Are the 2012 Texans better than the 2011 Texans?

Discussion in 'Texans Talk' started by gafftop, Sep 1, 2012.

  1. gafftop

    gafftop Hall of Fame

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    Obviously a hypothetical question but would you rather be starting this season with the team we have NOW or the team we had at the start of last year. Or put another way do you think we got better this year?
     
  2. Lucky

    Lucky Moderator

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    *checking calender*
    You mean the 2012 vs 2011 Texans, right?

    The 2011 squad had more talent. But, I think this year's squad, with playoff experience under their belt, have a good chance at achieving more. Will Schaub and AJ make it to the playoffs healthy? That will be the difference.
     
  3. EllisUnit

    EllisUnit Serving Koolaid

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    Do i think we got better ? In certain phases yes.

    RB - Yes we added Forsett

    WR - Yes We have Jean Healthy, Martin and Posey

    everywhere else we took a step back, besides QB and D-line.

    Secondary, J. Allen did good things for us and he was replaced by ball. We kept Shilo over Nolan. We Lost Dressen and have Graham. We lost Winston and Brisel and now have "whoever and whoever".

    I think this team has taken a step backwards TBH. BUT with that said i still think this team has superbowl potential
     
  4. The Pencil Neck

    The Pencil Neck Subscribed Contributor

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    I think we're better this year.
     
  5. Texan_Touchdown

    Texan_Touchdown Rookie

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    I think were better on offense but on defense not so much.
     
  6. Thorn

    Thorn Dirty Old Man

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    I'm thinking the opposite. With the O line taking a step backwards in talent and the defense with a years' experience in Wade's system and a full training camp under their belt will be even better than last year. With Holliday making such a splash the special teams will most certainly be better.

    So I guess I'll say (on paper at least) this is a better team than last year.
     
  7. Marcus

    Marcus Ruthless pragmatist

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    I also think exactly the opposite. Holliday and the defense will bailing the offense out all season long. The O line, already suspect, will be decimated by injuries.

    We might back door our way into the playoffs, but that's about it.

    And dust off all those "Fire Kubiak" threads. They're gonna come in handy. :)
     
  8. Malloy

    Malloy Site Contributor

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    Last year players stepped up to the challenge, if that happens again good things will happen.

    Tough question, I'm hoping for 'yes' :)
     


  9. Lucky

    Lucky Moderator

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    If necessary, we'll start a new one in your honor.
     
  10. b0ng

    b0ng Ooops

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    Might as well make a new one for the new season since it will happen by itself when Kubiak loses a game.
     
  11. Malloy

    Malloy Site Contributor

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    Only if 'it's on him' :)
     
  12. pirbroke

    pirbroke All Pro

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    I have not felt so good about a Houston team since the original Phillips was here. Pray for a healthy season and we can win it all. This team has improved this year mainly from just experience and learning the game more, I think that offset our loses in personal.
     
  13. srrono

    srrono Hall of Fame

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    All I know is 2013 is going to hurt. source spotrac
    2013 Houston Texans Free Agent Tracker
    Alan Ball CB UFA
    Connor Barwin DE UFA
    John Beck QB UFA
    Rashad Butler T UFA
    Antoine Caldwell G UFA
    James Casey TE UFA
    Shaun Cody DT UFA
    Tim Dobbins LB UFA
    Justin Forsett RB UFA
    Keyaron Fox LB UFA
    Andrew Gardner T RFA
    Shayne Graham K UFA
    Ra'Shon Harris DT RFA
    Trindon Holliday KR RFA
    Juaquin Iglesias WR RFA
    Bradie James LB UFA
    Tim Jamison DT UFA
    Donnie Jones P UFA
    Mitch King DT RFA
    Brice McCain CB UFA
    Jesse Nading DE UFA
    Troy Nolan S UFA
    Moran Norris RB UFA
    Glover Quin CB UFA
    Matt Schaub QB UFA
    Cody Wallace C UFA
     
  14. Lucky

    Lucky Moderator

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    How is that different from any other NFL team? Players come up for contract every year. 8 are starters, but some of those could be upgraded. I don't see it as a big deal.
     
  15. b0ng

    b0ng Ooops

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    Schaub, Quin, Barwin, Caldwell are the big ones. With a few notable exceptions, most of those guys aren't really guys you worry about keeping too much (or are already gone).
     
  16. Lucky

    Lucky Moderator

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    Caldwell isn't even a lock to keep his job through the entire season. The decisions on Schaub and Barwin are the keys.
     
  17. Thorn

    Thorn Dirty Old Man

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    they'll lose a few good ones, and then pick up someone else's UFAs. The thing of it is, the Texans are now a good team and fit for playoff runs for several more years.

    If Kubiak and Smith keep up the good work, they could keep this going for a long while. There are teams that do, like Pittsburg and New England. I guess my point is, I don't think we have to worry about crappy 5 or less win seasons for a long time.

    It could be worse, and yall know it, because we are only a season or two removed from the trash heap of the NFL.
     
  18. Dutchrudder

    Dutchrudder COOL BEANS!

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    Add in the fact that he has Mario Williams Syndrome (always nicked up) and you have a vet minimum price tag. He will probably be retained next year, but only if he can beat out Brooks and Ben Jomes for the job.
     
  19. kiwitexansfan

    kiwitexansfan Site Contributor

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    Thinking last year to this year, the OL freaks me out. I think we might have some better weapons on offense but will we get a chance to use them with the current blocking?

    I also recall Wade's second year swoon syndrome posts and wonder if the D is going to take a step backwards.

    So, no, I think our team is worse. Still good enough to PWN our division but not booking time off for the superbowl quite yet.
     
    Cjeremy635 likes this.
  20. Corrosion

    Corrosion Idealist

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    I dont know Lucky .... Lets evaluate the roster by position.


    QB - I think is slightly better with the seasoning of Yates and Beck is an upgrade over Lienart. The key here is Schaubs health.

    RB - I think is a push between Ward and Forsett. But we're talking about the third guy behind the best RB combo in the league.

    WR - I think this years group is considerably better especially the depth. Jacoby Jones , David Anderson , Bryant Johnson and Derrick Mason out - In with Martin , Jean and Posey. Its debatable tho since none of those kids has made an NFL reception but every one of them has shown to have playmaking capabilities that last years group didnt (outside of Jones).

    TE - OD , Dreesen , Casey or OD , Graham , Casey ? A lot depends on Graham ... he looked good against the Aints. I'll go with Dreesen until proven otherwise , advantage 2011

    FB - Casey and Vickers Vs Casey and Tyler Clutts - I dont know much about Clutts .... But Vickers wasnt very good , cost the team W game with a crutial drop. Call it a push here too ?

    OL - Last years OL was better without a doubt tho pass protection could be better. We'll give this to the 2011 squad.


    DL - Smith , Cody , Watt .... same starting trio and Watt should improve since he was a rookie last year. Crick , Jamison and Mitchell as depth. Call it even ?

    ILB - Cushing & Ryans Vs Cushing and Bradie James , on paper it seems like Cush and Ryans are the better combo but Ryans was a real liability in coverage. I think James is sligtly better in coverage and Ryans a bit better against the run. Dobbins was last years backup as well tho Sharpton is injured (again). Slight edge to 2011 just to be fair.


    OLB - Here's the interesting position with MW gone. He was playing well before the injury but Brooks Reed came in and didnt miss a beat. The defense finished #2 overall. MW clearly has more talent but for the second year in a row lands on IR. MW had 5 sacks thru 5 games , Reed had 6 the next 11. Advantage 2011

    CB - Not much change here other than Jason Allen leaving and we've had a Brandon Harris sighting. KJ wont be in a platoon situation this season. McMains didnt play much outside of ST. Dont know how to call this one but KJ has looked better. Call it even.


    Safety - Exchange Nolan for Keo. I think Nolan's the better safety but Keo's the better ST player. We're talking about the 4th safety. Who makes a greater impact ?? Probably a push.



    KR/PR - Jacoby was explosive but an accident waiting to happen making boneheaded decisions and carrying the ball like he was doing the funky chicken. He also ran backwards a lot on PR's .... which I couldnt stand.

    Tricycle is even more explosive IMO and doesnt really make the bad decisions. He has put a couple on the ground tho , the kickoff fumble I think the defender made the play popping the ball out while Tricycle was stiffarming a defender He does have to cover it up better in traffic. On the muffed punt .... I give Tricycle full responsibility , he also had the sense to get it out of bounds.

    I have to give the advantage here to the current squad.

    Punter / Holder - Hartmann has a hell of a leg. I hated to see him released and really wondered how they would handle the situation once his suspension ended. Dude would lay the wood in coverage too ....
    Also handled some KO duties last season but would occasionally line drive one short .... otherwise they were out of the endzone.
    Jones doesnt have the leg that Hartmann does but he has been solid and has saved at least two bad snaps on FG/PAT's. Thats a real importnt aspect of his job description.
    This one's a tough call. I demand a recount.


    Kicker - Rackers was solid last year but didnt have the leg to hit the long ones. Kubiak on more than one occasion punted rather than send him out to attempt a 50+ yarder.
    Graham was brought in not to win the job but to push Bullock - He won the job hands down IMO. The only complaint I have is depth on kickoffs.
    Both veterans with playoff experience - I call this one even too.


    Your assessment is probably correct .... but I think its at least debatable. They do have the tools to make a deep run but a whole lot depends upon health at key positions , especially Schaub's. Everything else being equal , a healthy Schaub this team is much better. The scarry thing is the right side of the OL keeping Schaub upright.
     
    ObsiWan, Cjeremy635 and gafftop like this.

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