Deandre Hopkins could have been playing in SB LI

Discussion in 'Texans Talk' started by cbs1507, Feb 5, 2017.

  1. ObsiWan

    ObsiWan Site Contributor

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    Show me where I missed something. In Brady's early years they won with a good defense and the running of Antowain Smith and Corey Dillon (when Smith was let go). Then there was the year when pretty much their whole defensive backfield was out and they had to play Troy Brown at DB. Brady became the Brady we know (and you worship) about 2006. They'd won three SBs by then.

    Hell, they won 11 games with Matt Cassel at QB and won 3 of 4 this season during Brady's suspension.

    The only constant has been Belichick.
     
  2. Texecutioner

    Texecutioner Hall of Fame

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    Dude, just stop already. I swear for a guy who claims he isn't a fan of them you sure do seem obsessed with them for as much as you talk about them. IF you're going to, then go ahead and at least watch the games. For you to take all that credit away from Brady and coaches like Mcdaniels and Patricia is disrespectful, but I wouldn't expect anything less from someone who hates their team more than he loves his own team. I'm not even going to waste my time addressing this tripe.

    The conversation was about whether a young QB could succeed or not. You acted like it was blasphemous for the Texans or any team to bring in a young QB without having a stacked offense, You were wrong. QB's have been going to poor teams for the last 30 years and more. They usually don't go to great teams which is why their teams are getting a new QB. A guy like Hopkins doesn't have high value on a team that has garbage for QB when their offense still sucks with him or without him. If you had to let him go to get a guy that you think is the future, then thats not really a hard decision unless you prefer to see what you've seen the last 4 years offensively. But it sounds like you do.
     
    Last edited: Feb 14, 2017
  3. ObsiWan

    ObsiWan Site Contributor

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    You misunderstood my meaning. (a) I respect the Patriots. And I think their success all can be traced back to Belichick. The coordinators you mentioned were picked and trained by him. They are branches on the Belichick coaching tree. (b) Belichick also morphed the offense to coincide with Brady's development. Brady wasn't a highly touted stud coming out of school like say, Manning or Luck. But he had a fire to succeed. Belichick took that fire and molded it. He never put the whole offense on Brady's shoulders until he was ready. In Brady's first years, Antowain Smith and the Corey Dillon were the focus of Belichick's offense. Later, when Brady was ready, they went pass-first.

    Again, you've missed my point. I just don't think you should weaken the chance of Garoppolo (or whoever) to be successful by trading away his best weapon. What I'm saying really boils down to this: I'd rather give up picks (as few as I can get away with) than a proven commodity like Hopkins. With picks, no matter how well you THINK you scouted them, they're still unknown commodities until they hit the field. I KNOW I have a stud in Hopkins.
     
    Last edited: Feb 14, 2017
  4. Texecutioner

    Texecutioner Hall of Fame

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    You've proven plenty of times to hate this organization and Brady in particular. For you to discount all that he's done along with Belicheck as that constant "constant" is indicative of the fact that it wouldn't matter if he won 3 more SB's, you still wouldn't credit him for anything so I won't even waste time typing out how many flaws you have in this above. I'll just leave it at that.

    Well that wasn't what we were arguing. It was just whether or not if Hopkins could be traded for him, and you acted like trading Hopkins for a franchise QB would be a bad idea all because the team would lose its best receiver. If you want to change the discussion to a question of picks or Hopkins, then I agree with what you're saying above. Yeah, I'd much rather give away picks than a young proven player with a good head on his shoulders. I don't want to trade Hopkins at all for the record. I love that guy. I was discussing from a scenario perspective, and I'd trade any player on our roster other than Watt for Garrapallo. To me the only other alternative is that we will go several more years with no QB and having no chance, because I don't have faith in Smithnair to get one in the draft. I agree with your analysis completely about draft picks and the unpredictability of them.

    My buddy and I discussed the fake scenario that wouldn't ever happen the other day, and it wouldn't be bad for both teams.

    Texans trade Watt to NE

    Pats trade Garrapallo and their 1st round pick (#32) to the Texans.

    This way the Texans get their franchise QB (Assuming he plays well) and a late first round pick for Watt. Remember, their defense was still really good without him. Clowney could assume a stronger role, and the Texans could now resign Clowney to a big contract since Watt is gone assuming they'd want to. Their defense is still strong, and they'd go into the draft with two first round picks for next year. The Pats get a once in a lifetime player on defense to an already SB team to try and win one or two more, but they're also taking a risk that Watt comes back clean from injury and is the same guy. If you take the emotions out of it from losing Watt, this wouldn't be a bad trade for both teams to me. Wouldn't ever happen though.
     
    Last edited: Feb 15, 2017
  5. ObsiWan

    ObsiWan Site Contributor

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    Look, I've been watching the Patriots since the days of Sam "Bam" Cunningham, Russ Francis, and Steve Grogan. And I've said that Brady is the best of this generation. I just don't like that "All-Time" designation because the game has changed so much over the years. If you think that constitutes "hate", well, that's on you.

    You're right. McNair would never sign off on trading Watt. Although I like this scenario better than I like weakening an already weak offense by trading its best weapon.
     
  6. Texecutioner

    Texecutioner Hall of Fame

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    Finding productive WR's isn't all that difficult though. Its probably one of the easiest positions to fill when it becomes a need. Finding a really good one that isn't a diva can be a lot more difficult though, and Hopkins seems to be another AJ/Fitzgerald type as far as that goes which is why I hope they extend him and give him a big contract, because he's worth it. I thought that Antonio Brown was like this as well, and then he pops up with locker room feeds and all sorts of stuff comes out about him. I wouldn't want a guy like Beckam anywhere near my team. Finding a player like Watt is extremely difficult and he's a once and a lifetime player, but realistically without a strong QB his value is great to the team, but he's wasting his career here just like AJ did. He'll never have a chance for a ring here most likely, because Smith is the GM and I just don't see how we get a real franchise QB in the near future. The worst part is that it seems to be getting harder and harder to find them, and less are becoming really good in the NFL. Thats a huge reason why I laugh at all of this garbage about NFL rules changing and how it is so much easier for QB's these days. That's total nonsense. QB's struggle like hell in this league, and they have to do more in order to be successful over a long period of time now when it comes to film study and their responsibilities. There just isn't a high number of them that seem to be able to handle it. If Andrew Luck has another bad year next year, then I've got no problem calling him a bust at that point, and he'll be the most shocking bust of all time. I don't care about whats around him or what isn't around him. He's been a TO machine since he entered the NFL, and he seemed to be the most mentally ready QB we've ever seen. That wasn't the case though.
     
  7. TexansSeminole

    TexansSeminole Hall of Fame

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    "First day of pads, already breaking ankles on the routes, ****."

    Love Hopkins.

     
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  8. steelbtexan

    steelbtexan Hall of Fame

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    Love Nuk, but would trade him for Jimmy G. QB>WR.

    I would trade Watt for Jimmy G straight up. I don't think Watt is ever going to be the 2014-15 Watt again and the trade would open up a ton of cap space.

    Of course Jimmy G is my guy.
     
  9. infantrycak

    infantrycak Mod. Staff Member

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    Trading JJ would cost $6 mil in cap space this year.
     
  10. Texecutioner

    Texecutioner Hall of Fame

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    Yeah, this was unforgettable. To embarrass a guy like Hall was the icing on the cake as well.
     


  11. Texecutioner

    Texecutioner Hall of Fame

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    Yeah, this was unforgettable. To embarrass a guy like Hall was the icing on the cake as well.
     
  12. steelbtexan

    steelbtexan Hall of Fame

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    Didn't know that, it would help the cap in the long run. I hope I'm wrong about JJ's back.

    Speaking of backs Romo is now the odds on favorite to be the Texans QB next yr. How do you feel about that?
     
  13. infantrycak

    infantrycak Mod. Staff Member

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    Doubt it is true but if so can't judge without seeing the contract but if so would get gloves with the fingers crossed.
     
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  14. austins23

    austins23 Hall of Fame

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    The Patriots would agree. The SB 51 WR's and draft status -

    Amendola - UDFA
    Edelman - 7th round
    Floyd - 1st round by the Cardinals. You guys know his story.
    Hogan - UDFA
    Mitchell - 4th round
    Slater 5th round.
     
  15. sandman

    sandman Brexit Advisor

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    Added in the regular season receptions for those WR's. 195 receptions, of which half went to Edelman.

    Bennett TE - 2nd round - 55 receptions
    Gronk TE - 2nd round - 25 receptions
    White RB - 4th round - 60 receptions
    Lewis RB - 5th round - 17 receptions

    That's 157 receptions to TE and RB's. Just pointing out that the NE passing game leaned heavily on TE's and RB's. Their WR's outside of Edelman were rather pedestrian. Those were the kinds of stats that got Shorts and Washington cut from a bad Houston offense.
     
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  16. austins23

    austins23 Hall of Fame

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    But those WR's were all productive in their role in the offense. Look who Brady targeted (and got the completions) during his last 4th Q TD drive. It may have been the next to last. He went right to Mitchell, a 4th round rookie.

    To the thread subject matter. To me, just the run of the mill football junkie, it doesn't look like Deandre would fit in NE's offense.
     
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