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Comparing Mario Williams?

gtexan02

Working?
Um, how am I lying with those stats? Im showing all important defensive stats for Dl of every DL taken in the 1st round.
 
It took Reggie about 11 games to score from scrimage on a top 5 offense...sounds like a project to me.
Reggie was an impact from day 1. Being an impact isn't all about scoring. How many critical 3rd down catches did Reggie had for the Saints prior to scoring. How many times were defensive players drawn to him on fake reverses. He is one of the biggest reason the Saints have the #1 offense in the NFL (besides Payton and Brees of course).

Like I said impact isn't only measured by how many times he has scored (though he does have 5 TD's in the last 2 games and 2 100+ recieving days in those games also). Also for everyone that is going to say he isn't an NFL runner, over the last 4 games he is averaging 4.5 YPC.
 
Um, how am I lying with those stats? Im showing all important defensive stats for Dl of every DL taken in the 1st round.
QB pressures are a lot more signficant then sacks. The last two seasons, the sack leader has had 16 sacks, one per game on average. Say about 25 pass attempts a game, a sack imapct 4% of all passing plays...not too great. Consistantly pressuring the QB, forcing him to throw the ball before he wants to and hitting him after the throw are much bigger factors in stopping an offense then one play which forces negative yards. Unfortunately, there is no effective way to measure pressures in a box score, meaning a DL's impact often is undervalued unless you watch the games.
 
Reggie was an impact from day 1. Being an impact isn't all about scoring. How many critical 3rd down catches did Reggie had for the Saints prior to scoring. How many times were defensive players drawn to him on fake reverses. He is one of the biggest reason the Saints have the #1 offense in the NFL (besides Payton and Brees of course).

Like I said impact isn't only measured by how many times he has scored (though he does have 5 TD's in the last 2 games and 2 100+ recieving days in those games also). Also for everyone that is going to say he isn't an NFL runner, over the last 4 games he is averaging 4.5 YPC.
This is a post condeming Mario's impact through stats...if you cant see the corrolation between your argument for Bush and our defense of Mario...
 

SLO Texan

Waterboy
Oops!!!
Well since I already started, I think Mario was coming along well untill his foot ailment. Next year will be the time when he will need to step it up and produce. Hopefully our overall D will be better so he is able to get loose more often.

Compared to the other DEs he does'nt have as many sacks but I doubt they affect the entire game as much as he does.
 
This is a post condeming Mario's impact through stats...if you cant see the corrolation between your argument for Bush and our defense of Mario...
I am in no way saying Mario isn't an impact because of his stats. He isn't an impact because he isn't an impact (stats or not). He disapears more often than not, getting blocked by one guy (I have seen him get handled by TE's). Thats not what an impact defensive linemen does.

Maybe its the foot, I geuss we will see in the next year.
 
With the exception of Wimbley and the Browns, all those players are on defenses that feature a bevy of studs. Mario doesn't have that luxury and has his two DT's out for the season as well...puts a ton of pressure on him...and he's got an injured foot and has been gutting it out. Doesn't change the fact that teams aren't running toward Mario.
Like I said, next year will be the tell.

When the Texans were sure to pick Bush and rumor was the Saints would select Williams I was hoping against it. Like I said he is a freak, but he doesn't play like it. Watch his college games, much like his NFL career to this point.

I am more than willing to admit when I am wrong, and come this time next year if there is a major improvement I will. But right now, he has given me no reason to change my mind up until this point. Only time will tell though.
 

bravesoul1999

Practice Squad
We will see next year, as the New Orleans Saints will be coming to Reliant Stadium.
Do you think TExans fans will sell thier tickets to Saints fans next year so it can be a home game for us? Dallas "fans" were pathetic to sell 10000 tickets to Saints fans and give up the home field advantage
 
Well honestly, Bush has had two good games so far so I'd hold off on calling him Jesus. Vince hasn't really put up a ton of stats yet his team wins but I'm not ready to crown him anything either. It's just WAAAAY too early to call anyone a bust or otherwise.

Personally, I think TEN needed Young. I think NOLA got a player who's going to be good for them and considering Deuce's injury history, served as a nice insurance policy too, and Houston needed help EVERYWHERE and Mario is the guy that works for them.

Bush has had 2 great games. He has had plenty of average to good games. He is the reason the Saints won the Tampa game, returning the punt for a TD. He has contributed 47 1st downs this year.

I agree that Tenn needed Young, but are you saying that Houston didn't? Are you saying that Houston couldn't of used a playmaker like Reggie? How exactly has Mario worked for the Texans? I have seen the games, he hasn't done much, not just stats wise.
 
Houston was expecting their RB to have routine knee surgery and be ready to play this season. They gave the guy a big extension and gave Carr a big extension as well before draft day. It wouldn't have made any sense whatsoever to throw that kind of cash at backups. To say that Reggie is the reason for the Saints turnaround is doing a huge disservice the the real reason they're successful...Brees. New Orleans has had talent, just not at the QB position. Good coaching has been right up there for the Saints too. Bush's TD return with perfect blocking by everyone on his team did win that game. Good for Reggie.

Next time you watch the Texans play, count the number of times teams run the ball to Mario's side. It doesn't happen very often. He's young and raw, but has shown flashes of brilliance, for example...the game vs. the giants. Mario was a wild man. He and DeMeco are going to be a very nice foundation on defense for a long time.
I hope you are right about Mario. But the fact remains. He takes plays off, disapeers more than often and can be blocked most of the time with one guy. I know fans are fans and they want to stick up for their team (like most fans), but facts are facts. Young could have been used, Reggie could have been used. And come next years draft the Texans are still looking to fill holes at OT (D'Brick), QB (Young) and RB (Bush). One of which could have been filled last year.
 

Mr. White

Retired OLine Coach
I hope you are right about Mario. But the fact remains. He takes plays off, disapeers more than often and can be blocked most of the time with one guy. I know fans are fans and they want to stick up for their team (like most fans), but facts are facts. Young could have been used, Reggie could have been used. And come next years draft the Texans are still looking to fill holes at OT (D'Brick), QB (Young) and RB (Bush). One of which could have been filled last year.
I'm not trying to jump into another draft debate, but the pass rush was a pretty big hole as well. He was the top rated defender on the draft board.

If you actually watch the Texans play and you watch Mario Williams, there's really not a whole lot to complain about. Most of us around here that do watch him think he's solid. There's more to football than stats.
 

jerek

Pro Hobbyist
I hope you are right about Mario. But the fact remains. He takes plays off, disapeers more than often and can be blocked most of the time with one guy. I know fans are fans and they want to stick up for their team (like most fans), but facts are facts. Young could have been used, Reggie could have been used. And come next years draft the Texans are still looking to fill holes at OT (D'Brick), QB (Young) and RB (Bush). One of which could have been filled last year.
The taking plays off is total BS. Mario isn't double teamed every play but he is often chipped, has played through injury for most of the season, and every DL "can be blocked most of the time" with one guy. It happens, oh, I don't know, well over 80% of the time across the NFL, even in the case of your perennial greats.

Reggie's had a number of bad games and Mario's had a number of good games where he has made a very tangible difference outside of the stat column. It's okay to admit you are a Saints fan and are happy with your pick without talking ignorantly about ours.
 
He still cant run the ball though. He is a great receiver, but from what I've seen of him running the ball, he will never be a feature back.
Over the last 4 games he have averaged 4.5 YPC. Also, unlike most rookie backs the shares the carries with PRO-BOWL RB Deuce McAllister. The Saints give Reggie 5-8 carries a game, Deuce gets 20+.
 
Over the last 4 games he have averaged 4.5 YPC. Also, unlike most rookie backs the shares the carries with PRO-BOWL RB Deuce McAllister. The Saints give Reggie 5-8 carries a game, Deuce gets 20+.
For one, Deuce was a Pro Bowler, but is no longer. Two, he has had multiple games with 15 carries or more and has not produced. 4.5 yards per carry is nothing when you only get 5 carries....you need an actual sample to create an accurate average...and he still dosnt have a run longer then 18 yards... but if he can get by as a receiver and "decoy" more power to him

Oh, and Reggie isnt the only one splitting carries- Maroney seems to be doing just fine, even DeAngelo Williams is doing better running thr ball
 
The taking plays off is total BS. Mario isn't double teamed every play but he is often chipped, has played through injury for most of the season, and every DL "can be blocked most of the time" with one guy. It happens, oh, I don't know, well over 80% of the time across the NFL, even in the case of your perennial greats.

Reggie's had a number of bad games and Mario's had a number of good games where he has made a very tangible difference outside of the stat column. It's okay to admit you are a Saints fan and are happy with your pick without talking ignorantly about ours.

Are you sure I am the one talking ignorantly? Like I said, I hope Texan fans are right, I hope you found yourself a great player for years to come, but right now I don't see that happening.
 
For one, Deuce was a Pro Bowler, but is no longer. Two, he has had multiple games with 15 carries or more and has not produced. 4.5 yards per carry is nothing when you only get 5 carries....you need an actual sample to create an accurate average...and he still dosnt have a run longer then 18 yards... but if he can get by as a receiver and "decoy" more power to him

Oh, and Reggie isnt the only one splitting carries- Maroney seems to be doing just fine, even DeAngelo Williams is doing better running thr ball
Multiple 15+ carries? Try 1 game with 15 carries (thats it). He also averaged 4.5 YPC in that game.

Also I know most of his stats are "recieving stats" but its not like he is running routes down the field. Most of his "recieving stats" come off screens, swing passes, shovel passes, which are glorified runs. Be in denial if you want to, but facts are facts.

Btw, even splitting carries this year (Reggie has 125 carries to Deuces 202) Deuce is on pace for over 1100 rushing yards. While not Pro-bowl numbers they are VERY impressive for back that until recently (last 3 games) had only 1 20+ carry day.
 

Mr. White

Retired OLine Coach
Signed,

3 years from now this will still be the topic
Are you still gonna be quoting Mario's scouting report 3 years from now?

The people around here that actually watch the Texans games already know what he's capable of.

You haven't said anything here we haven't heard before. Reggie Bush is a great weapon on your offense. Congratulations.
 

dantem

Waterboy
It amazes me that the "experts" on this board keep pointing to Carr and Williams for bad play... Why are you blaming these two players instead of the guys who are constantly screwing up the game. Anybody got any comments about, "butterfingers" Johnson, or "never near the reciever" pete, or the 25 yard punt king? how about "I can't cover anyone" Robbinson. not one word about any of the "we get bowled over on every play" O-Line. I wish you guys would be more realistic, so there would be something legitimate posted. How about instead of trying to prove your point about Carr (which is such a dead horse its almost laghable when another Carr Sucks post comes out), analyze the actual play of the whole team.

Can anyone tell me how many times Johnson has dropped critical passes (even touchdown attempts) that hit him in the numbers this year? I bet most of you blamed Carr for those.
 

dbspi

Waterboy
Not making any excuses but couple factors to consider first. Most of these other guys are playing with better DL support then Mario. Other factor to consider is his feet problem. He hasn't played healthy all season. After first couple of games I thought he came on strong prior to injury.

But still he should have had better STATS and more impact on defense. We will see double digit SACKS and more impacts on defense from him consistently for years to come.
 
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