Discussion in 'The National Football League' started by texan279, Jun 10, 2004.
Ridiculous...seems to me the franchise tag is hurting some teams...
I don't know if the franchise tag per se is what's hurting the team as opposed to a player that according to NFL.com only got 94 combined tackles last season...and wants at least the same money that Ray Lewis is getting.
I don't doubt that Peterson is SFs best defender but wheather they dropped the franchise tag on him or not he is still wanting a truck full off cash. I would be willing to bet that his asking price would be the same if he was tagged or not.
Keep in mind that Peterson is a LOLB, not a middle LB. Wong had 62 tackles last year. Peterson also had 7 sacks and 2 INT's--he is very good.
Compare to some other pro-bowl OLB's:
LaVar Arrington 88 tkl, 6 sacks, 0 INT's
Dexter Coakley 96 tkl, 1 sack, 1 INT
Peter Boulware 58 tkl, 8.5 sacks, 0 INT's
He isn't out of his mind thinking he deserves to be one of the top paid LB's. Don't understand why there is a prohibition on negotiating with tagged players though.
Thats what you get when you use the TAG on someone. They seem to have the upper hand in my opinion. But peterson is a great player. He makes everyone around him better. It is good for the 49ers to keep him.
I understand your point in the stat difference between ILB vs OLB...HOWEVER, do any of the guys you mentioned (including Peterson) have the same impact to the defense and team as a whole as Lewis. I am not saying that Peterson shouldn't be paid as a top LB...just that having a franchise tag on him wouldn't have mattered because he wants to be paid as an elite player at his position and that he is asking for a LOT of money for 57 solo tackles and single digit sacks.
One quick note...Peterson's had 94 combined tackles...only 57 solos, didn't know if you were counting just solo tackles or not.
Those were combined tackles. IMO he shouldn't and won't get Lewis money, but seems like he could ask for Arrington money without being unreasonable.
julian peterson is the best OLB in the league but theres no way he should be paid more than ray lewis who is the best player in the NFL.
I think Cak has a good point...Peterson is legit in asking for "Arrington Money" based on impact and ability. Even though Arrington's contract is for 80mil over 8yrs, I am not that sure those 2 are worth quite that much...that's big time money aginst your cap for long time if something happens.
Last note on stats - if you're the best defender on a low end defense you will get a lot of tackles regardless of your position...and just because you're the best on your team doesn't mean your the best in your division, conference, or league.
Just goes to point out the one thing we all know, stats don't tell the whole story.
Um...Derrick Brooks says hi!!
But anyway,I don't think he's out of his mind to want more $$$$,he deserves it. Like some1 said earlier in the topic,the franchise tag is a killer.
"playoffs!! what are we talking about?....Playoffs????"
The niners won't see 6-10 this year, with or without Peterson.
Julian Peterson > Derek Brooks
Lavar gets an 8yr $80mil contract...
"NFL sources confirmed Thursday morning the Ravens have reached agreement in principle with Lewis on a blockbuster contract that ranks as one of the most lucrative deals in league history.
Negotiated by agent Roosevelt Barnes over the past two days, Lewis' seven-year contract is worth about $50 million and includes a signing bonus of $19 million.
The whopping signing bonus validates Lewis' status as a premier playmaker. The fact is, middle linebackers aren't supposed to be paid like quarterbacks, but Lewis, arguably the league's most dominating defender, will be.
Lewis, 27, was the team's first-round choice in the 1996 draft and has been a force since entering the league. The former University of Miami star has 1,087 tackles, 19½ sacks, 12 interceptions, 56 passes defensed, four forced fumbles and four recoveries. -ESPN, Len Pasquerelli, AUG02"
Do we really think Arrington and Peterson are worth more coin than Ray? I just found this and it clicked back to me the Ray had got a big time extension last year for 50-55million. I guess no one can fault you if your willing to pay someone like Arrington $80mil...but, WOW...Lavar better be the next coming of Lawrence Taylor for that kinda cap hit.
It doesnt matter if ray got 50 mill, and lavar gets 80 mill. He is one of the BEST OLB's in the game right now. And you dont get that cheap. You let him go and sign 2 cheaper less effective guys, and he will go across the bay, sign with another team, and wreak havoc on you. You dont let guys like Peterson leave your team. You pay them, and thats that.
In the salary cap era you do if you want to succeed--for an example see the Patriots. The beauty to the NFL under the cap is the parity so that any team could be 3-5 years from a super bowl. The down side is the hard decision to let either (a) great players that have been on the team and are on the down side of their careers go or (b) great players go just because someone, cough Snyder cough, will try to buy a championship now and drive up the price of players. It's simple math, if you have $80 mil to spend and you give one guy an extra 5 it comes from somewhere. Obviously you try to keep your best players, but "at any price" has no place in today's NFL.
General manager Terry Donahue and Julian Peterson's agent, Kevin Poston, talked extensively Monday about the linebacker's contract -- they just didn't do it with each other.
Peterson, the 49ers' best defensive player and first-team All-Pro, is likely to conduct a holdout that could linger into the regular season.
Donahue and Poston haven't spoken since March. "Really, there isn't much to say," Donahue said.
He's right. Both sides appear entrenched.
The 49ers have offered a six-year, $37.8 million package with guaranteed money in a signing bonus of $15.5 million, bringing the contract average to $6. 3 million a year.
Donahue maintains that offer is the highest in team history and would make Peterson the second-highest paid linebacker behind only the Ravens' Ray Lewis.
Poston said that Washington's LaVar Arrington averages $8.1 million a year in a deal signed in December.
"I should know, I did the contract," Poston said.
NFL documents show that Arrington averages that amount through the first two years of his deal. Spread over three years, the average drops to $5.7 million a year.
The contract is also in dispute, with Poston maintaining that $6.45 million in guaranteed money is missing.
But the main issue between Poston and the 49ers is how to characterize Peterson. The 49ers believe he's a linebacker.
Poston believes that Peterson makes such an impact, he transcends his position. Donahue said that a letter sent by Poston stated that Peterson should be compared with Colts quarterback Peyton Manning.
While that may be overstating the case, Peterson is just as valuable to the 49ers' defense as a top-flight cornerback, Poston maintains, and he wants the contract average at $9 million a year, which is what shut-down cornerback Champ Bailey received from Denver.
Poston cites Peterson's ability to play cornerback and safety at times.
"He covers like a cornerback and hits like a linebacker," Poston said from his Farmington, Mich., office on Monday.
The 49ers think Peterson is the best outside linebacker in the league, and the team is willing to pay him as such.
Peterson did play safety and cornerback in spots last season, but the 49ers maintain he couldn't survive at those positions long-term.
Peterson can rush the passer, as his seven sacks last year would indicate, and does an excellent job covering tight ends. Those duties are considered the domain of the elite outside linebacker, according to the 49ers.
"Positions, to an extent, determine what players get paid," Donahue said. "If you want to get paid like a cornerback, go play cornerback."
The average pay for the top five cornerbacks this year is $8.781 million. For the top five linebackers it's $6.074 million, which is also what Peterson will earn if he plays under the exclusive franchise tag.
The 49ers tagged him as their franchise player in February, which means that Peterson can only negotiate with the 49ers for the next year.
Peterson's leverage is to stay out of minicamps and training camp. Poston suggested that Peterson may even hold out during the regular season. "If the 49ers think he's going to come in and play because he loves football, wow," Poston said. When asked if Peterson would stay out when the season begins, Poston said, "That's up to Julian."
Donahue, meanwhile, said players who hold out get injured more easily and that late-arriving players often don't play as expected.
When asked about the possibility Peterson will hold out during the season, Donahue said, "I can't imagine that anyone would think that's in his best interest. But who knows? People do funny things."
Briefly: The team has agreed on a four-year contract with fourth-round pick Isaac Sopoaga, a defensive tackle from Hawaii.
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