Discussion in 'Texans Talk' started by JAXwithanX, May 15, 2006.
Thought it may help clear up what we are planning to do with the pieces of line we have.
I'm worried about Mckinney's change to right guard and Pitts moved to left guard.
Really, really worried for Carr.
I have no problem with this initial lineup, if it does not work we'll know before the season starts. This is just the first attempt at fixing the line, at least they're willing to try something new out
[Edit] I'm woried about Carr too, but this is his last chance to show he's the starting QB. IF he does not thrive under yet another coaching staff, then he's at fault and out of here. Let's hope it does not come to that
If Pitts plays the team game, he'll be a very good guard. McKinney has had his problems, but I'm willing to see how he plays guard full time. I hope Hodgdon can handle backing up Flanagan so that McKinney can concentrate on one position from here on out.
This experiment will determine whether Mike Sherman is ever employable again in the league.
The line is learning a new (hardish to learn) scheme from new positions and learning to play with new players. This is kinda scary.
At this point, as fans we just need to take a leap of faith and hope for the best:
This stuff goes on the top of my list of scary but exciting stuff for next season:
1. Can the offensive line figure out new positions and playing together in a new scheme by the beginning of the season?
2. Will the David Carr look like a first pick of the draft?
3. Does the 4-3 solve our defensive woes, and what will our particular 4-3 look like?
4. Will the team resemble NFL football? All teams have good looking games and ugly games. Will we actually have more good looking games? Will we finally have a game where we destroy another team (like the first part of the Rams game looked like until the wheels came off).
5. Just in general, how fast can everyone be coached up?
Spencer could end up being a major steal out of the 3rd as it looks he has all the tools to become a dominant LT in the league. This is all very encouraging and though somewhat questionable on how it will play out, you have to start somewhere. I am just glad we acquired what could be some solid linemen and there appears to be competition and depth at every spot on the line. I expect steady improvement this year and drastic improvement in the years to come. I actually believe the o-line woes are turning a serious corner. Whether Carr can play with poise and make sound decisions is my biggest question mark since he has made some bad decisions in the past when given the opportunity to make plays. At least he should have more time back there to figure out what's going on with the new line and new coaching in place. In his 5th year he SHOULD really start to flourish.
Capers learned the hard way, keep Pitts at LT, at least for now! I thought that McKinney was supposed to start @ LG? then Mike Flanagan Center. on the right side who knows but the Texans just resigned Zach Weigert so you know that he will be a starter, most likey his natural position @ guard. that leaves open competition between Wade, Spencer & Winston for RT. I would like to see the coaching staff develop the young draftee's & start the experienced NFL vets first then depending on how well they understand & pick up the new blocking schemes move them into limited action accordingly.
Learned the hard way? Keep Pitts at LT?
We were 7-9 with Pitts at guard and 2-14 with Pitts back at tackle for most of the season when we had the worst offense we've ever had.
IMO, we should learn that Pitts should be at guard.
I would not blame 2-14 on Pitts, he was one of the bright spots on the team, that is if you actually watched the games
The o-line and defensive backfield are my biggest concerns going into next season. I really expected a major overhaul of our line, so it'll be interesting to see if it was bad coaching all along and our players actually have some talent. Our entire offensive production rests on the line play, as well as our QB's future.
I don't buy that "Wade figures to be the RT" but that's another post.
When looking at our line, and the players we have added over the yrs via FA and the draft, one thing just stands out to me like a sore thumb. It seems we consistently add "tweeners", guys without one true position. When you think of Orlando Pace, you think LT right? When you think Kevin Mawae, you think Center. We have recruited one guy in my estimation like that - Flannigan. Is Mckinney a center, a LG or RG? Is Pitts a LT, LG, or maybe he is better suited at RT. Is Spencer better suited to guard or tackle? RT or LT? The same questions apply to Winston. Is Weigert suited to play RG or RT? Is Wand a LT, RT, or heck even guard. I mean there is something to be said for versatility, but these guys are not versatile in the mold of Bruce Matthews, who was so good he could play center one snap, and LT the next. No, these are guys that are simply tweeners, the Jason Babin of the offense if you will. They don't have rock solid attributes for a specific position. They have no true home imo. How this bodes for our line is tough to tell imo, but one thing is for sure, the excitement will probably continue with personell changes and moves for the forseeable future, not exactly a recipe for success.
I disagree. The guy had one losing season in Green Bay, and will likely get a new coaching gig in 2007 or 2008 regardless of what he does with the worst pass-blocking line in recent history.
I think Mike Sherman is great. He unfairly gets the rap that his success in GB is just a product of Favre and inheriting a good program from Holmgren. That is why he isn't a head coach this year.
That being said, he is banking his future in the NFL on this line. After shuffling the folks around, if the line goes all Pendry on him, who is going to want to give him a head coaching job to a guy after a really bad season in GB and if our offensive line continues to be a national joke?
Wow! That showed me.
I didn't blame the season on Pitts, I just wonder what conclusion one can reach when the team's best offensive production was with Wand/Pitts at LT/LG.
When I did watch the games last year, I noticed the double teaming they did on the DEs with Pitts/Brown. I throw that into the equation too when I'm looking at the line play.
Sherman likes Pitts at guard too, but Pendry did end up on the "Pitts at tackle" side of the debate, so I guess that evens out.
Interesting questions, but I think it was the previous staff that was enamored with players that “could play multiple positions on the line”.
I think we’ll find that this staff will settle on one position for each player, or at least either side of the line at the same position. From what I’ve heard the coaches want to settle on a starting line during camp and let them play/grow together without a lot of panic moves looking for “the right combination”. IMO we won't see a lot of musical lineman because:
- Wand is a left tackle; I don’t think they’ll move him anywhere else, certainly not guard.
- They slot Pitts at guard, and given the tackle depth they brought in I don’t think they’ll be forced to move him around in case of injuries.
- McKinney is at guard now, and I really hope he stays there unless of dire emergency. This would require that Hodgdon to be a solid #2 center.
- Weigert is problematic to me; they seem to like him at tackle, but he played solidly at guard too.
- They’ve slated Winston at RT; we’ll have to see if he fits there first, and then see if they leave him there or move him around.
- I don’t know much about Spencer, but as a “project” they may have him practice at different spots even though he’s penciled in as an LT. I doubt he’ll be moved around in different positions in games, so I’m not worrying about him.
I still say I want Pitts on the right side of the line. I would play Wiegert at LG or Eric Winston at that spot. Another possibility is to use the rookie who is possibly playing LT at LG and use Wand at LT. I have a gut feeling our best lineup might be the following:
LT-Wand,LG-Spencer,C-Flannigan,RG-Wiegert,RT-Pitts or Winston or
LT-Wand.LG-Wiegert,C-Flannigan,RG-Spencer,RT-Pitts or Winston.
Pitts and Wiegert are both better run blockers and that's why I like the 1st lineup. Winston can adapt to a lot of positions so he would make an excellent sub along the line anywhere. Wiegert was leading DD down the field the one year and DD was scary when that was happening. We will just have to wait and see what is happening.
I think it highly unlikely that Spencer starts next year - he is a project.
Your line-up also leaves no room for Pitts if Winston beats him out for RT, which is also a highly unlikely scenario for a couple of reasons - Winston being a rookie and Pitts possibly not competing for the RT slot anyway.
We may seem some variation of this a couple of years down the road when Weigert is gone with Pitts at guard, but there is a lot of time for change between now and 2008.
Honest differences of opinion. I think the rookies are going to have a bigger impact than you think. For one, they won't have to unlearn the Capers error dogma. They are going to be evaluated by someone who knows how to build an O-line and knows what to do with the talent he has. Pitts made a lot of mistakes at key points in the game by being called for false starts.
I don't get why you guys don't think Pitts gives the Texans / Carr the best option, at least for the time being @ LT Wand is a back-up only. Pitts excells at pass blocking, his run blocking is not as strong as y'all suggest which is well documented with Pitts himself saying he prefeers to play the more athletic, finesse left tackle position.
Pitts should remain the LT for the Texans until unseated by the play on the field. McKinney is the LG with Flanagan Center. Like I said the right side is open & up in the air with only Weigert a sure bet to start one of the two positions
Well, I've outlined some of my arguments in this post and so many times in previous posts that many readers here think I'm a broken record.
I get why you don't agree with me - you don't agree with my arguments or evaluate the evidence the same way I do. The reverse is why I don't agree with Pitts at LT.
LT is also more glamorous and higher paying.
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