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D-line help to chase Vince & Peyton

trutxn

trutxn

Waterboy
News flash...D-line needed to help chase Vince & Peyton!

Since Adrian Peterson, Calvin Johnson, and Joe Thomas are not going to be around at #8, lets draft another defensive phenom that no one knows about...Amobi Okoye. Okoye and Mario working together with DeMeco behind them would form a defensive force in the future. Especially if we could land a quality safety in free agency.

Sure offense makes games fun to watch, but if teams can't score on us, they can't beat us. A solid front four would make the LBs and DBs better, allowing us to use more men in coverage. Any team with a front four that can pressure the QB is always dangerous.

I know our offense needs help but lets bring the House of Pain back to Houston, while our offense finds itself. As long as our defense scores 14 a game we should be good.
 
trutxn said:
Since Adrian Peterson, Calvin Johnson, and Joe Thomas are not going to be around at #8, lets draft another defensive phenom that no one knows about...Amobi Okoye. Okoye and Mario working together with DeMeco behind them would form a defensive force in the future. Especially if we could land a quality safety in free agency.

Sure offense makes games fun to watch, but if teams can't score on us, they can't beat us. A solid front four would make the LBs and DBs better, allowing us to use more men in coverage. Any team with a front four that can pressure the QB is always dangerous.

I know our offense needs help but lets bring the House of Pain back to Houston, while our offense finds itself. As long as our defense scores 14 a game we should be good.
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I think that is the right track, I would also be happy with having another true pass rushing DE line up opposite Mario, say Gaines Adams or Jamaal Anderson.

Take the money you would save in keeping Carr and not sign another QB and put it toward signing Luke Pettigout. That would be two huge additions to the lines and they need it.
 
Texian said:
I think that is the right track, I would also be happy with having another true pass rushing DE line up opposite Mario, say Gaines Adams or Jamaal Anderson.

Take the money you would save in keeping Carr and not sign another QB and put it toward signing Luke Pettigout. That would be two huge additions to the lines and they need it.
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Add Lavar Arrington to a short (not to expensive) contract and pick up Nate Clemens in FA we could have a solid defense next yr.
 
I'd be really happy with us shoring up the defense a bit more in this draft. I still want to see the Combine results because guys are going to be falling and rising all over the place but from everything I've heard, I wouldn't be against getting Okoye at this point.

We're going to have a lot of cash tied up in the d-line. But it would be really sweet to be able to get pressure with just our front 4 and I know that's high on Kubiak's to-do list.
 
trutxn said:
Add Lavar Arrington to a short (not to expensive) contract and pick up Nate Clemens in FA we could have a solid defense next yr.
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Clements is out of our price range and we stil have so many wholes that we cant put all the cap space in one guy.
 
trutxn said:
News flash...D-line needed to help chase Vince & Peyton!

Sure offense makes games fun to watch, but if teams can't score on us, they can't beat us.
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Chicago has pretty good defense, look what happened to them in SB. Bottom line is it doesn't matter how good your defense is, you still need to score points in order to win. BALANCE IS THEY KEY TO SUCCESS not one sided offense or one sided defense.
 
amazingandre said:
how many times have we picke dline in the the beginnning of the draft and how many times has it worked????
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The reason it didn't work out for us was mainly due to people who we had at that time in administration (Casserley and Capers). These people are not the best people to judge talent and it is their ineptitude that has this franchise at the brinks. The only thing previous administration ever did was to waste draft picks and with all the draft picks which we had all we have to show for is Andre Johnson and DRob.

If I am correct, I do believe we had 13 draft picks each of our first three years into expansion draft.
 
dbspi said:
Chicago has pretty good defense, look what happened to them in SB. Bottom line is it doesn't matter how good your defense is, you still need to score points in order to win. BALANCE IS THEY KEY TO SUCCESS not one sided offense or one sided defense.
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Yeah, but lets really look at it. Chicago's BEST DLineman TOMMIE HARRIS was out of the game. Typically Tommie Makes plays that most people would never think are possible(he is likley the next franchised bear, you read it here first!). Many times opponents have to double tommie which creates room for the other Dlinman to cause havoc. Tommie Harris makes Ogunlye that much better which makes Alex Brown better which makes Tank(the weak link of the Dline in my opinion better). Look at Freeney and Mathis: same idea, you double one, the other can come right at you. Put Mario and Okoye together and you will have a fierce Dline.
 
I like Okoye a lot. he could be a good pick up for us.

I think signing clements in FA would be a mistake. It would help our Defense tremendously but he's way over priced. We're not in the position to make a superbowl run next year or even in 2008 so getting him would be pointless imo. I'd spend that much money only if he was the last piece for us...

he wouldn't even be the last piece in our secondary...count in linebacker, d-line, o-line, rb, qb. that's a lot of holes..so we should go after lower priced guys for the long haul.
 
Texian said:
I think that is the right track, I would also be happy with having another true pass rushing DE line up opposite Mario, say Gaines Adams or Jamaal Anderson.

Take the money you would save in keeping Carr and not sign another QB and put it toward signing Luke Pettigout. That would be two huge additions to the lines and they need it.
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Just putting this out there.

but we save more money for Pettigout & Domonick Rhodes maybe if we cut David.....
 
no lavar arrington is not only overrated but injury prone he only excels in blitzing and when not blitzing gets caught out of position frequently and clements is also overrated as i personally think his tandem partner terrance mcgee was better but got less pub and if we go d-line im very intrigued with okoye he could be a beast let him and mario develop its scary to think about what could happen
 
BleedTheBurntOrange said:
no lavar arrington is not only overrated but injury prone he only excels in blitzing and when not blitzing gets caught out of position frequently and clements is also overrated as i personally think his tandem partner terrance mcgee was better but got less pub and if we go d-line im very intrigued with okoye he could be a beast let him and mario develop its scary to think about what could happen
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Sometimes punctuation can be a real cool thing
 
amazingandre said:
how many times have we picke dline in the the beginnning of the draft and how many times has it worked????
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We've picked twice? Travis Johnson and Mario Williams? Who have both been drafted in the last two years. I guess Babin can be thrown in there but he wasn't really drafted as a full time DL guy.

Travis Johnson and Jason Babin should not prevent us from drafting a top rated DL, if they are clearly better than other options on the board.
 
awtysst said:
Yeah, but lets really look at it. Chicago's BEST DLineman TOMMIE HARRIS was out of the game. Typically Tommie Makes plays that most people would never think are possible(he is likley the next franchised bear, you read it here first!). Many times opponents have to double tommie which creates room for the other Dlinman to cause havoc. Tommie Harris makes Ogunlye that much better which makes Alex Brown better which makes Tank(the weak link of the Dline in my opinion better). Look at Freeney and Mathis: same idea, you double one, the other can come right at you. Put Mario and Okoye together and you will have a fierce Dline.
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Don't get me wrong, I like Okoye very much but our Dline will still continue to struggle because of TJ and Anthony Weaver. TJ is inconsistent and Weaver is not much of pass rush threat from the other DE position.

If We move Weaver to inside then we need another stud at DE who can pass rush the QB opposite to Mario. Peek and Babin are not the answer to that position. Peek has the talent but mostly been injured and Babin is just not good enough to provide consistent pass rush. Both of these players are much better off as a back up.

Aside from Demeco, we really need to up grade both OLB position and the secondary.
 
dbspi said:
Don't get me wrong, I like Okoye very much but our Dline will still continue to struggle because of TJ and Anthony Weaver. TJ is inconsistent and Weaver is not much of pass rush threat from the other DE position.

If We move Weaver to inside then we need another stud at DE who can pass rush the QB opposite to Mario...

Aside from Demeco, we really need to up grade both OLB position and the secondary.
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So since we have Weaver and TJ we don't try to get better?

It would be nice to have two book ends but if we could line up a dominant DT next to Mario the two would crush an entire side of the line, in turn opening up the other side. Who would teams double, Mario or Okoye? If they double both that means the other DT and DE would be working one on one. We made an investment in Mario, :mario: lets take care of him. We definitely need LBs and DBs, although if we do not get pressure with our front four, it does not matter how good our coverage is. Give any NFL QB time and he will eat you alive, even Carr.

The offense would be efficient enough if we could improve our line and running game. Balance is key to success, but history proves that a dominant defense and strong special teams (which we have w/ Mathis in the line up) can (and have SEVERAL times) carry a lackluster offense. The saying that "Offense wins games and defense wins championships" has been around 100 yrs for a reason.
 
I'm just not sold on taking D-line yet. Don't get me wrong, I like Branch and Okoye but last year I was really hoping to trade down and take linemen. Now we are still talking about taking D-line again yet we still don't have any of the playmakers we need...whether it be another D-back or someone on the offensive side. I've never been an O-line high draft guy but if Levi were there I'd listen to that too. I guess growing up a Boys fan and looking at drafts over the years I'm a little nervous of anyone of the D-linemen turning into another Greg Ellis(#8) or Ekuban(#20) who is solid but not spectacular. We have alot of that.
 
HoustonFrog said:
I'm just not sold on taking D-line yet. Don't get me wrong, I like Branch and Okoye but last year I was really hoping to trade down and take linemen. Now we are still talking about taking D-line again yet we still don't have any of the playmakers we need...whether it be another D-back or someone on the offensive side. I've never been an O-line high draft guy but if Levi were there I'd listen to that too. I guess growing up a Boys fan and looking at drafts over the years I'm a little nervous of anyone of the D-linemen turning into another Greg Ellis(#8) or Ekuban(#20) who is solid but not spectacular. We have alot of that.
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There are far less game changing d-lineman that come out compared to skill position players (QB, RB, WR, DBs), so therefore teams are looking for that guy that can cause havoc from the inside out. D-lineman start out close to the ball, if a player can keep pressure on the ball from the snap it makes the entire defense better.

Skill position players are always in the lights and get a lot of the credit, but if a team can control the line of scrimmage, that team usually wins.
 
trutxn said:
There are far less game changing d-lineman that come out compared to skill position players (QB, RB, WR, DBs), so therefore teams are looking for that guy that can cause havoc from the inside out. D-lineman start out close to the ball, if a player can keep pressure on the ball from the snap it makes the entire defense better.

Skill position players are always in the lights and get a lot of the credit, but if a team can control the line of scrimmage, that team usually wins.
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I agree with the concept completely. I just don't want to hear this time every year that we need to look at D-line. At some point you have to hit in the draft and FA. I just get a little nervous because I've seen so many end up as more "dependable" and not a havoc reaker.
 
I expect Amobi Okoye will do well in the NFL, but the Texans need a 1-technique DT, aka NT, more than they need a 3-technique DT. Okoye is more of a 3-technique guy than a 1-technique guy. Branch on the other hand could be an excellent 1-technique DT, but I would rather see the Texans draft a 1-technique DT in the later rounds like maybe Walter Thomas 6ft-4in 370lbs or Paul Soliai 6ft-4in 334lbs and maybe also adding a Free Agent 1-position DT like Terdell Sands 6ft-7in 335lbs. As for DT Travis Johnson 6ft-3in 305lbs, the 2007 NFL season is the season that he must play consistently well or be replaced. He should be able to win the 3-technique DT position during the preseason with the competition for that position possibly being DT Anthony Maddox 6ft-1in 305lbs, DT Thomas Johnson 6ft-2in 302lbs, DT Alfred Malone 6ft-5in 308lbs, and DT Lional Dalton 6ft-1in 315lbs.

For those who have no idea what I am talking about with 1-technique and 3-technique, check this out.
 
I tought when we went with mario over all the other superior players was to chase down peyton are you trying to say mario was a mistake.:stirpot:
 
HoustonFrog said:
I agree with the concept completely. I just don't want to hear this time every year that we need to look at D-line. At some point you have to hit in the draft and FA. I just get a little nervous because I've seen so many end up as more "dependable" and not a havoc reaker.
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It is scary when you have to pick the same position every year. But teams are consistantly taking risks on these big men hoping to run into the next big thing. Dominant DLmen are far and few between, a high percentage of them are busts. TJ is on path to be a bust unless he drastically improves, Payne is old and recovering from surgery. Mario will be great, but Weaver needs protection on the inside. It is possible that in a couple yrs we have no real starters besides Mario on the DL. I like Maddox and the fill in crew that Smity came up with, but they are not the long term answers. We have to give Mario someone to work with on the d-line at #8, unless there is a "playmaker" available. I'd rather hear about d-line help than about a struggling QB. By the way, I'll take a team full of dependable players over a bunch of super stars any day.
 
Napa Auto Parts said:
I tought when we went with mario over all the other superior players was to chase down peyton are you trying to say mario was a mistake.:stirpot:
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I'm a huge Vince fan, but Mario was not a mistake. He will be a cornerstone of a great defense one day, along with DeMeco. As Vince is the cornerstone of his offense. We must give Mario help inside so he is not double teamed every play. With seasoning, I like Mario's chances in one on one battles. He will become much more disruptive with help. The Texans would have a dominate defense if the front four could pressure the QB. Especially with Rick Smith's blitzing style.
 
I would love to see the Texans take DE Gaines Adams at #8 if he is still available and they can still get a competent LT later in the draft. If it was up to me I wouldn't take a gamble with that and just draft OT Levi Brown at #8 if he is still available and then OG Ben Grubbs at #39 if he is available and then the best Center available with the Texans third pick. As much as I would love to add Defensive players with the Texans early picks the needs on the O-line far outweigh the needs on the Defense.
 
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