Evaluating Rick Smith

Discussion in 'Texans Talk' started by TexansSeminole, Sep 29, 2009.

  1. TexansSeminole

    TexansSeminole Hall of Fame

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    Do you think Rick Smith has done a good job upgrading the talent of the team, and more importantly plugging in the holes we had before he came.

    Before he got here, and after the Schaub trade, the most pressing needs were both safety spots, defensive line, corner, offensive line, and linebacker

    I'd like to give him credit for Schaub but from what I understood Kubiak wanted Schaub and told Rick to do what it takes to get him.

    Here are the drafts;

    2007

    1/10 DT Amobi Okoye

    3/73 WR Jacoby Jones

    4/123 CB Fred Bennett

    5/144 S Brandon Harrison

    5/163 G Brandon Frye

    6/183 G Kasey Studdard

    7/218 LB Zac Diles


    2008

    1/26 LT Duane Brown

    3/79 CB Antwaun Molden

    3/89 RB Steve Slaton

    4/118 LB Xavier Adibi

    5/151 DT Frank Okam

    6/173 S Dominique Barber

    7/223 QB Alex Brink


    2009

    1/15 LB Brian Cushing

    2/46 DE Connor Barwin

    3/77 C Antoine Caldwell

    4/112 CB Glover Quin

    4/122 TE Anthony Hill

    5/152 TE James Casey

    6/188 CB Brice McCain

    7/223 S Troy Nolan

    If someone else would list the free agents that would be nice.

    I am not overly impressed.

    He's just now addressed the DE position with Smith and Barwin, both of whom haven't produced a whole lot. Its still early there though.

    He hasn't addressed safety at all. A bunch of special teamers, that's it.

    He botched the DT position with Okam and Okoye, so far anyway.

    Myers has been less than average. He did pick up Studdard but the jury is still out on him. I like Caldwell, props there although he hasn't seen the field. Love Duane Brown.

    Our CBs are just as bad as before he came around. Actually Reeves is an upgrade, but he missed on Bennett. Small school players like Molden (can't stay healthy or get on the field), Quin, and McCain have been non factors. It's still early on those guys but we needed immediate help.

    He brought in one good RB in Slaton, who's struggling. Other than Slaton he has done little to upgrade that.

    He's done well with linebackers. Ill give him that. Diles, Cushing, and Adibi are significant upgrades.

    He picked up Casey, who I guess could replace Daniels, if we are lucky, but why replace him? He is a probowler. Casey can't see the field with Owen, Dreesen, and Hill on the roster.

    I think Smith hasn't done nearly enough. Sure he upgraded LB, picked up one good RB in 3 years, got a couple OL that Alex Gibbs can work with, but that's really all I am seeing.

    Drafted 4 corners in his time, no upgrade so far. Drafted 3 safeties, no upgrade. 2 DTs, no upgrade.

    How do yall feel about Smith, independent of Kubiak, moving forward?
     
    Last edited: Sep 29, 2009
  2. DerekLee1

    DerekLee1 Hall of Fame

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    Don't forget trading for Schaub, who is pretty damned important to this offense. Also, even though he wasn't officially announced until June of 2006, I have a suspicion he had a lot to do with that draft, either as a confidant to Kubiak, or a special adviser to Casserly. That being said, we'll pretend he had nothing to do with it.

    There are too many free agents to list (there are a ton of under-the-radar transactions every year), but I'll give some highlights.

    2007: Ahman Green, Andre Davis, Jordan Black

    2008: Bentley, Chris Brown, Ferguson, Reeves, Chaun Thompson

    2009: Cody, Orlovsky, Grossman, June, Pollard.

    Also, it's ALWAYS been this regime's policy to build and replinish through the draft, NOT in free agency.
     
  3. Second Honeymoon

    Second Honeymoon Hall of Fame

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    yup and that policy sure has done wonders addressing our deficiencies?

    once again, what has Bush done to show anyone anything?

    he has done jack squat.

    we are currently on pace to be THE WORST DEFENSE IN NFL HISTORY!!
     
  4. TexansSeminole

    TexansSeminole Hall of Fame

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    Out of those FAs, I like Bentley, Andre Davis (good for only one year), Reeves, and Pollard (I haven't seen him play for the team).

    I was thinking about the "we build through the draft" approach as I was making this thread, and it had me even less impressed.
     
  5. Texecutioner

    Texecutioner Hall of Fame

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    At the end of the day you have to look at results. The Texans aren't going to the playoffs this year and that will be 4 straight years without any playoff appearances.

    He's been awful at acquiring talent in free agency.

    He's not the worst GM in the league by any means, but he isn't a good one either. He is just an average one, and I'd like the Texans to have a guy that is better than average.
     
  6. DerekLee1

    DerekLee1 Hall of Fame

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    Now, considering it typically takes about 3 years to see if a pick truly pans out, it's still just a tad early to start evaluating Smith as a GM. Now, any skill position you get past the 3rd round is just a bonus. The true grading should come on the first 3 rounds.

    2007 and 2008 2nd round picks were traded for Schaub. WIN!

    2007: Okoye and Jacoby Jones. DRAW (Jacoby is above average, Okoye has yet to prove he's anything more than "ok") Bonus points: Studdard and Diles

    2008: Brown, Slaton, and Molden. WIN! (Brown is very good and still improving; Molden is even odds on becoming better than average, but he's hurt right now; Slaton is above average) Bonus points: Adibi

    2009: Cushing, Barwin, Caldwell. ??? They've played 3 games. Who knows? Cushing looks to be very good. Barwin has great potential, and Caldwell hasn't been given much opportunity. Bonus points? Potentially James Casey, although we haven't seen anything of him other than ST.

    I have to give Rick Smith an A- for drafts, and a D for free agent signings. He finds some good raw talent that fill needs on this football team. However, his free agent signings have contributed nothing, and he has yet to "happily" retain a key member of our team when they're up for free agency. He's lived up to his and Kubiak's promise to build through drafting and not through dropping big money on players from other teams.
     
  7. ATXtexanfan

    ATXtexanfan Site Contributor

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    He's upgraded the talent, how much say does he have in the staff? Defensive coaching is the problem right now.
     
  8. TexansSeminole

    TexansSeminole Hall of Fame

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    I disagree. If I had to grade him based on filling needs I would give him a C-. He gets a C for upgrading talent from me.

    I don't agree about the idea that anything after the 3rd round is a bonus. Completely don't understand that line of thought. I'd say if a player drafted in the 6th or 7th round pans out, it's a bonus.

    What makes you think Okoye is "ok". I'd say he is bad, going on awful.

    Molden has a good chance to be above average? Based onnnnn...what? He was a good special teams player. Has done nothing on defense.

    I'd say before this year, for every good play Jacoby has made he's made a bad play. He has shown up thus far as a reciever this year, so I would say he was an decent pick if you consider he was a 3rd rounder and the 73rd player drafted in his class.
     


  9. Texan_Bill

    Texan_Bill Subscribed Contributor

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    I evaluate him this way:

    How many players on the roster are holdovers from the C & C Factory??
     
  10. GP

    GP Go Texans!

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    It's really too bad that all of your grades mean absolutely nothing in terms of the LARGER picture here: He is saving McNair a ton of money in how he's doing contracts.

    Rick Smith is like Geico for McNair.

    Continue on with your lives in fantasy land.

    (sorry, I'm just having a hard time giving a serious sh!t about solving this team's problems right now)
     
  11. DerekLee1

    DerekLee1 Hall of Fame

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    Then go and show me any GM in the league that has had more than one year of "hits" in rounds 1-5.

    You can't evaluate talent after one season, or even two, especially when you're changing coordinators. Mario looked terrible in year one. Bennett looked good. Look where we are now.
     
  12. GP

    GP Go Texans!

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    Kris Brown.

    And the guy who ran out to grab the kickoff tee, then did a front roll when he reached the sideline.

    Oh, wait. That was the other sucky team we had before this sucky team.

    My bad.

    [​IMG]
     
  13. DerekLee1

    DerekLee1 Hall of Fame

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    How do you figure? We were in salary cap hell the first two years Smith was here. He had no breathing room because of contracts like Carr and Babin had. He's not trying to save anyone money.

    People that say that owners like Bob McNair are copping out and don't want to spend money just piss me off. You really think he cares how much it costs? Even as a business decision, do you REALLY think that he's going to make money by cheaping out on players and staring at empty seats? Nobody wants to win more than our owner, and that dude is NOT cheaping out by any means.
     
  14. Texan_Bill

    Texan_Bill Subscribed Contributor

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    Kris
    Andre
    Dunta
    Chester that come to mind.

    So in my minds eye, they've turned over 49 roster spots (including PS) heading into his 4th season. With that much turn-over, are you going to "miss" on some picks and / or trades?? Yes. OTOH, he's done a lot of things right, too, while clearing out C & C's mess.

    Grade: B-

    The minus is because of Amobi. I really thought he would be much further along by now.
     
  15. Silver Oak

    Silver Oak Hall of Fame

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    Logical thoughts have no place here.
     
  16. Texans_Chick

    Texans_Chick Utopian Dreamer

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    You don't botch 5th round picks. That the Texans have to rely on lower round picks for significant playing time demonstrates that the team is very thin. Part of them getting playing time or being relied on is because a number of 1-3 round picks who should be in the primes of their career with the Texans were busts under CC. And some of those top round picks were traded away for Phillip Buchanon or magic beans or whatever.

    Key players who should be in NFL prime are missing from the team. We should have more guys like Andre Johnson or just plain old solid players who have stayed with the team for years. Texan fans have eaten their brussel sprouts with first round d-line picks like Travis Johnson and Jason Babin not continuing with the team and the dline still a mess.

    It is too early to judge a lot of Smith's picks, and every team has some misses. The Texans just couldn't afford all the misses that happened under Casserly-Capers.
     
  17. TexansSeminole

    TexansSeminole Hall of Fame

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    Mario didn't look terrible he was just struggling. Big difference. Plus he was injured AND played through the injury the whole year.

    I'm not evaluating any of the picks this year on how they play anyway, just on addressing needs.

    I think its fair to grade the 2007 draft based on performance.

    The 2008 draft falls somewhere in between.

    I also expect 1st and 2nd rounders to produce in year one. Maybe not week one but somewhere in that year they need to start producing. Cushing is doing very well, we'll see if Barwin can pick it up sometime in year one.
     
  18. Honoring Earl 34

    Honoring Earl 34 Hey Koolaid

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    That's true .

    2002
    2nd rd. Gaffney ... gone .
    3rd rd. Hill , Weary ... gone .

    2003
    2nd rd. Jopru ... gone
    3rd rd. Wand ... ... Peek ... Ragone , gone .

    2004
    1st rd. Babin ... gone ... plus picks to get him .

    2005
    1st rd. Johnson ... gone .
    PBuch ... ouchy .
    3rd rd. .. Morency

    2006
    3rd rd. Spencer ... gone

    2007
    2nd rd ... trade

    2008
    2nd trade .
     
    Last edited: Sep 29, 2009
  19. Hervoyel

    Hervoyel The Right Track

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    Borrowing your text as I'm not of a mind to type it all again.

    Here are the drafts;

    2007

    1/10 DT Amobi Okoye: Daring pick that hasn't paid off yet. May never payoff.

    3/73 WR Jacoby Jones: Just now seeing any real production as a WR. PR duties remain "scary".

    4/123 CB Fred Bennett: Our new "Petey Buchannon". All the skills of both but only takes up one roster spot!

    5/144 S Brandon Harrison: Who?

    5/163 G Brandon Frye: Who?

    6/183 G Kasey Studdard: Kubiak: "Note to self: Debt paid".

    7/218 LB Zac Diles: The acorn this pig found in 2007.


    2008

    1/26 LT Duane Brown: Gibbs pick. Nobody can convince me otherwise.

    3/79 CB Antwaun Molden: Next year's Fred Bennett? Who knows.

    3/89 RB Steve Slaton: The acorn this pig found in 2008.

    4/118 LB Xavier Adibi: Beaten out of a job by last years acorn.

    5/151 DT Frank Okam: At least he waited till the 5th round to find the new Travis Johnson.

    6/173 S Dominique Barber: Who?

    7/223 QB Alex Brink: Who? Not really. Just a camp arm.


    2009

    1/15 LB Brian Cushing: Looks good so far. This year's acorn?

    2/46 DE Connor Barwin: Disappeared once the games started to matter. Actually being a rookie that's not surprising. It's way too soon to rate most of these guys.

    3/77 C Antoine Caldwell: potential but not ready yet.

    4/112 CB Glover Quin: potential but not ready yet.

    4/122 TE Anthony Hill: Ok, so we need someone to compliment Daniels & Dreeson.

    5/152 TE James Casey: Ok.... so we need someone else to compliment Daniels, Dreeson, and Hill?

    6/188 CB Brice McCain: Potential but not ready yet.

    7/223 S Troy Nolan: Who?

    I totally disagree with the idea that Rick Smith had anything to do with the 2006 draft. Charlie Casserly was still employed, Gary Kubiak was the coach, Dan Reeves was putting his 2 cents in maybe but Rick Smith? No, I don't buy it. I'm sure he'd like to be thought of when that draft was spoken of but he didn't do that.

    So really the man is batting no better than the old riverboat gambler himself Charlie Casserly. Granted Rick doesn't trade away a lot of picks like Charlie but his hit/miss ratio isn't far off the mark Charlie set. The 2007 draft is looking more and more like a disaster every year. If Jacoby pulls it out and becomes AJ's perfect compliment then things look better but right now I see a DT that can't make plays, a CB that can't make plays, and a LG who spends way too much time on the ground looking up. Jacoby Jones and Zac Diles appear right now to be the only two hits in the bunch

    2008 was all Alex Gibbs getting his LT. That's worked out rather well but otherwise this was another no-impact draft IF the Texans don't get lucky with Slaton. Just like Domanick Davis before him Slaton was picked to be a role player and played his way into a starring role. To say that Smith or Kubiak expected this however would be a mistake. They knew exactly what they wanted out of Slaton so I don't give them any credit for what he could do beyond their intended role for him.

    So one lucky pick and Alex Gibbs getting himself a lineman stand between this draft being another train wreck and Rick Smith pretending to be genius. Molden may still come around and hopefully will.

    2009 is just too soon. There's no point in even looking at those guys yet.

    On to free agents (more cut and paste stealing for me)

    2007: Ahman Green, Andre Davis, Jordan Black

    Ahman Green was a mistake and I was sure of that the day I heard about the signing. It was a classic Texans move. Ahman is a good citizen, a standup guy, and he robbed the Texans while he was here. Andre Davis was and remains depth at WR and nothing more. He had a great game when AJ was out, got paid for it, and ever since he's been the same receiver that didn't make much of an impact in Cleveland. Jordan Black was a joke of a signing. We could have kept Seth Wand or Todd Wade and had the same player for less money.

    2008: Bentley, Chris Brown, Ferguson, Reeves, Chaun Thompson

    Bentley has been good depth. Chris Brown has been an excellent presence in the training room rehabbing. Ferguson had his last good season last year. This year he's frankly not much help. Reeves will hopefully be our best corner when he returns and hopefully that should be soon. Thompson I fail to see the reason to get excited about

    2009: Cody, Orlovsky, Grossman, June, Pollard.

    Cody and Orlovsky are guys who didn't stick with the only team to ever lose 16 regular season games. If free agency was a shopping trip these are the two guys we picked up at the Salvation Army thrift store. Grossman frankly fell into our laps. Cato June had some potential but we'll never know. Pollard hasn't done anything yet. Hopefully that changes this week.

    Our GM is highly overrated by the fanbase. At least he has been. I've been guilty of it too. It seemed like he was finding all these guys and filling holes but once it's all together who are they (or we) better than? These are guys that anybody could have picked and assembled.
     
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  20. Double Barrel

    Double Barrel Modified Simian

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    Well...I can now see the excuse for the next head coach of the Houston Texans! It was Rick Smith's fault and will take us 3-4 years to dig out that hole yada yada yada!
     
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