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Houston's Carr has Crashed

D

drafter

Practice Squad
Source: http://www.nfldraftpro.com


Houston's Carr has Crashed
By Chris Steuber
Posted: Monday, February 12, 2007

I’ve never been to Texas, but I know that barbeque and Mexican food are huge in the Lone Star State. But as I am writing this piece, I wonder what the most popular breakfast food is? If I had to guess I’d say eggs… well, at least for the Houston Texans franchise.

The future of Texans quarterback David Carr is in question after another so-so year. Houston had the opportunity to draft hometown boy Vince Young with the first pick last year, but blindly decided that Carr was their future. A year later, the Texans are wearing egg on their face and the fans have to eat it.

Before the 2006 NFL Draft, Young declared that being drafted by the Texans would be a dream come true; to play professional football in his home state. Former general manager of the Texans, Charlie Casserly (who was the man behind the decision to draft Mario Williams over both Reggie Bush and Young), made it clear that Carr was the franchise quarterback and the Texans wouldn’t pursue Young with the first selection.

Hey Charlie, I know you’re no longer a part of the Texans franchise, but you’ve got to be kicking yourself with a spur for that decision.

I am not dogging the selection of Williams, but any time you have a player that’s dying to play for your organization and someone who’s already an icon in the state of Texas, it should be a no-brainer. If the Texans decide to release, trade, or drive Carr out to the middle of nowhere for any traveler to pick up, the decision not to draft Young becomes even more magnified.

After sitting on the bench for the first three weeks of the season for the Tennessee Titans, Young started his first game against the Dallas Cowboys. After his first two starts Young was a shaky 0 – 2, but his fortunes were about to turn around. The final 12-games of the season, the Titans went an amazing 8-4, and were on the doorstep of making the playoffs. But just as Tennessee was about to enter, a troop of Patriots invaded their territory and sent them home.

That’s the scenario the Texans could have embarked upon, but yet, they’re still in expansion misery trying to find an identity.

So, what’s next for the Texans? Well, they will probably trade Carr to a franchise that needs a young quarterback looking for a fresh start. They will try to add a veteran quarterback, like Jake Plummer, through free agency. And they will draft a young quarterback to groom behind Plummer.

One player that Texans fans should keep an eye out for in the draft is Michigan State quarterback Drew Stanton. Stanton is a very interesting prospect with great size and a strong arm. Another element of Stanton’s game is his excellent mobility. Stanton is able to escape the pocket and make a play on the run, which is something Carr was unable to do.

One downside is that Stanton had a better junior year (3,077 yards passing, 22 touchdowns and 12 interceptions) than senior year (1,807 yards passing, 12 touchdowns and 10 interceptions), but he was on a Spartans’ team that collectively struggled this past season. Stanton is still an outstanding prospect with a promising future.

The future for the Texans, on the other hand, remains in the balance. If the front office knew what all the many around the league knew in regards to Carr, they’d be the “Young” team on the doorstep of the playoffs.
 
good post, i do hope this happens i have watch drew stanton for a while now, i think he has could be the best or second best qb in this draft.

qbs (my top 5)
1. JaMarcus Russell
2. Drew Stanton
3. Brady Quinn
4. Kevin Kolb
5. Troy Smith
 
yeah, i'd also like to see stanton... the reason why he had a down year was because he was on a bad team.
 
drafter said:
Source: http://www.nfldraftpro.com


Houston's Carr has Crashed
By Chris Steuber
Posted: Monday, February 12, 2007

I’ve never been to Texas, but I know that barbeque and Mexican food are huge in the Lone Star State. But as I am writing this piece, I wonder what the most popular breakfast food is? If I had to guess I’d say eggs… well, at least for the Houston Texans franchise.

The future of Texans quarterback David Carr is in question after another so-so year. Houston had the opportunity to draft hometown boy Vince Young with the first pick last year, but blindly decided that Carr was their future. A year later, the Texans are wearing egg on their face and the fans have to eat it.
Click to expand...

Strike 1 against this guy. We brought in Dan Reeves as a consultant, and asked every coach who interviewed whether or not they thought they could work with Carr. We also brought in Young for a workout. There was nothing blind about the process.

Before the 2006 NFL Draft, Young declared that being drafted by the Texans would be a dream come true; to play professional football in his home state. Former general manager of the Texans, Charlie Casserly (who was the man behind the decision to draft Mario Williams over both Reggie Bush and Young), made it clear that Carr was the franchise quarterback and the Texans wouldn’t pursue Young with the first selection.

Hey Charlie, I know you’re no longer a part of the Texans franchise, but you’ve got to be kicking yourself with a spur for that decision.

I am not dogging the selection of Williams, but any time you have a player that’s dying to play for your organization and someone who’s already an icon in the state of Texas, it should be a no-brainer. If the Texans decide to release, trade, or drive Carr out to the middle of nowhere for any traveler to pick up, the decision not to draft Young becomes even more magnified.
Click to expand...
Strike 2 against this guy. NO ONE, and when I say no one, I mean NO ONE in the media outside of Texas or the fans of this board even remotely hinted at Young being drafted by the Texans. In fact, if I remember correctly, Tennessee was graded POORLY! in the draft for taking him #3. "Project, poor mechanics, runs too much, terrible wonderlic" Sound familiar? This guy was citing all these negatives about Young about a year ago as reasons why he shouldn't even be picked top 10! Now he's in the probowl as a rookie, and all of a sudden, guess who is claiming he was a supporter all along? Yep, every media writer in the country.


After sitting on the bench for the first three weeks of the season for the Tennessee Titans, Young started his first game against the Dallas Cowboys. After his first two starts Young was a shaky 0 – 2, but his fortunes were about to turn around. The final 12-games of the season, the Titans went an amazing 8-4, and were on the doorstep of making the playoffs. But just as Tennessee was about to enter, a troop of Patriots invaded their territory and sent them home.

That’s the scenario the Texans could have embarked upon, but yet, they’re still in expansion misery trying to find an identity.
Click to expand...
Well thats it. To assume every player would have the exact same impact on every team is beyond stupid. We had a lot of problems this year, and as much as people would love to believe it, one guy wouldn't have fixed them. Could we have won more games? Maybe, probably, but not definiately.

The future for the Texans, on the other hand, remains in the balance. If the front office knew what all the many around the league knew in regards to Carr, they’d be the “Young” team on the doorstep of the playoffs.
Click to expand...
[/quote]
Wow way to predict the future after it already happened. I'd love to find the article where this same guy is probably criticizing the Texans for even considering him above Reggie Bush
 
With regards to Stanton, however,r I really like him. He's got a great arm, great size, and great accuracy. He is, however, a bit of a "pretty boy" like Carr. If he's there in the 3rd, I say grab him
 
gtexan02 said:
Strike 1 against this guy. We brought in Dan Reeves as a consultant, and asked every coach who interviewed whether or not they thought they could work with Carr. We also brought in Young for a workout. There was nothing blind about the process.
Click to expand...

Well I'm just playing devil's advocate but didn't Reeves say that he was impressed with Young and wasn't against taking him?I think he put keeping Carr and not drafting Young on Kubiak's lap. As far as coaches keeping Carr, I believe guys knew in order to get the job, that was the answer.

All of these writers are going to have a random perception of what happened so I won't read too much into it but I do think this all makes a difference. I said this when McClain spoke about Carr. He could of easily have stayed quiet. By talking the team has now put itself in a position where they may have gone too far out on the ledge. Fine by me but it isn't like this doesn't affect player perception.
 
HoustonFrog said:
Well I'm just playing devil's advocate but didn't Reeves say that he was impressed with Young and wasn't against taking him?I think he put keeping Carr and not drafting Young on Kubiak's lap. As far as coaches keeping Carr, I believe guys knew in order to get the job, that was the answer.

All of these writers are going to have a random perception of what happened so I won't read too much into it but I do think this all makes a difference. I said this when McClain spoke about Carr. He could of easily have stayed quiet. By talking the team has now put itself in a position where they may have gone too far out on the ledge. Fine by me but it isn't like this doesn't affect player perception.
Click to expand...

Dan Reeves was all over the place when it came to the Carr/VY thing.

Here's the best explanation he has given:

Link

I personally think that explanation is a load of crapatola. Reeves comes in as consultant. He tells McNair that he likes what he saw in David Carr.

Kubiak basically comes off his Denver playoff loss, meets with McNair, says he can coach up Carr, and a couple of weeks later, they pick up Carr's option.

Then after the fact, Reeves lays all of this on Kubiak: coach needs to believe in his QB.

Well, REEVES is the one who actually was with the organization at the end of the season and saw work habits and what they wanted Carr to be doing. Kubiak just looked mostly at film and barely talked to DC before the option thing was due. If Reeves thought there were enough concerns about Carr to justify going the VY route, well then he needed to say something. McNair's discussions of Reeves' consulting at the time was Carr = doubleplus good.
 
dirty steve said:
strike 565. get more original than using another played take on Carr's name. maybe they could have thought out of the box and used "Houston, we have a problem."
Click to expand...


How about

"Carrfully weighing thier options" or "Carr'eeping Carr another year is 'Carr'apy"
 
I can't think of Drew Stanton without thinking of the all time best radio rant about MSU's loss to Notre Dame.

link

For some reason, I can't get the audio to work.

Here's some quotes from it on Stanton, and this link is a good summary of it:

link

On Stanton:

Now, I love Drew Stanton. But I can't defend you when you play that way ... you HAVE to make better decisions.

And you know what? It's time for Drew to step up in a big game. It's time for Drew to play [in a big game] the way he plays against Kent State and Indiana.
Click to expand...
 
Texans_Chick said:
Dan Reeves was all over the place when it came to the Carr/VY thing.

Here's the best explanation he has given:

Link

I personally think that explanation is a load of crapatola. Reeves comes in as consultant. He tells McNair that he likes what he saw in David Carr.

Kubiak basically comes off his Denver playoff loss, meets with McNair, says he can coach up Carr, and a couple of weeks later, they pick up Carr's option.

Then after the fact, Reeves lays all of this on Kubiak: coach needs to believe in his QB.

Well, REEVES is the one who actually was with the organization at the end of the season and saw work habits and what they wanted Carr to be doing. Kubiak just looked mostly at film and barely talked to DC before the option thing was due. If Reeves thought there were enough concerns about Carr to justify going the VY route, well then he needed to say something. McNair's discussions of Reeves' consulting at the time was Carr = doubleplus good.
Click to expand...

I've always believed that Reeves wanted a job here and was playing the game . Then after the Texans took a turn for the worst ... he was trying to save face .
 
hahmmm sorry I was asleep and thought I dreamed that another expert had stated the same things that have been mentioned ten trillion times already. You know we often lament Houston not getting national coverage and then we get something like this. Going to nod back off now and dream that Paris Hilton & I are at a Dairy Queen. That girl can use some ice cream.
 
Meloy said:
hahmmm sorry I was asleep and thought I dreamed that another expert had stated the same things that have been mentioned ten trillion times already. You know we often lament Houston not getting national coverage and then we get something like this. Going to nod back off now and dream that Paris Hilton & I are at a Dairy Queen. That girl can use some ice cream.
Click to expand...

I'd get her a Beltbuster also .
 
Texans_Chick said:
Dan Reeves was all over the place when it came to the Carr/VY thing.

Here's the best explanation he has given:

Link

I personally think that explanation is a load of crapatola. Reeves comes in as consultant. He tells McNair that he likes what he saw in David Carr.

Kubiak basically comes off his Denver playoff loss, meets with McNair, says he can coach up Carr, and a couple of weeks later, they pick up Carr's option.

Then after the fact, Reeves lays all of this on Kubiak: coach needs to believe in his QB.

Well, REEVES is the one who actually was with the organization at the end of the season and saw work habits and what they wanted Carr to be doing. Kubiak just looked mostly at film and barely talked to DC before the option thing was due. If Reeves thought there were enough concerns about Carr to justify going the VY route, well then he needed to say something. McNair's discussions of Reeves' consulting at the time was Carr = doubleplus good.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the info. I just remembered they were discussing the subject weeks ago.
 
Yeah, strike 1000 against this guy and not being from Texas, anyone from Texas would know that the Texans did the right thing in resigning Carr and passing on Young. Geez, where do they get these writers?
 
drafter said:
Source: http://www.nfldraftpro.com


Houston's Carr has Crashed
By Chris Steuber
Posted: Monday, February 12, 2007

I’ve never been to Texas, but I know that barbeque and Mexican food are huge in the Lone Star State. But as I am writing this piece, I wonder what the most popular breakfast food is? If I had to guess I’d say eggs… well, at least for the Houston Texans franchise.

The future of Texans quarterback David Carr is in question after another so-so year. Houston had the opportunity to draft hometown boy Vince Young with the first pick last year, but blindly decided that Carr was their future. A year later, the Texans are wearing egg on their face and the fans have to eat it.

Before the 2006 NFL Draft, Young declared that being drafted by the Texans would be a dream come true; to play professional football in his home state. Former general manager of the Texans, Charlie Casserly (who was the man behind the decision to draft Mario Williams over both Reggie Bush and Young), made it clear that Carr was the franchise quarterback and the Texans wouldn’t pursue Young with the first selection.

Hey Charlie, I know you’re no longer a part of the Texans franchise, but you’ve got to be kicking yourself with a spur for that decision.

I am not dogging the selection of Williams, but any time you have a player that’s dying to play for your organization and someone who’s already an icon in the state of Texas, it should be a no-brainer. If the Texans decide to release, trade, or drive Carr out to the middle of nowhere for any traveler to pick up, the decision not to draft Young becomes even more magnified.

After sitting on the bench for the first three weeks of the season for the Tennessee Titans, Young started his first game against the Dallas Cowboys. After his first two starts Young was a shaky 0 – 2, but his fortunes were about to turn around. The final 12-games of the season, the Titans went an amazing 8-4, and were on the doorstep of making the playoffs. But just as Tennessee was about to enter, a troop of Patriots invaded their territory and sent them home.

That’s the scenario the Texans could have embarked upon, but yet, they’re still in expansion misery trying to find an identity.

So, what’s next for the Texans? Well, they will probably trade Carr to a franchise that needs a young quarterback looking for a fresh start. They will try to add a veteran quarterback, like Jake Plummer, through free agency. And they will draft a young quarterback to groom behind Plummer.

One player that Texans fans should keep an eye out for in the draft is Michigan State quarterback Drew Stanton. Stanton is a very interesting prospect with great size and a strong arm. Another element of Stanton’s game is his excellent mobility. Stanton is able to escape the pocket and make a play on the run, which is something Carr was unable to do.

One downside is that Stanton had a better junior year (3,077 yards passing, 22 touchdowns and 12 interceptions) than senior year (1,807 yards passing, 12 touchdowns and 10 interceptions), but he was on a Spartans’ team that collectively struggled this past season. Stanton is still an outstanding prospect with a promising future.

The future for the Texans, on the other hand, remains in the balance. If the front office knew what all the many around the league knew in regards to Carr, they’d be the “Young” team on the doorstep of the playoffs.
Click to expand...


Let's talk Vince, well number 1 he was the worst QB in the league as to stats, and on one occasion the Titan offense scored 3 points - no VY did not kick it in, and the d/st scored 21, no VY did not play d either, or return the punt/kicks.
As for being a hometown boy, yeah he said that, but he also said I want my money, which was a MOUNTAIN that Carr doesn't even come close to. If VY wanted to play here, he didn't let it stand in the way of how much money he wanted. As for the Pro-Bowl, please,QB1-injured, 2-Played golf at Pebble Beach instead, 3-Let the rookie play, yeah what a pro-bowler. But you are right, we love our Tex-Mex & BBQ, oops, that's Mexican Food & Barbeque.
 
Texans_Chick said:
Dan Reeves was all over the place when it came to the Carr/VY thing.

Here's the best explanation he has given:

Link

I personally think that explanation is a load of crapatola. Reeves comes in as consultant. He tells McNair that he likes what he saw in David Carr.

Kubiak basically comes off his Denver playoff loss, meets with McNair, says he can coach up Carr, and a couple of weeks later, they pick up Carr's option.

Then after the fact, Reeves lays all of this on Kubiak: coach needs to believe in his QB.

Well, REEVES is the one who actually was with the organization at the end of the season and saw work habits and what they wanted Carr to be doing. Kubiak just looked mostly at film and barely talked to DC before the option thing was due. If Reeves thought there were enough concerns about Carr to justify going the VY route, well then he needed to say something. McNair's discussions of Reeves' consulting at the time was Carr = doubleplus good.
Click to expand...

If I am reading that correctly Reeves did not have a clear either/or VY/Carr take. It appears he thought that VY would be a better player longtem and that the direction he would personally go, but at the same time Carr still could be a good NFL QB and that extending him was a defendable position. Consultants can only make suggestions and give opinions, I can't hold him accountable for decisions of the organizations.
 
ArlingtonTexan said:
If I am reading that correctly Reeves did not have a clear either/or VY/Carr take. It appears he thought that VY would be a better player longtem and that the direction he would personally go, but at the same time Carr still could be a good NFL QB and that extending him was a defendable position. Consultants can only make suggestions and give opinions, I can't hold him accountable for decisions of the organizations.
Click to expand...
You really think McNair paid Reeves to evaluate the team and Not make suggestions on DC? Surely, you jest?
 
Meloy said:
You really think McNair paid Reeves to evaluate the team and Not make suggestions on DC? Surely, you jest?
Click to expand...

What part of the sentence consultants can only make suggestions and give opinions did you miss? A consultant DOESN'T make the decisions.
 
drafter said:
Hey Charlie, I know you’re no longer a part of the Texans franchise, but you’ve got to be kicking yourself with a spur for that decision.
Click to expand...

It's very clear he never heard Charlie speak, or he would have said "drowning yourself in clam chowder".
 
Tailgate said:
Hind sight is always 20/20 isnt it?
Click to expand...

Hind sight is fine, however when most of the fans have 20/20 "Before sight" or whatever you would call it, and those in charge of making the real decisions are blind, then I have an issue.
 
run-david-run said:
God I hope not. We have to learn from the Carr era. Get the team ready, then bring in a franchise QB, not the other way around.
Click to expand...

I totally agree! That's why I think Sage should start the season and Gary should bring Brady along slowly and insert him into the lineup when he's ready. Yes, Gary made a big mistake on picking up Carr's option. But hey, hindsight's 20/20. I'm not stuck on that. Carr should be on his way to Minnesota in exchange for a 3rd round pick in this year's draft. (we should use it to draft David Harris btw)
 
gtexan02 said:
...Wow way to predict the future after it already happened. I'd love to find the article where this same guy is probably criticizing the Texans for even considering him above Reggie Bush
Click to expand...

Game on.
4/16/06
....All kidding aside, as a fan you can already see Reggie Bush's future. He will most likely end up with the Houston Texans as the draft's No. 1 selection and sign a multi-million dollar deal that will secure the Bush family for decades to come. He'll go to training camp with television cameras following his every move. Bush will enter the season as the league's "Must See TV" player and ultimately struggle due to a weak offensive line and a poor supporting cast....
Click to expand...

4/20/06
...Players such as Reggie Bush, Michael Huff and D'Brickashaw Ferguson are no-brainers as their classes' "Shot Caller." But what about players such as LenDale White, Claude Wroten or Elvis Dumervil? Are they their classes' "Crystal Baller" or "Fast Faller?" Check it out ...

Shot Caller Matt Leinart, USC
Why: No question about it, Leinart is better than Jay Cutler and Vince Young. Leinart's play at USC puts him above and beyond any other quarterback this year. Fast Faller D.J. Shockley, Georgia
Why: Shockley's size and skills are questionable, but his athleticism makes him intriguing. Overall he's a tweener who may eventually become a receiver.
Prospective Baller Drew Olson, UCLA
Why: Olson is an interesting prospect. He's got excellent size, speed, and great presence in the pocket. If Olson was healthy his entire college career, he'd be mentioned with Leinart, Cutler and Young.
Crystal Baller Charlie Whitehurst, Clemson
Why: If Whitehurst goes to a team that passes the ball a lot and that team has a veteran quarterback he can learn from, he may become the best quarterback in the entire draft.
Click to expand...

I'm sure there's more out there, but this guy is just like any other with an opinion and orifices....
 
Tailgate said:
Hind sight is always 20/20 isnt it?
Click to expand...

yeah, and he's a day late and a dollar short. I won't be tuning into his in-depth analysis of the 2007 draft next February 2008.

Hookem Horns said:
Hind sight is fine, however when most of the fans have 20/20 "Before sight" or whatever you would call it, and those in charge of making the real decisions are blind, then I have an issue.
Click to expand...

Most fans wanted Reggie Bush, IIRC. There were some vocal Young supporters, but most Houston fans were looking towards Bush, especially since the FO had already resigned Carr and put the kabosh on picking VY early into the off-season.
 
Texans_Chick said:
I can't think of Drew Stanton without thinking of the all time best radio rant about MSU's loss to Notre Dame.

link

For some reason, I can't get the audio to work.

Here's some quotes from it on Stanton, and this link is a good summary of it:

link
Click to expand...

As a ND fan I almost die laughing when I hear this every single time. This rant ranks right up there with Dennis Green after the bears game.
 
dirty steve said:
strike 565. get more original than using another played take on Carr's name. maybe they could have thought out of the box and used "Houston, we have a problem."
Click to expand...

At this point I'm for trading David Carr if it means I don't ever again have to read or hear of another crappy wordplay involving his name.
 
drafter said:
Source: http://www.nfldraftpro.com


Houston's Carr has Crashed
By Chris Steuber
Posted: Monday, February 12, 2007

If the Texans decide to release, trade, or drive Carr out to the middle of nowhere for any traveler to pick up, the decision not to draft Young becomes even more magnified.
Click to expand...

I'll comment only on this 1 specific point (above). The logic is flawed and not uncommon. It has to do with what the finance wonks (self included) call "sunk costs." It is a tragedy to let past investment decisions drive future investment decisions.

The decision to pass on VY will not be more maginifed. The Texans FO already made one error in investment judgement: to pass on VY because we already sunk too much investment in Carr. If I understand the article correctly, the author would have the Texans FO make the same mistake: to pass on (some hypthetical) talent to replace Carr, but now the magnification would stem from the opportunity cost of not drafting VY.

It's a logic trap. It is a flawed argument. :drunk:

If the Texans want to part with Carr, they should do so. They should not let past mistakes (whether or not passing on VY is a mistake is not _my point, but that of Mr. Steuber) remain in the past, and look toward the future. It is that simple.

I am looking forward to the draft. Looking at that #8, I see either AD or Levi. Or, things could get really interesting and we trade down, foregoing a shot at AD in an attempt to fill multiple holes. I do not think I will be too disappointed either way. This is going to be fun to watch.
 
Why people get worked up behind articles is beyond me. It's just an opinion. Take it for what it's worth. BTW, Hookem Horns......Love the Edmonton Eskimo Avatar!
 
gtexan02 said:
To assume every player would have the exact same impact on every team is beyond stupid. We had a lot of problems this year, and as much as people would love to believe it, one guy wouldn't have fixed them.
Click to expand...

Couldn't have said it better myself! A team doesn't consist of only one player; you can have the best player ever but if the rest of the team sucks they aren't going to the Superbowl.
 
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