safety help, and he switches it to a deep route and hits his man for a long TD for example.
They have pre set plays they can change to yeah, but they can not pick any play from the play book to best suit the situation, not to mention i seriously doubt there is any plays that the mannings, Rogers etc cant check out of.
Its still a leash on Schaub no matter how you put it.
NO thats why i said we dont know if he could do it or not in a few posts ago. And lately it has had some pretty bad kinks, that need fixing.So you think Schaub can be as good as Rodgers, or Manning?
If not, why is this even an issue? We're one of the better offenses in the league, year in & year out. If it's not broke....
If our offense requires no more than a game manager to be effective, why on earth did we pay Matt Schaub 60+ million?So you think Schaub can be as good as Rodgers, or Manning?
If not, why is this even an issue? We're one of the better offenses in the league, year in & year out. If it's not broke....
Because a more than game maker costs $100+ million.If our offense requires no more than a game manager to be effective, why on earth did we pay Matt Schaub 60+ million?
QB friendly and simple are not the same thing.Kubiak's offense is extremely QB friendly. Not complex if you know X's and O's.
I might get KILLED for saying this, but a cheap Mark Sanchez could be effective in this system next year as we season a rookie qb.