Brian Gaine Thread

Discussion in 'Texans Talk' started by Mangler, Jan 17, 2018.

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  1. Lucky

    Lucky Moderator

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    That's your opinion and you're entitled to it. I'm just stating facts.
     
  2. maverick512000

    maverick512000 All Pro

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    Numbers wise your are correct and again you are correct that we don't know what BB would have done. I will say that history does not support that BB would have paid that much as he hasn't really in the past unless its a franchise type player but, again, you are right that history has also shown BB doesn't let the team get like that.

    My original point though was that Steel keeps using former SB bowl winning and what they do to support his argument but ignores when a current SB winning team does something that doesn't.
     
  3. Lucky

    Lucky Moderator

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    OK. But, can the Texans afford to mimic a SB organization when their most valuable commodity (Watson) is facing peril? NFL salaries are escalating rapidly. This time next year, Brown will just be top 10 in OT salary. The year after, he'll be out of the top 10. The only question that should have been asked is, "Would Trent Brown make Deshaun Watson better?" In all honesty, he would have helped. Then the Texans would have only $24 million in cap space, as opposed to $40 million.
     
  4. maverick512000

    maverick512000 All Pro

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    Disagree, with Devlin as the coach and already having average stats on one of the most Oline friendly systems and Oline friendly QBs there is, with a HoF HC and Oline coach, I don't think we would have seen a marked improvement. Certainly not enough to justify that kind of money. Also yeah the salaries are going up but we don't know that the cap will, granted it most likely will but we don't know for sure, or what kind of contract Watson in particular will command or Clowney this year.
     
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  5. Lucky

    Lucky Moderator

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    We don't know the exact cap number, but we know it's going up. Estimated at $200 million in 2020, a $12 million increase. Then, the new TV deals will be negotiated and these numbers will get astronomical.

    We don't know what kind of deal Clowney will get, or if he will get one. But any new deal will not have a 2019 cap hit higher than his 2019 tag number. That's just how contracts are worked. Pushing the money out to future years, when the cap is higher.

    I don't know what kind of performance numbers you are looking at in regards to Trent Brown. Clearly, Brady makes everyone look better. Including Belichick. But, to suggest that Brown would not help the Texans because of the offensive line coach is perplexing. Why spend any resources on the o-line? Especially a 1st round pick that will really need pro coaching? That argument begs for a vet LT, not against acquiring one.
     
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  6. steelbtexan

    steelbtexan Hall of Fame

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    Did the Eagles want Dillard more than Howard?

    Do the Eagles have a better track record of drafting OL than the Texans?

    This was my point.
     
  7. steelbtexan

    steelbtexan Hall of Fame

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    You're right, they've been made and what's done is done. We can only hope for the best. But pointing out the Texans orgs shortcomings and comparing them to a successful org like the Eagles doesn't make me a whiny *****.

    Calling me names isn't the way to go with me. You obviously are trying to live up to your Avatar.
     
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  8. steelbtexan

    steelbtexan Hall of Fame

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    The p Pat's are the outlier. They are a smart org that has already drafted Brown's replacement. A big difference in the way the orgs have been run. This isn't Gaine's fault. He's dealing with the hand he was dealt
     
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  9. maverick512000

    maverick512000 All Pro

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    Brown was ranked 32nd by PFF though I will grant you he had a good playoff run he still was only had a grade of 86 while Davenport had a grade of 76. A ten point difference is not enough to me to justify that kind of money. Add to that he looked to be completely run of the mill with 49ers and then he gets to NE and all of a sudden he's the best Lt in the league? Only thing that changed was Brady and the coaching and now he won't have either of those things.

    As far as spending resources on the Oline, first I didn't want them to draft Howard in the first round or even Dillard, I wanted Brown, I know I got the irony to, to have a backup when Fuller or Coutee go down again and then trade up with the Cards in early second to get Howard or whoever. Trouble with a Vet LT is you don't know if they can adjust systems very well especially coming from a well oiled machine like the Pats. How many times have we seen stars in NE become duds when they leave. I'm hoping that with a rookie OT that he can be molded a little easier and that the skill level is high enough to overcome the Oline coaching but I'll admit I'm not that hopeful.
     
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  10. steelbtexan

    steelbtexan Hall of Fame

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    Exactly
     


  11. steelbtexan

    steelbtexan Hall of Fame

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    Exactly
     
  12. steelbtexan

    steelbtexan Hall of Fame

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    TLTR,

    Brown was very good in San Francisco.

    32 is middle of the pack. I would take middle of the pack after the last 2 yrs. Gaine would have too but in true Texans orgs fashion didn't want to pay the price to get him.

    He had too many FA's to sign to one year deals

    Meanwhile Watson isn't protected as well as he could be and the Texans are sitting on the 2nd most cap space in the NFL.

    BTW, Signing Brown wouldn't have hurt them at all capwise
     
  13. Lucky

    Lucky Moderator

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    As I said, the money is not that relevant. The Texans have plenty now and will have plenty in the future. And I take these PFF numbers with a more than a grain of salt. What did your eyes tell you when you watched Brown and Davenport? Looks like at least $16 million difference, to me. One can do the job, the other cannot.

    Here's Belichick's opinion on PFF grading.

    Remember, these grades are being doled out by amateurs just like you. It's an opinion based off uneducated guesses.
     
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  14. Dejaview

    Dejaview Veteran

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    Ok, that does it. I now believe in abortion.
     
  15. Texansballer74

    Texansballer74 Hall of Fame

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    Nope. The Texans gave a hefty offer. We just stroke out. The Patriots on the other hand is known for not giving out big time contracts.
     
  16. HaveMercy

    HaveMercy Passing Through

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    We'll just have to wait and see what kind of peril DWatson is facing this season. The issue has a lot of moving parts and the solution isn't as easy as saying just do this or just do that.

    Whether anyone likes the way they went about it or who they picked, the Texans put some real draft capital into the OLine this year with their early selections. And whether anyone thinks OB and Devlin can do anything with the new linemen, I know the coaches & players will be trying.

    Gaine, OB, et al are well aware that Watson can't continue to get whacked around like he has been. We're not the only ones that see that his career and effectiveness stand a strong chance of being damaged if things don't improve.

    Also, as has been well said here many times, more needs to be fixed than just the OLine. Quicker recognition & getting rid of the ball faster by DWatson will help a lot. That's how Brady often beats rushers. So the Texans have brought in Carl Smith to help DWatson the way he was able to help Russell Wilson.

    Better play design will also make a big difference, but the biggest part of that is having Coutee and Fuller healthy, plus developing another couple of young receivers.

    I'm not telling you guys anything new. The Texans are trying to take steps that will help protect DWatson's health and future. A lot of folks here don't like the steps they have or haven't taken, and that's okay, we can talk about it calmly and rationally. But they're definitely taking steps.

    And while I'm posting, can we please talk to each other like grown men and dispense with the personal attacks, crude comments, and name-calling? We may not agree with each other, but we should always agree to be civil about it. As I've said before, argument by ridicule is really no argument at all.
     
    Last edited: May 30, 2019
  17. steelbtexan

    steelbtexan Hall of Fame

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    Great post,

    This is exactly where I'm at.
     
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  18. maverick512000

    maverick512000 All Pro

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    So you admit that he was middle of the pack but you are willing to make a middle of the pack guy the highest paid OT in history. Not sure I can trust your judgement when you say that it wouldn't have hurt us cap wise when your solution to any problem seems to be throw more money at it.


    I'm going to try and not take that personally but I haven't seen much from you to show you are any less and amateur or any more educated. Also your quote from BB doesn't address PFF grading at all. He was talking about announcers when looking at the plays and all he said was depending on the play called it could have gone different ways, well no sh!t Sherlock.


    I looked and couldn't find anything about what the offer was. All I found was Brown saying that he had three offers, Pats, Texans and Raiders and that the Raiders offer was a no brainer. If you found differently please link it to me.
     
  19. steelbtexan

    steelbtexan Hall of Fame

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    He's a middle of the pack LT (Which I would take in a heartbeat after seeing the last 2 yrs of OL play.) and a very good RT which he will be playing for the Raiders next yr.

    You gotta pay to play and the Texans org would rather not play than have to pay. This is why they are a draft only type team. When you make mistakes in the draft you have to overpay for those sins in FA if you want to be relevant. The Texans dont pay for their sins and therefore haven't been relevant.
     
  20. JB

    JB Old Curmudgeon

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    You're right. My apologies. I honestky didn't call you a name though, not even in my head, just stated what it looked like. I know better than that too. Again my apologies
     
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