Bring the House of Pain back to Houston!

Discussion in 'Texans Talk' started by trutxn, Feb 20, 2007.

  1. trutxn

    trutxn Veteran

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    Mario is our franchise! We need to give him help along the line so he does not receive the same criticisms that Carr has had to endure (#1 pick bust). With additional d-line presence, a second OLB, and another safety we could dominate on defense. We are not going to "out do" Vince and Peyton, lets try to stop them. If we win the division, we make the playoffs.
     
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  2. Texans_Chick

    Texans_Chick Utopian Dreamer

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    I worry a bit about the defense.

    Right now they need to work on average, adequate, non-embarrasing, and consistent.

    I don't believe they are currently within the zip code of House of Pain. I would love for the team to have a defense that is feared as opposed to one that is circled on the calendar to have a big stat day against.

    Lots of players needed.

    And they have a coaching staff without much of a track record of success.

    Maybe because I'm so down on the defense I wasn't as freaked as some were about the Mario pick.

    Name all the players on the Texans you would want if you had a different NFL team:

    Mario, DeMeco, Dunta, Anthony Weaver and....?

    meh.
     
  3. Stros5Texans80

    Stros5Texans80 Veteran

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    We have all number 1 picks on the line and we still can't get pressure. I think personally we try to get offensive weapons mostly this year. Would be a big help if we can nail Peterson this year.
     
  4. Double Barrel

    Double Barrel Modified Simian

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    We'll need "the pain" before we can bring "the house".

    As a fan of dominant defense, I'd love nothing more than a Texans D that ranks in the top 5 of the important categories. I think we've acquired a core group to build upon, but we'll need another playmaker (or two), plus some role players that can step up. Who knows if our staff is up to the challenge (I'm not a big fan of Richard Smith), but adding Bush to the FO will give us a more balanced presence, IMO.
     
  5. hollywood_texan

    hollywood_texan Hall of Fame

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    A shutdown corner would be the biggest impact for the defense right now. Unfortunately, those guys do not come cheap!

    The defensive line is underachieving and needs to improve, but I don't think it is really a talent issue as much as scheme and coaching.
     
  6. Stros5Texans80

    Stros5Texans80 Veteran

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    Completely agree. The balance can work either way for a defense (up to a point). If you have good corners/safeties, then that buys the D-Line some time to get pressure on the QB and vice-versa. :yes:
     
  7. Texans_Chick

    Texans_Chick Utopian Dreamer

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    How do you figure it isn't partially a talent issue??? Coach calls out the first round DT as lazy before camp even gets underway, some of the DEs are undersized 3-4 OLBs, and the DTs that end up playing most of the season are basically rejects from other teams who oft play better than your injured starters did, and your FA acquisition ends up being solid, non-spectacular, and having to move to an undersized DT at times because of lots of DEs not so much DTs.

    I will agree that a quality corner would be heaven. Of course, that assumes that the staff can actually identify a corner that fits the system (cough cough Buchanon cough cough--Jon Hoke is still coaching corners).
     
  8. Ole Miss Texan

    Ole Miss Texan Hall of Fame

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    I like a lot of the defensive guys that are up there in the 1st rd and 2nd. We can really help out our D with this draft but when I go through and 'do' that I skip our offense which needs a lot of help too.

    Depending on who's available at #8, I'd be happy if we pick...
    -Gaines Adams, Jamaal Anderson, Amobi Okoye, Alan Branch, Laron Landry, Reggie Nelson, Leon Hall, Darelle Revis

    I'd be fine if we selected any of these guys...particularly the first 5. And we'd be guaranteed one of them. If not...then that means someone out of Thomas, Russell, Peterson would be available for us.
     
  9. hollywood_texan

    hollywood_texan Hall of Fame

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    I don't think someone being lazy is a talent issue. Are you referring to Travis Johnson? As for the undersized issue, you are probably referring to Peek and Babin. Those guys are serviceable if you fit them right in the rotation and scheme. The issue with Babin is cost of ownership (draft picks and contract), but from time to time he has a flash or two.

    I agree with your assessment on our DT issue. That is a big question mark.

    In my assessment, Williams and Weaver should be able to hold more than their own at the end positions. Then kick Johnson in the rear and get him motivated with more production on the inside. Then you fill out the rest with roles players (examples are Peek and Babin, running something like a little 3-4 or something exotic from time to time to take advantage of their talents because they are not traditional DEs).

    I am not saying the Texans have the best talent on the defensive line, but in today's NFL, you are not going to stockpile marquee players at every position. That is where coaching and schemes come into play. Which was really my point.

    Putting together talent on an NFL team is like plugging a leaky bucket with 20 holes and all you can use is your fingers to stop the leaks. You can't plug all the holes, so you go after the bigger ones.

    Having said that, getting a shut down corner probably would provide the biggest impact on the defensive side of the ball. Is is worth the price? Ummmm, I don't know...

    Would I like to upgrade the defensive line more, ABSOLUTELY! But, I would seriously look for that shut down corner first. There is sufficient talent on the defensive line to get more production out of those guys.
     
  10. hollywood_texan

    hollywood_texan Hall of Fame

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    Actually, I think I can say it a little better.

    The Dline is underachieving talent, whereas the secondary is just way in over their heads.

    Faggins is not a cover corner, and the safeties probably would have hard time to find work in the NFL if they were cut by the Texans. You can't say that about the Dline. All of those guys are going to get jobs if the Texans released them.
     
  11. Texans_Chick

    Texans_Chick Utopian Dreamer

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    How can you call Travis Johnson an underachiever if he has never achieved? People want to peg him as lazy, but maybe he was never someone who was worth being picked in the first round. I'm not saying I have the answers on this, but there has been little in his play that makes me think, gee, all our DT problems are over.

    Seth Payne was a very good player, but he got a bad injury and is on the oldish side.

    And the rest of the DTs are basically either practice squad guys or over the hill guys.

    Babin/Peek really aren't great fits for the defense, and Weaver is okay.

    I am encouraged with how young Williams is, his potential upside and the attitude he has shown, but really, there is nobody on the rest of the line that makes me think that the Texans will magically develop more of a pass rush no matter what sort of scheme the coaches run.

    Yes, a new better corner would be terrific. But geez, the entire defense looks like a list of needs:

    1. A consistent pass rushing DE

    2. Defensive Tackles.

    3. Outside linebackers

    4. Safeties

    5. Another corner

    6. Football smarts mixed with talent

    Another corner would be great but unfortunately everybody is looking for that too.

    I'm not the biggest fan of our defensive coaches, but you can't make chicken salad out of chicken...beaks. (Well you could, but it wouldn't taste so good.)
     
  12. 2BCF

    2BCF Hall of Fame

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    With Carr you have something close, The House of Vain!
     
  13. dirty steve

    dirty steve Hall of Fame

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    amazingly fresh. how long did it take you to come with a disparinging word that rhymes with "pain?" why dont you take this to the other 40 threads on the same subject?

    anyway...i have soured on Peek since before last season. he never can stay healthy, and often makes rookie mistakes when he is out there. but he does have that streak of potential that keeps you coming back. if keep him, maybe you get more of the same. if you let him go, he goes double digit sacks in 2007. tough decision for the FO. i think him or babin are gone.

    i hope we go into 2007 not having to depend on payne and johnson alone. a depth infusion is really needed in case payne cant come back/is cut, johnson lays an egg, and the street guys play like..street guys in 2007.

    branch's value seems to be slipping a bit but might still be a good value if the team is to trade down to the 12-13 area. i think him or okoye are the only DL guys they would take in the 1st round.

    i am really hoping at least one DB (CB or safety) can be signed in free agency. i dont want the team to feel like they have to reach for both in draft, although safety and cornerback seem as big of needs as D-Line.
     
  14. BSofA04

    BSofA04 Hall of Fame

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    I can't wait until the combine begins. My hope is that the Redskins and Vikings lose intrest in Jamaal Anderson so that we could potentially acquire a pressuring DE. Same goes for DT Branch. I like the fact that he demands a lot of space and can clog the run. Either one of these guys would force teams to become pass-happy. Throw in some key FA's and suddenly the defense ain't that bad. We know the Titans would have fits.
     
  15. Ole Miss Texan

    Ole Miss Texan Hall of Fame

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    IN MY OPINION, THE BEST POST I'VE READ IN THIS THREAD, in quite some time. i'm too flippin lazy to read the same thing over and over.

    This is the perfect post to say, whoever we select at the #8 spot is a GREAT pick. (much like Mario was....get over it every one else) Especially if we want to bring back the house of pain.

    we are a long way from it. Mario, demeco, and dunta are the start of it. Whoever we select at #8 will be the next piece (if defense! lol) we only have three GREAT starters on defense. and one on offense (andre).
     
  16. Stros5Texans80

    Stros5Texans80 Veteran

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    That's the problem though. We have really only one real threat on offense. Moulds can be on sometimes, but most of the teams we played this year didn't take off as much pressure off of AJ that we would have liked. I still think we try to get AP or Lynch, possibly even Quinn. If none of those guys are available, then we draft defense.
     
  17. Ole Miss Texan

    Ole Miss Texan Hall of Fame

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    You're right we dont have a real threat, thats why I like the pick of peterson. lynch could very well help us....i don't like him...have no good reason...hope we don't draft him. ( if we do and he's great..i'll be the 1st to say damn i'm wron!!)..i do think he'll be a good player but don't want him on the texans....

    quinn won't help us next year. maybe in the 2008 season but not next season. if you want immediat results...i'd chose peterson or brown. if not them you go bpa on defense...or maybe even just go secondary.
     
  18. DocBar

    DocBar Hall of Fame

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    Since Samuels has been tagged, I'd like to see us target Clements for CB then draft DL or SS in the 1st. A top notch strong safety would help us in coverage AND the running game. IMO, TJ was coming along pretty good before he was injured. I think he fell victim to a big payday and some bad influences in the locker room(Walker and Smith comes to mind). Which came first, the dominant secondary or the dominant pass rush? We may have found a couple of diamonds in the rough in Maddox and Killings. They did a good job in a bad situation last year and should be able to provide quality depth at a reasonable price.
     
  19. nunusguy

    nunusguy Hall of Fame

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    We have 4 defenders who would be rated good to excellent: Dlinemen Mario
    & Anthony Weaver, LB DeMeco, & CB Dunta. WIL backer Greenwood and SS Earl are mediorce, but acceptable.
    Needs that remain unfilled but are not as challenging to meet are an ungrade in FS and SAM backer.
    Our most pressing needs on D are a strong pass-rusher (who at the same time is not a liability on rushing defense) to play weakside DE & another corner comparable to Dunta in cover skills.
     
  20. TEXANRED

    TEXANRED Texan-American

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    I must admit this part baffles me. Kinda makes you wonder what pictures or compromising evidence he has on the Texan organization. Marcus Coleman and Glen made him look good the first year and the job Glen did with DROb made hoke look spectacular. Since Glen left its been all down hill.

    Before we get the "We don't have a pass rush" crowd going, we have never had a pass rush. Posey still holds the record at 8, and that was set in 2002.
     

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